First-Ever Full SSBM Tier List 

holy shit the first ever of all time full ssbm tier list

Those who knew hax for while are probably shocked at the character development making a full character tier list AND letting falcon share a tier with fox

Holy shit its the first full roster tier list ever

Finally, he’s no longer underwater

5:58 "It is definitely impossible to win a major tournament with anyone in the C D or F tier." This clip is gonna be used in a documentary whenever franz wins a big tournament. (I hope)

This might be the best tier list. I’m actually surprised how much I agree with this.

i get your initial point about not separating dr and mario, but i really think dk is simply better than mario in the meta

Ness could be ranked higher. Although his fair can be asdi downed it has a huge hitbox and is entirely disjointed, so its not easy to get a reliable punish off of that. All of his aerials auto cancel off of a short hop and generally have good frame data, has the best shield in the game, is fairly heavy, chain grab on spacies, strong fsmash, small hurtbox, and dj cancel. All that considered I think he could be as high as young link at best given his flaws, but I cannot see him as the worst character in the game

I think ness is worse, but hax got jacketed in tourney once so I understand

I’m putting D.K. over Mario imo

The category minimization is really good, as well as the reasoning behind each low tier! I'm just waiting for the year 20DK where he gets put above ice climbers on the list, but the rest is really solid, loved the explanations!

Oh! Wasn't expecting this so soon after the other one. Neat!

OH MY GOD HAX CARES ABOUT LOW TIERS

0:02 Intro + explanation of tiers 3:08 Sheik/Zelda explanation 4:21 Doc / Mario 6:29 DK 7:52 Link 10:00 Ganondorf 12:06 Roy 12:46 Mewtwo 13:43 G&W 15:21 Young Link 18:00 Pichu 19:59 Kirby 21:07 Ness 22:57 Bowser 25:00 Outro

Bowser is just a downright hilarious character, like genuinely he feels and plays like a joke character. I wish I could've been a fly on the wall during HAL's discussions on the design of his moveset, or lack thereof lol.

fully expected hax to just have every character below ganon 5 tiers below in a tier labeled "trash"

honestly, I think that DK having a pretty playable matchup into fox and marth is a lot better than anything that the Mario's have going for them? like, as a solo main I agree that he's around as good as the mario's, but DK honestly seems like a pretty viable dual main character, which to me seems like enough to push him up to B tier.

This was a very fun video talking about the whole cast. Great video Hax$

Isn't treating Zelda and Sheik as the same character just ignoring the reality of how people actually *play* the characters? What's the point in ranking them together if it's just less useful to do so? You're essentially ranking a situation that doesn't actually exist, even if you might be technically correct, that they only have one spot on the character select screen. Sure, veeery occasionally a player might switch between them, but in 99.99% of cases, players stick with one character or the other for the vast majority of their match time.

Ylink below roy is wild

Thanks for making a tier list on the whole cast, it was actually really interesting to watch! I love your perspective on Melee and your reasoning for all the tiers, it's very pragmatic! Thanks Hax$ 😎

I love that he has Adidas bookmarked! He is known for wearing a red pair of Adidas pants, that would become synonymous with his legendary Genesis 7 run.

adidas as the 2nd bookmark. Hax is a legend

I like ranking zelda/sheik as one character

Dang the Sheik>Falco debate is happening now more than ever

I couldn't disagree more about Kirby's jumpsquat. None of the good 3-frame jumpsquat characters are good *because* they have 3-frame jumpsquat, they're good because they have overall good mobility and aerials, which their jumpsquat gives them quick access to; they get value out of leaving the ground quickly because what they can do in the air is *worth something*. Kirby does not have that. He doesn't have the tools necessary for having 3-frame jumpsquat to help him; he'd be *faaaar* better off with 4-frame jumpsquat but actually decent dash, run, and air drift speeds. Hell, I'd take 4-frame jumpsquat, improved dash speed, and a *single* extra frame of up-smash strong hit over the current version of Kirby. He's ass bro: definitive bottom 2, and he's not 2.

I don't play Melee. At all. For the last 6-7 years, I've been strictly a spectator. With that said, what's the deal with Ganandorf? In my 6-7 years of watching, I have seen really good Ganons. Most lately, it's been Mekk. But I have NEVER seen a good Dr. Mario, Mario, or quite frankly, since Abate, Luigi. Yet those three characters are regularly seen above Ganon on a tier list. Is it strictly bias? I know there *has* been good to even great Mario/Docs before I started watching, but it has been bare for those characters since. Again, I don't play Melee, just talking as a spectator, and a spectator for a relatively short period of time.

