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Why Doesn't God Simply Destroy Sinners in Hell? / On Annihilationism 

Orthodox Banter with Bojan
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Music: "Apocalypse" by SYBS (via RU-vid Audio Library)

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3 янв 2019

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Комментарии : 85   
@the.nerd.within
@the.nerd.within 5 лет назад
I keep on coming back to the sermon from my priest on Judgement Sunday two weeks prior to Great and Holy Lent. He said, it is not God who will judge you, but your heart will finally be exposed and in essence your choices and who you truly are and who you have ultimately chosen, which will condemn you to Hell. Not God.
@bradleyhauf5458
@bradleyhauf5458 4 года назад
HE is the judge jury and executioner, therefore HE will cast judgement... its for the protection of himself and those that are his chosen people...
@DiMacky24
@DiMacky24 2 месяца назад
​@@bradleyhauf5458God does not require protection.
@seronymus
@seronymus 5 лет назад
Very poignant and informative video, thank you. We undervalue the weight of our choices in this life
@nickolaospappas4485
@nickolaospappas4485 5 лет назад
Pls tell me that the dragon will be in a video about Revalation? Great vid btw
@BanterWithBojan
@BanterWithBojan 5 лет назад
Yes it is, the seven headed dragon of the revelation, will post image today most probably :-)
@nickolaospappas4485
@nickolaospappas4485 5 лет назад
@@BanterWithBojan Oyy can you do a video about The end times. I mean about the post tribulation that we orthodox hold. You know no rapture and other stuff. Να σε ευλογει ο Θεος
@70AD-user45
@70AD-user45 5 лет назад
@@nickolaospappas4485 The biblical end-times were fulfilled in 70 AD when apostate Old Covenant Jerusalem and the temple were destroyed in divine judgement.
@70AD-user45
@70AD-user45 5 лет назад
@@BanterWithBojan Annihilationism is what the Old Covenant Hebrews believed. The idea of an eternal fiery hell comes from Hellenism. The correct New Testament translations are Sheol and Gehenna which are very different concepts to hell. The KJV mistranslated Sheol into hell which is were hell was invented.
@eldermillennial8330
@eldermillennial8330 4 года назад
You related to anyone in the construction business in Cheyenne Wyoming? It seems like half the Orthodox Congregation there is a Pappas.
@artix548
@artix548 4 года назад
I don't know all of Orthodox theology, but this one you definitely got right. Without knowing what annihilationism was, I was a heretic for all of 10 minutes. If the soul was annihilated, it would mean that people like Aleister Crowley, Caligula, De Molec- I mean De Molay, Jezebel, Hitler, Joseph Stalin, etc. would have the satisfaction of only having to suffer God's judgement for a set period of time and then no longer be in the presence of the God they hated. And also as you mentioned, Yahweh is the Creator, not the Destroyer.
@bradleyhauf5458
@bradleyhauf5458 4 года назад
He is the creator yet he still destroys... this is his right, not the right of that which is against... God of life, not destruction, yet he still retains that he is who he is and executes his will with the help of his reverent followers given the authority...
@storba3860
@storba3860 Год назад
I understand the belief that God loves His creation too much to destroy it but I don't think this is a very good defense of ECT because sometimes love means ending someone's suffering. We love our dogs but when they get so sick and are in so much pain that they're completely beyond our help we have enough love in our hearts to put them out of their misery. That's my take anyway but I was also raised Annihilationist so I have a tendency toward it. Barring that we also know that God was able to change Saul's heart so I don't see why given enough time He would be able to do that even to the people who hate Him.
@berniegran4785
@berniegran4785 4 года назад
People in n hell can still be saved by our prayers , that's why God doesn't destroy then.
@traditionalfascists3303
@traditionalfascists3303 4 года назад
Temesgen Abraha it’s much easier to be saved on earth than in hell
@Catahract
@Catahract 5 лет назад
Hmmm, I had a discussion with a Orthodox theologyan the other day. He told me that the second hell is not forever. There is a context of ''Time'' even there and that it will end some how, eventually.
@70AD-user45
@70AD-user45 5 лет назад
It's called the second death, not the second hell (from Revelation). The second death is an eternal annihilation (no fiery torment in hell).
@bradleyhauf5458
@bradleyhauf5458 4 года назад
six thousand years mate, then those cast out will be permanently destroyed... understood? this is real and will happen... destroying every piece of their material and non-material substances... their components, even the remembrance of them will be blotted out...
