Had a guy come in to my shop last fall with a saw accidentally straight gassed for an entire tank. Previous to that the saw had been run on red armor since it was new. He had me tear it down to check it out and assess the damage. Though the crankshaft was dry there didn't seem to be any damage the cylinder and piston we're also on damaged because of the hours on the saw I did put a new set of rings in it because it was apart. But as far as I'm concerned that says something for the quality of oil. Try that after running Stihl ultra I can guarantee you will not make it through a tank of straight gas before the crank or cylinder and piston lock up. Also had another similar situation customers crew forgot to dump the mix oil in the 5 gal can before filling it with gas work the entire day after lunch running nearly all of the 5 gals up straight gas through all there chainsaws didn't notice it until the next day when the owner noticed they still had two quarts completely full of Shaffer's XP 2-cycle oil which is what he had been running for 2 years prior. He then asked his workers what did you guys use for oil yesterday and they determined I guess nothing. He came to me in a panic we looked at each of the saws with a bore scope. One out of the six had minimal scoring and could have even been from before. We sprayed a little penetral 90 penetrating oil down each cylinder dump the straight gas out and put in his normal 40 to 1 shaffer's XP two-cycle mix and he went to work that was about a year ago all of those saws are still running. To give you the long history on the guy before I got him to use Schaefer's he brought me 3 locked up saws wondering if I would be interested in giving him an estimate on what it would cost to get one of them running I took on the job asking him what mix ratio he was running and he told me he had been running Stihl ultra and he was very happy with it because he would get about a year to a year and a half out of his saws hand felt he used them heavy enough but that was probably all he could expect. Well I know for a fact that all of the saws were used when he switched to Schaefer's and I also know that it's been 3 years since then and he hasn't had a saw failure yet so he is a very happy customer. I definitely do not recommend straight gas in any saw even if you are running red armor or shaffer's XP but in the event that it should happen hopefully your oil is giving you the much needed protection for that stupid pet tricks situation.
Stihl's oil is Castrol 2 cycle motor oil. If you look at some of the older bottles they have the Castrol name and emblem on them on the back at the bottom of the back label.
I always do 40:1 myself! I watch Richard Flagg also and he can whip down that 400 Stihl inspect it and have it reassembled in no time running top notch! Ive also got a jug of the Honda oil to try to see if it smells good also!
I love Richard Flagg's oil test series. He ran the VP Racing oil in one episode and showed that it ran clean and gave good lubrication at 40:1. Plus the big bottle of VP oil goes for $10 so it's affordable. AMSOIL Saber is my preferred default oil but it's like looking for hens teeth in my area and the one store that used to sell it no longer does. But since I'm in an area where snowmobiling is a big thing so a lot of the smaller family run stores carry AMSOIL Interceptor. I bought a quart of Interceptor and Dominator last summer to give a try but it was just pissing down rain all summer. So I never got around to cutting any trees. Also, Project Farm tested bar oils a few weeks ago and showed that STIHL's own bar oil is just as bad as their pre-mix oil. It caused the most wear out of all the oils tested and the lab test results showed that it had no additive package in it to help prevent bar wear. Funny enough even Husqvarna's own bar oil wasn't all that great for how much it is. One of the best bar oils tested was also the cheapest which was quite amusing. I'll use up my Husky bar oil this coming summer just to get rid of it and I'll go with the Harvest King stuff he tested, I can get a 2 gallon jug for $15 at my local farm store. :)
Spot on! My experience is the same still Ultra is crap, switched over to Red armor and I was blown away it literally melts the carbon to liquid and burns it out cylinders and pistons look new. Also has helped revive a lot of old saws that haven't ran in years. I run 32 to 1 Echo Red armor in everything old and new. I run Amsoil dominator in my 2-stroke modified blaster that should have blown up already. Both Echo Red armor and Amsoil dominator look identical probably the same stuff. It has extreme protection even in lean conditions when I should have blown things up
Loved your informative and no nonsense talk about Two Stroke Oil, I always used Stihl HP Super because it has a fuel stabiliser, l am heavy handed when it comes to two stroke oil, l am closer to 40:1 than 50:1, totally agree with that, moving parts Love ❤Oil ! Keep up the great content, greetings from Ireland !