I do think DK is a bit undervalued in this tier list, you pointed out the Falco MU being rough, but the fact that you can pivot power shield the lasers and that you're mostly approaching backwards to hit with a bair anyway makes that MU just a little bit worse than fox but not by much. Surprisingly, Peach and Sheik are decent MUs, the only definitively bad MUs that DK has are icies and falcon (in the opinion of many top DKs such as Akir and Rishi), and those are still being labbed out. Icies has become better by using down b to help separate them, but falcon is still a problem. I'd put DK ahead of the Mario bros, but below Luigi, potentially even in B tier. He could be viable depending on how much more he gets labbed out, and he definitely has high potential for the future.

based takes especially ness. pichu should be in d though and roy should be moved down.

If marth wasn't in the game roy would be considered top 10

Pichu discussion: evidence that Hax saw Codeman take a game off S2J

Thanks. I pretty much agree with your reasoning. Is amazing how many shortcomings so many of these characters have and yet this is still such an amazing game.

I viewed Young Link into floaties being okay but into spacies being terrible the same way I view Roy + Mewtwo into spacies is okay but into floaties being terrible. Putting those 3 in the same tier makes sense, though I'd put them all next to each other. Putting Roy + Mewtwo higher is fine, though because there are more Spacey players.

I wanted you to talk about the Roy-Puff matchup.

But Hax, Bowser has the koopabackdashwaveslide hoverwalkmoonland 😂

Crazy how low people put Mewtwo

Woah, didn't think this would be so soon after the last one

Man, i remember Yoshi being lower tier til it all changed.

when i started playing i used your viable/unviable tier list to find a main which had every character but not super ordered like this was when you said the thing about gnw being the last char with a usable neutral ggs to qerb

I think you're underrating young link and overrating link. Link has a 6 frame jumpsquat and one of the worst dash speed, air speed, and wavedash length of the whole cast. Young link actually has great movement with his 4 frame jumpsquat, great airspeed, great dash speed, and solid wavedash. His wavedash OOS and nair OOS are 2 frames faster than Link's and he's much harder to pin down in shield due to his movement.

really dont understand why you dont view sheik and zelda as individual characters sharing the same slot or not, but they ARE two fundamentally different characters so they should be considered so

Ness below kirby is wild

I thought first ever full meant mega Hand and giga Bowser as well

I'm not gonna stop using Ganon I won't I'm not doing it they can't make me the bastards

Hax Moo-lah Bay-bee! Congrats on this being your 69th video and good luck with your training, Boxxman! ❤️

17:39 this is the craziest sentence I've ever heard

Some minor disagreements: Just based on tournament results, I feel like there should be a tier break between Mewtwo and Game&Watch. Pretty much all the C and D characters (except one) up to that point have notable recent results. Zain with Roy got 7th at Wavedash. Leffen's had some disgusting runs with Mewtwo beating some of the best europeans. Junebug just got 13th at Big House using DK, including several wins over very good players (Magi, Ginger). Aklo's Link caused some problems for top Marths. But G&W...it's not that nobody has tried, Cody tried. He failed. I just can't ever think of a time when some big player picked up G&W, and did really well with him. It's not that G&W doesn't have some decent moves, but he's the same weight as Jigglypuff and his shield doesn't work (always at risk of getting shield poked even with a full shield). My other minor disagreement is Mario. First, there's the results. Outside of some Mango stuff from 2010, Mario really doesn't have the results, in terms of beating players in 2022 or 2023 who are top 30 ranked with Mario. Unlike Mewtwo, unlike DK, unlike Roy, unlike Link, all of whom do have big wins. (Mango's Mario also lost to Zain's Roy in the one instance I can find of that matchup, and Mario's floaty enough that this would be expected to be a bad matchup for Roy). I also, and maybe I'm just bad at reading frame data (totally possible), but I'm also unconvinced staring at frame data and character information that Doc and Mario are close. Something like 80% of Doc's moves look in the data better than Mario's to me. There's Doc's up+B, which has up+B cancelling, which does get implemented in actual games by Franz. Mario's up+B doesn't have this. There's the cape, which is substantially better for Doc (hits well below the stage when edge guarding, deals more percent). There's the pills which are substantially better for Doc. (Deal more percent, bounce more erratically) There's pretty much every grounded A move, which is better for Doc (usually same frame data, but more damage. Forward tilt is less damage for Doc, but significantly better frame data so I suspect it's better overall too). (The one likely exception for grounded moves is Mario's forward smash, which deals less damage, has less knockback, but has a second hitbox--sourspot, and has the transcendental property meaning it never clanks, always trades. General consensus is this forward smash is probably better for Mario over Doc, but definitely not by enough to make Mario close the gap on the ground). So the one place Mario can close this gap is in his air moves. And yes, Mario's aerials do have faster L-cancel times. Usually something like 8 frames to 9 frames, or in a couple cases 7 frames to 9 frames. Add to this, often Mario deals a bit more percent with some of his aerials (unlike any of his ground moves). These are pretty nice. But like...Doc also has his F-air, often rightly highlighted as Doc's biggest advantage, cause he can kill and Mario often struggles to kill. Also Doc's d-air sends in a downward spike angle, Mario's doesn't. So like...I'm not actually convinced Mario's more scary in the air. And he's definitely less scary on the ground.

