Hiveswap Lore - Xefros Tritoh: The Page of Rage 

truth

He's not wrong.

Still new but Xefros already became one of my favorites in Homestuck/Hiveswap canon. He’s precious and must be protected.

Mah boy's gonna crack the fucking planet in half with raging mind powers

Calling it now: He's gonna be the team captain of that grand rebellion against the system

I mean, he fuckin slammed (insert troll with potent psykic abilities) so im thinking page as well and also (insert ending spoiler)

That's what I'm here to do, so thank YOU! :D

Hm, fair point! I thought I made it fairly clear by including his symbol from the Zodiac along with the other Rage symbol, but in retrospect that does seem easy to miss if one isn't already attuned to the visual detail of Homestuck/Hiveswap. Hopefully I'll get a chance to clarify that some more later on. Thanks for pointing it out to me!

You were talking about the whole caste's relation to Time at that point so I entirely missed it. It's the only explicit and official bit of information I'm aware of giving the aspect system any significance in Hiveswap so it's worth highlighting to make everything else feel less speculative.

Agreed. Hindsight is 20/20, but I'll definitely bring this up in the next Hiveswap lore video covering classpects, or in our first comments roundup video, whichever comes first. Thanks again!

This prompted me to go through and check the signs on that troll call teaser page. There's a noticeable over abundance of Hope signs in there. 6 of the 24 revealed (37 when it's finished)

optimistic Duelist whoaaaaa this is awesome!

OUTTA THIS HOUSE. *OUTTA THIS HOUSE.* *S P I R I T S B E G O N E F R O M T H I S H O U S E !*

Joey could be Hope bound Just like her father

Too late, Joey took his Moirail already

He is going to DIE

Ben Kilgallon Dammek fits the desceiption of a prince mostly

If you know what princes class are like., then you would know Dammek fits it best.

i don't think we know enough about dammek yet to figure him out especially because we can't tell if his treatment of xefros is well intended but misguided or flat out manipulation. From what we can piece together dammek's headstrong 'action hero' attitude and controlling personality make him seem much more like a thief of blood. His obliviousness to his teammate's feeling while supposedly being a master tactician and leader fit the general theme of Thieves being overly cocky, selfish, and ignorant. But I definitely think it's worth waiting until we learn more about dammek before we pin down his supposed narrative role. Plus classes aren't exclusive dog, there can be more than 1 prince.

That... actually makes sense. huh

But Joey is a doom player

Uh, how?

Cyber well process of elimination. Xefros is a rage player. Dammak is a blood player. Jude is obviously a mind player. So that leaves joey who by process of elimination is a doom player.

everything is terrible They are all completely separate species. And trolls have had several people with duplicate aspects. Many hope and blood players on the Trollcall for example.

