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I had no intention of buying an e dirtbike....until now. Thanks for opening my eyes. That KTM would be awesome in the back of my truck when camping. It wouldn't bother other campers in the area.
@@justinteixeiravaz I got an Electric Motion ePure Race. I can ride from my garage to the park and anywhere else with the same power as a 300cc and nobody says a word or hears it!
I wish I could turn back the clock even just 10 years just don’t have the money for either one it would open up a whole new world for me simply amazing 👍🏻
I don’t know if this has been said but, go back another day and swap the ride order. Start on KTM and then ride the other. See if warming up on one changes the results on the other.
This machine will go fast enough to hurt you. Im impressed. I appreciate this stuff, the bikes are getting better so quickly. These vids are getting it done...
Just rode one today (Sur-Ron), as a 450 owner/rider myself, the Sun-Ron definitely feels more like a electric Downhill Mountain Bike. However, it was still a blast to ride (in the snow/ice with studded tires), I’m sure the KTM would be even more fun to ride 🤘🏻
I would expect the KTM to be able to thrashed. KTMs rule and have lead many innovations in offroad motorcycles for years, forcing the Japanese adopt same. Obv they have dominated off road racing in the US for years, and of course World GP MXbut had little success in SX/MX in America until they took up that objective and started actually sponsoring riders in America specifically for US racing......
@Bryan Dickerson Haha, so true! It is without a doubt a lot of fun making these videos! The tough days don't often come through on camera but I can assure you there is a load of behind-the-scenes effort to make these happen. Just glad people like you are watching. Thanks for your support Bryan! 👍
can strongly reccomend a new controller on the surron... changes the feel entirely even with the stock battery. gives about 2x the torque low down, difference is smaller at higher speeds (battery limits the power) but still pulls a bit harder and just 'feels' lighter/more agile.
@@ElectricCycleRider well the nucular gets my recommendation in any case, lots of control over the response rate and a v. good controller all in all... about 1/3rd the size of the original despite 4x the power :P
Electric Cycle Rider - electricrt.com/sur-ron-upgrades/ BAC8000 - $1000 72v battery pack - $1500 Extended range 52Ah option - +$500 The controller/72v battery upgrade inceases HP from about 13 to 24! Top speed inceases to 85mph as confirmed by Jack Cecil on his YT channel.
@@__-pl3jg Sadly ERT doesn't have the best reputation, see regular complaints on FB and ebike/mx forums re issues with support, some even claiming they're blocked when they ask for help... Normally i dont put huge stock in FB complaints but in this case I've seen ERT put 10G wire on controllers that can put out >800A... thats just dumb in the extreme, will overheat in a few seconds of full current (that said, you'd be talking ~800Nm of rear wheel torque at that point, ignoring saturation... so you wont be pulling it for long hahah). The BAC controllers are only resold by them anyway, the controllers themselves are great, good 2nd option when you really want to go over the top :P
Random Person I appreciate you posting this information. I think the SunRon is a dandy, but this just proves when people try and boast about it’s “superiority” over the KTM (just like the Alta) due to price, it just isn’t true. If you add E Cycle Riders suspension & wheel mods + all these you listed + the retail price of the SunRon. You are right at the KTM’s price and performance specs again with a downgraded chassis. Despite what people think, these MFGs aren’t just gouging people (or they all are in a big conspiracy). The Alta vs KTM is the same way. Scale up the KTM performance specs 15-20% and they are pretty well matched and priced with what the Alta was... with a downgraded chassis. As a KTM owner I don’t have a problem saying that, because my bike is still in production despite it’s shortcomings 🤣 I just have to throw more money at it to make it do what I need it to do vs buying an Alta that will sadly be a paperweight in the not to distant future. If I had $10,000 of completely disposable income, I’d have an Alta MXR, Period. I just can’t afford a bike with possible ZERO resale value 5 years from now. The SurRon can grow with the rider which is awesome, but if you’re already a pretty good rider I feel the KTM is a better starting point. Does that make sense?
Another good video but there's just one more comparison I'd like to see. The design of the Sur Ron seems to lean more trials friendly than the full size dirt bikes. If you could get a video of a technical, stop and go, average speed under 10 mph kind of trail, then I'd love to see it.
