I'd actually love that for a ending even a troll one *Abby and Ellie stare menacingly at each other as the boat sways* Lev: "So....anybody got any cards?"
Lev: So...Remember when you guys were trying to beat each other to death? That was crazy, right? *Abby and Ellie glare at Lev* Lev: So uh...you guys remember Joel? Man what a crazy trail that set us down
I feel like using a fake name would make sense in a world like this lol. Never know who might have a grudge with you or a bone to pick and they know your real name.
Y’all know how crazy it would’ve been, if we started off playing Abby for a while and starting to care for her. Only to then watch her kill Joel. That would’ve hit HARD.
Yeah, this game's biggest mistake was having to play as Abby after they killed Joel. That makes it harder for the player to sympathize with someone who already killed your favorite character.
Zach Dilton holy, wow. That would’ve been amazing. I’d like to add tho, it doesn’t pertain to the alternative timeline we mentioned. But imagine if joel would’ve been killed by the bloated that almost killed Ellie in the flashback. That would’ve been a heroic way to die. Saving Ellie one last time. This game was amazing, I really wish we got a better story.
There's a part in the game where the Neil Drunkman insert character (Manny) said to a guy who lost some fingers "you only really need 3" after seeing the end of the game I'm glad he got his
@@futureflash6331 eh... you know thats not Niels self insert character right? Look up the actor and it'll make sense. Doesn't change the fact this game is ass but false info is kinda eh imo
What kind of monster lacks empathy enough to have that reaction at the end of a game? I was speechless when I finished this game because of how impactful it is. Joe needs a reality check or drop some acid or something.
@@REDEEMERWOLF What kind of idiot who actually invested time into this game universe and its characters would actually appreciate the complete character assassination of main characters and bullshit of the writing in this game? Absolutely no one. They should've just left this game alone and never given it a sequel. The DLC with Ellie was perfect.
@Simon Farre because he dies in a completely lackluster way, completely out of character especially when he saved Abbys life at that point in time. The game then tries to sell you the revenge is bad angle when you literally play a character who is trying to get revenge over an incident that happened more than a decade ago. Not to mention the chronology of the story is like a schizophrenic wet dream jumping through lapses of time with flashbacks. These are all legitimate criticisms.
The people that are upset the ending wasn't satisfactory... I wonder if they even played the first game? That ending isn't satisfactory in the slightest! It ends with a pit in your stomach, empty, broken. Upset for Ellie, but upset for Joel! It makes you think.
I played Dishonored, a game about revenge. However, I spared Daud despite the fact he killed the Empress, the love interest of your character, and kidnapped your child. I did this because I heard his monologue about how much he regretted it. A speech to himself with nothing to prove to anybody else. Even when you meet him he doesn't beg for his life because he knows he deserves it. That's good writing. He was the ONLY guy I spared from harm. The problem here is that the Empress had little player connection, unlike Joel. So when you off a character by means of slapping fans in the face, of course they're going to get pissed. I don't think Abby necessarily deserved to die. I just think Joel was killed in a way that didn't do the fans service.
and they also "deconstructed" daud in the third game, making him a whinny bitch blamming the outsider.... and then they killed daud and the outsider.. jesus western video games writting is getting terrible... no wonder dishonored was also abandoned by arkane..
@@HunterKiller- they didn't exactly kill the outsider. They freed him from torment. I thought it was pretty good. You're right about Daud though. But as I fan I didn't hate it.
In Dishonored you also get a choice; you don't have to kill anyone. There are repercussions to killing everyone as well. The ludonarrative is perfect. Kill the guards -> not enough guards to control the quarantine -> more people get sick. The guards are not the bad guys, they are just doing their job.
David0426 correct but that’s after Joe saved Abby from bitten killed by a runner. And Abby could have at least give joe a quick death, but decides to bash Joe repeatedly with a golf club
MC Cooper I personally think this game was pretty good for the most part, but there were a lot of reasons to get angry or at least frustrated at the game. Like how they tried to make you humanise and like Abby, but leaves us the worst first impression of her at the beginning, they could have probably fixed that by adding a bit of Abby’s story in a last of us 1 dlc or have last of us 2 about only Abby then have the revenge story in a last of us 3, but the story felt very rushed with how they were gonna make a new main character and have us play as her. And also they could have had us play as Ellie and then Abby and go back and forth between them for us to get both of their perspectives. But they decided to reset everything at the climax of the game which is right after Abby shoots Jessie, and then decides to give us around 8 hours of Abby gameplay before we’re back to that climax. And worst of all, they decided to have us play as Abby and have her beating the shit out of Ellie when it was at the climax, and it just felt weird to play at this point.
They should have made it like , “Joel, we’ve found a coffee plantation in Alaska! Let’s go get some coffee beans!” And that’s the game. Go get some coffee beans.
I think for Lou2 Joel and ellie should have found another girl of roughly the same age, showing dynamics of family and jealously culminating in a family with some dysfunction that loves each other. In the third one have Joel lose to Abby because he's getting a little older becoming a little slower, have Elie seek revenge in anger, but when the other "daughter" is gravely injured reconsider and have it be a catalyst for Ellie maturing and becoming a leader within her community, creating a prosperous safe zone. As she ages and raises a new generation of leaders she gives her life to create a cure for the city which she made her life's work.
