Deepmind 12 vs DSI OB6 

I think it's something to do with the viscosity of the teak oil adding a creamy finish

Tonewood

*cough* SARCASM

@Bunty McCunty You can if you eat green beans and pull your butt a little!

@Bunty McCunty are you showing off about your narrow cheeks ;)

demistified

listen to the "some sounds" section. they sound very different.

@@marlonjarek9071 sound different yes but not anyone of them is really better, you can tweak the hell out of both and the price point of the ob6 literally no longer makes any sense. The ob6 is not a great synth and I know that this is blasphemy among the synth crowd but I really dont think it sounds that great. Heard much better sounding stuff like Nord Lead A1, Roland JDXA, Virus Ti2 etc etc. and they also have much more features at a lower price than the ob6. The fact that the dm12 comes that close for 680 bucks will shake the market a bit.

@@ezassegai4793 agreed. didnt mean better, just different. i personally dont care what brand a synth is from. i use everything, lots of software too. but the ob-6 sound always felt special to me though. so lets hope it gets a little less expensive, so that maybe i can own one some day haha.

@@marlonjarek9071 yes mate I would totally wish for you that you get that synth if you like it that much man. Hope you make that dream come true for yourself.

ayup mate ;-)

Bought em both. Deepmind 12 keyboard, ob6 desktop

@@MajorOSC and how do u feel about them? Is the OB6 worth the price difference? Can the DM do almost all the OB6 can? Thanks!

@@sentokan you get what you pay for. Dm12 does ALOT more. If you're planning to make music / produce, dm12. If you like synths and just play around and noodle, ob6 feels more immediate, immensely more analog lush sounding. Couldn't tell anyone which to buy.

@@MajorOSC Thank you! I want it for production but in my production I also play as I record and a great sound inspires me more.. that s why I thought OB6 untill I saw the comparison and not anymore entirely sure it s worth the price difference.

ob6 and dm are both great....

Hey which setting is this under?

also wondering

me wondering too

@@sentokan From the manual: "Note: When using UNISON DETUNE in combination with the OSC KEYDOWN RESET setting (in the OSC1 EDIT menu), you will hear the effects of phase drift much more clearly, as the OSCs will all start from the same point on their waveforms."

Exactly that's why I have OB-6 and Pro-2 for the epic modulations. ;)

@Konstantin Ridaya Yes indeed. On a budget, the DM12 offers an outstanding value for money ratio. Plus, it does sound great once you're willing to explore its capabilities and forget about the meh presets. And if programming such a device is not really one's thing, there are always sound banks available for download at minimal cost. Such as the excellent ones from GEOSynths (which I had bought for the DM12).

It certainly does, I don't own either of them but there's no way on earth that OB-6 is 4X the price of a Deep mind 12...Crazy.

@@maydaygoingdown5602 The deepmind is solid as far as I have heard. It is probably the best value in the entire industry right now. Its also Behringers first original Synth. This thing is gonna cost a fortune 2 years from now, when people are swimming in nostalgia

EZ Assegai i have to say, that my confirmation bias lends me to agree with you. I have a dm12, and it was my first poly. I stumbled into a world I wasn’t prepared for.

Hopefully you’ve got one now, the prices will have dropped a little too. Love mine to bits and holds up well with the likes of my Peak and Virus tI.

Or was it a very stripped-back Baba O’Riley … ? 🤔😜

Haha me too!! Bring it on ;)

Agreed, For the price today of the OB-6 I could think of 3 synth modules for that price, Deepmind, Novation peak, and a Moog mother. Or Deepmind, Peak, and 2X Behringers equivalent of the Moog mother that sound pretty much identical to the Moog mother as shown and demonstrated on this very channel. That 3 module combo blows the OB 6 away in both modulation, sound, and features. For the same price or slightly less.

To me it sounds at least 3x as good.

Ob6 has soul! Just my humble opinion...

