@@OptimusPrime-dz9md It would've also been incredibly easy for Haz to never make this video and lie to his audience that things like this never, ever happen and every dog he ever put his hands on is doing great. How many trainers can you name that are open about "one of our dogs we sold to someone attacked the person we sold it to" despite that it's going to make a lot of people incredibly skeptical? I can't think of even one. The one thing you can't say about Haz is that he's dishonest and all smoke and mirrors, unlike some much more popular "trainers" I could name.
@@thecawckiestking yes he seems honest but also unethical. This dog was trying to bite him when he first got it. Is it a surprise this happened? You shouldn't rehome human aggressive dogs.
@@OptimusPrime-dz9md He got the dog from a place that explicitly sells these dogs for the purpose of protection, police, and military work. This isn't a pet dog and I doubt he sold it to anyone as such. He "rehomed" this dog to someone who explicitly had experience with Dutch shepherds. Whether or not its "unethical" largely depends on where it goes and what that person's needs are, private information which none of us have and which it isn't our business to have. Would it be "unethical" to sell a human-aggressive dog to a private compound with barbed wire fences and "no trespassing" signs everywhere for instance, where the intent is to keep people from breaking in? Or to someone in the military who plans to take the dog to a war-front? Context is quite important to whether or not we put the "unethical" stamp on the, quote on quote, "rehoming" of these dogs. Its not as though he sold it to your average white picket fence family with a gaggle of hyper five year olds living in Beverley Hills. And there are plenty such people who pick up much worse dogs from your every day rescue shelter. You can find them all over youtube, crying about how their vicious dogs have "never hurt anyone" after they made the news for their dog attacking/killing someone.
I'm sorry. If a dog is so unstable that it will bite unprovoked, that dog should not be used for breeding. You say this is common in Dutch shepherds, but that means the behavior isn't being bred out. Mental stability is 100% non-negotiable.
Man, I feel for that handler. Having your dog, who you thought you had a great relationship with, just attack you for no big reason...and bad enough to put you in the hospital...that's got to be a really horrible feeling.
@Jakerzilla Of course there was 'a' reason...there's always a reason. Maybe instead of saying "no big reason", I should have said "no noticeable reason". That didn't sound quite right either, though, and I couldn't think of a better word for it, so I just went with big. 🤷🏻♀️ lol
@@Noahsark17 Long story short everyone, Mace is the type of dog you NEVER turn your back on or let your guard down for. On the otherside my girl has the excellent temperament and rock solid nerves you'd want in the breed. That's why I want a stud like Mace, that level of fire would mesh perfectly with my girl's cold as ice attitude.
I had a halfway decent Dutch shepherd. Bit me several times. That dog got a permanent ticket to heaven when he bit my father out of nowhere for zero reason. Like absolutely zero. So yeah, handler aggression can definitely come out of nowhere. It's kind of rare, honestly, but definitely something I've seen with multiple dutchies.
So sorry to hear about Mace. I really like him. I hope it’s something that can be worked through. However he is one big powerful dog and can really hurt someone. This is truly a heartbreaking situation. Thank you for being so open and honest with all of us Mace fans. Wishing his former handler a full and speedy recovery.
Haz, ive said it before, ill say it again! nothing more valuable in this day and age than being transparent as to the true nature of some dogs, while so many people seem to mistake them as stuffed animals or humanize them without thinking! this is great valuable information here and im grateful for it. thank you!!
I love my Dutchie, but first two years were tough. I had him from 7 weeks of age. I too have owned a total of 8 GSD's. The Dutchies and Mals are different. I wanted something different after German Shepherd and I got it lol. Wish the best for Mace and his handler. Thanks Haz I truly respect your knowledge and wish I was closer to you. NJ.USA.
On my 4th GSD, 3 have been working line, 2 of the 3 hard as nails. I'm too old for a Dutchie. My current one is 3 y.o. The first 2 years about kicked my ass. These dogs are an acquired taste, not for just anyone. But damn I love a good badass GSD.
With dogs like that, a tiny piece of led placed carefully in the left ear prevents the dog from attacking his owner. Especially if you use a 357 to place the led.
