The Guild is right in that a level 5 arching requires only one agent. They're also right in that in the example it was OSI's guy who escalated a lv5 encounter to lv8, which sadly works as a point in OSI's favor: the level system is a classification system to rank villains on an arbitrary scale, but that villain (or their arch) could conceivably escalate the arching if they can get their hands on higher level weaponry. Because of that human element threatening escalation, it is sadly necessary to send out 2 agents instead: 2 agents can handle the villain escalating, and (ideally) keep each other in check so neither of them escalates the arching. That said there should also be a measure in place if the opposite happens and a villain either isn't or no longer is worthy of their current classification. If a level 5 turns out to only be a level 1 for whatever reason, there should be a kind of mercy rule in play that allows the villain a dignified retreat (ie: without getting Samson'd or assaulted by the agents). Call it a mercy rule. I don't know why I'm so invested that I felt the need to type all this out.
Part of the issue is also perceived threat as well. If a protagonist, like Doctor Doom or Doctor Dewgong, have TWO OSI agents on their side because they've been given an Aggression Level 5 antagonist like, say, a down on his luck Monarch, the antagonist might see the agents as a purposeful increase of aggression and try to respond accordingly, making the situation worse. One agent alone is enough for a level 5. Two agents should be a level 8. Once you get to Red Death levels of Aggression you're gonna need a truck load of agents to handle him. Keep in mind, too, EMA is also a measure of capability, not just past showings.
Well- Two OSI agents. One Guild Agent who's sole purpose is to keep evaluating the threat level. Their sole purpose for being there is ~~To keep an eye on OSI and feel good about it~~ To get the villain *Out* if shit hits the fan. Losing valued members doesn't make the guild happy afterall- They want the ability to beat the shit out of a rampaging villain, give the Villain an out.
You’re invested because they did a damned good job of world building this series. This whole system is bureaucratic, frustratingly complicated and full of adults in power bickering like children, and… The thing is it kinda makes sense. It regulates them and keeps them in check so that they waste time exhausting themselves on each other and playing by the rules while still allowing them to live out their hate boner fantasies, instead of being a bunch of nuts running loose with superpowers and death rays.
The best, dumbest, most realistic part of this scene is how both sides are making completely sound and rational points yet NEITHER side is saying "Good point, but also" and are all just going "No, because see." Typical politics XD
@@SwiftCreationStudio The show runners said it hasn't been about failure since season 4 because everyone regurgitated it like a prayer without seeing there were other prominent themes as well, namely identity and choosing to do something out of passion without regard for anything else.
Velox or maybe it’s open to interpretation. For me the show has been a systematic satirization\parody of not just the comic book genre but the entire culture surrounding it.
bureaucracy isn't needed at all in the venture bros universe, the guild shouldn't have any rights. it makes 0 sense the OSI even entertains these wack bags
A kick-ass rebel journalist from the 60s 0r 70s. Not many people know about him but there are two movies based off him - Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas and The Rum Diary
Notice that in general (Dr. Cuttlefish aside) its always the protagonist that escalates? Action Man capping Turnbuckle, Jonas Jr. and the Deathray and pretty much everything Brock has ever done. It really shines a light on the conceit that violence perpetrated by a "good guy" gets accepted and glorified and that generally, the Guild just has less stable psychoses than their opposite numbers. Of course the other way to look at that is that generally, the arching selection is performed by the villains; there's no evidence that protagonists can "opt out" of having a nemesis. The villains at least chose to engage in their lifestyle and are actively perpetrating criminal behavior (however incompetently.) Although I wish to clarify, that no crime should legally qualify a punishment as gleefully gruesome as "death by Sampson." (Still better than an encounter with Wiley Pete from Empowered, but, lets not pretend cathartic violence is justice.)
@@spandanganguli6903 Because he makes it terrifying because he gets off on it but he's also done this a long time, he's from a different era of villainy
In Action Man's defense, the guy came up, no real plan in play, and started making demands. They didn't have time for Turnbuckle's bullshit. Usually, the "good guys" have to operate a different way entirely, staying somewhat within the rules so they can make the villain look far worse, tossing out certain restrictions. It's also politics, which gets ridiculous at times
It simeltaneously sounds like politicians debating over a national issue and children arguing if Superman could beat Goku (also: "is there a difference?")
@@sethleoric2598 Actually! The better argument is Spectre vs Pegasus Seiya; not Superman vs Son Goku. Especially Pegasus Seiya, Son Goku is no match for him even with Mastered Ultra Instinct.
@@sethleoric2598 I mean the creators of superman themselves had to create the OP no kill monster for superman which is why OPM is the perfect parody of him. Literally nobody but him or an equivalent (who pushes him to his absolute limits) can beat him In fact: it takes LITERAL GODS to kill that hack of a superhero because everyone loves him which also explains Return Of Superman
The Monarch had 21 when he was still a level 4. 21 is on par with an OSI agent, therefore 1 agent should be the minimum for a level 4. Since a level 5 is more dangerous than a level 4, the OSI should be able to assign more than one agent to a level 5 arching. Also, the EMA level seems less about how dangerous an antagonist is and more about how popular they are with the Guild, given you can gain rank just by mentoring a level 1.
