As weird as it sounds i learned to throw 360’s by incorporating the same power derrived in the footwork/placement used to do a spinning heel kick, it helps a whole lot on transferring the power into your throws!!
@@MattRobertsonDG both have a similar startup to generate spinning power through pivoting off your non dominant leg by stepping backwards at first if that makes sense lol (when you start your run up turning your left leg backwards), you do it in the vid
Great vid! Nice to see the enjoyment of the fun of the game... The k3 on that reko is the type of plastic. It's usually favored for putters as it is a bit grippier. I actually prefer the k1, which is probably on her other older reko. Cheers, never lose that joy!
@@csaintj420 thank you for the kind words! Ah that makes sense! It's quite a bit softer than most putter plastics I've felt. Oh nice, Corinne still putts with the yellow one which I think is K1 as well
@@00discgolf thanks! Glad you enjoyed it. Yeah it's nice she has some interest for sure, not as much as me unfortunately haha. You should come play here sometime!
Please let us know how this goes. I still think there's a ton of value in just throwing FH's with the techdisc a lot also. I work on controlling hyzer, nose, and elevation angles, and then at the end, I throw a few max efforts and try to get a speed PR. I started with a joke FH, but I hit a record speed of 65.5mph a few days ago. I'm 42, 5'8", never played sports in school. I totally agree with achieving general fitness first, but from looking at you, I think you've already got that.
@@sabrewolf479 thats absolutely awesome!! Yes I absolutely agree. I think that will work really really well. I just have really bad shoulder mobility from a bad golf injury and it hurts when I throw more than about 20 forehands in a day. So in order to throw better forehands and get my pitch count up I figured the first thing I need to do is do my best to sort the shoulder out and hopefully improve technique as I go. Hopefully after a couple weeks I can move on to throwing more forehands and see how that goes!
Max distance is fun and you gotta have fun when you play DG as well. Yeah ofc precision matters far more if you're in a competition but hitting a massive distance PR is just something special.
@@theoriginalbreadcrumb yeah you're not wrong! Angle control and hitting gaps has always come easy to me so all I care about is distance right now hahah!
Great stuff. I'm going to check out some of these drills you mentioned. I used to deadlift quite a bit when I was in my 20's and 30's, I feel like I should mention that if you start moving heavy weight during deadlifts the wear and tear on your lower spine can be pretty bad. There are good alternatives to deadlifting that will be less risky for your lower back and hip mobility down the road. Keep up the good work!
@@dominicelder9950 thanks for the support! I actually used to Deadlift a lot. My Personal Bests were over 200kg (440lb) and i only weighed about 60kg at the time. Im not lifting anywhere near that at the moment but I will always be careful to do what I can to avoid injury, but I always found for me, injury comes when my body is out of shape so I prefer to do them safely rather than hurt my back because im not as strong as I could be.
@@MattRobertsonDG I definitely agree that I get injured way more often when I'm not in shape. If I don't lift at least twice a week I get hurt everytime. I LOVED deadlifting in my 20s and 30s. Now in my mid 40s I'm dealing with spinal disc problems. I don't want to come off as an internet troll or anything.
@@MattRobertsonDG Hip thrusts for glutes, romanian deadlifts for hamstring and back are good alternatives that will put less torque on your lower spine. Bulgarian split squats are also real good for giving you the torture feel of a great heavy deadlift too! I've read that sumo deadlifting is less hard on the lower spine than conventional, but I never lifted sumo so I can't say from experience.
@@dominicelder9950 that's great! Yeah there's definitely a difference between people who just say "oh no you shouldn't do that, you'll be crippled when you're older" whilst at the sometime not working out a day in their lives, and someone giving genuine advice! Those sound good ill look into it. Most of my deadlifts are with a trap bar anyway as that focuses more on your legs than your back anyway, it's easier to have good technique and harder to cheat with your back
@@OptikDojo yeah I loved content like that too! So very happy I could share my thoughts after I finally had a break through. Especially since some of my points were unique I thought!
@@MattRobertsonDG Hmm. Why do you have to throw it all flat? Why can't you throw it all vertical off its edge and corkscrew it in the air during the throw?.
