Thanks for watching, I hope you enjoyed this look into the world of Hades! Let me know what other topics you'd like to see videos like this about in the future!
Zagreus being the god of blood also extends to "blood" in a familial sense, bringing his separated family back together and creating a sort of found family with all the other underworld residents
@@baconlovingvampire4523 At this point he's not, Mel seems to have the same condition and it's propable that Persephone has red blood too, being half mortal.
Regarding Melinoe's arm: her place in mythos is pretty often unheard of. Being the child of Zeus and Persephone, Zeus tore her apart limb from limb when he learned of the pregnancy. Her arm might be referring to this, and Hecate may be joking that her right arm might end up similar to her left if she overworks the cauldron, not that her left arm was a result of doing so beforehand.
*Spoilers for the second surface area I guess* One of her conversations with Icarus mentions her arm, about how Melinoë tried "making a shade whole" to try to help Icarus, but she was inexperienced. This caused Icarus to feel guilt, so he disappeared from the crossroads because he "needed time to think", so I think it's more than likely that her arm is indeed thanks to inexperience while using the cauldron
There's actually an entire dialogue tree about Skelly being Schelemeus in Hades 1. After enough prying Zagreus gets him to talk about his life just a little bit, where he explains all the things we know about Schelemeus. Afterwards he plays it off as a joke though, acting like Zag is a complete sidiot for believing it. Later if you meet Asterius, he actually corroborates the story and says he has heard of a Schelemeus of that description. Talking to Skelly again has him say "well I didn't say it *wasn't* true," implying that it is, and he just wanted to play a prank on Zag while he was at it. I assume this is the trigger for Zag calling him Schelemeus sometimes. And that's the end of that plotline, in Hades 1 at least.
In regards to Chaos and the number 3142. It’s a reference to the number pi, 3.14159 or 3.142 shortened. This also references the Golden Ratio, a divine number or pattern seen in all of nature and mathematics. Very fitting for Chaos who is everywhere but unseen at first glance.
Thus was a connection I never made at the time, but it's crazy and very cool how many different aspects this number could be tied to. As you say, it is indeed very fitting for Chaos :)
A devout The Sandman fan here! In the comics, Dream is Orpheus’s father! In the myth Orpheus is the son of the muse Calliope and in the comics these two were married and Orpheus was their son. I won’t say more not to spoil people who are unfamiliar with the story amd want to read it and/or want to watch s2 blind.
20:23 There is a line in game, cannot remember correctly, but Zagreus asks Dusa if she's related to gorgons in Asphodel. She says something about that they all were born of blood drops (it seems of Medusas blood)
Thumbs up for ACTUALLY putting and showing the iceberg and its relative contents/location in the iceberg in an iceberg video. A ton of videos seem to miss the point of the iceberg and treat it like a top 10 list or something.
If I remember right, the difference between Erebus in Hades 1 and 2 is because it was originally the waiting room for shades to be seen and judged, but because Chronos took over, Shades no longer are being judged and basically are left behind, so the entire place has fallen into ruins and overgrowth.
In regards to finding the dialogue about the arm, Hecate mentions Icarus. After you encounter Icarus a few more times during runs, he and mel have a heart to heart about how mel's arm changed and what she did. I'll leave the specifics for you to find.
There are additional triggers for getting "Blessed" by Eris. While I don't know the exact numbers, she shows up *whenever* you reach a region of the underworld the developers don't want you to be in yet, not just Erebus to Oceanus. I've seen a clip of it happening in the Fields of Mourning as well, though I'm unsure if it can happen in Tartarus and I doubt it can happen at all on the Olympus route since, well, she shows up there regardless.
Homer being the Narrator isn't an _entirely_ new twist, even past him clearly being some sort of storyteller. In Hades 1, one of the furniture items you can buy from the house contractor is the Bust, Old Man. General context clues, mostly its name and the dialogue about it, heavily imply that the bust is *of* the Narrator. This bust resembles depictions of the poet Homer, identifying the Narrator as Homer.
