@@Number27 well to be honest that muatard yellow tinge is so sexy... Be interesting if someone volunteers a definite and backed-up explanation for the weird VIN stamp.
I believe we can confidently say that “the Corona virus” has not had ANY effect on anything, especially car prices. The alleged new novel coronavirus identified as SARS-CoV-2 that is being blamed for causing the respiratory disease known as Covid 19 is in fact not new or novel. However, the measures put in place by governments around the world to allegedly deal with the alleged effects of the alleged new novel coronavirus identified as SARS-CoV-2 that is being blamed for causing the respiratory disease known as Covid 19 HAS caused widespread financial problems in most sectors - except those chosen to profit from this situation.
It has a large plaque on the dash indicating it was a custom constructed car by Kremer and therefore would not have a standard VIN as it was sold as new by Kremer not Porsche. Kremer Racing is a motorsports team based in Cologne, Germany, founded by racing driver Erwin Kremer and his brother Manfred. ... Besides running Porsches, the team was also known for their tuned Porsche race cars that they both raced and sold to other teams who could not gain the best equipment from the factory.
There is a Kremer Logo in the Dashboard. The build racecars in Germany. And since the hat also has Ruf wheels, there is a pretty good Chance its one of kremers old racecars Converted to road use. Here in Germany These cars are quite desireble since they've been "battle tested" and usually rebuild by specialists. Just red to give the a Call...
I know this car, several friends were previous owners and I had the car in my barn for a year or so looking after it. I can attest that this 930 drives really well, had it in the air on a ramp for MOT and it is indeed in great condition. I have also thought about buying it when I saw it up for sale. Buy it Jack! Then sell it to me in a year or so.
If i was in the market for one of those, Id have had it in a heartbeat, especially with the saving just on the basis the VIN number is not standard. What 33 Year old car wouldn't have some sort of history?!
Yes I would buy this car for 8k. Usually racing Porsches are destroyed so no one uses the shell to rebuild another car. This yellow bird looks very well constructed and has a good vibe...
When You first mentioned that there was ‘something up’ with this car, it jogged a memory of mine from around 20 years ago, and my immediate reaction was that it was something to do with the VIN number. Back in the day I was selling cars for a living for a German prestige/sports specialist in East Horsley, Surrey. One day we were offered in PX a 930 Turbo with a 5 Speed gearbox, but I’m pretty certain that the car was in white. If I remember correctly, we decided to bring in a Porsche expert known to the owners, to get the car underwritten, as it potentially worth a lot of money even then, and it wasn’t something we wanted to go again it’s on a retail basis for all sorts of reasons. Needless to say that when our man looked over the car, there was a concerning anomaly with the chassis number, exactly as you have described...it didn’t follow the factory format, and so the car was deemed at the time to be of dubious provenance and of little value. I’d be really interested to know if this yellow car was once painted white, and is the same car we were offered all those years ago.
Looks like a very tasty car. I also wouldn't be concerned about strange VIN, as long as it is a legit car that is not going to get repossessed or something. You will get the same ownership experience while you have it and just accept that it will have a similar discount when you sell.
1. obvious clue to me and you did not comment (?) was the Racing badge on the glove box interior. 2. the condition is TOO good and mileage TOO low. What do the MOTs say and the history ? surely they’re are gaps. You do. to lay out the MOT or service history or indeed what the current owner says re this aspect. Conclusion. Car was raced and written off racing but not on public road. Rebuilt in the 000s using original parts but the rebuild used later model variants eg G50 box and vents. New VIN number is evidence of this. I would buy the car but recognise the rationale for the discount. I had 1986 911 3.2 Carrera 5speed box. was fab car to drive although the clutch too heavy. a needed servo assist for everyday use.
I noticed from the very beginning it started to add up after given the information of price and mileage...Firstly the color, then the interior material hood liner, The seats and steering wheel... The Ruf wheels without any Ruf upgrades I assume... Nevertheless very much worth for the price as you say being it was built from the ground up
I would buy it, the VIN doesn't bother me at all. And at least you won't be too scared to use it everyday, unlike if you have bought a "proper" 930 turbo. I think you should get it.
My friend , i'm 52 and on a budget. The 930 is my favorite Porsche of all tme and chances to ever drive one , let alone own one , are close to zero. But if i had that kind of money now and that car was a left hand drive ,i'd get it in a flash!!! Looks stunning , is relatively cheap ,is a 5speed and drives properly , what else would anyone ask for?
The Vin number on the car is of the type issued by the DVLA back in the 80s for Kit cars and Reshells. Some jiggery pokery must have been involved to get it registered originally as Q plates became mandatory in 1983 for cars built from different parts sources - seeing that the registration date is Dec 1986. New shells from Porsche didn't come stamped with Vins but I would hazard a guess that this car was built up from an unregistered car that had been damaged in transit - and had its original vin and reg quashed by the DVLA as it was unjustified for a dealer to register a repaired damaged car new. The original customer got a replacement fresh order from the factory - and the original damaged remains of the new car got built in to a new fresh factory 1987 shell in the autumn of 1986 - which would explain why the interior features details of earlier spec cars as I suspect there must have been a delay in sorting what to do with the remains of the original car insurance and salvage wise. I'd have had no quarms at all in purchasing this car - knowing what work that's normally needed on 930 turbos especially those that see little use - as a car to use cherish and enjoy this looked a peach.