Smooth is far. Its all in the snap and angle of release. Never try to murder it.... 👌🎉 tournament disc golf is not about throwing far also its about accuracy. 👍
Tournament disc golf is about accuracy I agree. But getting your speed up is absolutely about trying to murder it! Then you have to find a balance of what is fast. In order to get more energy out you have to put more energy in
I like how you are taking practical steps towards improving your max distance. A note on the run up example in the video. You essentially came to a complete stop before your x step. I am no professional but I have been playing disc golf since the late 90s and PDGA tourneys since 2007. I agree that a run up is important but not as important as keeping momentum throughout the entire motion. If you only take a couple extra steps before starting your wind up you may see better results. I'm 5ft 8in and 47 years old still throw 400 or just under fairly accurately. I think its most important to find a disc that you can throw with max flight and glide for whatever arm speed you happen to have. For instance as I get older and am playing / practicing less than I was in my 20's and 30's, I AM NO LONGER TRYING TO BOMB OVERSTABLE MAX SPEED PLASTIC. Controlling less stable lower speed discs correctly will yield much better results with less effort. I throw a roadrunner much further than the champ destroyer i keep in my bag for utility hyzers.
@@chadharrod5246 very good advice here! I think this is exactly why my more aggressive run ups are sometimes slower but sometimes faster! But I do seem to be able to produce higher top speeds with it, I will try to focus on continuing to accelerate into the throw. I tend to do a lot better with more overstable stuff but I like the idea of trying some flippier stuff and seeing how it works out for me! Thanks for the kind words and the tips!
I love how you organized this video with the keys, going to help a lot of people see what's important for them to do in practice! 500ft 360 coming soon? 👀
If you are up for reading, perhaps this will help someone. I am 50 and have been playing for a few years now, but only really working on my throw for about 2 years. No official training plan, but I've been watching videos and videoing myself on and off and really thinking about the swing (a lot). I play ball golf and spent years working on my swing, with some lessons, video analysis, pounded a million balls, etc. I am figuring out the same things with both sports. Working on doing it right is way more important than pounding balls or chucking discs and expecting hours of unfocused practice to help. Read that over and over until you buy into it. I've had many aha moments in golf where a concept finally aligned with my feel, and I was instantly much better. I mean instantly able to hit further and way more consistent, and with the ability to repeat it. These moments are as good as sports has to offer in my book. Knowing in a moment that you will always be better, and knowing why, is amazing. So like ball golf, I had some moments in disc golf where I'd chuck one and my body happened to get the physics and form real close to what they should be, and the disc flew like it was an optical illusion to me. It is those moments that I am now chasing so they can be repeatable. From age 48-50 I have went from about 260' to 340' for max flat ground drives. I am consistent around 310-320, but I believe that is about to get closer to 340 soon. Why, because things are clicking now that I am taking the same approach I did with ball golf. I also see so much improvement I can make in my video analysis. Here is what helps me in both sports. Work backwards. Start in a perfect follow through, and rewind the swing. Almost every bad golf swing or disc throw ends with a follow through that tells the story. Whatever change you make, take it to and from the follow through and get the feel first. I've found that making a swing or throw with nothing more than the swing thought of getting to that good follow through feeling of being balanced, weight on front foot and fully rotated, often yields a great swing or throw. That doesn't fix everything, but it is a great start in learning to play with feel instead of just sets of rules to process. Now, I am adding some of those rules that everyone reading this has certainly read about, and here are the ones that are making an impact with my throw. 1) Coil & uncoil, don't lean back and then forward during this coiling (video yourself and you probably do that too). I've found this habit very hard to break, but the physics of it makes way too much sense, so I am going to continue mastering that. 2) Relaxed big muscles in arms and chest. The loose whip factor is real folks. 3) Beto drill is legit. It provides the feel that you need experience to believe. The throw is like a throttle that you slowly turn until a moment where you unleash it with all its furry. It took me a while to realize that this furry gets unleashed way later in the throwing motion than I thought. To me it is just after the power pocket and in my head almost feels like I am facing the basket with my chest when I am in the furry state. This forces good rotation and a big follow through. I feel that for me the big follow through is what is causing more spin, and spin absolutely adds distance and much more. If you've ever had a standstill throw that goes a mile but you really didn't coil much or reach back much, that is probably because you started a lot closer to the power pocket and therefore forced your body to add the furry at the last second of the throw, because it had no choice. 4) NOSE DOWN (or just not up), end of story. I still struggle with this, and there is no distance or control killer bigger than a nose up throw. Barely nose up is all it takes. I have watched every video known to man on the subject, and for me, the more I am playing and working on it, it is slowly getting better and better. No one thing is fixing it, but I feel that when I get the form and follow through right, the nose happens to also be better. I won't lie though, it is my biggest challenge in this game, and is the next aha moment I am waiting for. My first few years playing, I never knew that was a thing, and now it is the thing I think is the single most important factor in the throw. I blame my arm, natural hinge points, wrist flexibility and all that, but then I'll get one perfect, so I know that it is in me. When I watched the most recent video of myself, I was doing exactly what Matt shows where the disc and arm are not stable and flat during a full speed reach back and throw, but look great when I go slow in a mirror. So I am just looking to find the feeling I need to fix that, and I believe it will be the next aha moment for me. Man did I just type a lot. I hope someone finds something useful for their game buried in all this text.