The Last Of Us Part II Story Remake Idea Ellie finds out the truth about the fireflies, something like in the flashback, but a bit longer, and she also founds out that her mom is still alive somewhere, she tells Joel she knows about the fireflies etc again like in flashback, but doesn’t tell him about her mom, then suddenly after making up with him again, she would’ve left to go and find her mother, Joel later finds out and tries to catch up to her, where we would go back and forth once we play as Ellie once as Joel, until it cames to that scene from the trailer where Joel founds her and Ellie asks: What are you doing here? and he would say: Did you really think I would let you do this on your own? And then they continue to find her mom, until they find her, and then it would priceless to see her moms’s reaction on Joel and Joel’s reaction on her mom, it would be better in the story where after they found her Joel will be like: Now I am useless as father figure, they don’t need me anymore etc. than killing the character off, and trying to make people like the one who killed him....
And adventure through a desolate wasteland fighting off incredible looking infected, discovering new factions and secrets about the infection... encountering new characters developing more for our beloved characters ? all through the main plot to collect some coffeee beans ? .... hmmmmm 🤔 Genius i say! Genius.
in the whole end part of the game, another thing Ellie lost is Tommy’s trust, this girl just killed your brother, many of your close friends and shot out your eye, and Ellie goes to kill her and finish it, imagine the conversation when Ellie gets back. Tommy: Oh hey Ellie your back ! Did you do it ? Ellie: No I saved her life and let her live Tommy is never going to talk to Ellie again, it’s like the situation with Ellie and Joel but with Tommy and Ellie.
@@choripanysida Ellie needs to pull a lie like Joel did to her in part 1, the difference is that Joel did that for Ellie's sake while Ellie needs to do so to avoid being killed by Tommy🤣🤣🤣
Technically Joel is also not the type of guy to hold grudge in the first place. He didn’t become an anti-military crusader or decided to take revenge for Tess. There is no point in fighting for dead people. Joel killing all the fireflies made more sense than Ellie’s revenge quest, especially leaving her family for something she wasn’t sure of herself. And if you do do it, then do it right. The funniest part is game forces us to play as Abby, still we want to kill her. On the other hand, Ellie has never even got a glimpse of GOOD Abby. Abby has just spared her 2 times which was so retarded that she deserved to die for it.
I didn't really got the "don't do it" vibe of the last fight, like, Joel never showed any sign of seeking revenge for anything of the past but I never got the feeling that he would be against her finishing the job. Maybe that's what Druckman and the crew vision doe, that Ellie didn't want to be like Joel and became a better person by not finishing the job. But idk feels kinda cheap and reveals she hated him as a person and forgot the "you do anything to survive" she learned in the first game.
@@blownupcreeperstudio Then tell us, what is the final cutscene about, why she did choose to let Abby go and what is the point of the whole game at all. Buddy.
Honestly not even upset the way he died, if I was Abby he would’ve gotten way worse than what she did to him lol. Problem was they did it way too early and then didn’t even give us the satisfaction of killing the bitch. That and the game felt out of order.
@@zachrobinson6801 yep, the core of the game was the story, and that was average AT BEST, its like everyone gave their 200%, animators, composers, actors, programmers etc, but the writing was a complete mess.
Alejandro Parra exactly and it’s sad because it’s just like with the movie and television industry. You see great acting, directing, score, and cinematography. But then the writing literally throws all that hard work out the window (TLJ GoT S8). Sad to see it happen here too.
Zach Robinson problem is Joel is a main character in a video game and they want us to care for Abby which I’m far from. You just don’t do that. Plus it was bullshit because Joel acted stupid for trusting Abby and her group, not at all the Joel we know. There’s just so many issues that make it hard to take seriously
Ghostrevivalist Oh I’m not disagreeing with how they executed it but I do think he needed to die. What they should’ve done was go through all the flashbacks first then kill of Joel then finish it off with Ellie hunting Abby down and actually killing her. The problem was that it was way too out of order and you genuinely don’t even understand Abby’s intentions until like 90% through her part of the story.
@Lick Tasty you gotta understand the perspective, when she entered the room where Mel and Owen corpses were she didn't saw the self-defense act we see, she sees her lover murdered and her pregnant friend with a fully visible belly stabbed in the neck. From her perspective Ellie had murdered a pregnant woman and shot her lover, Abby wanted revenge for that, and even though she (thought) knew that Ellie had done such an atrocious act she spared not only that pregnant woman life but also Ellie's life
@@therenx8385 I mean her dad didn't even want to sacrifice his own daughter, so at the end of the day it didn't matter. Abby said she spared her life, but realistically speaking she saw everything first hand and what do you want her to do, just let it go, lol? I like this game, but Joel should died in the middle, because I would have tried to understand Abby, but at the same time she did some dumb shit by trying to go after Owen making her a traitor, obviously at the time before TLOU 2 she and her father had nothing to lose till she actually lost something, that's why I didn't like her character. Not only that, but what was the point to bring Tommy out to let her finish the Job when she wasn't going to anyway, so it just didn't make sense, Abby showed no remorse of killing people and was basically relishing it. Before Ellie would kill someone she would try to spare them every time, but nope, they try to kill her every time and you(the player) know Ellie doesn't enjoy killing people, but for a means of survival. I don't completely hate Abby, but I just wish there weren't inconsistencies with her character.
Abby should’ve acknowledged that Joel saved her life. Also should’ve asked Joel why she killed her dad, to which he’d reply “if you had a daughter, you’d do the same”. Would have so much more meaning and reconsideration
Well he also didn't have to kill him in part 1 lol the guy had a knife, he wasn't going to harm joel. It sucks that joel died, but i understand abby wanting revenge. That was joels karma
honestly... this game should have capitalized on that idea... she goes and kills joel... then gets hunted by ellie... then when ellie tells her her name since it was never mentioned... abby realizes why joel did what he did... a father protecting his daughter... a notion she immediately sympathizes with and accepts the punishment of her stupid actions... and the player can choose to kill or spare her after playing the game from her and ellies perspective... would have been a much more accepting ending... considering that it would be player to player difference on a choice we didnt get to have in lou1...
