As much as the Venator is S-tier in my heart, I pretty much agree with what you said. They work great as a stepping stone to bigger and better things, mostly letting you put off spending a ton of credits on both early game fighter support and big guns. Despite being a fan-boy for them, I'd put them more-or-less where you did.
Like the other comment I love this one as well, its how I operate with this game, IDC what the stats are if it doesn't Do good in battles IDC if it has "better weapons" for certain roles, I LOVE venators in clone wars mods but they really are just stepping stones to save credits as they should be which is another thing i love about this mod.
Great vid! If I had to say anything I feel like your not giving the Nebulon-B2 Frigate its due. The Missile Jammer remains an infinitely useful ability especially for the Empire to stop fighter torpedoes from knocking out critical hardpoints as well as providing cover for your Raiders and Lancers from light proton torpedoes. It's also pretty good against corvettes, gunships, and other frigates. Anyway looking forward to more!
I appreciate the kindness 😂😂, tbh I never really build the Nebulon b 2. By the time I get to that tech the rebels stop using frigates as much making their offensive priorities not that important. But yes it’s ability is always amazing. I’m redoing the rebel one and putting the website into presentation mode to make it more enjoyable to watch, should have done it with this video :/
No Arc Hammer? Personally I just build it only to fill out the Imp raids a little when Noghri aren't available. If it's F tier, I can agree with that. AI also tends to yolo it so it's not a threat even when you're fighting it. One thing to consider on the Ton Falk's: while the Adv. Bomber only have one squadron of Punishers, that single squadron has 4x the bombing firepower of a single squad of TIE-Bombers and have shielding to boot. I personally rank them higher as a result. B tier. Carrack cruiser is an assassin of a ship. No staying power, but it punches far above its weight class. Not really able to punch down against fighters though. B-Tier. Venator's ARC's are actually really good at providing vision early game and V-Wings have more staying power than TIE's. In addition the Venators have passive flak that I rather like to stack very tightly. Not something that I put on the frontlines though. I like to think of them as Ton Falks but with a generic ability to shoot other ships. A-Tier. Also Interdictor ISD. A-Tier.
Definitely should have put the arc hammer in this. the ship itself got an update sometime recently and is much better than it used to be, is it good, not really LOL but prolly b tier now versus D tier which it used to be, i still only use it for raids like you. I just don't like bombers for the empire, can't ever seem to field enough of them at a time. Carracks are great against capital ships and cruisers but by then when the rebels field more of those ships and less carrack cruisers you have acess to victory 2s and strike cruisers. interdictor ability is S tier i just didnt want a bunch of ships in S tiers if you knwo what i mean
@@captonx2 I think the catch with bombers is that we want to use them in the same way the rebels do: taking out hardpoints on large structures. The weapons that set imperial bombers apart are their longer range assault missiles, or "corvette killers" as I like to call them. They're best used on CR90s, hammerheads, MC-30s/40s where you don't need as many of them to destroy a target, and as garrison units you can sacrifice them to destroy your target without losing anything. Anything else left in the fleet? An ISD does the job for you.
This channel is a hidden gem. Very helpful for getting into the mod. I have played a lot of eaw but not this mod and without this channel i would be completely lost. Deserves many more subs
Tier Lists are always a good time, I look forward to seeing what you have to say! But first, for any future videos, using the "Presentation Mode" (you can just barely see the button for this in the video on the bottom, just to the left of the middle) might make for a more enjoyable video. This way, it is more zoomed in, and you don't need to have any ads off to the side distracting from the primary content.
I 100% agree with your take on the Arquitens. I so want them to be worth using, i want to build "lore accurate" fleets with arquitens screening for isds. But every single time i use the darn things they dissapoint me. Even worse is that there is an obvious lore accurate way to make them substantially more useful, at least early on. In most other media the arquitens is shown to carry at least a wing of fighters around. The arquitens at the start should carry a wing of v-wings, which you can then retrofit into the imperial variant (which is also buildable at the start) that comes with a wing of ties. Naturally an upgrade to Tie interceptors should be avaliable later to help the arquitens stay relevant. This would help a ton with the empire actually getting the swarms of ties you are supposed to have, while still leaving you with the necesary weakness of poor staying power. As it stands there is simply no reason other than quests to build them.
