I love the contrast between the Light Side Sith Inquisitor and the Light Side Sith Warrior. The former is "I'm going to do something clever and pragmatic that helps people and gets what I want at the same time," and the latter is "Can you please stop attacking me? I am literally here to buy groceries!"
The rest part of the story: -You there. -Ah, Sith! Kill him! -No, I just wanted to talk... -You think I am stupid? Defend yourself! *kill everyone* -I wanted... TO TALK!!!!
"Always I try to be reasonable. To be fair. I try to talk to people. [...] Well, you know what? I can do crazy. I really can. And it looks like I'm going to have to."
To all the people complaining about NPCs not trusting a LS Sith, have you *seen* the average Sith and how they treat enemies? And usually allies, for that matter? It's justified
Also playing the Jedi side. How many sith seem reedemable or take that chance. As much of a dick move it was not to trust our LS SIth I understand after all the lightside playthroughs dealing with sith.
@@commandermerc58 The rare Jedi that's willing to speak with Sith and the rare Sith that's willing to walk in the light actually boggles the minds of some at times. The majority of Sith are... well Sith. The majority of Jedi are often unwilling to trust Sith at all, as they often should be. Thanks for your input here because I don't even blame anyone for distrusting Sith.
Trust and openness for discussion are different. Most who fight the LS sith don't give you a chance to speak or prove yourself and jump right to trying to kill you. You don't need to trust someone to at least give them a chance to speak.
I love how many different options the Sith Warrior storyline has. I enjoyed my light side sith warrior so much, especially when dealing with Jedi, I love leaving them so suprised that a Sith didn't kill them when he had the chance.
I think the best part of playing a Sith vs a Jedi is that I can make these flip choices and justify it by the character's traits but my Jedi I can't justify how harsh the actions are. It feels like the Sith ones are "Spare a few innocents here and there" and the Jedi ones are "Kill them because they annoy you and for no other reason" or "Commit a war crime"
It depends how you play it tbh. My Jedi Knight began as a generally well intentioned guy with the prime belief of doing what is best for the Republic no matter the cost. Sure, killing a few unarmed prisoners IS a war crime but it denies the enemy ever being given their soldiers back - it's not just being evil for evil's sake. (You can of course make the argument that keeping prisoners of war can be advantageous, but the empire, of all governments, probably isn't making POW deals for low level troops) Over time the choices became more severe because that's how the dark side corrupts. I agree that playing an empire character light side leads to a more interesting story than playing a republic character dark side, but if you're RPing a character with the right traits either can be justified and lead to a cohesive story (in much the same way that if your character has opposing traits to your choices it will lead to a dissonant story)
@@darkabysskiller What hit me was how many of the kinder choices are coded dark side on the JK playthru. Even on Sith Inquisitor, releasing Mother is dark side while leaving her imprisoned by the Rakata is light, wtf!?
@@nessanderson6460 It's been a loooong while since I played the inquis story so please do correct me if I'm wrong somewhere, but from my vague rememberings I think the general idea is that leaving the mother machine imprisoned essentially neuters its power, wheras releasing her - while potentially seeming kind or light side - is actually bad. I too remember being pretty confused by the dark/light allocation in that choice until I took some time out to think it over. The reasoning behind that being the dark side choice comes partially from both sides of the Rakata v Mother Machine being unreliable narrators. If MM is correct then it is an artificial intelligence with extreme power and an empathetic caring maternal instinct. IF this is the case then it would (probably - see below) be good/kind/light side to release it. However if the Rakata are right then it does NOT have that ability for empathy, and is instead acting and pretending to get its release. The player isn't given enough information to find the truth in the matter - but either way releasing such an AI could be seriously seriously bad for the planet and even the galaxy. If the Rakata are correct then it's pretty obviously a dark side choice. An AI manipulating its way into freedom to create force-sensitive life. God knows what kind of control it could exert on that life or what its motives would be. Consider: In the scenario that the MM is correct and it is an AI with true empathy and a maternal instinct. That AI, by the telling of events, became furious upon the imprisonment and abuse of its children. An AI with the power to take over belsavis and create force sensitive beings AND the potential fury of a mother in one package. Aside from the telling of the story in the game, we do not know the MM well enough to know that its intent is genuine. All we know is that it is very powerful and, one way or the other, capable of rage and deception. Unleashing that is at best irresponsible and at worst malevolent. The other way I look at it is that the Rakata are (or were) ruthless. It stands to reason that their AI probably isn't a great "person" either, as it were. Also, it is definitely gonna kill the Rakata. IMO not a great loss because the Rakata are dicks but it is still genocide which is morally not the best thing in the world.
