Testing out a few different loads of 9mm +P+ in comparison to a 9mm +P in a ballistic gel test and giving my opinion on 9mm +P+. Always appreciative of any channel help :) www.patreon.com/user?u=5828221
Hi Sam, would you Plz allow me to post my 2nd "Modern Meat Target" ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Z9IfVCdTipc.html +P vs +P+ Is Plus P Velocity More Effective?
I chronographed a lot of different 9mm back in the late '90s, and the +P+ on the market then was no faster than the +P ammo. I came to the conclusion that the +P+ companies were using powders that needed very high pressures to match the velocities of the other manufacturers' +P, or it was a marketing gimmick. Now some of the ammo makers are loading stuff that actually IS quite a bit faster than +P, but I genuinely wish they would provide pressure numbers.
I thought your comment about heavier (147gr) +P+ bullets not really giving you significant advantages over +P, but the lighter (115gr) +P+ definitely do perform better. And yet, looking just at gel penetration numbers, which a lot of people focus on, the heavier bullets performed better. I agree with you that gel damage and energy dump are very important.
@@dsrrecordsent158grain lswchp from buffalo bore are over 1200fps out of 4" barrel and over 1300fps from a 6"barrel.... those are getting close to standard 357mag numbers
Seeing as several people are 'going there' this this "velocity is slower in the winter" talk (which shouldn't even be a thought when it was like 50 degrees this day), I will share something I wrote up from a study I did 3 years ago, and here are the results I got, posting an old community post: I am often inundated with comments on my videos in cold weather that the cold weather slows the velocity of a given ammunition. Well, I went back and gathered all of the chronograph information I have recorded myself where I use the same gun and same ammo at two different times of the year, and here are the results: I just compiled all of the data I have where I have two totally different air temperatures with the same ammo and same gun, and what I have is 10 varieties to go on. Seven of 10 times, the ammunition in question was FASTER in colder air temp than warmer. I searched the weather history of my filming area of each day in question (I often post videos a day or two after filming so it's not exact, but close enough). 1. First ammo is the Critical Duty 135 gr+P 9mm both tests in the 4" barrel, in 34 degree air temp I got a 5 shot average of 1,058 FPS, but in 70 degree air temp I got a 5 shot average of 1,056 FPS. Cold air wins. 2.The Hydrashok 9mm 124 gr low recoil in the 4" barrel gave me at 36 degree air temp, 1,033 FPS and in 69 degree air temp 1,000 FPS. Cold air wins. 3.The American Gunner 9mm 124 gr+P in 4" barrel gave me in 45 degree air temp 1,152 FPS and in 63 degree air temp, 1,135 FPS. Cold air wins. 4. Critical Defense 9mm in 81 degree air temp gave me 1,158 FPS and in 31 degree air temp gave me 1,133 FPS. Warm air wins, but by 25 FPS and the largest air temp gap here of 50 degrees. 5. The Remington HTP .380 in the LCP gave me in 76 degree air temp 881 FPS and in 74 degree air temp 848 FPS (this one was the odd bunch as they were tested in April and September so far apart in time, but not by temp. Warm air wins, but there was only a 2 degree difference in this instance. 6. The Super-Vel .38+P 90 gr in the 1.875" J-frame gave me in 32 degree air temp 1,307 FPS and in 46 degree air temp gave me 1,285 FPS. Cold air wins. 7. The Gold Dot 9mm 124 gr+P in the 4" pistol gave me in 50 degree air temp 1,215 FPS, in 80 degree air temp 1,202 FPS and in 34 degree air temp 1,185 FPS. This one is sort of tied, however 50 degrees VS 80 degrees and still beating the velocity by 13 FPS sort of tells a LOT about this whole study. 8. The .38 Special +P Critical Defense in the J-frame gave me in 78 degree air temp 977 FPS and in 85 degree air temp 907 FPS. Cooler weather wins. 9.The Federal HST .38 Special+P in the J-frame gave me in 86 degree air temp 813 FPS and in 68 degree air temp 775 FPS. Warmer air wins. 10.The Gold Dot 9mm 115 gr standard pressure in the 4" barrel gave me in 50 degree air temp 1,190 FPS and in 34 degree air temp I got 1,206 FPS. Cold air wins. That's all for now, and what I am seeing is consistency, but the total opposite of what I have been told.
you may only find an issue with H110 / win 296 in 357 & 44 . Some say a sample size of 10 is too small , The Point , in most ammo ... same as one round to the next , not enough difference to make a difference .
