Removing rust can be challenging but if you give products that are available the best chance they can work wonders. bilthamber.com/product/deox-gel/ A link to the purchase of the Gel. bilthamber.com/product/atom-mac/ And Atom Mac
If you want to get into those rust pits, but some 68%+ HYDROCHLORIC acid and paint it on with a thin brush (USE A RESPIRATOR, NOT JUST A MASK). When it stops turning yellow, the rust is gone. Rinse well with cold water, dry with a cloth then REALLY dry with a heat gun. Now you have 100% rust free steel. I do this with ALL patch panels, even new bright steel. You will be amazed how much invisible "intergranular" rust is present in new steel sheeting, and it is this rust which will spread slowly until it eats all the steel. Kill it before it starts, and the steel will last virtually indefinitely. I use a good wash primer, or Zinga cold galv. Leave this for a month, occasionally throwing water over it to "season" it. I've had a test piece of steel outside for 15 years in a coastal area and there's not a speck of rust on it.
Hi, cheers for the comment, I experimented with some Hydrochloric Acid in the past but found it far too toxic to be around. Not sure what concentration it is, could be higher than 68% I don't know. The attraction was the speed at which it can work but I was put off by the vapors and the rust that resulted afterwards but that was my lack of understanding about the neutralizing after application. What I really like about the Gel is that it is so harmless to use, it biodegrades, is safe to dispose of down the drain, you don't need a mask or ventilation and barely even need gloves. The downside is the speed of rust removal but it's good enough for me. The pros outweigh the cons I would say, but I appreciate hearing your methods.
@@alfaromeo6878It is possible, just very rare and extremely hazardous. From a concentration of 40% HCl will start to vaporize on its own, irritating your skin and lungs heavily. I highly doubt if he actually had HCl with a concentration of 68%.
One look at that crease on the side and i could tell that was an s14, im happy to see one being kept in good conditions, instead of run into the ground.
Well spotted. 👍 this one required a lot of welding but it's nearly done on the metal work now, be back on the road very soon. Some parts are hard to get it seems.
Before i start to "evaluate" your work, i have to tell you, your !"intro" is the best i´ve ever seen on youtouhbe, man, THAT IS FUNNY! 😂😂😂 Your work is brilliant as always, my dinner isn't, definitely too much lactose, so I'd better spend a little time in my bathroom!😵💫 Nevertheless, I really enjoyed following your video for as long as I could!🤣 By the way, I rteally hope you are going on with videos like this
Agree with you completely that you must eliminate "all" the rust otherwise you'll be doing it again later. The time spent prepping the surface is paramount. Great video!
I fully agree. I made the mistake not to do a sufficiently thorough job removing rust when repairing the rear corners of a Mini Cooper, and within months paint bubbles reappeared.
Great work and great videos. To answer your question I think a lot of garages or people just can't be bothered to do a thorough job. I'm a big fan of Bilt Hamber products but as I keep saying in my videos there is quite a bit of hard work and patients in what more often than not turns out to be a long drawn out process to eliminate the dreaded rust completely. I openly admit I'm still in the process of being sure of doing just that.
Thank you. The work you are doing on your Mondeo looks great, really particular which is nice to see. I tend to agree with your comments about the garages. I think money rules a lot of people whether they have a choice in that or not.
I started using the Deox gel some years back, very effective indeed. I use a little mechanical abrasion afterward and finish off with Rustbusters Phosklean B. However I don’t buy Deox Gel any longer because you can make your own far cheaper and it works just as effectively. Powered food grade citric acid, Wall paper paste and tap water. Mix it together = Deox Gel.
We use to do meat plant fork lifts with rust restorations. Because the USDA will out of service a fork lift with rust. What we did was cut old rags that we soaked with rust remover and then wrapped them using plastic bags, or shipping pallet shrink wrap around battery boxes and the alike over the rust. This was preformed at the end of a shift. By the next morning they would be ready for finish cleaning and then repainting. We would use a rust preventive epoxy paint. Most time except for scratches or chips from posts it held up well.
@@jraposo911 It was a two step process after the rust removal. Rust Oleum product. Was a sealer followed up with the paint that has the Epoxy Mastic in it.
Thanks. Wired edged wheel arches have the same issue as an overlapped joint. Just like how the inner and outer wheel arch on this car is overlapped. There will be rust in between the two materials and there is nothing that can be done to remove that rust without taking the inner and outer arch apart or in the case of a wired edge taking that apart and redoing the edge. To protect after the rust has been removed tiger seal must be applied to the inner edge to stop water getting in. If your wired edge hasn't rusted through then you can just tiger seal it and that will slow down the rusting. You can use the method in the video to remove exterior rust around the wired edge and if it's not rusted through your good to seal up and paint.
