When you showcase Sonja games, I'd consider turning on the option that hides Sonja HP when it's not her turn. It can remind the viewers about how confusing it can be to go against her.
@@DeejusProductions I honestly forgot about that mechanic, but honestly, I personally love seeing it since it is a very real part of the Sonja experience.
it is actually not that confusing because the in game % percentage does lie so as long you you are not hitting sonja units on no defence terran you know how much hp it has left.
You definitely were prepared with that counter fighter and it makes me wonder if Spoot suspected that once you revealed your neotank, that you would assume he'd counter a bomber, and instead did a neo to take you off guard. Lot of good plays on both sides, great match commentary.
Honestly this taught me more to hold off on tech-ing up as Andy. His repairs does not come as often as when you just build tanks and infantries, and it may invites the opponent to tech up too, which is unfavorable since bigger units may one shot more of your units instead of the usual and predictable tanks that you definitely can wall up to prevent one shot. And less units because of a tech up means less units to utilize the movement bonus and firepower too.
EDIT: I see some people aren't happy about my slow play. Just a reminder I'm not breaking any rules. Believe it or not I can spend a long time weighing possibilities especially in the fog, and sometimes I'll put the game down and come back and see something differently. if the global league timer gets changed on my behalf I'll have a chuckle, but it won't be a big deal. 26:25 Fun fact, my power gave me vision of the black boat and I debated putting my 6HP tank on top of the com tower and occupying some key shoal squares with infantry to prevent your tactic. I ultimately decided against it because I felt it very likely that you would have a 2nd copter in support (which you did, just not in position). Besides, your black boat might not actually be carrying an infantry right? Hasn't your base been busy making vehicles in response to my pressure? Am I willing to sacrifice repairs on my tank? Personally, It's a lot of fun considering the web of pros/cons behind even the smallest decisions. We were both feeling the stress this game; My recon getting spanked right out the gate, Going days with no response to your neo, and planning for a potential Andy SCOP every turn while maintaining pressure is a slog. I've always been the guy that frustrates everyone for taking too long in whatever game we're playing lol. Tbh the stress exacerbates this, but the stress is also proof of passion for the game! Thanks for having patience with me, and thanks for the work you put into these videos (and games)! Also, Day 26 your black boat has 1 fuel left. It was so annoying I was looking forward to watching it sink :)
Out of curiosity, why did you not build a bomber when you saw the Neotank? As someone who plays Sonja a lot myself I was as confused as Deejus was when you built a Neotank instead, because the first thing I thought was "Spoot builds a bomber and runs it to the front line" You had Counter Break roughly around the time the Bomber reached the front line which protected it from a counter assault from the AA around as well, and having the Bomber as a constant threat backed up by tanks and AA to stop a Fighter (But the Bomber would have paid for itself by then anyway.) The only logic I had was like mind games, you don't build a bomber because Deejus thinks the most logical step is to make a bomber in response to the neotank, so he will build fighters and AA to counter the bomber, so I'll instead build neotanks and make his investments useless.
@@tmscribble5889 I mean Andy fighters are also insane units because it's impossible to kill them in one hit, so maybe it wasn't build to avoid running into fighters (which would have been a correct assessment)
@@tmscribble5889 I'm not the biggest fan of bombers, so on some level it's personal preference. It's true that Counter Break makes the bomber invulnerable to anything but a fighter for a turn, but outside of that turn it's still a very expensive unit that is vulnerable to his AA, and I reasoned his neo's dominating presence gives him the luxury of overcompensating for air threats (there will be lots of AA if not a fighter). Also, my neo benefits in roughly the same way from Counter Break as would a bomber, so I think of that as 2 sides of the equation canceling out. In the end if I'm gonna invest 22,000 in a unit I prefer it have the flexibility of being able to take a punch on the average turn. Sonja's day-to-day prefers this as well.