The Neutron is an original also.

You learn a lot by copying.

Yeah… it’s not really possible without the SEM style filter on those types of sounds where your using a blend of LP HP or notch, but with a bit of care and for sounds using the LP12 there’s enough to keep you busy.

Have you checked the tuning in the Global Tune (found using the POLY EDIT switch) transpose and Global tune should be set at 0. If they are, try recalibrating the voices (page 34 of the manual).

@@StarskyCarr I'm definitely in the right direction now! I really appreciate it! Great video too! Your knowledge is awesome!

Haha, Check out a fuller version I made using only softsynths. Sounds amazing (I was surprised how well it worked). Oberheim OB/SEM Softsynth comparison ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-mLqfRAhZGbE.html

I've only played it once - at Synthfest UK. It felt like a quality instrument and sounded great... but I've not had one in the studio to give any real insight.

The point is that the DM is 90% of the sound at 1/6 the cost...a lot of us could "get by" with that and buy new mics or go on a vacay with the leftovers...

@@thegood9 True. I am not comparing prices here just sound. Indeed a lot of money for the OB6 that's why I bought the REV2 instead.

Jason Lee 90% of WHAT???

I tried with my prodigy vs grandmother.. I even went so far as to have random cards giving instructions on what to di with each knob ie random tweaking always sounds good (almost). I editted that bit out as it was going in far too long but it’s a nice idea to revive.

Enjoy it…. Don’t worry, it’s a very decent synth, especially for the price. Watch my Juno106 vs the DM videos to see how capable it is. … plus a whole lot more. It’s divisive because it’s a Behringer. Not because of its capabilities or sound.

yeah... a bit of fun. I doubt anyones considering which one to buy - although someone mentioned they were after a Prophet 6 and ended up with a DM12, Model D, Neutron, Timeline and Big Sky plus some lingerie!!!

​@@StarskyCarr Hey starsky I was wondering, do you feel like the ob has a little more low end and high end than the deep mind ? I noticed (comparing my ob 6 to the minilogue that the ob has definitely more "quality" sound). I want to buy the deepmind, but Im not sure if it has that "low quality" of the minilogue... even though its better than digital sound... thanks

@@ultraconchetsap I think the OB has a more overall polished tone than the DM. It's easier to get the sound I'm looking for. You can generally get them to sound very similar if staying within the tones the oscillators the DM can create - it's just easier to get a 'nice' tone on the OB. I wouldn't say the DM doesn't have the bass though... it's not something that has occurred to me while comparing them at least. Maybe it plays a part in getting that perfect tone, but as I say you can normally get there on the DM with a little more effort... sometimes with no more effort. Perhaps people using the 2nd oscillator as OSC2 rather than a sub (as on the 106 or OB6) loses bass on a lot of patches.

Starsky Carr thanks for answering !

Yes, you'd think that DSI (now called Sequential) would have evolved from the limited computer technology of the early eighties by now... 🙄

Jason Lee not steppy at all. Those are called HARMONICS.

Oh yes, I´ll jump on it as soon as it comes out.

How did you know its coming this year? Just curious, couldnt find any info myself

@@iTsSdRaWkCaB This year or early 2020... The prototype are ready... Uli have only to estimate a production price... Isn't cheap as model d or odyssey... I think he cost like prologue 8 around 1100 euros...

Maybe this year?

Maybe next year

I think it’s a fantastic first synth. Behringer gets a lot of grief about quality. Maybe it wasn’t so good on old products, but they’ve invested in the new factory etc so that’s all in the last. I’ve owned a lot of synths and have had more problems with non-Behringer ‘high end’ expensive synths. I’m not sure there’s much, if any difference in quality these days. All manufacturers have issues, and we hear more about problems than those that work flawlessly.