For my Sith Warrior it was the opposite. A prodigy too lazy to kill his enemies that turned him into a beacon of the light side. He met a darker reflection of himself. He attempted to commune with it, but in the end he was just too pure to become dark.
LMAO I like how you worded it as he's "too lazy". His reflection must be like "Bruh you have to kill someone, you're literally the bad guy!" -_- And he's like "Eh, killing takes effort and it's Monday" :|
@@Commander_Shepard. No that's pretty much his way of thinking. He just wants to go back to training or watching holo-vids. Killing people feels just bothersome. However if killing means ending something quicker he'll just do that.
My warrior was light side from the start... but only because he was cocky. No need to kill your defeated enemies if you'll just beat them again next time. No need to lie if no knowledge can make them strong enough to defeat you. No need to cheat, because you will win anyway. No need to steal, you can earn or win all the prizes. No need to usurp power when your strength and skill will give you all the power you need.
Ngl, that was why i went LS Sith Jugg and it works so well Especially when other characters admit that they are sending you into suicidal conditions and that no one normal could even attempt these plans you're just like "Whatever" Honestly LS Jugg might be my fav star wars story since kotor 1/2
I play Neutral Sith Warrior, I just hate those Lightside choices that go Me: Let's try talking first Jedi/Republic: No you're evil Me: Why J/R: Because you're violent, now die *Proceed to curb stomp of the J/R* If they survive it goes J/R: Oh no I'm going to die Me: I still want to talk J/R: Wow I didn't know that Sith aren't 100% pure evil I like this Republic/Lightside/Jedi vs. Empire/Darkside/Sith thing but at the same these NPCs are dumber than strawmen.
That is just frustrating - what's the point if the other side forces you to kill them in self defense anyway when you clearly want to just talk things out
That kind of storytelling carries over from the source material, unfortunately. The force will forever remain blanketed by a black & white mentality, and anyone who seeks an in between solution is labeled some form of heretic.
@@811brian I mean I doubt they would be labeled as a heretic probably one of the reasons why the Jedi distrust sith so much is because probably most if not all of the sith they have encountered have probably wanted to kill them so I think it's a safe bet to say they would think your character was the same as the others
What I hate is the wild inconsistency. In the Jedi line you come across redeemed Sith and even save some yourself with Jedi saying "oh yeah, if we can convert them to our side great! LETS DO THIS WITH THE EMPEROR!" with the promise of a Sith Admiral turncoat leading us into a trap while failing to convert the emperor, fall to the darkside and then save them afterwards from possession. And then we have the Sith Warrior coming across only bigoted Jedi/Republic soldiers wanting to cut him down. Like the only constant is stupid NPCs making dumb mistakes and then we fix it one way or another by having a superior intellect compared to a bar stool, which means in this era we're OP for it.
Personally I dont limit myself to light or dark and just pick choices my character would make. He ended up mostly light but theres light choices that would make you a traitor, and some dark choices which are the obvious choice.
The NPCs reactions to your Lightside choices are really stupid, like they are really surprised that they aren't dealing with literal demons but people.
@@somerandomnesspoo8467 To be fair, they are expecting the sith to be completely dark side, which is usually murder, torture, betray, repeat. I wouldn't blame them for thinking that they are going up against demons.
I love how this is an option but man the reflection gives *terrible* arguments for the lightside. I mean you’re speaking to guy who’s already evil and your selling points are: “peace” and “clarity”. Horrible salesman smh
yeah, it's simply like going to the Ku Klux Klan member and telling him, that he should stop hating Black people as they have cool culture and he will be less hateful that way. I mean they do have cool culture, in fact multiple cool cultures, but KKK was about racism. They hated Black people and their cultures. you can't make racist stop being racist by telling him not being racist its less racist. Same you can't expect Sith who embraces Dark Side to stop after 2 minutes of arguments like "Light Side is cooler as your pov sucks and you lack peace"
It’s because Jedi don’t reflect actual goodness. They’re more like the forces of neutrality than the forces of good. Key word: than. They still do good, but I wouldn’t give them too much credit.
