A trans person could transition and then have a series of horrific life events unrelated to being trans (death in the family, medical issue, loss of job, etc.) and transphobes are like “they’re sad because they transitioned!!” Like no?? They’re sad because they got laid off, they have cancer, and their mom died?? Seems reasonable to be sad! Not about Elliot specifically- idk much about Elliot tbh
The reason why these things are more common in trans folk is the same reason left handed folk a hundred years ago has higher suicide rates than right handed folk as well.
I'll be honest, seeing Elliot on talk shows, he seems a lot happier. Personally, I'd rather have him happy than attractive (to me, as I'm attracted to women and femmes). That's what's actually important! But apparently transphobes beg to differ...
when your pre transition and your family loves you, you hate yourself and your depressed when you transition your family turns on you even though you finally feel a little comfort in your life and body, now you and your fame are you and your still depressed; there ain't no fuchking winning
Maybe they would be happier if they didn't have to face rejection and hatred from a non negligeable part of the population, which may include close relatives and loved ones. For some reason, I suspect it can have a negative impact on people's wellbeing...@@Gdr5928
The "notice how only women clapped for dylan?" Is like "See how women are ok with trans women and accept them as women?" You literally just destroyed your one argument against trans people.
Wasn’t Dylan mocking women tho? Like his whole page is literally just him saying he cries, doesn’t know how to drive, Does makeup and that’s what’s making him a woman 💀
Shes spending her time arguing with other idiots, rather than responding to the intelligent participants in the debate?? That says a lot. Can she even begin to engage with the serious points made by Dr. Ann Loutfi? Instead of scouring the internet for trash right now, doing the youth yet another disservice. Memes do not represent the reality, its comedy, or its trash, with a million interpretations: maybe the point being made was that the youth used to have it hard and now have it so easy they lose their grip on reality. Or think they can gaslight other grownups into denying facts. Lots of females become unsafe if men can legally enter their private spaces (changing rooms, shelters, prisons, sports) because some males will lie, exploit the gaslighting happening, and rape them. Its not about memes and its narcy to belittle and make comedy of the repression of women's right to female only spaces. Jamie. Does. Not. Care. About. Others. The videos are completely self serving. When I raise an issue on her video she says she will block me, yet actively seeks out dumb arguments to seem superior. Its the behaviour of a narc. Someone with issues. Its a problem to young people watching. And no one with any level of self awareness cares about being called a transphobe -- its a smear put upon anyone that seeks to set boundaries between males and females in the interest of safety. Its a manifestation of bullying, censorship and pressure to submit to narcissistic grandiosity. Its the grown up version of calling me a chicken on the playground because i wont play your ugly game
That's because they're telling on themselves. Transphobia is deeply rooted in misogyny. They claim it's to "protect women" but when a woman says it doesn't bother them they're like "shhhh! It's ok. You don't know any better. Let us MEN do the talking"...
6:51 My grandmother's response to me coming out as trans was "Oh, I know about that! I've been watching I Am Jazz" 🥺 She then proceeded to call me by my chosen name and pronouns 💖 I miss her so much 😭
Things I avoid in a relationship: 🚩Non binary people🚩 🚩Men🚩 🚩Women🚩 🚩Jordan Peterson haters🚩 🚩Jordan Peterson lovers🚩 🚩Dog people🚩 🚩Cat people🚩 🚩Humans🚩 🚩Non-Humans🚩 I am aroace.
You see, the reason the women are in woman’s hell is because they were transphobic, that’s the only reason it exists. To torture transphobic women by making them share a womens’ space with trans women (they aren’t real trans women falling)
@@chrisbfreelance prejudice /ˈprɛdʒʊdɪs/ noun 1. preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience. Not based on reason nor experience --> ergo, ignorance. The part about emotional commitment is a funny view on confirmation bias, which is one of the primary ways prejudice is developed. Here you go, hope this helps.😉😉
It all comes with your clout. Traditionally advertisers want ads in the middle near the beginning. However if you are big enough you can choose to take advantage contracts that allow you to put them anywhere
Remember, none of us are anywhere near important enough for archaeologists to care about our sex or gender, so the transphobes think we are very important Stay safe out there, friends
Also, because of the huge disparity of hips, archaeologists also had to realize that hips aren't an accurate way of determining sex. Some cis women have small hips, some cis men have wide hips.
In addition to the other comments in this thread, archaeologists have a hard time identifying gender of skeletons period. They'll use whatever the person was buried with to identify the person's gender. Therefore, a trans man buried in a suit would most likely be identified as a man, and a trans women buried in a dress would most likely be identified as a women.
I've seen a version of it where Crying Cheems says, "Mom, Timmy called me a simp". As far as I'm concerned, someone just took that meme and changed it up a little.
The haters have already proven they're mostly not open to learning anything, which tends to be true across everything, so poor art and they don't take feedback, are often entitled so believe they're good at stuff they really aren't; also, being driven by hate stops people thinking about it logically cos it would cause so much dissonance and questioning of things if they actually applied any consistency or logic to stuff. This is all a generalisation but true quite often.