People often forget that Fog is very Psychological and very stressful to play. The best Fog players are those that can witstand the stress and manage to pull in Through till the end. It's the reason I gave up on Playing fog, as it was just too stressful and I like to play casually (That and turns often take 5 days before I finally get another move)
It's funny because I find FoW to be less stressful than Standard because Standard players are (generally) more precise and clever in their tactics in general than Fog, where there's an element of guesswork that makes it possible to occasionally trick players better than you into bad spots. In STD it can be extremely stressful in games that are less scrappy where you have to be immaculate in your walling and overall unit placement if you don't want to immediately get put on the back foot. That and because you can't hide units, certain CO's are particularly annoying to deal with when it comes to calculating possible wallbreaks or even gaining charge from otherwise poor engagements. All this, and not to mention that with both players having full information, it makes comebacks less likely especially with income advantage disparities.
I like playing fog, but sometimes need to take breaks because I get stressed out when I keep getting the error messages popping up while trying to see what happened in the replay.
Spoot roleplayed as Sonja and won using her most powerful day-to-day power: psychological warfare. The ICC later indicted Sonja for grave breaches of the Geneva conventions.
The K/D is SO deceiving at times, so true! I think there weren’t any joined units during the game, i think the unit count difference wasn’t what you thought cause you were making copters like every turn which upped your unit count while Spoot didn’t, also your Hyper Upgrade turns repaired a tonnnn giving you more unit value. Great game and great video as always ❤
Mecha actually make a lot of sense for Sonja. Their fatal weakness is they die to a first strike, but with counter break up they turn into brick walls than not even tanks can afford to attack into.
Heart goes out to you Deejus. Having tilted/burned out several times while playing AWBW League, I can definitely relate. I no longer play League, cause of its asynchronistic nature had me checking out my phone too often XD Look forward to seeing you reach 1600 someday. Cheers!
That was so gutting! I dont think you could have worse feeling than after an outcome like that. I cant imagine having 1 game be active for like 4 months lol, no wonder the tire got to you and bamboozled your game senses. WP. thanks for awesome replay
DAMN you were winning so hard, tough resign, kind of a life lesson it feels... Sometimes we think things are getting worse than they are and we dont take a minute to stop and think about how they are really going. I found it really interesting how Spoot was always making sure he killed all your units, feels like he made you hold off on the power for so long and that gave him the chance to use so many more powers than you did, maybe it`s what kept him in the game(even though in reality he never was in the game, but obviously you couldnt know)
dont be worried Deejus u are such a great player take ur time u still making an excellent work i would say thank you for all the work and time u invest in the AWBW community i really enjoy every stream and commentary u upload :)
Last comment, having finished (sorry for the four!): *thanks for sharing*. It sucks that you got in a bit of a hole from the pressure and publicity. The number of people watching, though -- isn't just because you're insightful and one of the world's best players -- it's also because you're positive, you make things happen, see right to the heart of things. A couple of losses and a ranking dip is a good moment for a break, but it won't drive away your viewers. When you're back with a banger, we're here for it
Great vid and interesting ending. Even tho i love advance wars to death, i stoped playing adwb two months ago because of a similar reason, fog games giving too much stress to whithold. for me i definitely got better with your videos and hope you'll keep entertaining us for a long long time still :D
Yo Deej. The stress gets to all of us mang. Take as many breaks as you need dude! We all love the videos and want em whenever you make them. But make sure you take care of yourself first bro bro. Thanks for another good one man. Keep on keeping on!
Good to see even the big players can make horrible mistakes and you even made a showcase from them so we baboons can learn from them mistakes, cheers for the great video
Wow I was not expecting that ending. Interesting game. I haven't played much with or against Sonja, but one of the matches I had not too long ago was in high funds. Counter Break is surprisingly obnoxious when it comes every other turn.
Followed the video through in detail to figure out the deal with that one "confused" Infantry who faces the wrong way. It's Spoot's pre-deploy infantry, beginning right up in the top-left corner on day 1. It steadily migrates its way down the south of the map on Deej's weakside, before coming to an untimely end at the 17:17 mark RIP, confused Infantry. A befuddled soul for a bemusing, perplexing match.
I think Spoot got in your cahoot. Any other opponent and you murder them. The losing track record was eating away at you for sure Deej. Great game and give yourself more credit. You're an orangutan Teaching us Baboons how to play. You'll get him next time for sure.