The real argument being made here isn't clarity and peace. It's that at this moment your Darth Master Bara is tripping over himself in paranoia over a Padawan of the light side. If you want to become stronger, truly stronger, join the side he fears most.
If you're already Light, it argues for you to join the Dark. The reflection is the embodiment of whichever alignment you aren't, so I guess it makes sense that its arguments are kinda basic.
@@facundomontivero2299 Chill, will ya? Of course one good apple in a rotten basket won't stop the entire harvest from being spoiled. But the Jedi are supposed to be reasonable and to only resort to violence as a last resort. Yet they are frequently being the aggressors, even while my Sith doing everything he can to avoid unnecessary death. The Jedi Code dictates that there is no passion, there is peace, but instead many of their Knights indulge in their hatred and thirst for retribution. And then they have the guts to pretend they still stand on the moral high ground, after their actions result in violence? Nah man, I enjoy rubbing it in their faces when I'm being a better Jedi then they are.
@@facundomontivero2299 No shit Sherlock. Being light sideded kinda automatically makes you a bad Sith. But all jokes and games aside, are you seriously equating the way people play a VIDEO GAME to the countless reasons why the real world is fucked? If so, then your spending way to much time on the internet.
That's the thing that makes me enjoy the idea of SWTOR, even if you embrace the lightside as a Sith, you still believe in the philosophy and the Empire, you simply embrace a different path to break your chains and give you power than just becoming a being fueled by hatred and greed.
@@dekaron12 Siths embrace everything that can grant them power, every emotion is a well of power to be drawn from. Most pull from darker emotions like anger and hate because they are powerful but the drawback is that they're highly destructive, to everyone and themselves. Meanwhile, some are less aggressive and use their heads instead of focusing on their passion and desires. They are more focused, yes they can still connect to those darker emotions, but mostly do so in combat when power is required, outside of it, they make use of more positive reinforcements and emotions, which grant power all the same, but unlike the jedis, they draw from them as much as they wish, jedis don't do that. I remember a story in the old Expanded Universe about a Sith who actually never killed a person and was instead just a very successful businenessman, yet followed the philosophy to the letter. it's not about killing everyone you know.
@@dekaron12 Think on it like this. Theoretically a jedi can be in touch with the dark side, someone who can lean on the edges, just short from slipping and falling, and such jedi do exist, but what happens to many is that they fall and embrace it fully. What stops the same from happening on the other side? If a jedi can do horrible acts what stops a sith from acting honourably? If a dark master can rise undetected and unchallenged for years among jedi what stops a light master among the sith? If a good person can do bad, what stops a bad person from doing good?
It’ll be a shame to ruin your good looks Reflection: If you embrace the dark side, you are dooming your own good looks. Think about it, name one dark side user that looks good in their latter years
Dooku had only like .. hm 15? years as a darksider vs. 50+ years as a Jedi. Even Palpatine did look normal after decades of dark force use. so i'm not sure the Count counts for this argument
I love how this can be summed up with, ‘You there, become one with the Light Side.’ ‘Why?’ ‘Because it’s better for you.’ ‘Ya’ sure?’ ‘Yes.’ ‘Okay, I’ll convert.’
@@nessanderson6460 "The jedi are an extremist religious cult" Sith: Betray one another for the last slice of pizza, their philosophy teaches deception, murder, and hubris. They revel in everything wrong with the world, they are also religious extremists but their ideology is to better themselves by betraying the world, rather than helping the world by bettering themselves. "but they are both religious so like there's no difference between them except the sith are better cause they're comically written bad guys and that somehow translates to complex gray moral compasses while the Jedi are comically good but like they're just hiding something I KNOW it!"