@@TDCIYB77 I think Haz meant Mace might be a dog that has to remain with Shield K9 exclusively- not that euthanasia was a consideration. A Dutch Shepherd he previously had called Danger I believe was in the same circumstance; he would not trust the dog in another environment so he ended up not selling him.
He's a beautiful dog and doesn't deserve to be put down. But he's also a dangerous dog. Haz can handle him but obviously even other experienced handlers may not be able to. I have two Dutch shepherds, by no means an expert but have lived with the breed for a decade. Ime they are way less inhibited about biting people but they've really only gone after me if they felt I wronged them somehow(being too hard on a correction for example). They are extraordinarily intelligent but also sensitive.Definitely not for most people, just too much dog. Hopefully haz can figure out what triggered him.
Haz! Thanks so much for the Mace videos and for giving him another chance. I'm sure it will be fascinating to watch you navigate Mace. This is can't miss RU-vid.
This is too common for malinois and Dutchies. I think it's just what happens when you breed a dog to have an obsessive, compulsive addiction to biting things. It's like doing drugs to them, and sometimes the impulse control slips and they end up biting something they shouldn't. Either that or Mace felt he could assume the alpha position over his owner and took his opportunity. Just my theory, anyway, my trainer has a mali that sadly does the same thing that Mace did. Multiple times, with no warning and sent several to the hospital. It basically means the dog stays in the kennel until it's time for training, which thankfully works for their situation.
Germans were known for calling Mals et al 'Throw away dogs'....I wonder if some of what you mentioned is why.? Rare to ever have a serious working line GSD have the neurosis that some other breeds have.
@@mattg1889 Yes but why would you risk it? These breeds are known for their lunacy and neurotic behavior. They are no fit fot personal protection. Just Stick with German Shepherds.
So sorry to hear what happened to his handler. Mace is my favorite dog in the internet, your early videos with him helped me understand more about my dog.
Can you have the handler come on a podcast or a video interview?! Super fascinated by the experience! Tragic for sure, but I'm on my toes loving that you get to do a little behavioural and psychological modification, and we get to watch! Would love to hear the handlers story when he's ready! Also, such an informative video on the tools you use! Not that it's necessary for the average owner but SO fascinating and totally useful for those dealing with dogs like this, or if their own dog even has a few quirks. I am very grateful you shared. Curious, when leaving the crate, he's very impulsive. Is that something you work on? Or the idea is just to get him out? Any cues you can use to make him wait? He's so aroused when you open it. Curious about thoughts on curbing that arousal? Or is that just because he had been couped up a few days and pent up energy?
I think it would just be too dangerous to trust ANY sort of impulse control with Mace. If it were me, there's no way I'd trust him to hold a sit or a stay while I put a collar on him. The consequences are too dire.
Wow. I'm sorry to hear about the handler and his incident. I hope he heals quickly. Just looking, again, at Mace, you can see the power he has. His head is huge, and I'd hate to be on the receiving end of one of his bites.
Sorry to hear about this. He is such a beautiful dog. Thanks for taking him back. I've worked with some very high aggression, somewhat unstable dogs, and things like this do happen. If anyone can get him back to good, its you and your team. I'm looking forward to updates.
Is that behavior just Mase, or could it be medical (like a brain tumor) causing unexpected behavioral changes? Do you think he would be any different if the handler raised him from a puppy?
I can not help but to be in love with this dog. My grandpa had a few he used to train and these dogs and him where just inseparable the bond they had was like nothing I’ve ever seen.
