I've been getting a ton of comments regarding Super Paper Mario. A lot of you think I was being unfair to it. I respect that you enjoyed the game, but personally, I did not, for the reasons presented in this video. I can still acknowledge it did a lot of stuff better than Sticker Star and Color Splash. That's why my section on Super is very short compared to how long I talk about those games. I even bring Super back up multiple times to give it credit for trying to create original characters in an original world, and going all out with its story. Really, I just wanted to goof on Super for being so weird, but I don't consider it to be "part of the problem." Don't take me not liking Super so personally, you're free to continue enjoying it, and I won't try to stop you.
HyperBitHero I'd say it was clear enough though there were times when it seemed like you were grouping Super with the latter two rather than the former when it comes to being competent games, maybe that was from the aspect of changing things to work around some gimmick, such as near the very end when talking about how long it's been since there's been a good Paper Mario. It at least had some aesthetic past the "It's Mario but everything is paper" and there were rpg elements even if they weren't as well done as the first two. Overall good video I'd just say be a bit clearer on that sort of thing in the future.
There are some things that are best left unchanged. Miyamoto, you made a mistake with paper mario, you need to change paper mario back to its original core, mario and Luigi can't replace paper mario. Why are we just not allowed to have the paper mario we want?
Max G Miyamoto pretty much destroyed the Paper Mario series. Paper Mario TTYD gave it so much potential as to the right direction to take. He even messed up Star Fox Zero's control's so it was impossible for people to get used to quickly. If you want to sell something, give it a high budget; don't destroy the core mechanics the series is loved for.
Guard them back packs boys. In middle school some douche stole all my games and tried to sell them back to me. We did the transaction first thing in the morning and the assistant principal saw it, probably assumed it was drug related, and he investigated. Turns out he was smart enough to check the save datas and see that they were in fact mine. I got my games and money back by a stroke of luck
Maybe as virtual console. I can't see them doing a straight up port without remastering it with Color Splash's artstyle. which would anger some people. just like what happend with Superstar Saga 3DS.
In Superstar Saga 3DS. the Traditional Mario enemies have their standard designs from the New Super Mario Bros series, they removed the Geno easter Egg, changed and replaced stuff that didn't need to be there and the biggest reason is that some fans don't like the artstyle from Dream Team/Paper Jam. They feel that it sucks out a lot of the charm the original game had. I fear if they remade either 64 or TTYD. they'd make the Toads Identical, make the Mario enemies be generic, change stuff for no reason and make almost everything be made of Paper. As much as I defend Color Splash, I don't think remaking them that way is a good idea. I think releasing TTYD on the Virtual console and Intelligent Systems makeing a Paper Mario game that people actually want are the best options they have.
Superstar saga 3ds was bullshit i did the bowser castle with mario and luigi level 41 it was a bit fun, in the original i had a mario and luigi level 52 cuz i loved the battles
RedMage23 I have no idea why the Mario Luigi series deserved to get the RPG and have all the good stuff when Paper Mario has always been the better and more stylistic of the two. Mario and Luigi can explore the canon Mushroom Kingdoom and do cool brother moves, Paper Mario can explore SO MANY new worlds! What happened to rougeport? What happened to my Trans Vivian? What happened to my audience getting eaten alive and the chance to find a crime scene in rougeport alleys? What happened to literal "The GodFather" happening in rougeport? What happened to my 2001:A Space Oddessey TEC learning about L.O.V.E, Peach running around nude, Sherlock Holmes murder mystery (in the 1st AND 2nd game), Interesting party characters, new enemies and character races, Mario and Co. Going to actual heaven and hell, having the choice to betray all your friends and join a possessed Princess Peach in ruling the world, FUCK ALL OF THAT COOL SHIT APPARENTLY. NO, you only have Super Mario World characters none of that OC shit were toads can be sexy ladies, Maids, Train Conductors, Sailors or anything else but filler, No party characters, No Story, Battles only, make the battles new and no reusing what already works, no walking to different worlds LEVEL SELECT ONLY (IN MY GODDAMN LUIGI'S MANSION AS WELL!!!!!) Paper Mario was at the top of my favorite games of all time now I can hardly stand to think of Miyamoto taking every chance he had to torpedo the series instead of consulting the fans. Who cares about what THEY THINK. What I want to know is why they did it 3 times? You mean no one bitched and moaned at Miyamoto about Sticker star in japan? Famitsu? No one bitched and moaned about Color Splash? NO ONE BITCHED AND MOANED ABOUT PAPER MARIO BEING STRAIGHT UP DEMOTED TO A GUEST STAR IN ANOTHER GAME SERIES? I wanna cry.
The thing about Super that did it for me was the fact that it WAS a platformer. As a kid who really only knew Mario from his platforming games, it was too much of a leap going to an RPG. Now, looking back, Super had the same quirky, weird and kinda messed up soul of Paper Mario. The reason for the artstyle and gameplay shift was mainly because the people who made it tried something new. I for one really dig the character designs. I personally feel Super Paper Mario is indeed defendable. The latter two games...not so much
@Drewskey Artstyle is here referring to the character designs and odd, geometric shapes and computer based imagery very present in Super and not TTYD. They TECHNICALLY have the same artstyle, but not really
@@spudsbuchlaw Despite the Gameplay shift, Super Paper Mario is closer sequel to the first two Paper Mario games than Sticker Star and onwards. Super Paper Mario still has RPG elements(Unlike the later games). So Super Paper Mario has this unique platformer/RPG genre going on. Not to mention it still has a great and engaging storyline throughout the chapters that alligns with the first two games, the characters are unique and and have depth to them instead of just generic toads(Which again, that's more like the first two games than Stcker Star and onwards). Mechanics of the first two games are back in Super, like the stylish moves from TTYD and cooking items from the first two games. Thus, Super Paper Mario is the real sequel of the first two games, they just shift the gameplay, everything else is what you expect out of a Paper Mario/Mario Story game.
The worst thing about Color Splash was that visually, it was GORGEOUS! It's so difficult to look at a game that beautiful and think "You know, this is amazing and delightful looking, and I'm still not having fun."
No, it does not. The art style is not prettier than the others at all as they are far too different to be compared as one being a better looking art style objectively. The originals are more fitting for the series though and are more humble in their executions than CS's overblown and oversaturated aesthetics.
It was called Mario Story in Japan originally. Paper Mario being the new title isn't a valid reason to ask for or to make the series have this new art style. Color Splash's visuals are overbaked. The colors are oversaturated and the emphasis on the paper and cardboard is way too detailed and focused on to do paper craft as an art style justice. An art style should be humble and not feel jam packed with so much that it's distracting looking. The new Yoshi game does a far better job of it because it's more simplistic and humble in its execution, but even if it went for that it would still fit less than the previous art styles.
Paper Mario: Crayon Craze Paper Mario: Bubble Trouble Paper Mario: Styrofoam Squadron Paper Mario: Constipainted Paper Mario: Cardboard Cop-Out Paper Mario: Doodle Destruction Paper Mario: Concrete Calamity Paper Mario: Museum Massacre
FINALLY someone points out the paper aesthetic being stupid. Before, things were just 2D/3D for some reason, and it was weird but it worked. In TTYD they took it a little farther with the paper mechanics. In color splash, everything is made of cardboard and paint. It looks great purely in quality, but I hate that now its all paper themed. 'Paper Mario' was more in reference to the weird aesthetic, not everything actually being art supplies themed. No one has ever pointed this out, so thank you.