@@GarrulousHerald Both the Jedi and the Sith are hideously, irredeemably evil in my eyes. The Sith as a whole are a gang of conniving, murderous lunatics, and the Jedi are a sanctimonious cult of holier-than-thou charlatans who steal babies from their parents at what essentially amounts to gunpoint, raise them to be entirely dependent on the order even though they could TECHNICALLY leave at any time, and indoctrinate them with callous dogma designed to turn them into unfeeling machines who don't care that they'll be effectively enslaved to a cult until the day they die. In the period in time SWTOR takes place, I would rather die than live with the Force. The Sith are evil, sure, but the Jedi are a fate worse than death. The death of both orders was a mercy on the galaxy when it finally came in Revenge of the Sith and Return of the Jedi. Now Luke's order on the other hand, I'd join that in a heartbeat. Luke actually allowed his Jedi to be people, encouraged free thought, and regularly recruited adults. He never forced anyone to become a Jedi, and didn't demand that his Jedi cut off all attachments. Furthermore, even if you left the order, you weren't automatically persona non grata. Luke's New Jedi Order were the Jedi as they should've been. Grandmaster Luke Skywalker was one of the best things ever to happen to the galaxy.
Light side Sith Warrior is easily my favorite story to come out of swtor Something about that expectation gap never gets old, and I love the kind strength they project everywhere they go
The way I played my sith, I had him as a champion of the darkside, but one with respect for those around him. Vette asks if I can take the shock collar off? Sure, not my idea to put it there, never even used it! Republic troopers who could potentially be used to fight a sith I'm after? It's a pleasure to make their acquaintance. But if my mission is to kill someone, then they DIE. That is, until I hit Tattooine. In trying to retrace the Jedi Padawan's path, he finds himself going on a path of spiritual clarity. He doesn't kill the sand demon, nor the sand person who presents the parchment, instead bowing in respect of the tribal warrior. During the reflection, he came to understand that the light was stronger, but knew he was still too far gone in that moment to be saved. When he confronted the Jedi Master, he let him find peace before striking him down. The next instances of choosing the light came when he refused to let the lady of house alde go to the duke, then in helping General Organa and her collapsing front, inspiring her men along the way. But in the end, he still carried out his mission and killed the family of the Jedi Padawan, then the duke for having ratted on him. (Though, in my personal head cannon, he then has the near lifeless bodies of the Wilsam family saved somehow, brought back, and given a place to say in a much nicer area, where they could live in peace. Additionally, I have my own head cannon about Jaesa as well, chosing to teach her BOTH sides of the force). Further instances of the light would come and go, but it wouldn't be until coming out of carbonite that my sith warrior would embrace a new understanding of the force and achieve true balance in the force. Edit: I wonder what Master Timms is up to these days.
I think it's neat how there are different interpretations of the light side warrior. I say mine as a man who was raised to believe wholeheartedly in the glory of the Empire and in the honour of old Sith families. Though he did already have some criticisms of the Empire, such as the practice of slavery (he thought that serves to the Empire should be a passion, and an honour given to the strongest; slaves broke this model). Having been accelerated through sith training, he never really got exposed to a more "orthodox" Sith philosophy. When he got stuck as Darth Baras' apprentice (someone who was his opposite in many ways and quickly grew to hate him), he saw the Sith for what they truly were and how little his values meant to the Empire. Eventually he started toying with the lightside of the force, and saw the values of temperance and self sacrifice as not only a way to make his own power more whole, but to build the vision of the Empire he once imagined and set out to essentially be a Sith Martin Luther, trying to reform the Sith philosophy entirely. Though his time as Baras's apprentice taught him well, and he was able to hide his intentions to all but those closes to him. By the time he met Jaesa, he was a lightside force user in earnest, though did his best to maintain a reputation of being as brutal a darkside user as any other Sith Lord.
I was planning on playing as Manipulative person who will use what ever he can to get what he wants. If sparing someone gets him something he wants he'll use it. If not then he'll kill them. So if your incompetent then you're probably going to die.
That store line is really cool to follow up, the light side sometimes is way more cooler, tho i have nothing to say against the powers of the dark side
So the argument is that embracing the dark you will always get betrayed? Well if I recall, the consular story is nothing but betrayals. So being paranoid about betrayals is a good thing because at least you're not shocked when it happens like the consular's reactions most the time.
