Star Wars - Tenebrae, The Dark Lord of Many Faces Theme [Extended] 

But Traya was before Vitiate?

@@goodmind4940 No. Vitiate was over a thousand years old when he died. He mastered essence transfer and lived in many bodies, but his original form was that of the Sith species.

If the Ancient Sith still existed there wouldnt even be a need for the Sith rules.

@@goodmind4940 Actually, in the times of the KOTOR 2 Vitiate was a Sith Emperor ruling the Empire from the Dromund Kass, and Sith return (which become a plot for ToR) to face the Republic once again happen 300 years later.

@@goodmind4940 vitiate was there during Marka ragnos ascension as dark lord of the sith, that's like 700 years before traya i think. Although, i believe traya was talking far way back than those times

He basically said to Marr that Sith Empire was a failure basically the unfavorite child of two empires.

@@darthportus still amazing how he could hold his position as the most feared thibg5in the galaxy and be the head and master of the Empire and all it's Sith. But in fact creating bigger and better EMPIRE and not even caring about Republic and Empire war. His only setback was death of his host. But that is why he kept light and dark torn Revan alive. It was all planned long time ago.

"Everything else a means to an end."

True. The only thing that got him focused back on the Sith Empire was his desire to recruit Revan.

Nihilus couldn't control the desire to consume. He's basically a slave to his power. Personification of hunger?

Valkorion hype statements at their finest :)

Well Vitiate, at base, did not want to die. I think they missed that opportunity with him, like Bioware did with Corypheus. He would have been more compelling as a villain if he was rebelling against a fundamental part of the human condition.

@@salvadoroars Exactly. Nihilus was a slave to his power. Vitiate was master of his power. There is the difference.

Didn't Vitiate need to perform a complicated Sith Ritual to do that? As far as I know Nihilus could just do it at the drop of a hat, or maybe Nihilus' power does it itself and Nihilus has no control over it, kind of like a really lousy trade off for a quick execution.

I love how you used the line from his Valkorion persona but stating it was Vitiate who said it. His real name is and will be, Lord Vitiate

HK-47 is ready to serve. *Cough* *Cough* You mean Tenebrae *Cough*

I always remember that quote as being "A man can have anything, if he's willing to sacrifice... everything," which equally as cool in my opinion.

Ngl, Tenebrae is actually terrifyingly powerful, not many vilains in games and films alike can make me feel that way

Except he didn't sacrifice anything of his. In his Dark Side-infected mind he may have thought the galaxy and all its inhabitants already by default, but they were never truly his. He only sacrificed other beings and what belonged to them. I can only equate one other being with his level of soul-devouring evil, and that would be Sheev Palpatine Darth Sidious, galactic emperor and grandfather of Jedi Grandmaster Rey Palpatine-Skywalker.

@Anonymity Online Agreed. Kylo and Snoke are maggots masquerading as dragons. The Sith of old wouldn't even care to swat them.

The Ancient sith are a embarrassment to the modern sith, all Darth Bane needed to get most of his plans going to destroy the brotherhood was a single Revan Holocron and some Lightsaber lessons, if he had gotten to be taught by the Ancient Sith there wouldnt even be a Ro2 he would´ve remade the sith empire.

@@sebas8225 the ancient sith weren't embarrassments

@@aeriallogan7014 To Bane they were. The Brotherhood and all other Sith before them were stupid enough not to have come up with the Rule of Two before him. Remember, Bane came up with the Rule of Two by not relying wholly upon the Dark Side of the Force, but upon his basic common sense as well. Something so seemingly small and insignificant, yet it allowed Bane to claim the title of Darth and reinvent the Sith into something that would stand the test of time. The Brotherhood of Darkness, like the Jedi Order, would have stagnated and weakened over the centuries, leading Bane to conclude that the Brotherhood were rather unhealthy competition. He tricked Lord Kaan into gathering together all the Sith on Rusaan and making a thought bomb. But the Sith Emperor, Vitiate, would mop up the floor with either Darth Bane or Darth Sidious.

@@Robert_Douglass Therein lies the issue. Many of the greatest Jedi and Sith tempered their force powers, insight and philosophy with mortal reason. One need only look at the examples of effective Sith rulers to see this. Marr, Bane, Marka Ragnos, even Palpatine's success was achieved by him tempering his impulses, pity he let success deprive him of reason.