The way Melinoë finds out about how the Nocturnal Arms have future aspects was really cool, Moros basically says how he has never used Ygnium before which clues her in. But now it has me wondering because in Hades I always assumed the aspect of Nemesis on Stygius was from the past but now with Hades II and she has it I’m wondering if it was a future aspect all along…🧐
Regarding Erebus: it is considered a sort of space in between Hades and the surface, where souls roam, unable to pass through to the after life if they paid no toll and where the souls of animals reside. However, Erebus also means darkness itself, or the dark of the underworld specifically. Hades 2 specifically seems to be calling to mind the Odyssey’s usage of Erebus, inspired by how it’s connected to Oceanus. I’m not sure if this explains the usage between games, but it makes me think the space itself is probably used for “storage” in the first game, shown primarily by Charon’s massive gold pile. But also the souls- perhaps in Hades the souls down there are those who couldn’t pay coin, and thus are fighting to earn a spot in the underworld?
There's a reference to the changes in Erebus in the codex/book of shadows, basically stating that in the time between games Erebus returned more towards it's natural state given a number of reasons in lore
Still low key hope we get to see Odysseus's dog in the final game, but that's because in the original tale it was beyond sad, that I want a happy ending with his dog more then anything.
Regarding the Golden Apple from Eris. I believe if you've beaten her at least once and get a boon from Aphrodite later on, she'll give you a recipe that turns the Golden Apple into three nectars. Pretty cool since Aphrodite was the one who won the contest in the first place👀
I just realized that Chronos "Crown of light", featured in his dialogue artworks looks very similar to the "stress crown" of Darkest Dungeon games. The stress crown is used as a marker of a otheworldly eldritch presence or a symbol of an unescapable doom. The final boss of Darkest Dungeon 1 also has the power to rewind time after it's defeat, alike Chronos. We still don't know if Chronos will have a 3rd secret phase, like Hades but something tells me that supergiant is cooking something beyond human comprehension. Time devours all ;)
Zagreus doesn't just refer to Skelly as Schelemeus, Skelly spins a tall tale about his mortal life as the captain of the second Cretan fleet (if I'm recalling correctly) where Schelemeus was his name. He doubles back, claiming it made up (I believe) but it's left ambiguous since we're delivered the story from an unreliable narrator. (Also your statement at the beginning about the game making it out of Early Access "later this year" is untrue, as the devs have estimated it will last into the next year)
Asterius has follow-up dialogue where he says he's heard of someone of that description. Zag confronting Skelly about it has him say "well I didn't say I was lying I just implyied it." Overall I think the idea _is_ still to leave it ambiguous though.
You generally call Dusa a "fully romancable character" but I'd say that's not really accurate to how that plot plays out. In the end, Dusa decides that while her feelings towards Zagreus are deep and genuine, it's not romantic in nature. Not often that in a game with romance, one of the characters you _can_ romance, has their plotline definitively end in you being good friends instead. Evem more important that we do recognize and champion Dusa's story, then. Though it's also not often that in a game with romance you can start a polyamorous relationship so Hades really is at the cutting edge of videogame romance systems I guess
You called for someone who is a fan of Dream of the Endless, so here I am! In the Sandman series, the connection between Orpheus and Morpheus is direct: Orpheus is the son of Morpheus, and is "blessed" with the same immortality that the Endless enjoy. Except... immortality is not the same thing as invincibility. On his return from the Underworld, Orpheus encounters the Maenads who demand that he... *cough* party with them to which in his melancholy he refuses. The Maenads take that personally, and tear his body apart. For many centuries Dream refuses to meet with his son again, but finally in the modern era agrees to meet with him and end his millennia long torment by granting him death. In so doing, Dream has committed the cardinal sin: the killing of one's own blood, and so Hecate (aka The Fates, the Furies, and many other names) are allowed to hunt him down. A lot happens in the spaces that I'm not covering there, because everyone should read The Sandman, it's a really great story in it's own right.
