They left buzzfeed and then made all the financial mistakes buzzfeed made. You don't HAVE to build elaborate sets, you don't HAVE to hire all your friends, you don't HAVE to constantly travel. There are bigger channels than them that are literally just a dude in a chair.
But if they wanted to do that, they wouldn’t have started at Buzzfeed. It’s the same thing with the Try Guys imo, where they don’t just want to be content creators, and they don’t want to just be youtubers. They want to be media hosts/personalities and producers at their own independent production company, and youtube is just an easy way to build a fan base and get money from it. They all liked Buzzfeed, minus the lack of ownership over your work and quota system. But the Try Guys and Buzzfeed Unsolved were two of the biggest shows they ever made, so they definitely had better treatment than other staff members there. The only good transition (that I’ve seen) from Buzzfeed content into being a normal RU-vidr is Safiya Nygaard, who has been pretty good at staying relevant by making fun content that often stays within a niche. She doesn’t let the jokes run old/stale, and she doesn’t make a parody out of herself. It’s a great incorporation of her real life with content, and she’s always been pretty entertaining. Her videos are also high quality while still feeling like she’s a creator, not just the host or the star personality of the video. Those kinds of things are what rub me the wrong way about Watcher and Try Guys
people LOVED the low quality shit. small office, old ass decorations, and blue and yellow text on a black screen? 10/10. it was so good cause their personalities not the quality (watcher had some bangers too ngl but they kinda ventured pretty far from the content i liked)
Ikr?? I stuck with Watcher for maybe a year or two when they first started, but I lost interest in Puppet History when they killed off the professor (I think it came back but I just didn't care by that point), and I was growing out of the ghost hunting/true crime videos before they even left BUN. They never put out anything else that really grabbed me-- going through their channel now it just looks like a 2015 Buzzfeed reskin. That kind of content was fun when I was 17-18, but now I'm 26 and it's not for me lol.
Nothing compares to buzzfeed unsolved, especially pre covid buzzfeed unsolved. That period of unsolved was pure gold. So good. So entertaining. Two dudes talking, black screen. Just amazing
This! Why do they need sets, videographers, etc? You can also get amazing quality on smartphones now. Spending all this money just to make the videos is ridiculous.
Cause everyone is so numb to the fact that most people just ignore the criticism, double-down, attack the people critiquing, or just blatantly keep doing what they're doing that when someone actually realizes of their mistake, people think it's a needle in a haystack. Why? All we see if just the worst of the worst, so we just expect someone to be a scumbag.
the thing that has bugged me the most during this whole situation is shane's wife's tumblr post. she said something about how it's hard to pay people fairly and also make a survivable wage. girl... your wedding venue alone cost $50k and you wore THREE DIFFERENT wedding dresses. last week you posted about a $100 TOTE BAG you bought. don't pretend you're struggling or barely making a "survivable wage" edit: I'm not saying she can't spend her money how she wants to. I just think it's annoying when rich ppl act like they are struggling financially
Not to mention his wife doesn't work none of that money was her own it was watcher money she just wants people to keep paying for her expensive tastes while she gets to sit home and do half assed art
You touched on what the community suspects is going on: mismanagement behind the scenes. Specifically, the impression we get is that they've hired too many people, and have wildly inflated production budgets. As an example: they've got a lets-play series called Survival Mode. How many people do you think need to be involved in making a lets-play series? There's two people on screen, plus an editor, plus to be generous maybe someone to handle the lights, cameras, and microphones. Four people tops, right? For their latest Survival Mode episode, on top of the 2 people on screen/playing the games, they had a director, producer, tech director, editor, post-production supervisor, production coordinator, gaffer, camera operator, sound mixer, PA, DIT, and assistant editor. That's 14 people working on one episode of a lets-play. (There were more people credited, but I'm limiting this to people who presumably had hands on producing *that episode*, unlike for example the logo designer, executive producers, head of development, and head of production.) Thanks to u/Shitfaced-Crusader on reddit who raised this to the greater community's attention
PLEASE tell me it's at least the best let's play ever with dynamic lighting effects and multiple cameras and amazing editing that doesn't rely on the game itself. Because otherwise wtf is a director going to do? The game is the director. And I just went to look at it and it's the most basic shit ever...
@@ferinzz ur gonna hate this but the game is the main part along with shane and ryan joking about, theres some lighting changes throughout and some light editing here and there but literally no use for that many ppl 😭
Thats insane. To put it in perspective...when Gametheory does their GTNotLive vids, aka their let's plays...they have a team of four: Matt on the couch as the host, Ash as cameraperson, audio tech, and co-host, an Editor in post-production, and I believe one additional audio/video tech person. GT is also a huge channel like Watchers, so the fact that Watchers is using a team of 14 people for a lets play vid whereas Game Theory, a channel of similar size, does it with a team of four is insane mismanagement on Watchers' part.
I've seen higher production quality LPs done by just a single person and they were full LPs on top of that instead of just mostly one offs that Watcher was doing
I bet $6 a lot of pointing who's fault this shit happened in their office Also gonna wagger that this definitely made their relationship with each other on thin ice
Ikr?? That's when I watched them the most! I mean of course they had production value still, using stock images in a clever way, really good video editing etc., but they don't need an insanely high budget.