I liked your video. I’m planing to try red armor at 40:1. I burned a ton of lawn boy at 32:1 with no problems. Stihl ultra has been my go to for years because I had a in with a dealer no problems except for spark arresters and plastics getting terribly dirty and clogged up. I enjoyed your video and I certainly don’t have virgin ears but some of the superlatives I found to be unnecessary while I was trying to teach my 10 yr old grandson something about mixed gas. I truly believe a good non ethanol gas is more important than the oil at 40:1. Just works for me. A close friend of mine is a mercury master mechanic and has told me numerous times marine 2 stroke oil is for water cooled engines only. Not formulated for air cooled 12-15,000 rpm engines. Have said enough. Have a good evening Sir!
First off, not a stab at Richard at all. But I think his video almost doubled the price of HP2 on Amazon. I watched the video on it and added it to my cart @ $16.99 but didnt buy it since I have plenty of RA right now.. Its now $27.99... I hate when that happens on Amazon. 🙄
It has a good thick film cuz it runs 100:1 or 80:1 in place of 40:1 or 50:1. I run the same and like it. I like the stabilization that it comes with. So 40:1= 80:1
@@dubbssawshop Been running chainsaws at 50:1 for years given Amsoil's 100:1 claim, my 50:1 should equal 25:1 now how's that for logic?just for perspective that would be 20+yrs burning 5 gallons a week minimum. Been running my KTM dirtbikes at KTM's recommended 80:1 as well with Saber.
As far as all the oils go I agree red armor is the best for availability and quality. I always used "head to start" 2 stroke snowmobile oil until it got bought out by Mobil 1 and the name changed. I feel any oil is better than no oil and always run it a little rich. My dad would always say"Spark plugs are cheaper than pistons!" and I've lived by that. Never have I ever blown up an engine from too much oil, but I have found too much causes a lot of extra carbon in a stock machine. I run the small mix ready containers simply because I don't have to measure anything and I'm lazy when I'm at the pump. It's always worked for me! I do run marine oil in my boat and it does seem thinner. I'd say a muffler mod on all small engine equipment and tuning the carb just a tiny bit fat is the best way to keep them cool. Also I run 1/2 a qt of Lucas engine oil stabilizer in my bar oil. That makes it stringy/sticky and keeps the bar cool. Also a sharp chain is #1! I agree stihl oil sucks. Most saws I rebuild that have scored cylinders and half melted pistons are hard core stihl owners that run stihl oil. Great video and I couldn't agree with you more!
I've been running 40:1 in an older chainsaw. Recently purchased a CS-590 which recommends 50:1. I like your logic re: using the 40:1 and will use in the CS-590 as well.
I'm using that Stens Mix (AKA Opti-2) in those pouches I sent as a long term experiment more than anything else... I also buy it in the bottles, so I can mix heavier amounts of oil. I run it in everything 2stroke I have even my ported Poulan, so far so good. Next summer when I get my shop built, I'll be opening up that Poulan and having a look at the bottom end and how it all looks after only running the Stens mix at the pouch mix ratio. It might not be the best for all use case scenarios but I can't wait to see how it works long term, already been using it for years. I also %100 agree, just use whatcha got... All of the regular 2stroke oils would not be sold if they didn't work because no one would buy them and therefore it would not be for sale. I would be using a different ratio when i go up to a 70cc saw because I will want the extra oil for extra protection. I have seen so much proof that the Stihl Ultra is bad I definitly won't ever run it. I used to run IPONE 2stroke racing oil in everything and that was amazing and it also smells like strawberry, I may use that again at some point.
@@matticus6339 I've used a couple and all the ones I've used have been great at 40:1. I am using TC-W3 for snowmobiles now because it's thinner in the winter but usually use R50 for dirt bikes. Any of them are very good I'm sure. 90 ml oil to 4 L gas. Good stuff.
