Game of Thrones WHAT IF: Ned Stark REFUSED Robert Baratheon as Hand of King 

whys that the end? war was inevitable

Directed by: Robert B. Weide

Basically lmao everything was just “this wouldn’t happen and this wouldn’t happen and THIS wouldn’t happen” lol so basically game of thrones would just be life of thrones 🤷‍♂️

@@jasonfarrell00 Cersei would still kill Robert and Joffery would be king. Joffery would summon Ned to Kings Landing. Ned would probably go along with Joffery and accept his rule since he had no time to discover that Joffery was a bastard. Stannis wouldn’t wage war against the crown, Robb wouldn’t wage war against the crown. But if Ned ever discovered that Joffery was a bastard he would be able to join forces with Renly or Stannis and have a better shot at taking Kings Landing. So while everything would be different there is still tons of conflict.

@@SunlightGwyn I mean if he said no to Robert why would he say yes to Joffery lol I'm guessing it'd still be a no. Cersei might not even want Ned to be hand and try and convince her dad Tywin be hand again 🤷‍♂keep her family close during their rule. That's my guess

King Steve betrayal still

george rr martin said he’d be betrayed either way

Still Bolton was there to betray him.

After Stannis failed to sack Kings Landing, the Boltons and the Freys prepared themselves to betray Robb. Robb was only winning his battles because of Stannis's pursuit. While trying to hold off Robb and his army, the Lannisters had to focus a bunch on Stannis. Marrying Walder Frey's daughter wasn't Robb's only mistake, his biggest one in the first place was trusting the Freys and the Boltons. Robb was outnumbered in his war, so I can understand why he felt he needed to align with them, but I don't see how anyone can trust a man who brags about his flaying culture like it's not insane.

King Steve now this is a good question.

😂😂😂😂😂😂

You laugh? You forget the fact that the Butcher's Boy name rung out, more than Marlo's did in their respective stories and shows. 😂😂😂😂😂

@@JayCity10 OK OK bro

Mycah... Mycay... Mahcay... Myc-... My... MuH qUeEn

Ned leaving is the catalyst for the show... Jon would still go to the wall? Didn't he only decide to go because Ned was leaving for King's Landing? List of things that would change on the Stark front: 1. No war of the five kings means no pact with Walder Frey, no Talisa, no Karstark beheading = NO RED WEDDING AND NO GREY WIND DEATH!!!! 🤗🤗🤗🤗 Mission accomplished. 🤣🤣 2. Ned would've told Jon who he really is and who his mother is. That's pretty much it... I'm sure there is hella more 🤣🤣 but I ran a 10k today and I'm #dead... So I will compile a fleshed out schematic diagram later... Btw I like that hat on you like that... it's nice 🤗🤗

Mrz. Robb Stark yes !!!!!

@@NessaBear90 Jon's the rightful king by birthright, so let's be honest, everyone would want him dead: wall or no wall. If only the stark family knew, then it becomes a drama issue and Littlefinger will find this out eventually, then leak it to start his War between Starks and Lannister. Imagine, Ned stark protecting his nephew in a war of the 5 kings scenario. The other stark kids would more or less support their cousin, who they grew up with. If Daeny is killed, then her 3 dragons will seek out the last Dragon Lord, aka Jon Snow aka Aegon Targuryen. Drogon might be a rebellious dragon, but if he doesn't kill Jon in the end, so in theory, Dragons really do have a bond with Targuryen bloodline due to their relations to old Valyeria

@@time391 I don't even remember writing this. Also, I have 0 idea what you're talking about. I love when people try to explain to me things I know about Targaryen blood or about Daenerys or Jon. Lol.

@@NessaBear90 Well, this was your response about a year ago, it looks like. Just saw the video on my youtube reommendations and for some reason the comment was at the top about "what if Ned told Catelyn about Jon?", your assumption was thate he went to the Wall due to Ned leaving. However, I just point out that if Ned told Catelyn the truth, Littlefinger will find out, then use it to start his war between Lannisters and Starks. The only person that might save Jon in this scenario would be Varys, you remember the spymaster, who was working as a double agent for a Targuryen restoration, basically putting back some one of "royal blood" to the throne. In both the show and novels, at least to season 7, he was far superior to Littlefinger in terms of his spying abilities and intrigues.

