Explaining Erving Goffman's Expressive Order: Face and Presentation of Self 

I think this video is highly important to people who take the advice, 'just be yourself', a little too seriously or unfortunately mistake rawness for authenticity as an actual objective

As someone with ADHD combined type 2, this video was EXTREMELY helpful and, dare I say, essential in learning to not be socially awkward. I especially appreciated your examples of “playing a character and maintaining that character as best you can”, and I found this helpful because my style of learning is kinetic and visual with a need for examples to base from. You are a blessing. Thank you so much!!!

I was raised in a figurative closet, this is really helpful.

This is the most helpful infotmation about social interaction I've ever received. I knew there was a "norm" I consistently violate and have been so distressed trying to identify what it is. Definitely going to listen and absorb this one a few times.

I am so glad there is a proper philosophical framework for this! I was trying to explain this concept to my friend last month, having only the vaguest idea what it was, and now here it is, explained in academic splendour! I'd like to reframe the concept with an anecdote of mine, for anyone who might be looking for something less abstract. I think my careless faux-pas makes a perfect example, both of someone breaking the expressive order, and of how it gets communally repaired. I told my friend - who was terrified to drive everyone away after a catastrophic loss of face - that "I don't need to trust you never to say anything hurtful to me. I only need to trust that you will prioritize our friendship over my mistakes. If, tomorrow, I made a careless comment about [past trauma], and I hurt you badly, but apologized, would you forgive me? Right! So, in the same way, I need you to trust me when I say: I will prioritize our friendship. No, I know you don't trust yourself. I know it's a leap of faith, but you need to trust *me*; trust *us*. What finally cemented it was, the friend group was together again the next week and I made an even worse mistake. This friend's spouse has just recovered from COVID and still requires a CPAP at home. But at the time, it a possibly fatal hospital stay. During our movie night, the **agreed purpose** of which was to distract our friend, I made a joke about the bloviating villain and uh...curtailing his excess lung capacity, as it were. I immediately realized this was in extremely poor taste, and quietly acknowledged that it was **not at all the time** for that joke. The friend in question simply withheld comment, allowing the rest of the group to keep jeering at the movie: we all gingerly reconstructed the "laughing at bad cinema" dynamic, and the group's energy was restored in less than a minute. I later apologized to my friend in private. I trusted that - without ignoring or downplaying the issue - they would still forgive me. The response? "I forgive you, no worries. I really appreciate that apology though - you're right that it was a bad joke." My trust was rewarded! After their spouse's recovery, I went on to explain that reciprocally, my friend could trust me in just the same way - and the same was true for the rest of the group. And that made it click: "No, you're right. I love you all way too much to hold that kind of thing against you. I just...have remember you feel the same way." Humans suck, and we're all gonna mess it up for each other. Your true friends are the ones you can trust to mend any breach, no matter how severe.

This was super helpful! We're working on this in my sociology class and my professor for some reason isn't lecturing at all this semester. It's nice to be able to hear someone explain it rather than just reading it out of a book. Thanks so much!

Very interesting. Now I know what I do wrong sometimes.

It's a fruitful video to understand Goffman's theory. Thank you.

This is very interesting. My whole life I've never understood the purpose of the social game, "Expressive order" partially, so I found no meaning to adhere to it. Although I've understood I'm bad socially and sometimes I feel like people resent me (sounds dramatic). But after coming across Erving Goffmans theories and your video I can understand why I've felt resented and maybe even why people would resent me. If they find me not having the moral commitment I might seem unreliable, not trustworthy etc. and even outright stupid. Anyway very insightful video thank you for your time!

Hi Bruce, thanks this is helpful. I am also a big fan of IG. Something interesting to note is that people skilled in social power regularly break face - interrupt the order - make some change or claim and then sew it back up again. Happens with executive presence pretty often. --Roy

Can you talk about the expressive order in terms of social media group bullying. What about being cast in a role that is not in any way your own choice? There is often negative consequences to engaging, even in an attempt to maintain the expressive order (ie apology, rationalization).

Im really glad a watched this.

Now I get it! I'm a mathematician and always viewed conversation as a means of communicating information. Hope I'm not too old to learn to play hackysack.

I need this. Desperately. Thank Hell this channel exists.

