Mortal Kombat 1 - The "It's WAY Too Early" TIER LIST 

Definitely a long discussion, but there's lots to talk about when trying to place the whole cast! Let the arguing commence.

Sub Zero is an example why you dont (heavily) nerf a character due to a beta.

Glad to see you guys reached those goals. This channel has helped me realize just how deep the competitive stage for MK is even in its earliest entries, and even if i'm not a competitor myself i'm always happy to see and learn more of this franchise.

With Kenshi being #1 on everyone’s tier lists, I have some advice for my fellow online warriors. I’ve been trying out the Shujinko kameo lately. He steals the entire god damned Sento Stance. It’s so amazing. Most online Kenshi players have ZERO idea what to do against their own move.

i think its telling that some characters are pigeon holed into taking a cameo and others like Raiden and Johnny have multiples they can pick from. thats the real signs of top tier base character

Glad you guys went this route taking kameos into consideration. Seems like people are doing tier lists based on just the main roster, which is completely pointless because literally no one is playing a whole match without their Kameo.

It is too soon, but that's what will make this video a cool piece of MK history. I'm curious to see which placements change as you and other pros learn more about M1K

I actually enjoy the longer conversation based tier lists cause I can listen to them for hours at work. So glad this vid is finally here!

Props for not sugar coating on Sub Zero, straight up nerfs on the important areas. We can understand with the nerfed damage, but why everything else like frames and clone.

thanks so much to adress the unecessary nerf on sub-zero, boys!

I think people try to hard to label kitana as a zoner when in reality her strength is actually her bait and whiff punish game. That is what the character wants to do. She has great footsie buttons and an amazing backdash. Her zoning in reality is very meh u can duck the fan and where is a sweet spot where the fancy toss fan wont touch u as u approach. And many characters can easily keep up with her zoning

For nitara, i think she definitely needs a few tweaks. She has a decent overhead low mixup that pairs great with a few kameos like frost or scorpion. She probably has the worst projectile in the game she needs to damage herself in order to use it. Speaking of, her blood ritual only heals her for what she damages herself for so it’s entirely useless unless it’s meterburned then the slow heal and health drain to the opponent is great for corner pressure.

Glad I'm not alone feeling Shao's combo damage is a bit low. But he's so cool in this game

I think it's valuable to have your ear to the ground even if it's early, and even more than that, I appreciate the open and civil debates over certain picks. Thanks for this.

As a Li Mei player, A is an absolutely fair placement. Anybody who thinks Li Mei isn't good, simply hasn't seen enough of the character. She has a half screen overhead that's like 11 frames, you can combo off or make it safe with the right assist. Her auto shimmy is cracked, and she can get a truckload of damage off it. Her mids aren't amazing, but they are good enough considering what all she has. Launching projectiles, full combo punishes on things that nobody else can (D1 punish like...), good solo damage, huge damage off a pretty safe advancing low with assist, Incredible plus frames (albeit with gaps), lanterns shut down characters that like to be airborne (Good luck using Sonya assist), etc... She's not blatantly cheap like the top characters, but she definitely has the ability to compete in top 8s.

Nice to see you guys put Tanya up there and acknowledge how underrated she actually is. I like this list!

Honestly amazing tier list very informative than just placing and naming few key points

1200 subs wow really happy for you guys! The quality content and quality commentary throughout the years yall deserve it ❤

When you want to do a Tier list but don't want to upset the masses you do something cheeky like "It's what the fans wanted!" lol. Looking forward to this video and where you all place Tanya in particular.

Thanks for posting this; I missed the first half. Order of characters within individual tiers is definitely debatable but overall a well thought out list.

I think if Sub-Zero recovered faster from ice clone and got a damage buff, he'd be creeping into the top tiers of the game. But he can't combo off his lows with kameo, ice ball is too slow, ice clone has way too long recovery, and he has to spend a bunch of meter to barely brake 40% for his combos. I'm expecting he's at least going to get a damage buff, but considering the rest of his kit is pretty good, he might not.

Great tierlist, I love how I’m depth you guys went with this. Buff Sub 😞

While he’s not technically maining him, NinjaKilla’s Liu Kang with Kung Lao is ridiculous

Sub Zero was put on *ICE* with those nerfs. ... I will see myself out now. XD

Re: nitara; I feel like what you need to justify the low health is consistently scary neutral and offense, with probably some escape if not a traditionally excellent reversal. And while her air movement and mixups are good, im not sure they let her branch her options enough to warrant such a health difference, at least from the gameplay we're seeing so far.