Clearly this is racism or something. 50fps determines whether all bullets will be effective at all. I mean, if your 500 s&w loses 50fps from that sub barrel, it's just too weak to stop a mugger. 9mm was ALWAYS suboptimal crap. It's cheaper than .380 and you can have 50000 +1 rounds with 15 extra mags in your edc gym carry in case al quaida attacks with machine guns and bomb vests and you have to single handedly defeat them all with your Glock.
Something not mentioned but is worth noting, higher pressure does not necessarily mean higher velocity. The classic example is shotgun trap loads. They are much weaker, lower recoil than heavy game, buckshot, or slug loads but often run at the same pressures using a small charge of fast burning powder. This makes them cheaper to manufacture, cleaner burning, and lower noise. A change in propellant will result in more effect than a change in pressure using the same propellant. For instance, the max book load for VV 3n38 and 147gr 9mm is over 1100 fps at standard pressure. A +p load of Ramshot competition with 147gr 9mm would barely make 900 fps.
I've seen a few tests before with the 127 grain +P+ T-Series and this is the first time that I've seen such good expansion on them. I bought ten boxes of these about 25 years ago and have always been hesitant to carry them because of the less than flattering reviews and lack of expansion that I've seen in prior videos. Thanks for the tests.
Interesting results 🤔 I think I would be Interesting to see a similar test with the same bullet like a 124 gold dot standard pressure vs 124+p vs 124 +p+ (underwood maks +p+ gold dot) Great video as always 👍
Glad to see your voice is getting back to normal. I don’t think I’ve ever seen 9mm +P+ in a store. Unless I just didn’t pay attention to it… that Buffalo bore is a beast! I think I shot some 38 +P Buffalo bore years ago, and it was really hot
This reminds me of why I liked the Cor-Bon 115 +P that used the Sierra JHP. Penetration was under the FBI standards, but everything I shot with it, went down hard.
Thanks for another informative video - with a ruger max 9 i think i’ll stick with +P for SD. I currently use Underwood 90 grain +P xtreme defender rated at 1475 fps/435 fpe. With momentum I always think of a ballistic pendulum - if u were to hang your gel block to form a pendulum the bullet momentum will determine how far up the block will swing after bullet impact since momentum is conserved in the collision (assuming the bullet comes to rest within the block). For example with the BB 115 grain +P+ assuming 1400 fps impact velocity, 15 lb gel block (I'm guessing) and 2 foot long pendulum cords the max swing angle would be about 11 deg - Not as much as you might think. Like you said most of the bullet energy goes towards internal damage to the block.. Thanks!
This is Bob, LD'S other half. Great test thank you. I believe that Winchester seems to be optimistic on their handgun velocities. I have seen tests with Silver tip in particular especially in 45acp, where the rounds hit substantially lower velocities than they are rated at. Not a dig at Winchester at all, because I see this in other brands too.
Great test. Data is good to have. When you hit at distance some of the hits were nearly touching. 75 is a stretch for most folk. I have even made 75 my limit for 6"+ 44 magnum revolvers when hunting whitetail. Even though I have hit deer at farther than 75 the shots are not well placed and require extended tracking and follow up shots to harvest. I actually really prefer 50-60 yard max. That being said if the +p or the +p+ give us any significant increase in velocity in a 9mm then we should have better bullet performance at distance if it were needed. I would not want to have to rely on a 9mm in a gun fight at 75 yards. Good observable data in gel. Thanks
@@bobjohnson1633 From 75 and out they have been. Gut shots mainly. Open sights 6" 629 & 9" Super Redhawk. Others may be better than I for sure and may be using optics. My limits especially as I age are now under 75 yards for me and my set up. Just making a hit on the animal isn't acceptable. If at all possible I want a clean hit & harvest. Even as "powerful" as the 44 may be it isn't a rifle or shotgun slug. We have actually dressed buck and recovered our expanded bullet in the hide on the opposite side.
Thanks for your video. I would like to have seen Underwood 9mm 115 & 124 Gr P+P ammo as well. As far as 9mm P+P ammo goes Underwood is less money and a lot easier to obtain.
It seems to me that if you want your weapon to perform with those specs you should have one that does it without all the +p and +p+ crap. Standard Federal American Eagle fmj .357sig is running 1350fps and 604 ft lds muzzle energy. Get the real thing, 357sig for the win.
