Tests have been conducted on the crew for a long time and Janeway finally has enough The seventh episode of the fourth season. The episode is called: "Scientific Method".
Wait, you *increased* Janeway's adrenaline and dopamine levels, deprived her of sleep, threatened her crew and let her know it was you who did it? Were you *trying* to commit suicide?
I feel so bad for Janeway in this episode, esp when you actually see the metal prods being shoved and twisted into her skull. But lmao Mulgrew had quit smoking this episode and tapped into feeling miserable for her being so mean to the crew and then at the end tapped into 17 hr nicotine rage for her delighted insanity at the aliens 😄 iconic
what temp does the hull melt at I am just curious they never say it in the show just hull outer hull temp has reached 9 thousand degrees not what it melts at which would add to the suspense
@@JnEricsonx I just found out that Jeffery Combs, who played Thy'lek Shran in Star Trek: Enterprise also played Weyoun in Star Trek: Deep Space Nine. Btw, I'm still waiting for a Star Trek series with an Andorian as one of the main characters serving on the bridge of a Star Fleet spaceship.
This was true method acting; during filming Kate Mulgrew (a smoker) was going 24 hours without a cigarette. So her misery/aggression was 100% real. I’m a smoker, I recognize a nicotine withdrawal instantly.
I didn't know that but it makes total sense. I am a smoker too. I once quit and my partner at the time threatened to leave me if I didn't start smoking again I was so angry and irritable all the time. The withdrawal is absolutely brutal.
I love the stupidity of the aliens to think they still have control by threatening the captains life when the captains clearly ok with dying from her actions🤣
“You’re not in control here!” You don’t suppose those made Jurassic World have watched Voyager and remembered this line? Asking because it’s *nearly* the same when Claire said it to Owen.
I remember when this first aired, I screamed "YEAH!" when one of the alien vessels disintegrated when trying to escape. One of my favorite episodes from Voyager.
One thing that really gets me about this scene. Janeway didnt even hesitate to start CPR, probably the only medical thing she knows how to do. Didnt give up on that lady until she had to. She really would do anything to save every one of them. Not that other captains wouldn’t, but I don’t think there was ever a time where the captain was literally performing CPR trying to keep someone alive.
I like how it represents their situation too, they're stuck with no help from their galactic superpower allies and they use everything they have at their disposal, no matter whether they had the newest alien technology or were using methods thousands of years old to get by
Well this was an outdated CPR technic belonging to late 20th century. These days its all about chest compression, if you are doing it right there is no need for mouth to mouth oxygen delivery.
you know what's funny that ensign with sever adrenal stress that's me I'M SERIOUS MY ADRENALINE SYSTEMS ARE RUNNING THAT HOT HAVE BEEN SINCE I WAS A CHILD WHICH IS WHY EVEN IF I FAST FOR A DAY MY BLOOD SUGAR READING FOR A BLOOD SUGAR TEST COME BACK HIGH BECAUSE ADRENALINE IS TECHNCALLY SUGAR DUDE AND MY blood pressure is 127 over 65 not some insane number like the doctor says she has
Well, Kate Mulgrew was not very fond of Jeri Ryan anyway. I guess she was afraid of the competition. I remember an interview with Mulgrew where she said she hated how 'Voyager' supposedly had turned into 'The Jeri Ryan Show'. Sounds like she was a _bit_ envious of Ryan.
I met kate last year at the Rio, in Vegas. She is even more beautiful in person. I was also late to her table and almost missed her, but before they packed it up she gave me her autograph , I was the last one. Classy lady, she waited for me as I huffed up there, and then she smiled a me and then I knew she wasn't just an actress. Kate is a lovely kind woman who takes care of her fans, she called me a dear and then I walked on clouds all night. I also came from Anchorage, Alaska, from cool mountain air to meet her, to go all that way for that moment. It was one of the best times of my life.
astrangeone Kate is a gem, a real person, and she doesn't put on airs like she's better than everyone else. She's also beautiful in person, a peaches and cream complexion that would make a 20 year old envious. Kate is tops, I was not disappointed to travel from the top of the Earth (Alaska) to a dessert just to get her autograph. My roommate and I were in Anchorage the Winter previous, when we found out she was going to be there , we said ok, that's it , we're booking airfare and rooms. It was worth it, the highlight of our trip, and she made it all worthwhile.
pjgumby Kate Mulgrew was the reason I got my Fan Expo passes. I can't wait to meet her in person, and her voice makes me smile. Kind of that "whiskey and cigarette" voice. I have no idea how I'm going to afford the rest of Fan Expo.