@@volodymyrboitchouk ya definitely a solid take especially since off the top of my head I can’t think of a unit that directly replaces what it offers, for during the mid and late game. Cause the mini star destroyers are good (vindicators) but they don’t completely do it but what do I know haha,
I find the subject of the best ships for the Empire especially interesting, as I think most people agree about what the best *style* of fleet comp the Empire is best at, but everyone has their own opinions on how exactly to go about that. More than that, everyone has their favorites! Personally, I adore the Raider and the IEC and tend to put multiples of each one in my late game fleets (although I haven't played with the new Lancer yet). I also tend to favor stun and other debuff weaponry quite a lot, so I think I'd place anything with those weapon systems a tier or so higher than you did in general. I love AotR, because there is all this depth and complexity to it, while at the same time not forcing the player into a clear meta just to succeed--many different playstyles can work once you get the hang of things.
You've been such a great supporter of my channel that you know better than anyone how little I care about Meta. My favorite thing to discuss about this mod is the different playstyles for each faction so ya i agree 100% with this comment. BTW people have been dissing the IEC in my discord idk why lol
Sooooo... Gozanti bomber loadout for me was SS EX tier. I would drop in a huge wave of tgem with hero Vader or maybe Thrawn and send the bombers as a heavy wave to remove with extreme prejudice whatever target was biggest and ugliest. Then... when small ships like CR-90's or Neb B's or Longhorns showed up I would wolf pack swarm them. 6 units of Gozanti can delete a CR-90 from existence in 10 seconds or less. They also tend to be slightly safer during retreats.
I haven't played much of the Empire yet, but from what I have played I think this is a solid Tier list. I have one major disagreement though; the Victory I. I don't know who thought it was a great idea to give it unguided rockets for its warheads and turn it into an artillery ship...but that was a terrible idea. It's not meant for that. It's supposed to be a medium-heavy cruiser meant to take out other cruisers and slightly punch up. I get that there's tons of those ships already in the Empire's arsenal, but it could be turned into a cruiser/frigate wrecker. Give it Assault and Hvy Assault missiles and keep the untargetables the 6 dual Lt Turbolasers...but for all that is holy get rid of the rockets. Or even give it a new warhead, a Hvy Assault Concussion missile, which lowers the defense of hit Capital ships for X amount of time. Due to it being a rocket artillery ship, I think that makes it definitely D-Tier. Or at best mid-low C-Tier.
Rebels in my latest campaign spam MC60s which can outnumber your ISDs 2-3:1, so having a combination of missile jamming and PD is sort of mandatory if you don't want your capital ships getting shut down.,
Gozantis carrying Bombers are nice because you get the bombers and an anti fighter unit that can escort them if you aren't concerned about losing them.
Playing aotr 2.11. i like nebulon b2. They are good against small ships with their rocket launchers. And of corse jamming torpedoes always useful. No matter how much screeners you have , somethings reaches your fragile exteral ISD shield generators.
Arquitanse definetely deserves some love. I would put it in mid-B tier, right after Acclamotor, before the Interidictor. Just build 6 or 8 of these beauties, and you will get your ealry game ISD II. These ships will tear down early game Rebel fleet, that mostly consists of Bulk cruisers, Dreadnaughts, and Nebulon-Bs. It is also useful for taking down enemy's hardpoints, once the shields are gone. They don't have to be tanky, since it is an artillery unit. Also, I would put Venator in an A-tier, because 1) It is a lot more tanky than the Acclamotor, 2) provides you a decent fighter wing, that you urgently need before researching small craft III and building a Raider.
i talk about this in the rebel video coming out tomorrow when referencing the MC30 if you have to more than a couple in order for a unit to perform well it really loses desire to me, I will admit the long range light turbolasers it has is nice as it allows it to hit smaller targets but ya.
I really struggle to understand the Arquitens placement…. I’ve used them to great affect in many campaigns. They aren’t meant to be going up against ships bigger than itself because it’s an artillery cruiser. You keep it out of the engagement at max range so it can help lower the shields and deal damage while not getting touched. It’s not that big either, and dangerous if you have them in wolf packs hunting smaller support vessels
I have to disagree with the Adv. Bomber Ton Falk. It gets you XG-1s, which is an imperial B-Wing. It has a lesser variety of weapons but it gets more in number. They are also faster! Also, barrage rockets on fighters are really good. TIE Brutes are also great against anything from a fighter to a corvette and they get a turret for their Hvy Ls. Finally, the Punisher is a medium armours worst nightmare. You don't even need to get in close as they get 4 Assault Msls per fighter. I'd say its on par with the NR Quasar and an S tier imperial unit. Despite its bombers not being traditionally armed.
Isd 1 should be a tier imo, with the early game capital ship heros all being isd 1 and the 2 you get at the start they just shred all the enemy capital ships and space stations.