I agreed all the way up until you considered Super Paper Mario the downfall of the series. Sure, the gameplay wasn't as fleshed out as the first two Paper Mario games, but it was because they were taking risks and trying to find another unique system for people to enjoy. It still had just as good of a fusion of humor, character, story, and darkness that made the first two so good. Every game after Super Paper Mario was the exact opposite. They no longer took risks because of the negative reception of Super Paper Mario. They went back to the roots of the popular main-line Mario games with the hopes that fans would be happy again, but of course, this was the exact opposite of what fans wanted. It was the backlash towards Super Paper Mario's risks that led to Miyamoto stepping in and discontinuing any and all experimentation with the Mario formula.
Ryota Kawade is our God; we need his return. 64 and TYD aren’t masterpieces because of their general RPG structures and ideas - Kawade’s meticulous attention to detail and vigilance towards surprise and suspense was the extra “something” that made this series go above and beyond. The fact that he went from the head guy to “special thanks” in Sticker Star can’t be a coincidence. Read the interviews: this guy created what we love about the classic series. Please man come back to us😭
Harry Noke except play TYD first, then go back to the original no less than a year later once you’re already sold on the series and hungry for more. The first couple hours of the original haven’t aged too well
@Joel Johnson Sticker Star had a bland plot, millions of enemies, dumb mechanics, annoying puzzles, no partners, and really too much emphasis on the 'Paper' part of the game.
This proves how predictable and boring this series has gotten. He literally jokingly suggests "The Kooky Confetti Conundrum" as the title for the next game, and now one of the main mechanics of Origami King is confetti. The destruction of this series kills me inside.
It seems more and more like Miyamoto is going the way of George Lucas--losing touch with what made his work great. In so many interviews it seems like he's pushing the devs the wrong way, putting a damper on creativity for reasons nobody quite understands. He just has some weird drive to limit narrative elements, choices, and unique settings. It's like he's aiming for an elegant simplicity, but going too far, forgetting that nuance and off-color personality give things charm. Everything he touches these days is so elegant and safe that it's boring.
I think he is too focused on "you only need gameplay" and "never change a running system". But he also doesn't see that the system isn't running anymore
Not to mention that because of his legacy no one has the balls to stand up to him when he's trying to guide the development team into a new direction. This is likely the main reason why a LOT of his games he's helped make in the past decade have been so freaking terrible, no one wants to stand up to him and tell him how wrong he is from how much respect he garners in the video game industry. I mean he's said so many times that he never likes making a game unless he can pair a "gimmick" to it, as if doing something the same as before but with a new story is a bad thing. I'd much rather have had "Paper Mario: A Thousand Year Door" styled game made for the 3DS with a different story and look than the atrocious Sticker Star game we did end up getting. I'm sorry Miyamoto but it seems like your old age is getting to you, you're beginning to become more of a liability these days...
@@johnathonturner2279 Exactly, and Thank God for that. Miyamoto is out of touch. Also I guarantee that World of Light was secretly his idea (because it's more about "fun" than story! guh-huh! guh-huh-huh!)
I feel like there was a lot of interesting and surprisingly dark ideas and characters in Super Paper Mario underneath the admittedly underwhelming gameplay. Like Mr. L, Dimentio, Mimi, the fact that a Mario game actually has the villain ambush you in town, literally kill you and then you go to Hell, the Sammer Kingdom getting wiped from existence and then you have to walk through the creepy white void that's left of it.
Not to mention that during the very final boss, you're forced to only be able to play three out of the four main characters, with the fourth one ending up as the actual Final Boss fused with a guy you THOUGHT was a henchman but really he was the master manipulator all along. Lord I love this game
@@Iamstickman It actually isn't just Miyamoto's fault though - do ACTUAL research. Miyamoto has little to do with Paper Mario now. You want proof? You want HARDCORE proof?! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-KOk2QxDIW6c.html ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-1aJA3bOsvhU.html Watch both of these fully and then tell me it's Miyamoto.
I love how Miyamoto's criticism for the supposed original vision for the game was too similar to the a previous game, but he insisted on using only the themes and aesthetics of other Mario games that we've seen a hundred times before. I love Shiggy for creating so many historic and amazing games, but I think it's time he stopped interfering and let the younger devs do what they want.
There's an upcoming webcomic on Tumblr that will tell you this story in the amount of detail you so desire! Wait until it gets fully rebooted, because right now, it's on hold with an archive of an earlier comic that has a jarring, but tolerable artstyle.
I remember an interview video a while back in which one of the devs of Color Splash (not Miyamoto) says that Sticker Star and Color Splash were made the way they were because Mario & Luigi already existed. I don't know it was Miyamoto that thought that, but I really do feel this was a collaborative decision, and that to just blame him for the downfall of Paper Mario really doesn't sit well with me.
Meanwhile Mario and Luigi have been getting more boring and predictable. TONS OF TOADS! BOWSER'S THE VILLAIN ALL THE TIME! Whomever's messing with these games really has to stop.
I'd agree with you electric... except you also forgot that he was the one who set it on this path. He caused SS to become the trash it was, rather then the game people wanted. It was on a widely bought and available system as opposed to TTYD which only made things worse... not to mention the game was boring, by his words, when there was a year left... and he didn't delay the game to fix it. He let them release a boring game... despite completely chopping a game he felt was bad. This is pretty backwards. To stop a game because it is bad... and to let a bad game out when you admit to it is wrong in general. Had he done anything the second time... it could have been delayed and good. He dug the hole... and he left it in the hole.
Misconception..... yeah right, even if it was just a suggestion, he's still part of the fault because the games were completely the opposite about he wanted like calling the beta Sticker Star "just a port of the GC version".
Yes, he is. After all, who is the one who said "As much as possible, complete it with characters from the Super Mario World" and "It's fine without a story so do we really need one? Not Tanabe, but Miyamoto. Tanabe and Unintelligent Systems might have the fault in some aspects like the overuse of generic Toads but the one who started the true downhill of the series was Miyamoto due to his obssesion over simplyfing and gimmicks. That's why Paper Mario will never return to it's glory. Even if Tanabe and Unintelligent System get the hell away from Paper Mario, you won't see the stories and RPG elements ever again.
The first Paper Mario was great, good story, and great game all around. TTYD improved on the original and added some new quirks and was gorgeous to look at. Super Paper Mario didn’t have the RPG style play and traditional partner system, but it was still a fantastic game. Now what happened with Sticker Star & Color Splash? Shigeru Miyamoto is what happened. People think that he has the golden touch just because he’s one of the big gaming icons. He messed up the whole series, we could’ve had partners & a good story, but no. He needs to sit his ass down and let Intelligent Systems do their thing.
Em, Miyamoto may have to do with the first game, but definitely not in the second one, the second one was all on Intelligent System that were so blunt with the idea Sticker Star sold SOOO well because it was SOOO good, so a sequel to it must work SOOO well, until they realized it sold well because it was on 3DS and it was marketed as a “return to formula” unlike Color Splash that went too confident in a dead console without sprinkling the truth that time.
I liked Color Splash. It had improved upon the terribly broken formula that Sticker Star had laid out. I find it enjoyable and funny, but I guess it didn't really have the charm that the older ones did.
My thoughts on the Paper Mario trilogy: PM64: - Good gameplay - Turn-based battles - Good OST - Good characters - Nice story for the 1st entree PMTTYD: - Good gameplay - Turn-based battles - Atmospheric OST - Good characters - An even better story than the 1st SPM: - Gameplay could’ve been slightly better, was 11 or 12 & was able to accept that some things won’t stay the same. - Catchy OST - Blumiere, Timpani, Merlon, Luvbi & her parents, Dimentio, Mimi, Nastasia, O’ Chunks, Bowser, Peach, & Luigi all well written - The best story of the three IMO(W/ tons of heartbreaking moments w/ Luvbi, Timpani, & Blumiere) - And last but not least, Merlon’s fucking quote, “To feel sadness is to live... but as long as you are alive, the future is a blank page."
@@SteveCrafts2k close minded? paper mario has the best writing and story of the entire series yet this guy cant even acknowledge it because he's too concerned about it not being like the previous two.