Vitiate was actually in fact so weak with the force he barely could produce sith lightning... His stories, like many other ancient sith stories, are heavily exaggerated... The only truly old Republic sith that i believe were as strong as told are nihilus and revan ..... And for that, i hold them as 2 of the most powerful sith ever...

@@harrymurray9702 the first part, the string of slurs, was unnecessary and didn't make sense with the rest of your comment. I do agree this being is one of the most powerful force user in Star Wars history. Tenebrae will never be matched

James Jackson Films obi one said that in battlefront 2

@@tori9365 You literally see what Vitiate is capable of in TOR. He killed an entire world, and that was from beyond the grave.

@@tori9365 Exar Kun be like: Am I a joke to you? lol. No denying that Revan is the best Sith ever, and Nihilus is the very image of all my nightmares

It is you who fears death, 'Valkorion'. I do not. I will not kneel.

You would sooner die than acknowledge my superiority?

"Remember me, when your Alliance *burns* to ash."

lol i dont remember that line. He will be back thought. Maybe just maybe one day we will meet the dark god Tenebrah. The sith with black eyes that stare right into your soul. The hints are there my friends. Find me a black eyed sith and remember RED to grey skin. Sith appearance and black almond eyes. Then and only then will you have seen the body of a god. a being so terrifying it made even Revan scared. Revan who threw many force users around like ragdolls Revan who never losts 1v1 to anyone includeing your swtor hero as you needed the help of everyone who was powerful force and not to help you. That hero lost to Tenebrah in a 1v1 and it was SOO short of a match indeed. Be afraid very afraid when you meet the real version.

"You presume limits to my power... There are none."

i swear this is like a experiment to him and to bioware creators of the story to see how many people they can fool even though they throw the shit right in their faces with evidence to realize hes not dead.

Terlin1466 actually, they spend the after story throwing evidence of his final death, no ambiguity is made on the subject

his final death? after story? sorry i haven't played in awhile i didn't know they added stuff after his defeat inside your head.

+ Terlin1466 In the form of messages from the various important known force users of the game, like satele shan and marr, which are received after chapter 12, confirming that all force users which was once in contact with him felt his destruction as opposite to what happened when he was only banished

OHH you mean the scenes where she was training jedi. OK yes that thing died. But.. I still say hes not fully dead because we still have not meet the orginal body that other scenes talk about having insane powers we have not seen yet. After all what died what was Valkorian attaching it self to the out lander. Of course everyone in the galaxy felt that death. It was insanely powerful but that was not all of him. He still out there somewhere. Granted if bio ware truly ended his story like that. That is pathetic and show just how much EA has its tentacles in them now. There is unexplained ends here and all fans known it. WHat happen to force ghost revan. He said he had much to do.. What was that? and this is the other. Unless bio ware officially says hes truly dead i will most likely not believe it. They are fools to end it like this however. Just shows how shabby they have gotten i could write a better story then that.

He still lives.

gelul12 bet

@@gelul12 Hes immortal he can be wounded and hurt but not destroyed. Unlike the light however Tenebrae one with the force is more of a Control over it. The only way he would truly die is to let go which is what he probably does do at some point because he cant seem to hold on to all of the force as its too powerful for even him to control forever. Story wise there a several plot holes in his story line that can hint hes not dead either. His original body for one still exists somewhere and most sith spirits hang around their body's even if they are dead. So his force ghost would be near his at least a portion of it. It is very likely he lost most of his power however as a lot of his power was in the out lander. If they ever did bring him back he would have to consume a lot of power first to pose any threat.