This is incredible. I look forward to seeing more videos. I've always found the more knowledge I'm armed with, the less anxiety I feel so, thank you for this.

As usual, good stuff. You've opened my autistic eyes to a whole world I was blind to.

Very meaningful topic. Thank you.

This is a superhelpful and very well explained session. Thanks a million :)

This makes so much sense 😮

Wow! This is so good! Thank you so much!

Really fascinating. What are your thoughts on a type of "mass subconscienceness" during conversations? When you were discussing conversations falling apart, I think about times I have been in very robust discussions with multiple people, with everyone adding something in. Then, in my head, I'm considering something excellent to add, but when a break comes I have forgotten what it was that I wanted to add. The interesting part is that in some way it seems as if the entire group had a sense that I was going to add that, and when I don't, the conversation falls apart. No one else takes it up. Almost as if some undercurrent between us gave the "hackysack" to me next, but without any out loud announcement of me preparing to do so. Maybe it's body language? Hope this is clear. Thanks for the videos!

You rock, loved your Tik tok on this, groundbreaking!!!!

I will watch all your videos, they are just great! Thank you!

Thank you much this was really useful

Commitment over perfection

Thank you! Very interesting

excellent video. your analogies brought lots of clarity to the topic, nice work!

I totally agree with following the order is how to make an interaction as comfortable as possible and thats especially crucial with new people. However would I go into an interaction being insecure and not talking much and would only try to maintain my "role" once it has been established, I would not make the mistakes or take those risks which would make me gather the social feedback to grow and change into whom I really want to be. I personally believe that people have to get the context and understand the hierarchies but then slightly break the rules now and then.

Very helpful. Thank you.

Thank you very much. I believe that will prove helpful. I was a little surprised to hear you resort to the word 'class' in defining this, It fits, but how many think of this when they think of class?

this is amazing! thank you so much for this information

Great content!

So we have a “moral obligation” to maintain all the efforts involved in impression management? But what if we value truth over the illusions that other people are trying to sell the world? If we can’t tolerate all the facades and hypocrisy that so many people are projecting to be viewed as “professional,” and when their doing that results in them stepping on other people’s toes so that they seem superior in the hierarchy? (My workplace was trying to promote the idea of “bringing your whole self to work,” but that concept seems to clash with some of these ideas.) I really hope the idea of radical honesty wins out over impression management, because it seems that the latter “value” is going to ruin life for the next generations with all of the social media fakeness. There is a real case for the argument that narcissism is becoming the new normal. (Maybe where I live, near LA, is just the epicenter of this trend? I hope so. And that it doesn’t gain traction if it is.)

Love this content

Looking forward to watching the full video when I have time. Just wanted to comment because you mentioned linking to your first two videos and point to the top of the screen, but no link appears. Cheers!

But I dislike how fake social interactions feel

Hi can you make a playlist on small talk? I am 25 and trying to develop my social skills, I find that when it comes to small talk I am very lacking.

Sounds like maintaining the fragility of egos. If I did that I wouldn't be true to myself and my values, which are honesty and being genuine, things that ego gets in the way of at least in common American & Latin culture. Edit: looks like the opposite stance is already commented and favored by the uploader, so to those I say don't presume tact is not in the skillset.

This got me thinking about pecking orders. Is it still an expressive order if the group is establishing a hierarchy, with someone at the bottom as the butt of all jokes? The analogy with the hacky sack makes me think these orders are co-operative (given face), but can they also be competitive (and orders be rated from co-operative to competitive)? Some groups seem to have 'face' as a finite resource. As an aside, what is 'face'? Is it similar to respect (especially for boundaries), or is it more like one's expected position?

We used to play hacky sacks as kids, instead of the bean bag we used rubber bands to tie them into a bunch. And this was in Nepal.

I can’t do this anymore.

I think this was a very good overview of Goffman, but why he insisted we should all try to maintain the Expressive Order without realizing its pros and cons - maybe he could have elaborated on that more.

I don't understand what this means in practice?

So, respect the mask the other person is wearing in order to interact with the character they're portraying.

this reminds me of the korean notion of nunchi

I think I've interpreted the Expressive Order in the past as a set of different manners one would apply to any particular interaction. Would that be correct? I instinctively know that "manners" certainly must play a significant role for society to function optimally. I haven't read or seen anything about the importance of manners yet (links anyone?)