CandyLaStar Considering Janeway went through the "year of hell" and all Picard did was survive the assimilation, I'd say that Janeway is a lot physically tougher than Picard is. Picard however was a rough character in his youth, so he does have some "dirty fighting" tactics as well. I'd probably say they are well matched. Except Janeway has spent a good deal of her career in hardship (essentially stranded away from Starfleet, while Picard was basically pampered)...I'd say that my money is also on Ms Kathryn Janeway. :)
astrangeone Completely agree! Even to add to that point she was the leader of a mini federation in the void, and worked to make deals with the borg, and many other races like the kay-son. She forsure was the better of the two.
Some people claim Janeway's method if regaining control of Voyager is questionable. But we must remember she was making a command decision under circumstances that had limited her options in a very extreme way. The aliens had left her no means of negotiating. Her prime duty is in defending her crew and then the ship. I really can't think of how she could have done better. I would welcome anyone to explain what other options she might have had.
Picard faced much the same issue. His solution was to arm the selfdestruct. When the alien relented, they were able to remove the threat immediately, with no damage to ship or crew. He was in complete control of the risk from first moment to last. A plan with a 95% chance to kill you all even if it works is a bad plan.
I love how it kills one of those alien ships they were like I can kill you in an instant that didn't save their ship with that idle threat the clearly had no control despite being able to kill them all in an instant
Even if the first ship didn't get destroyed immediately, it still couldn't escape the gravitational field of the pulsars. They would've needed to go beyond Warp 9.99 to escape and considering their size, I don't think they had that functionality.
It's not plot armor. This is obviously the work of Scotty! He wrote the book on engineering after all. Always overestimate the time/hull stress/pressure/energy/etc you need so that you'll seem like a miracle worker.
What you quoted is first part of what he said. Actually, the relevant part was the second part: When writing technical manuals and specifications for the piece of equipment, always under-estimate slightly the amount of stress and assorted beating it can take. Because there will always be engineers finding themselves in situations when they have to dial some part to eleven and hope it works out. Now I am wondering how many thousands of lives Scotty has saved during decades he did that. Let's say that there is piece of equipment which can work at 500 gigawhiz flawlessly for 99% of the time (as in, you can use it for decades at that capacity), 600 gigawhiz for 95% of the time (10 years of constant use), 800 gigawhiz for 50% at the time (5 years) and 1000 gigawhiz for 25% of the time (1 full year of unlimited use, but it has a chance to blow up in 6 months). And Scotty writes that the limit is 600 gigawhiz, but you should really use it at 500 gigawhiz for optimum effectiveness. So when some poor engineering bastard is forced to use it at 800 gigawhiz, he really seems like a miracle worker to his captain because he actually has better chance to survive the shenanigans than even he (the engineer) knows. And then the crisis is averted and some other ship gets into shit again and the engineer says "You know, I heard that engineer at *previous ship* made it run at 800 gigawhiz for 20 minutes" And captain is like "But we need them to run at 1000 gigawhiz for 5 minutes. They are going to blow. We are all going to die!" Engineer: "But what other choice do we have here?! We need at least 30% of gadgets to stay intact for us to survive." Captain: "Ok, make it so." And 75% of gadgets miraculously survive, even though effort at some places went up to 1100 gigawhiz! Captain: "Engineer, you are a miracle worker and a lifesaver!"
So unfortunate one of those ships seemed to get away. I was hoping Janeway would turn around and send them a complimentary photon torpedo to go with all that research data.
You don’t suppose those made Jurassic World have watched Voyager and remembered this line? Asking because it’s *nearly* the same when Claire said it to Owen.
