They used their Ai and it lied to them - this is just what expected greed makes shortcut and all those genous were fooled by what they call "ai" Guess next Intel wants to push same Ai design on all Intelchips so everyone can experince the same experience as Intel - Good times
10nm vs 5nm. They increased the power to keep up with amd 5nm chips and that's what caused them issue in there. Big mistake... A Very Big Mistake. Let's see what will be the future with Arrow lake (tsmc 3nm or intel 20A)
@@tao4124 When I got into building PCs, it was the other way around with AMD pushing their bulldozer-chips to (for the time) ridiculous power levels... but these chips didn't burn out. The Fx-9590 was rated 220 Watts.
@@KR4FTW3RK intel uses over 250, but problem in some cases seems to be cache that was changed between 12 and 13 gen, and 13 gen was 11 month rush job, and 14 gen is just a refresh
Imagine thinking intel needs to "keep up" with amd. Check their price caps. Like saying the USA needs to "keep up" with Cambodia. I'm sure Cambodia is beautiful and has many nice things. But let's be real. They might lose some sales for these chips. But that's a hiccup for them.
"...a bunch of electrons dance on a rock" is so funny, yet accurate it hurts. Building a processor sounds like the hardest job ever. The resulting product is magic to me.
I mean, we did figure out how to turn lead into gold a while ago. The problem is that it is very energy intensive and the result is usually radioactive. So turning sand (silica) into something worth more than gold was a close second.
It's honestly still bonkers to me that we don't have to pay 1000s of dollars to get a chip that can run billions of operations per second with such precision... the absolute ingenuity behind getting this to an affordable price is bloody impressive
i do always use intel and always given better than retail unit too, i did buy ryzens on some machines and they all perform very well, great gaming cpus
Yup, this is the year (well next year more likely) AMD will completely overtake intel on the desktop, laptop, and server and intel will become the minority share of the market. I could honestly see Intel failing within our lifetime if they keep this up.
Intel was dead to me the day they integrated the Intel “management engine” on their chips totally outside of the users control. Even Andrew Tanenbaum, who wrote the OS it was built from, has decried it as thinly veiled spyware.
@@thathandsomedevil0828 . Nobody knows, but I'm sure its function is to open your device's 4ss-cheeks to Pegasus, why? Because Pegasus is sold for millions of dollars, and it even includes customer service! That business would not be viable if Pegasus depended on a vulnerability (as it's often said) that can be discovered and patched at any moment. That means Pegasus takes advantage of hardware-level backdoors: "Intel Management Engine" (for Intel) and "AMD Secure Technology" (for AMD). Supporting this theory is the fact that the FBI requested computers without any of those backdoors.
Been playing WoW for 20 years, never had any significant issues. Until i got an insane gaming pc last year with one of those chips. Nearly had to give up playing, crashing every 5 minutes and spent dozens of hours troubleshooting. I defintely believe everything that is being said in this video.
@@axjkhl7699 i didnt say i only played wow or that i played 10 hours a day, did i? But no, why would i think that? It's been a blast, made great friends and other stuff. What was wasted?
I usually never comment, but today I made an exception. Why? Because I want you to know that your comment is really funny, and I after a few minutes still have a smile on my face Keep being badass!
Here's the truth, a little bit of inside info: There is no bad microcode, the mobos are not broken, there are no flaws. The issue is with the CPU's architecture. You see, since the 12th gen intel started including the Efficiency-cores. Now those cores are running on the same bus as the Performance cores. With the last 2 gens (13th and 14th), to keep up with AMD, intel just drastically increased the clocks. This clock increase is severely heating the bus between these chips. It was not designed to run at these frequencies and temperatures, hence the obscene amount of crashes. Intel knows this because the guys from the QA department brought this up to management and management said "Fuck it, let's just milk these last 2-3 years since we are on the verge of releasing the new re-designed series." This is why they avoid doing anything because they know they can't fix and it's why they've been shifting the blame for so long. They are pushing for time. I know the whole story behind it, I simply chose to stay quiet for a long time because of reasons. I advise downclocking to 4.4-4.8ghz and the cpu will operate flawlessly, unless yours is broken after such a long time of running at the high clocks.