David Maas The mountain would kill Loras and that would anger the Tyrells against the Lannisters. Perhaps even an alliance between the young wolf and the Tyrells?

Or maybe they would’ve made common cause with Stannis after Renly’s death. Or they could just declare independence.

Ser Devil this is just one example what could happen. This is why i like this scenario. Tyrells wouldn't help the Lennisters in the battle of black water bay, kingslanding would fall, arya wouldn't meet the brotherhood and so on

Shiku Bah idk stannis is too strict and stubborn to make a alliance, hed be more likely to break before he bends

Shiku Bah I don’t know if the Mountain could actually defeat Loras, in the books at least Loras was described as being an incredible fighter, so honestly I could see him winning over the mountain, as the mountain is only really strong not so much a great fighter.

Jose Landa love that one !!!

It would've changed so much

Jose Landa maybe would of made Jon less sulky:)

Melly Mel And would definitely know more then just to give fantastic head.

I don't think Eddard would legitimise him. Eventually Ned was going to tell Jon who his true parents really were, this is hinted at before Jon leaves for the wall. Why? Because Jon would have taken his vows therefore revoking any kind of lordship or Targaryen right to the throne (hopefully not provoking Robert) by becoming a man of the nights watch. It was sort of why he was groomed for it "the Stark's have been manning the Wall for thousands of years". I'm sure it would have been kept hush hush even if Ned did reveal to Jon who he really was, but if not then he would pose no threat to Roberts reign (rebellions etc, being the son of Rhaegar) by being a man of the nights watch, revoking all that he was. Albeit, it wasn't the best plan. Roberts wrath probably would have decreed that Jon die anyway, if it somehow reached Roberts ears. This scenario based on Robert surviving. And, I think as cruel as it was for Catelyn and her treatment of Jon, she would have probably been too sympathetic and motherly to Jon if she found out who he really was and what happened. It would be too suspicious. Why would someone like Catelyn not be slighted by honourable Ned cheating on her, and somehow is okay with raising this child born of infidelity? It's cruel, but it was for the best.

Doctor Emmett L. Brown Would Cersei still pry her claws or would Robert acknowledge him?

Well then that saves a hell of a lot of heart ache, I say!~ Terrific idea

Doctor Emmett L. Brown Well, then.. There really would be no War of the Five Kings. Joffrey wouldn't be be mad because of the incest, and he might've been a good king.

xrx0R 9 Still may have been mad due to how he was brought up.

@@MonTheWell1886 it's made pretty clear in the books that he's just mad, probably because of incest. He cuts open a pregnant cat and shows the fetus to Robert in an attempt to impress him. It most definitely wasn't because of his upbringing

Fear the Pig Gaming No continental war but my girl dies.

cronon xs doubtful she'd die Robert ain't gonna blame Aria just the wolf

A Red Priest will rock his world :P Most likely dead

This is a REALLY interesting one. Arya of course would pretend the butchers boy wasn't there, and she would pretend that she never tried to fight Joffrey. I would hope Sansa would back her sister on this. They would probably say that Joffrey tried to fight the wolf, being wreckless, for fun. Nymeria would be killed, but Arya would fight for her to stay alive. On the other hand, Sansa could wimp out, and bame the whole thing on Arya.

whys that the end. war was inevitable

But they still tried to kill bran after he fell? that would have still happened, and Lysa's letter would have happened too. The starks wouldn't forget this or forgive this. Plus everyone on the small council knew that Cersei's children weren't legitamite. there would have beena war against the lannisters sooner or later, and ned would have rallied behind stannis.

Ahhhh that would've changed a ton eh! I like it! :)

Vlada Jovanovic that would never happen. . .