Hmmmmm, the new manufacture Defender is pretty obviously a bonded "Black Talon" minus the scary name and scary coating. Glad to see it back. I would love to see some side by side testing against the Federal HST.
From the independent testing I’ve seen, the new talon’s (ranger T) clog up in heavy denim. The HST’s rarely do, in any weight, from any barrel length, with any pressure designation (standard, +p, +p+). Near perfect performance every time. Not to sound like a shill, but they’re touted as the best for a reason. They even outperform the gold dots and the famous 9BPLE’s. The only test I’ve seen them beaten in was “shootingthebull410” 9mm test where the defender PDX1 147gr beat it in penetration vs the HST 124gr. But!!!!! The HST still hit the requirement, the tester just prefers more penetration which the 147gr has the advantage of. 124 vs 124, it was no contest, HST by a landslide.
@Chris S I am a fan of the HST as well. My only problem with it is that there are calibers they don't make it for. At least I haven't seen them. This new Winchester round may fill in those blanks. With luck, it might push Federal to expand the lineup.
Hi Sam, you can fit a cigar in the cavity of that 115 grains round, damn scary. It matches the description of the results Jim Cirillo got from his 110 grains supervel handloads
Thanks for the expensive test. Appreciated. 'Momentum' in the ballistic world, is measured as sectional density. How I explain it to non-gunners, is sort of like this: velocity is power, while momentum is torque. And torque is what does the real work. Tissue damage is important, but penetration is what really counts.
@@Valorius I don't know about "most companies", but since Underwood is primarily the only company that I choose for my 357 Sig.... I can say with the utmost certainty that there's not a single 9mm round in existence that can even remotely compare to 2,200-2,280 fps with around 720-740 ft-lbs of muzzle energy out of a 4 25" barrel.
@@nikos6220 With regard to tissue-fluid / shockwave dynamics in relation to high-velocity projectile wake regions produced during secondary cavitation .... the literature breaks terminal ballistics into three parts; low-velocity, medium-velocity and high-velocity. High-velocity is defined as approximately 600-700 m/s = 1,968-2,296fps and is (typically) reserved for rifle projectiles (the 357 Sig is most definitely an exception to this rule). At these speeds, the surrounding tissues lose the ability to 'bounce back', so-to-speak and this results in devastating & permanent wounding characteristics, which can range anywhere in size from 10-40x the diameter of the permanent wound channel itself. This is where the surrounding inelastic/hematopoetic and vascular organs such as the liver, kidneys, spleen, pancreas, brain, bones, ect are all highly susceptible to shockwave injury, due to the fact that they have minimal intrinsic ability to dissipate the energy transferred even if they are remote to the primary injury path itself. The higher the velocity - the greater the trauma / hemorrhaging following secondary cavitation will be, and this is irrespective of projectile size/mass. ~
@@nikos6220 I hear you regarding the 125gr and prior to when Underwood introduced the 115gr JHP, it was all I carried. Now a days I tend to stagger my mags with their 68gr & 90gr XD's as well as their 115gr JHP's in my EDC.
The velocity spread on that Winchester defender ammo makes me think they're loaded with a temperature sensitive powder. I would still prefer going to a larger caliber as opposed to using +p ammo but I don't think it will wear a modern firearm any more than standard pressure stuff. +p+ sounds like a bad idea to me in a standard brass case with a firearm that has less chamber suppprt such as a glock. Going outside of SAAMI specs with stuff like that buffalo bore 115gr +p+ will usually void most handgun warranties as well. If a +p+ powder charge was loaded in S3 casings it would be a non-issue, that's why the military expressed interest in 6.8x51/.277 Fury. I see the potential to push all existing calibers further with that improvement in case design. I like the new intro! You were missing to the left with that T-series and high with the 147gr Buffalo bore. I remind people to test their carry ammo because there may be point of impact shifts just like that.
Seriously, seems every problem with 9mm seems to get solved with another 300 fps. So why is the 9mm a thing? It seems to function in the mediocre status and the first sign of bone or material, it stops functioning well.
@@Valorius Only if you buy the weak loads that were intended for early Colt 38 Automatics. Today you can buy or make loads that will beat any 9mm. This is because there is more case capacity in the 38 Super. My 50 year old Lyman reloading manual contains 38 Super load data for a 130 grain bullet traveling at 1300 fps without resorting to excess pressure. This is 9mm +P+ territory. If I want to go even hotter, I can do so by reloading or buying boutique ammo such as Buffalo Bore.