So far I’ve played Smoke,Baraka,Raiden and now Geras, Geras being the most fun imo, he’s definitely tricky but that’s what makes him so satisfying

I've been getting decent results with Reiko/Sonya. I can hit 40 percent combos with her, get an extra projectile or grab, and Sonya can stop jump-ins when throwing the shurikens. I also just think the 2 together are good for anti-airing. Super fun.

They just need to give everyone the staples of a good character, 1 or 2 plus frames strings, couple hit confirmable safe strings, a decently fast safe mid that can be hit confirmed into things.

PNDKM 4 Lyfe

It's sad to see Sub zero so far down, being one of the two important faces of the game.

Grats on the subs you deserve it

I think Liu should be in bottom of S tier. 2,2 is +3. Stand 1 is 6 frames. DB4 is invulnerable to jump attacks and you can convert. Hes strike/throw like crazy and with Kung Lao cameo he becomes obnoxiously good. Anything can then become +2. Throw leads into free 22% and you can cameo early out of BF3 or BF4 to set yourselves right next to the opponent for more pressure. Hes just slept on because hes not instantly stupid like Baraka or Kenshi

As a Havik/Darrius main, I was super happy to see him so high. Saw there was a bunch in top 8 during CEOtaku.

I love when people ask your tier opinions then get mad when you do LOL

Sub-zero would be great if he had more decent combo strings without having to use a bar or cameo. All his kicks on the ground are 3 hit combos that don't combo into anything. If he wants to do those lengthy combos without a bar or cameo, he only has the back+2 (Which is easily counterable and foreseeable). They fixed his clone to where it actually works and people can't just attack through it like before, but his ice ball takes too long while every other character gets an ice-ball-equivalent-stun they can combo into and it's quicker.

I absolutely love they disagree instantly not even about the tier list. I think PND Lore is that they brotherly disagree or argue and its jokes to me

I’m sorry but smoke is absolutely not that low. He gets meterless confirms that you don’t have to confirm & negative frames can be cancelled. He also has long range 50/50s that lead into 40%. Which can also be cancelled into throw mix instead of overhead low mix from mid range neutral. So maybe people just haven’t used him enough but he doesn’t have to commit AT ALL to his strings and only play off of his first attacks into confirms & mixups into cameo safety. Not only that but invis is immediate & can be done after 40% combos for set play and make long range 75/25’s pretty much guaranteed. He also has one of the best armored moves in the game to low profile & high profile many attacks. Smoke is most definitely like how Fujin was. Everyone wrote him off until people realized how good he is & untouchable he’ll be

Commenting for the algorithm rn cause I'm at work but I'll tell you what I cannot wait to watch this at bedtime.

Appreciate you guys being realistic about Scorpion, he really struggles not having a decent mid

Rain has A LOT of potential to be really good down the line, but as of right now I think he falls behind a little too drastically in some areas The fact that his moves are so slow paired with the fact he’s not plus on hardly anything, it makes it to where he’s rarely ever at advantage in any situation

Nitara is bad bad. Unsafe combo starter, essentially no projectile, no low starters and she’s suppppper meter hungry. She should get one free dash after stuff like her back 2. The low heath isn’t warranted cause unlike Skarlet’s healing projectile in 11, Nitara has to hurt herself first with Blood Sacrifice.

I would love to see you guys make a video on Shang Tsung. I initially thought he wasn’t very good when the game came out, but I’ve slowly been learning more and more about Old Shang and he’s just becoming better and better, and I’d like to see what you guys can find out about him

Great tier list guys, hugs

I’ve been feeling very meh about scorpion. He gets good damage but every single button he has is either a high or punishable (slightly exaggerating here). His only low doesn’t combo without a kameo and lack of an overhead makes it really hard to do anything to anyone except throwing the opponent the whole game. I’ve basically resorted to just sitting and waiting for the enemy to mess up because there’s not much else he can do (again, mild exaggeration but it’s still frustrating). I also hate that his back 2 is basically a waste of a move at the moment with its really small hit box and that he doesn’t have a forward or back 1. Seems like an odd part of a kit to just not have that could’ve been used for a decent mid/overhead. Still really like the game and I’m having a lot of fun with it. Most of my issues are general growing pains of learning a brand new game

Amazing discussion, it's been a lot of fun playing with the many characters and the many kameos. But, one nit pick, background music was kinda distracting certain points, it's just a bit bombastic. 👍

Lets see how much this list ages like milk. Will be a fun video for sure. XD

Liu Kang has always been my favorite player. I still play with him but he's night and day different from any MK game. They turned him into a borderline zoner this game. I'm used to playing with a Liu that can do tons of pressure

Even if every characters has been tried in combination with every Kameo, the tier list of this game can completely change after every single Kameo DLC will be added in the roster and I love it!