Actually, there is a way for many people, like yourself, to own the synth of their dreams if you can make monthly payments. Go to zZounds web site and see if you qualify for their interest-free payment plan. If you want a DM 12 and can afford $69 a month for a year, or $46 a month for the DM 6 then you're in luck. That's what I did over 3 years ago and I also bought the DSI Rev2-16 and almost have a Moog Grandmother paid for. Most of the time they don't do a credit check. Other music sites like Americanmusical and Sweetwater (I have their credit card too) also offer a payment plan but they check credit. I prefer zZounds and they've helped me to outfit my home studio with a mixer, speakers, and high-quality headphones (Neumanns NDH-20). Good luck!

flat5sharp11 Good point, you’re quite right... I missed that. Shows how deep the DM12 goes. I made this after having played it for a few weeks.. it’s so flexible I was bound to miss something, no matter how hard I tried!! I did wonder why it was so different but could find the answer. I hope you enjoyed the rest of it though... ?? Maybe a thanks for the vid, but a point to note is that there’s a way around the phase issues you were having around 16:46 ... would have been a more reasonable approach? Just feels a little ungrateful :(

Wow.. what a waste of cash... you're better off holding on for the £50k version 2

The OB, if only for its more hands on approach. Menu diving is always a drag.

I almost did - but had to send the Rev2 back as it had issues... Have you checked out my Prophet 6 vs Rev 2 comparison? It'd be very similar to this which is another reason I never got round to doing it when I had it - I wasn't sure how much it would add... still wish I had now!

@@StarskyCarr I'm thinking about taking one of them, very different instruments but i need an analog poly in my setup which is gonna be the only one at the moment. The battle is between the character of the OB6 vs the many modulations and possibilities of the Rev2. What do you think about it?

Salvatore Vitale if I only had one poly I’d go for the Rev2. I originally had the Pro8 and loved it. Sold it after getting the P6 and OB6. Was considering replacing both with the Rev2. I had a couple of issues with the voices that put me off in the end, but wouldn’t discount it because of them... I had run out of time to send it back!! Might consider it again in the future tbh.

No it didn’t add anything to my current set up. I have A fair few polys - I tend to keep the ones that I can’t replicate with anything else - like the MONOpoly, 2600, CAT, WASP etc.

Are you being serious? On this I play different tones and generate the same patches on both, demonstrating how they differ patch by patch rather than individual oscillators 🤷‍♂️as I tweak each you can hear if and why they sound different. Not sure if you’re trolling or responding to the wrong video. This couldn’t be more of a side by side comparison. I’ll leave it there… if you can’t hear the differences or h set stand after watching this I can’t help sorry.

@@StarskyCarr your comparison is well made and goes very deep into the functionality and sound of the two instruments. I am a very long time engineer and musician and i should have my ears trained. I have both vintage and Behringer synths and many bays of boutique gear, together wirh big Amphions etcetera, just to make you sure about my capabilities of hearing the differences. I'm sorry, i don't ment to offend. Just my point of view. I did not have the time to see the whole video, i needed something to just see if the thing can be used in a "pro' enviroinement or is a waste of money. Not just the sound is important for me but also, for example, the "ease" of use or, sometime, if the instrument is a "one trick pony" and last if it "inspires" me rather than being boaring. I'm finding for those answers in researching for other user's experiences and i was looking at your video just for a matter of sound as i decided already the instrument is "fine" for me. In order to answer to this question i was looking for someone who played only patches but i did not find any. I'm not a piano player, unfortunately! So i do not go as deep in programming as those who play keyboards and TO ME does not make sense to hear the difference in the Sine, Pulse and so on. I know you played patches too but when you need something "on the fly" to hear it side to side to more expensive instruments it takes time if you don't have exactly the same patches played with no stop. As i said, i know your pourpose is another. And is more "scientific". I hope mine is not taken as criticism. I know everybody puts so many work and passion in making videos and i can immagine the experience you have, also in playing your instruments. Is not my intent to criticize but is also difficoult to explain those thoughts in a short comment. Your video is GOOD and hepls a lot those who wants to go deep in the thing. To me it works better an A/B straight comparison. Sorry if i offended. Best whishes. Marco