Janeway is insane on a *good* day! Those aliens should have done more background-checking before they decided to turn the dial on her crazy up to eleven!
hahahahahahha... shes a good captain, and shes gona be a fantastic federation admiral, maybe shes the reason picard finally decides to take a few decades off so he doesnt have to deal with her commandeering him to go find a new source of coffee so she can really stay focused and alert while dealing with negotiations with other empires :/ Janeways probably half the reason the JJ abrahams universe has a time anomalie, Tal Shier probably was trying to find a way to deal with her influence at the negotiations tables... they ended up destroying Romulus atleast temporarily instead :/
I love that line, "Seems like I'm trying to crush this ship like a tin can." and she says it without drama, just a matter of fact. Wow, now that's cool!
Yeah, it was sort of a bluff, but not really. I mean, clearly she didn't want to destroy Voyager, but she knew it would be worse to let the aliens continue. Thinking about it, it's kind of a shame that the Voyager crew never took up poker night the way the Enterprise-D crew did. I bet even Seven wouldn't be able to tell when Janeway was bluffing.
@@Tantalus010 That's PRECISELY why they DON'T play poker on Voyager! Janeway ran them off the tables for 2 months. Finally, they gave up, and switched to pool.
Aren't they like 500 years in the future? With food replicators everywhere, I don't think they'd have cans. Imagine using a figure of speech about some kitchen item 500 years ago - seems pretty archaic. ;)
@@ColinFox We still say something is horse and buggy thinking although horses and buggys aren't the norm for traveling nowadays. What's to say that tin cans didn't have their use in the 23rd century?
I love the different aspects of Janeway that you see in this scene. The captain and protector who takes ownership of everything that happens to her ship and crew, the tactician who works out a winning strategy to achieve her goals and the scientist who applies her knowledge to the situation to work out the best outcome. Just a brilliant scene.
70,000 light years from home, from support, from back up. Facing a 75 year journey she kept rank and order and discipline. She made them feel like they were still Star Fleet, no matter how far from home they may be. She is legendary.
STFU - This show was one of the first in a long line of Men Drool, Gurl Power Rules. Clearly you're trying to get one of the female writers to sleep with you, stop SIMPing and get some "T" therapy.
I have always wondered what material that voyagers hull was made out of to take 9000 degrees and not melt just turn red then again it's the future so it must be some amazing new metal to take that kind of heat you know
@@coren5911 what is duranium's melting temp they don't say so in a way the hulls at 9000 degrees does not mean much unless you know what that minor detail is I mean yeah it could be a problem to crew members closer to the hull but that's a separate issue
@@raven4k998 My very limited understanding of the Fed's tech is this: They made an agreement with the Romulans and Klingons, whereby those two got to develop cloaks, but the Fed couldn't (forget why). As a consequence of this however, the Fed focused on making super-durable ships. Fed ships can't cloak, but they're hardier and tougher. This does give some credence to the possibility that they might have a better than... usual(?)... chance to survive here.
@@Aeroldoth3 it was the treaty of algeron that prohibits them from developing cloaking tech so long as the Romulan Star empire exists they cannot make cloaking tech
Fortunately Tuvok is calculating those odds based on this knowledge of the engineering specifications of the ship and as Scotty said a good engineer always leaves plenty of tolerance.
Even after the alien scientist sheds her invisibility and addresses her directly, Janeway refuses to look at her. It's her way of saying "This is not a negotiation. This me establishing dominance over you. You can either submit or die, and I really don't care which one you choose."
Captain Janeway can be one hell of a badass! She doesn't let the Kazon, the Borg or even her own future self try to control her! This is a perfect example of a "decisive, risk-taking moment," especially when Voyager and her crew are confronted with hostile aliens. Janeway can kick ass, even if it means her own death and the destruction of Voyager.
@@oddish4352 Looking how the surviving ship burned opposite to Voyager, decelerating (and therefore doing an opposite of a slingshot maneuver, required to clear the pulsars)... I'd say all of them were turned into atomic spaghetti
@@caav56 Considering what they were doing, it's hard to feel any sympathy. Janeway told them to stop, and they not only refused, but then they killed a crewman. There are consequences for things like that.