@Terlin1466 You realize that they confirmed that Vitiate/Tenebrae/Valkorion died a final death at the hands of the Alliance Commander, right? He's dead. He's not coming back. Just like Revan cannot come back because he joined with the force, Tenebrae ceased to be an entity in-of itself. The whole story arc of KOTFE and KOTET was meant to illustrate that Tenebrae relied on stolen power, and he was only as powerful as the host he possessed could handle. That's why he wanted the Player Character. It was also revealed earlier that Tenebrae couldn't consume planets with his own accumulated power - he needed an ancient, hyper-advanced technological, force-sensitive AI that would 'buff' his power to do it - which you find out with the finale to the story arc wherein Theron Shan betrays you and turns out to be a double agent on your side. All in all, Vitiate was not as powerful as the original writers at BioWare intended him to be. They intended him to be a black 'stain' on the force, an abyssal aspect that the Force was actively trying to destroy because he was NOT NATURAL in any way, shape or form - just like the Force created the line of the "Chosen Ones" to stop Darth Sidious. Sidious was also not natural, and was considered a corrupting Shadow in the force. Everything to do with Shadow of Revan, KOTFE, KOTET and after makes absolutely no sense and is terrible writing at best. The concept of an Empire with technology far in advancement compared to the Republic and Empire combined was ridiculous, considering that one DARTH MALGUS was constantly crusading in uncharted space (so he would have FOUND the Fallen Empire and reported it to the Dark Council) before he became a traitor to the Empire. In both expansions, they completely retconned or outright disregarded founded lore set by the original writing team before EA liquidised half of their assets. In the Wrath's personal story conclusion, he/she receives mail from The Hand of the Emperor. They reveal that the Emperor's *REAL BODY* (yes, REAL BODY. His original, Pureblood body with its pure black eyes) was being transported to a safer location so that he could recover from his defeat to the Jedi Knight. His battle with the Jedi Knight nearly killed him permanently, along with the death of his Voice (The Voss Dignitary he possessed). Each death significantly weakened him, and his fight with the Jedi Knight nearly vanquished him. We never see his original body. We get Valkorion. Did we see Tenebrae's real form in your character's mind-scape during the final battle? No, we don't. It would have been good had they done that, but they wasted more opportunity. We saw Lord Dramath, his father. Nothing else. It was never stated that Vitiate was a bodiless entity, it was always implied that he needed a host in order to survive. As EU/Legends "canon" dictates that DARK SIDED ENTITIES CANNOT EXIST WITHOUT SOMETHING TO BIND THEMSELVES TO. Only Light Sided entities can do that in the Legends lore. Every powerful Sith Lord in EU/Legends "canon" has had to bind their essence/spirit to something in order to return, otherwise their spirit literally becomes nothing. This includes Vitiate. It was also originally intended that Revan died (for good) on-board the Foundry to the Imperial Strike Team. He was NOT MEANT to come back, his story ended there and the original writers/dev team DID STATE that they wanted to end Revan's story in the vanilla release. They had no intentions of bringing him back. Also, bringing MALGUS back so late into the game is also a huge desperation act, because he was the face of the Empire - one of the poster boys of the game - and was originally intended to have a MUCH BIGGER ROLE in the game's story besides the False Emperor events. In-fact it was even stated that Malgus wasn't meant to be dead, but the writing development of the game went back and forth that they were constantly going, "Yeah he's dead", "No he's alive, just hiding", "No he's dead", "Nah we're shelfing Malgus until we can figure out what to do!", "No he's back in KOTFE as a prisoner!", "Nah, scratch that, we've deleted the footage of carbonite Malgus. We've shelfed him again". See what I mean? Shadow of Revan, KOTFE and KOTET were all desperate ploys for a dying game. And this is coming from someone who has the pre-ordered collectors edition. What a wasted piece of potential for an MMO. TOR is very dead, it's running on a skeleton crew. It barely has 15% of its playerbase left. Most of them aren't even subscribed any more.

@@narky5071 hot damn dog you went ham

Or just a badass vilain like we like them

Peace through life be eliminated? What kind of peace is that?

@@johnnydavis5896 Absolut and ethernal piece my friend. "You presume limits to my power. There are none."

@@johnnydavis5896 for the empire he was a merciless emperor that they want dead For the republic he was a monster who bid the war For zakull he was a hero

At the end, there would be no one to hate him as villain. Or to praise him as hero if his plan had not been stopped.

It will happen bro don't worry :) Soon ownership will be a joke. The independent film makers which know the history will also be CRAVING to begin work if they havnt already.

I don't see Malgus here

It is already canon. But not in fake Disney's reality.

They are even better Than the "Canon" siths in my opinion. When I think of Star Wars, those are the names and eras that come to my mind.

What about Sion, Bane, Zannah, along with the EU's Krayt? What about the Yhuuzan Vong? Not to mention, RIP Naga Sadow, Ludo Kressh, and Darth Andeddu.

True. Like when he wants you to kneel, he says he'll share his power with you, and he does, literally gives you his power after you kneel. Then he's killed and starts prepping your body as his new vessel. Question is, did he only want your body after he lost his? Or had he already chosen you beforehand? Despite all that, it was still pretty awesome to be trained by Vitiate himself, even if it was only to his advantage. He really does know a lot about the Force, but sharing is not really like him. Plus knowing his backstory makes it pretty clear he's basically pure evil.