Lovin my Sur Ron !! Looking to upgrade the controller eventually but for now it's great for local dirt trails where you'd normally get chased off of on a gas DB. The Freerides seem like a lot of fun too ... but the Sur Ron's are a bit stealthier IMO. They look more like a mountain bike than a dirt bike at first glance... Great review though ECR !! 🙌🏼
This test was done some time ago. I'd like to see it done again and the Surron equipped with the x-9000 controller and a 72V battery. Or the KTM might be a closer match with the Ultra Bee which wasn't out at that time.
Wow, only a 13 second gain with triple the power and double the weight? That li'l Sur Ron is a beast. It works out to being 7.5% faster (although you got to know the course on the initial Sur Ron test) at triple the price. I see Sur Ron being the choice for most people who aren't made of money. What's the range for each? That might be a clinch statistic, too. P.S: Excellent comparison video, for sure.
I've gotta say my journey to finding the right machine for my needs started with this channel. I really appreciate the content. I took a serious look at the KTM and even kicked around the idea of putting a deposit down on the Varg. Ultimately the price of entry was a bit high considering this was going to be my first bike. So I took a long look at Sur Ron's and eventually landed on the Talaria. I really dig the upgrades, minor or not . And I'm comfortable with the price point as I consider the Talaria my "proof of concept". If I love it I can always upgrade to something like a Varg or KTM later and pass the Talaria onto the kiddos.
Flawless riding. What an exciting video. I’d like to ride through there on the Sur Ron at a leisurely pace and enjoy some scenery. My days of going fast at all are far behind me. Thanks for the video. I appreciate it. Have fun. Try to be safe👍🏻🇺🇸🤠
I feel that on a moto track the ktm would destroy the sur ron. But on more twisty technical singletrack trails the sur ron would be much more agile and beat the ktm. And i guess thats why one is an e mtb and one is an e crosser. Horses for courses as the saying goes.
Man, you've got balls to run so hot on that track. I'm currently building a Stealth Bomber frame e-bike and it's about the same weight and look as the Sur Ron, has a noseless Schwinn seat, the mid-drive motor is the Luna Cycle Cyclone 3D 3000watt with the standard sine wave controller, the battery I'm building is a 72Volt 40 AH battery made from LifePO4 32650's @ 3.2V 6amp, should be able to get around 45MPH, but watching you go around that track, I'm wondering if I'm ever going to get that fast. Maybe if I had some long level stretches with no turns, but at 64 years old, I don't think my reflexes are going to be up to running like you did. Hats off to yuh! It was a lot of fun, just watching you. I think my heart rate got higher when you ran the E-XC! 🖖😎
Man these electric bikes and motorcycles have come a long way they are so awesome I wish I knew somebody had a lot of money or was rich that would buy me one of these because this is the only way I've ever get one way too expensive but still awesome
Most your braking comes from the front brake. The front brake is actuated by your hand... Rear foot brakes are only for when the clutch takes up that space.
It is interesting how a mountain bike based E-Dirt Bike that costs around 4k can even hang in the remote area hot lap wise as a 13k full on electric Enduro machine. I have been looking at a bunch of different E-Dirt machines and one that really peaks my interest simply because of the way it is built and the price of ownership is the Veli Moto VMX 12. It is also available as Time ET moto, and the Nicot Moto. It is roughly the same price as the Sur Ron X Black Edition and puts out 12KW through a 4 speed transmission. They claim a top speed of 70 mph and roughly between 50 and 100km of range depending how hard you are running it. It would be interesting to see how it fairs in a hot lap shoot out. The suspension is going to be its greatest handicap as it is not a linkeage style rear swingarm but rather more like the older pitbike rear suspension or more comparable to the KLX 110 rear A-frame swing arm and shock. I have seen videos of it on you tube dog walking the Sur Ron x in a stock format. However, I have seen Sur Rons with about 3k worth of battery and controller upgrades raise hell with CRF 250Rs so I guess it is all about how much you want to pay to play. Anyway great video and for me if you are not a privateer racer the Sur Ron X is a economical way to play offroad and not be obnoxious.