***** It amazes me that Federation starships can survive flying through something like a binary pulsar yet against the Dominion they were getting blown up left and right. Although the fact that many of the ships fighting in the war were old 23rd century relics like Mirandas and Excelsiors (and probably some Constitution refits in there somewhere) it's probably no wonder that the UFP was losing so many ships in that war :-P
Yep. You hit it right on the head Amendolea. The Defiant and Galaxies did much better throughout the war. They apparently didn't put the Lakota upgrades to the Excelsior on too many ships...unfortunately.
3Rayfire Upgrading such old starships was probably more trouble than it was worth. In order to be able to have an Excelsior-class be able to channel Galaxy-class phaser power through its old phaser banks would require a major upgrade to its main power source for one thing (a standard power/warp core for an Excelsior wouldn't've been producing even half the power necessary to produce such firepower) and for another thing major upgrades to the power relay systems....since even if they could get a power source for the Excelsior capable of producing enough power to power the upgrades, without corresponding upgrades to the power relay system then the minute they tried to fire said upgraded phasers it would've blown every power relay that that old Excelsior had :/
I love that she got her revenge for her murdered crew, in that one of the aliens ships was pasted, probably taking as many or more of them than she lost. Well done Janeway.
Great character, yes. Can you honestly say if the plot wasn't set up keep voyager's journey going that the ship would have lasted five minutes in the Delta Quadrant with her as Captain?
Actually I would’ve liked to see Voyager fire a couple of photon balls just to get rid of those cowards, but seeing one ship blow up was a consolation price at best. Had it been a Klingon vessel, well. It would’ve been not only torpedoes , hah
Ironically, if the aliens had not doped up Janeway and deprived her of sleep she probably would NOT have done what she did. But when you push someone to the edge, sometimes you get cut. (See what I did there?)
@@oldnotweak Possibly. I remember watching this episode when it first aired and cheered my butt off when one of the two alien ships blew up while detaching (hoping it'd be both).
Ehhh..... Plot armor would be, "Captain, the vulcans showed up and shielded us, no damage to the ship." They were clearly limping after they went through.
This was very similar to Picard activating the auto destruct to prevent the crew from being tortured in the season 2 episode against Nagilum. Only this is more like playing chicken with a hot rod at full speed near a cliff.
It's a little Different. These experiments would kill her whole crew. Voyager couldn't get anywhere missing 1/3 the crew at random. Picard could have just called for a pickup.
I disagree. I think what Janeway did was way more ballsy, and it was not playing chicken. I doubt Picard would've sacrificed the entire crew. Picard could've turned off auto destruct, so he was indeed bluffing. Janeway did not have the option of turning back. Once she was committed, she was all in. There was no bluff. So, had Janeway been playing chicken, she drove straight off the cliff and landed on the other side
The guest star who played the head alien female did a great job. Her ability to portray heartlessness, arrogance and a superiority attitude helped us all cheer when the aliens died!
This is the episode that made Janeway one of the all time greats. Up until now, Voyager was a happy-go-lucky trek across unknown space. After this scene, she bent the universe to her whim. Everything wanted to kill her crew, and she knew that the only way to survive was to use her instincts. Janeway finally understood the prime directive
I was thinking that this was a very Klingon Tactic. Random Officer "Sir, The intruders have boarded the ship,they outnumber us 10 to 1!" Captain "GOOOD, we are assured a place in STO VO KOR! Aim the Bird of Prey for the Ground! FOR GLORIOUS SLAUGHTER! KAPLAH!!! "
Lovi Poekimo :) I've had insomnia on and off all my life, and the idea of some group FORCING me to go without sleep really touched me on a visceral level-- I guess we all felt that.
I know humans with similar ethics. All 'clinical' and 'in the name of logic or science' with zero compassion or humanity. A bit like some of the Nazi era savages
@@joet7136 yeah the second ship got the slower death. Even if they were able to make it the first one exploding already shows their hulls were far weaker than voyager in that situation so exploding shortly after the scene is a guarantee.
