A few things here: 1. The XFL merged with the USFL at the beginning of the year to form the UFL. Still, the BattleHawks are dominating attendance in the league. 2. If the NFL were to return to St. Louis, it CANNOT be another relocated team. It's expansion or bust.
In principle, I agree with you, but the NFL ain't trying to expand anytime soon. Eventually when they do in 12-15 years, St. Louis and San Antonio have to be the Top 2.
The place was half-empty and full of visiting fans both for the Rams and Cardinals when they weren’t winning 10+ games. People here don’t give a shit, it’s a baseball town
Don’t blame the fans. Don’t blame the city. The dome was the toughest place to play in the league when the team was good. Deafening crowd noise. During the last several years after the team had one mission and that was to get to LA as fast as possible and the NFL let it happen. Too bad the St. Louis lawyers settled for $800 million when it was a Billion dollar deal. This case should have played out and it would have been fantastic watching the owner lying under oath. This was a scam from the time he took majority ownership. I won’t say his name but he’s a weasel and he knows it. NFL belongs in St. Louis.
Been an NFL fan for over 40 years and iv never heard anyone refer to the STL dome as one of the toughest places to play. No one. And I live in Missouri!
@@firebird200I would disagree that everyone here wants a third NFL team. Most of my family, lots of my friends and me absolutely don’t want those greedy bastards back. And while the Dome isn’t in the top half of the league of football stadiums, it’s not a dump. That was just an excuse for Stan to leave. He could have easily built another stadium and if you forgot, the City offered to put $500m of taxpayer dollars for a new stadium! So no it wasn’t because of a stadium why he left. It was because he wanted to enjoy his team in nice weather and inflate his worth moving the team back to the second largest market in the US. AKA Greed!
@@Homedepotorange Not necessarily, you do realize about half the teams in the UFL are located in markets that have NFL teams right? The UFL is also considered minor league, which is justifiable considering attendance numbers especially outside of St. Louis and player quality. A more proper comparison would like when the NHL Jets(formerly Atlanta Thrashers) moved to Winnipeg despite them having an AHL team(Manitoba Moose) or MLS giving out numerous expansion franchises to cities that already had USL teams(like St. Louis for example). Plus, playing devils advocate, the UFL has no guarantee of staying around considering the fact that two previous versions of the XFL have folded, plus the merger they had to do with the USFL because of financial reasons. I do agree with your sentiment of having the Battlehawks here over the NFL but your argument isn’t that strong in my opinion. TLDR: Comparing apples to oranges, NFL is major league(top flight) while UFL is minor league
Bill Bidwell moved the Cardinals because he thought Busch Stadium was too small (51,000). He need not have worried, because he never tried to build a competitive team anyway.
STL deserves an NFL team. Mainly due to their market size But STL needs to stop trying to lure in other teams and needs a team birthed in the city and tied to its identity. The rams shouldn’t have left STL bc it never should’ve left La to begin with
Honestly the best bet for that is the Battlehawks. The UFL is moving to sell the teams to owners. If the battlehawks get a good owner they could probably merge into the NFL if the UFL fails in a few years.
You wrote, "stop stealing teams from other cities," but what if other cities that don't have teams are growing at faster rates and exceed the population of some cities with teams? For example, the Phoenix metropolitan area is now one of the top 10 or 15 metropolitan areas by population in the USA. However, it was not always a big urban area. How could the Phoenix area gain its major teams, other than by expansion, if some other teams did not relocate?
St Louis politicians and other Powers That Be after Rams relocated, stated they are done pursuing the NFL in their market. That means, just like what happened in 1987 and 2015, St. Louis City & County and even Metro East are unwilling to spend over 2 billion to build new stadium and entertainment district. I agree with them.
Yeah it blows my mind that these cities still want to play ball with these leagues that will ditch them the first chance they get. St. Louis has a historic baseball team that isn’t going anywhere, if I was on the city council I’d say that’s good enough for a pro attraction. If they need football they can root for Mizzou
@@adanalyst6925 I agree. Ive been to Cardinals baseball game, and was blown away by the amount of people on a weekday night, Wednesday, attending or just hanging around the stadium. BTW, Im from Miami (Marlins 😒😒).