Melly Mel thats why its a what if

DarthBricksEmpire true .. . . True. . You are :)

Sounds like one hell of a time 😂🤣

he did that one

John O'Malley agree with you :)

No

Andy Alvarez was John the son of Ashara Or is Jon the nephew of Ned? Neat

@@calebtimes453 nephew of Ned. Ashara was the FIRST option we're given. It was NEVER going to be Ashara. If Ned were ANY other man, I might have believed it.

olle engvall what the fuck

@@YorkusPorkus757 It is true in the book robert wanted a marriage between there two houses and myrcella was head over heels for robb

OH YES YES YES. Amazing idea. I will write this video HASTA PRONTO. Thanks Mya~!!

I think it should be TOP 20 or even more

Mya Maola you got your video!!! Wasn't it awesome! Thanks your in put. . . I loved this video!!

I think Catelyn Stark was way dumber than Cersei.

Joffrey still kills Ned and so Robb in revenge kills Jaime. Tywin is mad ! ! ! He will stop at nothing to destroy the North but also make sure Joffrey doesnt stay King.

@@МихаилРадулов-й4т Ned dies before Catelyn releases Jamie and Robb never even hints at wanting to Kill Jamie?

@@DoubleO88 i dont think they knew about his death at that time. Or i just forgot by now.

@@МихаилРадулов-й4т they sent them a fucking coffin with burned bones.

Daniel Stark it’s possible Karstark kills him and then Cersei might have Sansa killed but would Tywin probably wouldn’t let her but you never know

Ahhh that'd be a tough one for sure. Good idea! Thank you sir

He'd b a good king. Would stop the mad kings reign and possibly daenerys. Robert probably wouldn't have rebelled against Rhaegar. Kingslayer wouldn't have been born. Neds death would be interfered with. Rickard and Bran would still be alive. The rivarly with Lannister x Stark wouldn't have existed.

@@KiIIerz and he'd probably make his nephew Aegon/(Jon Snow) his successor, skipping over Aerys. IT's sort of what Queen Elizabeth was rumored to have considered doing skipping Charles for his son William.

@@time391Jon wasn’t his nephew. Aemon was the brother of Aerys’ father. Making him his great nephew.

@@hi-ls6lt Lines of succession at this point would be be interesting. Would Rhaegar's children by his 1st wife or 2nd wife be more legitimate?

Dean Voy they did

No they just sat outside Storm's End with the main force of their army for most of the war instead of helping the Targaryens at the Battle of the Trident or any where else.

Dean Voy Then they could’ve joined Jon Con and the targaeryans forces at Stony Sept and possibly captured Robert if Randyl Tarly was put in charge but I doubt it since Jon Con was hand of king and was prideful back then. A large battle would ensue and the Baratheon alliance would lose but they would still be able to retreat.

Ser Devil mainly due to the fact they assumed Tywin would Join the war on king Aerys’ side

Robb Stark I know I’m just creating a scenario where they pursued Robert, regardless of Lannister involvement.

The Fearsome Noob Ah

Laurence H same outcome, Robb stark calls his banners to go to war

He already did that.

Elite James Jamie probably killed by Robb

Robert Baratheon would go mad and kill Jaime

you do, its just a different Dance of Stags

Me too!

TheBattProductions they’d believe Ned from the jump, unlike Jon

Brainiac BS Lol when though season 1 or 2?

If she did that then they kill sansa stark, while she was still a hostage.

he wouldnt be. because the Battle of Castle Black doenst happen in the same way if a Stark army is there to help

@@godemperorofmankind3.091 well it would still take time for them to get there so instead of stannis it would be Robb or Ned

Jon was always going to join the Nights Watch. Ned wanted him to go because you renounce all claims, so Jon would finally be safe as there is no reason to assassinate a person who can’t press their claim on the throne. Jon even says to Tyrion that everyone else lied to him about what the Nights Watch was like, probably to convince him to join.