@@kishascape Think you're right. Right after they lifted away from Voyager Janeway says that she can't break free from the gravitational forces. That other ship is dust.
@@IronSpyder-ky2lk Sisko is another pet of godlike aliens. Once a captain says "I'll just play chicken and see if god saves me" he's not a hero anymore. He's a pawn. Then when he's going to let his son get killed and he's crying about how he won't go against his masters, just sickening.
They're going to ruin the new star trek, aren't they :( By pandering to whatever bs is in the news at that moment. If only they would look at this series and realise it was great without their agendas.
A great episode and finale. Janeway pulled her Boss card and handled her damn business. Killing one of her crew in front of her, what the hell were they thinking? Did not who they were F***ing with.
If she'd actually gone for 96 hours without sleep, that could very literally be the case. People generally start hallucinating and acting irrationally after about 72 hours of sleep deprivation. Now stack an extra day on that and whatever else the aliens had been doing with her brain chemistry... yeah, I'd say "crazy" is definitely a closer fit than "reckless"
I can't remember a whole lot of individual Voyager plotlines because I watched the show when I was a kid, but this episode has stuck with me. Janeway was pissed at being a lab rat and she was going to do whatever it took to get her crew free.
I think the part about this scene that showcases Janeway the most is the way she keeps fighting to save that crewman even after the EMH says she's dead. Janeway is on a knife edge ALL THE TIME because she's responsible for getting that crew home and there's no way to for them to be backed up by Starfleet. She's entirely isolated as a Captain in a way that none of the other series Captains are, and she takes that role to an extreme level because of it. Every single lost crew member is personal for her.
Which is why I don't understand these peanut-sized brain morons who say this was "TNG" lite. Opinions are beautiful. One can argue when the Borg became pussies and even if "Voyager" was as good as "TNG" and "DS9" but there is no way this is "TNG" lite. It was darker than "TNG" even if not darker than "DS9." This too was arguably anti-"TNG." This show had the most thrills along with "DS9."
And this is exactly why I love her. She wasn't perfect, she just did what needed to be done and wore the consequence. No other captain could have survived for 7 years in the Delta Quadrant
TARDIS Tales Agreed, except for the last statement: Sisko could have done it. He and Janeway were the only captains who had to make genuinely hard decisions, facing bad consequences no matter what they did. They didn't have all the deus ex machinas that Kirk and Picard got so often.
***** Agreed...but only because Picard always had the luxury of convenient plot twists to make sure he never had to make a really tough decision. Janeway and Sisko were the only captains who regularly had truly tough choices with no "right" answers.
YT Cyberpunk Hmm... I kind of disagree a little bit, Picard had to do a lot of scary mediation work which involved big decisions, but yeah, you're right in that the nature of both Sisko's and Janeway's situation was pretty unique, they really hadn't much room to handle. They basically were forced to be radical.
Zona Rosa Matter of perspective. The deus ex machina here is just externalized to the director. She did not blew up, because the writer chose so. This was a gamble, and it worked out, that's it.
i feel like thats a George Lucas touch having it have eyes and a mouth as it rocks side to side like its almost a droid... seriously he did over see the special effects, do not be surprised if he was trying to give the ship a bit of extra character and a sense of artificial intelligence
Remember when Star Trek actually asked questions? How far can you take 'the end justifies the means'? Is it morally ok to experiment on living beings? What does this say of our treatment of animals? How evolved does a living being have to be so that we think it is ok to torture it in order to advance science? etc. Now we have ST: Discovery and ST: Picard, where the most profound questions are like: Will Dahj take revenge on his boyfriend?
@@Mademoiselle_Katie Wow really? I haven't seen STP because I don't feel that I should be forced to subscribe to a streaming service just to watch one show. However, if that's what happens in STP than I'm glad I didn't. 😟
@@BlueCourtingBooks That actually didn't happen Dahj and her sister were at varying levels of existential crisis because their survival programming kicked in. That said STP did have issues. It completely inverts the general approach to Artificially Intelligent life in the series. Compared to what we're used to it's....remarkably bleak.