How did two generations of processors launch without Intel noticing the issue during QA? I imagined their QAs were very thorough and exhaustive, that is an epic failure.
@@ilikecybermen1036 Uhm I guess literally not focusing and putting employee-skills at the top where DEI could directly or indirectly affect the quality of the whole company and it's product. Especially what OP said, Quality Assurance.
I personally purchased a 14900k and immediately ran into issues with the video memory issue you mentioned, spent weeks going down insane rabbit holes and replacing everything. Only to find out that the default bios settings essentially cooked my cpu, fast forward to me ordering a 14900kf, undervolting, and using all the recommended power settings provided on intels website... only for the 14900kf to slowly fail over time as well... Intel has pretty much lost me as a customer for a very long time, I've had no issues with either of my AMD systems.
I ran into a dude who insisted that failure to undervolt an Intel K-processor counted as user error. You don't have to worry about Intel running out of customers any time soon.
Pretty sure the "don't be an early adopter" motto reigns supreme to this day. It's never failed me. If you look at every hardware manufacturer, they have stories like this throughout the history of time. Intel, AMD, nVidia, Apple all of them. This isn't something new. It comes with territory of "having the latest and greatest" hardware.
This exact thing happened to my brand new 14th Gen i7 laptop I bought for work. The motherboard lasted 2 months. Luckily I bought it from Lenovo and I think they did applied some firmware that declocked the CPU. The tech guy who came to my house to fix it said that they were purposefully overclocking these chips and didn't care that they were going to go bad but didn't think they would start to go bad this quickly. Hopefully, they'll do a recall on these and I can get my money back if this continues.
If not, there is one tool that enables the hidden bios developer mode (if that backdoor is still there) from where you can reenable userspace under/overclocking and voltage control. Another method was holding fn while off and swiping your finger over some keyboard rows then turning it back on.
Wow, I didn't realize quite the bullet I was dodging when I got a cheap 12700k a year back rather than something new. I even got a free NVME drive with the open box motherboard (hiding under the heatsink). Crazy luck in retrospect.
Intel (burning inside)™ 14900 L Sewage Lake aka (Sandy bridge refresh refresh refresh refresh), now with 500W total power dissipation and 1% general improvement compared to last gen competitors* *=on 65W power saving config 2133MHz memory clock Talk about snake oil salesman tactics... (They accused AMD officially)
Yeah for AMD it's great. For consumers, not so much. If Intel shits the bed completely, we will be eventually facing another Nvidia-level monopoly, but this time in the CPU world.
People forgot that previous architecture had a problem with hyper threading and Intel solution was.. turn it off, both for old chips, and current ones that don't have it anymore. Don't know if it is incompetence, or planned obsolescence, but is close to becoming a pattern.
Amd was known for their chips burning about a decade ago and fixed the issue and left intel in the dust. the only people that still use intel should be large businesses that refuse to change and still use massively outdated intel chips. Amd outpreforms at every metric and has for a long time, including cost
This is a crazy vid. Thanks for reporting on this. I started having these issues almost year ago on my 13th gen. Drove me nuts. Thought it was nvdia the whole time but then managed to narrow it down to my CPU. Disabled all my E cores and now finally no more crashing on anything... But thats like a majority of my cpu...
If u want high quality Ryzen cpus it’s better to get the 7800x3d (expensive but is stable and rivals both 13th and 14th gen intel cpus in performance) the 7600x if your just trying to get on am5 (still a very capable processor)
I still run 6th gen. Meanwhile my mom has 3rd gen. Neither of us has any issues. Then again we both aren't really power users. I game occasionally, but it's mostly sufficient for the kind of games i'm playing
I have an I5 14500k. I thought it was just me who had this problem: my PC would crash randomly and blue screen. My browser would crash some tabs and say that I didn't have enough memory. I reinstalled Windows, and the issue persisted. This video explains a lot!
@@gildg7806 I thought about that, but the problem is that it would be too expensive. Switching to my current CPU cost me ~ $500$ because I needed a new motherboard.