Living in Carbondale, IL, I would be very happy if the NFL came back to St. Louis. But it should be an expansion team as others have said. They could build a nice, functional outdoor-style stadium as shown in the renderings, and they could STILL use Edward Jones for a practice facility and/or if there's weather like they had for the Chiefs/Dolphins playoff game in KC earlier this year. As you said, though, this might not happen until the 2030s.
I watched their game this passed weekend and was amazed at the crowd. It puts the other UFL franchises to shame. St. Louis is hungry for football. They deserve an NFL franchise and a new stadium.
@@mikek784 Exactly. It doesn't matter where they start or move to. I feel like the Raiders will always be more of an LA team than the Rams or Chargers anyway.
Exactly....the NFL has already turned the St. Louis metro region into a Chiefs fan base now, and the people fell for it. And they did it without the squabble over the construction of a new stadium, lol
For the football St. Louis Cardinals the city leaders were bad and didn’t do what they should have done, and on top of that the owner was pretty horrible too. And for the St. Louis Rams, Stan Kroenke was just all around a bad owner that didn’t care about the market, or fans and team. And just wanted the team to move to LA so he could have all the bucks. The league wanted a team there too super bad so they let it happen, cause it was easy. A owner that is building his own stadium and paying for all the other expenses, the league said hell yeah! But the league actually wanted a team in St. Louis too, they tried to get the Raiders owner to move there, but he said he wanted the better market in Las Vegas. So I think St. Louis has had a lot of bad luck, and the NFL could return one day. But the lawsuit And legal matters hurt that possibility. But I do feel the NFL views St. Louis as a market where they can make money, and that reason could be the reason they return back if that day ever returns.
This video is a little all over the place. Of course St. Louis wouldn't get the Rams name back. The Rams have played 57 seasons in Los Angeles against 20 in St. Louis. The current Rams' uniform is an updated version of the style of uniform they wore in the 90s. It's not a rebrand, just a return to the style the team had for 60+ years.
IMO the league will never expand past 32 teams. They don’t need to. Expansion typically happens when the league needs a cash infusion or wants to increase TV revenue. Teams are making more money than ever and we all watch the NFL no matter where in the country. The only way they get a team is relocation. Possibly a smaller market whose lease expires and a new stadium doesn’t get a publicly funded replacement
It would be wild if they got a expansion. I expect the UFL to gain a lot in popularity over 5 years. The teams need franchise owners to really market them. The dome just needs a solid renovation. Nothing crazy
@@Mistertwist. Not always. Plenty of smaller leagues are doing just fine. The issue with UFL is a lot of them are trying to play out of huge expensive football stadiums instead of growing into them
@@MilesTailsProwe I just meant if you want to compete with the NFL, you have to do what the original USFL did. Big money. Big players. They were very close to succeeding.
I was at the UFL Championship last week, might have been 7000 fans there and my ticket was $4. It was an embarrassment and the product sucks. It’s finished
Adding one team for expansion with the NFL with 32 teams would not make sense. For scheduling, expansion needs to be at least two team, and arguably four which probably would be too many for people.
It's almost like you just think outloud with little to no research. There's way too much mistrust between the city and the NFL and no way will the NFL pony up any $$ to help build them a new stadium. I can't see StL putting the money out there upfront to build a stadium because they got suckered once before and stupidly put that clause in the original lease giving the Rams plenty of outs to leave town. Plus, they sued the league to expose their books which is what the NFL does NOT want in a partner. This isn't a knock on StL fans ... they are some of the best but after getting jilted twice prior, are they all going to be forking over PSL money on top of ticket costs and vote in a tax increase to pay the costs and upkeep on a stadium going forward? And Toronto won't be getting an NFL team as long as there's the CFL up there.
Who would want to go through this stuff again? We haven’t even figured out what to do with the money from the settlement from the last football team’s fiasco.
I don't think the Rams will relocate back to St. Louis. I also don't think the Chargers will go there. If any existing NFL team does go there, my guess is that it would be the Commanders. Just a hunch. If the NFL were to expand again, Montreal, Toronto, and San Diego may be good choices.
Rams are never moving out of LA again and giving up that market. Things have changed too much with TV and advertising. Chargers could move but I would guess it would be back to San Diego before any place other than that.