I'm betting that the format didn't bring in new viewers enough or it got played out. Sure we have a nostalgia bias, but no matter how great the original style is, the appetites of the viewers, especially considering there are always new young kids coming onto youtube, there almost certainly has to be a refreshing element. Only in very very rare cases can one stay true to the same exact format and maintain for more than a couple years. But who knows. Hard to deconstruct and be sure
@Robisquick im sure that flashier/higher production value videos made it easier to attract newer & younger viewers. if they never changed i know that i personally never would have complained
@@Robisquickactually they left because Unsolved was not allowing them to provide their own input into any of the videos and was making it harder and harder for them. They talked about it before. I do miss the text on the video but they might not be able to do that because it could be property of Unsolved.
it's insane to me that andrew and adam even agreed to join this whole mess... it makes me feel like steven/ryan/shane were so unaware about their audience's perception of them, they appeared confident enough for others to accept whatever offer they'd make i just can't wrap my mind around the fact that there were so many important figures in a room and everyone just agreed with the leaving youtube idea, like, no one said a thing??? specially andrew. dude always seemed to be so down to earth and idk? wise? lmfao it's just weird
“We need to pay our employees a fair wage.” *LIVES IN CALIFORNIA MAKING CONTENT THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH CALIFORNIA* Guys, just move your business somewhere more cost effective … your 1mil salaries would go much further literally 100miles east.
its not so much the channel... they are living extravagant lives so they keep paying themselves a "liveable wage" you know one that enough to to host as couple 100k wedding
@@sarahm.8013for their apology video alone, they credit like 2 directors of photography, a creative director, multiple editors, a production coordinator,... . That's not "i hire some friends&family". That is thinking they are a tv channel!
When they were describing Ghost Files costs thats when it clicked for me. I watched their supernatural on buzzfeed and was really enjoying it, but with watcher it didn't hit the same... thats probably because on buzzfeed they went in maybe couple of people and a few small cameras on tripod. You can tell ryan was actually scared there. I bet its less scary when you go into an abandoned building with crew of 15 people and lots of equipment. Didn't feel genuine for me anymore
I think part of that is also that at the start of buzzfeed, he was a random dude who had no real experience with going into these haunted places. Exposure therapy is a real thing, overtime the more people are exposed to/experience their fears the less they're scared of them. He went from having no experience to being a bona-fide ghost hunter. Of course he's not as scared, he's been in dozens of haunted places by now.
@@oliviap.1370 yes, I agree, this also plays a big role in this. It's not realistic for everyone to continue with every episode like its their first. That's why it just doesn't hit the same
I think they shot themselves in the foot pretty badly here. One of the things that separated Watcher from other RU-vidrs or entertainment ventures was their extremely loyal and active fanbase. If the situation was that they needed money right now or the channel would shut down, they genuinely could've just asked the fanbase point blank and the fans would've been there. Now, no matter how loyal the fans were originally, there's always gonna be a bad taste left in your mouth when you think of the company.
That is exactly how I feel! Like I don’t watch every video but even id try and chip in if they just flat out asked and I own multiple pieces of merch too. But like even with this apology being good I just can’t look at them the same
You’re right about their ads. Their fan base has actually complimented them on their sponsored bits several times and said they watch them willingly because of how fun they are. I can’t believe they would find it hard to get sponsors at all.
The ads on the last Mystery Files season maybe even got more compliments than the actual content, I saw loads of people getting really invested in them.
I love Professor Morris Ashley and his story. I want to see if he can find love after his time with his beautiful, estranged, Italian wife, Bianca Sophia.
The way I look at it is that they want full control on whether or not the videos will be monetized or not. RU-vid can at any time say "were changing the rules to monetization" and they wont have a say about the matter. Not to say their solution to this risk makes good sense for the audience.
there are a few content creators who's ads are either too funny to skip or blend in pretty well to the skit they are doing. Ryan George's can be funny sometimes and Zach Star blends his with his skits.
One of the comments on their video stood out to me: “It was funny when you ate gold leaf ice cream on Buzzfeed’s dime, but it’s less funny when it’s our money” They wanted more money, plain and simple. These buzzfeed alumni are used to a cushier lifestyle, but someone else was supplying the money back then. Now they’re treating their fans like their former employer; an infinite cash cow.
Fire everyone except Shane, Ryan and ONE cameraman. Go back to ghost hunting and storytelling (in a small studio). I will be sending them a bill for financial advice. 😂
To be fair it's been 5 years since they left buzzfeed so i doubt that they are still used to a cushier lifestyle at this point, this argument would've made sense if it was only a year after they left, but after 5 years i don't think it holds much water. Though was still a very surprising and very bad move from them, never would have thought that about them
can’t believe they said they would have to end the channel if they didn’t do this??? there were A LOT of other options, cut your own salaries, fire some of your staff if necessary. their audience already throws TONS of money at them, they said it themselves, live shows merch patreon etc., it’s not the audience’s responsibility to pay your 25 employees. could’ve just made some necessary cut backs but instead greed took over and permanently damaged their brand. sad really.