@@SteveCrafts2k He has the right to insult just like I do cant make a paper mario review video then end up slaughtering the very game with the best writing bc the gameplay isnt like the others
My favorites in the series are actually PM:TTYD and SPM. I feel like the original didn't age as gracefully, although it is still a pretty good game and set the stage for amazing games to follow. SPM did leave behind its RPG roots, but it kept the varied designs and locations and added in a new system to play that I personally found enjoyable. It doesn't have as many followers with real depth, but that's because it wanted to focus it's attention on Tippi. I believe SPM actually had the deepest story in the series, which it achieved by focusing more on fewer characters.
i agree the Fights in the first were bad , you just charge and then power bounce them down and the stats even are capped at 50 - 50 - 30 , in ttyd i like having many badges
Papa Grimly Super Paper Mario also made characters redeemable or made them characters you an sympathize with. I like how the main antagonists of Chapter 5, the Floro Sapiens, weren't even bad, their water was polluted so they resorted to bad things, and you can feel sympathy for Luvbi and her parents due to the situation they were in, growing love for what's now their daughter in their eyes, no matter what. Characters felt real and had meaning, and the game can be genuinely sad. I never understood the hate. At worst, it's a mediocre platformer with some okay RPG elements. At best, it's a fun platformer with a great OST and excellent writing.
Miyamoto's not an idiot. I've always thought the reason was money. I figured that the games were selling at a loss and that budget cuts had to be made. And most of Miyamoto's comments didn't actually imply that it should take the direction it did. Like even if you were to replace every new species in ATYD with other enemies from the Mario universe, it would still be a pretty good game, and with backlash from the cut out style of characters in SPM, it makes sense for him to limit it. As for it not needing a story, I would think that that could also be a money issue. More story means more development time, which means more time between games to be sold, which means less income, which means the game would sell at a loss after they are already not getting back the money they put into the Wii U. That being said the video makes it sound like Miyamoto is overseeing so many projects that he can't even take the time to play to them enough to understand them at a basic level. And he oversees a lot, so I can see how it could happen, but I wouldn't think he would direct games he doesn't understand. On the other hand everyone makes mistakes, especially when they are in their 60s.
There is one other thought I had that would explain Miyamoto's mistakes. There were plenty of demons in TYD, and I never was able to beat the final boss, and well... PM has always featured numerous 4th wall breaks, from the dragon eating the audience members, to the X-naught who spoke to us directly, and finally to Paper Jam where Paper Mario steps out of the world of the book entirely. But what if one character went further, perhaps this isn't the Miyamoto we know at all. Perhaps Paper Mario's decline was intentional, and he is switching things up in games to destroy the series. Until finally when all the fans are gone, in the final and easiest game yet he switches it up to make Mario the antagonist. and finishes him for good!
I found Super Paper Mario to be a really good game honestly. While the gameplay is really different, I think it works and is pretty fun overall (although the game is really easy for the most part). I liked being able to play as Peach, Bowser and Luigi too. The pixels weren't that bad, although I preferred having actual partners. The story is also really good too and one of Mario's best stories overall (with Dimentio being my favorite Mario villain). I can see understand why people may not like the game and find it to be a letdown, and that's fine, but I personally enjoyed it. Although I've never played Sticker Star (so I'm not going to fully judge it), the game seems really lame and boring. I was curious about Color Splash, but after seeing that it's essentially the same thing, I kind of lost interest in that too. Again, I've never played either game, so I can't form a full opinion or judge it fully, but I can't see myself buying them anytime soon.
@@trupotato It just made me sad that when we met them, they all had unique personalities and sometimes even a sad backstory (like Dottie, I think it was called) but just got introduced, actually importantly used in the storyline for like one chapter and then never talk or have a purpose again.
bash Super Paper Mario all you want, at least they still had original characters and a really compelling story to go along with it. I liked it, it was an enjoyable ride, not as good as TTYD but still enjoyable never the less.
Stela Boci Super Paper Mario had the best story of all 5 of the Paper Mario games, the gameplay is better than the 2 most recent Paper Mario’s, the characters are more original than the 2 most recent Paper Mario’s, the battle system (though it doesn’t have a traditional one) is better than the 2 most recent games. It is a great game.
They had some unique characteristics at first. Not the polygonal tag-a-longs but the villains had their own identity along with a few other characters, and I mean few. To some people, the characters being polygonal wasn't the worst thing in the world.
I actually really liked Super Paper Mario, just because of the sheer drama of the story. Yeah, I hated the fact that all the charismatic partners were replaced with Pixels and stuff, but I was absolutely blown away by how dark of a game SPM actually was, to the point that I was reduced to tears with the conclusion of the Tippi/Count Bleck relationship. I still remember that last set of scrolling text against the black screen left me a fucking wreck... SPM is nowhere near as good as the original or Thousand Year Door, but I really was floored by the quality and occasional maturity of the story.
Also the twist with Luigi and Dimentio made me so excited because, yeah, it was obvious who Mr. L is But what happened? And after he "died" we don't think it will have that big of a purpose again until BAM the finale comes.
And don't forget going back to the Sammer Kingdom and it being completely destroyed. A world with it's own history and citizens and life just wiped out of existence. It's as if it never even was. The Sammer guys don't even die, there's no bodies, they're just...gone. It's really eerie hearing the music they play when you go back too, it just adds an extra layer of creepy to it. And then the void. It looms in the background the whole game, silently growing larger and larger in the background while you play. And you know that worlds have begun to fall apart, so it makes you pressured to keep moving forward. Even on my 3rd playthrough of the game it still never fails to freak me out just a little bit. I definitely enjoy TTYD the most, but that doesn't make SPM a bad game by any means.
Guys there is a new Paper Mario and it is worthy and competent! As for the Pixls, I thought it was cool and added to the diversity brought up by TTYD. After all, SPM does take place in another dimension. For example, we know Francis was a big huge fan of the original 2 games (especially TTYD) and maybe Mario couldn't always live in 3D like usual because he got attacked by Count Bleck in Bowser's Castle. Maybe he was disoriented and got mentally impaired to the point that he lost dimensional perspective.
Personally, I think Super Paper Mario was a great game. The storyline was really interesting. It’s the third best paper mario imo. However, TTYD and N64 are better.
Honestly it's only a good game for it's story, the gameplay is slow, combat is bad, boring and much, much worse compared to its two predecessors, the bosses absolutely suck and are painfully easy and forgettable along with the puzzles being really lazy poorly made; also the game overall lost a lot of it's charm with removal of the partners you could fight with being replaced with these boring counterparts. The over-world isn't nearly as fun, colorful, well connected or lived in as Thousand Year Door had created and maybe it's just me but the music doesn't seem as catchy and original anymore either. Thankfully the villain is awesome and the story is done pretty well, though I have to disagree with it being the best in the series, I think Thousand Year Door has that honor but this game is definitely a close second! Technically you are right, it is the third best Paper Mario game on the series. However, Paper Mario 64 and Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door are both 92/100 and 96/100 games, respectively, while Super Paper Mario is like a 59/100 at best; a definite drop in quality. I mean it's above average, but if it wasn't for it's story it wouldn't even have that high of a rating. At least it's not like Sticker Star and Color Splash, which are both easily below a 40/100 rating...
I would have preferred a literal port of Paper Mario TTYD over Sticker Star. Even the original would have been better, since I never played it. I still loved Super Paper Mario though. It was different enough to separate it from the rest, unlike Sticker Star or Color Splash, which seem to attempt to be like the first two, but utterly failed.
Btw, people are making awesome mods for Paper Mario 64 as we speak! So once you're done with the game, go ahead and play the user created content for more of that Paper Mario content we rightfully deserve!
