Many years ago, I saw a documentary on the making of T2. James Cameron said Robert Patrick reminded him of a cat. Very alert. Analyzing his surroundings. He said the way Robert Patrick moves is very smooth and fluid. He also compared the Arnold model to a tank while the T-1000 is like a Porsche.
Patrick is awesome, no other actor could have given such a breathtaking performance ! Pun intended, since he managed to run after Connor's Honda XR and not only keep pace with it as intended, but at first even catching up to it easily (that would've made for an awful short flick) and forcing himself to slow down in later takes, all while restraining his breathing through his nostrils alone, keeping a straight and emotion-free face from start to end !! This never ceazes to blow my mind each time I rewatch this sequence...
I’ve read the script (you can find it online) and it’s REALLY bad. There’s a few interesting ideas, but the execution and dialogue is utterly atrocious for the most part. Anyone who says it’s better either hasn’t read it or has brain damage.
It does, but what happens? They save the world again and there’s no arc for the characters other than maybe John. What we got was infinitely worse: “talk to the hand”
The opening scene of T2 is one of the best of all time. Killer future war stuff, awesome voiceover by Linda Hamilton, Future John Connor looking totally bad-ass, and then cue up brilliant score by Brad Fidel as the endo-skull appears through flames. Unabashed genius.
@@albundy7794 Its a good thing to start a scifi film with action to engage the audience right from start like George Lucas did in Star Wars. It worked didn't it?
Eh. I kinda like the concept that Skynet was a virus that became self aware after it infected, well, Skynet. It kinda makes the whole 'humans are my enemy' thing more believable, since human would have been trying to 'kill' it while it was in virus form.
I think they should have just rebooted the movie essentially for T3. They prevented Skynet from winning, but it only pushed back AI going bad. John Connor isn't essential as the future had been changed. They'd need to make big changes so it's not a copy of T1 or T2, no easy task. The Terminator/Terminators should feel similar but different as they weren't created by skynet. John and Sarah Connor aren't important. Because the time line has been changed the Terminator doesn't even know who they are.
Simpson was cast as The Terminator before we cast him. That is 100% NOT TRUE. And I should know," Hurd tweeted Thursday, before confirming that Lance Henriksen was formally considered for the part. "Jim and I never ever considered O.J. Not even for a nanosecond."
The third movie should’ve just had John becoming the leader and the machine war happening and it looping by sending Kyle back. Paradox trilogy. T1, T2 and a variation of Salvation. Great video. I hope the franchise can come up with a hit in the future.
I never got why people want these films to end with sending Kyle back. We know exactly what happens. Why have the franchise build up to that point. It's a anti climatic. I think the franchise had the perfect ending with T2.
@@user-hz5lt7ki2o because what I described is a complete trilogy with a full arc beginning, middle, end. Anything else beyond that is welcomed for sure just like any other franchise.
@@yourlocalnemesisllcbut why do we need a trilogy? For the sake of having a trilogy? We haven’t had a good T movie since 1991 and everyone thinks it’s easy to make 3. I bet the makers of T3 - Dark Fate would tell you they had full arcs set up for trilogies, doesn’t mean it’s quality. It’s so hard to execute. All those films are full of filler trying to set up future films rather than simply make a great film. Look at the failed attempts at trilogies over passed decade. I mean Terminator has 4! Why not just make a stand alone great movie. Why can’t we do Terminator without forcing a trilogy…
@@user-hz5lt7ki2o you’re saying what I’m saying like I’m speaking against you lol. The franchise peaked at T2 yes. I’m satisfied with 1 & 2. What I’m saying is if there was a 3rd good movie that was MY take on what could have been not what should be. Turn off the friendly fire I’m a human not a machine lol
@unclebobconner1417 I was referring to Arnold as the main character in the Terminator movie series, not referring to his Terminator model number. I always wonder was Arnold's Terminator character based on a human, or did Skynet just randomly select his Terminator model to send back in time?
@@Slim1423 well as far as I know the endos were all the same but when they were disguised as humans they looked different so I'm guessing it was just a random selection that it was armies model they chose to do the job maybe because he looked the most real human you know most convincing or they thought he looked the strongest model they had but this is just me guessing but it was the same model in the terminator & T3 so if the models were different why did they choose the same model 3 times in a row doesn't make sense unless he just looked the best or they actually are all supposed to look the same it's a bit confusing however John Connor did say in T3 did they all come of an assembly line because he looked the same as in T2 he thought it actually was the same terminator as T2 but was a different model just same design
I saw an interview with the director of T3, where he said he added the slapstick comedy stuff because he was afraid of having people say he was just copying James Cameron, so he wanted to put his own little spin on it. He said that looking back, he can see why people didn’t like it, and he wished he hadn’t done it.