More people are watching the UFL than you would think I watched more this year but the talent isn't as thin which has made for better football but the Battlehawks has leaped frog everyone else but I think attendance is up and tv viewership in the UFL
I haven't watched much of the UFL this season because they removed the things I found interesting one of which was the XFL style kickoff and Daryl Johnson changed it to a modified version of the NFL kickoff because in his opinion the NFL didn't really like the XFL style kickoff but it turns out that the NFL owners have decided to use a version of the XFL kickoff for the upcoming season of the NFL
The St Louis Battlehawks remind me of the Baltimore Stallions in the CFL in 94-95. The Stallions were drawing near 40,000 in old Memorial Stadium feeding off the hate of the NFL in Baltimore over the Colts move. Right after the Stallions won the Grey Cup the Browns announced their move to Baltimore. This could wind up being a similar situation.
Where is the new stadium? NFL is not even going to consider St. Louis until the City/State builds them a $1 Billion new Stadium. Also, $4 Billion for expansion fee. NFL is capped in the USA for new markets. The harsh reality is they do not have much room to grow franchise wise which is why the NFL owners float with stupid ideas like London and Germany for new teams.
I will NEVER support the NFL again. I have, St. Louis, has lost two teams in my life. When the Rams left the NFL pissed all over my city. So the NFL is dead to me. The End.
Why does nobody talk about absorption or merger. A big portion of the NFL was brought in this way. The teams also usually have a better time in there early years in the league. The UFL wants to sell the teams to local owners, a good St. Louis/MO owner being absorbed into the NFL would be much better then one of goodells buddies or random team moving there
I can think of 790 million reasons why the NFL will never come back to St. Louis. Unfortunately the local powers that be burned that bridge with the NFL.
The NFL illegally screwed over a city and got called on it. STL always supported the Rams but kronke major leagued the city to tank the team to move them.
The NFL didn't "do anything illegal". What "law" did they break? And St. Louis got exactly what they had coming to them. St. Louis stole the Rams from LA. I didn't hear you crying about it then! Now that wrong has been made right. Face it, if St. Louis was a good enough city for an NFL team, you wouldn't have had 2 NFL teams skip town!
Actually fraud is a crime. The NFL didn't give that much money away because it was the nice thing to do. 3 NFL owners were going to jail in a week for contempt of court. I get why you don't know the facts, the NFL threatened ESPN and other media partners to not cover the story. I'm not trying to shame you for your ignorance, just be better next time. Or better yet, your mouth shut it.
They should just go ahead and build this stadium just cause. The location of the venue looks great when it comes to the many events they hold in St. Louis. If the XFL generating enough revenue to make this much of an impact then they should proceed. "If you build it they will come."
Wow I never thought St. Louis would ever have an nfl team again however after watching this idk you’re absolutely right about Toronto & London too a Toronto nfl team would be awesome London does not logistically make sense at all that St. Louis dome is a horrible stadium though they would definitely need to build a new stadium though & there were plans to build one national car rental field
The problem is St. Louis has a stagnant population and declining corporate support. Every day that the market doesn't get an NFL or NBA or whatever team makes it more unlikely they ever get one. If the NFL expanded today, then yeah STL would probably be at the top of their list for the USA. But they won't expand today, tomorrow, or probably not for the next decade. By that point, places like Portland Oregon or Salt Lake City might be more attractive. Or San Antonio/Austin have grown so much that even the Cowboys can't prevent the league from placing a team there (notice how Jerruh didn't stop the Texans from going to Houston).
St. Louis city which is 10% of the metro are has declining pop by 2%, but big deal. There is still 3 mil people in the metro. But, we have better things to spend 4 billion dollars on so we dont need the NFL. We have MLB, NHL, and MLS and can just root for Chiefs....
Jerry jones will never allow another team in Texas so enough with that idea. He would go so far as to sue the league to prevent it. He also has at least a dozen owners that will vote any way he asks. So no they are not putting another team in Texas.
@@jeffwebb2966 I live in St. Louis, you don't need to tell me the stats. No city needs the NFL or any sports league, but those 3 leagues are kinda irrelevant nationally.