I love the sound of gas bikes so don't get me wrong but I think the big advantage of these is noise. We would be able to get more commercial trails and motor tracks near to residential areas. Would be great to see some all elect tracks open up in the uk.
I've seriously considered buying one, but right now the ability of E-Bikes occupy this middle ground, where it can't replace my mountain bike because exercise is a big part of that, and for my motorbike trail riding none of them could handle the distances and terrain.
I do a lot of mechanical mods, some for system optimization. Enjoy the best of both worlds, ICE & E: install and plumb a rear foot brake with hand brake lever if hydraulically actuated. Probably already done. With eBikes you could even setup a left and right foot brake for leaning in either turn! Those levers can be mechanically connected without additional plumbing/tubing 😀
“The KTM is three times the price, it should be a bit faster” A Bit Faster?!! It should annihilate the Sur Ron! I can’t believe they’re this close, that’s the story here!
Yes, but the sur-ron is build for a single trail like this. With the ktm you can go on a motocross track. I don’t think that the forks of the sur-ron be able to survive a bigger jump because they look like normal mountainbike forks, but the weight is much more...
Electric cycle rider I would really love to see a comparison to the new REV-X or CZEM as I have my eyes on those, they look great and seem robust. Also would be good to hear the range difference between the Ktm & Surron. Thanks for the test.
@Ray Heppner Thanks for reaching out! I am actually going out to test the CZEM in a couple of weeks. I will have some videos in the near future with that bike. As for range, I am seeing approximately 20 miles on the KTM in these conditions and about 17 miles on the Sur-Ron in the same conditions.
@@ElectricCycleRider wow that’s a really low range I thought they can do more.. After that, do you have to charge them? Or can you put in a spare battery and continue riding, while the other battery is charging on your generator?
there should be a National Electric Bike series running with the current motocross and Supercross series. At least as an exhibition. Maybe a 2 stroke, 4 stroke and Electric shootout as an exhibition.
I've never ridden either but I can tell just by how you look on the Suron vs KTM this is basically comparing a mtn bike tinker toy to a Real Dirt Bike. Not taking away from the Suron, they just are two total different machines.
@Tony Clifton Curb weight, yes. But when you ride the bike it feels so light because it doesn't have any rotating mass in the engine. I have a KTM 530 as well and they are very different when it comes to riding characteristics.
The diff in power was noticeable in that on the KTM's second lap you could see that the course was getting roosted up. I didn't hear a comment about the weight difference while riding but I thought he said the KTM was as heavy as a real Thumper or even heavier and double the weight of the Surron. Surprised there was only a 13 sec diff on the respective quickest laps, given the performance difference.
Cake Kalk vs Freeride, I rode the Kalk OR and my Light Bee back to back and the Kalk definitely felt more powerful and bigger. I think the Kalk would be a good comparison to the Freeride. I've yet to ride the Freeride though. The Kalk weigh's 25lbs more than the Light Bee but it definitely more powerful, it doesn't "feel" as light as the Light Bee though.
Cool test ! So awesome how far we have come technologically , from being able to know your lap times and speed to knowing your heart rate . And yes the bikes and their technology is top notch .
Best review I’ve ever seen on both of these bikes! Using the lit pro and doing a head to head is awesome. Please do this on a KTM300/250 2-stroke I would be very interested. BTW our 2 SurRon’s are arriving tomorrow! Can’t wait. The KTM Freeride is WAY too overpriced I’d much rather have my KTM300 for that price.
@Brian Lampright Thanks man! I appreciate the feedback. Yes, plan on doing a 300 vs Freeride on here soon. I hear you, the 300 is a hard bike to beat at that price. Hope you have fun with the new Sur Rons.
Performance wise, maybe interesting. But really, if you’re interested in an electric bike a 2 stroke smoker is probably not on the radar. Not really comparable bikes. And lots of places don’t allow 2 strokes anymore.
@@mechanicalman1068 That's only a problem in CA. In Oregon, NV, UT, CO most people off-road are on two strokes. I own a YZ125, YZ250, Zero MX, & a Sur-Ron.