It could be both - if it has to do with how dangerous you are, St. Cloud could give a lecture on arching to the entire GOCI and not bump up by one, whereas with the monarch it could have to do with presentation - one of the things Dr. Z docked points on during inspection was his eyebrows weren't waxed, so he still has some internal politicking to do before they decide to give him that level of responsibility. Although in regards to 21, it does raise the question of if someone can have a base level of danger, just because of how ruthless they are. Brock Sampson is never going to be a level one because of how much ass he kicks, and even with no gear/backup and minimal preparation, Dr. Victor Von Helping is still a five. Honestly, if there's anything in this show I want more detail on, it's EMA. Considering 10 is small army and 1 wouldn't qualify for a scooby-doo villain, in my mind it raises the question of how much damage a level five could do. While Red Mantle seems to downplay it, what he seems to describe in all likelihood wouldn't break a two or a three. Long story short, at what EMA do villains start being dangerous?
I love listening to these types of discussions. It's as if they're Marvel vs. DC Comics writers and editors debating on whose merits are worth placing on the radar and who should be passed around. It's even better since Jackson Publick was a comic writer for the Tick.
One agent and a trainee. Problem solved... Although I don't know why the GCI would want to stop the OSI from wasting as many agents as they like. Every one busy With Mister Cold and his snowcone maker is one less agent available if Red Death gets murdery at the same time!
Considering that the Guilds' leadership under The Sovereign ended with half of the Council of 13 either dead or defecting, the death of The Investors, the death of Monstroso (thereby making Mammoth Corp. a defunct and non-viabpe business partner for making additional revenue), the Guild of Calamitous Intent is in a very fragile spot as a center for Organized Villainy. Regardless of the OSI opinion on the GCI, the Guild at least follows a code of conduct that organizations like the Peril Partnership and S.P.H.I.N.X. is lacking in, the only reason why most villains went with the Guild was due to its vast size and scope compared to the other organizations, along with the numerous benefits that it can offer them. Also, in-retrospect the Guild is the safest bet that the OSI has that can realistically prevent a WWIII scenario betwen Villains and Mad Scientists against Heroes and Super Scientists. At a time the Scientific community was united underneath one banner until a section of it broke away and declared war against the other half, the former becoming the Guild of Calamitous Intent in later years. It was only a matter of time until Super Scientists contracted the help of Heroes that they hired or created, resulting in the GCI creating or inducting Villains to help protect themselves andit all escalated from there to what it is today.
Red Death is a top tier asset. He is used sparingly. The level 5s are the real workhorses pulling in most of the loot. Think about it. He's needed at base. The agents of OSI are much better squishing the fat middle than worrying about the guys at the top or bottom. That is where the bulk of the guild's resources are. If you bottle neck that then the whole guild suffers. That is why they are against it.
I thought it was great because of how ridiculous it was and that Jonas Venture Sr. came up with it, the guy was probably messing with them and I bet Rusty re visioned the treaty to his own benefit.
The rankings mean nothing when persons of some rank can gain access to equipment and weaponry that is scheduled above their ranking for poor to arbitrary reasons. Saint Cloud and the Lightning Rifle come to mind. Two agents. Be glad that it isn't three.
The guild seems extremely bureaucratic, like a Rotary Club or some kind of hobbyists organization. Insane hobbyists, sure, but they like their rules and structure. OSI is basically a rogue government agency stocked with psychopaths.
Amd i the only one who like when this super agents and super villains discuss bureacracy like normal people in a normal business situation? Its looks strange and awesome at the same time hahaha
It feels like they are arguing over perspectives in a comic. The show makes it a point to say the heroes are not all good people (Jonas venture was a super scientists but often bullied his son as well as other people) and villains are not all bad people (red death may have a body count of super soldiers but he’s a loving family man and willing to make sure he meets a compromise with his wife) So yea the subtext of arguing perspective on a comic is there
I'm with the OSI on this point. A Level 5 Arching is, on paper, barely a blip on the radar, but they have the *potential* to go horribly horribly wrong, and that's why a minimum of two agents need to be on-site in the event it does exactly that.
Well you've got to remember that arches are not guild agents and that level 5 is something even the guild themselves consider barely competent while OSI field agents are largely trained super soldiers that could probably crush a level 5 in their sleep so having even one agent assigned to oversee a level 5 could be considered overkill and having more would give the OSI complete control of the situation which the guild simply can't allow since the consider themselves equal or even better than the OSI
@@archangeltyrael3369 your average osi member isn’t a Brock. It’s the corporeal at the table. A dude. With like. Basic intelligence training. Much like the CIA the I does not stand for “Incredibly-competent-warrior”. They just happen to have some top tiers who can go toe to toe with the guilds best. They aren’t the norm by any means.
YOU'RE SETTING ME ON FIRE AND TELLING ME IT'S JUST SUMMER the level 5 arch ONLY got bad because the OSI didn't oversee THEIR protagonist who got access to level EIGHT weaponry. The OSI not being able to properly manage their own agents is not a guild problem, one agent is enough, plus better OSI oversight.