@beognis9412
@beognis9412 5 лет назад
I have a question, Bojane. You can answer in serbian if you want. You say that, those who are against God and sin all they want are in Hell. Allright. But what about believers who want to draw closer to God, but keep falling back into sin. They want to stop sinning but they are weak. Sometimes they don't fall into temptation, sometimes they do. I am tired of going to my Priest and confessing the same sin over and over and over again. It seems I can't stop. I feel like there is no hope. All I just want to do, is to please God, but after some time I fall back and please the flesh instead. I hate this and my weaknesses. I am scared I will not be saved, because I can't get a grip. Sorry for the long text. Great Video as always.
@irene1234
@irene1234 5 лет назад
Beognis 94: Maybe these words will encourage you. "He that wrestles is still held fast but it is enough for him that he has not fallen. When we depart hence then and not till then, will the glorious victory be achieved. For instance take the case of some evil lust. The extraordinary thing would be not to entertain it at all, but to stifle it. If however this be not possible, then though we may have to wrestle with it and retain it to the last, yet if we depart still wrestling we are conquerors." -St. John Chrystostomos "God is loving to man, and loving in no small measure. For say not, I have committed fornication and adultery: I have done dreadful things, and not once only, but often: will He forgive? Will He grant pardon? Hear what the Psalmist says: How great is the multitude of Your goodness, O Lord! Your accumulated offenses surpass not the multitude of God's mercies: your wounds surpass not the great Physician's skill. Only give yourself up in faith: tell the Physician your ailment: say thou also, like David: I said, I will confess me my sin unto the Lord: and the same shall be done in your case, which he says immediately: And you forgave the wickedness of my heart." -St. Cyril of Jerusalem “We have within us deeply rooted weaknesses, passions, and defects. This can not all be cut out with one sharp motion, but patience, persistence, care and attention. The path leading to perfection is long. Pray to God so that he will strengthen you. Patiently accept your falls and, having stood up, immediately run to God, not remaining in that place where you have fallen. Do not despair if you keep falling into your old sins. Many of them are strong because they have received the force of habit. Only with the passage of time and with fervor will they be conquered. Don’t let anything deprive you of hope.”- St. Nectarios of Aegina "It is said, years ago at a monastery in Romania a party official who had a devout wife who liked to visit monasteries asked a monastic once what they did all day at a monastery. The monastic answered, "We fall down and get up again, fall down and get up again." Don't give up! Also, ask the Theotokos to help you! We all feel like you do at times. I feel like that a lot.
@beognis9412
@beognis9412 5 лет назад
@@irene1234 ​ Jonathan Morgan Thank you for your answer and sorry for the late reply. It's just that I thought repenting means to turn away from sin. Not to fall into it again and again and to confess it x times in your life. I thought this because of these verses. John 14:15 If you love me, keep my commands. Or Matthew 7: 21 - 23 Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many [a]miracles?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness. It is a devastating feeling just to think about hearing these words from God when you stand before him. I know that God loves us, but sometimes I feel fear and I am scared instead of love. I just can hope that God forgives my weakness that I can't defeat sin. But thank you for your encouraging words to both of you.
@irene1234
@irene1234 5 лет назад
@@beognis9412 I feel the same way you do, I could have written what you wrote. But I don't think the Lord was meaning those of us who struggle against sin repeatedly as workers of lawlessness. You hate your sin and wish you could stop. That shows that you have God in you or else you wouldn't care one bit. I think the Lord is willing to forgive us again and again, even of the same sin. "Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, “Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother who sins against me? Up to seven times?" Jesus answered, “I tell you, not just seven times, but seventy-seven times!" Matthew 18:21-22 He goes on later to say that what's even more important is to forgive those who have sinned against us as well. God sees your struggle. From what I gather, the Saints/Fathers say it's the struggle that the Lord sees and rewards. Eventually we may conquer and overcome it, but some sins we have to struggle to the end. I read that repentance is to turn to God and away from sin. Maybe there was a time in your life you sinned these sins and didn't feel bad about it. So now, you do feel bad. That's a huge step in the right direction. Does your spiritual father have any advice or penance that could help you? I looked at your YT page, do you still play those video games? They look kinda evil, I would stay away from those images/violence. The devil can get a stronghold if you involve yourself with that stuff, in my opinion. It could make it hard to have God's grace strong enough to fight sin if you surround yourself with that stuff.