Heavily agree with the Kitana pick being at least very solid. The frame data changes, new projectile, and access to Kameos like Goro and Cyrax make her neutral some of the best in the game. Insane projectile game, great whiff punish material, safe trap setups and unblockable scenarios, all make her dominate the screen and give her awesome set play. She’s not super broken, but weakness just doesn’t describe her anymore.

Tier lists really make it hit home that pros/streamers etc aren’t playing the same game as the average player

Kung Lao (I Main him since MKX) got good damage and a nice F2. I think the main problem is the range of his attacks and to build up meter. He has no good block strings and on higher level his launcher (db4) on block will gettin interrupted at startup or before landing. Also he has no good mid and 21 can be ducked easily. He is a good zoner as Lao/Lao with his mid projectile which come out very fast + you can throw it a little higher or lower. He is fun to play and the Cameo change his gameplan totally… Thank you for that nice Content 🫶🏽

I hope you guys see this but id like to say about smoke is that he’s super underrated. If you run scorpion kameo he gets that X factor dirt that higher tier characters have and that X factor is just insane meterless damage combined with almost all of his special moves become a launcher. So take smoke is doing dash cancels on block and the opponent is taking their turn as they should and the only way to enforce the mindgame is high risk low reward letting the dash rip on block and on hit you get like 80 damage with scorpion kameo that becomes a high risk high reward 50/50 basically bc that dash is gonna launch for 30-40%. There’s also some dirty invisible setplay with it and just finally NRS made it so if you wanna single hit confirm his gap strings you only get jab well like I said w scorp kameo he’s crushing you off a jab while being totally safe. He def burns through Kameo meter a lot but it regens so fast and the fact that he’s already got meterless smoke cancel so smoke is like Shang just sitting on 3 bars at all times so he can take a big risk and laugh at the raiden who finally blocked the dash and was excited for his 50% punish. His b2 mixes while invisible but it also shimmies a ton of down 3s for people trying to back tech. I really think he’s underrated.

Good tier list

Please do Kameo tier list! This is so fun to watch.

Johnny Cage is scary man. All my meter when I play against him goes to a breaker

Can you please make a video kategorizing kameos into types like extenders, pressure, utility

Reiko is alot of fun to use. Picked him up on a whim and everything just clicked. Currently practicing him with darius & Stryker kameos.. other then that i love playing Johnny Cage & Havik also.

Me crying as a sub zero main😭

Sub Zero and Tanya need buffs Tanya especially, surrounding her teleports. 1 teleport that just be charged up is insane

Even though tier lists are subjective it’s still good to hear the discussion

reptile supremacy

one good upblock takes half of nitara's hp and she's so meter intensive that she can almost never break which i think makes her C tier. she's not difficult to use, she's just kinda bad when you play against somebody with decent matchup knowledge or the ability to react to her overhead.

The difference between this game and MK11 is that at release. The low tiers don't feel incomplete and unable to compete with the top tiers. Just think back to how bad Kotal and Shao Khan were and how good release MK11 Geras was. I don't feel always punished for picking my favourite character, in Shao. Which in MK11 I always felt like I was limited by.

This game really is a love letter to Mk9: Kenshi, Johnny, and Cyrax are top tier again!!

I completely agree with all the s rankings. Almost every time I play against any of those I loose or have a hard time getting the win. I’d say reptile is A+ and Geeras too.

What’s the best way to train for online without severely effecting my ratios?

So I’m probably just making this up, but DAMN is baraka just overall good AF. I legit was able to climb to Grand Master off of 30-45min worth of practicing some strings into combos. I’m no ace in the hole but damn he’s got a good kit this go around. Makes me wanna play him more cuz he’s flashy

I feel, once you learn mileena’s strings (mainly the one where there’s the 2nd hit overhead and then the other with the third low hit) she’s not too hard to fight against

Do you think you'll make a video on ranking the cameos? Even though I haven't played this yet, I was told that all the cameos are solid and decent and they all have uses.

*Rain will fall upon you like daggers from the sky* 💧💧💧💧💧💧💧💧💧💧💧💧💧💧

As a Nitara main I’ll give you guys some insight. Her blood sacrifice “buff” is never worth it unless you amp it. Her heal gives you less health than what you sacrifice so it’s very misleading to say she “heals”. Amp blood sacrifice allows you to lifesteal by proximity which is actually pretty good, but to get any real damage you have to amp your special. This makes it difficult to justify its use because as a glass cannon, you have to take advantage of EVERY hit. She doesn’t gain much meter bc she has no projectiles to spam to build it. And whenever she does use specials she’s amping them to maximum damage. Very resource intensive. She has no mid or low starter either. She essentially relies on getting lucky to open someone up and blowing them away with a half life combo. Don’t even mention how using certain kameos makes her damn near unusable bc her health pool is so low

i love this idea so much🫶🫶

This is awesome to see as a Tanya main.

