How to take your Bambu offline for the safest printing. 

It’s easier to hack your phone than your 3D printer. If someone wants your info they can have it. I just don’t get the uproar over this. My dishwasher is also connected to the net. Oh and so is my Intex hot tub, But I’m not worried someone is going to hack it and turn on the bubbles. I would be more worried about your computer, which Is more vulnerable. Did you know MS can turn on your computer join a sat wifi do an update then turn your computer back off without you knowing it happened? Yet no one says a word, but access to the anima figure you just printed OMG!

@@lipinskirl What if you have designed something that took weeks on fusion 360 that you are selling for a lot of money, ie your business/ income!!!!!

@@jeremykemp3782 Can you show me one instance where Bambu Lab has stolen someone’s intellectual property? Also what’s wrong with just passing it on an SD card? I ran an Ender 3 for years where everything was transferred by SD card. It’s only been a few months of having the X1C with the ability to send it via the web interface. It’s a really nice feature, but if I was concerned about Bambu Lab seeing what I was printing, I’d just walk my happy ass into the adjacent room with an SD like I had done a million times before with the Ender 3.

​@@lipinskirlStill there should be a option to completely use it offline, if you like for companies to spy on you then go ahead but not everyone wants that

@@savedemperor8024 I use mine offline all the time. What do you mean “There should be”? You do not have to use the online option.

> Great to see that bambu labs also offers a local network only option, more companies should do that! Bravo to bambu :) Dont most?

@@francistaylor1822 I can name several companies that don't offer any non-cloud support and that will (largely) brick your devices as soon as their services end. Sonos, Ring, Sonoff, Tado, some of those robot vacuums, etc... With a big reliable company that's usually not too bad, but even google regularly axes their products and leaves many stranded (Google Suite for example). Cloud services are very convenient but I'm weary of the security impact and potential future of the devices

Don't use the bambu slicer if you care about protecting your data. The networking library is closed source with no way to audit the code.

LAN-only mode works exactly like that.

I am glad you commented this. I am in the same boat, I cannot believe how people are beyond completely fine with any and every appliance pinging a Chinese server. It really is a testament to their performance and print quality that a vast majority still rally to their defense after turning on in the middle of the night, while calling anyone who is concerned with privacy and security paranoid. I wish I could buy the hardware and leave the software behind, as I understand it, it is needed during setup to connect to wifi and create some account within the slicing program/app. As much as I want a turnkey printer, I am fine either building one, spending more money on and inferior product that does not have internet connectivity, or just not getting one.

Did you want the video? Because I show you how you can choose, as the customer, to use it in LAN only mode and it doesn't use the internet when you do that.

Excuses like “you don’t have to use the cloud”? 😂 That was true when you made your comment lmfao.

@@dangerous8333 - Bambu Lab uses their cloud by default. Not using the cloud is awkward and inconvenient. The IP address must be manually entered every time the power is cycled, or the user must insert a tiny micro SD card into the side of the display, and even then, the printer must always be air gapped from the internet to ensure it doesn't do what the terms of service say, which is Bambu's version of All Your Files Are Belong To Us.

@@dangerous8333 - After Bambu's cloud server crashed 3D printers by trying to print a job on top of a previously printed part and in many cases damaged printers, many Bambu Lab customers have adopted the idea that "you don't have to use the cloud", when previously touting its convenience. Bambu Lab makes a lot of inconvenience worth it not to use their buggy and insecure cloud service.

@@dangerous8333 - I use Klipper to send my files across the LAN to the printer. It works very well and is far more reliable than sending prints to a Chinese server and back to my printer. Honestly, that's just nuts and is completely unnecessary. The only reason to do that is to harvest people's data and designs, and the cost has already been crashed Bambu Lab printers.

Alright, so let's say you want to check on your 3D printer while you're at work, see how the print is going. How are you going to do that on Klipper, or any other system for that matter? It can be done, it just requires going into your router settings and opening up an exception for your machine so you can access it from the internet. That is a security hole, but security through obscurity. No one knows that you've opened up this hole in your firewall. Bambu, on the other hand, offers you the ability to see and control your 3D printer through the internet provided you hook your 3D printer to a web service. It is a value add, and that's the reason they're doing it. Now, do you *need* to stream the print through their web service? Perhaps not. But they've recently added the ability to stream prints through their web app from their makerworld, and that wouldn't be possible without a web enabled machine.