@@kevinrichardson8859 It's a bottleneck 9mm originally designed to match the popular 125 grain 357 Magnum load. It's primary drawback is its reduced magazine capacity when compared with a comparable 38 Super magazine.
@@Valorius I don't know where you are getting your data, but I rechecked the Buffalo Bore, Underwood, and Doubletap websites to make sure they have not updated any changes. Their highest posted 124 grain 9mm velocities were still 50 fps slower than their 124 grain 38 Super loads. The 38 Super achieves this performance without having to resort to +P+ pressure levels. No matter how hard one tries, it is impossible for the 9mm Para to match or exceed the potential of the 38 Super. It's basic physics. More powder can be stuffed into the 38 Super case than can fit in a 9mm Para case. Decades ago Jeff Cooper, the dean of combat handgunning, designed his 38 Super Cooper 1911. He stuck a 6 1/2" barrel in the pistol and made reinforced cases from cut-down 223 Remington brass because the original brass was blowing out at 1600fps when using 125 grain bullets. The stouter cases produced velocities of nearly 1750 fps with the same projectile.
Funny how far people will push a cartridge to get different or better results from what they perceive as bad or less then . I honestly feel like +P+ loads aren't really worth the extra wear n tear on the gun . If I wanted better penetration if personally just go up to a .357 sig and get the extra foot-pounds . Also Sam I was curious if you think that the .357 or .44 magnum really benefit from a 6 inch barrel versus the 4 inch I can imagine a lot of .44 mag loads do since I feel like a lot of them are hunting loads
The .357 is going to pick up velocity with the longer barrels. In my testing with my Ruger 77/357 rifle, a 16 inch barrel can give .357 around 400 fps gain.
I've seen this trend towards light for caliber projectiles pushing high fps what are your thoughts on high velocity solid copper 9mm like the 68gr or 90 gr Lehigh defense loads? I bought some they seem fine and feed fine, good penetration through barriers but obviously no expansion with the extreme defenders. I know you're a 40 fan, 40 S&w is my go to home defense gun! But it looks like there's some 9mm loads that get pretty close to 40.
Personally, I’ve always felt that +P+ is just a hammer to piece of glass. It’s a load that has no better defense benefit, but it certainly and needlessly hammers the crap out of one’s handgun. Talk about excessive wear & tear. No thanks. I’ve never understood those that buy a caliber , only to stuff it with the most amount of gunpowder possible (i.e. +P+). Sometimes good enough, just is. Go buy a bigger caliber if standard pressured rounds aren’t good enough.
A local sheriff’s department in my area has issued that Winchester 127 for years. I think they still do and I’ve never heard any complaints from the deputies I’ve known. I had to carry and qualify with +p+ back in the early-mid 90s, 115 grain Winchester (original 9mm +p+) and legendary 9BPLE and 124 grain Hydra Shok. No performance issues were noted in the field. I’ve seen one micro 9 violently come apart on a range that could have been linked to +p+, but it wasn’t a Glock or Sig. Full size and mid frames from Glock, Sig,or S&W aren’t going to have any problems. Glock cautions not to use it in their Slim Frames, but primarily due to slide velocity. I recall seeing a Taran Butler vid on RU-vid several years back going thru a bunch of 9BPLE in a P365. Having recently purchased a 365, I find the 124 grain Gold Dot or 135 grain Critical Duty, both in +p to be sufficiently stimulating to my arthritis. Anyway, it was ironic that back when +p+ was a more common LE option and Marshall-Sanow studies gave it an an 89% one shot stop rating due to its real world performance, FBI testing concluded it wasn’t a viable LE round because it didn’t meet their penetration standards.
Anyone who runs 9mm +p+ just needs to run 357sig. 357sig has virtually the same pressure as +p+ 9mm but with higher velocity and with a gun designed around all ammo that goes through it having that pressure. My 357 sig reloads go over 1400 fps with a 125gr projectile out of a 3.9 inch barrel and over 1200 fps with a 147gr out of a 3.9 inch barrel.