Now for reasons that I just covered the Orpheus in Hades probably can't be the same as the one in the Sandman, in that he is dead in the Greek era and doesn't escape that until much, much later in Sandman - also that he isn't a disembodied head like Dusa, but I still agree that the homage is entirely intended, the artstyles are just too similar to have not at least drawn inspiration from the story. Also Death isn't a punk rocker style 90s girl and Desire, Despair, Delirium and Destiny are nowhere to be found, but that's a whole other set of issues.
I love the idea of Zagreus being the God of Blood because that refers to blood as a source of life and what flows through mortals, connecting him to his god of death father and mortal heritage from his mother with his red blood, and the connections formed between family aka blood
Regarding Mel's missing arm - you missed an interaction where Icarus asks about it, and in the esuing conversation you learn she lost it trying to concont an incantation to revive shades, implying she attempted to revive him, as its implied theyre interested in one another
In regards to the blessing of strife, this is also an interaction you can get at the beginning of the fields of mourning if you get there on your following run
@@everberon she can also appear at the start of tart if you get there quick enough, I think. She did for me at least. You can run into her quite a few times if you were going fast
I ran into her in every area when I first made it there, but I did start playing the game right after it went to early access. I think they patched it now so that the experience does more resemble what you mentioned? because I sure as hell did not make it through every area in one or two attempts 😂
55:00 Dream is called by most mortals and Gods Morpheus, after the Greek God of sleep. He is also the father of Orpheus in the Sandman canon and the interactions between them leads to the series finale and epilogue.
I love your videos, they're quite entertaining to watch or listen, although I have a request for future icebergs, can you actually name the elements in the iceberg whenever you move to each of them? just so I can know firsthand what topic you're talking about whenever I'm listening while doing other stuff, it's silly but helps a lot, this makes for really good content man. Also, about the Hermes' dialogue from the Pact of Punishment, I can confirm I got the dialogue when I was completing the fated list with Tight Deadline not so long ago, I don't remember what he said, but it was a quite simple joke about "running out of time", or something.
Soo, I'm not sure if that's exactly what you're talking about, but I did get a line from Hermes about the timer recently! No footage, sadly, but basically he tells Zagreus not to worry about the time because it stops during their conversations, and that he was the one to ask for that to happen (not to be confused with the line where he just calls out that the timer is on, that's a different interaction)! It wasn't tied to the pact though, just regular gameplay with the timer on, as i haven't beaten in Hades in this save file yet. Either way, great video! I wasn't aware of a lot of these details.
@@everberon cheers, the number triggered something in my brain, either way it's crazy, so I don't believe it's a coincidence (with the total number of Gods) since the Greeks were big on numerology.
40:32 it's probably been said already but I'm 98% certain that Melinoe losing her left arm trying to heal Icarus is a reference to full metal alchemist. In which the titular character loses his arm trying to resurrect his dead mother.
Not a correction, unlike all my other comments, just lighthearted speculation. Assuming the Nocturnal Arms get secret aspects the same way the Infernal Arms did, I posit that the Argent Skull's is likely to be the Aspect of Hamlet. On an aesthetic level, the reference writes itself. And while not mythology in the traditional sense, Hamlet _is_ a pretty old fictional story that's greatly influenced influenced modern culture. Besides, Guan Yu is as much a historical figure as a mythological one. If he could skirt by I don't see why Hamlet couldn't.
@@everberon I'm glad my corrections are taken in good spirit, I was afraid that bombarding the video with multiple comments pointing out flaws in it would come off as pompous.
if you talk to icarus enough times in the rift, he and melinoe do mention the arm thing, seeming to imply it was the result of her trying to give him some of her life essence or trying to make him more tangible than a shade, resulting in him getting a more solid form (unlike dora) and her having a 'shade-like' arm.