Hey conversely i started reasonably young, am resonably athletic, and have very long levers. Stuck under 300 for a decade. Finally getting there -- trust me you can get stuck even with all the "right" advantages. IME those things maybe help people go from 500 to 700; getting to 450 is all about form.
@@taddfouch6637 thank you very much! As far as I know I do just a regular power grip. I have very small hands but they're pretty meaty and for some reason I've never really had trouble with wide rim drivers, probably because I threw them from the start. Sorry that's probably not very helpful but if you want more detail send me a dm on Instagram and I can send you a photo @roadtoscratch_discgolf
@@acfrisbee hey Andrew. Awesome to have you here my man! I'm doing form work about twice a week for about an hour to an hour and a half. Velo (Velocity) days where I do my overload and underload training, and throw 20 max effort throws in a net 3 times a week (about 30minute sessions). Then I throw distance lines when the body feels good and the speeds are good, never more than once a week. On top of that I lift in the gym about twice a week. But I have a full time job so fitting it in is tough. I aim to do about 12 hours a week, normally spread over about 3 or 4 days depending on weather and timing! Love your videos. Can't wait for more!
I love your message at the beginning that it is possible if you believe. I am a new disc golfer and struggle to hit 200' consistently. I know it's form, timing, and practice that will get me there. I am going to try some of your training tips and drills during some practice days.
Have you had anyone video tape you throwing out on the practice field? It's important if you have not. I am almost 62 years old and started playing 2 years ago. I could only throw about 150-175 when I started that first season. I can throw 240 consistently now. going to the practice field and working on achieving "Pro" form is the way to go.
@@jbakeindy this is great! And thank you. Yes I agree, it's so hard to believe it's possible at first, the difference between a beginner and someone who's starting to figure it out is just so huge!! If you're struggling to hit 200 I'd say it's probably more than likely a launch angle it nose angle problem. Once you've figured that out, I'd just work on speed, accuracy can come later in my opinion. And yes definitely get a video from face on and down the throwing line. I use a selfie stick and stick it in my bag between my discs to video myself
@@StuG-pr9tf this is good advice! I'd say try to copy run up, reach back, pocket and release positions. Then once those look ok, then try to throw some distance lines
@@carystallings6068 yes. This is a good thought. Thats bad for just about everything, speed, spin, nose angle. A very hard thing for beginners to get their head around though
Keep at it man. I just cleared 500' it's been a journey. My best tip for you is don't load your muscles as much. Disc isn't heavy, you don't have to try so "hard" as you do "fast" Think of footwork and speed like a figure skater, or a dancer.
@@msully1990 500 is awesome, congrats!! Interesting, I've definitely always been more of a muscle it person even in my golf days (when most say not to). Its just what worked best for me cause I'm small but strong. I did however start feeling like my arm was a lot looser recently and that helped a lot! Also when I throw on course shots I don't try to muscle it quite so hard to be fair. I will have a play around with this and see what/if it helps!