You wouldn't have heard of it before, I don't think--the theory was advanced by a friend of mine soon after the Extended Zodiac dropped, and this is the first time I've had a chance to work it into any writing of my own. I link to her original post in the description of this video. And holy crap, great breakdown! Honestly, you made ME feel way more confident about this theory. I've barely been thinking about the troll call trolls at all so far--I was mostly going off Xefros and Dammek. My big guess for Dammek is that he's a Rogue or a Thief of Blood at heart, since he's noted to Take Xefros' stuff pretty often, and Xefros implies he lets him at least partly because he has romantic feelings for Dammek, which definitely sounds like theft "through" Blood. But! The main things he takes from Xefros in Act 1 are his direction/goals, his singing voice by way of the Auto-Tune Mic, and most notably his Hoverpad. The Hoverpad is like...literally an object of detachment, freedom, and motion, so it's easy to link to Breath. Like. The laser it emits is literally Breath blue. So I didn't think I was out of line drawing the link. Seeing you lay out the links like this makes me feel way more confident, honestly, especially since I'm fairly confident I can plug the Indigo and Jade holes. Jadebloods in particular we've always known were forced into Space-coded roles, since they're responsible for birthing the young and so are kind of the foundation of Alternia, population-wise. Propagation and laying the setting are pretty Space coded things--Kanaya herself draws the link late into Homestuck: KANAYA: I Somehow Came To Understand Space Meant More Than Just Space KANAYA: Like Not Just KANAYA: Physical Room And Dimension For Stars To Occupy KANAYA: Its KANAYA: Deeper Than That KANAYA: A Field Related To Propagation KANAYA: The Ones Who Create It KANAYA: They Are Passing A Torch As It Were As for Indigos, Xefros references them crushing utensils, which seems to indicate super strength is a common trait to the class like the rest of the psychic powers. Linking physical strength to Void feels pretty straightfoward to me now, too. In Gnosticism, the physical world was also called the world of "Darkness", with the world of the imagination coded as the world of "Light". Hence the Serket's focus on thoughts and mind control, too. Also worth noting that I don't expect the pattern to hold for every single troll. Like any faulty societal system, some individuals likely fall prey to this one while others are perfectly comfortable in it's confines, and while others still notice it for what it is or find their true passions regardless. It's hard to say exactly how (or if) it works until Act 2 drops, which is part of why I'm so excited for it! :B

I would like to add on to this theory. you see the 12 original zodiac signs are supposed to be the TRUE signs, possibly meaning in the purest forms. now, these true signs are supposed to be the ideal face for their blood cast maybe because it's biologically easier for them or it just comes to them more naturally, I don't know. while the signs that aren't the truest ones have a bit of trouble trying to fit in this pure ideal for their sign. so they may slip through the cracks and might become a different kind of aspect like how Zebede has the aspect of light instead of doom because he isn't the pure gemini

Life is associated with physical health, determination to thrive, and (as I believe oD pointed out elsewhere, or it could have been Dahni) material wealth and gain. Fuschia bloods are naturally very long-lived (the Empress is actually immortal for various reasons but tends to cull other Fuschias young) and Trizza, much like the Empress, is obsessed with showy, tacky displays of material wealth. She's not a True Fuschia Sign, but is instead Blood-aspected, which holds up in her characterization of actually caring nothing for life or the continuation of trolls as a species the way the Empress or Feferi does, instead only appearing to care about the social power her position gives her. So based on one whole data point, I think this holds up for Fuschias too.

Just wanted to drop this in about Diemen: in his description about “oblong meat products” it tells us the “current” temperature of it. Which in itself is something relating to time. Might want to raise that theory score a bit!

I think focusing on individuals rather than on their caste's role in the society is detrimental to the idea. For some, however, there aren't enough examples of what the blood color's role is so I will be using the troll call cards for those. Burgundy: Due to this color's connection to time, it would make sense that the Condesce would have them as the lowest class, as she resents Lord English. Additionally, their short lives and mistreatment cause them to constantly be facing death, similar to how Time is connected to death through the ideas of decay and endings Bronze: Breath relates to freedom or a "wild" nature, reflecting their usual connection to Lusii. Gold: From what we have seen, gold blooded trolls tend to have ties to technology, which, based off of how Sgrub is a game, ties it back into the dooming of their universe Lime: Blood has more to do with bonds and unity, which the lime bloods did by soothing the other trolls. The recuperacoon still use lime blood to soothe trolls, further tying Lime bloods to the aspect Olive: They are the middle class essentially and as such are more free to "follow their hearts" so to speak. Charun is a lost and found "artist" Konyll seems to be following her *passion* and is a broad shoulder to cry on, possibly showing a more emotional side. Boldir's only connection I could think of right now is that she wears a hat, which doesn't sound like much, but hats do have quite a few ties to the Heart symbol. Jade: As a blood type they are literally the embodiment of motherliness, which is a space trait. Teal: They seem to have jobs that in our society are tied to a higher education? I don't know how to add on further to this one Cerulean: The blood type with the most connections to weird eyes, eyes being a symbol for light often times. Indigo: Taz already covered that, but to further the connection to physical strength being tied to Void, Roxy also has fists as a strife specibi Purple: Chucklevoodoo Violet: Where Rage can be seen as doubt, Hope can be seen as faith. In this case, they have a "faith" to the caste system. Additionally, they have basically limitless options when it comes to creating their hive, which could come back to Hope as they use their imagination to build it. Fuchsia: Despite Trizza being the only example of a non-life aspect Fuchsia, her and her blood color embody it perfectly, depending on how you interpret Life. Looking at the definition of the aspect on the extended zodiac does not make sense in terms of not only Trizza, but also Meenah, who represents a different aspect of Life than Feferi. Life has ties to food and the idea of eating, as well as recklessness. Trizza's burning of poor districts shows her recklessness and willingness to "consume" their lives for her goals. Life as a general rule so far is also always tied to someone of a high social standing, since every life player in the comic is an heiress of some kind.