@@captonx2 thats for sure, but thrawn, isad, piet and probably others I havent unlocked yet are isd 1 aswell+ the isds all just got the cool factor, but i definetly agree with the isd being behind the tactor and II.
Actually, the Bellator and Executor come from the same tech, Capital ships 1. (yes really) Overall id say thats a pretty good list, but i would shuffle a few things around. On a SMALL Side note, it is worth noting their is a difference between "Squadron" and "Flight" Of fighter/bomber craft. (I know your just using squadrons as a general term.) Flights are half the size of a Squadron (maybe even smaller). Anyway, I definitely agree with the Arquitans and Carrack being BOTTOM TIER. They both Suck and the AI has a serious HARD ON for killing Aequians for some reason. Corvette Artillery ships are only really good in packs and even then you have to protect them as well (and as noted its obsoleted by the Vindicator). The Carrack like all Destroyer class vessels might be good in packs, but even then for what you pay for it......The F@#$ing Black Sun Interceptor Frigate does its job BETTER and its CHEEPER! I feel like your underestimating The Bomber Ton Folk and Nebulon B2. The Nebulon b2 is always nice to have in a fleet, its got 2 Concussion missile launchers in addition to its lasers to help deal with enemy fighters and bombers. Plus its the smallest ship you have with a Missile Jammer, weather its escorting a Fleet of ISDs or grouped with some strikecraft, it can defend them from incoming ordinance and it lasts quite a while too. Plus it is the most heavily armed Ship of its size in the Empire, so it can deal with enemy frigates and corvettes too. (A jack of all trades if you will.) Meanwhile, the Bomber Ton Folk. Let me remind you the Imperials STRANGTH is Tubro Lasers and killing BIG SHIPS, but it sucks at killing smaller vessels. the Bomber Ton Folk brings a little bit of everything to the party to help deal with Targets Big and Small. Brutes with their heavy laser can deal with anything up to a Frigate im pretty sure, Which is where the XG-1s come in. XG-1s are armed to a TEETH and recently even got Barrage rockets to help deal with fighters too (like they weren't good enough at that already), 2 Heavy Lasers, 2 Ion Blasters, Rockets and Barrage Rockets, XG-1s can do it all besides bomb capital ships or cruisers. Which is where the Tie punishers come into play. It is kinda nutz how RARE Tie punishers actually are, you get 1/1 from every Upgraded ISD and 1/2 from the Carriers. "The star galleon provides Flak weapons" Um....what? It has concussion Missiles and the Laser turret, Can't say i remember it having anything else. The Ton Falk has 6 Flak cannons and the Acclimator has 2 flak Cannons, as does the Venator. "The unupgraded Veantor hangers arn't grate" EXCUSE ME, are we playing the same mod? The V wings (they are classed as Interceptors btw) are BETTER then Tie Fighters and a Side grade to Tie Interceptors (they have less weapons but they have shields and i think droid repair) and the Arcs are a solid heavy fighter. In fact, since the Imperial Venator DOESN'T get bombing runs for some dumb reason id argue its the WORSE of the 2. BTW you forgot the IPVs. (those Hunter Corvettes you get from fighter tech 1 i think)
I love you so much for agreeing about the arquitanse and carrack and YES the ai loves to target them, and yes units that have to be used in packs are not good, anything used in packs will be good LOL, Neb B2s are fine, also I could have sworn that star gallwons had flak guns but oh well, and finally I always considered IPVs to be gunships, thanks for the support as always :)
@@captonx2 The thing is Destroyers the Exception to the rule, they MUST be used in packs if you want to get good damage out of them (or any notable damage at all for that matter). I mean you don't HAVE too, but to be fair they are so small and take up so little space, i guess its kinda expected. As for Corvette Artillery ships, They arn't BAD, but individually, id say they are only threatening to Frigates or "light" Cruisers like say the Vindicator maybe or the Interdictor Cruiser. Or Carrier vessels like the Ton Folk or Quasar. (and as I said the AI REALLY loves to shoot them for whatever reason.) As a final note, the Carrack Cruiser is ESPECIALLY AWFUL! Think about it, you are using a "Corvette" with Turbo Lasers and Ion Cannons (not even Turbo Ion cannons) to _TRY_ to bust though the shielding on a REBEL MON CALIMARI ships...... Bruh that is not gonna happen. (due mostly to the Fast Charging shields) They would probably work on OTHER ships in the rebel fleet (the Sullesten Capital ship for example), IF the Rebel AI built them!