I agree fully there but just want to point out something. Customers going into a restaurant to eat are expected to pay waiters in America by way of tips. A waiter/servers salary from their employers is that small and pitiful that customers are expected to give the servers a tip. Isn’t what watcher asking of it’s fan base the same as what is expected of customers in a restaurant? My thought to your comment of it’s not the audience’s responsibility to pay their staff, it’s not a customers responsibility to pay a waiters wage either. It’s the employers,
@@Lozza685 i agree with you but unfortunately employers refuse to pay their servers a living wage, that’s the way it’s been for a long time i don’t see it changing any time soon
@@Lozza685what they’re doing is closer to having a meal served by a person that’s only slightly underpaid bc of seniority/popularity, getting ample tips(patreon) and now adding an automatic tip onto your check on top of it all. i have no problem tipping but we patrons shouldn’t have to pay for more than just our meal to ensure their server made enough money to buy their own. and on top of that when a person just adds a tip for me to give them that leaves a very bitter taste. Watcher is now expecting and demanding viewers to pay for ANY of their new content, which is so much more entitled than just having a patreon where supporters CHOOSE to further support you and often get a special thank you video.
This reminds me of when the fine bros tried to trademark the word “react.” It showed that they were completely out of touch with their audience and now it’s how people remember them. I doubt people will just forget this.
The comment section on Watcher's announcement was majestic. It turns out you either die an independent youtube channel or live long enough to see yourself become Buzzfeed again.
I do fully believe that they are mismanaging their money and don’t know how to budget properly. None of these 3 guys know anything about running a business. Shane and Ryan fully backed out of their executive roles in the company to make Steven the sole CEO. And Steven, frankly, is the one whose content specifically revolved around buying, eating, and/or making very expensive food. From my perspective, he doesn’t have the best grasp on sound financial decision making. Honestly Charlie, you should get in contact with them and see what the hell is going on over at watcher hq 💀
yeah, like worth it was fine cause it was all off buzzfeed money but i don’t think he fully realizes that this isn’t buzzfeed anymore and the people aren’t gonna be happy with him eating gold and truffles in his tesla off viewers money 💀💀
lol, I've watched Shane and Ryan's content and if Steven has been involved in their content.. cool. But I have never watched anything Steven has produced. It just doesn't interest me.
Honestly he could write off all that expensive food as a tax write off in the United States if it was in a monetized video. So if he’s smart enough to do that at least he’s getting a fat return every year which is even worse
The thing with the $6, is that it legitimately ISN'T that much, that's 1 cup of coffee a month. But the problem is that there is already 500 other services who are begging for $5-10 a month, INCLUDING THEM WITH THEIR PATREON. If they were one of 4 services in the world asking for a $6 sub, that would be one thing, but since it's one of so many (and again, they already had a different subscription that they asked people to partake in) that left such the bad taste.
and they completely forgot about conversion for outside rhe us. a fan from the Philippines on the goodbye video said $6 usd is more than a day and a half of normal wages there
If they at least made a deal or shared service with like 3-4 other channels it could've made sense, but did they really expect to earn big bucks from this? Would't it be better to make the prices on patreon higher or smt? Or even ask for direct donations? Or sell each episode for like $1?
@@ramseyzev5179So, so, so true! My husband earned 400€ a month (conversion rates between Euro and Dollar are not that crazy) which could provide for a family of 4! Imagine more than 10% of your wage go to that! When you can feed so many people on your wage.
I work on independent films that can get really high production value with just a small fraction of the budget watcher has. I call total BS on their excuse that they need more money in order to provide that quality. What I’m seeing is a huge mismanagement of funds and resources. They need to cut back on the ridiculous amount of money they’re spending before they start asking for more.
I think they need to hire a CEO with legitimate experience. This has been a disaster and 100% could've been avoided with more oversight and business acumen.
Apparently up until recently they were doing fine with Steven as the head, especially at the start. They did videos around the process of making their company. But I suppose reviving his old content of traveling and eating expensive stuff threw a wrench in the machine.
Watcher: “We are going through financial strive, thus we need more money from our fans!!!” Also Watcher: *hires two people to continue a series which causes major financial costs, to reboot a show that had its own channel that flopped due to lack of funds…* 🤔🤔🤔
This is what I feel like a lot of people aren’t connecting, like they make this announcement as soon as they hire on the two guys associated with making content that involves buying the most expensive food/service and it’s just a coincidence?? Seems a lil fishy
saw a comment under the apology vid that said if they’re struggling this much to produce videos even with patreon, sponsors, merch, live shows, and everything else so much so that they felt like they needed to launch this separate subscription service in the first place, it’s not a matter of making more money, it’s a matter of spending less. this hits the nail on the head for me, so many ppl are saying they’re just there for the chemistry between shane and ryan and don’t care about production quality, and it seems like watcher either doesn’t know or doesn’t care about this and both their finances and their intentions with their content seem to be horribly misguided, like they don’t know what their audience is even there to see in the first place
Your comment brings up a good point. If they’re struggling, they should ask for help in a more humane and compassionate way. Not push away the majority of their viewers by putting up a literal pay-WALL.
Agree completely. If they need help financially they could come up with a new show and ask for crowd funding. The fan base would put money on anything as long as they get something out of it for not much… like buzzfeed unsolved was peak for me and although they were being funded it was cheaper than what they are doing now.