I don't think there's a comparison between the two pairs, mainly because Dammek is a child and Bro is an adult man, and Dave's legal guardian. The power differential is inherently far more extreme in the latter, and Bro far more responsible. A more apt comparison would be Vriska and Tavros. Dammek may well be a complete asshole, but even if he is, he's at least still a kid with a lot of character development to go through. So I'm pretty hopeful, personally.

Yeah, i think vriska and tavros would be a more appropriate comparison. Thanks for responding to my comment I didn't even think anyone would read it XD

h e i s n ' t

ohmygod dude i think you jinxed it

This is incredibly heartening to hear, because I'm making this stuff for people like you in mind the most. Thanks so much for saying so!

I'm glad we're overall pretty similar in our answers, though our approaches are different. We disagree on Xefros' Class, of course--I don't think Joey is any less angry by the end of Act 1, the direction of her anger simply shifts somewhat. And I don't personally use inversion theory in assessing Classpects for a couple of different reasons that might someday be worth going into? Suffice it to say, I think any "inversion" like behavior found in canon is better explained through the lens of roleplay. I think there's a *little* more evidence that Dammek might be a Thief than that he's a Bard, but that evidence is slight enough that I wouldn't be surprised if you turn out to be right, and the Roleplay approach to the story I'm taking means he could well be linked to both Thief and Bard at the moment. I'll definitely be keeping that possibility in mind going forward. I also already felt Jude was a Doom player, though I consider him a Seer for the moment. As with Dammek, we know so little that his story could be complicated in any number of ways, so that could well change. Joey's the oddest of the bunch right now. I agree it'd make sense if she were a Mind player, but looking at the text of the game she's overwhelmed with references to both Light and Life. At the moment I read her primarily as a Maid of Light, but it's hard for me to say how much of that is due to roleplay as opposed to her actual personality, and if it is roleplay, it's even harder to say what her "true" class or Aspect might be. At the very least, I think we'll need to learn more about A. Claire before I feel confident in any particular direction. I'd be pretty happy if she was a Mind player, though, so if I pick up evidence for the view from the text that I feel carries serious weight, you can expect me to talk about it here.

Joey and Jude both have a *lot* of Light allusions in their text and context (Joey's flashlight, lite brite, symbol; Jude's signal light and quest for understanding; both of them are involved in primarily light-based puzzles in the Manor segment). I'm pretty sure only one of them is actually "Lightbound" or possibly neither, though, so I had to wonder what it is that gave them a connection to this Aspect, and then I thought. Hey, what do they have in common with a canon Light player? Answer: de facto guardian. I wonder if Roxy just has this effect on kids she takes care of, whether their her own daughter or not. She constantly surrounds herself with Void (specifically alcohol that prevents her from understanding or being understood), maybe it's a natural reaction in kids she takes care of to want to increase the Light around them. Hence, Jude and Joey "roleplay" having the Light Aspect, to use oD's terms.