Late comment but endings like that are especially why I love playing fog. For a majority of the time it's better to operate based on the notion that you're losing a match so you're encouraged to optimize your decisions. You can't really have this feeling in standard, but at the same time it's really frustrating when you resign and see that you were winning
I don’t know why in each turn I feel that Spoot had the advantage but when I look the units’ value and count I see that Deejus had the advantage. Maybe because Spoot had a better units positioning
I think it could be cause for the +1 vision of Sonja. It give you a incredible advantage Vs COs without agresives powers. And make you able to choose the combats even if you are losing the mach.
Man that shit was grueling, but also exactly why I love Sonja matches. Sonja's dominance on the map makes sense to me as. 1.) Sonja's main weakness is wall breaking but this map is so massive and spread out that forces are usually scattered thin enough for her to not have to worry about deathball pushes/major walls. Even if the opponent has a death ball Sonja can just move her forces to other areas. 2.) From a Sonja offensive standpoint, the distance of properties and terrain makes it easy for Sonja to stand right outside of other CO's vision and attack on her turn. Nothing that can keep her from just sitting 3 tiles away from properties. 3.) Properties on this map are easy to defend but hard to attack. Forests favor the defenders and properties are clustered thus the person who has them can heal while the opponent has no way to sustain themselves. This is why there were so many enhanced visions popped on this map. Sonja did not have to save up for counter break because she just needed to position around whatever was in the nearest forest. Even if an opponent pushes in, they will lose everything because they'd have to retreat back so far, seceding anything they'd have taken. Sonja constantly using her power is what allowed her to stay competitive in the match despite her macro blunders earlier on. Andy's power is all about timing and while it has amazing potential, it isn't widely applicable and thus Sonja was allowed to make plays left and right while denying Andy the ability to play his game. (This is why I believe Andy will never be a consistently strong pick against high elo players but is a great noob stomper). As long as Hyper Upgrade never had value, there is nothing Andy has to make plays. One thing I noticed is that the fighter could have been a more active threat since you could have just hyper upgraded it. As long as it wasn't hit by 2 anti air in one turn, it would live on 5 HP and be fully healed upon power proc. It spent so much time sitting around doing nothing.
I think that sonja can shine in a pvp match where you can psych out your opponent - "I thought there was a huge army out there" is a pretty legit war tactic!
The map name (Ardennes) is loosely pronounced "Arr Den", or from some people "Arr Denn-uh" -- the S at the end is silent. It's a hilly forested region stretching across North-East France, Southern Belgium, Luxembourg, and Western Germany. Key region in both World Wars, and a fitting name for a battle map peppered with mountains and forests.
I did this once, and since I never resign in fog until I'm completely sure I've lost, instead I just yeet and see how it goes when I would've resigned normally, that actually got me quite a few wins too in the end too, because people have resigned games when I went full yeet because they thought they were losing instead. The imperfect information can really get in your head, especially because you don't know if the opponent has been base skipping or joining.
Your summary at the end has a lot of very relatable points for me. I love Advance Wars, but AWBW definitely sucks the life out of the game sometimes. I'm a bit of a move planner hater, I really think it ruins the experience as it no longer becomes a game of who is the smarter player and instead becomes a game of who has more time on their hands to find the most optimal turn through trial and error... I personally just don't care enough or have enough time to invest to match that type of play. I also don't want to match that type of play - chess has timers for a reason, that same concept applies to Advance Wars. This play style then leads on to what you mention where people then take an entire week to take a turn, which is just so ridiculous and it saps the interest in the game. Feels like another cheap tactic to grind the opponent down and force a quit through that rather than their skill. I play Advance Wars for fun, and that is just not it. As you climb the ladder (I got to over 1200) I find that these types of player become more prevalent unfortunately. Not saying I could be a 1500 player, but I honestly think you reach a ceiling without the move planner where it's impossible to realistically climb any higher. Anyway, I enjoyed the video, always do! Please keep them coming, your commentary, insight and overall demeanour are incredibly entertaining!