Vette: “so… if we’re good guys now does that mean I can wear something that actually covers my mid riff? And my legs?” Sith Warrior: “but your bare mid riff and legs are half the reason I bother waking up in the morning.”
I did this a few days ago. I wore armor similar to Darth Vader but after having a chatter with my light reflection I joined the light, cast aside the armor and now wear an outfit that would be described as a grey jedi style outfit.
Thank you for this. I was playing a Light side Sith when I came to this and had never seen this side of it before. I really enjoyed the Light side as a Sith, because when you encountered the Jedi, they usually went bonkers over it. Usually one of the 2 would show their true colors and attack me. LOL so much for the goody goody Jedi!
"Yaknow the dark side is bad." "Huh, I never thought of it that way..." "Turn away from the dark side, join the light!" "You're right! Man have I been blind!"
I wish there was something like this for the Jedi Knight. I turned my Jedi Sentinel dark-side in the Jedi Knight story after Chapter 2, I saw it fitting due to Vitiate's influence having her as his pawn for a significant amount of time and also due to Scourge's influence along their travels.
It's like in Fallout New Vegas when Caeser gives me a second chance after I've brutally screwed his expansion into wider Vegas's wasteland, saved the Burned Man while foiling the Whitelegs, and hunt his men /for sport/.
Dark side always best for imps, especially inquisitor. Someone speaks *ZAP* someone disagrees with you *ZAP* someone just stands there all existingy *ZAP ZAP ZAPPITY*
WHOA!! I have no idea that line or those options were there. I've been playin it since release and never thought I had that choice. THAT'S AWSOME! I'm going to have to do it again one day.
Going in the opposite path than usual is fun. My knight was so ruthless when they give you the title of master it’s very different (not spoiling anything)
Hey my Sith Inquisitor turned to the light sort of. She only killed as is necessary. Unfortunately the hypocrisy of the Jedi keeps forcing me to kill the Jedi who only claim to follow the light while she walks the true path 🤦♀️ but it’s possible.
Story is not determined by your choices only but your aligments. If you have dark aligment then story will end in darkside, if you are neutral will end in neutral blah blah
So what I'm learning from these comments is I'm more interested in being evil than an interesting story. As with my inquisitor I have so far picked every Dark side option possible.
Light Side SIth Warrior is an amazing story change. Dark Side Jedi Guardian is a travesty in hilarity. You do the most EVIL shit, and everyone is like, yes, FOR THE LIGHT!
I just wish that somehow they could make a console port of it. I know it wouldn't be easy since it wasn't designed with consoles in mind but I'd still love to see it.
I can never correctly guess the tone on a lot of these dialogue choices so I end up choosing the opposite of what I intended. So I slapped a Revanite mask on my Sith Warrior and embraced the chaos. In my head he's tried to emulate the path of Revan as accurately as possible. Unfortunately I've played SWtoR on every moral spectrum possible. So my memory is.... mixed. As a result the constant back and forth from light side to dark side has driven the character completely insane. As a result talking to people presents a roulette wheel of possibilities. "Fuuuuck. Ok how do the scriptures say to get bread? Should I just ask? No no I need to demand it! NO! That's crazy!! I don't have the amount of tuna needed to drive home the threat. I got it! Send the assassin droid to kidnap his family and demand the bread as ransom! No! YES! NO!!! YES!!!" "Sir can I help you?" "KILL! KILL!!..... WITH KINDNESS!!" "Ohh like that sayi-" *reaches for lightsaber engraved with the name Kindness (yes it's the red one)* "Ohhh..."
You realize how cliché that is right? "Realistic" he says, it would be realistic if you killed Vette after she served her purposes. Someone who's pure evil doesn't go good just so he can tap that.
I play all my characters different and the force users are typically the extremes. Fully dark Sith Warrior & Jedi Knight, but then fully light Sith Inquisitor and Jedi Counselor. But after reading these comments its giving me the itch to go back and play through as a light sith warrior
My favorite part of playing Sith Warrior is that every NPC will assume you're a psychotic brute while you can snark and scheme your way through every mission.
Sith who follows light side are not sith,like papa Palpatine would have said. P.S. The Dark Side of the Force is a pathway to many abilities, some considered to be unnatural.