Wheres: *master hand *crazy hand *female wireframe *male wireframe *mario climbers *giga bowser **SANDBAG* Epic fail

I agree with everything besides the order in F tier. I think Bowser is better than Kirby. Kirby just can't kill. Bowser can at least throw out strong moves and hope their opponent runs/jumps into them, not to mention up-B out of shield. That playstyle is probably completely invalidated in high level play, but you cannot do anything as Kirby in that level of play either

finally, a real tier list. ty ty

I hope some high-level player gives game & watch a good shot. I'm biased but I think he still has potential to prove he's a good C-tier.

*my co worker gave me his gc & a loose copy of melee, havent played this game in 20 yrs, time flys.*

super strong list! if you faced a player representing each character from bottom to top of your tier list, at which character do you think you would begin to struggle?

Young Link having a top 100 rep is pretty crazy. I think he's decent at getting time-outs if nothing else.

Wheres Giga Bowser, Master Hand, Crazy Hand and the Wire Frames?

I'm pretty surprised to see Sheik in the third slot knowing the bad MU's she has against Puff and IC's, opposed to Puff and Falco who don't really have that issue.

You should make matchup charts for characters in Melee! I’m intrigued with how you would do them.

24:08 sounds like Hax$ could have a pocket Bowser lmao

Ness has a 4 frame jumpsquat

Massive W w/ Link > Young Link

Amusing that you started this video off with an explanation of why you have such a big S-tier when I just commented on the previous video that, essentially, I'd want to break that into two. I still stand by what I said there, the short version of which is: "I don't like consolidating down to 3 tiers for this. I think with the characters you're looking at, there are some clear tiers that you captured well in your previous list: - Wins regularly - Wins occasionally - Rarely or never wins, but it is or should be possible - Never wins, and should never be expected to win, but is a threat to upset/make top 8 (and then everything not tiered isn't even a threat to upset, although I might add a few more characters to that final group)." I do understand your point about it feeling arbitrary where you'd split the S-tier though, and in fact I also said: "There's a results-based argument that only Fox and Marth should be in "wins regularly", given the limited pool of players that have ever won majors with any other character, but it's hard to disentangle that from how few players actually win majors at all, so I could see ending this top tier anywhere from after Marth to after Puff." Still, I think picking a dividing line somewhere is better than not doing so, because as I also said (sorry for excessive quotation but I'm just repeating myself anyway): "But I just can't see Falcon belonging up there when Wizzrobe is the only Falcon to ever do it, and has only done it a handful of times (depending on which events you count, arguably only once). By results Yoshi is arguably better than Falcon in terms of threat to win, though I'm not saying I'd put Yoshi above Falcon on a tier list." By not picking a dividing line, and grouping Fox and Falcon together, I think it gives a distorted picture of character viability/threat to win.

They intended her to be a separate character when they allow you to choose her before the match starts.