MadRazz I know I’m a year late, but I think Valkorion was actually going to either A. Take your body or B. kill you. The player character is a threat to him and has more potential than any form he had ever taken especially if you are a Sith Inquisitor dark sided.

@@JacobTD don't discount light side inquisitor, since absorbing the darkness from ghosts does give you some power too since you are still sith

@@a1z158 But not full power as the Dark side inquisitor will get

@@EeniThesian66 oh yeah, no question-though I would question if it would be safe to have ghosts imprisoned in your head along with valkorian

He had to be gone, for the movies to happen. ;)

or maybe he returned as Snoke. Death cannot contain him. When will he come next? Like seriously do we know how he survived all those deaths? How did he chain himself to Yavin?

+T. Actually, this game isn't part of the Disnay Star Wars EU. They could bring him back and use him however they want.

He will be back. remember what Doc said. That kira and Scourge dissapeared when valkorion was defeated and they felt something. And you see his Essence Escape at the end.

He is still out there somewhere waiting for the opportune moment to rise and strike back of those puny jedi

somehow, vitiate returned

I might start doing this thanks for the idea

I'm going to have to do that now.

you comment is​ perfect, i agree, but Palpatine is a great character too, a great sith, the personification of the dark side for​ me

the sith are the most interesting charters in stars. vitiate, bane, palpatine, vader, plaugius, maul and even dooku though a lot of people dont like him i think he was one of the only good things from episode 2

funny thing is he already had the power to do it. BUt for plot sake and interesting character development he didn't care about that anymore. His son however did care about it and completed his father original idea. His daughter just wanted death and destruction because she was torched and only knew pain threw her life. His plan was to cause change and live and he for sure achieved one of those goals. Because hes dead now until needed again.

The real planet destroyer is nihilus but ur right he can destroy planets too

That's why all Sith aspired to be him he was never consumed by his emotions but he commanded the power of the dark side.

probably get instantly eaten

I can mimic that voice

Valkorian was an amazing performance, I thought Vitiate's voice was simply sufficient.

*and I can DO THAT VOICE*

in Star Wars*

So you don t join the dark side So you will death

you trying to say something?

To me it was perfect if you are a inquisitor

He is the masterpiece of Star wars history for me, the only sith so tempered and patient to wait milenia for his plans to work. magnificent.

@@saltymate9104 To be fair the Ro2 sith before Darth Venemous and his sucessors were patient as hell.

So wholesome

"A god has no family."

"Remember me, when your Alliance burns to ash..."

Luke724 was, and ever continues to be

Yes, He is a really great villian but I think Darth Sidious is best.

Luke724 Yeah. Vitiate, Darth Malgus, Darth Revan and Darth Nox are the greatest Sith of the Old Republic (In my personal opinion).

Here's part II (from 1:45 to 2:05): Ima in manu sunt. Vorator terrarum. -> The most inferior are in his hand. Devourer of worlds.

fascinating, are you able to decipher the complete first phrase?

you are awesome

For years now I've been trying to find the text to it, thanks for a part of it

A good use of my language’s great-grandmother^3. Latin is basically one of the easiest scariest linguals to use for anything this awesome.

Ouch, even if true that was a bit blunt.

Jay Seyton "He is immortal but not invulnerable."

Who needs a family, when you have god-like powers? Powers to crush all your foes to atoms...

A "god" doesnt exist... But everyone and everything that lives has a "family" ... 💩

@@tori9365 Prove God doesn't exist? No life can exist without God. No science or theory can quantify or justify existence.

There's so much to do with it, in so, so many eras, so many movies to do. They would litteraly crawling in a big ocean of money if they did, but no, they choose to swipe this.

not while Krazy Kathleen Kennedy and her ilk have ther hands on it.

NOOOO!! do NOT let disney NEAR the old republic era! no no NOOOO

I’d rather Kathleen keeps her grubby mits far from any of the actually well written female leads of these games. Plus part of what makes the games so great is the Dark Side vs. Light Side choices that the player makes. Stuff that could only reasonably work in the video game medium

It has begun.

I wonder what those pesky little force immune brats would do in the closest galaxy to the star wars one.

Valkorion: Fascinating

He indeed still lives.

snoke is just a joke

Sidious is up there with valkorion

@@isaiahdryg5010 Check the Echoes of Oblivion story, Sidious isn't even close

@@MegaAgamon Sidious literally requires the main characters of the Star Wars universe to overcome him. Valkorion loses to characters I create and make up in a video game 🤣 That’s like comparing the clown “grandmasters” from the coruscant council who exile Meetra to the council from the movies. I mean really? You’ve got to be joking. BioWare can rant about Valkorion all they want. Yoda and Mace were basically the most powerful Jedi ever and couldn’t even figure out they were in Sidious web. I know you want to imagine your little role play character being on Yoda and mace level, but you’re delusional.

