C-Webb was trippin HARD with his DWade comment. "He had Shaq. He had LeBron." No, Kobe and Penny had SHAQ. DWade had Shaquille O'Neal. I guess he forgot everything DWade did during the Finals when he won his 1st ring. There's a reason LeBron said "I'm going to go play with THAT guy." Wade also would have won Finals MVP against Dallas had LeBron shown up A LITTLE BIT in that series.
more like lebron/shaq had dwade. i'm still mad at lbj at 2011 finals, nowhere to be seen. Just like today's g4, he disappeared in the last quarter AGAIN
When Shaq actually averaged 21.6 ppg and 9.9 rpg over the two years Nash won MVP, not 28 and 15. And missed 32 games in those two years. Not MVP numbers there big fella.
Yeah for real, Shaq is wicked annoyingly stupid and prideful sometimes. And maybe Kobe deserved one of Nash’s MVPs but DEFINITELY NOT Shaq. People don’t get it, MVP isn’t anything but a regular season prize for a single year, voted on by former players, management, and media members. It’s not a career achievement award. It’s like the all-NBA First, Second, and Third Teams, which is why Mullins was on the Dream Team instead of Dominique Wilkins or James Worthy (then Isiah wasn’t picked because he wasn’t that good anymore as he was a year away from retirement and because he was a total asshole to everyone including Jordan, Bird and Magic and he paid for it, and then Shaq wasn’t on because Laettner was coming off NCAA player of the year and back to back championships and the game winning championship buzzer shot, but as Shaq rapped once, Shaq was picked first in that draft a month before the Olympics, then Alonzo then Laettner, so Shaq is the only one with a real argument for shoulda having made the OG Dream Team, but it’s not a bulletproof one by any means, especially because they had Ewing and Robinson who could fill a Shaq like role and then needed more shooters like Laettner at that point in time due to international game rules.
Damn.. Dwade disrespected! D wade carried shaq to the 2006 championship! Shaq averaged 14pts and 10reb and less than 1blk. Wade averaged 34.7pts 8reb 4asst and 2.67stls. Greatest finals performance of all time.
I can't believe Wade wasn't instantly unanimous. He's better than some of the ones they OK'd off the bat. You have to go back to the stats to see how truly insane some of those seasons are. Stop his career after his THIRD championship and he'd still be a shoe-in.
Chris Webber is just a hater. Prime Wade is right there with Kobe, LeBron, MJ tier as far is talent’s concerned. Payton isn’t even in the same floor as wade let alone room
Dennis Leavitt only shaq had more MVP level performance. If shaq wasn't on the floor they would be losing. The same shit happened to lebron, when he was my on the floor cavs would be a less than .500 team. Meanwhile steph got it...like wtf? Mind you Kobe had a fucking amazing run the year nash got it so I know for sure there was some bullshit going on there.
Jose Gonzalez Lmao What? Everyone knows wade is by far a better all time player than c web and Reggie miller. That’s just an objective and true statement
Jose Gonzalez nah your comment proved that you know nothing about dwade. “Asked for help”? Lebron and his agent called dwade. Not the other way around. Shaq also chose miami to be the team he wants to be traded at cuz he know dwade can help HIM win another ring. Dwade gave mourning, walker, payton, and j-will their only ring. No disrespect to these old guys especially to webber and miller but dwade is way better than them. And webber shouldn’t be talking in this and he acts like he did something in his career.
The disrespect towards Nash is crazy and Shaq is always going to be petty about it. Nash is one the best shooters/passers ever, bar none. His playmaking was so good that he inflated his teammates stats and made role players look like all stars. You can’t ask for more then that from a Point Guard. Depending on the roster...he could be seen as more valuable than Kidd or Payton. There are many variables to consider.
its actually not as bad as u make it seem. He was a good system-player. He played little no defense. & Never rebounded as well as Kidd, so the points about him being greater than Kidd is laughable. Kidd is a champion. The disrespect of him, maybe more glaring by this point. The glove provided defense in ways Nash could never, decent passer rebounding in his own right. Without Dantoni's system those years its highly doubtful he'd have ever reached being named mvp. In the very least Kidd >. Nash's lack of defense & what he did OUTSIDE his time under DAntoni, are the reasons why he's not seen as being as great as u seem to think he is.. no disrespect, js..