Took him long enough. On the DVD commentary he was laughing about it all specially how he treated the T-X which was honestly one of the more interesting terminators since it was built to have emotions (it was specifically designed for long term infiltration missions). And that's not counting the interviews which he called the Terminator movies "silly kids movies".,.
Yeah, T3 is an entertaining movie by itself, but tonally off compared to the first 2. For me, the Terminator story is 1-Salvation and I feel that Salvation got the correct tone back.
@@LordofMovies91 not completely. Compare the future scenes in 1 and 2. With the future in salvation. The resistance is too well equipped and supplied in salvation. 1 and 2, showed people desperately struggling to survive, eating rats and using salvaged vehicles and makeshift equipment. In salvation they somehow have an air force and working submarine. The resistance wouldn't have had any of that. Subs require regular intensive maintenance to maintain their stealth capabilities(as in spending time in drydock maintenance) and also need to be resupplied with food and water every 6 months. And air force is silly. Helicopters I can see but every satellite that's left would be owned by skynet the minute it saw anything resembling an airstrip it would hit it with an (possibly nuclear) airstrike. And that doesn't count the fuel and maintenance needed to keep planes in the air. They might be able to steal fuel but the factories making parts for those A-10s would be long gone. Any air power they had would be a dwindling and ungodly precious resource. Honestly the Terminator video game. (I think it's called resistance) Got things better than salvation did.
Plot twist: Cameron wasn’t working on Avatar sequels over the last 12 years. He was building a time machine to send a terminator back and take out Gale Anne Heard.
In my humble opinion, the best Terminator 3 we ever got was the game Terminator: Resistance. No spoilers, but the way the game ends perfectly wraps up the series and ties T1 and 2 in a perfect knot.
In the original script of the first Terminator, another Soldier was supposed to help Reese protect Sarah Connor from the Terminator but was killed upon arriving.
4:28 If you think that's crazy, Cameron also completed the script for Terminator 2 and Point Break at the same time within a few days of each other. At least thats how the story goes.
These videos are beyond fascinating in terms of how the process of filmmaking can change and rearrange day by day. Not to mention what became, rather than what could have been for better or worse, it really makes you think and appreciate what these people go through for our entertainment!
20th Century Fox should have bought Carloco's Assets when they had the chance. Because not only would they have produced the 3rd Terminator Film, they would have also likely produced a Total Recall Sequel (based on Minority Report) as well.
Edward Furlong was cast as John Conner for part 3 but his drug addiction got in the way of him Starring in the film. Personally, I think they should of stuck with Edward and got him in Rehab. Edward Furlong would of made Terminator 3 so much better.
@@johnpinneriv9958 I'm pretty sure this must've been after he'd killed two people and he was referencing the killings. Due to double jeopardy laws in the US, once he was found guilty he knew he'd gotten away with murder and could do things like this. O.J. even wrote a book called "I didn't do it, but if I did, here's how I would've done it" or something like that. Chris Rock had previously done a skit where OJ wrote such a book before OJ actually wrote that book, so I get the titles mixed up between the parody and the real one.
I will, more than likely, never meet James Cameron. So here... I will say Mister James C. thank you so very much for making The Terminator. It has and always will be my most favorite movie. Thank you. Terminator 1 is a masterpiece. Only wish some of the cgi could be remastered.
@PumpkinJack88 ... you say "cgi"... did you really mean the special effects? Most of the effects were what are now called "practical effects" - that is actual models, and so on. I think the only computer effects were the screens we see, where the robot picks possible responses from a list of choices. If you want to replace the practical effects with CGI effects, I couldn't disagree more. Those practical effects were done extremely well. There are other films, that had practical effects re-done to use CGI, decades ago, and the CGI has aged badly. Leave it as it is, please
Love your use/editing of movie clips to compliment the play by play of the alternative film treatments. Cool stories and great work compiling/celebrating them!
That was one of the biggest backstabs of all time, screwing Cameron out of ownership and millions of dollars. Terminator was Cameron's baby. He pored his heart and soul into that franchise and wanted to be an owner and writer for it more than anything. You don't just "let go of your ego" for this one. Just try to put yourself in Cameron's shoes.
I'm glad Cameron didn't go through with it bc of the fact he didn't want to go through with someone else's script which I agree. It wouldn't have been good imo.