@beognis9412
@beognis9412 5 лет назад
@@irene1234 Thank you for your encouraging words. Because of your words, I thought back when I was in a worse situation regarding sins. You are right. I sinned more in the past than I do now. Reading the Bible, going to Church, fasting, receiving Holy Communion, living in constant and daily prayer, forgiving others and to obey Gods word changed me for the better. Not in a single day, but through struggle and over time, I felt how my soul finds peace in the prayers I read from a prayer book. It's just that, let's say in the past I sinned a particular sin 30 times a day for example. And then turning to God and trying to obey his Word, today I sin let's say 3 times. And it bugs me that I still cannot reduce this three times to zero. I guess there is nothing I can do than to get up again as you said. Hoping that God forgives me my weakness. Regarding the advice from the spiritual father. Let's say he is a loving Priest, but also very busy. I seldom ask him questions, because I don't want to appear annoying. I am sure he doesn't think of me as annoying, but I still don't want to bug him for every little thing I want to ask. In times of temptation or other sinful behaviour, I grab my prayer rope and start to say the Jesus Prayer so long until my mind is calm. Atleast for me, a calm and God oriented mind is important. It is not of great use to not sin with your deeds, but your mind is troubled with sinful thoughts like a traffic jam in New York City. For me I found out, that constant prayer while being outside Church is the best thing I can do. And of course, reading scriptures. And about the video games. I uploaded this Videos two years ago out of curiousity. Just to see whether someone will see it. After uploading it, I lost interest and the channel stayed pretty much dead. Then here and now, I use it again for watching orthodox videos. Maybe it was not the best idea to mix those two things in one channel. Maybe I should clean up this channel. And yes, I still do play games occassionally. I am not the type that plays games 24/7, but I like some as a simple hobby. Don't worry about that, I still get enough sun and outdoor sport activities. It's just one hobby of many. I view games the same as alcohol, food, work/rest and so on. If it is enjoyed in moderation, I see no problem. Playing some games is fine, but if it's the only thing someone does, then it is a problem. Same with food. Food is delicious and healthy, until you eat too much and probably get out of shape or maybe even health problems. As long as God is on the first place in your heart and the most important in your life, you will recognize when you overdo it. Be it games, food, drinks and so on. God gave us a materialistic World to enjoy, but we may not value these things more than him. These materialistic things will vanish with time, but Christ is eternal. Bojan has a video about this. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-kT5hAk9DpNc.html Again, thank you both for your encouraging words.
@beognis9412
@beognis9412 5 лет назад
@@irene1234 Strange, I put a link in my comment. I'll copy it again. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-kT5hAk9DpNc.html If the link doesn't work, just type it in the search bar. "Bible Illustrated games". Then you should be able to find it. Bojan has also made a video and answered my question. Really nice of him. Here is the link. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-UIO9lFWaeKU.html Again, if it doesn't work it is called "Repeating the same sins over and over again" on his "hands" channel. And thank you for your story about the alcoholic monk. It seems that even saints and monks have individual struggles. It gives one hope, that God sees a man who struggles with sin instead of a sinner who doesn't care about it.
@greymane2090
@greymane2090 Год назад
One of the greatest things I struggle with understanding the process of conversion to Christianity is the idea of eternal punishment in a lake of fire, a burning eternity. Jews believe that when God created all things it was good and yes, there was a fall, but that, when a Jew dies, there is a period of time we could say rehab up to a 12 month period. The idea being that an eternity of punishment does not serve a good end. A punishment exists to be corrective. if I am misunderstanding, and have been told wrong, that hell is only separation from God and the suffering you experience is the complete realization of what you could have had as you roam outside the kingdom of God than that I could agree with.
@bensirach3586
@bensirach3586 5 лет назад
Does Orthodoxy have an official stance on Sports and other Athletics?
@orthoglobus
@orthoglobus 5 лет назад
All athletics are acceptable as long as they benefit our physical health and do not distract us from our relationship with God.
@annatham4591
@annatham4591 5 лет назад
Hi
@BanterWithBojan
@BanterWithBojan 5 лет назад
Hi
@randypittman279
@randypittman279 5 лет назад
Excellent answer. Thank you, I get caught in this type of thinking and this elucidates the matter.
@carissstewart3211
@carissstewart3211 5 лет назад
What is your opinion of people who believe that heaven will reflect the desires of the individual? So, for example, my mother-in-law believes that she will immediately receive a brand new body in heaven, unrelated to the body she has now, because that is her preference.
@carissstewart3211
@carissstewart3211 5 лет назад
@@TheRealRealOK thanks. I do believe in the Resurrection of the body when Christ returns at the end of time. My mother-in-law's viewpoint doesn't make sense to me: after all, here in the "real world" we are all bound by the same natural laws regardless of our personal opinions. Why should the next world cater to them? But I've heard far too many well-meaning people express that opinion. Like in that weird Robin Williams movie where his son turns into an Asian lady. 🤔
@orthoglobus
@orthoglobus 5 лет назад
@@carissstewart3211 ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-S6oQGfJYH3g.html
@70AD-user45
@70AD-user45 5 лет назад
@@carissstewart3211 There is no "end of time" in the Scriptures. The Scriptures say the end of the AEON or age. End of time is a mistranslation from the KJV.