There was absolutely no reason to include this within the game, but BioWare did anyway offering a key RPG choice that based on your SW's alignment and interactions Jaesa within an MMO that otherwise shouldn't exist and I love that it does!
This is one of the most interesting path you can take in the game and really sheds a light on the Sith Philosophy and its flaws because if you break it down the Sith Code is not inherently evil more about embracing your power and emotions for personal liberation what made the Sith evil and unstable was their fanatical practice of the Darkside because despite pledging yourself the to ways of the light your still a Sith. The problem with the Sith was believing that the dark side was stronger then the light and that it would be the path they seek when its really just an inherently mentally and physically corrupting force that isn't meant to be studied exclusively its faster which is the flaw that ultimately doomed the Sith ideology. Its not that the dark side doesn't have a place in the force but its more a realm to study and use in moderation as a tool think the old Legends New Jedi Order who were significantly more lax on its masters and their students studying the dark side of the force.
This mission and the combat style changes were actually the inspiration for my current (mostly) light side jedi knight playthrough. I created a SW, played through to this mission then deleted my SW to create a JK that looks the same and still uses the SW combat styles (took a different name tho cause i felt it was fitting to help symbolise the change, like the inverse of Anakin becoming Darth Vader) and switched my saber color crystals to blue and green but with a dark core to represent that my character isn't exactly a true light sider (I forget the exact name of the crystals) My headcanon is that this mission showed my SW that the dark side of the force doesn't hold all the power and that the light side still has its merits which led to him understanding that the empire is fucked if the sith keep running things the way they are (and by extension the galaxy is fucked if the empire/sith fully take over) resulting in him defecting to the republic cause they may be "holier than thou" and hypocritical at times but they're still less likely to do things that directly hinder their goal of winning the war (for example a sith killing loyal and competent imperials for failing when it wasnt actually their fault, they just got bamboozled by Jedi Swagmaster Bluntius Smokius 69)
Finally someone says it. Dark side is about bending the Force to your will. Through emotions, sorcery, whatever works. That's the difference between the sides, not morality.
My LS Sith Warrior is a Sith Pureblood. It's make me wonder, is that even possible? Just seems weird. But it seems to fit, so I'm rolling with it. It's what's on the inside that counts, right? Still... I'm conflicted. It feels wrong. Is he LS just because he doesn't kill for the sake of it? Sometimes I feel like turning back but then I think about Vette. So maybe it's love that guides him. I/he. Whatever lol. But that's a good explanation maybe for why he resists the DS. 🤔
Or think of it like this, Honor is what leads my Sith Juggernaut closer to the light. On Korriban, I chose to not strike down Trammell because he had given me my start, so why would I betray him for a Sith Lord who had sent me to die? I denied killing Lord Grathems son, because why would I strike down an untrained boy, there is no honor in it. I made Baras spy tell his men the truth before we fought, because his men deserved the truth for their honorable deaths. He accepted Rathari as an asset, because Ratahri wanted to honor your superiority with service. Honor is what makes my warrior closer to the light, still murked Baras though.
My sith boi is sith pureblood as well but he took the revenant questline very seriously when one of the sith lords ghost dudes turned out to be actually LS(at least thats what i got out of it) . i imagined that spending all that time trying to fit in with revenants..he actually started seeing possibility of using the light side...at 1st just to see what happens (hes curious ) and later on, as he learned its ways and seeing how kindness , patience and understanding gives his followers respect and admiration towards him (at least the 1st 3 companions ) - embracing it . Im on story ark 3 so havent finished yet :)
Light Reflection: "The Dark is constantly in fear of the Light. Don't you think there's a reason for that? The Dark can grant you temporary power. But the Light will not only grant you permanent power, but also everlasting peace. It's entirely advantageous." Dark Reflection: "Join the Dark Side. All the cool kids are doing it!"
The funny thing is when I first started playing sith warrior I was going to try and be neutral do some bad things do some good things but I ended up just going light side for the most part because most of the dark side actions gave me massive guilt lol
gotta replay Swtor again lol, I dont think ive finished all class stories in this new account i made a while ago so. Guess im going back into the dive lmao.
