I guess it comes down to it just being easier to live with for most people. I used to hate it when I started driving a dsg because I couldn't gel with it and get it to behave how I wanted it to in drive or sport. But with an adjustment period and using the manual mode when appropriate, I can now honestly say that I could be happy with either. Imo (funds permitting) having both a good manual and a good dual clutch car is the way to go. Both different but rewarding experiences when driven appropriately.
The DSG is tunable without needing to change the clutch. This was my motivation for buying a DSG. I've had my share of manuals and am happy to have the DSG as a daily. The DSG shifts excellently, as well.
WOW TCR! That takes me back. I had a set when I was a kid. Unlike Scaletric you could actually change lanes to overtake. Loved that set right up until my older brother took of the covers and souped up the engines (without my permision) to make them go faster. They weren't long for this world after that.
I had TCR, lucky for me we had a local shop that sold spares and new cars (i even later bought a Trans Am to go with my racing cars)I loved that set, and so did the group Sleaford Mods who even did a song called TCR a few years back, check it out on RU-vid. The guys are even playing with a TCR set in the video (that looks like the one I had)
I'm probably in a minority but I actually love the way the Type R looks. It's aggressive and chavtastic which for some reason appeals to the inner yob in me 😂
Like he said even VW has a better setup called the "Club Sport S addition" (only to put numbers on Nurburgring) but still failed to Type R. Now there is a Type R TCR so comparison
It doesn't have the performance pack so it's kind of a silly comparo since the Type R costs way more and is on much stickier tires, with the performance pack it gets lower firmer suspension with dynamic chassis control and cup 2s which on their own would probably close most of the lap time gap.
@flacjacket If you put them both on Cup 2 tyres the CTR would undoubtedly be the faster car. Steve Sutcliffe got a 45.8 lap time round Llandow in another video for Auto Express. According to Fastest Laps, that’s quicker than the times he got in an M2 and F80 M3. It was 0.1 seconds slower than he got in a 550bhp GTR and was faster than Jethro Bovingdon’s lap time in a 991 Carrera. Not bad for a car costing from £31,550 (£33,550 for GT spec). The Golf TCR starts from £34,065 for a 3 door with no options.
@@KXP70 You know nothing about engines. Let's start with the fact that VW didn't improve nothing from its first gen 888 and the issues with stretched timing chains, high oil consumption, etc are still same. What reliability you talking about? I seen them engines totaled in less than 100k
All large manufacturers are prone to cash out retiring models, with limited editions. Given the long delay in introducing the Mark 8, this must be an even bigger temptation. The Mark 8 GTI won’t be introduced for ages. This seems to be quite poor value compared with the Golf R or even the 245 PS GTI. If it had been given an extra 100 PS and was stripped out, then it would be collectible. I can’t see this being a “must have” limited edition. A missed opportunity, perhaps?
Quite a gap for such a short circuit...can’t help but think the tyres the golf was on probably lost it the turn-in bite it would have if it were on cup 2s... Still Honda for me, I think they are great, a proper hot hatch and I love the looks...very tempted to get one next year but we’ll see!
@@mikewhitehead50 yuo can get a Performance Pack for the TCR and i can't understand why the Testcar is without it for a Tracktest. This test is useless.
Chris 84 possibly because a basic TCR is already at least as expensive as the Civic. Tyres wouldn’t make up that much on such a short lap. It’s not a totally useless test.
I really like the Honda and see the GTI as a Marketing exercise, but after owning 4 GTI's and now a Golf R, I'm over trying to squeeze a lot of HP out of the front wheels alone.
This review seems a bit biased. The reviewer seems to try hard to spin negative things about the Golf in a positive way and discredit the type R. If he prefers the VW that’s totally fine but if you are making a comparison you should minimize biases.
Good video. Personally, I think VW as a corporation was compelled to rate the power options with respect to the existing R, Clubsport, and regular GTI.
I can count approximately three or four special edition GTI's, to have a shot at the Type-R. All have failed and done so miserably. VW should be tuning the R if they want a shot at the title. I can't see the Honda being beaten anytime soon and it has been out for 2 years. Maybe the A35. Stop with the GTI already, Honda is pooping them out it's exhaust.
@@gaycha6589 Sad days, I find it hard to believe this machine will not have a full cycle of development. All we will be left with will be expensive character less hyper hatches that the driver will point and shoot. I love the rawness of my R.
@@jaylocke9574 it may be raw compared to the supremely dull Golf R, but when I test drove the Civic I found it hugely capable but fairly tame overall. The ease and fluidity of driving it normally and fast was greater than I had expected, but it wasn't as thrilling as I had hoped it to be.