Yes, it's pretty obvious that Ned promised to tell Jon about his mom "the next time [they] see each other" instead of telling him right away (or not telling at all) was because he counted on Jon becoming a Crow by the time they meet again. That way Ned could be sure that even knowng he's the rightfull heir to the Iron Throne Jon wouldn't be able to try to fight for it and get himself killed.

MegaSwiftrunner no he wasn't. He mentioned it and wasn't allowed at first by uncle benjen, Ned didn't know about it at that point maester Luwin brought it up since Catelyn didn't want Jon to stay in Winterfell with Ned gone

Shoaib Ashraf actually it was catelyn(mind the spelling) who urged ned to send jon to the wall,while yes jon wanted to go to the Wall, but that was properly ignited by catelyn wanting him sent, that may not be shown in the show, but that was only yo make her more likable, in the books she wanted jon sent and also tried to convince ned to go unlike her show counterpart

jon would have died when he was fighting wildlings south of the wall, bran's wolf saved him and that wouldnt have happened as bran would still be in winterfell.

Then Ned could actually be able to tell Jon about his mother. ;)

Chazman I know right?! Would be soo awesome🤩

In the show he really wanted to go to the Night's Watch, so I think he might still be getting there, and in the show he already is 16. If you are talking about the books you probably are right.

Hendrikjaep The books

Than you probably are right.

These videos are based on the show though, so I see Jon still going to the Wall

no true differences. i dont see him being Iron King because Euron won through his more compelling arguments and promises of conquest. whereas theon would have Asha's plan

jon dies at the Red Wedding

Why? Jon isn't a bastard. Ned knew that. I doubt he would ever let it happen, it didn't make sense. And Eddard had intentions of letting Jon know who he was, it's better for him to be neutral through being in the nights watch than a Lord who could challenge Roberts reign.

Jack Challenge that is a great question

Still despised by his father for killing Joanna, but maybe a little bit more respected for being a 'true Lannister' and not a 'stunted little beast', still hated by Cersei for the whole 'killing Mother and valonqar' shit, even more attached to Jaime (who would totally teach him swordplay). Maybe a little less 'learned' and bookish that canonTyrion, seeing as he would be able to learn to fight and wouldn't need books as his 'wheatstone', but he'd still be very intelligent, cunning and political savvy, way more than his siblings. A little more arrogant for sure, and less compassionate (his compassion is mostly born from his condition, IMHO). He'll may be a respected knight, and by 298 AL, even married with one or two kids.

A potential bride for Tyrion could be Alysanne Lefford: she's the heir of the Golden Tooth, and so the Lannisters would be able to claim this important castle (gold mines and the way to Riverrun) through an eventual second son of Tyrion and Alysanne.

The only reason Tyrion killed his mother during birth was because his head was too big 😂

@@alessandromariotti2252 tywin intended his sons to either marry royalty or a LP's daughter. so my better guess would be Arya, Asha or snap up Margaery before Renly does

Mike Castro if you watch the fight he wasn't trying to kill med just then soldiers I think he would have told med about r+l

Jason Bornot agreedddd

Stannis the mannis could survive. His death was offscreen. We know how offscreen deaths are treated lmao.

He probably just joins the watch or keeps fighting though the North favors Jon.So can't say.

He bleeds out and dies :( Wouldn't be a very fun scenario. The camera zoomed in on his bleeding leg just to basically show that he was screwed.

TheBattProductions What If Stannis won the battle of Winterfell.

Thanks Jill! And SERIOUSLY. It changes everything...flipping nightmare!

A TON would've changed, haha. What a ridiculous - GAMECHANGING - thing, right?

It might be stupid, but even something so ridiculous can have a deep impact. Elia's storyline would have radically be altered, if her mother and Lord Leyton brokered a marriage pact between House Martell and House Hightower. Of all the suitors, Elia liked Baelor the most, until he became 'Breakwind'.