Followup on this. Since Bambu properly implements the inserted/empty detect, just inserting and removing the large card isn't detected, so this is less useful than I had originally hoped.

Fair.

The only feature you don't have in LAN only mode is the ability to use the app on your phone. And there's really no way to make that possible without punching a hole in your firewall and exposing your IP to the world, which is actually less secure than what their doing. I think this is the best possible solution.

Seems a bit excessive, but you do you.

I meant "Wifi" as in the settings on the printer, but I agree it's a misnomer. Wifi != web service, which is what the alternate to LAN-Only mode in this setting is.

Il have to try it again and se.

Gonna need some sources on that one. I have a pihole and wireshark monitoring my networl and no such thing gets uploaded. Where did you get that info?

​@@No0o0o0o0o0 You need tools that could work with spintrol and rockchip.

Conspiracy theories do better if you don't question them.

It is not a conspiracy theory, It is a known fact, that there are atleast 22 websites Studio, X1C or P1* tries to connect. IP model data is as tangible as physical object, that need to be protected and accounted for. Machines can get destroyed and replaced easily, but not the IP that took a lot of effort😅 to create and whose reward🏆 is not fully realized. The least of the issue is a machine turning rogue, and build a 3d printable army of toy soldiers😂. Eventhough LAN mode seems a good solution, it is not, even when using the opensource Orca Slicer, because it needs BL Network plugins, which do not have a source code and can access cloud independantly, that coupled with BL contacting its servers, made Orca implement what is called stealth mode, to ignore contact with BL servers. So, in essence LAN only mode gives false sense of security for ignorant users.😊

@@aware2action I can run my printer with a router with ZERO internet access. Networks arent magic. It wont suddenly connect to the scary cloud. Air gapping tech has been a thing for decades the printer works fine with BL studio and Orca with ZERO internet. I did it just now as a test and lan only mode with ZERO internet from Bambu studio and orca slicer. As long as the computer and printer are on the same, disconnected from the internet, network. So I have direct knowledge of the topic. So how come I can to it if its not possible? Where is the cloud or net access in an air gapped network? You have a choice if you have a bambu printer. cloud, True lan only and sneakernet. If you dont want to use the cloud...you aren't forced to. To posit anything else is clearly FUD and the ravings of someone who's digital heart is in the right place but you need to fill the gaps in your information with facts instead of unfounded conjecture. So ask yourself this question. Are you the type to change their mind when confronted with contrary, factual, data or will you double down on disinformation?

I agree. Especially since I can remote into my computer on my phone, and check my printer through that if I wanted. But a web service like that is the only way to give WAN access without having people punch a hole in their firewall.

and yet, most of us here use a Smartphone every day that sends more private data to 3rd party cloud services than you might think! Stop complaining about all the privacy issues etc, you want privacy? GO 100% OFFLINE and forget about the Internet. That's all I have to say! Like it or not!

Check out the Flashforge Adventurer 5m line. My review for that will be going up this week.

I've never done anything like that myself, but it seems like a common process, easy enough to do. So I'd be surprised if anyone hasn't done it yet. Thr fact that there's been no outrage raised, it seems to me that maybe BambuLabs is acting nobility in this matter at least. But if you get a chance to give it a shot, let me know how it goes.

@@3dpprofessor Thanks for the reply. I don't own a Bambu Labs printer myself, or I certainly would. I've just been researching them while shopping for a new printer. I guess I just don't trust a bunch of former DJI engineers who seem to need encrypted mystery data that they surreptitiously pull off a device loaded with physical sensors that lives on my home network, haha.

I do my firmware updates over the web. But, no, they don't collect everything you've printed with every update. That would be a ridiculous amount of data all at once. Maybe they capture the data when you stream the print to your printer, but as far as I can tell the only thing your sending is GCode, which is stealing 3D models the hard way. Besides, no one wants 3D models, they want name, email, phone number, and location. And more than likely BambuLabs is not stealing or selling any of that stuff. Does it make sense for BambuLabs to make a top-notch industry redefining 3D printer, for which they charge a premium price that the market at the time would have said was a mistake, only to supplement their income by selling stolen data? Because when it gets out that they're doing that, and leaks happen, they will lose all credibility, their business will be shot, and I don't think their CEO's parachute is golden enough to risk that yet.

Glad to hear it. I need to get Wifi out to my shed because I've been doing the microSD shuffle for a while now.

Creality cloud doesn't bother you?