@@msully1990 yes you are not wrong! But I think you're absolutely right. I think there's just a fine balance between using your muscles and staying loose if that makes sense? Hahah. Honestly I think not that long. I hit 64mph on TechDisc yesterday which would be really close to 450 on a good hit
Hey Matt, been watching all your videos, and rooting for ya! I also experimented with lefty backhand when I started playing early on and I was surprised at the baseline level of performance I had with it. I definitely think this is something worth pursuing, as if you can get the same distance and accuracy as a righty forehand, you have the potential for less wobble and more spin. And I think there's a balance aspect that's important for longevity. Not saying you have to put 100% equal time into it, but getting it into useful territory is a perk! I know a couple people who throw left and righty backhand. Neither are ambidextrous, but they got them to equivalent levels, and it's useful.
This great to know Nick thank you. Yeah I’m going to plan to stick with it and see where it goes. One of the main issues with my forehand is the run up feels terrible a lot of the time, and this solves that issue
@@bytetacos I did isometric exercises from a Nick Krush video for wrist, elbow and shoulder strength. Here's the link ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-j8bo6-gdut0.htmlsi=qqDULKHCsr8iaBpN
Sorry I put it in the video but some people can't see it for some reason. Here you go ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-j8bo6-gdut0.htmlsi=qqDULKHCsr8iaBpN
@@OneFocusPhotos absolutely. I went from not physically being able to keep the disc flat in the pocket to being able to do it without even trying in about 2 weeks having done 3 sessions a week. If you want me to be technical my wrist wasn't strong enough to maintain the Ulnar deviation you need to keep the disc flat and the exercises quickly strengthened those tendons
Congratulations on hitting your goal! I've enjoyed your videos, and I've learned some things from you. I don't think you've maxed out yet. I think you can get to 450, and that would be pretty awesome for 5'4."
So i did the heavy disc side of this today, did a techdisc set before and one after and saw a 6 mph increase, based on video what it really did for me is it forced me to be balanced better and keep my weight behind the brace. unsure if it's going to help build any speed by muscle. smooth out form, but it did seem to help in a short 20 minute session. will keep experimenting with it over the next 2 weeks.
Very nice! Heavy side is unlikely to improve speed. But it will certainly clean up technique. Congrats on the awesome progress! I've heard of athletes phasing out the heavy side as their technique gets better as it can be detrimental to speed when you don't need it for the technique improvements. So maybe once you stop seeing improvement either add in the light weight as well or don't bother with the heavy any more
It looks to me like you could bring your shoulder more forward to create some lag between the shoulder and elbow. It is ok for the elbow to lead the arm and the disc but you could create more coil into the system by not allowing your shoulder lag behind by that much. But then, yes, your arm drops below elbow, which helps create the wobble. Bringing the shoulder forward more could actually help with that issue too! As always, though, take these suggestions with a serious dollop of salt!🤣
Very cool. I agree, forms look good for a start. This might help. I throw FH at 49 mph, 630ish RPMs and 300+ft. With an 11 speed MVPWave. (I am built like you, learned to throw in my 20s, took 41 years off, now 69, PDGA #308) So, when you clean up the variations, you should be on your way to 350ft for FH. As for your BH, looks like you reach back too soon. And, I've known a few people who developed opposite-side BH. The best I've seen is decent consistency, but less power. If you consider shooting a basketball with the opposite hand, only a few of the best players in the world are decent up to 15ft from the basket. So clearly it isn't easy. I'm all in on following your progress. I hope you can achieve your goals.
Thank you very much. Yes, I think you are right, my speed is not at a bad starting place. I just need to somehow clean it up! Great to know that you can throw 300+ at 49mph! I have hope!
I haven't really seen any evidence that there would be any benefits to doing this. I plan on phasing out the heavier weighted reps once my form has gotten better as you want to be developing speed. But let me know if the results are good, I'm curious. Be sure to warm up properly. Anything that's a different weight to what you're used to is gonna feel strange
Finally got a chance to watch this video, super well done Matt! BH form looked so dang clean and it's well deserved that your timing finally lined up with the improved form
@@MattRobertsonDG sure other sports do it, but correlation does not equal causation. Perhaps there is a reason it does not translate well to disc golf? Perhaps it has been tried and failed? As far as I can tell, disc golf is a speed sport, not a strength sport. See: Emerson Keith Do you have any formal training or expertise in biomechanics or strength training? I'm just playing Devil's advocate, I tend to agree with you here, but I would be making an assumption to think 'overloading' in disc golf is beneficial. I wonder what David Wiggins take is on this? He seems to be the most power orientated thrower, and potentially the best strongman for your theory.. but again; correlation does not equal causation. I prefer evidence-based arguments TBH.
