No Spark Troubleshooting The MVT Digital Direct DD06 Scooter Ignition System : TPR 86cc : Part 39

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My two-stroke scooter broke down during the 48 Hours of Ruckus event in the last video. I coasted down a hill and the engine stalled. I got it going again after many kicks and changing the spark plug cap. Then I rode for a few more minutes and it died again when I came to a stop. I couldn't get it going again and it ended up in the back of a truck to get home.
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Here's the 48 Hours of Ruckus video if you want to check it out :
• 48 Hours of Ruckus 202...
In this video, I'm going to troubleshoot the problem and see if I can get my scooter running again while explaining the process of troubleshooting the MVT DD06 inner rotor ignition system step by step. This video will show you how to figure out what is wrong with your ignition system if you have no spark with the MVT Digital Direct or other ignitions. Testing the stator, ignition coil, plug wire, spark plug cap, ignition switch, kill or engine stop switch and more.
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The multimeter that I use (affiliate link) :
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My MVT Wiring Diagram
www.49ccscoot.com/pics/triton...
My MVT Installation How-To
• Detailed MVT Digital D...
Find all of the videos in the TPR 86cc playlist :
• TPR 86cc Build Series
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#ScooterHelp, #NoSpark, #NoSparkTroubleshooting

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29 авг 2020

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Комментарии : 143

@JohnKohl-oz4uo Год назад

This guy is extremely informative he knows his stuff assemble hevel problem I hope I can get some input from him

@Savage-lx5yj 3 года назад

Another test you may try that will save time in the future. Test from the ground terminal ON THE CDI to the other terminals. If the CDI has shorted internally, this test will confirm a short. You should have NO continuity with the other terminals. Some CDI'S have two ground pins, test them both ......😁👍 In fact, check the one you just removed to verify internal short. It's best to isolate the CDI completely when performing test. On other occasions, the capacitor will fail.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Yes. Yahoo! New c.d.I. box install ! Wrapped in foam.47 $7.63. EBay. Good spark. Smooth idle. I was chasing carb clean. Manifold leaks. And vac.fuel valve. You are the 49cc guru. Thank you ! Next is the mech fuel valve install and the engine hanger bushings. ! They are fun 50cc scooters. Bill

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Hi I did have 45vac to the c.d.I and 470 ohm. From the exciter coil And .25 vac and 115 ohm from the pick up coil. At .o12 inch gap. With cranking speed . no voltage to the ign. Coil.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Hi I did have .2 ohm primary and 2900 ohm. Secondary without cap at the ignition coil

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

We will see now if my Chinese 50cc scooter ignition can stand up and run for some miles ! Thank you ! Bill Ashby ma

@justinbales1574 3 года назад

Very helpful video!!

@jaromirdanek2642 9 месяцев назад

Thanks sir,I have possible same problems.👍

@no.nomoreidontcare 3 года назад

Awesome video! I respect that you are going the troubleshooting way instead of replacing everything. CDI broke probably because of hard mount to frame (vibrations), you should use rubber mount instead.

@niallrothery7439 3 года назад

Your content is brilliant, learnt soo much looking forward to future video how to's. I do long rides on my two stroke 50 as well it's air cooled so less daunting to work on in my opinion have a great day

@NeoCGS 3 года назад

All that kicking without spark maybe did something to the inlet, also worth checking is the gaskets on the crank inside the CVT/behind the stator.

@Josemanc 3 года назад

I really enjoy your videos man. Still wondering why T2 won't start. I hope everything is ok with your piston and cylinder and there's no compression issues.

@arminprnjavorac2084 3 года назад

Please make a video on reed valves, what they do, how they work, what are the symptoms of a fault valve...

@paulbudford 3 года назад

I'm sure people will find this useful. Can't be many videos of troubleshooting this kind of ignition out there. 👍 Onward to the next problem. At least it's making good viewing for us. 😁

@bsrktm1 3 года назад

After removing the kill switch from the circuit, I start at the coil then work back. If there is good voltage at the coil input but no spark, the coil is the problem. No voltage at the coil means the cdi box, stator, or wiring is at fault. Often though, its easier to just start off by plugging in another cdi box and try again(if you have a known good spare) since the cdi box seems to fail more often. Good video like always.