@@3dpprofessor I bought the P1S with AMS this morning, so I'll try to use the cloud as little as possible.

That's smoke. Their "lan only" mode is a button, not a guarantee. And no matter what you do, once you update firmware - you're online. You have no idea if all logs, all your designs stay or go to their cloud "for quality purposes". A machine that doesn't wipe data after a factory reset - is NOT to trust.

I don't know about the P1S, so you'll have to tell me how it goes.

Connect it for long enough to update it, then disconnect it. I still prefer LAN mode, so it's already connected to the wifi. Now, if you don't even want the wifi, well I don't know.

once you connect to their cloud to update the firmware, they will extract every ounce of data and use log from you. they made it so if you want to update firmware you're gonna have to surrender all your data eventually.

@@irbose9895 You clearly don't have one. If you've ever had a support ticket with them it's clear that (1) their log files are a lot of data, even more if it's including model data, which your other replies are implying. And (2) you have to give them the log files, they don't just take them. Meaning they don't have them sitting on their server. Meaning you're making baseless accusations with conspiracy theory level leaps in logic. Anyone who actually has one of these machines can tell you that's not the case.

​@@3dpprofessorNot so quick... Just because the support is poorly connected to the rest of the company datawise, it doesn't mean data is not flowing. If in doubt about the motive just follow the money trail (the data). Always surprises me how true that proverb ends up becoming. Don't get me wrong; I'd buy one now... If it wasn't for these uhm... choices, they've made.

Well, yes and no. I mean, the whole point of the web service is to be able to start, stop, and monitor prints remotely. If they couldn't do that, if you had to confirm web actions on the machine, it defeats it's own purpose.

Fair. Don't look at Creality either. Their K1 runs off a cloud enabled slicer.

@@3dpprofessor thanks forn the info. I will say this tge itch of using the X1 is really hard. Jusy would love for it to run smooth offline and require no activation.

@@JJ-wd4rb I suspect the IOT is going to only have us more connected.

I mean... yeah. What's the other option? Never trust anyone and live your life frustrated and angry?

@@3dpprofessor Learn, observe, reflect and choose wisely most of the time. There is, as you touch upon, a balance between knowing everything (about the tool, the 3D printer) and producing printed designs. I just like to know my tools to a degree to avoid painting myself into a corner.

I find it very unlikely the thought that Bambu made this amazing piece of technology just so they could maybe have a side gig selling off other people's IP.

This is incorrect. You can use LAN or mini SD card.

@@Ulfgrum i did not realize that. Thanks for the correction!

How's the Voron treating you?

@@Ulfgrum you are incorrect bambu pumper

@@irbose9895 Clearly a plant! Oh wait...I use my Bambu offline

Camera seems to work fine in LAN only mode for me, provided I'm using the Bambu slicer on the same LAN, not the Bambu Handy app on my phone.

@@3dpprofessor thats only after the recent firmware update which you would have had to connect to their cloud to gain access to.

Honestly, the IOT is overrated IMHO.

@@3dpprofessor yeah, but cross zone temperature knowledge means you can move latent heat from one place to another, which saves money and fossil fuels. Basically, I like "just smart enough, and no smarter".

I didn't make that word up.

At this time you can only get updates if you connect to the internet. So if you are running LAN only, you don't get updates unless you take it off LAN. That said, a lot of people make a bigger deal of updates than necessary. If it's working, are updates really necessary?

You've firewalled it so it can't get out, and you're still worried? That is paranoid. Listen, BambuLabs didn't develop a top of the line 3D printer and release it for a price that conventional wisdom at the time would have said was too high just so that they can maybe find out how many benchies people are printing. The only thing they care about is making the world a better place through 3D printing. If someone really wanted to put a clandestine sniffer in every home, a much easier way would be to make a cheap and indispensable piece of electronics that everyone wants so they can watch cat videos wherever they are. And would you look at that, China already makes 90% of our cell phone. If not the whole phone, at least several critical components. I'm just saying, if you're gonna try stealing people's data, a niche product is not the way.

Not this one. But I do have a 3D printed tie. Two, in fact.

How so ? p1p being limited

@@jeremykemp3782 that's quite an old situation with the clouds being down.. P1P has weaker control board and does have some features cropped compared to the X1C, such as in Bambu Studio > Devices > MicroSD does not work for P1P. In order to copy files to and from SD card, you have to manually eject it from the printer and put it into computer, even though it has wireless capacity as I print wirelessly from the cloud anyway. I haven't tested extensively pure lan mode, since after that cloud event all has worked fine so far.