James G That’s an appeal to authority fallacy and also what made Joel’s actions so appalling to many. Joel is not Elle’s daddy; Joel & Marlene knew Elle was okay with it and willing to-wanted to-despite *both* not liking it and wanted ideally a better way. Despite that, Joel killed Marlene who merely was the messenger and he also killed the doctors when he didn’t have to dooming humanity for his daddy-daughter complex. To many, that’s inexcusably bad.
Not really there's better moments involving action in the game any emotions moments they try to have are ruined by the lackluster story the first t 3Joel flashbacks are going tho
@@user-fb9sm7nn2x any seen with Dina was horrible for me but she seemed more likeable near the end when she had the baby just the whole game total cringefest jesse was cool but really undeveloped its sad
@@leecameron9226 It wasn't perfect and some things around their relationship seemed kind of cringe, but the moment where she is doing a cover of Take on me with Dina looking at her, was cool to me. I really liked Jesse, he was the best new character introduced and a cool dude, his death was meh tho
Well it's because Ellie is a good kid, in case you noticed she was never a killing machine, but you guys are too young to understand, it's all about MUH REVENGE !!
@@TheTariqibnziyad she killed like hundreds of people just to get to her. She abandoned Dina and baby just so she can kill abby, and she doesn't even go through with it
The real world is about how to overcome suffering, hate and resentment, Ellie did at the end by forgiving her, she saw Joel in Abby. Abby should've been dead but clinged desperately to life for the love of the boy as Joel for Ellie. The story wasn't a masterpiece but the events that played throughout the game was a philosophical masterpiece, hate.
@@PLaStiiCMoNtAGE doesn't matter if there are a lot of people around you, if they don't matter to you then you feel alone. Btw adding "fuck off" shows that you have not been feeling well lately, hope everything turns out great for you in the end
Hector you clearly missed the message. not only does it show that that was the last encounter Ellie and Joel had with each other, it also shows that Ellie may never forgive Joel ever but she'll try to. and thats what happened at the end of Ellie and Abbys fight. Ellie broke the cycle of revenge by forgiving Abby of what she did
@@fisthound0027 If I ever hear again that explanation again, I will mess somebody up. Ending the cycle of violence? What are we, 12? The last of 1 had a story about making a human choice instead of a possible right choice. But in TLOU2 Abby is spared because "revenge is bad"? Are you kidding me? Hell, that doesnt even work. If you have a story about ending the cycle of violence or whatever you call it, your character cant end up worse than the person she spares! That makes all the effort worthless. Besides, Ellie killed some guys who didnt even touch Joel to reach this point and when it comes to finishing Abby she changes her mind? Thats just weak writing. If they really wanted to keep all their elements here, they could either: A) Let Ellie finish Abby, but in the process she loses her fingers and ends up on a farm alone (thus completing the message that revenge is not worth it and doesnt change a thing). B) Let Ellie spare Abby, but end up happy after that. Easy as that, but the writers just mixed those options up for some reason.
Card Master because at that moment of drowning her she remembers her last conversation with Joel which was her saying she'll try to forgive him for what he did and thats what Joel wanted. and Ellie probably thought thats what Joel wouldve wanted Ellie to do with Abby. and so she forgives Abby. not only does this honor Joel's wishes but also ends the clear and obvious cycle of revenge between Ellie and Abby. if you missed that point of the story then you're clearly just salty you didnt get what you wanted.
The genius of this quote is that this is going to go around in circles. They used it as a "breaking the fourth wall" devise and people will say that it is obvious and that makes the game bad again. Pretty smart.
this game doesnt make any sense, Ellie kills like 400 people and all of a sudden realizes that killing is bad? "Joel wouldnt want this" is not that hard of a message to grasp, she waited until the very end for that to kick :/
The point isn't that "Joel wouldn't want this", the point is that forgiveness is something Ellie couldn't grasp until after everything she loved was lost as a result.
Mason Morgan if Druckman or however you say his name wanted the theme to be forgiveness then he should’ve had Abby forgive Joel. He stuck to the worst story out of all the choices.
@@jamisonlynch6437 While Abby was seemingly unable to forgive Joel for what he did, she did allow Ellie a second chance at life multiple times throughout the story. But I agree, while I enjoyed the game and it's conclusion, many of the narrative choices were questionable.
If we had a game with Abby as the protagonist that wasn’t this game. That would’ve been better to. So you could build up her story in her own game so it wouldn’t be a big mess. Then she meets Joel in the next game.
@G Money not pure garbage tbh, the multiplayer is reviewed as good and fun from the majority of the community and a forge that offered so much more than 3 and reach. The campaign isn't well received as it tosses out alot of what halo 4 and Spartan ops built up with Halsey wanting revenge and how jul mdama was looking to be a decent villian
@G Money you're thinking of Spartan assault lol, Spartan OPS is the halo 4 multiplayer campaign based a bit after events of H4 with the unsc researching requiem for tech and jul mdama trying to find the librarian to get the Janus key which is a map to every large piece of forerunner and even some precursor technology
@G Money lmao can you read properly? He's talking about forge being better in 5 then other halos, spartan ops "mobile game", obviously you haven't played any halo, nor have you researched about the sequels. The campaign is shit but the Multiplayer is good, sure it tries to be like cod but it has to evolve or it'll just get repetitive.