@geoepi321975 3 года назад

you need a shunt to measure the primary coil voltage not a multimeter alone

@bsrktm1 3 года назад

@@geoepi321975 I use a DVA meter.

@geoepi321975 3 года назад

@@bsrktm1 yes because stator frequency Is not to multimeter standards

@jimihakovirta1648 3 года назад

How much vomtage you should have from coil input

@bsrktm1 3 года назад

@@jimihakovirta1648 anything other than zero. I've seen from 30-200v but it could be more or less depending on the system. They rarely fail partially so any output is a good sign that the box is ok. In my experience, the box fails 1st, then the stator, then the coil. but it could be any one or the wiring.

@robertpierce1981 3 года назад

I saved your electrical diagram as it may be useful in the future. It’s probably available on your website/forum. I would find it unlikely for two problems to simultaneously appear causing a breakdown but I’m sure as time goes by the issues will be videoed.

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

If you just did a screenshot, there's a link to easily download the diagram in the description and it is on the forum as well.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Nice elect.work? My new c.d.I. in my gy6 will be wrapped in foam in the battery box. To stopbangin around and failure!

@natvega1 Год назад

On a 150cc gy6 you can check an a/c stator on continuity, 500~520ohms.

@MrSandRune 3 года назад

Friday,my electric stator broke.40km straight into wilderness.So I had to be picked up with a trailer.7$ on aliexpress+7$magnet.150$ in europe original part(cheapest way).My deleted comment was:Cvt montage on sym-factory.Worker stand on belt right foot,and squeeze contra spring,while twisting it clock-wise into the pulley.Clamp the belt close to clutch.Set it into cvt.Fasten variator,wich has loose belt.After realease the clamp.COMPLETE IMPOSSIBLE WORK.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

I'm not giving up on hot ridding my 50cc gy6. Only if I could reg a 150 as a moped in mass r.m.v. yes big engine and hill climb

@49ccscoot Год назад

Nothing wrong with hopping up a four-stroke. Most builds can be good as long as you have reasonable expectations. Short of some serious engineering feats, the 50cc GY6 isn't going to be a wheelie monster capable of 80MPH like a high end 2T. It can be a good bike to ride though and still fun to work on. Just a 72cc kit makes them much more enjoyable to ride while still capable of being reliable with good gas mileage. The big bore is the big gain and then you're paying much more or spending much more time for any improvement.

@moonmanmedia8146 Год назад

Thanks man your video helped me realize that my scooter has a ground kill switch that's opposite of what the CDI wanted to read! It RUNSSSS

@gpzephyr 3 года назад

I'd whip the inlet manifold off and have a quick check that the reed valves are ok. A broken petal can lead to poor compression and is easier to check than taking the cylinder off. Its strange that you have cdi failure and a possible low compression at the same time.....good luck

@Bestswordable 3 года назад

I had really dumb issue as well, I was driving and it just bogged out, Tried starting it but had no spark, my cilinder had 2bar compression. Changed cylinder and spark just magicly appeared :D Btw it's a aprilia sr mk2 with minarelli lc engine, was runing stage 6 sport pro mk2 cylinder but when my small end bearing failed The cylinder was ruined :(

@andreww.6283 3 года назад

I’m having the same issue on my 1999 Prebug Zuma. It wants to run, but will not fire, and I noticed that the vacuum fuel petcock is not opening fully. It also has plenty of compression seemingly, could the reeds be damaged or not sealing if there’s low vacuum?

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

Could be reeds. I'd do a compression test if you have a tester. Make sure the hoses are in good condition. Could be the petcock.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Hi will non resistor plugs and or caps hurt the c.d.I on my gy6? Bill

@49ccscoot Год назад

They should be fine. I've never noticed any gains from non-resistor stuff though, so I use resistor plugs and caps on all of my scoots.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Hi I'll try 3 8.5 s. Rollers In my new vari ordered from best bike.

@KaiIngebrigtsen 3 года назад

Are you sure you got the right cdi? And if it isnt that might you have run your pistonrings dry when it stopped and lost compression?

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

Same code on the CDI, so it should be OK.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Hi any info on gy6 swing arm bushings? 30 mm diameter or 28 ? Will they punch out on the bike with a rod. And heat ?