This was a lot of fun to watch to be honest. A+ lol.

🔥🔥tier list

I’ve been doing good with Sub-Zero and it’s been fun honestly. I heard about the nerfs but I just like how simple he plays.

I'm not saying havik isnt strong, I think hes a solid A or A+ type of character. But would it be so bad if his EX torso spin was his armored move. And the helping hand was faster on startup to allow it to link into combos?

I main Shao, and he needs help. His Range with axe feels shorter than half of the characters. Just taking off the timer on his hand to hand stance would be a welcomed buff

Dude this video is so much fun! I'd love to get your insight and thoughts on a regular basis. Maybe a monthly tier list?

After all these years my man Bi-Han finally gets to be Sub-Zero and he's the worst character in the game. For the love of god NRS, buff him

ITS HERE

I actually like early tier list just to see how much peoples opinion change further down the road

I'll accept bottom 5 for Li Mei, as a low tier Hero for myself. Its hard to do tier lists because what do you rate the character for their Kameos? If we look at Li Mei (because its a character I know) and we say that she gets 50% 1 bar in damage. Thats exclusive to scorpion Kameo. So do we value that damage or do we value just what the character can do irrelevant of Kameos?

Man.. I love Havik with Darrius or Sub-Zero.

my biggest sticking point with Sub Zero is that all of his jab strings can be armored out of as there is such a gap between the hits. I think his damage is fine but everything else about him needs to be overall faster to compensate for it. And maybe make his ice clone better and ice ball faster so it works in juggle combos without kameos

Shang tsung is definitely not in the S tier. He has no mixups, no footsies, and easily outzoned.

Shang Tsung is a high-execution character, he’s gonna take time for people to get good with him, but once the pro’s get him and understand him… he’s going to DOMINATE.

This is so early but let’s go!

Raiden is goated his only downside is some of his combo strings can be down poked which is annoying and his mid has a long start up but you rarely use forward 2 in the neutral

My thoughts any time a new game comes out, tier lists are made before any developments in the meta are truly made. People just want to make new content so much that they can't wait for anything to develop.

i think that with motaro and ONLY with Motaro nitara could be higher A. I need to test out stuff with Sindel and Motaro but i believe there's some dirt with that pairing as well.

>Creates a "Tier" list >Puts half the roster in one tier

Sector and cyrax sitting together let's go

Sounds like Deoxis is spot on, Nitara so fun to play, I am maining her until I see Quan but her shortcomings are very frustrating. I feel like shes a balance nightmare though and will either get patched to the top or buried. Im a kasual though.

Based tierlist

Don't get me wrong, I absolutely agree cameos should be taken into account in tier lists. However I think you've been way too forgiving with characters that are very cameo dependent. Of course that specific cameo can always be nerfed, but also cameos can very much be matchup dependent thus characters that are cameo reliant have much less room to maneuver when it comes to adjusting to specific matchups. Also cameos aren't available 24/7 so characters that are too reliant on cameos simply fall short from characters that are rock solid even without cameos. Scorpion is the perfect example of this, he's 1 of the weakest characters in the game with a few specific cameos allowing him to be functional. However in matchups where he really wants a different cameo he just can't do it as it makes his base kit dysfunctional. I have some other disagreements of course, like Milena rated way too highly because all she does is a lot of damage, which isn't really a problem for most characters, her other tools are severely lacking. But those are more minor gripes compared to the base issue of counting too much on cameos to solve core base kit issues.

I love Smoke Motaro, but god is it hard to do the cancels online (or maybe its just the PS controller). It also doesnt help that it feels like many of his moves are unsafe. I never thought of trying Sektor, but I'm thinking of learning Kenshi as a pocket pick so I i dont have to feel like I'm taking drugs to play the game, lmao.

It all depends on where and against who characters are played I find smoke is Stier vs new players. Absolute pub stomper. But against someone who can block he struggles. I'm a guy returning to the series from Armageddon so I'm down with the trash

why add an A- tier when you can just move Sub to D lmao

Of course I chose to main Smoke. I know this is just opinion but I have been having some luck with smoke. I do wish he had a projectile of his own and a decent wake up. Frost helps him immensely.