Democrats and progressives generally don't run successful businesses, the ones that do are lying and are conservatives 😂 so just like vice and buzzfeed these guys will fail no matter how much support they have or how many views they get . Democrats can mess up a wet dream . Shame the content is good , they just need a conservative to run the business .
If I had a dollar for each time some ex-buzzfeed employees made a company, resulting in 3 men talking seriously on a couch, I'd have 2, which isn't a lot but it's weird that it happened twice.
If I had a nickel for everytime someone has repurposed this quote in another uninspired way, I'd be rich. Which is hilarious considering the quote was about something be slightly unusual, not so common you hear it multiple times a day.
2 things people: 1. Don’t spend more than you earn. 2. Don’t think you’re bigger than RU-vid - there’s thousands of stories out there… but millions of others who can tell them.
Right. If you can’t make the content because you can’t afford it, don’t make it. Their fans would rather see them make something of lower production value than feel abandoned or forced to pay them a subscription for their content
As someone who works in market research, it’s absolutely BAFFLING to me that they didn’t poll their audience on this idea first. It seems like the way the “goodbye RU-vid” video was led up to and the entire concept of that video was very insincere and not transparent, which left people feeling ambushed and then thrown away. If they had asked their patreon members and their RU-vid audience what they thought about a potential streaming service, they could’ve gauged the audience reaction and also introduced everyone to the idea in a more gradual way, but instead they hit everyone with it out of left field once the decision had already been made. Especially when they’ve created a community that feels a close personal connection to them, it really feels like a betrayal to leave them out of decisions like this. I just want to know if they consulted with a professional about this move or did it on their own, cause they either need a refund or to hire a pro lmfao
"really odd mismanagement" It's this one. Everything I've glimpsed from their behind the scenes makes it seem like they have no idea how to manage their money as a business and they aren't hiring anyone to do that. Ghost Files should not be taking six figures an episode to produce.
@@blademasterzero If they are paying a living wage to a few people to work on it then that seems reasonable. If they are wasting 90% of it on extra shit then yea thats dumb.
@@davidlazerz8564yeah the problem is it's not "a few" people that work on it but they have So Many employees (which can be seen listed in credit under videos), they really don't need that many at all or to spend so much on production/equipment
@@davidlazerz8564 a livable wage according to data and news articles for LA is 110k, which is insane. They said they have 25 ppl hired. At 110k that’s 2.75MM a year. Even if you drop the salary to 80k that’s 2MM a year. 25 employees on salary for a RU-vid channel that produces 4-6 videos a month in ridiculous. That isn’t a few people. They are bloated and more than likely paying significantly more than similar roles at other companies. Their operating expenses are too high before you get into the rest of the balance sheet. They don’t know how to run a business. They need to drastically increase their revenue (which probably was the result of their original announcement) to keep their current staff, less people at current salary levels or cheaper labor. That should be the first step before they optimize their whole production to reduce costs.
i just feel like they so easily dismissed all youtube viewers who dont pay them like "if ure unable to afford a little 6 dollars subscription we dont need you to see our content BYE" like okay bye im not returning even after the apology 🤷🏻♂️
Honestly, they might just be really out of touch and somehow genuinely not know that $6 wasn’t affordable to everyone. I don’t watch their stuff, but that’s how I perceived it
Surely no one believes they’re genuinely sorry because they messed up? They’re apologising because they’ve realised they’re gonna lose subs and money from it.
@@aidanwiehl2397 it took to long and was to calculated for it to feel like anything more than "sorry we tried to blatantly demand more money we'll try to be less obvious next time"
@@aidanwiehl2397A bunch of millionaires begging for money in the most obviously manipulative tone possible. These people are extremely calculated but act like their greed was a mistake. The business is making easily a million dollars yearly, and they cry about expensive in the thousands.
@aidanwiehl2397 Ryan and Shane? Sure, that could be sincere. Steven, however, you could tell he was reading off a paper and most likely wasn't sincere.
You should not be needing an apology from the Internet. Like seriously what is wrong with you? I think you need to put your phone down and get in touch with actual human beings. Anybody who is needing an apology from somebody on a free platform is completely out of touch.
The fact that they also just hired more people for Steven's show but they say they worry about paying ,in Shane's wife's words, livable wages but are paying new people and are worried about the pay is wild to me, like how can you hire more people when yall are having trouble with the people you already have
I get the impression a lot of this fuss is specifically because of Steven and his own goals steamrolling the other guys. He took the lead in the original video announcement and some of the verbiage by Shane and Ryan in this apology feel VERY pointed. Lots of unspoken "I told you so."
They wanted to bring on the guys from Worth It. Which Steven and Ryan wrote for Buzzfeed and was as successful, if not more successful than UnSolved. Hiring the two guys from that show would be worth it in my eyes specifically Andrew, he's very charismatic and has quite the following of his own. They could all make really good popular content together. They will make more money with Andrew and Adam, I just think they failed to realise they would need to make budget cuts else where to support the new talent.