@49ccscoot Год назад

Don't know the diameter off the top of my head, but that's all easy enough if you have calipers or just a tape really. You may be able to press them out with sockets and a nut and bolt. Use one socket to catch on the larger side and one to push on the smaller as the nut/bolt are tightened. Heat may help.

@Jortsa 3 года назад

In conclusion, are these MVT ignitions reliable? I have heard so many cdis being broken so not sure. I have ordered mvt dds for am6 but not sure is it mistake. And thanks alot for the stator measurements(ohms) because i really need them. Thanks and great video!

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

I wouldn't say I have enough data to make any conclusion on reliability. 190mech from the forums said that he has had a lot of reliability issues with a number of aftermarket ignitions in the two-stroke world since way back. I'm hoping this doesn't happen every 500-1000 miles or CDIs will get incredibly expensive.

@Jortsa 3 года назад

@@49ccscoot Yep, thats only thing that i am worried about. 290€ should get proper and reliable ignition but i dont like bying expensive cdis everymonth. Fully programmable and reliable cdi would have been 230€ shipped with adjustable ignitionmaps, limitersetups, quick shifters etc etc but chose mvt because lighter flywheel. Thanks for answer

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Hi. Can you check the radial play of the rod bearing thru the spark plug hole with a screw driver near T.d.c.

@49ccscoot Год назад

That would not be an accurate measurement.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Thank you. I would think any play. Up and down is bad

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Yeah, but IMO just take the cylinder off and check it. I don't like to question measurements and what I'm feeling so the extra time is worth it to be sure I can tell what's happening.

@nastynatesscooters9896 Год назад

I have a mineralli 2 stroke zuma and they key don’t turn the engine on or off just the lights. But when I start the bike without the lights on it revs but when I switch the lights on it will idle but not rev, kinda like it has a rev limiter. I’ve tried different stators, different cdi. Idk what’s up with it.. I posted a video on Instagram.

@49ccscoot Год назад

Odd. I would check to see if there's any continuity to any of the headlight wiring to any ignition parts or the kill switch circuit. Maybe some sort of short or interference. Possibly related to the switch. Not sure if that will get you anywhere, but maybe worth a look. I know at least some Yamaha stuff is ground to run. If that's the case here, the CDI is getting a ground on that circuit from somewhere.

@nastynatesscooters9896 Год назад

I figured out when I unplugged my stator lighting wires the bike runs better but when they plugged in it will only idle not rev

@JoniK1 3 года назад

Those CDI's are really fragile, broke several ones until I changed to different ignition system

@JoniK1 3 года назад

Definitely not for daily driven scooter 😃

@porkher Год назад

@@JoniK1 what ! yes especially for every day rider

@porkher Год назад

Can you say"timing

@hannnapret6636 2 месяца назад

what if i have 1volt max at the first measure to red black cable?

@49ccscoot 2 месяца назад

If it's not making spark, then you probably found why. Definitely go over your checking process to be sure all is good there, but 1V from the exciter is not sufficient for the ignition to work. You'll probably need a new stator.

@MrArni765 3 года назад

Hi again, i have commented on your other video about MVT, you have explained here that Red/black wire along with green/yellow is energizing coil, would it be possible to machine a plate that mounts to the existing rotor with little magnet at the red line spot that will spin near the original pickup with the right gap and tell the CDI when to energize the ignition coil ? I own Aprilia RS 125 and i would like to get inner rotor ignition with lighting, 55 W is enough for LED lights but since MVT DD 12 Igniton does not have pickup, i would like to make a custom ignition point with that plate and basically just use lighting coil from the stator.

@MrArni765 3 года назад

I have already machined everything to fit to the Aprilia RS125, i just need to sort out ignition point.

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

@@MrArni765 I don't think you'd need a pickup if you can use MVT's CDI. I'm not sure how it works, but I have to guess that it uses the signal from the exciter to trigger the spark. I have no obvious pickup, but I have spark timed where it should be, so it's getting that info somehow.