@@gildg7806 we are going to witness AMD become the new villain in the CPU market. I am sure they are going to increase their price tag because the completion will likely die for a while due to Intel's idiocy.
@@ilxplaycope harder. Then your Intel that eats almost 4x more power to barely catch up with AMD will get 9% performance hit before going out in flames. You can then quote Cheech and Chong's "up in smoke, that's where my money goes" xD
It's not like every failure results in a crash. Imagine all the non-crashing data corruption these could be causing. Definitely won't be getting a PC with one of these in it.
After the patch: Corrupting things no one notices until it's impossible to trace 😅 I think it's their new marketing strategy to sell more chips - they just turned the dial up too much at first.
I bought a 13600k for my new (first) build. I enabled the intel default profile and it has a massive cooler (idles at 35c). I'm praying that my i5 will last. If not, I can't waste time switching out the mobo. I'll just get a 12700k.
@@adreto2978 issues can be in all raptor lake chips, including i7s and i5s, also laptop chips.Yes, on warframe posts>75% of crashes were i9s, but in the rest you had 14700 and 13700
Mine has been stable for over a year. I did however change some settings in my (gigabyte) bios the moment I got the chip.. In case you are interested: limited the wattage to intel recommended, disabled all gigabyte overclock settings, set the ac/dc loadline preset to medium (which slightly increases the base voltage iirc), undervolted the chip when under heavy loads using the vf points. (-100mv when all p cores are at 5.5-5.8ghz, -0.8~ at 5.4, -0.6 at 5.3 etc). I also reduced the SA voltage to 1.2v from the mobo default 1.28v. These settings have left me with a perfectly stable chip so far and no performance loss in benchmark. My ram is running at 7200mts with tuned timings using buildzoid recommendations and some experimenting myself. Hopefully I managed to accidentally fix my chip before it started degrading lol.
Oh shish, I would stop trusting intel after their infamous tripple bug on all processors that was 5-6 yrs back... bad luck anyway, you don't expect to be that scammed bying from intel
@@Bramagonyou have an unlocked chip right? So why purchase an unlocked chip just to do all this? This means they basically are false advertising their unlocked chips and their is no reason to unlock them
@@cameronroman506 Undervolting can increase performance while reducing temps and noise. This was the main reason I initially experimented with these settings. Unlocked chips also tend to be the better binned chips that allow for bigger undervolts without having to lower the frequencies. Overclocking nowadays doesn't make sense because the chips are already pushed to their limits by Intel. Also, another reason for doing all this is because I like experimenting with my hardware :p.
Bite the bullet and go with AMD . The 7950x3d games are waaay smoother. I think the lags and micro stuttering was related to my 13900k. So far the 3d cache and ccd works correctly 💯 of every game. The newest AMD drivers and uefi updates fixed everything
Got a 13th gen chip this past year. Been in contact with Intel for months with these exact problems, specifically issues at X referenced memory. Intel has been "clueless" about this issue when discussing with me and won't cover the warranty replacement or refund. Have had more help on random intel forum posts and reddit from other people who have these issues. Finally, I have been able to get a SOMEWHAT stable fix when underclocking the voltage, but still super disappointing.
Holy shit yea that was INSANE. The fact that even got approved, and went through the upper management who thought "yea, this looks sane, lets put this out PUBLICLY" is bonkers. Gamers nexus ripped them a new one :D Like holy fuck, that is really what helped with my next cpu being amd...
This video validated my experience with my 14900k for the last year... ive had every single one of these problems and have had to underclock using extreme tuning utility to not bluescreen constantly. Im so mad i didnt just stick to amd
Admitting it publicly, means admitting fault, and admitting fault means admitting liability for a massive class action lawsuit, and and admitting liability means line go down and line goes down means no extra billions.
"Diversity, equity, and inclusion have long been Intel’s core values and are instrumental to driving innovation and delivering strong business growth." I mean they say it right on their website
First time ever to use an amd for me was at the beginning of the handheld pc era and I must say I'm really impressed! Took it a step further and decided to try one of those pre-built AMD eGPUs and again it hasn't disappointed at all! Watch out Intel!