Why is no one talking about how they literally changed Jesse's model with Joel in the trailer to give us fake hope while Joel is dead? For the entire game I was thinking "hey maybe they thought of a massive plot twist or sth, I mean it's Naughty Dog after all" .... such a dirty move :(
I'm pretty sure they just took different scenes from the games and messed around the order. Like that part of the trailer Ellie was outside and all of a sudden Joel is next to some stairs. It's pretty obvious they engineered it to confuse us as to what this game was about. Edit: My bad they did switch models, I missed that.
operation skuld Just imagine if it was Joel who popped up and said ‘You think I’d let you do this on your own’? Even after getting his head caved in and buried. Ellie/everyone would be so shook, imagine the face on Abbey 😂
Ellie should’ve pulled a Batman in dark knight returns and told Abby, “All the people I’ve murdered by letting you live” Ellie would’ve saved lives if she killed Abby
Ellie didn't kill Abby because of Lev. What would happen to him after Abbys death? There was Joel who helped Ellie to grow up, but who could help Lev after he lost his sis and mom? Well... at least that's how I see it, you can be angry and it's ok.
flawed logic. In an apocolpytic scenario everybody is killing people in order to survive whether that be for resources, self defense, pleasure or any other reason. By your logic joel should have been put down many years ago.
@@SlayerDUDE1993 That sounds like head cannon. Ellie saw Joel no lev. If lev woke up and begged for abbys life and the game paralleled Joel's death then that would make sense.
Xterno50 Also it’s called instinct I think most people would save their daughter in the heat of the moment as they can’t think logically so you can’t blame Joel plus the vaccine wouldn’t be 100 percent certified. And I never praised Joel’s actions so I don’t know where you got that from
Its like if Frisk from Undertale killed all of the monsters in the Underground and when they face sans, sans is like 'Nah I forgive you'. And lets them pass
If you try to spare Sans at that point, my man pulls a Get Dunked On and blasts you into oblivion, because MERCY DOESN'T MATTER ANYMORE AFTER YOU'VE KILLED THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE and Toby Fox, being an intelligent person & an intelligent game designer, realized it perfectly (so in short yeah I agree with you).
Sans didn't have a child who would've resented Frisk if she'd killed him and she also wouldn't have lived with the remorse of killing someone's parent in front of them much like was done to her at the beginning of the game. Stop drawing all these false comparisons
@@yungmetr0135 In good faith? Cool, nobody gonna mention this doctor pulls a scalpel in between a father and daughter defending his ability to experiment on and kill a child for the *possibility* of creating a cure, a cure that may not be feasible to mass produce either. This doctor, a man of science and presumably reason decided to not let Ellie choose. But no it's entirely Joel's fucking fault.
Watching this ending for the first time and I’m so confused about the moral this ending is supposed to tell. If it’s supposed to be about forgiveness, it’d be way stronger if Ellie hadn’t gone after Abby that second time and stayed with Dina on the farm. If it’s supposed to be about how revenge takes everything from you then...let Ellie actually get her revenge so that the message doesn’t get muddled. Shocking ideas, I know.
Exactly!!!!! This right here. Everyone defending it was like oh she realised at the last second that why even tho she forgave she still lost everything. Like wtf??? Im no big writer but even i came up with the same comclusion as you did.
@@finleymorris04 WHAT? Abby lost her humanity and was consumed with revenge. Then, as a result of getting that revenge, she unleashed Ellie and Tommy on them all and lost EVERYTHING. Reading through the comments by people who hate this game just paints a clearer picture of how they either have 0 emotional maturity and understanding, or they were blinded by hate due to the spoilers and let that cloud their judgement going forward.
@@EccentricMeati swear! Enjoying and understanding this games story, depends solely on how you, as a person, is able to percieve different perspectives. Big reason why i respect it aswell, is the risks they took. They told a story, that they wanted to tell, not one that would satisfy the fans.
Absolutely not. Did you play the game? Abby's actions to Joel was justified. She was far saner, logical, & far more measured than Elle was in her pursuit of revenge.
@@josejeronimo4409 Yes. Thanos is a mad titan, he does bad things conscious of what he's doing. What Abby did was bad, but what Joel did to Abby's dad was also bad, and what Ellie was about to do when she could've killed Abby would've been bad as well, but she realized that it wouldn't bring Joel back and neither would bring satisfaction to her, just like Abby got none from killing Joel, therefore if she continued with that she just would get more and more bad things in her life, and end up like Abby, that in a comparison, lost way more than Ellie.
The Last Of Us 2 is like if Ares had Kratos kill his wife, and daughter, and instead of murdering Ares Kratos gives him a high five, and a turbo mansion.
Raven_ Rez “she’s pregnant” “Good” Nah she seems pretty shitty to me Edit: well the difference between Ellie and Abby is that one of them enjoyed killing a pregnant woman and the other didn’t. There seems to be a lot of genuine sociopaths in the replies if you can tell the difference between them
She should have found Abby dead and screamed in agony at missing her revenge. That it was all for nothing. Qué a flash back of Joel and Ellie.. then finish the flash back with Ellie hearing someone crying. It's lev, their still alive. Ellie gets them down and they rush to leave as the violence ramps up behind them. The end
The ending should have been choice driven. Whether you abandon her at the pillars to die. Or you take too long and she's already dead. If you untie her, then you kill her yourself or you can choose to spare her. Then they give you alternative endings according to the decision you've taken.