@@Valorius the difference in cartridge capacity between a 357 sig and a 9mm with the same magazine length is between 1-3 rounds. Since glocks are so popular I'll use them as an example. The glock 19 which is 9mm holds 15 rounds, the glock 32 which is 357 sig holds 13, and even the glock 30 which is 45acp holds 10. The average number of shots fired in self defense is between 2-7 depending on the source and the number of assailants ie single vs group. So based off that even a compact 45acp theoretically is enough rounds without reloading. In addition anyone who trains, which if you carry a firearm it's irresponsible and foolish not to, should be able to reload in just a couple seconds and if you have had to fire off more than 10 rounds you should have found cover by then which gives more time to reload. Some states don't even allow more than 10 rounds in a magazine regardless of caliber. The response 9mM hOlDs MoRe BuLlEtS is a common response and a typically true statement by its self but not one with much factual REASONING behind it. And this is just a few thoughts in regards to 9mm +p+ vs 357 sig cartridge capacity. There is even more that could be said and FAR more that could be said in regards to standard pressure 9mm vs 357 sig if you look at the other pros and cons of each.
I'd take the 147 or either Winchester over the 115. Could be very helpful against very heavy clothing or a bucket shot to a head that is mostly bone. No comparison to 357 is legit without specifying bbl length. I'll take my G19 loaded with 124+P GDs any day over a 357 snub. But a 4" 686 is entirely different. While I own and love J frames I prefer 38 in those. Seems like one of the purposes of +P ammo is to reach the velocity required for expansion when using shorter bbls. This comes at the expense of recoil, noise, and wear on the gun.
I got 1,362 FPS max velocity out of Sig P320 4.7 inch BBL with Winchester Active Duty 9mm M1152 115 grain ammo that is FMJ target loads yesterday over my Garmin chronograph. Incredible numbers. Most definitely the equivalent of +p+ in my opinion. Btw the shorter 3.1 inch BBL with an Sig P365 I found only a 100 FPS difference with it.
Packed with information again Thank you. Question or my thoughts or for me any way I have found that the faster a bullet travels the more accurate I am ? Could that be the sooner the bullet leaves the barrel the less chance I have to flinch ? LOL. a little voice as I pull the trigger screaming get me outa here before he goes to shaking & I don't know which way I am going.
With the shell shock NAs3 casings you can load 9mm SUPER hot. The shell cases themselves can handle like 48k psi without any bulging. I loaded 124 grain bullets to 1400 fps out of a glock 17. I think as material science increases we will start to see insane power out of handguns and unbelievable power out of rifles.
The lack of case capacity isn't a huge deal, IMO. For what the 9x19mm cartridge is designed to do, it could well be ideal. As an analogy, think of an automobile engine. High compression engines are more efficient than low compression engines. You get a great expansion ratio out of the gas, giving more energy for the amount of gas. To do the same with the larger 38Spl case, you just need a bunch more powder. The little bit of extra length on the 357 Magnum case doesn't help matters. Of course if you throw a 158gr slug out at 1200fps, that's going to make a 124gr slug doing about 1100fps not seem so hot. When shooting the steel at 75 yards, you could edit it with a bit of slip so that there is more delay between the boom of the gun and the impact ping on the steel. Make it seem further away! ;-)
+P+ is needed for the old HI Shock 147 grain to make them do there job I can still get all I want of that HI Shock for 20.00 a box of 50 as well as the stranded 115
The Barretta 92 can not handle +P+ ammo that well. It has been known to break the slide in front of the bolt face. That is one reason the USA replaced the model 92.
Just wanted to add a few things. As for ammo scarcity, I'm still shooting up 9mm I accumulated in '16-'19. I don't handload. I will reiterate, one should use what you can master & what gives you confidence. 10mm? Knock yourself out. 40S&W? A well proven cartridge during it's 25ish years of heavy "institutional" use. 45ACP? "Two world wars!" I'm a fan myself. That said, there's one handgun cartridge that has grown in use continuously since it's inception, that's 9mm Parabellum. I believe only the PRC doesn't use it militarily. Even the Russian Federation uses it. Much like the 5.56x45, reviled at home while the Soviets developed an analog & the Chinese adopted a 5.8mm with similar performance ( maybe more like a 6x45mm, which is what the US likely should have fielded in the '60s). The 9mm just checks all the right boxes, nothing more. It's amusing & sometimes mildly annoying to still see people trolling or really getting defensive about the 9mm's global dominance. Also, the common American expression of kinetic energy, the "Foot Pounds" measure is simply a mathematical formula of often questionable value. You might be better off shooting pine boards. So hey, just because you don't use the most widely deployed defensive handgun cartridge in the world doesn't make you weird or inadequate, it just makes you uniquely you😉. Best to all. Keep charging that windmill.😂
No. I have done studies on this. About 60% of the time the same box of ammo shot faster averages in the winter, which is within normal round to round variations. The only time temperature changes things (I did this experimentation) is when I froze some ammunition and compared it to body temp ammo. There was about a 20 FPS average drop with the frozen ammo, which isn't much difference.