That's what happens when you just keep dumping more and more power into them instead of making actual architecture improvements, just to claim the highest clock speeds. Doesn't matter how high the clock speeds are if the chip burns out and doesn't work, you get no clock speed.
Their at the very limit of what architecture improvements they can implement. Problem with Intel is they refuse to spend a dime on improving how much cache their stuff has. Intel machines could be lightspeeds faster if they simply added more cache to their chips.
@@honkhonk8009 Cache size depends directly on transistor density, and this depends directly on manufacturing technology. As Extreme Ultraviolet Litography is reaching its limits, improvements in manufacturing have become ridiculously costly. Intel produces it's own chips, while AMD uses services of TSMC. TSMC benefits from industry wide funding (for example, they also make Apple chips). I don't think Intel "refuses to spend a dime on improving how much cache their stuff has", it's just insanely costly.
Phenom? FX series? LLano and any other APUs? Sempron? And don't even get me started on Single Core/Thread performance. Sure, you might have 256 thousand cores, but that doesn't mean much when 99% of software can fully utilize four of them. Want to play the milsim ARMA 3? Better not have an AMD.
Uh you know what , Arma likes cache. You know what lots of cache is in? X3D. Even crappy optimised games like star citizen runs faster with that cache.
@@TheeGlocktopus Did you just wake up from some sort of experimental cryosleep program?You're about a decade behind in your Anti-AMD trash talking. Intel chips usually have way more cores than AMD chips nowadays on account of them tacking on 6-8 "efficiency" cores to everything. Hence we get "14" core i5s that perform like an AMD 6-8 core cpu but will win in multithread benchmarks that use the extra "efficiency" cores. You're also behind on the notion that only 4 cores get used. Alot of AAA games in recent years really suffer or won't even run properly on anything less than 6 physical cores. You're supposed to be complaining about AMD cpu firmware having bugs at launch or Zen 2 processors being in the Zen 3 lineup, or something like that.
What if Intel knows what's the problem? Meaning unfixable hardware mistake. CPU's would have to be replaced, which would be super expensive for Intel. They will rather say we don't know the issue, if your chip dies, buy a new one.
Wait. Isn't AMD an American company too ? Driven by the same moral values as intel and boeing ? That is greed, and more greed ? It's only a matter of time before similar issues happen at AMD (outsource anything and everything to india and wherever, don't raise employees salaries, raise top management's salaries to silly amounts, cut costs on innovation, etc...). Our hope is that the Koreans/Taiwanese/Japanese take over this industry.
@@johnsmith-ro2twZen 5 will be a real wake up call for a lot of people. It's obvious AMD is positioning itself to announce some insane MSRP's with Ryzen 9000 series.
Loaded up on INTC puts after watching this video when it was first published. At the time of writing intel is down 30% in 1 day. Thank you fireship Edit: Typo
Funny, when raptor lake was first shown off one of the primary pr pushes was insisting that constantly sitting at near boiling temperatures was actually just fine for the cpu and the silicon could handle it!
So around a year ago my coworker was building a new machine and it keep crashing and that thing uses a i9 13900K. He sacked the CPU over to me last February and I couldn’t figure out why it was crashing randomly eithe. I ended up contacting intel support to see if I can RMA the thing, but then told me to turn on Intel Fail safe mode in the BIOS, which then stopped those crashes. That was back just back in May. I mean, I got a free CPU, so I shouldn’t be complaining, but I can’t believe this shit is only being discovered now. I legitimately thought this i9 I have was just a faulty one off
I am so very, very, glad that I went with 12th gen Intel. I bought my laptop 6 months before 13th gen came out. Having "new" CPUs coming in 6 months was a concern of mine but I went with the model I chose. Phew, that was close.
I had a problem with Vbox and VMware where enabling 3d accerleration would lead in a 99% chance of the guest system crashing. I thought this was some kind of NVidia problem but no, probably my 13th gen intel core i7 processor.