The Type-R competition was the Golf R and still didn't win. At least there is a manual version of the Golf R. What are the final prices on the street? In terms of agility, especially for the daily driver, the two seconds doesn't matter either, sporty experience while driving does, reliability does. Out of these two, I prefer the Type-R, if both cost the same, of course. The manual transmission in a sporty car makes a big difference in the driving experience. I still prefer to drive my STI rather than those two, slower or faster, I couldn't care less. Is the mechanical driving experience, that is vanishing from the sporty cars, that would make me pick the STI today. There are rumors that in the future, the STI would not come with a manual, so the situation doesn't escape even the models that seem to bring the driving experience alive, even today.
@@unassailable6138 Yes! you're right, slower. However, I wish I had learned a long time ago that numbers are not all to achieve the desired driving experience. Before buying the STI, I changed my GTI DSG for a 2015 WRX thinking that I was outsmarting any STI buyer. Fortunately, I didn't buy the STIs that Subaru sold knowing that they were unreliable, but if I would have avoided that issue, I might have been still with the car that I could have bought back at that when I bought my GTI. Again for mere numbers, there are Teslas there, but how much enjoyment this car produces, makes me think that if Subaru goes automatic in the next gen, I'll keep this one for as long as I can.
It’s actually more fun ( could say that’s preference ) but agree you would really want to have a GTI rather than the extra AWD. The TCR looks the business to as the R is quite vanilla
lewis Ratford You’re right, it is preference. Personally I think the R is better looking. And those optional TCR stickers are awful. But anyone wanting a GTI over an R would be mad to spend £35K +£2K for the Performance Pack. Save around £5K, buy the GTI Performance and APR it. A faster car for thousands less.
I find track tests kind of pointless unless the cars are purposely built for the track, these are road cars so test them on the road. The TCR is also completely different with the lower suspension, 19" wheels an DCC fitted.
I bought the R and am very looking forward to it. I'm sure the driving position, engine, and gearbox are perfect. Only thing that worries me is how easy everyone says it is to drive, how the control is quite neutral. I had a Megane RS 265 and 275, and it could get quite wild at the limit. It's beautiful control and feel is what made it the most fun car i've ever driven. The Clio RS trophy I had after was disappointing in this regard.
on normal roads you will not get the type R to behave nervous unless you are wanting to break the speed limits very hard lol. On a track though and if you have plenty of skill to drive it on the edge it will behave like a ragged dog. It has a fairly high limit though so it brings some danger too.
I just bought an older MK 7 gti after owning lots of fast French cars overs the years. It’s a great car. Definitely not as exciting as a Megane trophy by a long shot or as focused but as a daily do it all car it’s brilliant. Less exciting when you don’t want it to be and less exhausting when you do want it to be (if that makes sense!)
For saying how relatively close the Golf can get, and it’s better ability as a daily, I’d say this is the victor. If you’re that into track drivings and still need a daily, I think there are more interesting options than the Civic (in my humble opinion)
Driven a MK 7.5 Gti on a regular basis and it’s just so slick and brilliant at everything. Don’t be fooled though as the TCR is pretty much a bhp bump with cosmetics. The optional performance packs will still leave it trailing behind the type r. The TCR is a bit at odds with itself as wont challenge the dynamics of the R but is a lot louder and brash to what Gti owners go for. Great car though be it a bit pricy
Kurt Phillips The balance of the vehicle can always change if you use different tires, but being gripper doesn’t mean it is definitely going to be more understeer, the car can also be more tail happy.
Get someone else in front of the camera Autocar. I’ve no doubt this bloke has knowledge, talent and experience in abundance. But my god is he dull! You hear about jaded car journo’s, this is the epitome of it. Seriously cool job, would it really be that hard to look like you enjoy it?
I am your age and totally remember total control racing with those tiny cars. The type R was inevitably going to be quicker than the golf, but not necessarily more engaging, fun or comfortable on the road. But as a track car, the tcr golf seems a bit gimmicky in the shadow of club sport S. Nice video Matt, like your style
Yes, all this proves that the Civic is faster handles a shade better and so on, but most of us wouldn’t drive our cars like this because it wears them out faster, there’s the potential for a life threatening event, and, are you really going to play chase me on the road every time you see a type R?
Some of us go on track though...and considering how quick it was for MK7s to give my CTR a point by, the difference is even more massive on a bigger track. I'm not saying everyone lives on the track everyday but consider this. You have a very good daily and STILL can have more fun than allowed on track whenever you choose, as opposed to a fun daily is just that...and kind of understeers everywhere the few opportunities where you really get to test its limits. I's a bit deflating as an owner...I've been in that situation before.