I was contemplating trading my 997.2 turbo in for this car too. it seems like it’s been reshelled. My only worry is that, it could potentially be a ringer from back in the day? I have stumbled upon a few “converted” cars previously up for sale with similar sort of history. At the money i still do think it’s worth it, but just due this pandemic, i reckon a normal clean 930 turbo will soon pop up for similar money, which will obviously retain a better value.
I think the answer for the mystery vin number on the 930 is that Porsche allows other legal small car manufactures, like the german RUF to produce 911 with their own serial numbers. Correct me if l’m wrong.?!
Rick Hunter I’m with you Rick. I think it’s a really lovely example of a 930 and your always going to get your money back if you bought it. Its value just won’t appreciate in the same way, which wouldn’t be bothered about, because it’s a fantastic drivers car. I love it.
Great video. I'm so over people buying cars as investment assets. This car has a unique history, is beautifully presented and drives well. I say take advantage of the current market conditions, buy it and drive it like you stole it!!!
It's a gorgeous car. The fact that it has a mysterious vin number seems to make this one less desirable for the hardcore Porsche fan. The Ruf wheels are added later as well as the Kremer badge AND it's yellow AND it already has the 5 speed gearbox... These things are signs that this want to be a project car! ;-) Maybe Alois want's to add some extra pressure along with some nice upgrades and some badges with his surname for the money you saved on the purchase price of this hidden gem ;-) Cheers. NV.
It's very beautiful. Rather similar to an old 911s ex racer I rebuilt to road use, in the 70s. Sahara Beige with satin black everywhere.....twas so lovely.👍🏽🇬🇧
Very interesting car and an intriguing dilemma. As your friend had previously owned the car it would be interesting to know his story and how much he paid and sold it for in the past. Looking forward to the next episode.
Hello Sir. Hope you're well👍🏻 not seen much of your fine work here for ages. I would have been very suspicious until investigating. Phil Rabey is one of the top dealers and been around for years so I'd expect he would have theory of it's originality. What you're saying makes 100% sense. I'm sure with enough personal investigation one would feel confident in making the purchase. In short, I would most def buy this beauty. Lucky for me I already have a 1986 3.2 sitting on my drive. Thumbs up for a great video👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Cool. Thanks for the VIN explanation, that was nice to know. As for the car, if it looks and feels like a Porsche turbo and cheap, i would buy it. Just because it doesn’t bear the right VIN number doesn’t mean it wont drive like a Porsche!
I’d buy it without worry. You are getting exactly what you are after. A car that was built to be driven and you can do just that. Drive the wheels off of it.
The car looks lovely Jack. It's perfect from every angle and you wouldn't need to change a thing. As for the 'history', or lack of it..........It's a heart over head decision. If it were me I would just make sure that it's mechanically sound and hasn't been in any 'incidents' over the years......then drive the balls off it! :-))
I would buy this 930 in a heart beat. It reminds me of the Yellowbird from Ruf. Doesn't Ruf apply their own VIN Number to their cars? Who really cares if you got a racecar which was in some point in time converted to a streetcar? If the Chassis, Gearbox, Brakes and the Engine are still in good nick, go get it and enjoy it. Would love to own one of these once in the near feature!
These VINs are an earlier format of identity numbers that were allocated by what used to be the local vehicle licensing offices (the LVLO part), or DVLA Local Offices. This particular VIN was issued by the Luton local vehicle licensing office (LVLO362), on 22nd December 1986 (6356 = yDDD based on Julian calendar), which was when (or shortly before) the car was registered. 093 is a sequential number to avoid duplication, so in this case its the 93rd VIN of this format issued by Luton office. The format of these VINs changed slightly in the early/mid 90's when the offices became known as VRO's (Vehicle Registration Offices) instead. They were normally issued in order to register vehicles that were found (following inspection) to have no official/manufacturer-issued identity e.g. like you say low-volume kit cars, radically altered or rebuilt vehicles. /anorak mode off
@@Number27 No worries dude :) It's a while ago now, but I spent 12 years of my (pitiful) life as a vehicle examiner for the Department of Transport, so I remember all of this BS lol I'm presuming its registered on a UK plate? Establishing provenance can be a tricky affair in these situations, but going from some of the other comments on this video, it appears to be straight up. Would be interesting to look through any documentation/history it has to see if it all matches up.
I’m an ex -Porsche technician, I wouldn’t touch this with a barge pole, it’s a “bitsa” car. What ever it is, how come Philip Raby doesn’t know it’s past history??? He obviously bought it from someone, why doesn’t this someone know it’s history? Take the car to a Porsche centre and let them ell you “what it is”…. I’ve seen so many ringers and supposedly good cars being two different cars joined together… The anomalies in the interior are also very curious… It’s obvious you want to buy it, then just buy it. Sorry for my negative comments but a Porsche, or any car for that matter, without its genuine VIN should set huge bell towers ringing.