Insane that I a comment about this, literally like 20 minutes ago I had to turn off the 3D accel because Ubuntu wouldn't start after upgrading from 22 to 24 LTS. 13700KF too, guess we're all fkd
This literally happened to me 2 months ago. Had a i9-13900KF shut down, bsod, gpu error, screens turn off all randomly degrading over time until I RMA'd the thing, had it replaced with a i9-14900KF and literally had the same issue and had to be replaced by yet another 14900KF.
If there is a trade in program in the computer stores near you, you could use it to sell your Intel motherboard and parts and trade it with AMD Ryzen processor and motherboard at much cheaper additional price
3:17 You literally took the words out of my mind. I'm running a 12700k and I'm so glad to not have went for 13th or 14th gen. Will be moving to AM5 and 7800x3D
I've crashed twice in two days. Its been right after launching valorant and as soon as I load into the game the first time. When I reconnect after the reboot there isn't an issue. Got a 24hr ban for it hahahahah.
Underclock and undervolt doesn't solve it. Heck some say the opposite might be needed. This is a complex issue and it seems like all of these CPUs will deteriorate at some point. I would consider returning it if possible.
You know everyone was using intel to avoid this instability issue that was present on ryzens? 😅 Just google "is intel more stable than amd" and look at stuff from few years ago.
Just had my first BSOD yesterday while making a RAR file. Confirmed that making a RAR file tanked my 14900k, but Cinebench was fine. After updating BIOS with the new Intel mitigations it's working for now.
Since I built my first PC at the end of the last year, I had instability issues with my 14th gen, and it was sad. I read dozens of posts online, videos, even reassembled the whole cpu cooler thinking I had applied thermal paste wrong... I can add that I got it stable by running at default settings with latest BIOS AND (important) disabling XMP1, so I have to run my 128 GB RAM at 4k MT/s instead of 5.6k MT/s. I even stopped sending games crash reports because I assumed it was on my end so not to confuse the developers. So it's relieving to see this video.
I did not noticed as I dont watch this crap from longer time :). Initially I watched but had very bad opinion about this channel. You can notice right away it is not about reliable information or ethical but more "show" and "hype". He does not mention probably because she would make harm with "sponsors" (but as I does not watch it from longer time i can be wrong of course :) ). Ps. There was also other controversies with Linus later after i already dropped watching this channel.
The Linus Tech Tips channel is mostly an entertainment channel now. They don't really ever do dedicated deep dives or videos about news. At most you get a TechLinked video with a 2 minute segment on it.
Maybe because the core issue is still under investigation. So that's why the main channel still hasn't covered this news. But Techlinked has certainly covered it a while ago. They don't want to rush to make a video about this thing currently. They learned their lesson of making rushed videos.
LTT really has nothing to add to the conversation here. It would make a very boring and unsatisfying video with no conclusion. Bascially only repeating information from other sources. This is not what LTT usually does on the main channel. Something like "The Most UNRELIABLE Gaming PC" would be a more LTTish way of covering a topic like that. But not as long as the story is still evolving.
I'm glad I'm still running an i7-7700K. I can still play all my games at the highest settings. Windows 11 doesn't officially support it but it runs fine, so I've gotten about 7 years out of this CPU so far. I'm hoping to get at least a decade before I even consider upgrading.
So glad I went all amd this time, no melting power connectors, no unstable chips with glaring design flaws. Also was much cheaper while being only 10 percent behind
You might be able to prevent or delay issues by making some changes in the bios if you're willing to experiment. My 13900k has been stable for over a year. I did however change some settings in my (gigabyte) bios the moment I got the chip.. In case you are interested: limited the wattage to intel recommended, disabled all gigabyte overclock settings, set the ac/dc loadline preset to medium (which slightly increases the base voltage iirc), undervolted the chip when under heavy loads using the vf points. (-100mv when all p cores are at 5.5-5.8ghz, -0.8~ at 5.4, -0.6 at 5.3 etc). I also reduced the SA voltage to 1.2v from the mobo default 1.28v. These settings have left me with a perfectly stable chip so far and no performance loss in benchmark. My ram is running at 7200mts with tuned timings using buildzoid recommendations and some experimenting myself.