Very possible

Bammm

Great video btw! I've rewatched it a couple times now. Wish you'd gone a little more in depth with the end game bit, but you pretty much covered/nailed most of the major stuff! There's really too many variables at play to keep up with, but it is fun to think about. Like, if that throne room scene with Ned plays out the same, and Renly gets betrayed by LF (this is before Renly's jumped into bed with the Tyrells, I think) or does he have the political savy to offer LF Hand of the King, and prevent the betrayal? Even if this happens, does Stannis still murder Renly with Blood Magic? (or Maybe LF would eventually betray him anyway.) Does Ned even march on KL with either Tywin or Stannis, or does he just stay in the North the entire time, and prepare for Winter? Does Stannis perhaps even march _with_ Tywin, thinking that his brother is usurping his nephew? Or Does Stannis elect to believe his brother's word that they're bastards, and march independently, and in conflict with Tywin as well? (probably the latter) Assuming Renly _does_ still get shadow-Stannis'd, suddenly it's either Margery or LF sitting on the Throne, maybe even both. OR, if Tywin happened to be storming KL at the time, perhaps he takes it back for Joffrey. If not though, it's hard for me to imagine ANYONE (Tywin/Stannis/Ned combined included) unseating the epic duo of Littlefinger and Margery. Another interesting possibility still is Marge marrying Joff anyway to prevent the remaining Baratheon soldiers from flocking to Stannis, and quell Tywin's wrath simultaneously (LF could then even Marry Cersei, perhaps) The only real X factor in either possibillity there is Cersei. In any case, you're right about the Starks being *incredibly* safer. At least until the Long Night comes for them. I think there's a decent chance Ned survives all the way to present day. The only difference with them being, as others have pointed out, Jon might not go to the wall, without the prospect of being alone in Winterfell with Cat looming over his head. (and they have that talk... LOVE to know how that would play out... especially if B+C=R wound up being true and that came out as well...) But Ned surviving if he had just elected to say fook his 'destiny' and stay in Winterfell was mainly what I was getting at when I made the suggestion; I'm glad we seem agree about that, at least! ^_^ Sorry if this was too long a reply, it's just really interesting to think about alternate timelines and such... Which is why you're channel is so awesome in the 1st place! Keep up the good work, man!

Ned would never have done that, unless Tywin threatened to kill Sansa.

Lawrence R what would you have him say???

Imagine he said something like 'YOU . CANNOT . PASS'

UCANOPA

You think so? That's possible! I will say that I think he wanted the Starks very much involved because of, you know who! (his love Catelyn!)

TheBattProductions I think he loved Catelyn because of what she offered as his step up. It's the only love of which I believe Littlefinger really is capable. The Stark fanily was easy for him to manipulate because of their devotion to family and honor, as well as blind loyalty. Especially poor Ned. But I believe that if the Starks were not an option, he'd have devised another plot to gain power.

That's a fair point my friend! Excellent point

Haha. Thank you :)

Haha. I did it!!!!

TheBattProductions thank you for making this one. . . When I saw the title I was like "OMG. . . . OMG!!!! Thanks kev . Your the awesomest!!!!

Hahahaha. I do what I can :) and NO, I did not stream yesterday. Was occupadoooo

TheBattProductions well catch ya next time. It's supper busy this time if year. . . . ..

numbers beat plans most of the time. for all his supposed geniusness, stannis couldnt do a thing vs Mace Tyrell last time around

@@godemperorofmankind3.091 Let's assume Rely gets 100% of the stormlands (extremely unlikely), He's got the reach and the storm lands and is outnumbered by the north and the Westerlands, remember Stannis has the backing of Ned in this scenario. So Renly has a comparable force (at best) fighting against the 2 best military tacticians in Westeros.

@@godemperorofmankind3.091 I forgot to account for the Riverlands. So it's the North, the Riverlands and the Westerlands vs the Reach and the Stormlands. Renly is very much outnumbered in this scenario.

@@datnoob4394 well the scenario to begin with i think is flawed and probably wont happen.

@@godemperorofmankind3.091 I mean it's not impossible that Ned refuses to be hand of the King.

Thanks bud! I certainly would! I'm trying to find a way to make it visually better looking before I re-boot the series.