If you want that kind of performance out of your weapon get one that does it without all the +p crap which is very subjective as the man says. For example Federal American Eagle 357sig 125gr fmj is 1350fps and 506 ft lbs energy at the muzzle. That's the baseline, it only goes up from there and it's designed for it. 357sig for the win.
So if you want more straight penetration you'll go with the heavier grain? I like the damage of the lower grain bullet, but not very useful if you think humans move and get cover.
Depends on many factors. Some higher pressure ones might be more accurate in some guns, but it seems to me that overall my experience is that lower pressure rounds are more accurate.
I agree w/ GunSam. I know this is different but out of my AR full power mil spec M193 will give you close to 3100 fps out of a 16in barrel and will give me roughly 2 1/4 to 3 in groups and if I use PMC .223A I'll get about 2800 to 2850 fps from the same barrel and get about 1 1/4 to 2 in groups but I have gotten 1in groups from it. All at 100 yards. Both are 55 gr fmj.
@@nikos6220 thanks for the input. What I put down was just my limited observation with two different rounds from one rifle. I guess correlation does not always equal causation. In your opinion really high pressure stuff can be just as accurate provided the consistency of charge was precisely controlled?
I hear lots of 9mm guys say that there is no real difference in stopping power between handgun rounds, but then they will only carry 9mm +P or +P+. If the energy doesn't matter, and standard pressure rounds perform fine, why are you carrying the round with more recoil and more gun wear?
Great video Sam The 115 grain Buffalo Boar that you call the " energy dump " and I call the " PUNCH " Is doing the the same as the 357 Mag and the 357 Sig This is what the 9mm lax's in all of the other rounds in 9mm in my opinion
357 mag isn't a 125gr round. That's just light ammo. 357 sig was designed to copy that performance, which is supposed to be a weak version of 357 because 158s, 180s, and 200s are too powerful. The key is putting in your gun the proper load for that gun. It's what they are designed for. Full size 357 is not for shooting human attackers, but 115 9mm are. It's why dirty Harry carried 44 specials.
I did a study, years ago where I took boxes of ammo and chronographed half in the winter and half in the summer. About 70% of them shot faster in the winter. So with no disrespect, you don't know what you are talking about.
No they won't. I have already done this study out of the same boxes, 20 degrees VS 80 degrees. On average 60% of the ammo I tested shot faster in the winter. So maybe average the low temp will increase the velocity.
@@crusiethmaximuss Happy to share. Found it easily enough? What did you think? I would also recommend the video of Buffman R.A.N.G.E. reviewing the Winchester M1152, as he shoots it through various barrel lengths, including 16".
Great video & great explanation of SAAMI designations.+P+ is really an 80's-90's thing. For example, Speer 115 GDHP ( current iteration) does whatever you need of it from 3" barrels on up. The 9mm will likely dominate until we start using "phased plasma" guns. It's just reality. .40, .357SIG, 10mm, .45ACP are great but merits aside they can't approach the market dominance of 9mmP. It's adequate with massive options & support & that's what matters.
Every time there is a run on ammo 9mm is nowhere to be found. I can always get ammo for my .40, 357sig, and .45acp. The .357sig is quickly becoming my favorite round. I do own a 9mm too but it's been shelved for a while.
You're trolling, right? In light of 9x19mm's impending descent into moribund obscurity, I'll simply observe that these last 121 years was a "good run".😂 30 Super Carry? Thanks for the laugh.
@@bobjones-bt9bh Umm, you have no idea what you're talking about. 200 ft lbs ( a contrived unit of measurement) is a significant difference on your planet? Why can't people just accept that 9mmP balances various positive attributes better than other pistol cartridges put to similar use? It's really that simple. Again, 300 ft lbs vs. 500 ft lbs is night & day, according to you? I'm genuinely sorry but that's just gibberish.
Like your tests. However, firing only one or two rounds tells you nothing about its performance. You need to shoot a larger sample size to draw any conclusions. At least 5-10 rounds. I understand that’s more of a hassle, but it’s necessary to draw any conclusions.