@@AquarianAngel kidd has 5,100 more total rebounds than nash, almost 2,000 more assists, almost 2,000 more steals than Nash, roughly 350 more blocks than Nash, almost 200 overall more points scored. We all know he played more defense than Nash. If a team has a Kobe or a Duncan, & their team's looking for a pg between nash/kidd; i think the vets in the league would almost unanimously say Kidd would be the better 'championship/dynastic' fit of the 2.
If you don't think cwebb deserves this go watch what he did against Some of the best power forwards ever. If he won championships he'd be solely the best power forward of all time.
alexchilled because he was amazing? You do know that him and a bunch of other "rookies" beat the dream team right? Idc if they were not ready, they lost.
D Hamm bs narrative. Jordan ain’t winning shit without pippen. Kobe ain’t winning shit without shaq and pau gasol lmao. Plus who joined who? Shaq chose miami because of dwade and james joined miami because of dwade. Dwade never called for help. Foh.
He's also the most intelligent, as well. TMac, Penny,Webber? Please. Reggie is border line, but I don't think he makes unless they kick some of the original 50 out. And don't hold you breath on the CWebb HOF invite. Neither his college or NBA career warrants it.
+j ho i wanna see you average 30 a year and have back injuries but get shitted on because "you couldn't make it out the 1st round". Basketball is a team game. But i guarantee t-Mac would've made it to the NBA finals in 08 if he didn't get injured. And c Webb got screwed out of the finals.
Even if he did, Webber played 13 other years. The refs cheated him out every year. That's a huge difference from getting knocked out by Utah in the 1st to beating the Lakers and the Spurs. And what I can doesn't matter. I can't do what Danny Ferry did, it doesn't make him not a shitty player. And played with Yao, Artest, Battier, Scola, Ariza and a bunch of good role players. He had mediocre teams from 01-03 but the east was shit back then. Bball is the sport that relies most on single stars, it's only guys like Chuck who whine about. The point is, retarded, cross eyed Shaq has so little knowledge of the game that he thinks those guys are part of the next top ten,when not one of them if going to be in the HOF.
+j ho I disagree about that hall of fame thing. NBA hall of fame is the most relaxed hall of fame. I think even Ben Wallace is going in the hall of fame t-Mac and Webb are not top 20 or even top 50. But they are definitely top 100. Me personally I think Chris Webber is a better player than Scottie pippen but you know pippen had Jordan. And I feel bad for t-Mac because he's the greatest what if since grant hill.
+j ho and let's not forget about that 22 game winning streak. You don't think they could've won it all that year? Or at least force a game 7 against the Celtics.
+Neo Blade Problem with T-Mac was that he got injured often. But when he was healthy and in his prime, he was competing with Kobe as the best in the NBA
In his prime? no but that don't really or we would put tracy mcgrady ,penny and many others way higher on our list but injuries cut their greatness short so imo wade better. Also you have to consider wade carried that heat franchise to playoff even after the championship year in which he carried shaq and that team in. Another thing is if wade didn't get the knee injuries who's to say he wouldn't have still been averaging 28 to 30 points still.
Steve Nash... Put sum RESPEK ON IT! x2 MVPs and all those assists... It's probablyt because Phoenix never saw a Final even though they had the best record out West and in the League.
A.I took some bums to the Finals. That's still more credible than any championship Wade has. Kidd couldn't shoot. Reggie was a beast. Reggie is better than Wade offensively. Wade got him on D though. Wade is not Top 25. You don't know the history of the league buddy. You can tell you've only been watching basketball for 10 years or more.