I think the kids are the other way round; Sylph is both a female-only class and a healing class, so it would have to be Joey, and there's discussion of how she fits Doom here: skaiamechanic.tumblr.com/post/168281029389/judejoey-aspect-theory-and-just-a-couple-of

Well, I guess I can see how Joey fits into Sylph of Doom. She did save both Byers' and Xefros' lives already, in addition to not dying to all the monsters, drones, and other generally dangerous situations she's been in so far.

I like your theory in terms of narrative balance, but typical in Homestuck narration was throwing around lots of allusions to Class and Aspect in their narration and settings. Alpha kids got it especially bad with their Class and Aspect in allcaps on their intro pages, but you can still see it with the first four kids - the narration and the panels all have some reference or another to at least their Aspects, even if it's only obvious on a re-read (Jade's gardening and pictionary shenanigans are space related because space is about creation and creativity, for example). I don't know if Joey gets *any* Doom references except for her dead mom and being surrounded by dead animals, and things that are *already* dead are usually a reference to Time (Dave's collection, Aradia's...self). "Doom" tends to be about things that are going to die some time in the future, based on the Captor kids...although that may be biased by the fact that Sollux is a Mage. Hm.

Aw jeez, thanks for the compliment! I didn't notice that about Xefros' sign before, but come to think of it, you're right. If my channel's any good, its only because I pay attention to lots of people who make valuable insights like yours. Thanks!

Hmmm, good point! I'll try and figure out a smooth way to let the viewer know I'll be drawing on what we know about various elements of Hiveswap from Homestuck, at least. Thanks!

I've written about my view of Joey as a Maid of Light here: medium.com/@RoseOfNobility/born-to-be-a-star-joey-claire-maid-of-light-61cad5f8869f Kinda referenced it in this video too, since i included the text promp that tells Joey to "Make" Light. So I definitely think she reads pretty strongly as a Light player! I'm not 100% sure she's actually a Light player, but only because given Xefros' (and Dammek's) example, it's entirely possible Joey is also roleplaying. Life is the other big contender for her "true" Aspect, and as of this moment I'm honestly not sure what Joey's true class actually is. If she's not one of the Fairy classes (Maid or Sylph), my next best guess is that she might be a Witch, based on exactly one set of dialogue text. I haven't seen much to indicate she's a Knight yet, but I can't discount the idea entirely right now either, at least not right now. So I guess we'll find out together!

O, y saludos de Puerto Rico ;)

Great I'll give it a check later, And well my main reason to think of her as a Knigth of Ligth is tat her strife weapon is a flashligth which in the case of her being a knigth could be her "weaponized" aspect. Also I would say that her personal problem related to her aspect is the lack of attention from Pa Harley, beacuse she doesn't know why he doesn't want to be with her or Jude. About the lack of the aspect on the session, as Hiveswap doesn't happen in a Sburb session we could say that the session is what we see on the Act 1 itself, and the lack of Ligth could be that neither she or Jude knows where the mosnters come form in the beggining of the game and also Jude doesn't know a thing about Alternia after she get's there form the portal, so I see the lack of ligth as a lack of information about what's happening around her. And well thats about it, thanks for responding to my comment, means a lot

I think Xefros probably endured more psychological trauma. Trauma from Trizza, Dammek, and being a lowblood in Alternia. This trauma has stunted his psychic powers, which become much more powerful when his friends are endangered. He doesn't want to witness the trauma of seeing his friends die. Sure Dammek once hit him in the head and knocked him out, but Xefros' psychic powers were already weak before that.