Welcome to the corporate world. my last company they kept delaying our pay rise for over 2 years saying lack of funds but kept hiring new people with higher salary. And what do you know they lost 7 of the original members within 6 months. Companies have the money but refuse to take a dip in profit for a better workplace
I love how Ryan just looks scared, Shanes face exudes pure "told you so", and Steven is just barely holding on, watching his dream of even more money crumble before him.
@@aaronstevens5325 First off, not doing something scummy like this knowing full well is wrong. Now since it has impacted them negatively they're obligated to apologize. Not because they want to, but because they have to
@@IvyHale151 All apologies are made out of obligations. You're obligated to apologize to the wronged party for whatever you've done to wrong them. Doesn't matter how you feel about the person, it's what's supposed to be done regardless.
I have to admit, I'm also shocked how genuine this apology is. They took accountability for everything, addressed all the feedback and concerns, didn't try to deflect or act like they're right, and explained things pretty clearly. I'm in agreement that it's baffling why they thought this was necessary to make a separate platform for further profit when they aren't struggling, but they at least were quick to react and course correct instead of doubling down on it and blame their fans. So good on them for that.
I agree. I thought it was a sincere apology that also addressed people's concerns with appropriate solutions... It is weird though why they felt like a private platform sub model was needed though? I seriously question the decisions of their ceo on this... and I'd be curious about what type of contracts Shane and Ryan have agreed to with him.
When Smosh was going down, they literally sold their company in order to provide free entertainment to their fans while still being able to do what they wanted creatively. I think it's frustrating that their first thought was not to get a financial manager, business manager, even a damn media/marketing manager or look within their company to see what they could do but rather impose it on their fans. Saying we're taking away all your content if you don't pay us is wildly horrible marketing strategy to introduce a new product.
Smosh is such a good example. They have way more mouths to feed and much lesser views during that era. They survived without paywalling and now became bigger than ever before.
Because Steven's tesla isnt going to paid itself, or you know...Steven's lets go eat to the most expensive restaurant we can find and make a video of me eating a 1000 dollars hamburger, for the channel of course. Also, who has extra money to hire a financial manager or a business manager? Steven first needs to hire his buddies from back of Buzzfeed to work on his lets eat expensive food show.
the best example I've come across so far. Big props to smosh for not giving up and always trying to keep their fans happy. Now I'm even more bothered by the whole Watcher situation considering what Smosh went through.
I was wondering if they were going through something similar to smosh. Perhaps they already sold watcher and are owned by a scammy company or already have a manager who is taking way more than their fair share(?) That's the only way I can see their maths making sense...
Their "Goodbye" video basically described their viewership as negligible and inconsequential. Not what I'd call good marketing. Also, I think them talking about their $250K wedding and honeymoon before crying about needing more money was very ill advised.
@@rs-mt6kli think it’s Shane’s? But also steven just got married so it might be that! But both weddings were insanely expensive (no one needs three dresses for one day XD)
what ultimately confuses me and I haven't really seen anyone talking about is the cost of creating and managing an entirely new streaming platform, like to operate they need their current staff to dedicate more time to managing it or hiring new staff to solely focus on it or outsourcing to a company. I understand that this way all profits go to them and they don't have to pay an already established streaming platform to host their shows and receive a smaller cut but I honestly don't see how that would cost them more than creating a whole new platform, maybe I'm ill-informed but from the outside I don't get it it would have made more sense and honestly probably been more lucrative and well received if they just had their episodes go up early on their patreon, they would probably get more people signing up and paying more money at different tiers rather than a solid $5.99 from everyone and wouldn't have the added cost of making an entirely new platform
The funny thing is, if they had just made a kickstarter or crowdfund and stated, "hey this is how much this show costs to make, please help us raise the money we need for the season and then we'll go do it" with direct promises of what that money was for, they would've easily hit targets, like no question, especially if it was Puppet History or Ghost Files related. Asking people to pay for a nebulous idea including content they don't want was the wrong move when they could've easily focused on direct funding to things they want.
@ZackM-sx7tc Brother, as a woman, if you start a sentence off with "Not to be a creep, but", whatever you're saying or typing should stay as an inside thought 😭
You're right. If one of your shows is watching someone eat literal gold maybe people don't want to see that if it means they now have to pay to see the content people want to see.
I think one of my biggest problems is they introduced these changes in a way that fits the format of “I’m talking to you as a friend and not a customer.” I feel like they prooooobably knew this might not go over so well, so they had this “month early + ad free” on the back burner. This is a good business decision! When making big changes, it’s good to have the same changes but to a lesser extent just in case people don’t like it. To then make the business decision into this idea of speaking to you, their FRIENDS, from the couch in plain clothes trying to be comfy and casual and saying we are sooooo sorry we never thought this could happen…. It feels very disingenuous.
Cmon friend (person they don't know who is on average a random teenager) give us more money so we can make even more profit. RU-vidrs hate para-social relationships until tax season comes around
here's my little piece for the "staying relevant to brands"--i went to their live show in 2023, where we were shown the Montana State Prison ghost files episode. we were then told after the episode that because the RU-vid episode was sponsored by a certain advertiser, most of the "inappropriate" content that we had just seen at the show would be cut for the RU-vid release--and it was. most of these guys' most memorable moments are them being dumbasses and inappropriate while ghost hunting, namely. if most of their ads are causing them to restrict their content like that one episode did, I understand why they wanted to ditch ads and make their own service--to make the content they and their viewers want.