Sidious would be dust by the sheer knowledge of Vitiates knowledge of the force. He is immensely powerful in the force. He is a weak duelist though, that is his downfall.

Vitiate ez win

Vitiate is literally a fucking god of the dark side, creating multiple galaxy-spanning empires and turning even the brightest Jedi to the dark. Sidious ruled for, what, 40 years tops?

probably sidious is vitiate

@@giuseppepapaleo3030 He's not.

"He copies me so much, must be a fanboy" Valkorion

"Vitiate, the guy that with 2 empires didn't rule the galaxy? Oh sure, that cute innocent boy" Palpatine

@@mr.ditkovich6379 Valkorion's plan wasn't to rule the galaxy, though. He wanted everything to be destroyed, not rule it

@@frederickivan6009 Rule or not, George Lucas said Darth Sidious is the most powerful sith when SWTOR was canon

@Jairugar Same as Sidious if you count legends too 🙄

and mutated sea bass with lasers

tenebrae returned, not valkorion

@@aeriallogan7014 both returned

That's what all this lockdown business is really about. They're stopping us from leaving because Tenebrae is preparing for Nathema 2: Electric Boogaloo

:)

@Exar kun The dark side cosmic entity Don’t forget Marka Ragnos

According to George Lucas, Sidious is the most powerful.

@@troyandrade435 i think that only Mortis Gods and Anakin at full Power could be more powerful. Palpatine Is smarter

Sidious : " consumes his force storm with his own , larger , more powerful one "

:)

They found god and converted to his cause.

technically his original form was a pureblood bastard born to a maid who had an affair with a sith lord.

Well looks like we'll get👀

We do now. We didn't get to see his true original form as much but at least we finally got to see it. It stood true to the book.

And apparently that was my only at a small portion of his power.

Wo

You're welcome bro! This is my favorite theme as well!

Tbh, even then I still suspect he’ll have done something to survive. I mean, he does leave your mind for a while to “attend” to something he never explains. Bet he’ll be back eventually. (Also good to see a new comment lol)

Long live Emperor/Empress Nox

AgentSmithXD It's very likely that Nox turned into the new Sith Emperor.

And his ex family , and the holocron of his father

He aint dead.

The Last Jedi novellization retconned this, saying when she seen into Kylo, she also "seen" into his training, when they became connected, she gained even more of his training and knowledge. She couldn't control it though, things just popped into her head, bits and pieces. Also if you think about the fight scene at the end of TFA, Kylo was just messing around, toying with her, he was cought off guard at the end, happens, remember Maul. If the movie explained this, or at least hinted at it, I suspect, there would be a lot less controversy surrounding her character. Also, she lived as a scavenger for a really long time, had to fight other scavengers and thugs, she was a melee combatant from the start. I kinda have a better idea how this should have been solved. As a child, if she found any "basic trainer" or manuals of Jar"kai, Teräs Käsi, or some Echani unarmed combat, then she could be way above the level she displayed at the end of TFA even without the Force. Is it possible? Yup, martial arts training for self-defence is a thing in Star Wars too, and to find a holovid with basic training sessions is not inconcievable. Even though it was in Legends, there was a master-level Jar'kai warrior in a Clone Wars novel, who could outperform many Jedi knights with his dueling skills. Considering how Rey fights, Echani would make most sense since they train for swords and staves too. This would solve the "untrained" part far better than convenient Force crap. The TFA novel also hinted that she liked to learn all she could as a kid. It would not be a stretch at all!

I don't remember him becoming a sith lord at the age of 13. However, Vitiate was an anomaly among the sith species, his black eyes being a distinct characteristic that hinted to him being exceptionally strong in the force. To this day we have no backstory of Rey or why she is so proficient in the force. She's the main protagonist of new SW and she's completely void of anything interesting and intriguing. A complete waste of screen time.

@Rick Lewis , were you refering as Sidious and Vader, the last two sith lords ? Because the thing is : Kylo Ren, his knights and Snoke are not Sith. They are another type of darkside users. ;)

@@HallimarRathlornStudios Wait, so the true moral of Star Wars would be that "it was better before" !? xD Nooo... x)

@IamKingOfHearts It's stupid and it serves only to favor Johnson's need to subvert expectation. Fuck that soy soaked fool

L Drago I will miss him, but his death was completing the whole.Kotor cycle, everything must end, His death was well introduced and highly symbolic, and no one say his mark on the galaxy will not.continu to haunt us

Maybe a Force Ghost in a Canon story for that matter?