Carracks arent just used for caps only. They’re close range light TL’s, same with the IC. Frigates upward should fear carracks. 3 of those will shred them. Carracks aren’t made for anti fighter. Really good for trying to flank and cripple from behind
I know you run Destroyers in PACKS. But my god those cannons can't it JACK! Tried 1 v 1ing a Quasar and ALMOST got it. The bombers killed me first. Still alot of those shots miss (at least visually).
The acclamator is why I want to siege Rothana as soon as possible. It's one of the only early game options the Empire has which can put up a fight against both Rebel and BS small craft. I cherish the few free ones I get
Ya I do everything I can do keep the free ones alive, it’s interesting though that once you take the planet you can only build them there and not everywhere that’s a neat detail making the planet important.
@@wolfpack95805 ya in the trailer video, we got to see criftothis or however you spell it lol and it looked pretty good, still like a empire at war map but pretty good
a bit late to the party, but ton Falk bomber loadout deserves much higher than D tier. Tie Punishers are cracked, and most importantly Xg-1 and Tie brutes are extremely effective against corvettes!
Tbh I actually recently have been really impressed by tie brutes and XG1s are solid heavy fighters themselves, the real reason why I put it so low is the lack of torpedoes for a “bomber” loadout
I have to disagree on the Bellator. It typically becomes the target of a lot of Ion stunners from ships and B-Wings. Also, the AI likes to get into point blank range so it can’t fire it’s much stronger long range weapons. The high pop cap also doesn’t do it any favors.
Its definitely not overpowered but even in those situations where the enemy gets up close and it becomes less effective. As long as your escort ships are doing well hopefully you can get out of the fight without losing the expensive ship.
There is one big problem with your tier list. You happen to have a completel misunderstanding of certain weapons and ships and how they perform. Arquitens at the start, you mention that the Light LR turbos are not very accurate while in fact they are the most accurate turbos in the game. Carracks you say you want to use vs fighters and that it is bad for that role. Which is correct. Because its role is to attack cruisers and other exposed large support ships. It can''t really hit anything smaller than a cruiser. Imperial Escort Carrier you are completely wrong there. first, it doesnt' carry squadrons, but flights. So you get 2x 3 Tie Hunters. 6 fighters in total for 1 squadron. And no it is not very good vs corvettes. In fact it gets hard countered by corvettes. the IEC loses to every single corvette in the game, hard. (Except the Interceptor corvettes). And no it can't damage fighter squadrons at all. Gunships maybe. The main guns can only hit cruisers and capital ships. It is essentially a carrack with worse guns, less health, but a size class smaller and carries the equivalent of 1 x-wing squadron. Other than that... yeah, the list seems solid enough. I would put some ships in different spots but that would then just come to playstyle and fleet doctrine being used.
Are you saying that the Arquitens frigate is too big? Like model wise it’s too big or what? You may be correct that it’s not tailored for anti-fighter, but 4 2-burst laser cannons help. Also, I don’t understand how the long range light TL is too inaccurate
When i say a ship is too big for its own good I mean it is a small ship class with a large enough frame to be hit consistently with different turbolasers, In AOTR i swear the size of the ship matters not the class. Neb Bs and arquitanse are the same class but neb bs are harder to hit if that makes sense
@@captonx2 they do have different hit boxes so yeah I can see that. There is one thing I don’t like about them. If they get single targeted then they just die, they’re too slow to get out of danger. Then again if the enemy gets that close to them then something went wrong
Eh, they can look at the comments, people will stand by whatever units they believe in and that’s fine with me, it’s been great seeing the passion everyone has for their favorite units
@@apex1757 hahanice! A lot of people have been going beserk over the arquitense but what’s funny as looking at the other tier lists they put in my discord the number ton folk is always f tier
also u got really good buildable fighters at T1 like avengers and IPVs for anti corvette duty, star galleons with their repair ability can keep arqs alive pretty well
let me know if you have any questions, plenty of content on the channel talking about different things as you know, also I'm really excited about my next video I think you'll love, its an overview of the mod.
On a more serious note - The interdictor is for me an s-tier ship. Being able to control the battle completely can turn any war into my advantage, and instead of having the enemy being able to "fight another day" I can inflict serious casualties to them in every battle. I rarely use the ISD version - to much unit cap.
Ya that's the argument, the interdict ability itself is too good not to have S tier, on another note very interesting to see your opinion of which interdictor to use. If im really trying in a battle I think the immobilzer is better for the pop cap reason for sure.