Makes me grateful for my dutchie. I have 3 dogs & live alone with them since my husband is deployed and the bond with my dutchie has only strengthened - he’s always been “my” dog as I handle him. I sure got lucky with mine on the genetics side of things. BH test upcoming
Dont want to make your relationship with your dutchie sour, but as Haz said: There were no indications prior to handler agression, and all other indicators looked normal. Mace too seemed to have a deep bond with both Haz and the new handler.. And here we are. Its not a common thing, but with this breed you just need to be on alert, and ready all the time. It is no coincidence the breed has the repupation it has, and that allmost all experienced trainers dont recommend them at all as pets, even to very experienced owners, other than for professionals like Haz who also love the thrill of having such a primal dog. They are bred to bite, to be neurotic and full of drive. I would be cautious, and i am a 220 pound man, and even more as a Lady as Haz said, no offense. Likely you are right and have won the genetic lottery, and as i said, those unprovoked attacks are uncommon. But i would still be consious of the possibility. It is IMHO the most dangerous and demanding breed, beside the usual suspects of Pitbulls and other dogs bred for dog fighting.
@@TDCIYB77 I find the label "Dutch Shepherd" questionable on Mace as he is a KNPV dog that is very unlikely to be a pure bred Dutch. Particularly at his size where I'm guessing he's 95+ lbs. So that is probably a misnomer at best. I work in security consulting and place dozens of handler teams in working roles every year. I have nearly always predicted when a dog would be questionable in the work environment or with the handler beforehand. Haz said as much about Mace many times in his videos. I definitely agree that I've observed FCI line Dutch have more dominance and sharpness than most Malinois or GSD, but not to the level of some working Molossus.
One thing Mr.Haz is forgetting to mention is that redirecting for no reason at all its not a sign of strong character,it actually shows weakness in the dog ..Real dominant dogs like to challenge the handler from time to time but key word is challenge in appropriate times,dogs who bite out of nowhere when not even training are just nasty dogs...this a common issue why rotts are not used much nowadays for police work,all rank aggression more then anything else...There are way harder dogs out there then Mace that if you train em fairly and wont back down when they test you and uve got good reflexes that u will probably never ever get bit by them...Also redirecting to the handler its not the only form k9 shows dominance,also willingness to not obey repeatedly (in later stages of training) is a sign of dominance .A dog can be hard as granite and not be nasty..... Side note:Dutchies are notorius for chewing up theyre handlers in many dept while having 50/60% of work performance of a good mal/gsd ...theyre notorius for redirecting in operations too a lot..many seem to not have the best nerves..
Really sorry to hear that news about Mace and his owner! I hope you guys are able to sort it out and figure out if there’s any way of moving forward … or if he needs to be elsewhere! He’s obviously not like ‘Danger’ but can be just as lethal! It goes to show you, it’s imperative you understand these breeds … they’re not for the faint of heart or your average person. Like you said, look at what happened with the owner who is knowledgeable. The breed are intense dogs … that’s for sure!
Honestly not the tiniest bit surprised. Some dogs just seem to have a more intact primal kill switch somewhere in their behaviors/personality than others, and it can be the strangest things that trigger it. Mace definitely seemed like that sort of dog. Seen it in a few rare dogs before, but its definitely not a common occurrence. Looking forward to seeing the work you do with him! Hopefully everything can be resolved with a good outcome.
They call it a "Rank Dominant Male.." This was one I had. Aero nailed me three or four times. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-FbcnWfw0aNM.htmlsi=BWsOHbOXnoT3Fw33
I am not familiar with the breed, however I think it is clear, as you've pointed out, that his primal instinct is very deep and can only be dealt with with STRICT and constant obedience. Just the fact that he wants to get out of the kennel as soon as the door is opened, already (too) highly excited, and not wait to be invited out of it, is a significant warning sign to me. Read : intolerable. ~~~~ Regrettably, I do not see in this video a working dog eager to please his owner. And I bet the dog thinks he can do any time whatever he was trained to do. That may well be the 'reason'... I will go as far as affirming that this particular dog should NEVER have been trained to attack. Even a chased criminal would not deserve to be hurt so badly by this animal. ~~~ In addition, unless this dog works HARD daily, it is more likely that his extraordinary drive will trigger some erratic behaviour again. ~~~ If that attack was not instinct, then one would have to consider that this powerful dog has a neurological problem.
What a monster. Mace scares me ngl. I mean, I love the powerful dogs but he would be WAY too much for me and I'm not too arrogant and stupid to admit it.
