Grab some G54 merch here - www.en.garage54.ru/ The drums were front mounted for the purpose of the experiment (turns out that Ladas are simple to convert from disc to drum). For business inquiries: promotion@garage54.ru
@@joshmanis9860 Yep 👍 But as we can see, they over did it, drilling too many holes. Crossing the threshold between heat dispersion and not enough surface area.
You also have a car for thesting!! ( that's suprise.. or does ot was... They have all russian ladas loaded on g54 to waiting testing different 'car acgeny' :D
You should redo the first braketest because the brakes weren't braked in so that is why the distance was long the first time. I guess the result would pretty much be the same as for the diskbrakes. Holes can help with cooling but too many makes the whole assembly more prone to break because of less material.
Pretty good idea💡. Cooler brakes should mean longer lasting. Wish there will be some study of this someday. There has to be a sweet spot of number of holes, hole pattern, and maybe even hole angles to find the optimal combination for best performance and longevity
Bad idea, brake drums are designed to reliably stop a vehicle within a certain distance. The introduction of water and dirt will greatly effect both. Interestingly you can buy disk brake with holes, but those are for niche applications only, such as auto racing.
@@gnaedigerfelsNot realy, disk brake are lighter and have better heat disabatience, but that doesnt matter much for normal driving. Drums are cheaper, more robust and a much longer service life.
Genau... deswegen sind alle modernen LKWs mit Scheibenbremsen rundum ausgestattet. Trommelbremsen halten bis ans Lebensende aber es kann gut sein, dass das Lebensende deutlich schneller da ist als es sein müsste. Desweiteren haben Trommelbremsen eine höhere Neigung zum Verglasen der Bremsbeläge und die automatische Nachstellung der Beläge ist deutlich fehleranfälliger.@@jonasstahl9826
back when everything had drums on all 4 wheels there was a big advantage to drilled drums they push all the water and dust out of the drum so after a water crossing you dont loose your brakes
many years ago a Top Truck challenger Had a Bronco that had been converted back to 4 wheel drilled drums from disk brakes because according to him they worked better.
The braking force is directly proportional to the surface area. When you first drilled the holes, the surface area decreased about 10% but heat buildup decreased and so the braking efficiency stayed normal. Then as you made more holes, the surface area decreased and so the braking force while heat desapitation into the air was high. Lesson: Yes holes help, but just enough of them.
The amount of heat generated from a small car stopping once isn't going to be anywhere near enough to saturate drum brakes. Drilled rotors are completely pointless unless you have a car with enough power to quickly accelerate up to high speed and brake hard over and over again like on a racetrack.
@@rubiconnn They will perform better because stopping less mass centrifugally is easier. But more work is needed to stop because of the lesser mass. Hence stopped better temp stayed even though "vented". Hence more exertion on the proceeding test. The size, weight, and even shape are considerations when designing brakes. The weight of the rotor, drum, plays a significant role because it's also a moving mass that needs to be stopped.
I propose 2 more tests. Transverse drilling with slot angled in different directions to see if and in which direction the cooling increases and test with water spray to see if drilled drums lose performance compared to non-drilled ones in wet condition.
I'd love to see you guys put rear disc/caliper combo from a small car to the front of a lada. Something of a size of yaris, mazda1, lupo etc. Or maybe even motorcycle brakes. Lets see how small will still stop the car.
3:42 18 Year Old Me Spray Painting the Rear Drums on my Yukon & Standing back like "Oho Yes!" loool 1st Person I'm beating up when the Time Machine is ready is gonna be myself. -_-
Cross drilling never increases stopping distance, it's only purpose is repeatability, to combat brake fade from heat soak after repeated use. The same for finned or drilled drums. Cross drilling actually decreases the surface area making braking worse for the first stop, but it's outweighed by the ability to continually stop at that same distance. Much the same as race compound pads, they will work terribly at the start but have a higher opperating temperature then start working better, and will be repeatable if maintained within that opperating temperature. They maintain this temperature by air ducting to brakes, vented, crossdrilled and/or slots for de-gassing rotors so they don't overheat whilst continuous hard braking doesn't allow them to cool.
I think the test is faulted because of the aluminum , it stretched out, I would like to see this done on steel drums and a wet and dry test would be helpful too.
The aluminum didn't stretch. The steel lost it's tension outwards once part of it broke, so it let go of the aluminum. It's how I get press-fit sleeves out of engine blocks. I cut the sleeve on one side with the boring bar until it's thin enough to stick a pocket ruler behind, then stick a small taped rod down behind it on top of the ruler (so I don't damage the parent bore) and pry inwards. Once the sleeve snaps, you can just pull it out by hand.
Both of them failed due to structural integrity that was lost with the drilling. Those pads push out with so much force, plus the added heat, that both of them deformed into 'cones' and they lost all effectiveness. The Aluminum is cast around the steel core and only bonded by the surface tension between the two....which, after all the testing (heat), drilling, and deformation...was gone. This is a VERY cool test, love these guys because they aren't afraid to do anything.
The holes have nothing to do with stopping distance . You had a brand new brake and rotors therefore in the first run they would not perform the best. It is normal to have better brakes with every run even with NO HOLES .
@@topzozzle6319 It also allowed water to vent out of the drums in wet weather conditions to help mitigate the performance loss. Once disc-style brakes got more sophisticated over the years though the performance gain for the drilled drums was lost
I am impressed you were able to improve the braking performance with the first round of drilling. I don't expect you guys to do it but I would like to see the results of a long term test with a similar amount of holes. You may have discovered a genuine advance in technology. 🤔
I definitely appreciate your videos you guys really are having fun with things I enjoy it. As an American though it seems I'm unable to visit your store.