@@jeffwebb2966i keep seeing STL folks looping in places like Wentzville into their metro population. That’s a cool 45 min drive to STL. That’s like KC including Lawrence in its metro. It’s not part of it
The window for St. Louis to get an expansion team ended when they settled out of court. They should’ve negotiated in mediation that they would get an expansion team but instead the city of St. Louis government officials decided that they wanted more money than actually wanting an expansion team like the actual people of St. Louis wanted. Politics didn’t have the city of St. Louis’s best interest as the majority of the citizens wanted an expansion team not more money that they’re never going to see.
The Dome at America's Center is completely disgusting inside and out. I wasn't even impressed when it opened. It's just so bland. A library looks better and has more excitement to offer.
Baseball town? Dude STL is a sports town. Watch a STL City game, the crowd doesn’t sit for the entirety of the match. This town is also rabid for Hockey. They sold out the enterprise center and Busch stadium for a WATCH PARTY for the SCF.
Interesting video DG, but I don't think anyone in St. Louis has any interest in ever hosting an NFL team again. Not after the NFL & Kronke stabbed them right in the back, after years of making promises to them. The damage they did will last at least a generation, if not longer. The Rams didn't do well in St. Louis primarily because Kronke was intentionally tanking the team's worth -- he was always planning to move the team back to LA, as soon as he got control of the team, & make a gazillion dollars, a fact which is beyond dispute with him having done exactly so. But if he had made any kind of effort to invest in the team and/or stadium, the fans would have come right back & rocked the house like they did during the GSOT years. Yes, the Battlehawks proved the NFL & Kronke wrong about St. Louis' ability to support a football team. But that doesn't mean St. Louis would *ever* want them back. ...so, for now: KaKaaawww is the Laww!!
I'm from St. Louis, go to battlehawks games and live across the street from the Dome. I want NFL and so do a lot of other people. Just not the owners so much. Let the city own the team is the dream scenario. Profits to making St. Louis better.
That stadium is a shit box, we have no ownership prospects, and the general population doesn’t really care if we get a team back or not. Now if the NFL was going to give us a team with no expansion fee, and a 40 year no movement guarantee to make right that screw job they pulled off, perhaps we can talk about it. But as of right now, they can keep their teams.
One thing you can bet is if anyone ever brings an NFL team to St. Louis they are on their own for funding a facility. It will be a cold day in Hell before voters and leaders agree to fund a new stadium.
This will sound crazy. Do you think the Bears would consider moving to St Louis or use it as leverage if they cannot get state funding From Illinois for a stadium in either Chicago or Arlington Heights? The Cardinals ditched Chicago for St. Louis in the early sixties.
The Edward Jones Dome is just not an NFL caliber stadium anymore and the NFL won't expand in to St. Louis without a new stadium deal. No billionaire owner or investment group would seriously consider STL without a new stadium. One the flip side, Saint Louis has been burned twice by NFL franchises, to support a taxpayer funded stadium would be the end of your political career and the residents of Saint Louis will NEVER support such a deal. Realistically, it just isn't in the cards. I'm not saying St. Louis will never get an NFL team again, because it could happen, but I don't think it will happen any time in the next few decades and certainly not without government intervention (i.e. barring taxes being used on sports stadiums)
St. Louis was never just a baseball town. Frankly, it’s a lazy take. The Rams only left because Kroenke knew he could make more money in LA. If the NFL is going to use STL to leverage new stadiums in other markets they can go fly a kite. Besides, I’m sure the NFL is still salty about the $800M relocation settlement STL won.
It's not going to happen, St. Louis is a baseball, hockey city. St. Louis all they had was existing NFL teams The Cardinals 1960-1987. The Rams 1995-2015.
As a former Rams season ticket holder, from the first games at Busch Stadium, the NFL can go fuck themselves. I have not watch an NFL game since the Rams left for LA.
Hot take: Move the Chargers to St. Louis. Most everyone in Los Angeles likes the Rams as their favorite team anyway, and the Chargers will have a larger following in St. Louis. Not only that, but moving them to St. Louis will also create a Missouri rivalry with the Kansas City Chiefs since they're both in the AFC West.