I don't see where those two are trying to be 64 and TTYD. even though I like Color Splash, it's certainly not trying to be the first 2. Color Splash is more like SPM where it wants to do it's own thing IMO.
The fact that you have more faith in an original you've never played than this new, modern, brainwash hollow crap that is being mass-produced warms my heart...
Ches Phendshil. I don't see how the newer ones are "Mass Produced" besides, There's multiple ways to play the older games. Despite Color Splash suffering from no original characters (aside from Huey) there's still charm to it IMO. can't say the same for Sticker Star since I didn't play that one.
"There's multiple ways to play the older games" Nope wrong to a degree anyways. Let's look at Paper Mario 64 where can it be played: 64 (cartridge), Wii (download), maybe Wii U (download). Paper Mario the Thousand Year: Gamecube (disk), Wii (Gamecube disk (and not the black family version since that doesn't play gamecube games)). Super paper Mario: Wii (disk), Wii U (disk). So that's (maybe) 3, 2, 2. So I have to disagree that's not multiple ways that's only a couple ways for all of them (with couple meaning literally 2 (except maybe the first Paper Mario if that is on the Wii U).
I played through super paper mario when I was younger and really enjoyed it, the game was legitimately challenging on the first go. And some of the tougher portions were incredibly satisfying to work through. The story wasn't half bad either, especially when you compare it to a typical Mario game. Overall it sounds like your giving the game a bad wrap because you wanted another thousand year door.
Although I disagree with the opinions your stated towards Super Paper Mario, most of your points are unfortunately correct. Paper Mario these days is hollow because Miyamoto wants to try new things to show off his consoles' capabilities and make Paper Mario more "family friendly". Because of this, the newer games are so dull and uninteresting. The first 3 games were amazing, even though I only played TTYD and Super. I watched two episodes of a Let's Play for Sticker Star and I grew so bored of it so quickly. Super Paper Mario's only two setbacks for me are the removal of turn-based battling and the removal of battle techniques Mario already knows on his own in the other platformers. I didn't really have a problem with the art style in Super in all honesty, but Nintendo is killing this franchise in favor of the Mario and Luigi series. I hate that Bowser is always the antagonist. He used to be a humorous and shaped character with his own unique personality in each of the game. He was always in the middle of things in the older games which I enjoyed a lot as a kid. I mean, Paper Mario used to be an emotional yet humorous game but now it's just dull for the sake of trying newer things and keeping it safe for younger kids. It's so sad that the series became this lifeless over the years and Miyamoto encourages change. He only pays attention to sales and not what the fans want. Miyamoto probably isn't even aware of how the sales were rigged towards Color Splash and Sticker Star because of the sales of the consoles themselves. The characters made Paper Mario more of an enjoyable experience. Even the Pixls from Super made the game partially interesting. Now we have this bullshit finite resources horsecrap that none of the old fans enjoy. Huey, Mario's only main partner in Color Splash, seems like a nice improvement. However, this doesn't excuse the lack of personality the newer games have. Having a different antagonist every time and feeling the emotion of each game is what made Paper Mario stand out and made it such a fun game. The only problems with TTYD were the confusing parts that you had little to no leads on. But even then, you can use Goombella if you're stuck and she can give you some kind of idea of where to go. Nowadays, more modern day 7 year olds and even gamers like the Game Grumps won't turn to these characters for advice because it isn't common in modern day games. The older games made you use your brain a lot more. Now the only thing you can think about in the newer installments are the amount of stickers you have left in your inventory. The death of Paper Mario might come soon, and Paper Mario is completely out-of-shape. Miyamoto ruined the original purpose of the game. And the only thing we can do is watch it burn in the fires of Nintendo.
I have a feeling people these days think that "Dull, plain, and boring" is "family friendly". Seriously, compare the kid games(like Paper Mario) and movies we had back then to the ones we have now. It seems like we're afraid to tell simple, but fun stories. That they're somehow "too complicated" now.
Sticker star had puzzles, they were just obtuse and not a challenge. The difficulty came from a scavenger hunt for 3D objects. Also why were there 3D objects, in a paper universe? The world may never know.
Sticker Star's puzzles were really easy. It was the wild, directionless goose chase to find the things that made it frustrating. You always knew what to do but had to search far and wide to acquire the tools to do so.
Good contribution of further arguments. I totally agree with your points also. I played Super Paper Mario and didnt liked it too, but this is where tastes is different for different folks.
This is pretty much exactly what happened to the Ratchet and Clank series, too! From being a little gritty and dark, for a kids game, to become some cutesy cookie cutter bullshit. Going from having a atleast mildly interesting story/stories, to some bullcrap that's generic as fuck and plain boring. Also, why remove cool and funny characters, to just using originals? It's so boring! I'm surprised Nintendo made the choice to basically downgrade the Paper Mario series. Like come on, their thing is being creative and pushing boundaries.
I get why you don't like Super Paper Mario, but I personally enjoyed it. My family had this tradition that when someone was playing a paper Mario game, that someone else would voice the characters. And my brother was the best at it! That made it a really fun experience for me.
My dad used to do JUST that with TTYD :P Goombella had a stereotypical Californian accent Never got Koops really good. I never could decide whether he should be whiny or dumpy Flurrie was an ostentatious Russian accent Yoshi seemed to be whiny, but another one we never got down. Actually, come to think of it, the voices were really only done with Goombella and Flurrie :P I did have them out the most.
What made Paper Mario so amazing was not just its interesting characters and comedic writing, but it was the creativity of the world you journey through. Mario is traditionally anchored by its predictable world formula - forest, sand, snow, fire, water levels that serve as a shallow thematic backdrop to what is in essence the same gameplay with no variety. Thats what made Paper Mario so amazing: variation. The Thousand Year door saw Mario scale a castle to slay a dragon, Mario explore an ancient tree in a grey and purple saturated wonderland, climb the ranks in a professional wresting circuit IN THE SKY (while exploring the dark and mysterious underside of the competition), have his identity stolen in a land of perpetual doom and twilight, shipwreck on a pirate island with a comedic crew of adventures, relax on a long train ride investigating a mystery inspired by "Murder on the Orient Express", convince a race of snow bombs to send him to the moon and then finally face the ultimate mystery: what was behind the thousand year door. How insanely fun it was to finish up a world and have no idea what was coming next. While the gameplay at the core is the same, I've never seen a formula of progression and storytelling so amazingly shift its pace and emphasise certain mechanics/gameplay styles all while keeping the macro experience so solid and consistent. You don't finish up the in forest world and then move on the sand world - you move onto something more unpredictable. Then sticker star comes and completely reverts to predictable and boring. Also, how Thousand Year Door treat Luigi and Bowser was absolutely perfect. Slotting those two plain characters into purely comedic roles was genius. Luigi has an offscreen adventure that is just drowned in cliches and it simply a shitter version of Mario's adventure. Bowser is jealous and insecure and is always one step behind. This is the first time I've seen Mario characters nail their potential and actually HAVE character. Thousand Year Door is one of the gaming industry's very best - and it is such a shame to see Nintendo systematically destroy one of the greatest and freshly unique spin-offs ever crafted. RIP Paper Mario
Super Paper Mario was definitely a good game. It does not however even touch Thousand Year Door. Some levels in SPM were just as creative as TYD - in particular the nerd's castle, the level where you run on the wheel and especially the genius heaven level. In those levels it felt like the creativity met the Paper Mario standard, but in every single other I did not feel the same. In TYD every level concept was perfect, in SPM, only some delivered the essence of Paper Mario. I also felt that some of the decisions they made in changing the mechanics of the gameplay were for the worst. A very solid game, but not close to a perfect one like TYD. I think we can all agree that SPM is significantly better than Sticker Star, though.