And i already have an OB 6!🤓😅

I do a lot af comparisons when mixing or tracking to find for the best preamp or compressor to use. In order to get the difference is very, very important the loop or track or whatever you use is not too long, not too short and does not have variations, and than you go fro A to B without ANY other sound in between!!! Neither your voice!!! If not you can't get the difference of the gear you are trying to compare. This was the problem i tried to suggest. Sample used of part you play has to be something simple with no changes. The ears must concentrate on the sound of the gear. This happens even with very experienced ears.

Yes, i saw you play same patches, is just to fast for me to catch the difference. It sound similar but i can't understand really. I need a few seconds of playing of one keyboard and than the same of the other. If you play single notes that fast i can't get it and, again, i'm playing my instrument since '89 and staying in front of a DAW since '96 every day of my life, running my studio, mixing at night, not sleeping, moving things everyday, tond of hardware, drums and heavy amps, connecting cables and all sort of it like many people so please, please, consider mine as a point of view of someone who makes this as a job and not as a game, as i guess you do... i hope you get the point...

Me too :)

An OB clone is coming? Take my money!

@@Synthfidel There is a UB-Xa that has been announced from Behringer about a year ago... Following their Model D (Minimoog D module clone which sounds indistinguishable from the real thing) I sure hope the OB-Xa clone becomes a reality.

LOL 😆 yeah right a trend since the 70's

... exactly :)

@@StarskyCarr There is another patch comparison between OB6 and Novation Peak on youtube by coyotesynth "Blind test: OB6 or Peak?" where he created 20+ patches. It was hardy possible to determine if it was from one or the other. One could come to the (wrong) conclusion: OB6=Peak=DM15=... Beside you released another video on youtube using a talkbox (digitech talker?) With the P6. "Single sawtooth...funky little vocoder" This was awesome and such a catchy (earworm) tune, i'll always remember! Cheers from Vienna, M

You can compare similar things...and you can also compare dissimilar things :)

That or the minilogue, you can make solid arguments for both. Comed down to if you want the polyphony/key size and which you prefer the sound of.

beginner synth?

Pekka Grönfors microkorg prolly

I have no luck with the the DM12 . Quality issues on the first one , returned it and my second has had issues as well . No more Behringer synths for me or at least not on the initial release

@@jarrod9052 I've heard the opposite, that the initial releases are of a better quality (not including the DeepMind)

I have an Ob-6 and it's worth the money. Like all things, the $$$ goes into the subtle details, which matter. Watches, cars, you name it. The used market is where you pick up an OB-6, not a new one.

You got the key fixed right?

Hahaha you wish that was true. Me too BTW. Try to do a xmod with filtertype modulation on the dm

It's literally a detune for the 12 voices. Usually brings the audible volume down due to phase cancellation? (not sure if this is correct). It can be used way past it's usable/audible enjoyment, but with some resonance can give some cool 303 sounding noises. Just another tool, I think if not pushed past a certain point it can add "harmonics", again not sure if that's the correct word to use.

It really depends. Form what I remember, for Unison you can menudive and select how many voices are used. The default setting on the Deepmind is that Key Reset is off. So all oscillators are free running and can cancel eachother out, giving volume drops. You can enable Key reset so each voice starts every key, but that will take away the more organic feel. There is not really a middle ground unfortunately I found

Not even close.

If you don't notice the difference in sound...then yes you are lucky, get the cheap one but the downside is you might want to improve your hearing.