Good work, you're dead right about getting all the rust off. I prefer 30% Phosphoric acid mixed with a little fumed silica powder to make a gel, dab it on and overlay cling film on top of it to stop it drying out, much faster removal than the deox stuff. I'd avoid the Hydrochloric option too, as it's far too hazardous. I change it out a couple of times, agitating the area each time to help loosen and remove rust from the pits. Be sure to get any rust off the rear of the lip as well!, as if you don't it will creep back around.
I’ve had success with kettle descaling fluid. Mine was a solution of phosphoric acid that turns rust into iron phosphate. Soak toilet roll paper with the stuff and cover with cling film. Dipping the metal is better but difficult on a car body. If you can’t get phosphoric descaler “ph down” for hydroponics is a strong solution. Just paint it on or dilute and use the bog roll method.
Elbow grease works on just about anything. Pair that with a 50/50 mix of gumption and stick-to-it-tivity in a spray bottle and well begun is half done. Just watch your top knot.
I'm currently using Bilt Hamber deox gel on my Z3 sills...Z3 forum advised I leave it until the gel turns murky black..we're talking three, four days, even a week..it certainly works !
I have a 2019 Jeep Wrangler and after poking and prodding i noticed there's already rust in between the lower pinch welds on the lower rockers, pretty much all across. What do think, try to get gel in the 2 layer's or cut the welds out and thoroughly clean? Another option is just spray in my rocker panels with fluid film and leave it alone?
The gel won't remove rust between two lapped pieces of steel. In order to remove that you would have to cut off one side, then use the gel to de-rust, then re-weld. Your best option if it's not rusted through anywhere is to get some cavity wax in there. There are usually manufactured holes where you can inject it in. That will delay the corrosion problem substantially, eventually it will need sorting but you might as well hinder the progression of rust as long as you can.
Ensure the drain holes along the pinch welds are clear of debris. Plugged drain holes hold back water and can therefore accelerate corrosion. Yes, annual treatment with FF will work or get a shop such as Krown or Rust Check to apply to the whole car.
@canuckfixit7722 There are 3 or 4 drain holes on the rockers running along the length but not in between the 3 layers where the spot welds are, the lower lip. When assembled and welded from the factory, I wonder if they primed the metal or not.
@@WilliamVG As I understand it, the bare chassis of modern vehicles are submerged in an electrochemical dunk tank to get the paint in all the chassis holes that you would not otherwise get with a sprayer or brush.
@bensclassicbodywork hi. Its the sills rear end beginning to go. Arches are ok. I cannot find a welder to do the work so I'm thinking of doing it myself. Thanks for all your good videos. Most encouraging.
Isnt a Wurth rust a good choice ? I used it on my car, after I cleaned the spots as much as I can, and it blackens the stop if there is rust. It is supposed to prevent rusting again, idk. After that, I used Zinc spray and then, im going to use primer and color coded paint. But your rust dissolver did great job, well, you did most of itm but it looks mint
Hi, I haven't found a rust converter that actually converts or kills rust. If you scratch the surface, under the black (converted) rust is brown active rust. So in my opinion all they do is remove the oxygen, just like paint does. If there is rust present then it will return without fail. The amount of time it takes to return is a lottery. For anyone spending thousands on a new spray job removing the rust is a must. Not so important if you are at home with a rattle can. Zinc primers are good at preventing rust but I don't use them for other reasons.
The adhesion I found to be ok but zinc primers use xylene thinner, this can cause a reaction with the other primers I use. Had to stop using them for this reason.
I’ve seen painters go over with a diluted vinegar wash and wipe to neutralise the steel it goes orange so I’m not really sure what’s right to be honest.
Nevr tried vinegar but it is possible to use it as a rust remover, don't think it's very strong so can't imagine it would remove anything other than light surface rust. The steel going orange is flash rust, that won't happen if you use the correct product for neutralising. Atom mac in my case.
Great video, time will tell if the rust remover method will work. With rusted bodywork "if it's black, it'll be back". Cut it out is the only sure way.
Yes, anything black will come back as you say. If you make sure the black stuff is gone you're good but if you leave steel open to the workshop elements then any rust remaining will start again. I've left this arch for a month and there is no sign of any rust. I also used this method on a car I painted 6 years ago. It's the red Mgb I did a video on. There are no rust bubbles anywhere on the exterior of that car after 6 years. Good enough for me but as you say if in doubt, cut it out.
From my experience they don't work. When dealing with painting the exterior of cars and spending a huge amount of money doing so there is only one sure way to prevent rust returning at that is to remove it. Scratch into a "rust converted " surface and I bet you will discover orange active rust beneath.
@@bensclassicbodywork Thx for sharing your expierience. I used rust converter on project once. Did 2K Epoxy afterwars etc. but after 5 months it started bubbeling again. Will use your method on a other project, thanks for sharing.