@MrArni765 3 года назад

@@49ccscoot I do have MVT CDI but it is not ment for Aprilia RS 125 but RS 50, i use ZEELTRONIC CDI for my bike which is fully programmable along with RAVE exhaust valve so i need the existing CDI. I was thinking that i could make an adaptor plate to work with the original pickup and Zeelternic CDI. But the only thing I'm not sure how to do is where on the plate do i have to place the magnet to keep the correct ignition. I can set offset in the CDI program but I have no idea who to ask.

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

@@MrArni765 Sounds like you should make something that could easily be moved. Wouldn't need to be a permanent job just to test what timing it's at.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Hi what's up gy6 guru? Have you tried the adjustable AC c.d.I. units? Yellow ones Some have. One Phillips adjuster. One has 3 dip switches. ! They may be the answer. Bill

@49ccscoot Год назад

I have a purple adjustable Kitaco CDI for the GY6. It basically just changed when the ignition ramped up, but wouldn't do anything for total advance. That's one of the problems with these things is you don't know what you're getting and descriptions aren't always/often accurate.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Ok thank you. What about mounting a reluctor extention. On the fly wheel . Steel or flex magnets. Solder or cements? What would the max safe advance be? 5 deg? Any offset keys for the gy6? And is the increase acceleration worth it for a 2 h.p. gy6?

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@williamhaskellhaskell3162 I wouldn't mess with that. Not worth the risk of throwing the flywheel and engine out of balance or having a magnet fly off. There used to be offset keys. Not sure if they are around anymore. Not something I hear about lately. Ignition advance can give nice gains. You could potentially advance the ignition quite a bit, but I wouldn't blindly add a lot of advance. You'd be better off to try a little at a time if you had a way to adjust it.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

I'll look into offset key. And the adjustable cid w/3 dip switch. 3 position each

@dennisvanhees6884 Год назад

Can u make a video, of output voltage once connected to the cdi. So the same cable but connected to cdi. My piaggio runner engine cuts out at high rpm, spits threu exhaust. My voltage once connected to the cdi is 180volts on idle, when i trottle it up it goes down to 130volts. Like the charging system does the cdi power side must go up in voltage???.

@49ccscoot Год назад

I actually just had someone ask me about specs for the red/black wire when revved up so I have an answer. Roughly 100V at 2000RPM and increases as revs increase. My max was a little over 14,000RPM and it reached 305V.

@dennisvanhees6884 Год назад

@@49ccscoot ok thanks a lot, ive replaced my stator and the cdi/coil combined. Could that be the flywheel is bad, i have never had a isseu over 20 years with flywheels. Greetings from the netherlands

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@dennisvanhees6884 I guess you can see if the rotor is still magnetic. Can't say I hear of them failing either. Maybe a bad ground or poor connections somewhere.

@Deathstroke069 3 года назад

Hey could u measure the resistance between the red/black cable and the black one ?

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

165Ω

@Deathstroke069 3 года назад

@@49ccscoot okay my pickup coil is definitely broken .. since the screw of my mounting plate broke for some reason and the stator got damaged . Thanks

@user-bl4gm6gq7u 3 года назад

dude on my switch is not black and white wire and brown, what is that wire? and where to connect it? because everything is connected except him but there is no spark

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

www.49ccscoot.com/pics/tritonv22/DD06Diagram.png You may have to check MVT's site or with a dealer to see if you can get a schematic for what you have.

@everythingbro4786 Год назад

I have piaggio nrg power scooter, and it has spark bet very weak one, any suggestions for that?

@49ccscoot Год назад

Check the ignition coil. Check the output of the exciter coil. If a weak spark is causing problems, sometimes a tight plug gap, like 0.010"-0.015" will clear it up and help you verify that weak spark is the issue.

@everythingbro4786 Год назад

Well it hasn’t been started for a long time, so first thing I checked is spark and in normal lighting it’s invisible only in dark u can see it, so I assume it’s a weak spark.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

On a gy6 4t

@olivermbk6042 3 года назад

Bonjour. Hello from france . I not sure to buy à mvt dd now . Pvl is Very good but no light . I dont know ?sory for my english .good job!