@@ionianechoes Its not about the just the sound difference which by the way there isn't that much in it, it's more about capabilities. For less the price of this synth costs, you could purchase 3X modules that will give you much more tonal and modulation and everything else to go with it that goes far beyond this synths capabilities..and sound. You would be purchasing the Inferior sound. But it your happy with spending more for much less and lesser sound then you might want to improve your knowledge of anolog hardware. Sound wise both tonaly and sonically this synth simply cannot compete, not even close to a 3X minimum cheaper anolog rack module set up...hence it's overpriced. It's a good synth, but it's overpriced for what it is compared to what can be got for less money.

@@maydaygoingdown5602 Maybe.. I'm one of the idiots that paid this much. After having had a Deepmind for a few years. For me personally, I could not get past the thinner base-sound of the Deepmind. Opening the filter has this grainy, ratty texture. I don't know, maybe it's in my head, but it needed a lot of effects to dial that out. Which it has ofcourse. I considered the Rev-2, but that also (for me personally) has some spots opening up the filter that I don't like. For me, everything on the OB-6 sounds great. Doesn't matter what I dial in, it sounds great to me. I have a Model D for basses and a Typhon for more experimental things, so I'm lucky, but to me it's worth knowing that I have a synth that can do everything I want. Maybe not for everyone, but in my experience (with guitars) you can get cheaper ones that half do what you want, and get annoyed, lose money selling them etc. If this synth does not do everything you want/need, it's not worth it. I get it. For me though, I was done buying synths after this beast. That's worth it to me

The effects are pretty good tbh, but I think people rely on them too much. The raw sound is good enough, the FX are more of a distraction to me.

Yeah I have a DM12 and I would say the fx in the patches are overly wet, but maybe the best fx of any poly out there. The raw sound of it is actually fantastic. Just not quite as big as the DSI stuff.

Haha... 😎

Nothing wrong with cloning gear that's not being made anymore or has priced itself out of the hands of those on a budget on the used market.

@@Renzsu hey, I don't disagree with you, it's just how my brain works and why I don't personally like Behringer. I'm fully aware of this only being limited to my own personal point of view. :P I hope that makes sense.

@@CaidicusProductions And I fully understand your point, I'm a product designer, so I'm all too aware of what it feels like to have your work ripped off by others ;) But I feel Behringer are doing it respectfully (they're not doing 1:1 copies and they always mention the original synths in their interviews), and they're not copying the latest hardware. Sometimes a market is just begging to be disrupted, just to get everybody to wake up and pay attention again. I feel Behringer play that role at the moment. I might be wrong, but I feel their approach interests new people into the market and that can only be a good thing in the long run.

@@Renzsu I hadn't really thought of it like that, so I appreciate the expanded perspective. Any specific Behringer synth you'd recommend I take a look at, one that has a very "this is Behringer" look or sound to it?

I dunno man, I'm looking to purchase my first synth so I'm hardly the one to take buying advice from lol. I'm just doing a LOT of research and finding that a lot of synths that I lust after are out of my price range and that Behringer (whilst not as premium or unique, like you mention) are a nice option for newcomers like me. For someone with a limited budget, you also have to consider stuff like warranty and purchasing new vs. paying more for the original used. Then again, the used option will probably hold value better. Btw, I'm not trying to be their business ambassador ;) I'm also looking at a Minilogue, but want to try them both before I make a decision.

Just get a Jupiter 6

The DM is no clone.

Haha... show off :)

SO true but only if its been fully overhauled.

Rembrand Van Dooren ???????

@@SPAZZOID100 Obxa's blow away even a Prophet 5. But you seem more like a Jupiter 6 kind of lad.

It might be weird at first glance, but I'm not pitching one against the other. It's really so anyone who's not had the opportunity to play with both side by side can get a feel for how they sound, and why some folks consider one to be the worst and one the best.

Let these anti-behringer goofs spend all their money on overpriced synths. More excellent, affordable synths for us. You could buy a Behringer D and Neutron and reverb pedal for the cost of a Moog Subsequent 25.

@@camlong89 You get what you pay for. No matter how much you want to convince yourself otherwise it'll always be true.