I Got An F1 Engineer To Test Handling Realism In F1 22 

This was such a fun video, man. The best part about this is that there are SO MANY stones left unturned - we literally just scratched the surface. BUCKLE UP, F1 NERDS 🤓🤓🤓

Would have been cool to also compare this to a lap in the W13 in iRacing

What you can't see from telemetry is that in real life at low speed it seems much easier to catch a slide or oversteer, while in F1 22 the slip angle of the tyres is so wrong that when you lose the car is almost always game over

Am I the only one who didn't expect this guy to have an American accent?

Part of the time gained in the F1 game is in eating part of the track you wouldn't eat in real life if you don't want to experience fernando Alonso Airlines or becoming an incredible fidget spinner

My gripe with traction isn't so much how close it is to real life, as I have never driven an F1 car. It's that the FFB is so unreliable with the Codies game. With other racing titles, I can feel the back end about to go and can adjust depending on how the FFB feels. With F1 22, it's so random, and I have to rely more on visual cues than FFB because there's like a sheer cliff, and not a gradual loss of traction. And when you're busy with other stuff like battling for a position and looking at the opponent, you need to feel the car as your eyes are elsewhere. So the amount of traction isn't an issue. It's that reacting to it is not as intuitive as other titles have made it to be. And don't even get me started on the gear shifting. Esports guys taking a second gear corner in 4th gear and being able to go faster than 99% of the player population. I'm not expecting the game to be a full blown sim, but taking hairpins in 4th gear, sometimes even as high as 5th gear is just beyond ridiculous.

Before changing anything, I think you should try to do the same on a Q3 session on the Hungaroring (GP Mode). Tyre wear will be active and you will be dropping some grip as the lap goes on.

For me personally, I actually think in low speed corners the game is a bit too quick, while in faster corners there is not enough grip (not only on the rear but especially the understeer).

About the traction: you must compare gears used in the corners. You are probably 1-2 gear ratios higher than F1 drivers use in the same low speed corner (every single F1 player uses almost always 3-4 gear for turns that require 2nd gear in real life) so the traction is actually much higher at those gears than real life (in fact you can see in the graph how the gear ratios of higher gears are so messed up, just because of this). You can prove this also in the telemetry because in every single low corner you are carrying a higher speed than Russell just because you are using a higher gear.

Bringing my favourite F1 game content creator and real F1 content creator together. Watched a preview of Blakes on his stream, it is so good.

Did you do the lap in TT? In that case of course you have more grip in the final sector, you have static tyre temperatures

The one thing I do hear regularly, especially from pro drivers I watch play, like lecler, lando, albon all say traction is way harder in the game. Medium traction in the game is closer to the real thing.

I think the difference in cornering speed is mainly due to the unrealistic ability to mount the kerbs

This is cool, interesting and exciting stuff! Looking forward to the next part!

Haven't played a ton of f122 as I've switched over to ACC, but my main gripe was more that the traction when getting on isn't linear. There's no feedback as to how much you have.

For anyone wondering, the only laser scanned tracks in f1 22 is spain sector 3, japan, miami, saudi, imola, algarve, australia and yas marina

I would like to see this done in other F1 games like F1 2020, if possible. I think it would be really interesting.

Great vid guys. Only thing I’d add is I think the main criticism related to traction is the inconsistency + the use of high gears to almost hack what is possible from traction

Brilliant video with two legends in! Very interesting comparison indeed, didn’t think it would as close as that

My thoughts are, that in real life, you have the external elements on the body that plays a big role - which you do not have in a sim. Just the G-forces alone is probably playing a big role in unsettling the driver for the next corner etc. Also the risk of crashing is probably playing a role as well. In a sim you do not worry about loss of life and take more chances.

I came from the other side(Brrrake) and I always wanted to say this after watching F1 co op with Ben. "Let there be peace among us fans" ☮️ thanks for making the series entertaining Alex. Team Ben here.

Amazing content! Looking forward to the next part

Alex, just a quick heads up, if you ‘fix’ the DRS, you wouldn’t be ‘neck and neck’ by Turn 4, the game would be further ahead as you currently lose time on the straights. As in you’d be 0.8s up not just 0.4s. Think you guys got it slightly wrong towards the end there… seemingly some more grip intrinsically in the game so maybe not quite as close as you concluded. Don’t forget also the really tight and twisty stuff happens in the second half of the lap which would compound an increase in tyre grip (likely more than just tyre deg). If you’re doing tyre deg perhaps you could do some more analysis long run lap deltas and see the lap time drop off rate compared to reality? Then you could filter that into an accurate quali deg and then you can isolate that variable and give you some closer metrics on grip differentials etc. I like the idea though… this is probably what game designers have to go through in the first place

Best f1 game video in a long time. Brilliant work I really enjoyed this.

Great video! Though I would’ve had engineer tell us exactly what his real life F1 experience is right off, and then lapped Russell’s Mercedes in the game with soft/med/hard tires. Haven’t played F122 but I think the series bases each teams performance on real early F1 season performance so maybe data trace wouldve matched up better than the Red Bull you drove :) And reading some of the comments it’s funny that some people think they know what a real F1 car should feel like to drive

Very nice video,waiting for the next one

Odd, regarding traction for go on throttle, some F1-drivers (Lando comes to mind, if my memory isn't too far off) have said that the game-cars have less traction out of corners: simply put, the real F1-cars have more grip, they don't spin off as easily, when going on-power.