One word. Snoke....

L Drago We should have had a chance to consume him, making him only allowed to speak. Sap his power, like the Sith Inquisitor. Too bad we sent him to the void. Imagine this: Valkorian: "A God has no family." Outlander: "Then you'll be a forgotten God, but don't worry, I will be remembered and you will watch while I destroy everything you built and wipe your name from existence."

He was an apex of everything Dark Side represent including total DEATH of everything what lives, so he must be *REMOVED* from it for the future of the galaxy... However I still wonder if there IS possible to truly kill someone who had have enough time to learn secrets of the Dark Side making Palpatine a kindergarten Sith in compare...

Öziboy TV except luke skywalker

And Abeloth.

Tealion Wolfheart abeloth is more of an entity than a person i think

and Sidious -from The Dark Empire comics anyways.

Except from the celestial beings

Sounds just like Dromund Kaas. Sith dreams friend!

It seems getting together a bunch of force ghosts is the only way to kill Sith emperors these days.

@@CyberController- Well it took the most legendary and most powerful jedi and sith that ever existed to destroy him and even that was almost not enough. If tenebrae hadn't made the mistake of concentrating on more than one jedi, he would have a body again and then nothing could have stopped him.

@@zerefdragnell8756 I was just bringing up how Tenebrae and Palpatine die almost the exact same way.

@@CyberController- No you don't, I've already heard that many people compare the scene with the 9 part of Star Wars. This is the greatest bulshit of all time. Rey eventually gets the strength of all the deceased jedi and palpatine dies from his own lightning bolts. Really embarrassing by the way. Tenabre, on the other hand, is fought effectively and personally by the living and the dead. The fact that many dead appear at the end does not mean much or did nothing, it was just dead who wanted to watch tenebrae die. In the end tenabrea dies because of the main character and everyone who fought.

@@zerefdragnell8756 If you read the novelization, that's exactly what kills Palpatine. Rey gets killed by Force Drain, and all the Jedi force ghosts possess her body to fight against Palpatine. She wasn't talking about powers or being metaphorical, she literally was all the Jedi. But that doesn't matter. What matters is that EOO gave us an amazing send off to an amazing villain. And I swear to god, If Bioware brings Tenebrae back one more time......

He wasn't particularly evil though. Still an amazing villain though.

he is described to be a demonic figure even as an infant, and then annihilates billions of people, kills or enslaves anyone he meets including his two different families. How is he not particularly evil? I'd argue along with Sidious, he is the most evil character in the lore.

The scary thing is knowing all that and talk to him in game. Seeing him so calm and planning ahead, as he knows, nothing is gonna stop it.

They've butchered the character though. As much as I hate to admit, Valkorion lost all claims to respect after KOTET ending.

TheBozkurtreis Why??

Not sure how that would work since his story is already told and concluded... well "almost" concluded if you know where im going at with 6.0

@@relaxedclaw I mean in canon, if Disney ever decide to make Old Republic movies

i highlt doubt hey bring back vitiate

Is possibly Vitiate returns in the future?

Thanks for watching man!

This is why Skywalkers kill kids.

^^

What if i told you that there is a similare entity in the real world? Although not immortal, this entity have transfered its beliefes to its successors since Babylone, all so it can own this planet and specie and all it can create.

​@@kagetsuki23terrifying idea

No Vitiate destroyed two and created two galactic empires in his lifetime - not to mention ascending to another plain of existence.

Yeah, but as a ruler, Palpatine didn't last long, even if we count the Legends. Palpatine is more powerful, but with all that power he should of been more effective.

Sidious>Vitiate, but Valkorion>Sidious. Sidious can use a force storm, but he will kill himself if he's too close, even without that, Sidious can defeat Valkorion in a hard match, BUT, Valkorion can return as a ghost, and he will have the same power (or little less) than he was alive, and can kill Sidious and return later lol. So, in the end, is a win-win for Valkorion

We never actually saw the full extent of Valkorian's power, ever. We only saw glimpses. A glimpse being his utter mastery of Tutaminis. If that is a glimpse, Valkorian must have much more to counter Sidious in every way.

Sidious was the senate though