And gameplay wise, it’s very customizable, you can do risky or very safe straight forward runs using all partners you want and either focus on side quests that grant more power to you or go straight ahead. Unlike Sticker Star and specially ColorSplash where everything plays almost as if all was scripted and can only be finished in one and only one way, including battles, how you grow stronger, etc.
@@dustymcwari4468 I think the way Color Splash does it makes the game feel more open than it is. TTYD is just as scripted as the rest: because they're all scripted. Games like Mario 64 and, to an extent, Galaxy really let you explore different worlds. TTYD was quite straightforward, and while it did have a few elements of exploration, it really felt confined as to what you could do. My least favorite part about the original games was attempting to find the next chapter, since it was always hidden in an obscure area that was previously closed off. I'd always assume it was still unable to be accessed, since the NPCs were so adamant about not going that way earlier. This is why I like the structured formula of Color Splash, and how it always has you exploring these seemingly large areas, and the way they format it feels like you're actually finding these things and going to these places of your own accord.
Genericdude Also, the personality, creativity and charm seems to be better than both those games. Even the rabbis have gotten an improvement in this game. Your rabbis in your party have a different personality and are not the same and rabbids humour seems more varied this time. I didn't see them scream constantly and they seem a bit smarter than usual while still being dumb
My wish is that one day. Super Paper Mario' s story is remade with TTYD's gameplay. That would be awesome and I'm it would make it the best Paper Mario game of all . Who is with me?
How about taking the gameplay of TTYD, the element of a good story from Super Paper Mario and the visuals from Colour Splash? That’s my dream for the next Paper Mario game...
I didnt even play TTYD, only 64 PM. But from the looks it looks like an updated, polished and way better version of 64 PM. And I liked the shit out of it. Just by the looks, even from a person that didnt play any TTYD, it sure looks like a great game.
Minene Uryuu922 I PC Masterrace I Please, no spoilers! You're breaking the whole reason why others should play the game! I despise this annoying tendency to spoil the experience for others!
if u hav a decent PC get urself the Dolphin emulator and download the TTYD iso. UNLESS u want to wait and see if it will b added to the eventual Gamecube VC on Switch.
1 important Tipp i didnt know until my 3rd Playthrough , theres a badge shop , if you dont have much money you can always sell badges there its above the item shop
Someone warns him that being "innovative" is no excuse for removing the story, for making the battles useless (since enemies don't give EXP) and turning all NPCs into generic Toads.
What kind of rpg removes gaining experience points?! There's being unique and then there's being stupid. ALSO RPGS ARE ABOUT STORY. Don't give me that excuse that Mario is simple. Christ I never even played a Paper Mario game but good lord looking at paint dry sounds more interesting than playing SS.
I agree with you for the most part... but RPGs without experience can be done well, just look at the Mega Man Battle Network series and SaGa franchise, which are very freakin' awesome!... but yeah, Sticker Star & Color Splash do non-level based RPGs terribly.
The Qwertynator I think what we desire in "experience points" is actually anything that shows our character markedly better than when you started. From my experience in Sticker Star, the only thing that makes you better than when you started is the amount of coins you get from enemies and the time you put into disposable moves. In other words, nothing permanent sticks with you out of your own merit. You're forced to feel stronger simply by progressing in the game.
Exactly why Battle Network & SaGa do their non level based systems well! They give you a sense of progression one way or another. For Battle Network, it's new Battlechips, with many of them being stronger versions of existing ones, (Said stronger battlechips are balanced compared to the "weaker" variants by having less flexible chip codes that make them harder to combo with) and like Sticker Star, giving you more Max HP through that game's counterpart of treasure chests, called Mystery Data. SaGa gives your characters stat increases based on a mix of RNG and what actions you took in battle, being an overall vastly improved variant of the stat increase system found in Final Fantasy II. (You can't target your own allies to increase Max HP anymore)
To add to the Dissidia comment here, while a lot of people absolutely hated the transition from Chrono Trigger to Chrono Cross, it went from a traditional exp system to a star level system, which worked really well in my opinion, and as so; When you beat a boss in the story, you get a star level, and with it, a boost of stats that'd be enough to get you to the next boss fight without too much trouble, with maybe 2 or 3 small hp boosts from other random encounters, rarely a free strength or resistance stat point. This is why speedruns of CC revolve more around getting equipment and using good elements (read: spells in this game). No grinding is ever involved! As for Paper Mario, I wholeheartedly agree with the badge concept. As I've been slowly playing the game for a friend who has never played or seen the series for herself, I started with a 10HP Mario in TTYD, and as soon as I got to the Chapter 6 interlude, I went and lowered my HP to 5 in exchange for more BP (No, I'm not running Danger Mario with damage, only a few damage reduction and dodge chance badges, I refuse to let myself use more than one power rush badge and cheese the game) to show her how by just utilizing every one of my allies and the badges I collect allows me to beat TTYD with only 5 HP. It's great stuff and is why I hope that maybe, eventually, they can come back to the Paper Mario 1 & TTYD gameplay
The Qwertynator People hit their own allies in FFII? I guess that works, but I had way more fun doublefisting shields or chilling in the back row. There was something fulfilling about boosting your evasion enough to never get hit by a physical attack again. Waffersforever It's been a while since I played through Chrono Cross, but level up systems that nerf grinding are annoying in their own way, too. I like to have the freedom to either play smart utilizing the battle system properly OR grind an hour and fly through the next few stages. Take Final Fantasy V, which has a rich job class system. You can balance your team buffers like chemists and healers, or grind with berserkers (the original auto-battle) and stay an extra 5 or so levels higher to mow down the opposition. Chances are you'll do a bit of both. This is also why we need to go back to games that stock a few wildly expensive items to appease the grinders. Outfitting myself with the best equipment before entering new areas was one of my favorite parts of Dragon Warrior (aka Dragon Quest) as a kid. This is probably one of the few things that Sticker Star preserved well: you can stock your sticker book with powerful stickers and squash bosses through pure carnage.
Especially old art style. Thank you for mentioning that. Granted the first three games each had their own unique art styles from the others but they still looked similar. They are beautiful and should be revisited.
already happened and ignored man, also YES the graphics doesn't need to be a main focus if there is another PM game. Graphics nowadays is a distraction.
Wrong VistaGunner while it's possible that they might achieve nothing that's not to say that making them is pointless since there are examples of petitions achieving what they were aiming for. Also with some that the companies might ignore it can even point out severe problems in the industry that the company chooses to ignore.
I don't think philosophy-wise it was the turning point. Even with an entirely different gameplay it felt like a complete Paper Mario Series game to me thanks to its characters, storytelling, dialogue. On the other hand Sticker star had the gameplay but didn't feel like a Paper Mario game; unlike 99.9% of world population I like the game but not as a Paper Mario series game, it was totally a New Super Mario Bros. game, with the characters, atmosphere, items...
I don't think it really was, I think they just wanted to try something new, as said in the video they were going back to the roots of the franchise until miyamoto threw his two cents in.
To me it follows the pokemon series. Gen 1-2/ 64: were the original story/ stories that stood initially alone Gen 3-4/ TTYD: made several small differences but kept it relatively the same for newer players to enjoy and older players to hold onto. Gen 5/ Super: took the concepts, made unique tweaks and focused more on story that, at the time, was poorly received by the public. Gen 6/ Sticker Star: began focusing on style over substance and used more gimmicks continuing onwards while giving people what the fans thought "a proper game" from the series deserved. Gen 7/ Color Splash just had them say good enough, make more a decent entry and send it out knowing people will still buy it.