This is excellent informative content. Well done!

This is such a cool video. Please please PLEASE do more videos like this and more collars with him!

Looking forward to part 2!!

Really, really love this kind of video! So cool to see what the differences are and why the game might never be fully realistic. EA should prob add a new game mode to duplicate the the real world. That would be good for the hardcore fans to try and master.

Great video. My question for @brrrakef1 is: if power, drag and traction are roughly correct, then why don't drivers take all the corners in at least 4th gear IRL, like esports drivers do?

Really cool video bro!!!!!

one thing that you shouldve mentioned about tire grip is that in time trail it doesnt degrade. therefore you have optimum tire grip at all times. Also about the thermals, when you do a pitstop in a race. the first 1,5 laps are much harder to get up to pace because of the tire temps. i feel like they should extend that.

Alex man love the content as usual..my go to to get my sim racing fix for sure. Question though what are your CSL DD GT PRO wheelbase settings for F1 22!? I can't seem to find that sweet spot and dial it in, so please please help me out man! Anyone else all advice and opinions are welcome!

on tire wear: is this being compared with a full weekend setup in f12022? from what i understand about tire wear in the game, it's relative to the length of race, so 70% of the 5 lap race has the 'same' tire wear as 70% of an actual race (avg 40-50 laps)? im not an expert, so some feedback would be appreciated.

Great video🔥

The problem in the game is the AI, they always get perfect traction out of a corner, it's frustrating when you're 2-3 tenths back and they just disappear out of the slow corners, I've tried keeping up with their lines and traction, but just spin out every time even with short shifting

This is a really cool idea

Absolutely epic been waiting my adult life for something like this lol !

Ok so the stats are similar to real life... but has he ever tried F1 22 and experienced the force feedback?

I wonder if the type of grip (lateral vs longitudinal) is the big thing here, it looks like there's more grip when turning and all of that, but seems to be on acceleration where there's no grip in the game. Perhaps the way they simulate that is incorrect, but you'd have to really dig into the numbers to figure that one out.

8:45 that was cool.

There’s a yt by Niels Heusinkveld, you know him, does pedals and programming, on how there are no conclusive models for tyres. Not even at professional teams or manufacturers. They just don’t know all that’s going on under there, so you can’t program for it either

Really appreciate the effort you guys went through to analyze all the data but there is one variable that people seem to miss all the time when comparing the game to real life. Real f1 drivers drive the car in a cockpit. Makes a massive difference to racing lines, brake points and acceleration out of corners. A true comparison would be if Alex drove around the track in cockpit view. Alex wanted there to be little to none track variables and just car variables but the biggest variable is the view. I hope this exercise can be done again with the gamer driving in the cockpit. Would be way more accurate.

Now rewatching this video this is exactly what they did in f1 24…..

This is great viewing. ❤

You should definitely compare these results across all tracks, or at least a fair few of them, otherwise you will have confounding variables like track grip differences etc. Why is Hungary a super accurate one…? I would also ensure to drive exactly the same lines as the F1 drivers if you’re looking purely at driving physics. Little things that help the games be more playable for a wider audience (like kerbs with amazing grip) are abused easily in esports and make unrealistic driving lines as it’s faster in the game. If you stick to driving just like an F1 driver it should eliminate this. Also race fuel differences game vs reality would also be an interesting one to look at maybe? Idk just a thought

Awesome idea

I'd love to see Codies hire some engineers to help bring some insight into the game cause a lot of the games features are so stupid, like no downshift protection

The traction is actually good on F1 22 when you race in high downforce circuits, so I think Hungaroring is not the best circuit to do the traction comparison. The thing is in real life drivers are taking some corners at second gear and on the game we have to take it on 4th or 5th gear to not loose the car. It's not good at all. Nevertheless, great insights on the video!

Blake bloody legend ⛳

i would have gone with miami tbh, or one of the newer tracks, cus budapest isnt that accurate to irl, but codies' newer tracks are much more accurate. maybe even australia since i believe that uses actual laser scan data

I think the traction complaints are not in general but are specific to wheelspin oversteer on throttle

I think one reason why the game is faster and has better traction is the condition, in time trial there is always a perfect condition and also no tyre wear (maybe the say it also, didnt finished yet d: )

I would like to see this but then with the iRacing W13 :)

This would be amazing with the iRacing Merc F1 cars

What you really need to change is the camera(t-cam to cockpit). Otherwise you can't compare it exactly like you trying to do(you see way more in t-cam).

It will helps a lot to if they make the track like real life

Interesting and nice to see that it’s actually not a million miles off all things considered. However, it really ultimately comes down to does the game “feel” like you’re driving a car and connected to it, and for me, that’s where the codies / EA F1 games fail. Which is a big shame because F1 has been a huge part of my life, all my life, and to not play the games is a shame, but they just dont feel good in my eyes, accurate data wise or not.