Yes I would buy it IF I had $80k to spare. It’s a good car to drive the hell out of. As an investment it would always be dogged by this mystery to the broad consumer market. Bonus being switching or replacing components is no concern for matching numbers. Free to do whatever you please!
I think with a title search and a call to Kremer Racing you should be able to piece together a lot more of its history. Personally, I would buy it and drive it and enjoy it.
Any old 911 with the boot and bonnet staying open is a miracle already. My Targa came with a plank to prop the bonnet open until you change the struts. Only for them to collapse again six months later. Slow, crap to drive and not a lot of fun. Looks good though. Wouldn’t buy one again however.
The 930 did not produce 330bhp - it took until the 964 Turbo in 1991 until it made 320bhp in 3.3 guise (same engine as the 930, with enhanced electronics, bigger intercooler, higher boost) and 360bhp in 3.6 guise. There may well have been special wishes versions and one-off uprated models by dealers, but the 930 definitely did not make 330bhp as stock.
Check your Porsche history again....from 1983 to 1989 porsche made the 930 WLS with 330 HP (engine nr. 930-66-S)....had a special front spoiler with a larger oil cooler and double exhaust tail pipes in both sides. I own a 930 WLS from 04/1987......with Porsches you can always learn new stuff .... have a nice day .. :-)
@@TheStigc123 yes, that corresponds with what I said re: "special wishes", but in relation to standard production models, the 930 definitely was not 330hp. It's like claiming the standard 964 3.3 made 360hp, when in fact only the Turbo S with the M30/69S engine variant did anything like that.
I would - anything to acquire a 930. Uncle had I believe a 1978 930 - Brown metallic exterior with the tan interior with the plaid pattern. I know I’m not using the right terminology on these items - just leaving a quick comment. There is a global 930 registry - maybe the original car VIN is on the motor so you can trace those origins
having built and registered a couple of kit cars, it is a DVLA issued VIN number, if the car was a reshell of a writeoff / rust bucket , then the original VIN would have been used, the ** indicate it was done profesionally....prefer the red turbo tho :-)
I’ve been eyeing that car up too. It’s so good looking. But the 964 and 944 would have to go to fund it, with no guarantee of future value - a hard one. If I had the money spare not doing anything? Like a shot!
Have you looked at the engine number to see what car it came from? Maybe that will give you a clue to what happened! Great car non the less. The VIN discrepancy wont lessen the feeling.
Buy it! Why not? You're getting a good classic car, with all the right bits. And at a massive saving too! And when it comes to resell I'm sure you'll find plenty of people who will feel the same way about it. So what do you have to loose? Carpe Diem
It sounds very quiet. I hear air noise over the body structure, but not from that engine. Why?? It's a very interesting story I must say. It had me glued. Provenance is very important to me. If one is prepared to overlook that and the price is right; it could be a winner. 🏆
My late father bought one in 1982.It was Casablanca Beige,which actually looked gold.The only way to drive it at high speed,was to put two bags of cement in the front,to stop it "taking off". 😂😂😂
Buy it! I have two Porsches with typos in the paperwork of the cars. Like WP0777... Completely crazy stuff and I can't get the error fixed (I live in Taiwan). I think my cases are worse. As long the documents fit and you can register it with that VIN, I would buy it. Great car... Best wishes
palatina works bought our car and never gave the VIN. a thought !!! How do you think we did ??? 😎 ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Q7H6T2FWPZA.html
3.56. There's a big clue right there on the glovebox. A KREMER car perhaps? What was the history of the engine, where did it originate, what car was it in from new? Very pretty car.
I bought a 911 4GTS that came with a Macan revision booklet. Even Porsche makes mistakes and could with the VIN. If the yellow car looks like a 930, runs like a 930, it's likely to be a real 930.
Randomly watching this video something has dawned on me, looking at the side profile of that car it looks super low and like a no compromise performance car, seems to me that the as the buyers of 911's have aged (started off with yuppies in their late 20's and 30's in the 1980's) the cars have got softer and higher off the ground to cater for them!
You say 3.3 Turbo started in 1978, but I had a 1977 3.3 Turbo I did notice a Kremer sticker on the glove box. I used to go to Le Mans. Kremer brothers are a famous Porsche racing team. Could the car have come from there in the past. ?
This was a RU-vid queue suggestion. We should all go out and make a video every time we test drive a car! Dude did ALL this research on the car and didn't mention Kremer! Obviously didn't want to give up the game. We caught it and I hope one of the viewers snatched it up! Number 27 can make his money off the ads. ; )
@@Number27 I literally know nothing, sitting here at my computer! Ya gotta admit that you left out a key point without mention. But look into it and let us know how it turns out. Best wishes.
@@Number27 I'll not take offence 😂 but you and I have had this convo before ☺ ☺ ☺ I know it must be hard being so famous 🤜 🤜 Keep up the great vids boss! 🇬🇧 🇩🇪