Bodyshops do not suggest painting over any rust. However not all painters can afford to be correct, and if a customer wants a cheap temporary fix then there’s a Fred in a shed painter always hard up enough to accommodate. You get what you pay for in life, either repair it properly or bodge it, sorry temporarily fix it lol.
I can understand there are always going to be the temporary fix people. What I find harder to understand is there are two or three sprayers I know that are decent painters, they have been in the trade a very long time. But give any of them a car with rust and you will see bubbles in the paint in a short time. Fine if you give them a rust free car. I don't understand the mentality, they know the rust is going to come back, they know the customer isn't going to be happy but they do this year after year after year. It could be just the painters I Know have this Mentality and I'm unlucky to know three of them. I'm sure there are painters that know how and will do a very good job. They just seem hard to come by, here in Devon at least. We do have wildae restorations who are high end car restorers, I'm sure they would do a superb job but they are the other end of the scale.
@@bensclassicbodywork are these rust spots not local to the repair or reason it was in the shop in the first place? Painters will only do what they’ve been paid to do these days especially if it’s insurance work. Mainly for blending colour reason they’ll paint over dents, chips etc. There are still painters around who will be upfront with you and say if we were to do all the little bits that will come back we would of re-sprayed the whole car if you get my point. If you was to say to the paint shop please do a bare metal job full resto you’ll have all your rust issues sorted properly anything else will always be patch up on top of patch up. Car restoration in all respects isn’t cheap but it’s a false economy to patch it if your intention is to keep. Job worth doing is a job worth doing properly as my teacher used to say.
@@bensclassicbodywork It looks like one of those Powerstop drilled and slotted rotors that people buy because they think they're cool. And it's covered in pitting and uneven rust. The caliper is all rusty. I've tried cleaning up a caliper and putting new pads on, hoping the rust will just rub off through braking action. What happens is it causes uneven pad wear, maybe the outer edge of the pad gets ground down by the rust. This can cause the pad to tip within the bracket, leading it to bind. Once it binds, that can overheat and warp the rotors, it can lead to the rotor rusting more, allow the caliper to seize, all kinds of havoc. Just change the rotors and pads, clean the caliper bracket and slides, avoid all the trouble. I'm considering an on-car brake lathe, though, since rotors might not be readily available for all classic cars.
Good advice, and I might have to look at the rear brakes then. I need to check it all over for mot soon, no doubt there will be a few things to sort. The car has been sat for a lot of years.
Hi, I like Wurth products, i had a quick look for it but didn't find a rust remover gel. Found a rust converter but that was the closest thing. What was the name of It ? Thanks
@@bensclassicbodywork They do the rust remover in aerosols/bulk jugs & their rust converter in 1l ish plastic pots. Names in Cherman on the aerosols & I cant remember what they call it right now. Will check when I finally stumble out to the workshop after breakfast.
@@bensclassicbodywork it is s converter but it converts all the rust all the way down to the metal, light surface rust gets outright removed by it. Then it can be primed and/or painted over. There is a similar product called total boat, I haven't used it but it may be available. Currently using ospho on my Corvair Monza and it is doing a great job. Sky Co also makes a remover
Ok 👍 I haven't found a converter that works personally. How much testing have you done on this product? You have obviously scratched into the surface to check for penetration. The products I've tested failed at this point.
@@bensclassicbodywork I have triad it with a few different types of rust and this far I've observed that it effectively removes light surface rust and turns the thicker stuff into a different iron compound. It does take alot longer with thicker rust and will need more to do it but it will penetrate. I've seen it likes to pull itself through pinch welds and other small spaces. .for best/faster results sanding or scraping the flakey stuff is a good idea. It also doesn't like greasy surfaces so you do have to degrease the surface if you can. I did try a rustolium product and found they are worthless.
Rust like this sucks. Only those in the southern US or other countries where there is no real, prolonged winter are free of this risk. Why not just wire brush the rusted areas and paint with the special "rust paints" that convert the existing common Fe2O3 (brown) to the stable Fe3O4 (black magnetic)? I've tested paint like that on my cars (I'm in southern Ontario, one of the worst places in terms of damage from exposure to winter road salt) and as long as the repair is fulsome and doesn't get chipped off, it lasts.
Personally I haven't found a paint or any coating that will convert rust. They only cover the rust and remove the oxygen. If you scratch through your paint I bet you will see active orange rust. That's what I've found anyway. I live in the uk where we get a lot of damp days through the year and a rust bubble will appear in two weeks after painting with anything I've tried. The only way is to remove the rust. One of the cars I painted 6 years ago came in for some other work and I couldn't find any rust on it. If rust is removed properly it lasts decades.
Да ну...., Терять время на эту жижу в арке неинтересно) Почистил кораллом ,допесочил либо преобразователем 15 минут и погнал дальше - эпоксид-антигравий-база-лак!