+Sea Pea You really have no idea about basketball. AI took a bad team to the finals yes, but Wade won 3 Championships and a Finals MVP in one of the best performances in finals history. Also, while AI was a more prolific scorer, Wade was more efficient, a better defender and a better playmaker. Miller is not a contender compared to Wade. He doesn't have the accolades nor awards, and while Miller was a better shooter Wade is a much versatile and prolific scorer, better defender and better playmaker. You should watch entire games and not just highlight reels on RU-vid.
Man shaq is SALTY about steve nash. I agree that he didn't deserve his second one (Kobe should have won) but he absolutely deserved the 1st even though Shaq was amazing. People hate on Nash way too much these days and it really pisses me off
+Nashty i get that but 35 ppg in modern basketball?!???? Thats unreal and he did carry them to the playoffs in a tough western conference (almost won also
Rj Macready Kobe only averaged 27 ppg vs the Suns (worst defense in the league) in that year's playoffs. Kobe played great vs the Suns but it was actually the Lakers' size advantage that gave the Suns trouble in that series. The Suns' couldn't get rebounds and they were being killed inside by Bynum and Kwame Brown of all people.
Chris Webber's a Hall of Famer and should be unanimous 10 next players. without qualifying his stats at all he is a career 21 PPG 10 RPG player. add that to the fact that he made teams like Washington and Sacramento winners. In Sacramento he averaged 24, 11, and 5 and had them knocking on the door of a title and had it not be for Tim Donaghy and the rest of the corrupt referees, he's have a title. and last but certainly not least he was a five-time all NBA player. his career averages would be even higher if it wasn't for trying to hold on after his knee blew out for three terrible Seasons between Philadelphia and Golden State. for any NBA fan it is impossible to watch the NBA during Webber's time and not say he's one of the 60 best players in NBA history.
This is not top 10 greatest players for the 14/15 season, this is which 10 players who didn't play when the top 50 greatest players of all time list was made in 1996 who would be on it.
What's Webber's point of bringing up the fact that he won a ring with Shaq? Shaq was struggling like shit in those Finals and Wade completely took that series over. Multiple 40 point games and a 2 or 3 30s. He averaged 36 in that series. Shaq should thank Wade for that 4th ring.
Wade had like 5 veterans though. Alonzo mourning, Gary Payton, Antoine walker, Jason Williams, and shaq. I'm probably missing somebody too. Idc if they were old. They still seasoned him. Why do you think d-wade has a high b-ball IQ
The disrespect for Tmac man... SMH. For a brief while Tmac was the best player in the league. If you maintain that position for any length of time you deserve recognition. End of story
He's a better all around player than Ray Allen. But Ray Allen is the greatest shooter of all time until bitch ass curry surpasses him in a couple of years.
+Adam Johnson (RailRoad) I don't care what nobody say, Ray Allen will forever be the greatest shooter of all time. The only times he played with good teammates, he won. Rashard Lewis was good, but he wasn't as good a shooter as Klay's bum ass so I can't give Curry that. Especially since he plays with 3 all stars and Ray played with 0 in his prime.
Dennis Leavitt it's really hard to compare players from different eras. The game evolves, rules change massively, players and coaches learn from those who came before them (or at least I hope they do), shoes, nutrition, training, medical care, etc. all get better as time progresses. It is too different of a game compared to 50 years ago to be fair to either one.
If this is a top 10 in the 2000s then it should be. Kobe Bryant Tim Duncan Shaquille O'neal Lebron James Dwayne Wade Dirk Nowitzki Kevin Garnett Paul Pierce Allen Iverson Tracy Mcgrady This isn't just based off their championship statuses but also their ability to carry their own franchises or boost the value of the team.
When Steph Curry, Klay Thompson, and other snipers start passing Ray Allen all-time, people will easily put Miller over Allen. He carried a franchise for 17 years, they were competitive from 93-04 because of him, and top 5 clutch performer. BOOM BABY
Kenny got both picks, Steve Nash and Dwayne Wade - Both shone over Shaq. It's really disgraceful when someone is so proud;till the point where his bias overrides common sense...