Abby: *kills Joel as he killed someome close to her ages ago* Ellie: *saw that Abby killed Joel in front of her very eyes and lets her live* There should have been an option in this game where you are allowed whether to kill or not to kill off certain characters, it would make more sense from my point of view
i think the people that wanted ellie to kill abby at the end really didn’t get the point of the game at all. yes, the revenge is complete, but where is the evolution in the characters? did the actions that you took trough out the whole game really made an impact on you?
@@orangelarian4754 Joel died and they were as dead as Ellie was, and continued to be dead even after Ellie finally made a good, non selfish decision. Their emotions were fueled by hate and hate alone. Feel bad for 'em.
richystardust this comments funny bc the game bashes you over the head with this tired ass message of revenge and violence is bad (in a zombie game where violence was normal in the first game) yet Abby gets to do and destroy whatever she wants. The bias is almost as laughable as the writing.
SizzlingGuatemalan the only “bad” thing abby did in the game was killing joel, but in her mind it wasn’t a bad thing to do in that moment. after joel’s death, abby didn’t find the internal closure she thought she would find, until she met lev and yara. and the game isn’t showing that violence is bad, the game is only trying to make you see that maybe the people that you are killing are not as bad as you think they are. in some cases they definitely are bad, but in some other cases maybe you are killing a good person thinking that they are bad because of which group they are, or their ideas, etc.
I'm surprised I don't see more people drawing parallels to Season 8. Characters built to be one way then suddenly acting different to make the plot happen. Most people bring up Joel not falling for the ambush in the first game as an example, and it's not bad. But later on he even tells Ellie he's been on both sides of that situation. That is not the same dude.
Imagine if John Marston fought his way to the top of the mountain and chose not to kill Micah. Imagine if John Wick chose not to kill the guy that killed his dog after everything. Imagine if Kratos killed all the other gods but spared Zeus. Imagine if Niko Bellic let Dimitri Raskalov go at the end. Imagine if the Punisher spared the people who killed his family. But hey, revenge bad, right?
Joel 5 minutes into the apocalypse. In the car with his daughter and brother. Tommy: “there’s a family” Joel “ don’t stop” Tommy “they have a kid” Joel “AND SO DO WE!” Joel in TLOU2 HI MY NAME IS JOEL!
It’s a tragic, poetic ending. Pretty sure I’m in the minority of fans who enjoyed this brutal game. It shows how ugly people really are, seeking revenge. Ellie didn’t even know Abby’s full story but spared her life, we the player gets to see both perspectives and a majority of the outcry is that we didn’t kill someone in the end. It truly goes to show you how ugly humanity really is.
The problem is the whole story plays with Abby (except for the revenge on Joe at first). No Elie or anyone was mentioned. And abby had a whole story of her own, after she killed Joel , look like she forgot about everything and moved on and it was insulting.
The ending bugs me because there are two ways the message could have been clear: 1) If the message of the story is that "Revenge won't give you what you want," then the game should have had Ellie go through with the killing and go back to an empty home. Basically, "I've had revenge, but at what cost?" 2) If the message of the story is "Revenge will destroy you, but if you want to heal, break the cycle," then Ellie should have been able to walk away from Abby AND come back to Dina, with the chance for a now-frayed but still salvageable relationship. Maybe Ellie would have found her in Jackson, and she could have started over. Instead, the writing does this middle ground garbage and muddles the message. Allowing Abby to walk away with a second chance with new family BUT ALSO leaving Ellie with nothing but loneliness and wounds just comes off as morally hollow, unfair bullshit.
I strongly disagree. This is an infatuation with a happy ending thinly veiled. There is nothing wrong with a gray/morally deprived story. That is what make shows like The Boys good. It should be more prevalent in games, IMO. Elle realized Joel started this in the first place; while he was like a father to her, he was imperfect and did deeds that would without a doubt he could not offset with how it ultimately kept humanity stuck in a loop with his selfishnesses-regardless his emphatic some can be of him not willing to let Elle go as a surrogate father. Elle accepted this about Joel once she found out what he did in the hospital.
I don’t think the message is any of those things, the message is not about revenge, but about forgiveness. Also Abby doesn’t exactly walk away without any consequences.
I honeslty feel like the last scene with ellie and joel was the real ending until neil druckman decided to do something different. It just seems like it would work. Dina dying instead of joel. And part 3 is all about ellie trying to forgive joel
Yeah, I thought Dina was going to die too. That misleading ass trailer is what did it. Your idea of part 3 sounds beautiful if they could've executed it the right way. I feel the same way about The Last of Us as I did about Game of Thrones. At least with Game of Thrones there's a second chance at changing things since the last book will be released one day.
I was hoping part II would be about Ellie's parents... maybe her real dad shows up and puts strain on Joel and Ellie's relationship. there really could've been so many possibilities
@@hannahtucker4694 never thought about that. Sounds like it could have worked. Honeslty anything involving ellie and joels relationship im sure this game would have been a 10/10 for everyone. It just doesnt work without them both.
@@ThaRedPitbull the trailer was a knife in the back to the fans. It was only to make us think it was joel and ellie again. Only time i felt emotion in this game were the flashbacks.
@@walterpinkman6570 Yep, I agree. If only the game was as good as the first hour or so. The scene with Joel singing for Ellie made me tear up when I first saw it. I think it would been cool if they didn't fuck up the story and ended part II with Ellie and Joel singing together and then ending with them smiling at each other. Gross and Cuckman are idiots.