I can’t deny that the newer games have really cool effects and art, but I’m so uninterested in anything past Super Paper Mario that I can’t seem to bring myself to play them. Seems like I’m not missing out on much, but it makes me sad that this series fell apart. I love the Paper Mario games so much, my first introduction being through TTYD. My first copy was actually broken to the point that it would stop working every time I went down to the sewer area to get the sun and moonstone (yes that early on), but I would keep replaying up to that part because I loved it so much. That visual whenever you first enter the thousand year door room always brought me to tears...I want that again. I want an experience where I’m brought in by the beauty of a game just by looking at a goddamn door.
ugh...that Miyamoto interview still makes me wince. There hasn't been an rpg since to fill the void paper mario left, but Odyssey has done some interesting things with the general Mario universe that makes me wonder if Nintendo's returning to being experimental with gameplay elements of olden times. Reaching, I know, but I'm looking for anything to re-ignite my hope that we'll get a TTYD 2.0.
@@jaydenc367 I mean normally when someone says something is overrated, particularly in regards to something that is genuinely loved and favored by 99% of people, they offer evidence or points of reason as to why. Otherwise they just come across as edgy or seeking attention. Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door is genuinely and objectively a masterpiece, I could list reasons as to why it's a fact and not an opinion. Me personally I think it's the best in the Paper Mario series overall, since it improved everything Paper Mario 64 did and then some. So I'd really like to hear your reasoning man, love a good debate/discussion with someone!
I see a lot of people saying people only liked the old PM games due to nostalgia but as someone who was new to the series and recently completed all games. SS and CS were dull compared to the previous for these personal reasons. i wont include reasons named in the video about it because I already agree with them, all of theses are about sticker star and color splash: - *Enemies died too quickly and easily,* because there was no level system, mario was OP. and it didnt help that he could jump on one enemy 5 fucking times, and unlocking more sticker slots with the lotto (which was pretty much every time since there was an overabundance of coins. it pretty much means the end of the battle. so fighting enemies got tiresome - *the koopalings as bosses in CS* i fucking hate them - *Boss Battles had to be ended with things and had other cheap means of winning (infinity jump).* when I first got to the pokey boss and saw his health, i got happy and thought "finally, an enemy that I can have a normal battle with that wont last 10 seconds." but after doing damage he healed so i fought til i ran out of stickers, later realizing that I needed a specific thing sticker and further realized that I could take out the boss fast with the right OP stickers. so it was either defeat the boss in the intended way or defeat him using cheap tedious methods. both of which end the battle fairly quick and didnt make boss battles feel special because it ruins turn base battles when one character gets to attack a single character multiple times and still have more consecutive turns unless enemies have this ability instead of the actual player - *the overused paper theme.* i know it was discussed in the video but i hate how the backdrop and every element in the game (SS and Colorsplash) tries so hard to tell you that everything is paper, and IMO it really ruins the visuals to make everything cardboard and paper cut outs and everything responding in a paper fashion. PM, PMTTYD, and SPM all treated their designs as a style but in the newer games its become more literal - *The sectioned world.* I dont like the idea of the super mario bros style level selection, for example: forest level 1-1.... completed mario appears on the world map and moves to the next little blue circle, forest level 1-2, completed so on and so forth. it makes the game feel linear and empty, i dont remember any villages except in the toad town hub and there was no room for exploration. now SPM SORTA ran into this issue for me, but i forgave it for the fact that it had a 2d focused gameplay with a 3D ability and it would be hard to implement a full immersive world in 2D but you could still explore in that game. - *Partner relationships were too forced.* Kersti and Huey weren't that memorable. these were two conveniently important characters capable of giving mario the correct power to 1v1 the main boss from the start who found mario and forced themselves on him because the story asks for it to keep the ball rolling. previous PM partners were regular joes who had no significant importance. you had to gain their trust or they join you for a greater good. Kersti was a shiny sticker capable of combating the king sticker, and Huey was some sort of guardian of the paint stars if i remembered correctly. and both games make them try to make the game emotional by making a sacrifice for mario with the tired speech "even though weve been through some rough times we had a lot of good times together, thanks" blah blah, and expect us to feel sad when the character never really DID anything or gave any real background on themselves to make us understand them better or any good reason to make sacrificing their lives for mario more rational. Tippi, practically a nobody who isnt some pompous character or some underlying key is the only PM character that seemingly sacrificed her life for a good reason and it wasnt just because she and mario shared good times. she did it for herself, blumeire, and the world. she use to be a regular human who realized her own importance in the plot as she regains her memories throughout the chapters. THATS as relationship and character development - *Too mario focused.* mario is the main focus of the newer PM games which wasnt the case, even in PM64. that game seemed more interested in the problems that lie with marios partners and the star sages. TTYD was the same but implied more focus about the world around him, and SPM focused more on tippi and blumeire im sure there are more but id have to think harder. these are just off the top of my head that i noticed only when playing SS and CS.
I like to contrast the Tower Power Pokey boss from Sticker Star to Hooktail from TTYD. Tower Power Pokey Hp: 300 Def: 75% damage reduction when in full form (0 when toppled) - Immune to hammer attacks with spikes out. Attack: 7 Tower Power Pokey was designed to be beaten with the use of the baseball bat, otherwise you will just suffer as he heals away your damage and attacks you (probably crumpling you so you can't attack). You can beat Tower Power Pokey without the bat, but this is so excruciatingly time consuming having to gain the high powered stickers that the game is effectively telling you "Give up and come back". The issue is, you don't fully know what Thing Sticker is going to be used in the environment, or what thing sticker is going to be used against a boss until you begin the fight, at which point it's too late, you're probably going to die. Compare this to Hooktail however: 20 Hp Atk: 5 (Decreases by 1 for every hit mario lands whilst having the Attack FX R badge equipped) minimum of 1 Def: 1 (As above) minimum of 0 You are perfectly able to battle hooktail even without finding the Attack FX R badge and win, even with Hooktails effective 30 Hp and the fact you're probably only going to be able to deal 3 damage per turn (2 from upgraded goombella/koops + 1 from mario hammer attack) unless you skillfully use badges and guard commands/items. If however, you've been paying attention to the story, you will realize that Hooktail "Hates things that begin with Cr- and end with -icket ... such a thing exists somewhere in the castle". Low and behold there is an auspicious badge in the castle which gives you a sound effect which can be tested in the field which makes a cricket noise. This drops Hooktails high stats (for the second main boss in the game - after Blooper) to much more manageable levels, giving you survivability, whilst simultaneously reducing hers. The only clue you get for Pokey is the general design of the place resembling a stadium and the fact it says "Play Ball!" rather than fight. But again, unlike Hooktail where you can use customization to actually fight a boss even without the correct equipment; the resistances, debuffs and health total is so high, that you're probably going to die unless you fight it the way the game wants you to - even if you played the game many times before so as to become a master of it. I wager more people will have performed Pre-Hooktail Pit of 100 Trials runs vs a 200 Hp, 2 Def, 8 Atk, Bonetail and won, than will have completed Tower Power Pokey without the baseball bat/effective thing sticker. ____ Sticker Star is just poorly designed in all areas of combat: Fighting should come with some form of strategy in turn based battles. The ideal, of course, is to be able to finish it in one turn (due to player 1 advantage where player 2 will die if player 1 attacks first [and kills them]), however, due to enemies having different effects, resistances, hp and so on, this is often difficult. Consequently, you need to choose the best tactics to slowly imobilize or remove enemies systematically to reduce the damage you take, and maximise the damage you deal. PM/TTYD had a variety of badges which allowed you to customise how you fight, from quake hammer/multibounce hitting multiple enemies, to firedrive inflicting a debuff, to power plus simply giving you 1 more attack power. Different skills in different situations allowed you to fight however you chose, but being able to fight suboptimally and still win. SS does not afford you this luxury except in everyday combat (which is as mentioned in the video, and pretty much everywhere online with any combat reviewer worth their salt). The combat becomes tedious because you pick the most powerful option you have to end the fight in one turn (so you don't take unavoidable damage), and then either avoid every enemy you see, or keep stocking up on this same item so you can finish every battle the same way. Sticker Star isn't a rewarding experience to play. I even let a friend borrow it for... 4 years(?) which is the only game from a sizeable collection to be gone for anywhere near that length of time without me being somewhat concerned about whether I'd get it back.
