INEOS America's Cup Yacht Reveal 

For sure, especially compared to the peanut gallery at the New York yacht club

nahhh... vittorio d'albertas, sail ring. much more objective

Totally. ✅💯

Me too, im actually disappointed when its not straight after, but understand why it isnt! More content from Mr Mozzy!

Glad you enjoyed it!

These boats are rigged with mainplane and tailplane, nut in an aircraft they get longitudinal stability by using the tailplane to press DOWN relative to the mainplane. It the tail is designed to lift it'll need constant adjustment to keep a steady pitch.

@@bobwalden5853 I think that was part of the problem with Patriot, or more so with Defiant, as the had the crew far enough back that it seemed they were relying on a not insignificant degree of rudder lift.

@@weatheranddarkness I think you've got the problem sussed

You and me both!

Great analogies. Foil riders also generate more foil lift by (body) weighting the leading edge of the foil dont rhey? Also, when an AC75 nosedives it might be nice to have some buoyancy in the nose😂

Could moving the rudder forward decrease the turning circle (ie, tacking arc) of the boat? That would make Ineos more maneuverable. Otherwise I don’t see much advantage. More downforce equals more drag equals lower speed.

We live in hope....

Mmm

so it would possibly be good in a narrow window?

@@spare9434 That’s my take on it. Whether that’s a low wind window or high wind window…my intuition only takes me so far! Over to the intellects, for their hypothesis 😊

@@breakinghabits_II so like some formula 1 cars, it could lack the ability up operate in a range of conditions

@@spare9434 But unlike F1…this has a set position for its rudder. Is it set for a large range of conditions or just one? What Merc have done with their front suspension (made it moveable up/down and can be set for a specific track) could be some inspiration for the sister team Ineos for their rudder. Perhaps have a couple of positions to suit the weather conditions of the race.

Isn't there an assumption here that the original rule and placement of the rudder as far after was by default correct, maybe Ineos have determined that this may not be the case. Far from an expert here but I can't believe that such a decision would have been a huge consideration for the designers. Guess we will see soon enough.

You got it!

I might go down to the CBD on Monday and have a nosey at her.

Flew? It's a freaking missile.

@@jamesaron1967 How can you tell?

Modern aircraft do indeed have tailplanes that pull down for takeoff and landing, but in cruise the tail is offloaded by moving the CofG for efficiency.

These are such high apparent wind machines that there is practically no light air - over the sails and deck.....except when taking off. Surely they looked at rules re minimum windspeed for racing and planned accordingly.

You pommies can't help yourselves when it comes to this.

Hope Mozzy is right in that it is a better boat because team Ineos needs it. In the standard 40's their sailors dissapointed.

Mozzy gives an analytical assessment of what the designers may be trying to achieve, you call him a fanboy. Very good mate.

As mentioned in the video, INEOS do their own thing and while they may not have pulled it off last time, not many challengers do first time around. It's a bold departure from the norm, which I think is worth getting a little excited about as a fan, more so if you're British, but also a little apprehensive about if you're not, like this kiwi 😬

Your hurty feelings caused by the empire?

One Italian expert thought it would get on its foils super quick compared to others. But in other aspects he wasn’t convinced. Time will tell.

if anything waves favour a boat balanced centrally over the main foils unreliant on downforce or lift from the rudder, because it's easier to keep the main foils submerged. we've seen it already in the f50's where losing rudder downforce on mark roundings in high wind/wave conditions is probably the leading cause of pitchpoles. so relative control will come down to how far each team is off centre balance, if ineos is less far in front than other teams are behind they should be less susceptible to that issue

​@@rydenkaye9735I would have thought that a boat that pitches further forward would be more susceptible to pitch poling, especially if the rudder is pulling down, no?

@@jasonpickens9839 yes, that's what i said. the relevant factor is the degree of pitch the boat naturally has, not the direction, so if the ineos boat wants to pitch forward less than other boats want to pitch back it will have better control. but if the ineos boat wants to pitch forward a ton they will have higher risk of pitchpoling because if they lose rudder they're going down the mine. if you lose rudder lift instead of downforce it also often results in a pitchpole fyi because the boat pitches up increasing the angle of attack on the main foils making it jump and then crash down so it's not really like one is worse than the other

@@johnmartin7158Likely to be the opposite but if so then it's a world beater.

That takes me back!

No the role is to increase righting moment. Rudder moved forward means you loose torque to pitch=you need higher «effective lift » to pitch . So if negative lift is needed on rudder to maintain flight (which seems to be the case with crew forward and foils backward) , the effect of forward rudder is to increase righting moment!

This was similar to my thoughts. A couple other theories/rank speculations. Getting the boat out of the water in low or rough seas and keeping it out of the water may just be what they are targeting overall. The other thing these changes make, beyond moving the CG, is that they reduce the rotational inertia of the boat which has dynamic considerations - for example potentially improved maneuvering and tacking. Looking at the shape and where they have shape I partially wonder if there is some effort at getting aerodynamic ground effect/compression lift. With the CG shifted more aft on other hulls that may not matter, be possible, be pitch stable because the center of lift would be far forward as you make the air work...but if you can make it work and then move the CG to optimize around it they may see an advantage. everyone else seems to be aimed at a combination of managing clean airflow under the hull and I'm a little surprised we haven't seen more high risk tradeoffs to use that space given the high percentage of time spent on the foils. To the forward mounted rudder - its worth considering whether they are seeing the extra potential leverage (and reduction in trim drag) as a false path to chase. Moving the rudder forward reduces its power, but that may be preferred in certain conditions. E.g., you can make more precise control movements when the same angular adjustment creates the same force but at a reduced lever arm. Another potential point is simply - if it is pulling down, the consequences of it leaving the water are far higher. In that case the small increase in trim drag may just be the cost they pay at their optimal point to keep the boat upright. In sum, they seem to be chasing a different optimum point - there are always multiple. If you think about how right ETNZ has gotten it several cups running it may simply be the consideration that chasing their path can only leave you chasing them and taking risks and seeking other optimums is the most likely path to beating them.

I too was wondering about the increase in drag from the rudder. Surely less leverage and greater bite would offset the gains. But then here we are and INEOS have built it that way. And so far they're the only one to diverge from the relatively coalesced designs of ETNZ, Luna Rossa and Alinghi.

@@benjaminweslake4174 it could be another W foil or an actual advantage 🤔

Meh. It's perfectly possible they might be competitive but not win it.

Not a bad strategy in a competition where famously where 'There Is No Second'

Just like in cycling and F1...

Yah, either Ineos have it extraordinarily right, and the others have it woefully wrong or vice versa. Time will tell if the experience of Italy and Team NZ mean anything in their designs. Cheers.

@@jaysdood Or the other way round. If Ineos wins the challenger series and handsomely win it, Team NZ will have their work cut out.

The catch 22 is that you don’t win by building the same boat as everyone else

Sir Ben, you might have said, will fall on his sword?? 😂

This must be Bens last chance.The fastest boat win and team GB consistently produces slow boats