@@Picklemedia completely understand your point of view! However I would say number 1, disc golf is a new sport so of course we aren't seeing techniques like these used! However I would guarantee they are being used by guys at the top of the game, why? Because I cannot believe I'm the first one to come up with it haha. Number 2, this is definitely a speed exercise not a strength exercise, the heavy weight is for building technique not strength. And yes I have a degree that included sports science and training (mostly around golf but still applys) and I consulted with a professional trainer whilst working on this.
@@MattRobertsonDG "in disc golf, none" "I guarantee they're being used" Which statement is true? You have made a series of assumptions. I will defer to Occam's razor.
@@Picklemedia those were different questions. First you asked me to name one and I said I couldn't. Then i said that I guarantee people are using similar techniques since they are used in many other explosive sports so why would disc golfers ignore it? That's the only assumption I have made
Not long. The whole routine takes about 15 minutes. But I do have a very extensive warm up routine before I do this and that take about 30 to 45 minutes
I use a 240 gram bunker buster disc (using 40 g lead tape) and a 140 g dino disc. Since you took a lot of time to determine weights I was wondering if that sounds about right to you.
Thanks mate! I just get them all from the Team Discraft website. Yeah they aren't cheap to ship but it's not so bad if you buy in bulk (just keep it under £200 to avoid import charges). I've also bought a few while I lve been on US trips as my wife's American, but I think that was only 1 Jersey and a bunch if rare discs.
Thanks for the observation! I do have a tenancy to accelerate too soon for sure. Hard for me to be smooth and fast hahha, I don't have the levers. One of the drills I've been working on has been to try to achieve this
@@MattRobertsonDG I'm roughly in the same stage of the game and pretty much the same build as you so I know the struggle with working on timing the levers we have. But also worth noting how you're changing your swing when you go to throw. The swing directly after the swing I linked is abrupt and stiff which is 100% a mental part of the swing because you just did the motion perfectly before
Another video I thought might be great is about transferring the 400ft from field work to a course situation. What does it take to consolidate your max distance and start employing it in course play?
Very good idea! I do notice that my Nukes that are pretty understable on a full power throw are pretty Overstable with on course power. That would be a fun thing to look into!
Many congratulations! Great outcome! I'd like to see more training and improvement videos from someone like you who really understands how to improve one's form. Forehand perhaps? 😁
Welcome to my world! My every second training session seems to feel like that 😐. But given your work ethic I expect you to bounce back twice as strong in no time! Keep up doing the great work with this videos! They are super informative and very motivational.
First off im not a pro nor a pro coach but I can throw over 500ft. The focuspoint from my perspective anyway, I would look into the bracing a little bit if I were you. It looks like a lot of power is lost when you drop your hips so low and having the plant knee so bent. Cheers mate.
@@traviskauffman7583 my max spin is about 1400rpm as well on a good day. Speed is really my issue. On a good day I can maybe throw 1 or 2 fast enough that 400ft would be theoretically possible but that's needs to be more consistent
Good question! Personally I have serious doubts about the theory of heavy weights causing injury. But thats not guaranteed. Being so heavy means you can't throw hard and therefore probably less likely to cause injury. However 800g is very heavy, if you imagine trying to throw a 1kg weight lifting plate that's pretty crazy. Also I think it would probably not have any positive affect as the extra weight will definitely slow you down which would be counter productive for speed and I think the extra weight would be too much for improving form
I use a 200 gram Bunker Buster disc with 40 grams of lead tape for a total of 240 grams and one of those Dino discs at 140 grams. I feels right but I have just started and don't expect to see results for a couple of weeks.
@@user-pj3ir4vt6x sounds like good weights to me! Let me know how you get on. Just stay consistent with it. Results for me probably started after about 2 or 3 weeks slowly but now I'm throwing 50ft further
You can also just buy the weighted baseballs and make the same throwing motions with them thats what I've done for overload training, works especially good for forehand as the motion is nearly identical
Cool idea. Probably not as good for the skill transfer as a disc I'd imagine but definitely more accessible in the US. I'm in the UK so not easy to come by. I'm ordering some Plyoballs for dynamic warm ups though