No, because it's not worth doing, both for us and for the potential danger to others, I know and they know that in this class with a clear road and a competent driver the Type R will win, why bother? Just sit back and smile,
Now if only the dealers in my part of the world weren't asking $51k USD for a Type-R, I would have bought one. Settled for an SI instead and saved $20k+ in doing so. What are these dealers thinking?!?! $50K for a 300hp hot hatch?!?! No.
I know they are ruthless! You've got to shop all over the country if you want an R, I was lucky I knew my dealer so I got mine just over MSRP with minor goodies like tint thrown in.
@@piero914 Exactly! I am really happy with my SI and with the all the money I saved, it might be time to invest in some aftermarket toys! Enjoy your R! :)
I don't get why it's called a Golf TCR when it looks nothing like a TCR car. It's like Honda releasing another Type R without any rear wing, flared arches, vents or spoilers and calling it a BTCC edition.
If you think the Gti has a lot of body roll you should try taking my Jimny through a round about lol, Seriously though in my 1.4L Golf TSI I never knew what body roll felt like, Then I bought a Jimny.
VW GTI IS THE QUEEN! ABSOLUTELY! Please don't joke at "taxi driver" in this short circuit: mayby is the Luna Park circuit?!! I never seen the record time lap of Honda Type r on the Nurburgring Nordshleife or in Imola in the last 3/4 months. In THE NURBURGRING or IMOLA CIRCUITS I remember all the times only The record lap of VW GTI TCR or R: THE QUEENS! What else!!! GOLF GTI or R all the times! Ciao from Italy
@@layne4376 If you rely on someone/something to make you feel like a king you are not a king :-). BTW, its just my opinion, the car is ugly in my eyes but I am not denying that driving the car may be fun.
Outdoor Layne - and then you cant wait to get rid of her next day. Or you cringe if you run into her when out with friends? Yep, thats CTR. Like shagging a fat lass, or riding a moped. Great fun until you are spotted
I didnt like the rear in pictures until I drove behind one in traffic...IMO it looks really good.The wings looks fine. The styling fits its aggressive performance!
Golf is more expensive, and then you have to spend an extra £3000 to get the optimal package... I just can’t see the appeal with the other hot hatches available for less money.
The Golf is so far behind is because it’s just not digital enough, the Honda has loads of tech helping it to be a better drive, the problem for VW is, the Gti is already a dear car, and to add the tech to solve it overall driving problems, it would be expensive, and that’s the problem, lots of other brands have come up with Gti bashing cars for around thirty grand, VW can’t just bank on the iconic status of the Gti anymore.
So vw will sell you a touring car racing edition of a car thats already supposed to be performance version of a golf but still want you to pay extra for a performance pack...
Just don't change the rim size and you'll be fine. Once you alter the rim size, it alters the entire geometry of the suspension and it will never handle the same.
This Golf TCR don't have the option Performance Pack (19-inch alloy wheels with 235/35 R 19 sports tyres (semislicks), plus additional anti-theft wheel locks, Vmax limit removal and adaptive Dynamic Chassis Control (DCC) including running gear that is lower by 20mm compared with the normal running gear (five millimetres less as compared to the GTI running gear) as well as a special sports adjustment of the front axle and rear axle shock absorbers) and that make a big diference!
@@rceauto yes manual boxes are slower too... DSG means it shifts fast therefore allowing more gears and tighter ratios meaning more power and torque more of the time... so put a dsg on the civic and it would be another second or more faster again
So pretty much the same price, less HP, more weight, Electronic not mechanical LSD, a full 2 seconds slower in a sub 1 minute lap in a 6 corners track. Why would you buy the TCR again?
This golf should be where the regular golf gti should be. Not as fast as a type r but competitive in the current hot hatch market. The 230 bhp non performance pack gti is way too tame slow and boring to be considered a hot hatch imo
Dunno if is important but Civics 6th gear is same as golf's 5th. It's way low geared which is great on race track but not so good for every day use. 2400 rpm at 60mph is annoying
1:21 minutes in and the Honda has already won it for me, no packs or options, it comes with everything standard unlike the Golf, it’s a limited performance edition, why is there a performance pack for it??
Yes, on a track the TCR is a lot slower, but on roads it doesn’t really matter unless your in to a pub bragging , mine is faster than yours mentality...
Peter Cavellini I’ve regularly driven a mk 7.5 with 245 bhp and it’s set up so well for Uk roads. Sport mode doesn’t turn it in to a crashy mess. The TCR like the standard GTI have always been set up to be great road cars. In the real world these two cars point to point will be the same