F1 22 does not incorporate wind effects. Is it possible the real-life lap could have cross winds that may have affected lap times?

Should try this in the w13 on iracing

Im so used to hearing blake waffle & joke about on his podcast, its easy to forget this guy is insanely smart & great at his job😂

can you do this video concept but with the W13 from iRacing?, i think it would be closer to real life

you should do this but with the iracing w13

Tbf Hungary quali the track was a bit damp I think

Ensure that you are not on time trial though. There you have always optimal temperatures and no tire wear! Play a 100% length weekend.

9:00 and 9:28 Am I dumb or is this a wrong conclusion? Alex loses time on the straights as the DRS in-game is less powerful. Yet he is 4-5 tenths ahead in turn 5. So if you make the DRS more powerful as in real life, you'd be even more ahead, not "neck in neck". You already gain a lot of time in the corners in the first half of the lap, not only in the second half when the lack of tire degredation becomes more relevant. So you just have overall too much grip, which is even enhanced in the second half of the lap. Which could also be due to setup, as you're just faster in most corners (funnily enough not in all of them though, maybe that's due to track inaccuracies in the game) but slower on the straights.

Hungry in 2022 qualifying and the race was overcast and the track rubber was low due to rain. Also hotlap mode is trash for realism.

It would be way more interesting if you got him to analyze data from an Asseto Corsa lap, cus that's an actual sim

I hope ps5 will do it in vr!

If they could make it more like an sim than a game..

Imola is the best track for 1:1

Why is this video without sound ?

I don’t think traction is difficult perse, but it’s unpredictable.

What team did he work at if anyone know?

The outcome is somewhat very misleading and they compared wrong things to each other. Alex lap was done under normal F1 22 shifting (perhaps slightly lower than you would go) but still higher than IRL and Russells lap. So essentially they are comparing Alex in third gear on the apex and throttle out of the corner to Russell whos in 2nd gear at that time and does no shortshifting, while Alex is arleady in fourth when Russell just upshifts to third. That makes a comparison impossible as traction is obviously different in every gear. Alex should instead have done his lap in the same gears (or as close as possible) as Russell. Because then the outcome would have been completely different as George is flat in 2nd gear and Alex wouldve had to be much more cautious while putting power down.

based on this analysis, can anybody publish the mod can correct

now make a mod based on these findings

Go on career mode do a quali = tyre wear Problem solved

Interesting

I dont understand how the traction is comparable. Russell uses 2nd gear on exit of T1 and obvviously lower gears all thru the lap. Alex shouldve done the same thing and then compare the laps. He uses higher gears (which is normal in the game ofc) so he gets better traction. So isnt the end result completely misleading?

i think it would be better if you did a quali lap not time trial

I always felt f1 22 was very close, can't wait for part 2!

That’s not bad is it ? To all those people that slag off this game !

So hear me out….if we always ran 100% tyre pressures it makes it much more difficult to keep the tyre temperature down and therefore makes it where you lose a ton of lap time. Is that what we should run at every track if we want the game to be more realistic?

"F1 engineer" who only has televised digital brake data 🤓

Great content, so codemasters is indeed doing a good job, this is going to piss a lot of sim racers who never been in a f1 car. But wouldn't be better to do the test in a practice or qualifying session and not in time trial?

Entry understeer sim into corners, power oversteer out of corners, super high gear just to remain grounded out of corners. It’s absolutely not realistic, I think I will listen to MAX, CHARLES, GEORGE who have all said it’s a bucket of shit

Imagine thinking the F1 game is a simulator. You want simulators you go to assetto corsa.

Your using TT it has optimal tyre temps at all times...

Fantastic Video but Why did you do this in time trial mode ? As it has NO tyre deg ! So this data is worthless & unfair in comparing the truest F1 22 simulation as turning tyre deg ON would effect every metric, especially traction which everyone complains about. On the next video would be cool if you could turn ON deg. Comparing the evolution of the tyre through the lap to real life & see how true it really is!☺️👏❤

I hate you Alex 😡😡😡 Im a huge fan of Ben 😅😅😅 Anyways love you guys I really enjoy Co-op best of luck guys ✌️

Well, the entire comparison is based on one lap where you don't lose the traction. So how the heck can he tell if the traction is right? This is a fun concept for a youtube video, but given how significant and divisive the matter of traction in F1 22 is, it seems like a negligence on your part to draw any conclusions from such a limited data set and then to suggest that people who play the game for hunderds of hours are more biased than a person who saw a single lap where the main issue of the handling model doesn't even occur. This is as unscientific as it gets, borderline manipulative.

Yeah not the best doing tt, the car is always at optimal performance with no drop offs

Most deluden red bull racing worst control in high speed curve

Of course this dude drinks water in a nalgene bottle at home. Lol seemed like that kind of guy, I was right.

0:02 not realistic at all

video out of sync .

Not realistic at all, can the F1 driver hit reset and try again if he crashes from pushing too hard? While the sim racer has no worries about what happens if you crash the car? Maybe add a feature to the game….every time you crash a car you have to pay real money to fix it…like $1000 repair fee to continue using that car or lock the game until it’s paid.