Out of curiosity, what kind of stuff was cut? Because I can’t imagine what they’d be doing there that’s so not safe for RU-vid that it would scare off an advertiser. Unless they’re taking dumps on the floor uncensored or calling the ghosts slurs I can’t think of what would turn off an advertiser when true crime channels and such get sponsors. Especially when I think back to their Buzzfeed stuff- they had a lot more fun but none of it seemed “edgy”
@@averyeml I don't remember the exact bits that were cut because I obviously only saw it once, but I believe one of the jokes and bits that ran through the entire episode was the guys making jokes about Satan's penis. I'm sure there were more, but that's all I remember.
@@lunarlullaby05 gotcha- yeah I get not recalling specific bits but vibes are plenty. I could see that being on the edge depending on the sponsor. I think the guys have some work to do on the back end regarding staff size vs. output but if they can strike a better balance, those advertisers could either be turned down or put up with because they could cut more loose in other videos. I want to see them succeed but I think there’s some bigger issues that they gotta hammer out. I want my ghoul boys back!
@@averyeml I agree. I've been a fan of the guys since s1 of unsolved, so I honestly paid for a sub to their service immediately, but that's only because I'm lucky enough to have a good paying job and not a ton of other things I need to budget for. I put on all of my socials that any of my mutuals could have my password, at least before their apology video. I do think they need to iron out a few more things, but I think the whole thing of them releasing episodes a month earlier than RU-vid on their site is a pretty smart move, all things considered.
"Shane, you have stepped in it this time, you are ON YOUR OWN." "You can have your bridge back???" "Maybe someone will rent it from you for six dollars a month."
unironically one of the best youtuber apologies genuinely sincere and admitted wrongs and actually said what 90% of apologies don't say "I'm sorry" solid 8.7/10 apology
Why are people so butthurt about it though, paramount+, Netflix, Hulu, hbo max all cost money, twitch subs, but they crossed the line by wanting people to pay a monthly subscription for content?
What if they were genuinely sorry? We get it, you like drama. You like it when someone famous goes under because its a guarantee ego booster. But these guys were sorry and generally cares for their fans.
I'm sorry, but the whole situation felt like a fever dream. I mean, Shane "eat the rich" Madej making a RU-vid apology over such a topic? Yeah, never in a million years did I see this coming as a long time viewer since Buzzfeed Unsolved
I agree with Charlie in that I appreciate the apology, but it still doesn’t land for me. Shane sounded genuine, Ryan sounded scared, and Steven sounded about as empathetic as an HR manager explaining why you don’t qualify for unemployment after being laid off. Thanks for the “sorry” boys, but you already showed your hand.
shane means it, and was probably expecting this response. if ryan was scared, its probably because it seems like that was part of his Big Dream(tm) and hes seeing that it isnt able to happen the way he thought it was. steven literally does not give a shit, hes always been in it for the money imo.
@@ohapplesaucegood, don’t support them. Any employees laid off will surely find a new job and they needn’t be spending their *apparent* low revenue on hundreds of thousands of dollars on weddings.
Their live show made me not trust them at all, it was called Ghost Files Live so we assumed they would research the city they are in and have a little script about the ghost stories of that area and Ryan would read it while Shane joked about, their classic setup. Instead they just.....played a 40 minute youtube video of an episode of ghost files. They did a Q&A after but probably 1/5th of the audience left before that. It was really disappointing.
The funniest thing to me is that their patreon already existed at nearly the same price and we already got content early through it. This whole thing could've been avoided if they just upped the patreon price by one dollar, released ad-free content a month early rather than a day early, and advertised it more on their RU-vid channel. And Patreon has a comment section so the community would be more engaged and still get to discuss new episodes as they come out.
Buuut moooom, daaaad they want their own site 👶. Jokes aside, I get they really wanna own their media to the *bone.* But they really don’t NEED too yet. And honestly they can’t yet, the audience doesn’t want that.
@@RyuKyu.77 She had a little pretentious guilt trip moment on her tumblr implying people who didn't want to pay for WatcherTV didn't want to pay workers livable wages or something along those lines. The funny part about it is, her and Shane's wedding was apparently in the $250,000 range, and she wore THREE DIFFERENT wedding dresses. In one day. So her post comes of VERY out-of-touch and preachy.
it’s funny that wealthy people always conveniently forget that $6 to most of the middle-lower class is a cheeseburger for lunch and that means a lot to some of us. Edit: Also it seems like they mismanage their money and asking for more is not the ethical way to fix that issue.
I have to say Watcher handled the situation with a lot of grace. It wasn't a desperate "Please buy our thing", it was a "Oh, we realize some of our supporters might not be able to buy our thing, we're sorry" before promptly changing their tactics for how they went about this new platform.
Lmfao there was no mistake, they knew what they were begging for money and attempted to tone it perfectly to avoid criticism. Millionaires begging longtime subscribers to fund their yacht. You think they didn't know?