Didn't Cameron postpone making T3 in favour of directing Titantic? Kinda has himself to blame. If he cared so much about the franchise, he should have stuck to his original plan of making T3 with his script before moving on
I confess I’ve only watched the first three movies for the first time last week. It’s a mind-bending series, and I feel like it all made sense by the end of T2. The third one just muddled it for me, and I’ve yet to even try the fourth or fifth ones.
There would be so much testosterone in a Terminator movie starring both Arnold Schwarzenegger and Vin Diesel every man would leave the theater with a fully grown mustache and a Busch Light can in hand.
@@tyrannozilla not to be 'that guy' and start plugging stuff, but I have the first one as an audio book on my channel. 'Rising Storm' and 'Future War' will follow.
@@RisingUnderdog S.M. Stirling is the author of all three. There is some retconning (but that’s what you get with multiple timelines!) but the plot is sound. It picks up just after the events of T2 and then skips forward, mostly following Sarah and John (who is now 18). Skynet still somehow exists in the future, and has once again sent something back to change the past… The first book is good, but pretty long. The audio book version comes in at about 21 hours.
Actually 4's ending was supposed to be They'd put John's face on Marcus... Who'd then have his eyes go red and kill everyone in the room. Director even said as much. People reacted badly as they should have.
Not just a fantastic recap but the editing of this video was absolutely spot on - every time uou made a new point about the intended script youd have rhe perfect b-roll to overlay
@@lazerfrogstudios I don't want to bust in your bubble. Although Terminator 1 & 2 are the best, the third one is alright, fourth is ok, and the rest such as Genisys and Dark Fate aren't that good. Although the second Terminator is way better than the first one. Just saying.
@@meathead6155 imo the characters are worse, the plot is contrived, basically the same genreal plot other than like character changes, the child acting is really not that good (no offence to the kid actor, child actors are never THAT good) ultimately is just a rehash of the first one instead of focusing on the obvious sequel that would be what salivation turned out to be.
To me, the best Terminator 3 is Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles… such an underrated show, great cast, and really interesting exploration of the different factions and the world of terminator
badass? They watered down Terminator for Teens. They don't even play the Terminator theme lol. It's trying so hard not to be a Terminator film. It's just a cash grab set up film for a trilogy that never happened.
This is just my opinion, so feel free to disagree; but I think Terminator Salvation would’ve been a good follow up to T2, had it been done differently. Had it been released in the mid-late 90s with either James Cameron or George Miller directing and made in the same vein as Mad Max - a post-apocalyptic, sci-fi, action thriller - I think it would’ve been great!
Speaking of Terminator: Salvation, I feel that Sam Worthington would've been more convincing as John Connor over Christian Bale. He just had more of the look and charisma that I'd imagine John to have in the future war.
Yeah, maybe that would have kept her relevant or at least make her more focused on her carrer instead of falling to her inner demons.... or it could have speed them up, guess wellynever know
"But James, I want you to listen to me very carefully. I'm the Term-i-naeigh-TOR!!! NYAAAAAARGH! You have GOT to let me shoot somebody!! NYYYYYAAAArrrrGGGGhhhhHHH!!!!" "Ok, Arnie. Once in the leg." "NYYYYaaaaaaaaaaaa............."
@@stealthmode1303Agree, shame that it carried on with Genisys (my vote for the worst of the series) But honestly I enjoyed Dark Fate. The only part I would have taken out was the T-800 that killed Conner ended up in a family and had a business that sells curtains or something… wtf was all that about, so weird. Everything else I liked. Terminator 3… take out the odd silly humour part, better movie. Salvation… really enjoyed it. Genisys… just awful throughout. Dark Fate… it’s no Salvation but better than T3 and Genisys.
It at least attempted to not be a retread of T2, which every other movie was. I think it had some bold ideas, but ultimately just did not work at all for me (and a lot of other people).
One of the script ideas I read about years ago was a Back to the Future 2 concept.A Terminator and the heroes of the story go back to 1984 .They see the events of the first Terminator movie going on while they themselves are fighting, and they dont interact with them so that all the events never change.
Honestly I just want to see a successful trilogy set after Judgement Day, with the resistance against the machines. A young Kyle Reese as the lead. I thought Salvation was going to give us that, but not a lot of people liked it. Too bad. At least there's an anime series set during the war we're getting soon on Netflix
See I don't understand why we need a trilogy. That's a huge problem with T3 - Dark Fate. Every sequel after T2 tried to kick of a trilogy and we got set up films. T1 & T2 told complete stories. This franchise was never about trilogies. Look how many times Hollywood has tired to manufacture a trilogy and it's turned into a disaster. Hell, Terminator has done it 4 x now! Just give us one great future war movie. Make it Terminator meets the opening to Saving Private Ryan. 2hour plus war movie set in Cameron's future. If it's successful they can always expand. I think trying to create a 3 movie arc has really helped destroy this franchise. Salvation basically ends with John saying "tune in next week for the next adventure" .