Even my 11 years old ivy bridge 3470 is running well to date. I keep it running for weeks sometimes as I have to use VMs for some work that takes time to start/shutdown (I'm too lazy 😂). It's still stable after running 24/7 for couple of weeks without single restart, unless Windows 10 f*king update kicks in.
10 years ago this year went to university to study computer engineering because I was fascinated by hardware, specifically Intel. Sad to see how far they have fallen in a relatively short time.
My understanding of the issue is that Intel's 12th gen processors were fairly good, but in order to get 13th/14th gen (they're basically the same gen, fight me) to market, they had to rush the architecture design, and they rapidly adapted 12th gen into a new architecture by adding more little cores and cache, but in rapidly adapting 12th gen into something it wasn't quite meant to be, they introduced the issues. I'm pretty sure future architectures won't have the issue, as they're ground up redesigns, but I'm also not sure enough to recommend my friends anything other than AMD until I've seen next gen intel chips lasting for more than two years.
If this were the case, Intel would quickly solve the existing problems, everything would be as transparent as possible, and silence most likely indicates that: either a deep quality check is being carried out, and I think that's why Intel is postponing the release of new products (maybe I don't know something, and that's just my guess), or a very expensive solution is required to cover the cost of marriage, which will radically change the approach to production technology
you mean the 12th gen that finaly can catch up to ryzen 5000 when 10th and 11th gen failed ? dont be foolish, every Ryzen 5000 CPU is better then a intel 12th gen for sure and upgrade path of a 12th gen to 13/14 is something nobody want to risk even on a used market in a year.
@@allxtend4005 In this context I meant "good" as in terms of reliability as it related to the specific issue in the video. Generally I've preferred Ryzen processors overall for every generation they've released as it always felt that they offered better value for what I wanted at the time, but it's not as though Intel chips haven't had reasons to buy them, as well. It's more a matter of what tradeoffs you're willing to accept, what you need out of your processor, and if you do custom workloads to the metal that can take full advantage of all the features available which you're paying for when buying the processor.
So glad I went with a 12400F, no problems, from a 4790K. 12th gen works just as well to me for what I need it for. Bonus was migrating from DDR3 1866, SATA 3 SSD over to DDR5 6000 and NVme M.2 SSD. Kept the same GTX 1080ti, with aftermarket Morpheus cooler. Maybe I will get another run for many years out of this, like the last setup.
I own a 14600K, and some games like Terraria, and even Steam itself can crash the entire system. Happens on every OS, and even emulated games. Im starting to think that the CPU is to blame here... Anyone else has this issue?
holly sh*t, that SSD and ram corruption is actually vey serious. gonna have to regularly be making sure all my backup scripts have completed successfully just in case my ssd's get corrupted.
That's what happens when you do 100% vertical and horizontal manufacturing integration. Intel was stuck on 22nm node for years before it was able to shine it with "difficulties". Now we know the difficulties are there because they do not have tech to do smaller nodes very efficiently and make flawless chips. Jim keller left or was forced to leave within months because of this, for those who don't know him, he's a vetern in chip designer who has contributed to almost all companies who designs modern processors so most of us are using his derivative works one way or another. AMD switched to Samsung and TSMC until global foundries did catch up and there are still few more years before AMD will switch back or start making other chips with their good old friend. In my experience of hardwares, recent hardware have failed alot more than old ones so it's common to question quality of what we are getting for what we are paying. The per clock performance is almost stagnant since a decade now and more squeeze is happening in pipelines and lookup and retiring logic these days. Intel is known to be notorious, for example MKL was defacto supressing performance on non intel chips, which is now outperformed by other BLAS implementations working even faster on Intel chips and AMD chips as well. The company has alot of shady past, this is great example of how monopolies can not stay forever if they are overconfident. AMD was 4B company a decade ago, look at them how they evolved with good leadership and strategic research with limited budgets and market share while competing against 4 major companies ( Intel, Qualcomm, nVidia ) and many other smaller companies in mobile, server, desktop, GPU and telecom sectors.