Team Honda in 90s used yamalube 2r. In Honda HP bottles. Maxima superM is very good for chainsaw. Castor oil will carbon up after awhile been there done that. Use to use my bike gas 927 in my saws a lot . But it's the best protection 🏁🏁 just gotta clean and maintain them
As long as an oil meets ISO EG-B C or D standards I will run it. My favourite brand is called "on special", and if that isn't available, my next go to brand is "whatever is cheap" - sounds like I have been lucky, because where I come from I can assure you I am in no danger of burning up my gear on Stihl oil, as it is never "on special" or "cheap"
Any idea of what happened to him? The last time that I remember him putting up a video he wasn’t seeming to be doing very well. When he said that it was something intestinal, I asked him if it was Chron’s and then he responded back that it was. I have it and it’s NOT the end of the world. I had a bowel resection in 2004 and I almost died in the hospital because of an infection, but After 6ish months (as far as I remember) I was finally doing what I’ve always done, just pooping like crazy. About 4months back my neurologist had to prescribe me Tramadol for an MS related issue but after that my poop issue is TONS better and almost like I no longer have Chron’s.
Man, my boy’s used to ride 2 stroke bikes and the guy that tutored me on 2 strokes ran 36:1 in his bikes. So I went to that with Castor 927 in the mix. I fly RC planes and have always loved the smell of RC gas exhaust and it had the same smell. It does tend to gum up the rings if you let them sit for a while but a shot of fresh gas down the top and let it sit usually loosens them up. I have run 40:1 on my saws and weed eater gas for years and it does make your stuff last a lot longer. I run Husky oil ow simply because all my saws are husky. Much love from NC.
I've been using Super tech TCW3 Marine 2 Stroke at 40:1 with e free gas and stabilizer. Have yet to have ANY lubrication related issues. I've had MANY people tell me OH it's for water cooled 2 strokes not air cooled. It's funny that I've been running it in ALL of my equipment for years. I'll let them know if i have a failure related to it. But it works even in my 14,000rpm Zenoah Clone with 372XP carb custom intake & lightly ported filter horn, cylinder intake, exhaust, and piston transfer ports. It only has normal wear when I pulled the cylinder to check it for wear after some hard testing.
At least you're mixing 40:1, could even go richer if you wanted - especially during a break in. Glad that stuff is working well for you. Someone picking up a random marine 2 stroke oil and mixing it at 50:1 or 100:1 might not be so lucky, plenty of saws have been burned up like this
Yup totally agree with you there. My grandfather always used regular motor oil. What ever he had in the truck at the time. Laughed at me when I would measure out my 2 cycle motor oil. I laugh now just thinking about it. Poor pop simpler times I guess.
My poor 346 didn’t know there was bad 2-stroke oil until Facebook groups were a thing. I apologized to it for feeding it Tractor Supply and Walmart oil for 20 years. I do just put the Stihl Ultra in my old 7.3 when I get it given to me with a saw😂
Love some 927. I just mixed up a fresh batch Sunday. I just wish Maxima would put some dye in it. 927 is a castor blend, Klotz makes a castor blend as well, there Super Techniplate, has dye in it but never tried it. The smell of 927 is just amazing.
Motul 800 I use it at 50:1 and have had no problems but like you said Red Armor is good as well . I use 101 octane ethanol free racing fuel so it’s clean of additives that kill 2Stroke motors .
I have been in the same camp for years...they all work. Other than the Stihl the only one I wouldn't run is the Super Tech because the one you have is for liquid cooled 2 stroke outboards. I've run the air cooled Super Tech and it's fine. The other question I get often is what ratio to mix? I agree to just go with 40:1 for everything from dirt bikes to model airplane engines.
Very well said👍🏻 sure, a lot of us have our preferences and there are definitely oils better suited to different applications but at the end of the day, almost anything will work at sensible ratios. The HP2 has a neutral smell IMO. Close to Red Armor just not as sweet.
Started running the HP2 at 40:1 in all my Echo and Stihl equipment, largely due to Richard Flagg. Though I haven’t done a tear down, it still runs pretty clean, and the engines are slightly cooler by about 5-10 degrees F. The spark plug and arrestor screen do get dirtier quicker, likely due to 40:1 vs 50:1.