I’m amazed at your sharing this valuable info. 🐾🐾 In 3+ yrs, I’ve found ONE trainer near (Wa) me who understand this breed, only recently. Most say you can not rehabilitate & refuse to work with challenging “working” dogs. This one is from poor breeder, puppy mill, & has epilepsy. She would rather be a K9. It’s the wrong setting for her (like a senior or a family or apartment) for most any true “working” dog. I had hoped to train as my SD. oops OOPS You’re showing the right way, with respect, to do it. Thanks so much. ⭐️🙌 I know I can’t ever re home my girlie, unless it’s to a K9 experienced person, if I have to replace an ankle, just hoping she’d be prepared to be a good companion for the right person if it’s not me. . (Unlike my 4 previous AKC GSD’s…over 40+ yrs around me as I raised my babies in the 80’s’s). My current GSD has only had treats from my 3 yo granddaughter (my dog is 3 1/2) when she’s in her kennel. Someday I know they’ll be friends .. when rules can be unquestionably followed. Safe, not sorry.. don’t give up. You couldn’t change this behavior by beating it out of them… so many don’t understand this.. clear training & micromanagement.. knowing the consequences… If she lives 11 more yrs I’ll be 80. I love the collar you showed. Glad she’s only 62 lbs of lean. Loves people, my fault she’s the 1st dog I’ve ever been bitten by .. was my fault 3 times, seizure one time - still my fault. I knew better.
Thanks for sharing this! I've been wondering! I hope the former handler recovers fast and Hopefully Mace gets better in the future. No doubt he's in great hands with you
Those that say Haz is talking crap don’t have years of training thousands of dogs, witnessing genetics thru his breeding program, so you are in no way qualified to talk. So what- you have had a few Dutchies, doesn’t mean you are an expert. Haz is pretty straight forward and it’s amazing that he can tell there’s a different look in Macey’s eyes. Truth is..as Has says, you may never know what drove him. I hope the handler pulls thru ok. I would love to see more videos of how this goes
My uber friendly Police Bred GSD had Bladder stone surgery. Long road to recovery. When she was given the all clear for off leash walks she "out of the blue" seriously went for a Dachsund. High stim and a meaningful verbal stopped her. I struggled to comprehend the "why". I think it was residual discomfort/ pain fom the surgery, bad mood, if you like. Maybe Mace had a headache? Kai's back to her loves everybody [including dogs] again.
Just met a Dutch at my trainer facility yesterday and wow..they are SO much bigger and more powerful in person than they ever appear on film..I also saw one of the guys that wears the bite suit and his bruises were incredible! That can’t be healthy for the dudes/dudettes in the suits to be getting terrible bruising and clots like that..and I wasn’t aware of how much skill, education and technique it takes to “be” the person in the suit, I learned that dogs can be severely injured or even killed by “stiff arming” (not properly ‘receiving’ the bites) when they bite and the dog’s neck is broken or severely injured.
Those bruises and clots are called hematomas and are incredibly dangerous ....thats why its best practice when the dog is an adult to work in thicker suits as much as you can or hard sleeve work mostly ...but nah ,most around dont like functional limbs much
Your honesty has reminded us all of a valuable lesson. 1.Alpha k9s instinctively challenge the handler otherwise you wouldn’t have a job. Good luck with your weapons training program there is a place for it.
It makes me feel good to see a professional handle a truly powerful dog. My puppies are fiesty, but not on this level. (yet) They are super sensitive to your well being so you must be truly honest about your self and ability to handle an animal like this.
Please keep everyone posted of Mace. He left and didn't hear anything else about him. This is a special dog, to be honest we need more like him. There's a diminishing of strength in so many of the working breeds such as German Shepherds, Dobermans ,Rottweilers, Malinois, even the Dutchie.
Yes it does my shepherd went after my wife the person that he has been with all his life we still are not sure what happened but moving forward I will be the only one handling him your so on point have a great day my friend.
Wow!! Haz.. your the man.. the patience and calmness u had while takin Mace out if the kennel is superb.. your both amazing.. Reminds me of Danger, as you mentioned in your podcast but mace is a little bit mellow maybe compared to danger Enjoy training
I mean no offense by this comment, but curious from a legal standpoint, could the handler come after you? Or do they sign some type of waiver when they purchase the pup?