What Nash did to that suns franchise is the same as when Stockton and Malone went to Utah!!! I mean... the year he got there they won like 25-30 more games than the previous year!!! At least 3 guys had CAREER seasons playing with Nash!!!! If what I said doesn’t qualify for most valuable.... I don’t know what should!!!
The early 00's gave birth to alot of hall of famers, Pierce, garnett, allen, carter, mcgrady, kidd, iverson, bryant, webber, etc. Those names have some much power and history. Could care less about rings, if anything, the rings should cement the slot but not be the sole criteria
Lol some of these comments questioning how great C-Webb was. Like Chuck said, everywhere he went they started winning. No coincidence there. He was an elite player at every level of basketball and one of only a handful of bigs to average 20/10/4 over a career. Simply put, one of the most skilled PFs to ever play the game which allowed him to excel so long despite being hobbled by injuries later in his career. Kind of sad though because if not for a bullshit 02 series with the Lakers, C-Webb would have a ring and this wouldn't even be a debate. Glad he gets his props from his peers though
How the hell they gonna say dwade not unanimous especially shaq on play wit him 1st hand and all the stuff he said about him when playing wit them and chris webber and billups had 1st hand experience being on the same court wit and billups played against him in the 2005 and 2006 playoffs and I remember billups during the 06 playoffs that billups he thought played better than lebron that year
Are you fucking kidding me steve nash, is third all time in assists. Had a 50 40 90 season four times, back to back mvps. Made average players look like all stars and was the heart and soul of those phoenix teams. The system worked because of nash. Canada's best player of all time and your telling me he doesn't even crack the top 50?
Nash was a great player. BUT... was he a better point guard than, Magic? Oscar Robertson? Isaiah Thomas? Gary Payton? John Stockton? No, he was not. Thus, he is NOT in the top 20 al-time. Top 30 perhaps.
He was better than Gary in terms of passing, facilitating and shooting. Gary Payton was just so good defensively that it made up for, not being the very best at passing or running the show.
Shaq hating lmao he must've forgot the 2006 playoff run!!! Wade carried the heat he single handled scored almost every point or assisted every point in the 4th quarter Shaq only averaged 11 fucking points
+Wei Qi Even if it's not about the MVP, that man is special. I disliked him when he was playing, but now that he isn't, on retrospect, dude gave so much flair to the game, I actually miss him. LOL. He adds a different facet to the game. That passing game was straight up DOPE.
Tracy McGrady retired in 2013, was introduced to hall of fame in 2017. Chris Webb retired in 2008 still not in hall of fame as 2019. There’s no comparison between these two.
TMac never took one of his teams out of the first round!!!! Dont get me wrong for about 6-8 years TMac was top 3 player in the league at his postion, prob number 2 behind Bean. He was a beast, but not gettin out the first round is a big wort on his career
I'm happy I finally found this video on youtube. Finally other people agree how they disrespected Wade so much in this video. He's unanimously unquestioned in the next 10 and its not debatable AT ALL. If someone didn't make the original top 50 why would they make the next 10???? Look at his resume and it speaks for itself.
I am 27 years old and in the mid 90's i was obviously around the ages of 5,6,7,8,etc. That said, even then I knew how impactful penny hardaway and grant hill was. injuries aside their talent was literally ridiculous. So if we're talking greatest players I would at least(at least) put the argument up for grant hill. I say all this because, championship teams ARE NOT solely functioning off one player. Its five. for dwade he had ALOT of help. Now does that mean he shouldnt be included? No of course not, but those without the talent around them shouldnt discredit the individual play.