@1999bill1999 West coast TV schedule. I think that is what the other poster was referring to when the NFL wants an AFC team in LA. It's all about the TV schedules.
They're talking in KC about the possibility of them moving into Kansas. And St. Louis has already been turned into an expanded Chiefs fan base. Trust me, that team will never relocate here.
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Wow! They beat The Cardinals one day!? That's CRAZY.
If St. Louis gets an NFL team again (and they deserve one), it should be contingent on one thing. Some kind of document MUST be signed that essentially says the team CANNOT move for at least 50 years.
@@mattstaebel3543 Really don't think us humanoids will be that big a population at that point. Your population decline agenda has unforeseen consequences.
@@BoldcastifyPrime, right. Yet that’s kind of a key point. The NFL wants an empty market to hang over the heads of cities with old stadiums. No long lease, no STL to threaten other cities with.
@@mikek784 St.Louis is not LA or Vegas where you could do that. No one is relocating to St. Louis from another city. It is a fairly small market. It is an empty threat.
As someone who’s lived in the STL for six years. I can vouch that the city is mostly interested in XFL, NHL, MLB, and we just got a soccer team/stadium as of 2022. Between already having a new sports team in town and the Midtown renaissance with new places such as, The City Foundry, The Armory, Topgolf, a brand new Target. The city already has its hands full for at least the next 5-7 years.
It seems when professional sports teams leave it is because they want a new stadium. STL seems like the best temporary place to go. Fans are always supportive but the city does not want to provide the teams with new accommodations. If STL got on board they would be able to keep their teams. STL absolutely deserves a NFL team.
A NFL team will never go to St. Louis again until the city changes its tune on tax payer assisted renovations/stadiums. I know a lot of people are against using tax payer money to build a stadium, however the amount of taxes the city is now losing out on will make you sick. That’s also a warning to any city who has a team currently, if you are not going to invest in a stadium they will just go to a city that will. People need to start looking at this as an investment, especially with the tax revenue a NFL game will generate. It makes me mad see politics that are against this but will turn around and spend money on stupid crap such as researching bird species and DEI initiatives. Just absolutely bad business…
Well the NFL has the St. Louis fan base right where they want them. They turned the metro region into an expanded Chiefs fan base now, and the people fell for it. And they did without the hassle of trying to construct a new stadium, lol.
still to this day, I believe the Rams should’ve stayed in St. Louis and they should’ve committed to funding a new or renovated stadium. Sofi should’ve been for the chargers solely.. they were closer anyway.
SoFi was paid for by Rams owner Stan Kroenke, the Chargers didn't pay a dime to construct it and are basically 'squatters.' Without the Rams moving back to Los Angeles, no stadium would ever have been built there. Also, before 2016 the Rams had 49 previous seasons in L.A. and the Chargers had only one.
That St Louis Rams logo was only in St Louis. Before they moved to St Louis from LA they had a different Logo and brand and now that they jave moved back to LA they branded back to a different logo. Food for thought when they arrived in St Louis from LA they wore the old LA unis until they rebranded and they also used the St Louis logo for couple yrs in return to LA at coliseum.
Yea… Kansas City built the Sprint Center in 2009 bc KC was “high on the NHL or NBA list”. And here we are 15 years later with no team and frankly never coming close to getting one
The Battlehawks don’t have to compete with the Chiefs or even the Bears for that matter for fans. Every Battlehawks fan I know (including myself) is a Chiefs fan. The Battlehawks have the whole state of Missouri backing them along with a lot of Illinois. If they had an NFL team, that would NOT be the case. Selfishly, as a Chiefs fan, I do not want St. Louis to get an NFL team. But if they were to get one, then i think they’d do alright.
This may be a surprise to anyone outside of St. Louis, but Stan Kroenke is a liar. St. Louis is certainly more than a baseball town, and yes, the Cardinals have had a rough couple of years and so has the Blues. Like a lot of cities, our fans support winning teams. Guess what, that is like a lot of cities. The Rams were terrible for multiple seasons before the move and our attendance was among the lowest in the NFL. While I would say the losing record and the lack of newer facilities contributed to the fans not showing up, the fact that Kroenke seemed to have little interest in talking to the city to improve things may have been a factor as well.