KeatonTS I always thought super was rly fun and it is still a great game in my eyes but after playing the other original paper Mario’s it is really fun
KeatonTS the koopalings eventually get some more actual character development attention and ya'll still hate them lmao I like them in CS but I do think they should have tried doing original bosses again, a bit of adjusting to the storyline and maybe CS could have been better, maybe not ttyd good but like SPM without the epic story I guess??
24:56 “Oh, who am I kidding? I can’t outlaw straws. Because then only outlaws will have straws” Topkek, a Paper Mario game using an alteration of the basic civilian gun ownership argument.
The moment you mentioned that Miyamoto wanted only established characters from Super Mario World, I was officially mortified. Then you told me Bowser was mute in Sticker Star and I had a fucking heart attack.
That Kid Called AJ but the reason that happened is because someone made a good sonic fan gam Nintendo sues people that make fan games not hire them to make games. A mania Mario game will never happen as well as Pokemon and probably Zelda too.
Well, the new CEO is younger, maybe he can understand what we're saying and... You know... Fix the fan game problem and remove games that actually rip off games on mobile.
Colour splash is such an uninspired name too. I can type thousand year door and get relevant results, whereas you cant type color splash on its own to get relevant results :/ if thats another point that reinforces that the new games have no soul if that makes sense
Sare. I think "Paper Mario: Prism Island Adventure" or whatever would be a better name. I can't exactly speak for Sticker Star having no soul since I haven't played it. but from what I've played of Color Splash, it seemed to me that it had charm and soul. it's just altered to fit the Papercraft artstyle and paint gimmick.
Jeremy Knight The paint gimmick and artstyle don't add soul to the game. The characters were forgettable and the story was generic. That said it isn't a Paper Mario game at all. It could've been a great standalone title if it didn't have the Paper Mario IP plastered over it. And "Prism Adventure" still sounds generic. Games that actually imply the plot in the title are much preferable. Like all Zelda games before BOTW and the first two.
21:57 The sequel to that game will be called Paper Mario: Scribble Scrap, where Bowser uses the pencil of doom to scribble over the world of Paper Mario (and he kidnaps Peach, of course). Mario gets saved by a sentient, floating eraser named Shavey, and the two set out to rescue Peach and save the world. The gimmick of the game is that you use a limited supply of drawings to attack (drawings are exactly the same as stickers and cards, but the game wants you to think they're different). It's so easy to come up with a Paper Mario game now lol.
I'd love it if they brought back the Shadow Queen. she's my favorite Paper Mario villain... But yeah, DImentio's cool too. he's my 2nd favorite Paper Mario villain.
Although I personally really enjoyed super paper mario, I can fully understand the criticisms you have for the game. I really do belive that the story itself held up with just the four pc's. And I can't agree more with the quote for sticker star being "having a finite resource as your only method of attack is a terrible idea" even though I believe that there is some way that it could work out. I can't think of it on my own, but I feel like its something that could work in a game where the battles aren't nearly as useless, long, drawn out, and repetitive.
Guess what game has a far better and more complex battle system than Sticker Star's, yet shares a somewhat similar premise? It's called the Megaman Battle Netwok series. The Megaman Starforce series also has something fairly similar as well.
It works in BotW, where even though you have a finite supply of weapon durability (aside from chucking bombs), you'd pretty much have to deliberately TRY to run out of weapons at any point after you leave the Plateau.
Mikey I mean... You could maybe watch a silent walk through (It's worth the spoilers (in case you don't waste money)) maybe only 1 part and see the battle system and some RPG elements and conclude if you find it like the original. Personally, it's the greatest game I've ever played and I automatically recommend to anyone that they play it. And an awesome thing is that there's a lot of secrets and things to do after the game including the 100 trials (VERY difficult). Speaking of difficult, this game is HARD. Especially the last boss.
Just play it my dude. After the first 10 minutes of it you will see why fans (Including myself) have begged for Ninty to go back to this style for the past 13 years. I *still* hold it as not one of my favorite Mario games, but games of all time.
Paper mario: Good Paper Mario TTYD: amazing Super paper mario: semi good Paper Mario sticker star: pretty bad Paper Mario color splash: shouldn't be considered a paper Mario
Ehhh I think you should put Sticker Star as horrendously bad and then put Color Splash as pretty bad since color splash was at least better than sticker star.
Honestly, I have a hard time believing Miyamoto is 100% to blame for this. How does "Can you use characters from the Mario family?" equal every NPC being a soulless lazy Toad re-color? Mario has Goombas? Koopas? Magikoopas? Lumas? Piantas? Sprixies? Or even Toads with unique designs. Or at the ABSOLUTE least, throw in a few Toadettes. I understand he said during the early stages, Sticker Star was "Just a port of TTYD" but how does that explain Color Splash, which is practically a port of Sticker Star? What I'm getting at here is these claims of what Miyamoto did seem too contradictory, if he really is the cause of all of this then I'm sorry but he's officially lost his mind.
Minene Uryuu922 I PC Masterrace I Personally, I don't mind the series not being an RPG. I loved Super Paper Mario. I just don't get why it has to be soulless garbage.
pff miyamoto is probably one of my biggest thorns in the eye towards nintendo. besides he has become more of a stuck up poster boy in like look its the guy that made that plumber which is actually a bland character if you ever took a closer look at him.
It's not just Miyamoto. Kensuke Tanabe is also to blame for his lack of knowledge on the first three Paper Mario games, which he admitted knowing next to nothing about. Despite that, he has a big say on the development of the Paper Mario series.
It's funny how Miyamoto called for the Paper Mario games to offer new gameplay instead of refining the old turn based system, yet also calls for every Mario game to have the same, old enviroments, story and characters. Even Odyssey is pretty tame and it's the most refreshing Mario game in awhile. I would like to say Miyamoto is killing the interest in Mario, but people will still accept and eat up mediocrity. It sucks, bad.
I see a different purpose in odyssey. I honestly didn't enjoy it very much, but one thing stood out: the fact that bowser and peach got married. Again. Last time it happened, it resulted in the end of all worlds, and I don't think Bowser is stupid enough to forget all that ever happened. I think this was proof that Dimentio is alive and well, ressurecting the chaos heart to use when the time is right. He seemed way to confident when he died, and he literally showed us that he still had power after death. The Ultimate Show was a suicide mission.
@@SpaceLobster21 I think it's entirely possible that Dementio is still alive. Like you said, he could have easily planned the Ultimate Show as a suicide mission considering how smart he is.
@@SpaceLobster21 well, The Dark Protagnosticus (I dont know how to Write) Was Stopped, So maybe now they can Marry and Nothing will Happen And sorry if my English is Bad
Super Paper Mario had one of the most deep and dark and also hilarious stories of any Mario game, Paper or not. The gameplay might have been subpar but everything else made up for it. I agree with the most recent games but I just can't even see how Super Paper Mario was any worse than the first two.
I'm playing through it for like the 10th time and the gameplay is starting to get to me. You can kill the final boss in two hits and remember that please guy? That's one of the worst parts in the game, if not the fucking worst. I want to know how many people said to him "Fuck you" instead. Then you got the prison where you got to hold right for ten minutes. And they purposely designed maps that you got to climb so if you fuck up you got to start all over again just in an attempt to lengthen the game. You also don't just have maps that purposely lengthen the game you also got levels that if you know that you're doing will be over within 2 minutes. If they had made this game an RPG this could have been the best Paper Mario to date but nah we got this. Impressive how I put up with this for like 10 maybe plus times ey?