Andre insanally..... if those two guys.... PENNY AND HILL don’t get hurt and play a long and healthy career; I’m saying BOTH OF THEM are top 15-20 all time!!!( maybe even 10-15)
These guys are adding too many players, for the list to not loose its integrity it should be 5 or less. Without a doubt you put Duncan, Kobe, Lebron, Dirk, Wade. These guys are tier 1. Borderline entry or tier 2 Garnet, c Paul, Pierce , miller, or allen. Cris webber is a joke and the staff are elevating his status because they are all buddies and c-webb is a cool kat, but he is not top 60.
dwade should be unanimous Reggie is highly considered on this list Nash is also higly considered but cwebb, come on this dude is not one of the next greatest
Shaq wouldn't have won his rings without Kobe and Wade and he acts like penny was the greatest player ever. That's very convienent Shaq. Deny credit to the man that got you your fourth ring.
Mo 2k....... the ONLY reason we’re even having this debate is because PENNY GOT HURT!!! if Penny stays healthy his whole career, he’s a top 10-15 player all time!!! Him a shaq get at least a few together, and shaq stays in Orlando!!!
Dennis Leavitt oh really? If dwade was also HEALTHY, Dwade would’ve been better than kobe. Don’t act like dwade was always healthy. Talkin about getting hurt nigga dwade was injury prone and can still play great.
shaq questioned if dwayne wade was better than penny umm shaq you and penny were in your prime and couldnt win dwade carried you to the finals way past your prime dwade is better than penny
Nigga this was 80-90 this era was wayyyyyyyy more difficult and tougher then 0'6 smh . Like which era is harder to get to through the playoffs and finals, a time with magic, kareem in there prime, JORDAN who was in his prime as a rookie by avg 30+ or player like steve nash and brandon roy dont talk shit about carrying. Also it's the other way around, if shaq was not there wade would have the same number of rings as lebron.
When I looked around the league in term of two guard after mike and kobe DWade comes right after no discussion ,as Allan iverson was more as a point guard .
Shaq is just the ultimate hater. Wade essentially gave Shaq a 4th ring. Shaq is the same person that thinks #'s are the only thing that matters. He's funny, but he isn't that wise when ranking players.
In the intermission where they show them talking casually, CWebb goes off saying his stats were way better than Dirk's. They're definitely good, but Dirk's is right up there and the sheer amount of years he averaged 20, sometimes 25 ppg is crazy. He's only now slowing down in his final years, but even then it's 17-18. Overall Cwebb's stats were better, but the point average for Nowitizki is really eye popping. He's really under the radar in terms of how we perceive the best scorer's in the league history.
Steve nash fucking disrespected. 3rd all time assists, 50/40/90 club more than anyone in the history, one of the greatest shooters ever. Come on now. And A.I, Wade, Kobe, Lebron, Vince Carter all deserved MVP before Shaq in those years Nash won it.
+IanLEAU If that was the case then why didn't hardly any if them average a double double with essentially average teammates. Stop hating on Nash because of some rule changes.
horseshit, PGs of the past had their game predicated on driving to the hoop. That's why the "physical" aspect of the game back in the day is always brought up. Nash's points in the paint generally came form running circles around paint defenders while trying to divert their attention to the forwards who he'd pass the ball to. If he confused them well enough, the paint would be empty for an easy layup. But besides that, it was that silky jumper. *That's* the reason he made the 50/40/90 club so much. Cause he is arguably the greatest, if not one of the greatest shooters in the game.
Kenny Smith needs to make up his mind: "Reggie Miller over Ray Allen because he carried a franchise but has no rings....." later: "Not Vince Carter, because he has no rings and guys with no rings are not great"
I would take Manu over Reggie and Ray and T-Mac for his defense and passing, he was more of a complete player despite not scoring as much because of him ultimately becoming a 6th man; also, Manu is my fav athlete ever. That being said, I don't think he's in the next ten, Kobe and D-Wade should be ahead of him for sure, TD, Lebron, Dirk, KG as well.