Imagine losing in tournament to the 17th best character in the game

can't say Kirby is better than Ness. idk if i can even say Pichu is better than Ness. also Young Link being bottom of D, borderline F, is a crime to me. other than that i agree

I get wanting to limit the number of tiers, but falcon gets fucked by every other character in the S tier so I feel like he should be in A tier...

DK bros... we were doing so well...

i feel like young link’s projectiles would give the rest of D tier a lot of trouble

I genuinely think Ganon is higher than everyone in C tier and even Luigi, he bullies all those characters. I’m not saying he’s good by any means, but I do think your undervaluing him a bit, Mekk has too 8’d multiple majors this year with him and even beaten you with the character He struggles with spacies hard, but his bad matchups aren’t that bad actually. Sheik and Fox are his biggest road blocks, but you can learn execution with his CG and he becomes way more dangerous. And marth is rough but CC is REALLY good vs marth, and ganon lives for so long vs him

I respect Haxs attempt at ranking the lower tiers aswell, but he should really stick to high tiers, because he has almost no knowledge about any of the mid/low tiers and just goes by some singular strengths they have. 1. Falcon is way too high (most overrated high tier imo) 2. Mario is way worse than Doc (the fact Mario can't kill is huge, when the main goal is taking stocks) 3. Adult Link should be in B (His only really bad MU are Sheik and Falcon, he has good disjointed moves that are almost all combo starters like dsmash, dash attack and utilt, he has a tether grab which is relatively fast for it's range, he has solid kill confirms on all most the whole cast, he is heavy, has a great recovery and etc.) Link just doesn't have that one player who travels with him otherwise people would easily agree that Adult Link is B and WAAAY better than Y.Link 4. G&W is really underrated (All his aerials are basically high tier level good, except uair; dtilt is super good; has chaingrabs on spacies; can actually scrab because of his jab; kill confirms like Doc almost; good wavedash; high recovery; up b is a 1 frame move I think) 5. Bowser should be his own tier (If you have a big hurtbox and have the worst jump squat in the game, you are automatically the worst character in a game like Melee; no other character shares those two bad aspects, and thats just the tip of the iceberg why Bowser is absolute trash)

Love the content bro

Zelda top tier is DAMN RIGHT!

what do you think about a tournament with only the C/D/F characters?

i cant believe zelda is s tier

I swear Hax made a full tier list 10 years ago. I remember him putting G+W above Doc, and Ness unusually high (likely due to Mofo's influence)

ness is above g&w hes a really shit ganon with dash attack for range and asdi down, downtilt to create weird timings not to mention double jump canceling makes him actually have okay combos against fast fallers he also has charged smash attack to ledge trap, i just dont think people have played him enough (or should)

Falco and Puff could change depending on meta. Otherwise it's a pretty good list. DK should be over Doc.

Genuine question: Is Hax unbanned? I feel like he could be a top ~30? player again?

link has an up-b oos?? idk I agree with most things up to this point

I'm surprised u put GnW this low. I think ur looking at it too much from Fox' perspective. Roy is for sure better than GnW against spacies, but GnW seems way more balanced

cool video

It's sad that the Zelda transformation is so damn slow. Zelda isn't even *that* bad. It would've been really cool if it were actually viable to swap between them frequently like a proper stance character.

Real, true, and based.

Think that Dk is better than Samus. Yeah everyone above him has better neutral, but I think his punish game is just so much better

Samus is good against DK. Nice list!!!

Its fulllllllllll lets goooooo

Falcon? In S tier?

ness has djc bair and uair at least

Can someone explain to me why Pikachu isn't above icies? Is it just because he loses that matchup?

Ufffff you know the top tiers p well my guy but ur knowledge on mid and lows is uhhhhh.... yeah not great lol i will give u a hard agree specifically on YL tho xD anyone who touches YL i just tell them to play Doc. Doc does everything YL does but better. Still good video tho liked hearing ur thoughts and logic imma still hit the like lol hope ur doing great hax 😊

Afraid of the Zelda players anger I see

Bowser is the worst At least for now

you know NOTHING about ness nor have seen any ness gameplay

good vid

Mario is way too high

sure bud, pichu isnt E tier

How about Zelda?

Hard disagree with ganon's placement. He has seen more results than mario, dk, or link. When has the last time any of those three placed top 12 at a major?

Samus over Doc, Ganon and DK is wild. Lol

Dude falcon is not S tier sorry u trippin homie

coo