Naughty Dog should have done TLOU2 in the fashion of the Silent Hill franchise: Silent Hill 1, 2, 3 & 4 are not directly connected to each other, and have different protagonists with different stories. But nooooo, Neil Druckmann and Naughty Dog had to massacre the ambiguous beauty of TLOU1, whilst completely destroying beloved characters beyond recognition for shock value and subvert the audiences expectations. TLOU2 is even worse than Star Wars: The Last Jedi / Star Wars: Rise of Skywalker, Game of Thrones: Season 8. Massively disappointing.
Morbid Lust I couldn’t have said it better myself. What happened to this franchise is utter betrayal. “Put your faith in us, we’re gonna do right by you” they said. What a lie that turned out to be. The slimiest thing of the situation is how they sold this as another game with Joel & Ellie. Look at all the marketing and how prominent Joel was, even going as far as to change his and Ellie’s character models to make them look older in the flashbacks to trick us into thinking they’d have more screen time together. They even swapped Jesse out for Joel in that State of Play trailer to get us hyped, fucking assholes. They capitalized on the popularity of these characters to sell the game, knowing full well no one would buy this garbage if they knew what actually happened. Don’t even get me started on how Abby wasn’t in the marketing at all!
@@Skikopl Complete false comparison. the analogy would only be accurate if john wick had killed the mobster's wife and the mobster had a dog of his own causing john wick to not be able to bring himself to kill the mobster
Alex’s take I really liked. The disconnect between the story and gameplay is honestly ridiculous. I think we all know what will be #1 on the Top 10 most disappointing games of the year.
The Monologuer she didn’t Arthur didn’t avenge anyone by dying on the mountain or dying going back for the money either. He gave John a chance at life. Just like Joel gave Ellie a Chance at life. And they both blew it by going for revenge. John by killing micha alerting the pinkertons, and Ellie by killing Abby’s friends causing her to destroy her friends and push her down a deeper darker cycle of hatred
@@skidzzthewiz9226 I disagree mostly, Joel's death meant literally nothing besides move the plot of the story, in which in the end meant nothing after everything Ellie went through, besides just lose everything, I get that hatred can lead down a dark path and etc, but the whole damn story could've been told a different way! They didn't make the player invest into the idea that vengeance was a dark path. It mainly targeted towards making Ellie look bad. Her character was treated horribly, just like Joel's character death horribly, Ellie didn't redeem anything at all, the only message players received is that life is horrible, and that the person who caused it should be allowed to live so that she also can go and ruin other's lives.
@@skidzzthewiz9226 if ur father was murdered wouldn't u go out to kill the killer? Wouldn't u want justice? I get Joel killed Abby's dad, but her dad wanted to kill Ellie, even tho there's no point when the whole human population is a mere sliver. Of course Joel was gonna try to save the closest thing to a daughter, he lost it once, he's not gonna sit there and do nothing about it
Imagine the outrage if at the end of RDR2 John Marston said “just go” to Micah. Imagine. I mean shit, imagine having to play as Micah in the open world after killing Arthur? People would be pretty fucking upset. Anyone who says that “you shouldn’t be mad at The Last of Us 2” either hasnt played the first game, or is someone who doesn’t play games often and doesn’t understand how impactful video game stories are to some people. I was genuinely sad after finishing this game. I was depressed. Neil hurt me. I waited 7 years to play this game after making so many good memories playing the first with my older brother. This really hurt me.
@@Perrylayne105 idiots like you just keep saying: "it's poor writing" without even know what are you talking about, you're just a little kids that didn't had his farytail story
You completely missed the point of God of War 2018 then. Kratos wouldn’t have killed Baldur if he thought revenge was badass, he killed Baldur to put an end to the cycle of violence and revenge. Kratos got his revenge and it ended up almost destroying him and the entire world, even so it still left him with nothing.
@@cam4748 Exactly, he still got his revenge and that was still not enough for him ending himself just as empty, alone, and unsatisfied. That's the biggest mistake LoU2 made, you fight to kill those who destroy your everything and you conveniently decide in a 2 sec flashback to not kill her. Give my a fucking break. Just bad.
I cant wait for the review. She lost all those people, all her friends and family, lost two fingers, JUST TO LET HER GO?! SHE KILLED A PREGNANT WOMAN TO GET TO ABBY AND JUST LETS HER LEAVE.
@Mr. Vic how are you defending the attackers lol Ellie defended herself and she was dumb enough to try anything while she was pregnant, it was her decision to attack Ellie
And Ellie didnt Kill Owen and Mel coldblooded! Owen attacked her and got shot and then Ellie fights with Mel After Mel attacked Ellie... AND after that then Ellie get back to the Theater she was shocked and shakin
Y’all are really trying to say Ellie acted in self-defense? Mel and Owen were literally chillin in the aquarium until Ellie came in with a pistol pointed at them.
Just gonna pretend the game was just a bad dream and after she wakes up from it she has that conversation with Joel on the porch and that’s it Joel is alive and everything is fine
So let me try revise the whole story through what I've seen in other people's comments: Main character from previous game got killed by Mrs. X because she lost a game of wii sports resort golf and then the other playable character let her go in the end while it-hulk didn't show any form of regret and basically got away with everything
Just love how after all she's done, the game makes her be so weak and pathetic at the moment where you get to take your revenge. It's such a way to FORCE you to feel pity for Abby...
M .G.F then its entirely an argument that relies on the emotional upset from butthurt people, in that case there isn’t an interesting conversation to be made.
@@shy7940 Exactly, all I hear is "mimimi, Joel is dead, therefore game is shit, mimimi" without paying any attention to the narrative and details ND built into this game.