If it ain't broke don't fix it,im not gonna disagree with you to hardly because it is a fair argument,but IN MY OPINION Reggie was the better player,because of how he led Indiana and he's also one of the best shooters ever
Andre Bailey I respect your opinion, but I think Manu was capable of leading a team on his own were he put in the same position. He could do everything besides defend someone in the post, unless he drew a charge or flopped like how he did in his younger years.
If you looking at it today he already deserves to be there. The last 2 years he has achieved more than most people in the discussion have achieved in their entire careers.
I don't know what Shaq is talking about. The two years Steve Nash won, Shaq was old, fat, and on the decline in Miami. Those aren't the years where he was dominating the league in LA, those were the years he average 23 and 10 and 20 and 8 playing second banana to Wade.
Some simple achievements to look at. All NBA Teams All Defensive Teams MVPs Scoring Titles Rebounding Leader Steals Leader Assists Leader A combination of this would easily give you the best players. Keep Opinions aside. This isn't just about your favorite player. Great players achieve results. Reggie Miller even being considered is a joke. 3 All NBA 3rd Team thats all. You want to make him the greatest Pacer okay. You want to call him the greatest shooter okay. But don't bring him into this convo. I wouldn't bring Ray Allen into this convo either. Chris Webber as great as he was was selected into just 1 All NBA First Team. Dwade has a combination of everything. Nash makes it easy with his achievements as well. He did not change the rules to his benefit that was out of his reach. Despite Shaq's dislike for him you can't take his accomplishments away. Ben Wallace deserves it more than half the people they discussing.
1 kobe 2 duncan 3 garnett 4 norwitzki 5 iverson 6 lebron 7 mcadoo 8 Wilkins 9 durant 10 miller 11 kidd 12 payton 13 nash 14 dwade 15 webber 16 rodman 17 pierce 18 chris paul 19 dwight Howard 20 yao Ming 21 kemp 22 dennis johnson 23 English 24 Carmelo 25 Dumars 26 ray allen 27 tony parker 28 mutumbo 29 mourning 30 marc gasol The next 20 is still up for grabs. Could be players playing in the nba now or we don't know them yet. Vince, mcgrady, ginobli are not hall of famers. So they don't make the list
In this discussion, let us consider this issues> Players like LeBron James, Kevin Durant, Tim Duncan, and other current players, we should let there careers continue to go forth before they are added to this list of greatness. Its hard enough trying to select the ones who have retired. Some of you don't remember people like, Bob Cosey, or John Havaick, or Hal Greer, or Elgin Baylor, Connie Hawkins, Dave Bing, The Big O, Lou Hudson, and many more. All of these men are Hall of Famers and are the very foundation of the NBA. LeBron, Tim and the rest still are playing and will continue to dominator. So let the older guys see some glory. They deserve it.
+Pastor Ern Sye LOOOL im sorry but there is no question duncan and lebron or on this list it doesn't matter if they're still playing or not there better then any other players who have retired since the last 50 greatest players and there top 10 all time so there at the top along with kobe and dirk etc.
This is total race bias and I can't believe it. Nash won two Mvps, sympathy vote? Get real. System that made him? It's the same system Steph Curry is in. They won a championship. Did Steph get the sympathy vote too last year over Harden? I think there is a hate over the dantoine system and a disregard over the "white" NBA player amongst black NBA players, trying to keep white players breaking through. You can feel the tension when Kenny Smith brings it up. Go back to another Open Court where Steve Kerr said next to Jordan, Nash was the greatest player he'd ever seen prepare for a game, and these guys disregarded it, moved on. Steph Currys mother is white, and look at the lack of disrespect he's getting amongst his peers. Guess who he and Kerr consultant this year to make his game better? Steve Nash. Nash is now a paid consultant on the Warriors team. Currys balling..ha. I don't hear or read anyone asking for Webbers services, Like Hakeem,Nash,MJ, etc
Jason Culhane Steph curry’s Mum is actually mix race and I disagree with the race bait as players such as bird and Stockton get high praise I agree nash was a great player but you’re reaching