I forgot the worst thing of all. The pit of 100 trials in flopside. The main goal of that thing is to waste hours of your time and leave you with disappointment. I guess they forgot that games were supposed to be fun multiple times in the making of this game.
I remember liking Super Paper Mario when it came out. Then years later when I replayed it I absolutely loathed it. Awful game play and unappealing abstract visuals.
Zeldedede Ab9 I liked the sound, the catch cards collection and the 2D to 3D aspect(don't wanna see it again though...) But yeah, the game can't compare to the two originals, they had partners with their own backstories and humors after all...
Super Paper Mario is not a Paper Mario game with "Super" in the title. It's a Super Mario game with "Paper" in the title. I like it much better that way. However, I can see how putting "Paper" in the title makes Paper Mario fans upset. I pretty much agree with everything you say, though.
Paper Mario games don't feature side-scrolling levels with a goal at the end that leads to a loading screen. Super Paper Mario does. They're completely different genres. Also note the point counter in Super Mario games also appears in Super Paper Mario.
I hate it when people throw Super Paper Mario into the same bucket as Sticker Star and Color Splash. Yeah, the game had a different style of Gameplay and no interesting partners, but it still felt like a true Paper Mario game at heart. The reason there weren't any "real" partners is because the game had 4 main playable characters, and it focused on their development instead. Each chapter still had a very unique setting, and I would argue that the story and the villains are the most interesting and engaging that the series ever had. So calling SPM an "empty shell" really isn't fair towards the game imo.
And the gameplay was still really fun and engaging. It was still an RPG because of all of the RPG elements in its gameplay. The only difference is the different battle system. But as it was meant to be a one time change to avoid stagnation and be fun and invigorating for its new gameplay style there's no way I can hold anything against it. It is a true Paper Mario game.
So people aren't allowed to criticize SPM at all? I don't know where people get this idea the game can't be criticized. Super Paper Mario had more issues outside of the removal of turn based combat system. In fact I think that to be a unique change of pace, even if I do prefer the older game's style. The cryptic puzzles, repetitive combat that lacks diversity, any character who isn't Count Bleck, Tippi, The Nimbi's, Jaydes, Mimi, O Chunks, Dimentio, Nastasia, Merlon, Norlem, Flint Craigley, Croacus, Francis or Merlee had no personality or there wasn't enough NPC to diverse each world. ( in fact aside from Chapter 5 and 7 none of the levels had interesting NPCs) I also feel some aspects of the level design and game design itself were counter intuitive. Like the Pit of 100 Trials (Flopsides) Sammer's Kingdom was poorly designed. And the Pixels were complete blank slates. Peach, Bowser and Luigi's usages aren't well balanced. I still like Super Paper Mario in spite of all of this. I do like the gameplay aside from the fact it hardly has any skill to it aside from mindlessly goomba stomping or using a Pixel/Item. I do like the interactions between the characters who do develop. And I do like the atmosphere and music. And of course the story is a no brainer. I do like it as much as the first two games
Interesting enough, Super Paper Mario is more of a real Paper Mario game than the new Paper Mario games. If you ignore the fact that Super change the gameplay up to be a hybrid of platformer/RPG, Super Paper Mario is actually a successor of 64 and TTYD that capture the same spirit as these two games.
I will point out in color splash, the only thing bowser wanted a colorful shell and he accidentally mixed the paint.. Then paint possessed him causing him to become evil.
Sticker star is the only mario game I traded in halfway through. If they ported Paper Mario 64 or Thousad Year Door into an HD version for the 3ds, I would've bought multiple copies and recommended it to EVERYONE. If they were worried about it being a straight up copy of the older games, they could've made a new afterstory for it. It would have sold SO MANY COPIES!
You summed up and articulated all of my thoughts so perfectly (except that they should no longer use TTYD designs), what a great video. Do more of this kind of video and I'll sub for sure.
I found you via the Pro Crastinators, and I've been loving the sound of your voice ever since. Like I will literally watch anything from you just because of those buttery smooth vocals. That's not to diminish the merit of your work, however, I do end up appreciating what you have to say as well. But damn, them cords.
The best Paper Mario game was on the best system, the GameCube. I think Nintendo took chances, because the GameCube was a very unpopular system, and didn't sell well, so Nintendo made what they wanted, and enjoyed playing. And you didn't even mention the non-story aspect of TTYD, which is awesome! There's so much to do, and I have yet to 100% it. And you didn't mention the badge aspect either! Wearing badges upgrades Mario, so he can do a wide variety of moves, and also add new costumes like Luigi, Wario, and wearing both together for Waluigi!! Plus the most immersing story of any game I've played yet, which I won't write, because I'll be here a while. I feel like you, and other bigger RU-vidrs should talk about how good the game is, because the GameCube was so unpopular, and TTYD feels really underrated, or unplayed. However, all the people that HAVE played it, loved it, because of it's direction! I loved collecting every single Crystal Star, because the world's were so immersing, and unique! As well as looking forward to doing the short, but sweet Bowser segments. Even as a little kid, not old enough to understand diolague, I still had a ton of fun with the perfect mixture of both. And now,replaying it, I can appreciate the story, and get a good chuckle from the diolague. I basically just wrote you a script, but I had to say every bit of this, because I love this games so much. And the sad part is, Nintendo actually KNEW that this, with Sunshine, and other titles on the best system(the GameCube) needed to be played, so originally they ported the system's over to the Wii, with GC controller ports on the side, and GC games support, but stopped development on it, and made the "Wii Mini" or whatever. In conclusion, I can see how much you love the game, and how much every person who plays it loves it. Nintendo seems to be heading in a 5 year old direction, rather than a still family direction, but ballsy enough that even adults can enjoy it. I just want everyone to know how good this game is, so they can buy it, play it, and enjoy it. So if you could make a video on how great it is, and possibly contact other RU-vidrs on the subject(no shoutouts to me), I'd appreciate it. I want to be able to talk about the game with people, without having to explain every aspect. Thanks.
There was a bit of backlash with Superstar Saga 3DS where people complained that the traditional mario enemies looked closer to their New Super Mario Bros designs, the Toads being Identical, removing characters such as Geno, psycho Kamek and the Skeleton Donkey Kong and replacing them with a computer voice, Dr Toadly, (who didn't appear until Bowser's Inside Story) and a standard skeleton soldier. some fans also felt that the current artstyle introduced in Dream Team made the remake not as charming as the original. Intelligent Systems could do simillar things if they decide to remake 64 or TTYD.
The original doesn't need that artstyle. It isn't fitting for the game nor the series as a whole due to it lacking any sense of variety or atmosphere to it. You can't tell me that Flower Fields, Lava Lava Island, Plesant Path, and Star Haven would look better with the materialistic aesthetic from Color Splash. It would benefit nothing to make everything look and feel like a novelty shoebox diorama. You can't have an atmosphere like something like Boggly Woods from TTYD when everything in the game looks the same and lacks any restraint in its execution. The aesthetic of Color Splash isn't an improvement on the aesthetics of the previous games in any way. It's in HD and is really shiny at times but it has a lot of problems both as a suit for the series and in how it was executed in those games.
TheZeldaExperienceWithin. Hmmm. I can see what you mean. What do you think of the artstyle from Dream Team and Paper Jam being used in Superstar Saga 3DS?.
You gotta admit, Super Paper Mario was excellent at what it did. I wouldn't call it a paper mario game besides the ability to "flip" but it still had a great story and l lots of fun things to do.
I actually welcome Super Paper Mario to be called a Paper Mario game. Super Paper Mario is more of a sequel of the first two games than Sticker Star, Color Splash, and Origami King.
Paper Mario is about adventure, almost like you're being told a story Mario and Luigi focuses on the brother's relationship and the trials they go through to protect the world