I don't know about the P1S.

Thank you@@3dpprofessor

I feel as the reality of the IOT is realized, security is going to become less and less of a promise. On the plus side, a proprietary networking library takes longer to hack.

I'm a trusting sort.

Not really.

From what I can find right now... no. But that seems like something that needs to change.

Not any more. I'm on LAN only mode now and besides not being able to check my print on my phone I can't tell the difference any more. I have full access to my camera and time lapses. It's all very good.

@@3dpprofessor but no firmware update that's how they get you

I don't know about the P1S because I don't have one. I'd have to ask someone else.

That's good to know. I should try it out next time. There's a lot of folks who are paranoid about what Bambu could do without any evidence that they are doing anything, and when they dig and find nothing, they never admit what they didn't find. Yes they send Gcode over the the net, but not the STL there's no evidence that they store it. They have an extensive log file, but they don't send it regularly, you have to send it when they request it. Bambu did have one misstep once. A rooky mistake. And they corrected it. But people are still holding that over their head. If it's the tool that will work for you, use it.

I don't know. I need to get one and try it out.

Did you find out if it works on the p1p brother?

@@anders9968 No not yet , still trying to find out tho

LAN-only mode takes care of the SD shuffle without internet required. The Flashforge Adventurer series also allows for wireless transfer of files. Prusa's MK4 and Mini do as well, though it's... interesting. I've used a handful of 3D printers that have similar functionality and I'm grateful every time.

Don't know. I was wondering this myself. I mean, if it's working, hopefully you don't need to update the firmware. I know on my Prusa I had to roll the firmware back recently because the latest firmware update bricked it because I had a Revo installed.

you can't and it is intentional

I do not know. I was kind of wondering this myself.

Nope. They will force you to eventually connect to their cloud so they can extract your data and print logs.

I mean, I show you in this video how to do that if you want. But you lose the ability to manage your 3D printer remotely, which I do sometimes like being able to watch my longer prints while I'm at work.

Truth is, nothing's really secure. So it's a question of how much are you willing to give up to get what you want vs being secure.

Spares you from looking at the mess of a room behind me.

I assume you're talking about @3dmusketeer's recent disassembling of their logfiles. You must have skipped the part where he was able to confirm that LAN mode was secure. Don't be so quick to demonize something that you skip the facts.

I mean, every piece of software you have could potentially collect information about you. The question is do they have a motive to collect information about you? And since I don't participate in racist paranoia, I really can't think of any reason they'd want to know how many benchies are flowing out of their printers.

racist paranoia? The hell are you on about? ​@@3dpprofessor

In this case, the printers DID have authentication. The issue (as I understand it) was one caused by distributed (for redundancy) print queues. The same print job exists in multiple queues. If queue A goes away, queue B still has the print job and no data was lost. But if queue A dispatches a job, queue B should delete its copy of the job. What happened in this case was queue A and queue B got disconnected. Queue B thought it was reconnected so it tried to sync up with queue A to tell it which jobs to delete. Queue A wasn't actually listening, so when it came back on line for real, it had a batch of jobs that needed to be done and no indication that it shouldn't dispatch them. All the auth is done prior to the jobs getting into the queue.

@@paulpardee ah that makes a lot more sense thanks for the clarification. Although I find it odd they even bother storing the queues in the cloud. gcode are pretty small files you could do it all on the machine and then update the servers. That way if there are server issues they fail in a way that doesn't endanger the machines. But that is just my novice view as someone who gets suspicious when cloud issues affect physical machines

... not really relevant to this discussion, but okay.

when... NOT? Is that even a option?

@@3dpprofessor how are prints starting for people if the printer is not idle? makes no sense.

@@russnbish The prints that were going were canceled and a new print was started on top of the existing print.

3:00 Yup.

That was the one that came to mind immediately over broken printer parts and marital aides…. Even a remotely sent firmware corrupting print file that disables thermal runaway would be even more insidious as the cause and the runaway may not happen at the same time or day. 🫤

Sure.

For sure, if you have designs that you need to keep confidential, do not ever send them over a web service. That should go without saying. LAN mode promises to fix that, but if anything I had were at risk of being stolen, I would consider not using a web enabled device at all. However, nothing I have is particularly sensitive, so I'm not to worried about it.