With the competition type of Nemesis encounter, it's not gaining Obol you're competing in. Not least of all because that's not actually the currency in Hades 2, in that game you're instead collecting gold coins minted by Chronos to hand them in to be destroyed, but that's just me being a pedant. Mechanically, you're not racing to get money, you're racing to kill more things total, with the prize (or punishment) being a flat 100 gold. You might be conflating this with the Heracles encounters where you *are* racing to get as much gold as possible (though with no defined prize that *I've* noticed), with some enemies giving more than others. So in a Nemesis encounter a heavier enemy is the same as a lighter one, but in a Heracles encounter a heavier enemy is technically more valuable (though there's cost/benefit analysis to be had about of slaying multiple easier targets instead of one hard target). Additionally, you didn't mention two (arguably three) types of Nemesis encounter. SOmetimes she wants you to hit her rather than the other way around, with you having to deal at least 1000 damage to her before 5 seconds passes. I _think_ you get better rewards if you damage her more but that might be wrong. Additionally, she sometimes offers something for straight gold instead of taking a hit. This one does seem to be rarer than the others, I've personally barely encountered it. Maybe I'm just unlucky. Every now and then she also appears in shops and if you take too much time she annoyingly buys one of the wares on sale before you're able to. Heracles does this too.
the aspect of lucifer is actually a story that already happened, not a future occurance. if you hold the aspect of lucifer and talk to zeus, he mentions it and says that lucifer struck at his own lord father, meaning not only is this real in canon history, but that it already happened.
Some people were questioning the triggers for Eris. While I don't have specifics on the triggers, she absolutely can appear in every region post-Erebus and Hecate fight. How do I know? I recently restarted Hades II, and while I didn't get the Oceanus trigger (as stated to be in the first two nights), I did get the Fields of Mourning trigger. I actually was semi-pissed because I had a surprisingly good build that carried me through night/run 3, which was allowing me to heal myself. My damage wasn't great enough to surpass this though. On night 4, I managed to pass Cerberus in the Fields of Mourning and moved on to Tartarus, where Eris once again gave me her "blessing". I can confirm she appears in all regions, though only given unidentified triggers outside of "I'm here too early". Not sure what "too early" means in this context, but screw Eris, I was having such a good time until she blessed me lmao.
Ran into it just recently in one of my runs, but Icarus also has some dialog about the arm incident when you speak with him. He leaves the crossroads because of it, and fashions his own wings, and isn't using his father's.
So regarding Hermes' knowledge about Pact of Punishment. I actually discover his dialogue but it wasn't from Tight deadline, but rather from Forced overtime. This is what he said "Got all your father's lifeless wretched hot and bothered, going all out all because of that Forced Overtome condition of his, isn't that righr? Coz? Well, if they're interested in getting things done quickly, I am sire you can oblige them in a bit!"
Hey actually regarding Melinoe's arm its been mentioned by Icarus that she did something to help him (probably to turn him into human/ not full shade) and lost her arm doing that.
for some reason i didn't expect scylla and charybdis to be so... different in my mind they're almost the same entity, i've always seen them mentioned together
perhaps erebus has some building such as charons docks(for the mass's of treasure you give him) and a punishment facility/baraks(where you fight the waves of enemys in infernal gates)
Great vid!!! I adore Hades so this was a fun watch. As for Dusa's "romance", a lot of folks in the queer community view her relationship with Zag as "queerplatonic" meaning that although they are incredibly close and value each other greatly, their connection is strictly platonic. It's used most often for people who are some form of aromantic
For the last tip discussion bout the fates. Someone could go mad trying to ponder the role of the fates. Some say they write the history and the future of everything. Some say, they have no control at all, and simply transcribe what they see. Some others imply that they see possibilities, and set things in motion for them to happen. and of course, what is the fate of the Fates? I recall one person theorizing that being a Fate is one of the most powerful abilities, and the greatest curse, and they already know how they will end up.
Do we have any indication that Hades 2 is missing *any* tools? Other than the general symmetry of six tools and six weapons, I don't see a reason to believe any are missing. The spots on the other side of the toool circle don't look like the ones the tools are in, for one. They look like the ones Frinos and Toula sit in. In fact, in the footage provided, *Toula is sitting in one of them.* The game definitely doesn't feel like it's missing any tools to me, and I'd argue it would be *too* cluttered if there were any more resource deposits to chase down. Unless Supergiant has stated that we're getting new tools eventually (which I don't know of ever being discussed), I think the fairer assumption is that these are the tools we have and will ever have. It seems rather more likely to me that we'll get more Familiars, really.