From my underdeveloped/antisocial perspective, I feel like conversation between personas is like damming a river into a stagnant pool. But since my life has been worse than underwhelming so far, I'm fighting off embitterment. Because I know I must be wrong

Can I ask why People are so attached to the meanings and Face?... I grew up isolated... and I honestly don't get it.

Sometimes exploding the expressive order drama is very needed and so what if it's broken up to make people think

It sounds a lot like what used to be called "being polite".

How does the expressive order’s moral imperative work with people whose social skills are inherently impaired? For instance, a mental illness or autism?

is it possible to apply this theory to serial killers?

"Civilisation is based on violence, slavey and nice words" - M. J Gurdjieff you need to be a good politician or lawyer or psychopath to create the deception of expressive order

I will learn how to play even though i hate the fucking game because otherwise, what will i be left with?

My notes from this video: Face is the positive social value that we claim for ourselves. Every interaction is a moral drama about our commitment to the Expressive Order. The Expressive Order is the entire set of meanings that are being sustained in a given interaction. Every interaction has a set of meanings. Your task is to maintain the Expressive Order of the interaction. If you, for example, claim that someone is not who he says he is, you broke the face and you'll need to restore the Expressive Order. Having a social conversation is like many people trying to keep a balloon in the air. The balloon representing the things that are said and maintaining the reality of them. If someone fails to keep that and breaks character, they betray everone else and the Expressive Order will need to be restored. Reults of someone failing to keep the Expressive Order could be panic, humiliation, stress, etc. Just by attempting to rebuild the Expressive Order, you show that you are commited to the conversation and people will respect that. It often times is more important than even maintaining the Expressive Order. The Expressive Order is meant to break sometimes, because humans are imperfect. This is just part of a normal conversation. The Expressive Order will not be kept by everyone at all times. -> People who care to keep the Expressive Order show dignity, honor and self esteem. When someone is poised or diplomatic, they really just have a strong commitment to maintaining the Expressive Order. They know that social interactions are risky and they are ready to rebuild the Expressive Order at any time. If we think or notice that someone isn't aware of the Expressive Order, it feels unsafe to interact with them as they don't have class nor shame or social skills. They might even intentionally break down the Expressive Order and / or don't have the commitment to rebuild it. They lack the moral commitment that we are attached to. Be aware of the Commitment you have for the Expressive Order in Conversation. And when it inevitabely breaks down, show that you want to help put it back together. For example: - not paying attention when someone embarrasses themselves - doing whatever is necessary to help someone restore face

Goffman believes that people interact with each other based on our unique sense of self. is that true of false

needs closed captioning

( so you mean maintaining a performance ) when you say maintaining ?

So basically we should be fake?

Business writing yaaaaaay.....

I wouldn't wanna be tasked with the duty of teaching this to Donald Trump. "Moral obligation," lol!

What about us, anxious ones? I can't look at the eyes for long, the only reason I can stay still while someone says something completely uninteresting to me (most things) is if I start thinking about something else and when is my turn I change topic...

I think this principle assumes that all participants are acting in good faith. Where there is a significant power imbalance, for example an employer coercing an employee to behave illegally in the employer's interests, there is little the employee can do to keep the hacky sack in the air without betraying their values. This is when the employer tells the employee that they're "not a team player" and gets variously shafted, isolated and disparaged. In this way, Goffman appears to me to be a Polly-Anna.

Incrível

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I really couldn't give a fuck about what this means. I just need it for school. Thanks tho

Seems to me this is exactly how abuse goes unchecked.

So for Example your wife tells you to , 1. Take out the trash Go to sleep with her Drive 🚗 to work

No wonder I don't fit in... I don't play the game of facade. Screw that. I have no moral obligation to be inauthentic and play along with your lies. Fine, don't like me. I like me, and I have enough people in my life who are real. If you feel embarrassed because you're being a phony that's not on me, however, of you do something embarrassing like fart lol, sure I'll help keep the order.

It’s so strange to see the similarities between human communication and dog communication, as a trainer, I realize that when dogs play and people converse we are doing the same thing