Test from initial set of holes showed an improvement in braking possible from the friction surfaces wearing in to shape, the temperature differences side to side possibly due to the direction of the holes drilled, one side the arc of holes spinning to the forward braking shoe, and the other side arc of holes spinning away from forward braking shoe...also the holes drilled could have become acting as a fan, one side pulling outside air from the wheel to underneath the car and other side pulling hot air from underside of car to outside the wheel...
this might work really well for mud bogging for clearing them up quicker. when you drive thru deep water and get mud slurry in your brake drums you loose all brakes it might help to clear them quicker.
there is an advantage to this people used to do this for offroad racing. it allows the drum to push out any water so you dont loose your brakes after crossing water it also pushes out sand and dust
you might have hit on a good idea if you can calculate how much surface area you can remove without compromising the strength of the drum, I think a combination of holes and grooves would work best, like a disk brake, when you look at a disk that is drilled and grooved not a lot of surface material is removed to have big gains in braking efficiency,
I wonder if you could of drilled some holed on the vertical face between the ribs to help improve the air flow through the drum in combination with the first hold spacing might of helped? Your video was fantastic.
Yeah, but the improved stopping distance can be attributed to the shoes bedding in. You have to bed the shoes in for 500miles really. The holes were helping the bedding in.. less area to bed in. My first cars were all drum brake front ends, they are fine once bedded in but BAD when newly fitted..
The breaking improves when you drill more holes in the rotor or in this case the brake drum because the more metal you remove the more pounds per square inch gets applied to the brake pad and rotor and allows it to bite on them holes just a little bit I believe
That weight difference is very neglible, rotor weight has very little to do with braking. The difference was that regular drums main weakness is heating, drilling holes allows much more cooling substantially reducing brake fade. Surface area doesn’t affect coefficient of friction at all, force does. So because the brakes were cooler, he was able to push the brakes harder without any fade improving performance.
@@2seep well then that's probably a good thing my comment has nothing to do with the weight of the rotor I feel as if you may not have read the whole comment or you did not understand it at all
@@2seep and yes the holes help with venting clearly but it also helps increase how many pounds per square inch you are putting on the brake pad being less material means the brake pad can actually apply more pounds per square inch on the surface is pressing against
Race drums. You're the first! Actually, you're the first in alot of your videos. Don't you dare stop! Keep them coming! Your videos are very entertaining and quite often revealing. You're not afraid of going to the extreme! That's the ticket.
I've heard stories of old loggers using water sprayers on their trucks drums when driving through the mountains to improve their braking. Some swore by it!
So now do it all again only this time do it properly. Drums and Disks. First bed in the brakes 10 x 80 kmh to 40 kmh to bed in the NEW brakes. Then drive figure 8 route as fast as you can like racing. You should only get about 5 laps before Brake Fade takes effect. (Stock factory brakes) Now start drilling and racing the figure 8 again to see how quickly the Brake Fade comes back.
They will perform better because stopping less mass centrifugally is easier. But more work is needed to stop because of the lesser mass. Hence stopped better temp stayed even though "vented". Hence more exertion on the proceeding test. The size, weight, and even shape are considerations when designing brakes. The weight of the rotor, drum, plays a significant role because it's also a moving mass that needs to be stopped/slowed.
the holes in disc brakes arent for cooling but to allow the gasses that build up between the pad and the contact surface to escape that way you dont end up with a boundry layer of gases causing brake fade, thats why things didnt get better after the first round of holes
Drilling drums...hmm. I wonder. Drums, but if they had like...fins/ heat sinks on the outside of the drums that kind of slice through the air. Granted, at the point of trying to upgrade drums, most people would convert to discs., but this is an interesting idea and topic.
Brake drums and rotors generate heat faster than they can dissipate it. The mass of metal is a heat sink, and can get saturated. That is why a hard stop from high speed can result in "brake fade", where no matter how hard you step on the pedal, the car will not slow down any more. Also why you do not want to cut drums or rotors, that gets rid of mass. Just replace them.
Were there identical tires being used? Was a dot4/5 brake fluid being used? Drilled brakes are not for single shorter braking distances. Drilled breaks are theoretically for better heat dissipation after multiple braking zones seen on race tracks. Each brake drum test should have been a series of 3 back to back brake tests measuring distances and heat before drilling.
This is the same effect of drilling centrifugal clutches for Karting works great till it fails but the amount of holes you can get would blow your mind all whilst keeping it balanced
I like drum brakes and i'd like them on front brakes too performance wise but they are complicated and behave weird when wet and heat up easily and cool down slow, are also a witch to adjust and break them in, in fact they could drive for a week in town and the shoes would still not be set to the drums. The performance increase they saw when started drilling them are not because of the holes but because the shoes took a step to break in and maybe quicker.
Slotted rotors will have less stopping distance by default. But during times of constant, extreme braking, slotted rotors allow better dissipation of heat. Your honda civic doesnt need slotted rotors.
I would of stop since the first set of holes. It is allowing gasses to escape from the shoes. There was no contact surface to brake properly with the more holes you drilled. I would of done with the tests with 5 braking test after each modification to see what brake fade would do.
Hey guys love your crazy ass channel! So you have reversed a clutch pedal, made steering more sensitive, you should try reversing everything and see if anyone can drive the car! Maybe brakes should stay the same but gearshift pattern, gas pedal, steering, clutch all reversed. I dare you
Aluminum drums? 😗.the last two times when braking was the worst,the steel friction surface in the drums locked to the pads and was spinning in the aluminum housing. Terrible idea to save a few pounds weight