I legit joked about this possibility to myself earlier but I genuinely would not be surprised. The guy makes all the financial decisions apparently and he’s the CEO who gets the final say. This whole idea has his name written all over it
I still can't get behind "we weren't going to survive, we were going to have to lay off employees and eventually shutter without this pay wall", when they are also expanding by hiring two more, I'm sure expensive, on screen talents.
It seems like it is their own fault. They grew too big too fast and are afraid to make the necessary changes because they don't want to fire anyone. So instead they are making everyone else pay for their mistake.
@@semperaugustus661 not that they grew too fast, they just want everything to be super high quality when thats not what we care about. We care about the personalities not the set of the shows or the animations. they seen to have this idea that more people equals higher quality which isnt true
@@niccolom4556 You have to have natural growth. If we take them at their word that the company is bleeding money and on the verge of shuttering and costing everyone their jobs it is an incredibly unwise and frankly selfish move to keep expanding rather then tightening things up and keeping your people employed.
Not only did they hire 2 more on screen talent. They want to bring back the more expensive show of traveling and eating expensive food. Nothing about their announcement said “we need to stay afloat” all it said to me was “I want more”
As someone who is almost finished with their Business Management degree, one of the first things I was taught was to always have an Exit Strategy if you plan on being a business owner. I would ask what they were thinking the whole time they were doing this, but it's now clear they didn't have a sustainable long-term plan.
I cried alot as a kid because I couldn't use any of my game codes again from the games I bought physically. Literally didn't get to play them just found out I needed a new SD card after installing them then EA NEVER let me use my expensive ass games again.
I can't imagine Ryan and Shane's "Ghost Files", "Puppet History" or "Are you Scared?" really costs that much to make. It's 100% Steven's luxurious spending that brought them in this position in the first place.
Of the ventures that would cost a lot more to produce would be Ghost Files if they are traveling around the country and having to bring camera crews along, equipment, rent hotels, buying food, etc, BUT just like Charlie said they make a really good chunk of change through patreon, ads, and merch They should have plenty to cover the costs of Ghost Files. It seems like they need to have an actual accountant or something along the lines to help them budget their money if they are that hurting for cash.
Other channels already do this shit. You guys are just throwing a hissy fit because your relatable RU-vid want to get paid for it lol. They're stupid doe announcing it
@@nuyynuyy they ARE getting paid though patreon, merch, live show tickets with ad cents and sponsors it's not a making money issue it's a irresponsible spending issue
With this method they aren't as exposed to risk when their videos get demonetized. They talk about murder and sex and rape all the time, thankfully without bleeping or annoyingly muting them out, other channels won't even say those words for fear of getting demonetized. If you're only posting one or two big videos per week it takes a huge chunk of the revenue if it gets flagged.
@@Maplebear1203 patreon has a tax, merch is barely sold, they don't have many live shows, sponsors hardly reaches out to them and sometimes sponsors doesn't give money but rather benefits.
I'm so glad charlie brought up the fact that their content is super brand friendly, cuz that's like the first thing I thought when they were explaining their original decision. They're former buzzfeed employees, their content is pretty much as brand-friendly as you can get. So to act like getting brand deals was an issue hasn't made sense to me
I could see maybe if they wanted to include more drunk content (idk RU-vid's stance on that) or swear more, but yeah, most of their content is perfectly fine for advertisers...
Exactly, it's not like Dropout where they're drawing dongs every other episode and swearing like sailors. There's a need for an independent platform for content that YT will flag, but that never felt like the case for this group.
That's what I thought. I guess you could call some of their topics not suitable for kids and their language isn't clean either, but over all, what's the problem. Or rather, what kind of content did they plan for the future, that couldn't be put on RU-vid? What are they planning that could risk their "brand-saveness"?
@@msthecommentator2863 but I have to disagree. They do swear quite often and a lot of the stuff and jokes they make can be “inappropriate” for a younger audience. Especially when doing their true crime content their jokes can get pretty graphic . I am not sure where the family friend/clean comments are coming from. They also have a show where they try to get extremely drunk and often talk about Ryan being a stoner. Maybe they wanted to make more mature content where they don’t have to beat around the bush about things and watch what they speak about. Maybe have a stoner version or too many spirits without getting demonetized or having trouble finding a sponsor. I’m not saying they made the right decision with making their own platform, but saying their content is “clean/family friendly” is not completely true.
Or it could just be the truth, if you go into every situation thinking an explanation is just a sympathy garnering tactic then the whole world will seem like a bunch of manipulative cunts.
Good thing it doesn't seem to be working. Most are accepting of the apology but still are asking how the hell they allegedly ended up in such bad shape.