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

I will say that the time that it took for a CDI to fail is not good. I have heard from others that this is life with racing ignitions. I do like the MVT though. Being able to have a racing ignition and maintain my battery while using DC lighting has been nice. It's not on par with what the stock stator could do, but the stock ignition system couldn't make the engine run like this.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Ok you have no pick up coil for timing. Check. It's integrated with your stator? Can you check timing with a lite

@49ccscoot Год назад

You can still check timing with a light. This thing didn't like any fancy lights. I had to use a basic $15 timing light. I had 4 lights and that's the only one that worked. The timing light is picking up pulses on the plug wire, so it doesn't really care how you're getting spark for the most part.

@williamhaskellhaskell3162 Год назад

Ruckus 2 strokes beat out the gy6 engines. On all speeds?

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@williamhaskellhaskell3162 That's a tough question because it depends exactly which build for each. In stock form, the 150 is stronger.

@DH22013 3 года назад

Are you sure your ignition isn't damaged since you changed your water pump a few weeks ago?

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

The water pump drive really shouldn't damage the ignition. My main concern there was if it would cause the nut to loosen and potentially change timing. It could stress the crank and potentially cause clearances to change if it did. I don't think that is happening. I will verify the timing mark alignment though.

@lajestecreations9939 2 года назад

Did you solve why it didnt start

@49ccscoot 2 года назад

No spark from the CDI and a stuck ring at the same time.

@aeiouer 3 года назад

Overnight parts from Canada

@2strokemf Год назад

And since then how many cdi’s have you bought. Because I bought mvt ignition and want to know if they are reliable.

@49ccscoot Год назад

None so far.

@2strokemf Год назад

@@49ccscoot so they are reliable

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@2strokemf I have hear that they are not the most reliable... but I'm out there riding on the street. I think with race oriented stuff like most people would use them on, they're not necessarily your biggest concern.

@2strokemf Год назад

@@49ccscoot I am also going to use them on the street.

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@2strokemf It's not cheap, but if it's a big concern there's always the option to carry a spare CDI.

@julekmisaczek 3 года назад

Maybe it's a sign to go back to the ssr build?

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

LOL

@user-ft7uk3hy8o 8 месяцев назад

What was the problem

@49ccscoot 8 месяцев назад

The CDI.

@traystunna 3 года назад

What did it end up being? I am facing this exact problem now 🤦🏾‍♂️

@49ccscoot 3 года назад

It's detailed in the next video : ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-8l1hkM8Ciwo.html

@traystunna 3 года назад

@@49ccscoot thanks Brent!

@nationalboosted2877 Год назад

Mine sparks first time when I crank it after that it does nothing, sometimes it will work as normal, but it will eventually come back to getting spark first when I crank it

@49ccscoot Год назад

That's an unusual one. If it were heating up and then stopping spark, then it would likely be the stator failing when hot. If it's just turning over the engine and it doesn't spark after the first tries to start it, then I'm not too sure.

@nationalboosted2877 Год назад

@@49ccscoot I fixed it, it was the key switch, I unplugged the connector and now it has spark. Here comes the other problem now it's shutting off, it starts pretty fast but it won't idle for even 5 sec and it will die

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@nationalboosted2877 I'd start with making sure there are no air leaks and then carburetor settings.

@nationalboosted2877 Год назад

@@49ccscoot I don't think that it has air leaks, the mixing screw is 2 turns out. It starts ok, but if i try to start it with the idling screw turned in or the if I move the throttle it won't start.

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@nationalboosted2877 Try adding some fuel. Either a larger starter jet or just richening the mix screw or a larger pilot jet.

@deathvader58 Год назад

HOLY SHIT. 22 minutes for a 5 minute video. Way too much Babbling.

@49ccscoot Год назад

Some people like to have all of the details. You can always skip around to find something more quickly, but you can't add more when the info isn't there. You're probably here because you couldn't find anyone else showing this kind of info for this ignition.

@deathvader58 Год назад

@@49ccscoot 22 minutes and you still did not fix it

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@deathvader58 The video was intended to give some ignition info. The bike had other issues (shown in the next vid in the series).

@chrisricks6736 Год назад

@@49ccscoot Fine job! Very helpful. I have the same issue with a kinetic TFR. Have spark, new carb... Nothing, not even a pop on starting fluid. I did have to free the piston loose. Likely have a stuck ring too. But does have compression and should fire, especially on starting fluid. New CDI on the way, we'll see.

@49ccscoot Год назад

@@chrisricks6736 Good luck with it.