My view is that Vriska's roleplaying a Sylph, not a Sylph of Void or Light specifically. Her roleplay is simply intense enough that it makes her "resistant to her true calling", as Calliope puts it, and so results in her Making a lot of Void. Bad luck and making Tavros more irrelevant and prone to sleeping are two examples. It seems to me that where these Aspect "Switches" are concerned, the player's primary Aspect sticks around for the most part. Rose reads equally clearly as a Witch of Light *and* Void for most of Act 5, and her roleplay as an Active player gets her called a Mage at least once, too. Xefros is primarily thinking about Time a ton, but he's simultaneously most effective at changing reality through the vector of Rage. The symbolism can get fairly complicated! I agree about Joey. I think her Maid of Light imagery is fairly clear (The "Make some Light" text box is hard for me to argue with). What I'm not sure about is if she's actually a Maid, or simply a committed roleplayer. I'll probably make a video on her regardless, though as with this one, it'll be subject to revision as we learn more. I don't really know about Trizza. I don't think we know enough about her to say what her actual Class is. But I would wager that she, like Jane, will likely be a fairly proficient Heir roleplayer, since she's the only other Heiress to actually keep the role--Feferi and Meenah explicitly abdicate. Insofar as testing Roleplay theory going forward, that's what I've got my eyes on for her. Trizza seems to be living up to the role well enough for now--wielding massive power through the Life/Bio-tech coded Drones certainly fits with how I read other Heirs. So I suppose we'll see if it holds. As for the verbs, until we get official canon word, I think the debate will go on forever. I can give you my rationale, though. I think it's notable that Calliope used "Exploit" to describe general behavior all Active classes engage in, with Allow/Invite being similar terminology for Passive ones. So Exploit/Use have always felt too general for Knights/Pages to me, and it never quite felt like it gave the classes an evocative identity. Serve accomplishes that, while bringing the existential duality idea behind the classes into greater focus. Just like Destroy and Create contrast, so do Serve (to Give) and Steal (to Take), giving us two more keywords with which to explore the classes in canon. Serve has the link to Butlers, but also establishes a link to Warriors by way of the "You got Served/Owned/Wrecked" saying--Knights and Pages excel at dealing particularly devastating defeats. Reading the two classes that way gives them a fair bit of clarity to me, so a competing verb would need to A) Provide just as compelling a picture of the classes, and B) Be referenced in association with those classes just as many times in canon. If such a verb surfaces, I'd be pretty delighted. But until then, Serve seems to fit the bill best.

Hm. Well, there's also "Equip", which is a more specific sort of utilization, if I want to crib from Dahni instead of Callie. But at that point it's basically a synonym with Serve since it involves the idea of the Aspect as a tangible item that can be held or given, just like "Steal" involves the idea of the Aspect as a tangible item that can be taken or removed. So I guess I've talked myself around to agreeing with you on this one.

optimistic Duelist I really like the idea of Joey being a Sylph of Doom. Not only it would complete certain pattern, alongside with Mage of Rage, Thief of Blood and Bard of Mind, but it'd also fit by her, deep inside, still not getting over her Mom and Dad's leave, as seen when she's examining the photo. I support the theory of her roleplaying Maid of Light to "cheer herself and others up?" in a sense, like "BRIGHTen the day" and all that stuff.

wow you didn't have it make it that long

Game and Time Extended Zodiac quiz gave me Light for an Aspect. I don't believe in irl astrology determined by a 12 question internet quiz, but it's not wrong about me sharing traits with the queens of long-winded exposition either.

Rogues and oD's interpretation of Pages are pretty close to each other, but who or what is Xefros taking Rage from in order to give it to others? Mage I've got no comment on because I don't know what Perfect Class Complimentary Theory is and all canon really does is implicitly compare it to Seers.