Terminator Salvations didn’t make enough money? What are you talking about? It came out at number 2 behind The Night at the Museum, it was number one world wide. It went through legal trouble and Chapter 11 Bankruptcy, which is why we never got a 5th film other than Genesys.
According to Schwarzenegger's autobiography, he didn't want to make a third, and didn't like Producer Andrew Vajna. However, he had been paid on T2 with the expectation there'd be a third, and the producers only got the money because of Schwarzenegger's name and threatened to sue him if he backed out.
yeah he was considering running for Gov in the 2002 election, but b/c of threat of being sued for T3 he delayed that till the recall election with Gray Davis.
i like how you examined the origins of "i'll be back" and note that Schwarzenegger said "i will" because he had trouble pronouncing the contraction 'i'll' and that Cameron loved it... yet the famous line is indeed "i'll be back." great analysis, 11/10
Man, I got to see Terminator 3D when I was a kid. I completely forgot about it and was staring at the screen going "This is familiar..." I didn't remember it until you said the name. It was pretty cool, especially for the time. The dude riding the Harley around the stage was awesome. Thanks for dredging that one up.
I always thought the original T3 script was a lot better. Some changes i would have made would be adding Kat Brewster and keeping Sarah dead (yeah i now but even Linda said her arc was done) and having the nukes actually go off like in the final version of T3. In the older script it really gives you hope that they can stop judgement day with John and the Terminator working with the feds instead of running from them in a sort of reversal. Judgement day still happening would be even more of a punch in the gut. John killing the T-X is great also, great way for him to step up instead of needing to be saved.
I LOVE Cameron .... but *DAMN that's a great script!* I understand him not directing, and Sarah should have sacrificed herself to save John so that he could save the world ... but I'm not gonna complain. I can't believe how bad they diverted. They pretty much just kept the title. *Subscribed!*
I had a chance to see and experience Terminator 3D and even though it was loud due to the machine gun fire it was awesome to see this continution from T2 and see Arnold back as the Terminator, Edward Furlong as John, does indeed battle across time and space.
I actually really liked Terminator Salvation, so it's cool to see that it's part of some original furthering idea instead of being more of a cash grab. Thought that Sam's character was very interesting with him being an outsider's PoV to the otherwise already seen Kyle Reese and John perspectives. That and Christian Bale pretty much always rocks in whatever role he plays.
So Linda isn't okay with Sarah being unceremoniously dumped at the end of the film, but she's okay with John getting unceremoniously dumped at the beginning of another?
Makes her involvement in Dark Fate all the more understandable, she had as much hate for John as the writers did. I wonder how much of her dialogue was just unscripted musings she had on set.
I still believe that the "Sarah Connor Chronicles'" TV series was the best continuation the franchise ever received following T2. That show, imo, did a wonderful job in expanding the lore of Sarah/John and the future war, while also remaining respectful to the first two films (and ignoring T3). Of course, good old FOX didn't know what they had and cancelled it on, what is probably, the biggest cliffhanger I've ever seen in my life. The biggest kick in the face from that was that FOX didn't even announce that the show was cancelled till over a month after the final episode aired. You can probably imagine how upset my family and I were after that, as we had believed we were going to get a third season. Another kick in the face was that after that series, we ended up getting Genishit and Dark Fart in its place. And people wonder why Hollywood is considered a farce. So, even though the Sarah Connor Chronicles is an unfinished continuation to the franchise, I'd rather the story remain unfinished than turn to shit. EDIT: Also, the first Terminator is my personal favorite film in the franchise, and my favorite James Cameron film overall.
If I remember correctly, the showrunner said at comic con that they had stories for 4 seasons. Interesting that Cameron wanted to do the third one with Fox and they aired the tv series. And the showrunner was involved in Terminator: Dark Fate. He was one of the writers.
@@Christian39521 I've heard about that, and that details about seasons 3 and 4 haven't been revealed. I'd also argue that since the showrunner was involved with Dark Fate, his script probably got shredded during production, and that's how we ended up with that abomination.
I didn't see the finale as a cliffhanger, but as a full circle back (actually forward) to the human origin of Cameron. Had the series continued into a third season, it would've been rebooted into a completely different storyline, an apocalyptic wartime romance between John and Cameron (in human form). Frankly, it's kind of hard to picture how the show could've worked without Sarah Connor, as John's season 2 love affair with Kacy was pretty cringe and so much of Cameron's appeal was rooted in her robotic nature.