I laughed too hard at this. Fucking imagine, GOD OF WAR and NARUTO did the revenge plot much, much better than this game. Like, WTF. Krators was made as a meme for being a ruthless killing machine before the latest GoW came out. Then people joked about Naruto and his cringe talk-no-jutsu shit, yet the anime and manga still did a very good job with the revenge plot & conclusion. This game is absolute hot garbage. Literally fucking lol.
Looks like she didn’t kill Abby because she realized Joel wanted Ellie to have a “normal” long life. But at that same time she doesn’t realize how Joel strongly thinks you need to fight for it though. Hence him saying he’d kill the fireflies again. Therefore she’s betraying his beliefs because she sniffs her own farts. That ending is some groan zone quality.
It’s a good ending. I even felt like what’s the point of killing Abby when she was choking her under the water. I agreed with Ellie’s decision to let Abby go.
Clearly nobody understands the deep meaning of this game. That it's a strong well written story about how you shouldn't waste sixty dollars on a sequel just because the first one was amazing. Man it's a real 10/10 if you think about it.
I've heard a lot of people refer to the last fight as an "honorable duel". Yes because fighting a person that's weak from starvation and unarmed while you yourself have a knife is completely honorable.
Just as honorable as overwhelming one old fella with multiple people and brutally killing him with a 9 iron. Wish she disemboweled Abby at the end. But at least Abby loses all of her friends
@@nightrunning5870 Oke i need to know. does literally NOBODY understand Abby's point of view here? Joel murdered her father for selfish reasons. She murdered Joel for revenge. Then suddenly Ellie killing off ALL of her friends AND the man she loves is a good thing because we liked Ellie in the first game? Joel is a monster for literally EVERYONE for what he did. OFCOURSE they beat his ass to death! When i played as Abby in the second half, i completely understood her point of view and her feelings. I don't understand why no one here thinks "oh fuck, Joel did take away the only real option to save the world. i understand why people want revenge especially after he killed her father." Ellie said in the first game that he worst fear is her being alone. Her need for revenge took Dina away from her. and the baby. and Jesse. Ellie went through hell, but so did Abby. Everybody is killing everybody in the last of us world because of hate and revenge and the cycle continues. Ellie remembering a good memory at the end while choking Abby makes her realize that killing Abby just makes everything worse and doesn't fix anything. She lost her fingers during the fight and now can't even properly play guitar anymore. Revenge took everything from her. Jesse, Dina and potato baby. To us Joel was a knight in shining armor. Saving Ellie who he cares for like his own daughter. But nobody seems to be able to put themselves in the shoes of somebody who got their father murdered for selfish reasons by Joel. Joel was an absolute monster for what he did. He completely screwed the world of any chance it has to create a vaccine. and then Killed Abby's father on top of that.
Lol. Completed the game and thought about replaying. Then I thought about the boring parts and the abby parts and was like fuck that ima go play tlous1.
Why should it focus on Joel and Ellie, it's not what the first game already did? I guess all the critics just wanted to play a repeat of the original "The last of us" 🤦🏼♂️
@@christophersidebothom7919 its because they are the essence why we love and want to play part 1 and 2. And now Naughty Dog screwed us. They force to give us a new main character that is not even relevant in the first game. They didnt even gave us a glimpse of abby in the first part
If it focused on Ellie and Joel THEN it would have been like a random TWD episode. There's not a lot more to explore there and flashbacks really covered it all.
TheDeadlyBlueWolf except we aren’t her and we as the players don’t initially give a shit about her and when the game has her kill joel without us getting a chance to care about her she becomes irredeemable
Ok so abby loses everything AFTER getting her revenge. Makes sense for the theme. Ellie loses everything BEFORE getting her revenge though. What’s stopping her from killing a horrible person like Abby if she’s already lost everything? She wouldn’t be any less lonely if she chose to go through with it.
@@gilgamesh8334 and there in lies the point. It is wrote that was so us as the players feel she is finding redemption even though she regrets nothing. Its some ole bullshit
Imagine thinking this is a good story 😂 Fanboys are saying that abby is a better character than joel 😂 I am a big fan of the first game but not a blind fanboy
There's a niche public who loves this kind of suffering/misery porn. I mean, look at the joker movie. Even if the misery makes no sense, let's overexpose that to this zoomer and millenniums generations who thinks the world is so bad and mean with them
@@RRRRRRRRR33 I can kinda see what you said but I think even the Joker endend up in a better place than Ellie doe. He ends up self aware that he's "mad" and actually can get some kind of joy from it, he ends up in a "better" place than he started. Ellie just ends up in complete misery. I mean I think they wanted us to see Ellie in this better place, breaking free the infamous "circle of violence", Joel's "control" over her life, as at the end she wanders for a new start. But that looks like absolute hell to me (yeah I get the life isn't what you want). She will never get over Joel's death nor have the courage/see the point to finish Abby. She has no family as her wife is gone and they even want to show us that she can't even play guitar anymore, as a sign of her having not much to relate to Joel. That just reasured the "misery porn" aspect of this game. Looks like Druckman thought people liked Sarah's death and Ellie/David scene because of the shock value not the they're ending in a better place than they started thing. It didn't had me questioning my beliefs like the first game it just made me uncorfortable and dragged me down.