Sometimes i really wish AWBW had a live ladder, my biggest complain honestly, every time you feel like playing you have to come to terms with the fact that in reality that actually might just take months to end
I like the approach (partly for its novelty) of leaving fog up so we relive your experience. On similar lines, it would be cool if you tried replaying one of these matches from just 1 side someday to talk about how someone saw through the fog. Perhaps pick someone who predicted their opponent really well, then play us through from their point of view - and only at the end recap with fog off so we can see how things were really laid out
played over months!? in your next video can you explain the time setup as i figured these were just played over like 30 mins or something! Loving watching this btw, didnt know people still played :D
They do not play at the same time, after the match starts every player has X days to do their turn, gaining X days whenever they finish their turn. So one player can do their turn and the other checks in 3 days later and do their moves etc.
Damn, I feel ya. One of the most annoying things in FoW(or the other modes TBH) is when it's a slog or even stalemate and at the very least the opponent doesn't take the hint to request a draw. I'm glad I don't care about MMR so I just resign or throw those games and move on. I understand tho when people say the games can be stressful. I recommend just playing unranked public matches or with friends. When there isn't MMR or a tournament over your head, games are more fun.
Why do you expect the opponent to “take the hint” and send a draw offer? If you think it’s a draw then can’t you just send the offer yourself? I’m confused by this sentiment.
Are you going to make a list ranking types of monkeys and maybe plays associated with that ranking? I feel like sometimes there isnt consistancy with calling things chimp plays, baboon play, etc.
I think Sonja is the most psychological CO in a Fog game just because of +1 Vision and hidden HP. Then add in Counter Break to stop a push without much effort and she should be constantly winning the information war. You played well, but I get it that stress can be a factor to leave a situation.
Fred is just sometimes a bit confused, though others might see him as an rebel. anyway it is nice to have him. I have seen the match before, I am really curious about Deejus his perspective.
@@conehed1138 It doesn't count differently, but when you build a copter, you're building an extra unit (producing from all bases plus an airport). If you're building a extra unit for 5 turns, you can theoretically be at even unit count even if you're losing by 5 in K/D.
My stomach churned when you said the match lasted a quarter of a year, wtf that's fucked up. Also, the game saying you were down 15 units is complete bullshit.
I think there should be a stricter time limit. It's absolutely ridiculous to take months to play a single game... Also I kinda have no respect for people who take so long to take turns, reminds me of classmates who studied a week and took more than an hour on tests that I didn't study for and took me less than 10 minutes to finish, just to get the same grades when I was in school. Only with this, you gotta wait for your classmates to answer each problem in order to answer the next. Eww I hate it more the more I think about it.
I dunno this match REALLY illustrates the one thing that annoys me to no end in AWBW - people get WAY too long to make their moves. You should never be a month behind your opponent, it’s honestly disrespectful. You don’t need a week to plan each move and I say this as someone who move planners everything. It’s caused me to step back from the game to the point I’m only playing one match at a time, we really need a live league or at least a much shorter timer imo. Like two weeks in the bank starting then only +1 day per turn
100%. I think it should be majority live play tbh. I just want to play a match and move on, I don't want to be playing the same opponent for weeks (or months). It sucks to wait days in between turns, then you have to spend time remembering the game state, what you were planning, if fog, where your opponent was hiding, etc.
@@JohnPaul-nb5iu Honestly I just don't think that's a sufficient answer to the issues I raised sadly. It's not the same without the competitive edge & no one should need as long as they give you. I think the timeline I proposed is very reasonable
Not a fan of the nonvision on the enemy. I'm not planning to actually "watch" this video, but it's on my second screen and check it now and then to see what is going on. And it just removes a ton of information about the match by hiding the other side.
I mean? Knowing what each side actually sees on their turn is kind of the point in a fog match? That's part of the game? I know that some plays do include the other team's units but i think it's fine either way.
@@draconicfeline6177 Definitely! The way the match is played you'll just see visible movement and units of course. For a video explaining a match I'd rather see the full image. But that's a matter of personal preference.