Thx for the comparison but just another thing is the Surron is sold as an E-bicycle but the Ktm is sold as a motorcycle. That Ktm looks fun. I love my Surron. Incredible for the money.
if you use a foot brake, you slow down your right hand turning capabilities. although that probably wouldn't bother you in the woods. when you actually lean the bike over to turn, it's big. iunno. I grew up on bmx and mountain bikes, so a left hand finger brake for the rear is pretty easy to adjust to. the sensitivity of the lever/cable needs to be kept in tine tune though. /2cents thanks for the review. :)
It looks fast on flat terrine , but you should try high up hills and you will find out than e bikes are not there yet. Love new technology but ebikes need some more tuning etc..
@djdario8309 I've done some hill climb videos you can watch where I directly talk about this. I live in Colorado and had to climb quite a few vertical feet to even get the bikes to this practice track. The Sur-Ron suffers on the hill climbs but KTM makes short work of them. If it's slow speed technical climbs, I want for a clutch to modulate power but if it's over 5MPH, the Freeride screams up it.
Nice work, really good video. I am planning to buy Sur Ron but i have doubt about battery temperature as we all ride dirt bike to their limits so this electric version batteries will heat up a lot, its a most important critical factor but no video shows what exactly temperature behaviour of sur ron batteries in field, can you guyz show us, it would be so exciting to watch temperature behaviour of Sur Ron battery in action.
I have both, I put 2K into the Sur Ron, and its every bit as fast as the KTM now. I'm all in on the Sur Ron for 5900, 11K on the KTM. Value is with the Sur Ron all day long. We have a Lite Speed Big Power Battery, MX Wheels, New Seat, Bars, Brakes, Pegs, Fenders. If your thinking of getting into electric off road, the Sur Ron is by FAR the better value, and the aftermarket support blows away the KTM
@Robert Corser Another great idea! If I ever get a 72v battery/controller to compare with, it will warrant a cost comparison video for sure. MSRP + modifications as the bikes were in this video would be in this ballpark: Sur-Ron : $6,000 Approximately KTM: $11,000 Approximately If you added a controller/battery and some other suspension upgrades to the Sur-Ron, you'd be getting dangerously close to the cost of a KTM or a Cake Kalk.
Definitely man You got to do a review on that it's a whole different beast with those mods. It should be nearly equivalent to the KTM but with a lot less weight.
The lap times truly are impressive compared to ICE bikes. Also, the Sur Ron with a controller and battery upgrade, some Fox 40s and better brakes and it would be absolutely mental.
Interesting comparison. If you’re looking for speed the Freeride seems the clear winner. It’s 2.3x the cost but you’d spend that much getting the Sur-Ron close to its stock pace. But if ultimate speed isn’t the goal, the Sur-Ron seems a good choice. Have you done a battery comparison? How long does the Sur-Ron last? That’s my biggest concern. Then I also wish they’d redo the rear swing arm to fit a 16” rear tire instead of the 19” front tire they are using stock. It probably eats through front tires on the rear and is giving up traction and puncture resistance.
I have the segway x260 which is the clone of the sur ron and the company claims like 60-75 miles of range but I can’t typically do about 25-30 miles of hard riding and I’m down to 10% battery. I’m usually toast by then so it’s perfect. In terms of speed, the Surron will hit 50 on flat road and 45 up a hill so it’s no slouch in the speed department
Nice comparison, thank you. Would love to see the final Alta and the upcoming Sur-Ron thrown in. These 4 bikes comprise the exact group I have been considering for my next single track bike.
@Dave Stacionis Thank you! Yes, for sure that will be fun. I'll be doing a bunch of tests with the Storm when it becomes available and have access to a couple of Alta MX and MXR's we can throw in the mix as well. Appreciate the feedback!
im sick of seeing youtube videos with a 72v bac8000 on the street i would love to see them off road with a comparison video like this especially that you can push the sur ron past 20kw essentially higher power than the ktm at half the weight you already a lot of mechanical upgrades to allow it too
Wow awesome comparo mate I'd have to say at 1st glance you look way more at home on the KTM overall the KTM is definitely a winner in my books I'm sure both bikes have their advantages the Suron looks more like a MTB than a Moto
Raw speed is one thing. What about flickability, fun factor, playfulness, tight technical single track? Theres different tools for all different types of riding.