@@everberon I'd say they'd sit on the other tiny circles. Those currently don't have any usage, or at least I haven't found one if there is. Those are what Frinos and Toula sit on, after all. I'd think it's more unlikely that we _won't_ be getting at least one new familiar if Supergiant seemingly specifically made space for them.
I may be insane but I think theres a line of dialogue with icarus that suggests the "draining" by the cauldron was caused by melinoe trying to help icarus? To be honest I cant remember its been a few weeks since I last played hades 2.
41:32 Zagreus if the god of rebirth. He was captured and torn apart by titans, then a goddess (i don't remeber who that was, I think it was Nyx, but again - not sure) mamnaged to pick his heart and place it in a little statue made of clay or mud (or in different versions of the story something similar to that) and then gave him a new life and so Zagreous was reborn as dionysus. There is even a conversation between those two in which Dionysus tells Zagreous to tell someone (i dont remeber who) that they are the same person/god. ( Also now I remembered - zeus found out about the titans and struck them all dow and that's how he manged to save at least a little of what was left of Zagreous) The game isn't 1:1 wwith the actual mythology and where it isn't the gods say that it is due to humans missunderstanding some things. Witty
It’s not hard to say whether or not Dusa is Medusa because she openly admits to being one of the gorgon sisters in her dialogue. This was never even supposed to be remotely ambiguous, you just turned a fact in to a mystery.
Another reference for Mel's appearance could be in a story that related to having one arm and leg being white and the other being black. It was a video relating to the Lore on Melienoë (I can't spell her name, sorry ^^)
i like your theory about the fates but to me is more about chaos, multiple times it's said that the fates are his creations too, and she/he's experimenting a lot and even his change of appareance for me it hints that she/he is going to have a role in the oncoming religions, her newer attired and wing like abominations signifies change for me.for that thing almost everything is an experiment and you'll never know when it will get bore of the greek gods. and don't forget what eris says that the world was staggered the way it was before chronos appereade again.
Extremely minor correction to a mostly throaway line less than 2 minutes in but as far as I know Supergiant doesn't intend to get Hades 2 out of Early Access *this* year. The opposite, in fact. At least on the roadmap in the game itself, it's stated that they think early access will last "at least through the end of 2024" implying that as of right now they consider early next year to be the earliest point at which Hades 2 _might_ fully release. The statement then goes on to clarify that it's too early in the development cycle to say for sure when exactly it will happen. Still, the text is clear on the fact that you _shouldn't_ expect the game to come out this year. If they've made any statement to the contrary that I'm unaware of then it's great to hear that development is going so well, someone please tell them to update the roadmap.
Where do you get Game Chronos being father to Nyx from??? Both Hades 1 and Hades 2 are VERY explicit about Nyx’ one and only parent being Chaos, it’s brought up in dialogue on a handful of occasions iirc
yup, was trying to find a comment saying this dude missed some stuff, not to discredit the effort put into the video, but yeah he mustve forgotten or misremembered
I feel like Artemis did/does have a crush on Zagreus and took a liking to him because he couldn’t necessarily talk back to her since he was in the underworld and she was in the surface or in Olympus.
chronus is not nyx' father! not in the game nor in myth. he is only the father of the olympians, nyx is explicitly stated in the game to be chaos' daughter, spawned from them alone. chaos is refered to as nyxs "mother and father".
On Extreme Measures, not _necessarily_ all three of the furies will fight you. At least I'm pretty sure sometimes only two of them show up. Otherwise accurate.
I think I disagree with that last bit of information. Chronos was capable of capturing The Fates and Chaos themselves says they have the ability to tamper with the Fate's designs in the first game I think whenever the Greek world comes to an end the other pantheons of gods referenced by the various weapons will come to be or some may have already happened and the Fates While being some of the most powerful beings during this incarnation of the universe are not all-powerful and their weaving can be disrupted.