I've had 2 Dutch Shepherds that I worked the street with. Both had bonding issues. The first was a 18 month old neutered male. He would demo bite, but did not have that edge on the street. The second was at war all the time, about once every 6 months he would try to take a shot at the title.....me. 4 times. I could handle him but told the department they needed to put him down when they retired hi. They didn't and it cost the city alot of money.
Does such accidents happen with GSD? I have a male Bully Kutta/ Indian Mastiff whom I purchased as an adult after he was too much for his previous owners and bit several people. I got him down from the brake van of the train and the drive him back straight for four and half hours in my car. It took almost an year for him to settle down. In between he bit me once . Now he is a different dog altogether but unfortunately he is very reactive to other dogs so he stays in our home. I wish I had trainer to make him neutral to other dogs.
this is so interesting. i have a dutch shepherd who's on her way to get service dog certification (which in my country is necessary) so she can task and help me with my disability. shes so sweet, friendly and gentle that i cant help but think "goddamn i must have gotten lucky if this is the breed standard"
I did some research and I discovered that Dutch Shepherds don’t like the smell of calamari on people’s breath. I’m convinced that the guy that got bit had most likely eaten a fresh can of calamari prior to handling Mace. I hope the gentleman will regain full use of his extremities moving forward!
Well thanks for the update Haz I really like Mace Have followed the Dutch line for years. Best wishes for the handler and a speedy recovery, I Followed your videos when you were in Europe and enjoyed those. I personally would of like a little more on info on the assessment of the handler with Mace as it may provide a clue why he bit him or not. (I know none of my business.) Just curios as I have heard of this before and the connection with the dog has been suspect. Is the Handler mentally ok now? I know he probably want nothing to do with mace now. But you know getting back on the horse or finding a reason why, may make sense of this. I apologize if my curiosity is overstepping.
Enjoyed the video, thanks for sharing. But so many questions. You get the dog, form bond, train him and sell (I assume) him. Things are good with new owner/handler for a while and then for whatever reason Mace attacks him. When you went to pick the dog up you used a catch pole---did he not recognize you when he saw you? When you were getting him out of the kennel at your place why did not put him in a sit command, open the door, and then leash him? He was trying to rush the door and push through---not cool---he should come out when you say so. It was like a scene from the animal shelter with all the barking, excitement. Do the other dogs not know what quiet, shut-up, hush mean? And this is just a side note--what is with the hair on his back--can he not be brushed, groomed? Not a hater, just wondering. Thank you.
They breed some of these dogs to be crazy breeding for bitework - Haz likes them crazy, but I think breeding for that much intensity is like a time bomb waiting to go off
I love Dutch Shepherds. Have one now and probably always will. I definitely notice more dominance and sharpness in their working lines than even Mals and GSD. That said, you are correct that lineage means a lot and Mace is KNPV lines which makes me question how much "Dutch Shepherd" he really even is.
Dutchies are good dogs I have 8 and they can be bullhead but are good dogs and can be handler sensitive I have a good amount of experience with this breed I had one assigned to me when I was in the marine corps and they are a pleasure to work with haz you will get him where he needs to be if anyone can do it you can brother
Some dogs like Mace bite their handlers based on an experience they had with their original handler. My favorite dog, a very strong Malinois came to me expecting that I was going to do something to him. We would go on walks and he would start eyeing up my hands. It took more than a year to develop a real bond with him. The first year was a hoot. I laughed when I saw your collar. My dog wore one every time we were out, for a long time.
I have a soft spot for mace..my GSD is a problem child..If I had the space I would really try to buy this dog if that's even possible..Me and mace would do just fine together.