I personally don't see the NFL coming back to St.Louis....would I like to see them expand back to St.Louis, yeah but I don't care if they do or not....St.Louis has the Battlehawks and The UFL and that's all we need......all the Battlehawks are part of the UFL or United Football League, the XFL and USFL combined
After what St. Louis did as far as the lawsuit, I would NEVER trust them again with an NFL team. San Diego deserves a team. Toronto can support a team. San Antonio (or some other City in Texas) can support a team. I wouldn't give St. Louis 💩!!!
@@coreyrowe4119 Yes it's true St Louis is a smaller market but it's still a great sports town. Lets' face it Kroenke wanted to go to LA there was nothing the people of St Louis could do to stop that from happening.
The NFL said St, Louis had two chances already so it's unlikely they would get an expansion team, but didn't Cleveland ALSO lose two teams? And yet they got a third...
I think the dome could be cool if they put big screens with back projected videos and lighting on it. Can you imagine what a cool screen on the roof would be like? The building is attached to the convention center and is used more for conventions than it has ever been used for football.
St Louis is a SPORTS TOWN!!!!! All teams in St. Louis draw high in the percentage of capacity. Add to that NASCAR sold out last weekend, the PGA championship set attendance records in 2018 and will host the 2026 BMW championship and presidents cup in 2030. This is one of the most knowledgeable fan bases in sports. Just don’t ask the taxpayers to fund a new stadium, won’t happen
For me I would purchase the Battlehawks from the UFL and officially become an NFL team plus my dream 40 Team expansion with Columbus, Ohio and Austin being some of the team locations
No way 3 teams in OH. Austin/San Antonio area will have about 7M residents makes a lot of sense (after Jerry Jones passes). Only see Austin/San Antonio & Toronto as North American expansion candidates. But I can see 2 teams in UK & 2 in Germany plus Toronto as most likely.
@Mr.Ed_Wayner plus if California, Florida and New York have 3 teams, why not Ohio plus the Buckeyes give Columbus a good history on the football and the city had former NFL teams that did poorly due to budget issues
@@Gabriel_Rojas_Arena Ohio 12 M, Texas 31 M makes more sense to put a 3rd team in Texas. I live between Austin & San Antonio (grew up in NYC) and I certainly could support an NFL. Nothing against Ohio, I do believe they could support a 3rd team.
@@Gabriel_Rojas_Arena NFL being a weekly sport makes long travel doable.If NFL were to go to 18 games with 3 byes, I could see a Euro pod working. Euro teams would probably play 3 successive games at home and them 3 successive on the road to limit time zone changes. It’s just a matter of time before NFL expands to Europe. Probably in the 2030’s. It would not work with just one Euro team.
Toronto won't get an NFL team because there is not a single Canadian billionaire with the bandwidth, wallet, and stomach who would want to: pay the expansion fee (around $4 billion USD); and build a $1 billion stadium. $5 billion USD is a staggering amount of money in Canada; we are not that wealthy of a nation. If you spend that much on an NFL team, where is your exit? Who is the Canadian billionaire that would buy the team from you in 15-20 years? Canada has many rich and wealthy people, but only a select cohort of mega-wealthy individuals. To further illustrate this, Toronto has the same GDP as Miami or Cincinnati. Those types would rather go after an NHL team if they could. The only mega-wealthy Canadian who was committed to the NFL was Ted Rogers, who sadly passed away years ago. No one else at his level, wealth-wise, has beat the drum for an NFL team since.
if St. Louis ever gets another NFL team, it has to be 1: an expansion team with a contract with the city that states that they will not move for at least 50 years, 2: has to have a new stadium, 3: has to be entirely privately funded - Good luck convincing St. Louisans to pay for a stadium when we've already been used as a rental twice before. but after all this, it'll take even more convincing. Many St. Louisans have bit the bullet recently and have decided to root for the Chiefs given their recent dynasty and success.
Being from Akron,Ohio I know how it feel to lose a team the Browns and know that I live I'm n St.Louis I feel that they want and deserve a NFL team. Been to the dome and I feel it can be refurbish look at New Orleans dome its old
If St. Louis does get an expansion team, I hope that their stadium is outdoors, I’m getting a little sick of the cookie cutter translucent roof stadium