I run 40:1 in my personal equipment, which incidentally is the same fuel I put in my customers equipment. I tend to buy oil by the gallon and use a mix bottle. Currently, I'm messing around with the Stihl Ultra oil. I am disappointed that its only JASO FB rated though. I have seen quite a few engines with low compression with Ultra oil in the tank come across my bench. I have seen quite a few with TruFuel as well. However, I don't think I've seen much, if any engine failure with the Stihl "High Performance" oil.
I run 90/10 Klotz/Castor in my RC engines and nothing protects bearings as good as Castor oil. Currently, in my saws, I’m running Amsoil Saber @ 40:1, really like it. Used Husky LS for many years without issue too.
the caster is the one oil you cant mix with other oils (or so iv been told) i been wrong b4. im too old for dirtbikes so i use ELF MOTO2XT i close my eyes and whack the throttle on the 044 and im back on the gate waiting for it to drop!
I have one cautionary tale from using Maxima 927, mixed with 100LL avgas. This was/ is my favorite mix in my kx500, banshee and rz350 because it smells so good. But, at cold temperatures 927 will separate in leaded gas. Not a problem in a Jerry can because you can just shake it up. But if it separates in the fuel tank and you forget to shake the machine you can end up filling the carb bowls with straight oil, which is too thick to even drain out of the bowl drains on a motorcycle. So it requires a complete carb removal and cleaning. And on my old 028 stihl it just formed a gel on the fuel filter and it would not pump fuel until warmed up enough it would mix back into the gas. Just one of those things to be aware of, and is no big deal for an enthusiast but could be a headscratcher for the average homeowner. Although I suppose the average homeowner isn't likely running avgas and bean oil.
It separates in regular fuel below 30f too, it's wrong application to be using castor in a saw for sure.. it's main purpose is to prevent seizure in high stress motors that are torn down often and it'll build up a lot of gunk
Great video. Now, about the Stihl Ultra, I have a Stihl 4 mix engine that only runs properly off of it for some reason (when I tried other oils, it ran like total crap). I read somewhere that the stihl ultra oil was designed for their 4 mix engines and not specifically for 2 strokes. For my other 2 stroke equipment, I use white bottle Stihl oil, simply because they come in these cute little pre-measured bottles.
Personally I never go heavier than 60:1 on oil, only exception would be a small bore MX bike. 250cc and up, 60:1 is plenty. A high-quality synthetic just doesn't need that much oil to lubricate everything, adding extra just makes a gunked up mess. The mix in my power equipment now is about 80:1 with Amsoil Saber, no issues. My 300cc cross country bike is injected and averages about 80:1. 150 hours and the motor is in great shape.
All 2 strokes 40:1 any FD or greater rated 2 stroke mix oil. And never use sthil ultra for anything but starting a fire. Personally my go-to choice oil is Schaefer's XP 2-cycle it's clean does an excellent job. It has built in friction modifiers, Micron Moly® and Penetro®, which create a slippery, tenacious shield to prevent metal-to-metal contact. Even when you’re pushing your machine to the limit in demanding conditions. < Yes I copied that part from their website mostly for spelling 🤣. Great video and it is very true most any oil will work and be just fine with the exception of sthil ultra FB rated oil and a couple others that are also lower than FD rated carbon builders and lacking lubrication value as well.
I just use Husqvarna pre-mix fuel in those cans. If something happens to my saw I can provide all the receipts showing it’s the only stuff I buy. My 585 rips and I love it! I do recommend 2-4 ounces of SeaFoam at the beginning and end of every season to clean out some of that carbon buildup.
I've burned many many gallons of the Premixed VP Racing 40:1 fuel with excellent results. All of my two stroke outdoor equipment runs it flawlessly. Everything from my cheap Echo weadeaters and blowers all the way up to my hopped up, ported, high compression Husqvarna 365. Easy starting, cool running, low carbon buildup, stable octane rating, long shelf life (when properly stored) and great wear protection. Plus as an added bonus; it smells like a day at the race track every time I break out the two stroke tools. Red Armor is great as well. I just got tired of keeping track of the constantly multiplying/disappearing 1-2.5 gallon jugs of mixed gas. Was that ethanol free? Did I already mix it or is it virgin gas? How long has that been rolling around the truck bed? Did I do my math right or did I just mix that at 29.2:1? All of that aggravation is rectified by using the premix. That's worth the extra cost to me.