Culling is for weak specimens who cant do the work due to mostly poor nerves ...if this is a nerve problem,the dog is done for ....if its not proper handling there is still hope
New here but let me ask. You did some distraction/control work with the toy. With the bite work, I've worked with trainers that in cases with dogs like Mace, real flamethrowers, kept the bite work toned down with emphasis on control. Work obedience out in the training yard while other dogs were hitting the decoys. Also, when they were allowed to bite they would remain quiescent and just let the dog bite - never shake them up or piss them off. Control wise get them to the point of reliably doing a call-off without a bite. Some dogs we just limit the bite work altogether and work control and socialization as the aggression component is there. Just wondering.
You need to identify what gets him into the mental state that triggers the aggression. Clearly it’s nonexistent when you have him engaged with yummy training treats. Maybe possessivenesses or dominance?
Rage Syndrome in dogs is a seizure disorder that leads to unprovoked aggression. Episodes tend to come in threes. Seizure meds may help.💔 Sourced: Wikipedia and Google
When hearing of the unprovoked attack on the new owner had me reliving the past....I purchased a Springer Spaniel from the most well known breeder in US years ago for my sister-in law. I showed dogs (different) breed) for over 35 years. At 6 months of age this dog started exhibiting "problems", which I attributed to my sister-in-law's lack of training a dog. One morning my brother came over with both arms bandaged--I asked what happened to you--he said " " attacked me. I asked him what he was doing when it happened, and he said he hugged him. I did some basic training with him and figured if there would be a problem it most likely would show up when putting him in the down position--pressing on his withers. Sure enough, he stiffened and reminded me of the Incredible Hulk. Luckily I had a choke collar on him and knew how to keep a dog off me--even if it meant making the dog a helicopter. I also was a vet tech for 45 years.I started asking Springer people at the shows if they had any problems with their dogs as far as dominance, aggression goes--ALL of them said no. One day a friend of mine who showed cockers said she had a friend who used to show Springers. I talked to her, and she said yes, there was a problem in the breed and it was called rage syndrome. She mentioned a certain dog in the pedigree that they thought was a carrier. By this time the dog was a little over a year, living with me and had almost finished his championship. Even though I showed him I would never have considered breeding him. I finally called this world known, writer of books, breeder about the issue with the dog. The reply I got was--Yes, there are a few dogs that are like this--put him to sleep. Yep, that is the answer I got, and unfortunately that is what had to be done...it was like having a loaded gun lying around waiting to off. Rage is now found in other breeds too. Back when I/we encountered it little was known (1980s). Sorry I got carried away. Thanks
Thank you for taking the time to tell your story. I have always been interested in dogs and dog training, but my lifestyle didn't permit me to be an owner as an adult. But I still enjoy learning. You went to some impressive lengths to get answers, hopefully it can benefit others.
Dogs are one man owners from pups. That's the whole issue with preliminary dog training. Not all dogs are transferable. You can see it with Mace's original breeder. Keep your eye on the balloon 🎈
With Mace I'm really curious about his upbringing. I would venture to speculate he grew up with an inexperienced handler that didn't check or otherwise address his bad habits or guide him to developing any degree of respect for them. Not sure I'd have the tolerance if one went off on me like that. Respect from the dog is the bottom line, they must respect the handler.
I know you are professionals but when you have a dog like Mace not knowing what was the trigger, doesn't that carry some worry and fear while you are handling him? I mean to lose the use of an arm for some time is no simple attack. I would imagine that any inkling of fear, Mace will pick up and that's not a good thing with dogs like that.
I am pretty sure Haz knows the danger and is VERY consious of what can happen.. But he also loves his craft and, i guess, the thrill of working with such a danger.. And he has at least some tools.. And i likely would not be the first of last time if he would have to use those tools to defend himself. That is what you get when you work with that caliber of dogs opposed to pet dogs,
When you hear people (mostly breeders) say "I brought this dog in into the world it's my dog til it dies" that's what they mean and that's what you should see from your breeder not just hear!
If you teach a dog to be aggressive(even on command) don’t be shocked when a dog shows aggression, especially one that doesn’t need human intervention or coercion to perform tasks like the Dutch Shepherd. Dogs who don’t are the exception, not the rule.
overly confident dog maybe too much training can be a issue. like using bite sleeve. i noticed my dog can get wild too. and will test me. these Dogs are way too smart