Dude, Picard asks if humanity has the right to destroy a life form we created and if we can even legitimately create life or if everything we create is inherently property. It doesn't get more profound than that.
I met Kate Mulgrew at a Star Trek convention some years back, she is a lovely person and she appreciates her fans, I was so honored to meet her, she also called me a dear and I was over the moon. She truly is a beautiful person, inside and out. She truly is a stellar person, one of the most best moments of my life. She is also just as beautiful in person as on film, she doesn't need make up, 20 years olds would be envious of her completion, she was older, but I'm telling you, this is and will always be a beautiful woman and the best Caption of Star Trek!
One of the many moments janeway proved she IS a badass Janeway: *does CPR to try and revive her not working * "this ends right now" In her head: OK NOW IM PISSED AND NOT JUST BECAUSE OF YOUR NEEDLES
Picard would have first asked Riker's opinion, then asked Troi what she was feeling, then maybe called down to engineering to ask Geordie if the ship could take it, and finally thought about it all. Janeway just did it.
Well, when Nagilum did the same thing to his crew, he actually activated the self destruct put on some opera (I think) and had a nice cup of Earl Grey.
I'll admit to blatant sexism when it came to Janeway, I didn't think a female captain would be able to exert the same level of authority, but I was pleasantly surprised, janeway is the perfect captain for voyager.
@@LilKumStainzzIt’s the same now a days, like with Doctor Who. Everyone was concerned when there was a female Doctor, and their concerns were proven. Unfortunately/fortunately for me, before I could write the whole series off, my mom got hooked on it -_- but I got to see, around mid of the series I think? They accidentally showed they were perfectly capable of writing an amazing Female Doctor Who. But they had that character be written off to keep sucking the non-existent dick of the shitty one. Motives always shine through with writing. If motives are genuine and innocent, like here with Star Trek, you’ll find incredible works. If they’re scheming, conniving, gaslighting, manipulating, and focusing solely on checking boxes, you’ll get garbage like Doctor Who was/is today.
OK, I know I'm gonna catch flak on this comment but Janeway is one of the best captains in Star Trek. She's a brilliant scientist, very knowledgeable and "don't respond well to threats" LOL. STV wasn't the best series in the franchise but i enjoyed every single part of their journey.
A fabulous episode and sequence. I remember reading an article in the Star Trek Voyager magazine back in the day about this episode. Kate Mulgrew had given up smoking when this episode was being filmed. I think her nicotine withdrawals made this episode! I miss Voyager!
"I never knew you thought of me as reckless, Tuvok!" "A poor choice of words. Clearly, you are not reckless, but crazy. Unfortunately for us both, I like crazy."
she had actually the most difficult task from all 3 captains, Picard, Sisko, Janway I mean. 1. No reinforcements 2. Picard had Data as a super strong Android with the ability to calculate everything, also Deana Troy could tell him everything he needed to know, about the mind of his enemy. 3. Sisko had ODO, who could impersonate everybody, ALSO Sisko had the prophets who saved his life and the lifes of every human by destroying the Dominion Armada in entering the Alpha Quadrent. Also Jadzia, who had like 500 "mind" years. Janeway had only Tuvok, and maybe KES, but Kes was only an unexperienced child, didn't do much. Later she "acquired 7of9", then it was bit easier, but still she wasn't DATA, or a shape shifter, or a prophet for that matter. Well the Doctor, with his mobile emitter was kinda helpful. So she had to "improvise" ;)
One of my favourite Janeway moments. I like her and Sisko best when they're doing the sort of psychotic (kamikaze star diving, face-mashing time erasing ships) or sociopathic (poisoning planets, murdering Romulan senators) things that Picard would never be caught doing.
Yeah Picard is just the kind of guy who will park you between the Enterprise and Three Bird of Prey, blow up the flammable coolant when you won't, or put bitches in their place diplomatically.
you mean the same Picard that went into Romulan territory on the whim of a defector ... got caught ... only to have two Aces (Klingon ships) in reserve.