OK, thought u were going to go one level deeper, the ester vs. paraffin vs dino vs bean etc. , and the different generations of synthetics all have different burn characteristics that effect lubricity & carbon build up. Working from the perspective of understanding the base stock and how that effects the final product will help "predict" the characteristics of the oil. AND you are right, most will work or they would not be on the market. But some work better than others in different applications and work scenario's. AND the definition of "Better" oil is defined with matching the base stock with the application. BUT just a farmer....and I am not wasting with my mix choice. The oils I avoid are any paraffin based oil, any of the early generation synthetics like the Bel-Ray MC1 . The oils I like are typically marketed as "synthetic blends' ( I chose based on base stock ) and the better ester based oils like Bel-Ray H1R :) Some of the "Autotunes" felt the wrath of the paraffins. :)
i totally agree that any oil will work but i judge an oil when then saw burns up and to see the damage .i have had some very good experience with some synth..... oils that saved cylinders in the compression area and yes 40 to 1 ratio i also believe a high flash point is important to get more lub to the entire engine!
I do completely agree on the subject of the worst oil. That being said, does anyone know why? I’ve seen a lot of videos on WHAT it does but never a comprehensive reason why it does it.
I run Lucas semi synthetic after years of using anything I saw on the store shelf. But I changed after hearing Iron Horse, I figure if it is good enough for a fellow his age that used and torn down and repaired 100s or 1000s of saws and he is a wood cutter too, and he loves his saws- So Lucas 40-1 and not another thought about it. And it is available where I live, also tried Red Armour, but that is not even sold here.
It does matter, as a family that has been racing 2 stroke dirtbikes for 40 years, not oils are created equal. Some oils separate in cold weather, some don’t mix with ethanol, some are ashy, some leave a waxy film, some don’t burn and oils your exhaust, and some flash at such a low temperature that they flash in the bottom end before it can lubricant the top end. I was skeptical at first especially after running gallons of probably every kind of oil possible and burning up a few bike motors along the way. I exclusively run saber at 80:1 now. It was scary to take a $3k race engine that calls for 32:1 of yamalube and run it wide open on saber80:1, but now I do with no problems.
yes. I run a 2 stroke outboard rebuild shop, and I would never put oil designed for chainsaws/air cooled in a water cooled motor and vice versa! He was showing TCW3 for outboards and saying it was fine, which, no doubt, motor will run on it. for how long before it sticks a ring and detonates is anyone's guess. they didn't make 2 different classes of oil for no reason!
Red armor contains Polybutene which keeps the deposits low but by itself is not an optimal lubricant according to a paper from Yamaha. Cheap mineral based 2 stroke oil lubricates fine but leaves more deposits. These deposits can cause scoring of the piston if they dislodge. Also the exhaust port, muffler and spark arrestor will plug up using cheap low detergent oil. Use FD rated oil to take advantage of the most current oil technology.
Been using red armor 2 yrs works great. Used redmax works good too but more carbon. Used amsoil saber and failed on redmax trimmer. Yes I would the right ratio. Tried again on a used trimmer and it failed also. No more amsoil saber. Curious on the Honda hp2 or the bel ray
Myself run Shell Advance Ultra Snow (synthetic) marketed as a snowmobile premix/injection oil in all my 2-strokes, chainsaws (40:1) and even my YZ125 (30:1) motocross race bike. Similar to Amsoil Interceptor but even cleaner burning and more importantly, a better residual film on parts.
I stoped watching her channel after she rebuilt that saw that I’m sure had an air leak. And she only did the top end without looking for the problem. Lost faith in her then lol
I run lucas in ported saws and they dont show any wear or carbon. I know saber or dominator is better but the lucas is good enough and quite a bit cheaper.