@@RRRRRRRRR33 And tbh I thought the whole message the could make you empathize with Joel is that "the world is shit" and it didn't really deserve the death of that girl to save it, in contrast that this girl was born from that world and many others could do too, at least that was the starting point of what made me love the first game. So I didn't really get that part of your comment xD
@@f.miller801 That's the thing, the world is shit. People are shitty. Society is not entirely just. And that's ok, this is the world we have. You can't simply say "fuck it, I go live in the moon". This is the issue with this niche public who got so distressed and lonely (a direct consequence of the internet), they assume the world is worse than hell. "I am sad and lonely, this world is mean, my little life is not being accepted by the majority, my wrists will cry if you don't look at me", meanwhile people are starving to death in africa, china is enslaving millions, our environment is getting fucked, etc So, when you force the issue and show a caricature of mental illness in the Joker movie, you end up trivializing the whole problem. You are not raising awareness for schizophrenic people, you are doing it for the fake praise and awards. Same goes for Last of Us 2, the theme is centered around on the concept of "hate", right? So... let's smudge violence and use minorities in villainous situations to make you feel uncomfortable. So much blood, so much shock value for the sake of shock value (as you mentioned), etc.. it desensitize the whole thing, the message get lost in the process. When you have so many whiners complaining about everything, wanting every minority to be "included", so much conservatism to a point of resembling fascism... And you give attention to this public, you tailor your product to be appealing to them? Good luck with that. You got "dragged down" because you are not the target audience, these people actually enjoys the misery (believe me, I unfortunately know some of them. Lonely social justice warriors who fights on twitter 24 hours a day)
Thank you for the message of revenge leads to revenge causing you to lose everything except if your abby. Also another thank you for trying to guilt trip us into feeling bad for a psychopath. 0/10
Did Ellie lose everyone though? I thought that Tommy, Dina and her baby are fine and still with her, it's only the Asian guy who died during Ellie's revenge course.
@@baconingbad Tommy and Dina left Ellie as Dina as she took the baby too, they abandon Ellie and Ellie's worst fears came true, she is alone now. So yeah Ellie did lose everyone.
That revenge is pointless, and what’s done is done, abbys dad, friends are gone and all she’s has is lev. Ellie lost Joel and Jesse and now Dina and JJ Due to her nt being able to let things go. Both characters lostSo Ellie leaves to find Abby for revenge even though for Abby it’s over but for Ellie it isn’t, even in the end Ellie wants Abby to fight by threatening to kill lev if she didn’t, not until then did Ellie realize through seeing that glimpse of JoelWhere as Abby was in the military force known as WLF. So she has that background and after she killed Joel she was done with that but Ellie needed her revenge and killed all of abbys group so Abby wanted her revenge and went to the theatre which after that Ellie can’t let it goAbby kills Joel cause Joel killed her dad so Abby trained to be a killing machine to get that revenge cause she’s a broken person, Ellie goes on a journey of revenge to kill Abby who killed Joel, yes while Ellie regrets some some of her kills she still does themI don’t think you are willing to see the big picture here, Abby killed Joel for pleasure and revenge for her father and Ellie was and guess what? Ellie was going to do the same. Let’s take the gameplay out of question and focus on both Abby and Ellie. Abby let Ellie go so many time, but Ellie never listened. Dina even convinced her to stop but she didn't. Therefore, Ellie lost everything due to a stupid revenge which ruined her life/family.
To be honest when i saw the Joel flash with the guitar when you're drowning Abby i thought that was a reminder of WHY SHE HAS TO KILL HER but i guess not?
Alex makes the point about "leaving one guard while the villain leaves" cliche, but that was literally in the first one as well when Marlene leaves Joel in the hospital with one guard to march him down. However, Alex may have disliked that too, hard to tell.
whats truly sad is the only part of this game that caused an emotional reaction from me was that flashback scene with Ellie and Joel at the end, I started bawling. the last five mins of a game that you don't even get to play just watch should not be better than the rest put together.
That was the point. The rest of the game was just as engaging. Normally you don’t hate when a character dies. You guys aren’t realizing that they was never going to go on a journey together again. Joel was getting old
@@jchibz_4313 No, I could really care less that you didn't get to play as Joel. I don't believe any part of my previous comment had anything to do with that. And no the rest of the game was not equally as ingaging as the end flashback. It was boring as hell.
@@christianescobar3209 You know, one involved with a super shady organization, that likely lacked the means to suddenly invent fungal vaccines, that didn't allow for closure between the involved parties (partially Marlene's fault there too), and couldn't even answer when grilled on whether or not he could do the same to Abby.
Now I don’t mind the whole thing of Ellie being alone and broken after this. Like the Last of Us is set in a dark, dark world so it seems fitting that Ellie’s greatest fear comes to life. It’s just the execution. Maybe if Ellie’s obsession with killing Abby drove everyone away and she actually did it and felt nothing but emptiness afterwards it would work. Naughty Dog get their “eye for an eye makes the whole world blind” moral and we get a satisfying conclusion to the story. Of course that’s both everything they could’ve changed to make the game better but for now I’ll go with this. Instead. Ellie let’s Abby live for some reason. Like not only did she kill someone you consider a father, someone you said you were trying to forgive. But you went through so much just for this moment. You’ve killed pregnant women for this, you’ve lost your girlfriend who’s having a kid of her own for this hell, you lost your uncle for this and you decide to just… let the one person you sacrificed all of this to kill… walk away. Not just walk away either you decide to spare her life right as your about to kill her. Literally the last moments and instead of just finishing it you’re gonna save her and let her walk!? It’s a cop out and I don’t know why they would do it other than for sequel material. In doing that they just take so much away from this ending which would’ve actually been an interesting one were it not for everything else wrong with the game’s story.