Honestly Im completely turned off by Watcher now, the facade is broken with this sht and that language has caused me to just see these three dudes as greedy corporate faces now. Any of their business problems are completely on them as a business, if they dont make content that the public enjoys or watches, thats on THEM to produce content thats viable. And that wasn’t even a problem with their channel; people genuinely enjoy them! But their poor ass business decisions and “tv quality” obsession with videos lead them t9 this point. If they want to do tv, they should put their asses into hollywood, except they won’t because they’d be at the bottom all over again and they already have a large yt audience. As we have seen throughout the years, youtube IS NOT television programming. I’m sorry for being so fired up about stupid drama, but I’m actually disgusted with these guys. I used to love watching them; but they’ve became what they were running from. Just Buzzfeed but in different font.
its a common reason believe it or not, bad stuff comes out when something goes wrong and clearly they needed to give a reasonable reason on what they did, its not only for people to feel "bad" for them its also to assure people that they made a mistake due to this "reason" that they gave, if they gave a reason that isnt acceptable they would dig a deeper hole on what they already dug it would be a dumber decision up top a dumb decision. so if you made a dumb decision in the future and dont want to look even dumber dont halfass your reasons
long time fan of Shane and Ryan. i’m glad this hasn’t spelled death for them. i believe they are genuinely good people and didn’t have malicious intentions. we are all human, we all make mistakes. nobody is perfect. they were able to see the flaws that they overlooked and were able to compromise. they owned up to the situation and are trying their best to make it right. good job guys. we need more people like this on this platform and other platforms as well. i’m glad the community understands that forgiveness is okay and can be a good thing. these guys definitely don’t deserve to be ‘cancelled’ and they certainly don’t deserve failure. they’ve been working so hard for years and it shows. the world is a tough and confusing place to navigate. thank you boys for still allowing us to watch[er] for free.
Honestly, this is by far the best RU-vid apology I’ve ever seen and they handled it so great and they now did it the best compromise they could have come up with, my subscription is now safely secured
He took most of the flak for the decision from an audience he probably thought supported him just as much as the other two. The thing is most people didn’t want to blame Shane or Ryan which is probably why.
@@LeMenace1this, but also, he was the one who said “anyone can afford it.” even if they came up with that together, steven said it, which probably allowed people to find a scapegoat to not hate on ryan or shane.
@@m_here1 live shows are hard to judge without actual numbers. Cost to the venue, paying staff, renting equipment, transporting merch can all be more than you'd think. From what I've gathered, unless you're a major artist or something in that nature, live shows can be a loss leader. It still rings true for a lot of esports. LCS is one of the most popular video game events that happens and is still a loss leader, but it promotes and commercializes so its seen as good regardless. OWL is also not profitable. Hell Charlie himself has claimed that Moist Esports isn't profitable. At most they likely get 5-15% profit.
Be honest though, how could they have improved their apology even further? They apologized sincerely, took accountability, and directly fixed pretty much the main issue people had with their move while still trying to save face financially. Are they just irredeemable to yall?
Watcher literally got sponsored by the state of Washington, it's crazy that a channel with a sponsor like that is saying that they are unsuccessful on a platform and would otherwise close down if they didn't launch their own streaming service
The interesting thing is that the video you are talking about was incredibly censored and restricted precisely because it was sponsored by the State of Washington so it had to fit certain guidelines and standards. I understand why would an artist want to figure out different ways of founding so they dont have to rely in that. Obviously this wasnt the right way tho.
Here's what Shane Madej's wife said about this issue over on her Tumblr: "I get people don't like to pay for things that were once free, but paying people fairly and making a survivable living while making cool things is HARD." - Sara Rubin I'm sorry but If you're already having trouble sustaining the money that's coming in from this project then that's an issue in your camp. There's people working two separate 40 hour a week jobs barely making a "survivable living", It just sounds like they are living above their means.
This is the same woman who in the post DIRECTLY BEFORE THIS ONE, showcased that she bought a $115 Tote Bag. Oh, and spent an estimated $55k on the wedding. But sure, pop off about "survivable" wages
Exactly. I saw a video recently of this girl talking about how her and her husband live on one source of income and her first advice was “don’t buy a new car, get a used one” like yeah as if all of us poors have luxury new Lexus 😂 if they live in California they are definitely living above their means and they feel entitled to it. Girls don’t NEED to get their hair colored and cut by an expensive hair dresser. They don’t need to get their nails done. They don’t need to wear the newest clothes or have expensive handbags. I bring a $30 backpack to work everyday, and I bought it 4 years ago. I don’t eat lunch to save money dawg 😂 sometimes I just drink water to feel full lmao
to be honest, I was SO surprised by their decision, I've been following this group since their BuzzFeed days, this really felt out of nowhere... I am glad that as genuine people they replied to their community the right way. They've always been relatable about financial situations, about their dreams and goals creatively, etc. So I don't know if possibly someone hyped them up a LOT blinding them with that excitement.
"For free" really pisses me off, it's not free because we are watching ads/brand deals/paying for premium. No one is doing anyone a favor or providing anything for free if it's on RU-vid
Thiiiiiiiiis. I commented on it too they NEED a CFO to hone in on where the money drain is. Because they are not hurting for money, for the thousand reasons youtube commentators have stated these past few days. None of them have business degrees or experience they need to stop hiring friends and family for the moment and get an actual business model set up. They want to be taken serious as a media company then get the core of a business going. Get a marketing/PR person hired, get someone to manage their sponsorships and ad deals, get a freaking financial officer in place to rein in their spending and help them budget so they can grown steadily and not bankrupt their company. Sorry to vent lol 😆 it’s just they missed so many steps in between RU-vidrs and streaming platform.
Bro are you serious? Sometimes Financial Manager are the reason this whole shit show happened in the first place. Many Financial Manager are Boomers and they doesn't know jack shit about social media