For anyone using a Husqvarna XP, I have something new, the XP, it's the Castrol Power 1 Racing 2T. Instead of paying 30 euros per liter I paid 12 euros for power 1 racing.. Husqy is a bit greedy.
@@gyulaiarpad It has the same relative density 15ºC 0.86, viscosity 100 ºC 7.5, flash point 88/89ºC and viscosity at 40ºC 42/43... Everything is within the margins of error in the two independent tests carried out on XP and compared with the technical sheet Castrol Power 1 racing
That's good. I am very glad for you, seriously. Lots of folks have never had an issue. My advice is the same as if you told me you lived in a high tornado area and never been hit by a tornado... get out while you can. Eventually, something will happen, and you won't have enough protection. Good oil is like a storm shelter. It really increases the chance of survival in a storm. Stihl Ultra is like living in a trailer park in Kansas. When the tornado comes, that storm takes everything.
Everyone talks crap about stihl ultra, but I have a little 270 that's 14 years old, have cut well over a hundred loads of firewood, cleaned the arrestor screen once, carburetor has never been touched.
I use either Amsoil Saber or Echo Red Armor mixed at 40:1 with ethanol free fuel. But I prefer the Saber because I can buy a quart of Saber for the same price as a pint bottle of Red Armor. I’m an occasional saw user, but I run this same mix in my three vintage/antique Lawn-Boys, my trimmers, leaf blower, and even my snow blower if and when it’s needed.
Amsoil Saber is mixed at a ratio of 100:1 and provides sufficient lubrication, Red Armor is 50:1. What's the point of pouring such a large amount of oil? This excess amount of oil will not improve the condition of the piston group.
@@MrGreenjubas. Because I mow with three vintage/antique Lawn-Boys and I have an email directly from Amsoil stating that they don’t recommend going any leaner than a 50:1 mix ratio in them. So I mix at 40:1 and use it in everything I own. Plus Amsoil also states that it can be mixed at manufacturers recommended ratio. I’m not worried about saving a few dollars in the long run, but I definitely want to keep my 46 and 49 year old Lawn-Boys running for a long time.
Slightly oil heavy is always better. I bought some NOS recently… Shindaiwa T2500, Tanaka Tbc255pf, Tbl7800 & Redmax Bc2600. 1995-2008… I have 4 Toro tv5002 mowers with Suzuki engines & 2 Snappers with Robin 2 cycle engines. Most parts are NLA… Vp 101 race fuel mixed at 20:1 & 40:1. Older power tools get more Vp, Saber or Red Armor oil. The built to last era is long gone…
@@twocyclesmokeNice mowers! My machines are green, but I love the old Snapper Hi-Vacs with either the Wisconsin or Tecumseh TV-XL840 engines on them. And those Suzukis are beasts too.
I used to get no smoke two stroke locally for under a buck. It was great, no smoke. Everything is kind of like it now, very little to no smoke. Anyway I settled on red armor because of the utter trash 5 10 15 dollar saws I have acquired. I splurged yesterday and spent 20 bucks on a 42 cc name brand. It's gettin' red armor.
I think the oil mix ratio should be chosen based more on heat. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying 40:1 is bad but many outboard motors lubricate very well at much higher ratio. I think it's the fact that they run much cooler due to water cooling. I'm a 50:1 Sabre guy in power equipment.
Hell I buy the 6 pack of stihl oil to get the extended warranty when I buy my stihl saws and I take it home and give it to my neighbor who swares by stihl oil but he’s also always bringing me his shit to work on every spring when he needs to use his stuff meanwhile I put my stuff away with a full tank of ethanol free gas and motul in the tank a cpl drops of stabil and they fire right back up in the spring like they were ran the day before!!
No my man. Not all 2T oils good. For example in Poland we have so many brands that most of them can be only use as needle bearings nothing less nothing more. Me personally I highly recommend it mobil 1 racing 2T for Husqvarna.
Castor 927,Klotz SuperTechniPlate, Red Armour, and VP are my go to oils. But anything but Stihl brand is good with me. Never seen any good from Stihl oil.