@carissstewart3211
@carissstewart3211 5 лет назад
@@70AD-user45 I'm not sure what your point is, or even which passage you're referring to (I couldn't find the phrase "end of time" in the KJV). Nor is it necessary to slavishly use words and phrases pulled directly from Scripture. The Bible itself does not do that! Whereas the phrase "end of time" may not appear in Scripture, the Hebrew phrase acharit ha-yammim "end of days" does... several times. For example Isaiah 2:2. The Greek Septuagent translates this phrase as eschatais hamerais, a phrase picked up by St. Paul in 2 Timothy 3:1. (Eschatais is also where we get the word eschatology.) I don't know if Biblical Hebrew had a separate word for the concept of time, but I think it is fair to say that if there is an end of days, there is an end of time.
@70AD-user45
@70AD-user45 5 лет назад
@@carissstewart3211 The authors of the Old and New Testament had no concept of an "end of time". The Jews used to say "this age, and the age to come". "This age" was the age of Torah, the feast days, Sabbaths, the Old Covenant temple rituals etc. The "age to come" was the age of the New Covenant kingdom or the Messianic age. This is another way of saying the age of the corporate Body of Moses and the age of the Messiah or Body of Christ. There was a transition period of 40 years, from 30 AD (the cross) to 70 AD (judgement of apostate Jerusalem) when a righteous remnant of Jews/Christians were leaving the Old age and into the New. The eschatology of the Bible was only concerned with the end of the Old Covenant age of Israel or the age of Moses. This has already been fulfilled when the Old Covenant temple was destroyed in 70 AD. We are now in the New Covenant age of the Church which is the eternal kingdom prophecied in Daniel. The eternal kingdom has no end. There is no "end of time" in the Scriptures.
@Mrm1985100
@Mrm1985100 3 года назад
He does actually. The wicked will perish, disappear and be no more John 3:16.
@michakasprzak1371
@michakasprzak1371 2 года назад
No, they won’t perish. Mark 9:47-49; Rev. 20:10.
@Mrm1985100
@Mrm1985100 2 года назад
@@michakasprzak1371 Mark 9:47-49 is about corpses in gehenna where the fire never went out, not living people, read the OT background to the passage. Rev 20:10 is apocalyptic hyperbole and is explained as being the 'second death'.
@michakasprzak1371
@michakasprzak1371 2 года назад
@@Mrm1985100 So you belive that the fire in Gehenna will never go out even after annihilation of the wicked, don’t you?
@Mrm1985100
@Mrm1985100 2 года назад
@@michakasprzak1371 It's metaphorical language.
@SilvioSalieri
@SilvioSalieri 4 года назад
Rules, playing, you make it sound like role playing game. Why are we all forced into this ? Why put in people into this world that God knows He will have to punish ?
@timsetto
@timsetto 4 года назад
SilvioSalieri Life Ain’t Nothing But A Test.. those in hell had a choice , to either choose their creator or not... and they rejected the free gift of salvation. 🤷🏾‍♂️ but why are you on here asking those questions? Ask God to give you answers.
@SilvioSalieri
@SilvioSalieri 4 года назад
@@timsetto I've tried asking God, he does not reply. I don't know much about the Orthodox church and their view on salvation, I just viewed this video out of curiosity.
@timsetto
@timsetto 4 года назад
SilvioSalieri God requires ALL your heart when you pray to him.. Satan can stop your prayers if you sit in doubt while praying. God hears you bro, life is a test... every Christian had that time where we thought God wasnt there but he is. Life is a test Brother, God teaches you many things throughout life. & one thing is to Wait On The Lord.. brother, you have to wait on God his timing isn’t our timing. He lives outside of our time, so when you pray believe it’s already done & it’s gonna happen if it’s according to the will of God. Keep praying bro, ask him to make himself known in your life.
@timsetto
@timsetto 4 года назад
SilvioSalieri ask him that last part and mean it with all your heart and the God of Abraham, Isaac & Jacob will be yours also. & will begin to show you things & open your eyes to the things of this world.. it’s spiritual man, all spiritual. But once you enter the battle, Satan will come hard at you.. that’s why Christians go through a lot at times, God tests us and ALLOWS Satan to do whatever for a period of time to strengthen our walk with him.
@timsetto
@timsetto 4 года назад
SilvioSalieri salvation comes from believing in the Son & following the Son of God Jesus Christ, who also was God in the Flesh 2000 years ago reconciling the world to himself. Believing and accepting Jesus as your Lord and Savior
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