The theory is sort of a combination of class pstterns in all sessions we've seen so far and the shadow role theory Speaking shortly: In each session, for Heir of aspect there is a thief with opposite aspect for Seer of aspect there is a Rogue of opposite aspect for Prince of aspect there is a bard of opposite aspect To complete the Kids session using this pattern we'd need Thief of Blood and Bard of Mind then, kids session has the pattern visible even if you invert the classpects Knight of Time>>Rogue of Space Witch of Space>>Seer of Time Heir of Breath>>Mage of Blood Seer of Light>>Witch of Void Maid of Life>>Bard of Doom Prince of Heart>>Sylph of Mind Page of Hope>>Thief of Rage _Bard of Mind>Maid of Heart_ _Thief of Blood>>Page of Breath_ and we're left with only two classes and aspect s that could compliment the existing ones and complete the circle Mage of Rage (inversion Heir of Hope, complimentary to Thief of Rage) and Sylph of Doom (inversion to Prince of Life, complimentary to Bard of Doom) I hope it clears out part of my thought process; Also please kill me if Folykl is not Seer of Void

And I say Rogue for Xefros, because I don't really look at role d he'd have in sburb per se, but rather at his behaviour pre-game, as it is more important. Rogues are often seen as ones that don't work towards their aspect and allow it to be taken by others, like Xef letting Dammek lead, then when Dammek vanishes he automatically trusts Joey and allows her to lead. He's also seems to give Joey hints about how to play the game, and is a major spurce of backstory, and I still attach rage to "plot" and "action", so he's basically giving away rage in a sense. for Dammek I say Prince as secondary possibility, because of whole thing that happened with Dirk, as well as the overall manipulation of all Princes.

Hm, I don't know if I agree on that assessment for Rogues. It fits Nepeta a bit, but Roxy's one of the hardest-working people in the comic and one of the like two we actually see training specifically to master her powers on-screen. Rufioh we aren't really given a lot of time to look at, although like most of the Dancestors he stagnates in a questionable interpretation of his Aspect after death. It doesn't seem consistent the way a Page's questionably helpful protector or a Witch's powerful familiar/dragon or a Knight's repressed emotional problems are. His automatic trust in Joey is pretty anti-Rage, I guess, but Pages are also described and shown as lacking their Aspect to begin with - Tavros lacks freedom and mobility, and Jake is pretty clearly forcing himself into his Hopey attitude as a sort of fake-it-till-you-make-it not unlike Tavros's imaginary self-confidence. Again, Horuss we don't see at the beginning of his journey, so I can't really comment there.

Oh, yes, Roxy is a realized dersian-bound Rogue, which makes her quite different from Nepeta, who was confirmed by hussie to have more easy-going Prospitian-bound behavior. Hussie confirmed in one of his posts that Your dream moon is a thing that dictates your activeness first, then class second, then aspect third. He also confirmed that John and Dave were acting "in bounds" with their moons, having the same class activeness as the moon they are alligned to. Prospit is said to attract passive players, and make active classes mellow out, and be more "acted upon" by other players. Derse attracts Active players, and make Passive classes shift into activeness, sometimes into EXTREMES, as shown by Rose, and they go into being main "planners" of the session. (it also goes as a backup for the theory that Knights are active and Pages are passive) SO back to the Roxy and Nepeta case, hussie confirmed that Nep and Vris are "Harry Potter sorting hat" exceptions to standard pattern, as Vriska much more prefers Prospit as it is for "HEROES" and Nepeta is on Derse, as she does not see herself as a heroic role model. Despite their standard behaviour and mannierism matching the moon opposite to the one they reside on. (sidenote, all gt Derse players die Heroic on-screen, ironically) And Roxy is a textbook Example of Dersian Rogue, on whom the activeness of derse left its mark. I still believe Xefros is Rogue of Rage, but hey, we can only wait for whatpumpkin to announce the classes of Hiveswap Trolls to find out.

That's the plan eventually! Got some other stuff to cover first, and my views on Joey have changed somewhat since then so I'm still reevaluating, but I still think the reading is there and worth talking about. So I def wanna get to it soon. Thanks! :)

first of all, nobody actually knows the alignment, second of all, they have an entire article on their classpect placement so read that first.

another objection to the assumption that rage players cant be pure bois: charun

What with the Active/Passive alignment of Knights and Pages?