@@QuicksilverSG if I remember correctly, the showrunner said that it acts as a series finale and as a season finale in case they didn't get renew. He mentioned it in the commentary. Thomas Deker and Summer Glau have given hints of what could've happen in season 3. I remember in the old days of the IMDB message boards, there were rumors of what would've happen in seasons 3 and 4.
@@QuicksilverSG You do make a valid point with the finale. The way it ended, you could easily leave it ambiguous as to what would happen next. At the time, however, it was meant to lead into a third season. I do agree that Cameron's robotic nature is what made her unique, as well as some moments when her "humanity" kicks in (the episode where her memory glitches and she acts more like human is a masterpiece). Summer Glau's performance was truly one of the best I've ever seen, right up there with Lena Headey's portrayal of Sarah. Still, I would've trusted the writers at the time to deliver something interesting in season 3 and beyond, but we'll never know.
Im not gonna lie, I think we should've been able to see James Camerons version of Terminator 3 and just moved on acting as if the real terminator 3 never happened, they tried to do this, but James Cameron decided to change every thing and make Dark Fate which was a horrendous idea and who knows what could've been going through his head when he decided to make those decisions. In my opinion they should just never make another Terminator movie and just do Dune prequels becuase the Dune prequel books are about man vs machine, so imagine Terminator in space, further more they could make it significantly different and more philisophical so it doesn't feel too similar to Terminator
I'm going to disagree with that. It makes T2 absolutely feel like the conclusion as Rise of the Machines does too many things wrong. For one, a completely weak and sniveling John Connor was an awful idea and the digital effects were mostly pretty bad. The script still needed a lot of work too.
I believe William Wisher said that he was supposed to write the sequel to Terminator Salvation. It would've involved time travel. The T-1000, Sarah and Kyle were supposed to be in it.
I am SHOCKED to learn that Edward Furlong actually reprised his role in the T2 ride. I think he's the only actor to play John twice (Not counting Thomas Dekker who played John for 2 seasons)
Hey Bullets and Blockbusters, I love watching your videos and learning so much movie trivia and history, keep up the great work. Also here is a list of unmade movies that would be awesome to learn and talk about. -the 1980s attempted Live action Mobile Suit Gundam Move (with concept art by Syd Mead) -Steven Spielberg's and Amblin Animation's Cats move -the unmade animated movies of Don Bluth -Disney's Gigantic -the 1990s attempted Sonic The Hedgehog movie -the many attempted adaptations of the manga/anime movie AKIRA the many attempts to adapt Jeff Smith's BONE comic series -the many attempted Muppet movies PS sorry for using the word attempt so much
Going off of T2 3-D:Battle Across Time being a stepping stone for T3 I assume James Cameron would’ve had the heroes go into the future and stop Skynet for good. We would’ve finally had a film that took place in that constant dark night future.
T3 and Salvation should have been combined into one movie, where after John sends both Kyle and then the reprogramed T-800 into the past and blowing up the Skynet time facility he has to trek across a post apocalyptic wasteland to get back to the resistance base. Armed with a smaller plasma cannon John with an other reprogramed T800 and found and activated Marcus Wright travel together fighting off wild Terminators patrolling the wasteland until their reality gets rewritten as the past does.
The problem with the Terminator story is that there’s nowhere to go with it after the second movie. The first one left an open end, where the Terminator’s parts could (and would) be discovered, furthering the development of Skynet. T2 tied that loose end up perfectly, but left nowhere to go after. Any attempts to further the story were just convoluted retreads of the same old tire. The only true way to expand on this story would be to explore into an alternate future, where machines and man exist peacefully side-by-side until a new threat arises and wipes out humanity. But, we already got that with The Matrix (which are the spiritual sequels to The Terminator).
As bad as Dark Fate was it did drop the idea of an interesting take on the time traveling aspect. Since Skynet basically wiped itself out by killing Jon Conner and setting up a new future with another machine entity; then it releases for itself to survive it needs Conner. To make sure it survives Skynet sends another Terminator to stop Jon from being killed but at the same time there is Skynet vs the AI from Dark Fate both trying to keep its timeline intact, and we have Terminator vs Terminator. This could also introduce, and resolve, the alternative timeline from the 2nd season ender of The Sarah Conner Chronicles.
They could also make a prequel to T1 about war with machines. They could also go with something like Terminator:Resistance. So what they did? A silly parody of T2 with most lazy script possible. Worst decision in the history of movie sequels.