I think what pisses me off most about the anti-trans sentiment running through the LGBTQIA+ community is I remember being hated by the L & G portions of the community for being bi before I even knew I was trans but now they wanna buddy up to the bi folks to try and run off the rest of the community. These people are why I've never felt welcome in the community.
fr fr. before i knew i was trans and ace it was all "a women should be able to do whatever she wants with her body" but when I hear people talking about ace people it's like we're here to murder children and cancel pride. but then ALSO people use ace people as a weapon against kinky people, which I also am. it's all a bunch of bull. I call it "using xyz as a meat shield" the way terfs are using lesbians as a meat shield. It sucks to be the victim AND it sucks to be the meat shield.
As a bi person, I cringe when transphobic GL people lump us in with them because I remember when the same people said that bi people were disgusting and “need to pick a side” and I know damn well that we’re next to be ostracized from the community when we are no longer useful to them. (Yes I know transphobic bi people exist but in the queer community it’s largely cisgender GLs) Edit: to answer questions- GL in this case means gay/lesbian. I remember about 20 years ago the whole community was referred to as the Gay/Lesbian community in the news (I’m almost 30 now, I was about 8 when same gender marriage was achieved here in Canada so that’s the news stories I’m recalling) because all the other identities we very much erased by mainstream society. We’ve all come so far. I don’t wanna go back and I don’t want things to continue to deteriorate for my trans friends either.
you know bi people are next because bi people have ALREADY been targeted. one of those "drop the T" xitter accounts was posting months ago about how bi people should be kicked out of the community too.
I'm Nb and I had someone compare me to the shooter from club Q. ( who wasn't even nb btw, his friends confirmed he never was. I'd rather listen to his friends than his lawyer who was paid to say whatever he wanted him to say) they really think they're doing something here.
I just recently finished reading Elliot Page 's memoir, and it's very clear that he had very awful gender dysphoria. It led him to having an eating disorder and horrific anxiety and depression throughout most of his life. So for him, that picture of his pre transition self would not be representing happiness, but a false mask he put on in front of the world.
Indeed. He was (and still is) an actor, but it doesn't take a great actor to put on a false mask of happiness. A lot of closeted people do this every day. Frankly, I'm just glad he's happier and more comfortable in his own skin. That's what matters.
@@Qpolitely it's so easy to pick out bots these days. Not a coincidence your account is only 1 month old. The vast majority of actual transphobes will probably die of old age in the next couple of decades.
the whole “lgb” thing was always so funny to me as a bi guy because it’s very much like….shit, bi folks care about their partners genitals? news to me.
As a trans guy, majority of my partners have been bisexual lmao. A lot of my closest and most accepting friends are also bi. “Lgb” should rename themselves again to just “Lg”, in my experience bi people generally have 0 issues with trans folks. And when they do, it’s because they’ve never even met one of us and are just falling for right wing propaganda.
As a bi, cis dude, when I was shown a photo of a trans dude by a mutual friend, all I could think of was “he’s hot,” and the bisexual flag. That didn’t change even after the mutual said he was trans.
You don't care and that's cool that's why you're bi lol, as a lesbian can I ask then what is the distinction you guys make between bisexual and pansexual?
@@BelieveInImaginationim not bi or pan so i’m not sure how well i could explain it, but my understanding is basically that bi people are attracted to two specific genders, such as men and women, and usually have a preference, such as liking more woman than you like men, while pansexual people generally are just attracted to people without any regard to gender at all Hopefully if i’m wrong someone replies to correct me on that, usually nice to learn something new C:
To be fair, Tr*mp frequently speaks of trumpself in the third person, so Tr*mp might consider trump/trumpself to be the most accurate set of pronouns...
I mean I sometimes I refer to myself in 3rd person just to maintain a grip on reality, being my own narrator and speaking directly to myself helps me stay sane.
"I accepted that I could not change my gender, so I changed my body instead." That's such a clear way of putting it. I hope it helps someone understand.
I mean that's the whole thing that so many don't get. If we could have a means of changing gender via say brain surgery and assume said surgery was entirely safe, no risk of complication or problem in the hypothetical, then why not? If someone agrees to that method if it were available instead, does it really matter? The point is for people to feel happy, comfortable and confident in their own skin. The means to get there is something I don't care about. I just want people to have a good quality of life coupled with as much longevity as can be mustered. That's what matters. The method, the labels, whatever. The best path to me is the one that maximizes longevity and quality. Transition surgery and hormones from all the data we have when someone is trans and wants to go through with the procedure does exactly that. The how any of this happens or whatever is irrelevant. We all need to use tools available to us to find our maximized longevity and quality. The tools themselves shouldn't matter. So long as you aren't causing suffering to others, I don't care about anything you do as a person. Denying tools that are effective for life quality is causing suffering. Not getting properly evaluated to consent to those tools is causing suffering. The entire anti-LGBT idea is causing suffering and therefore is problematic. Someone dating a consenting adult, someone changing their body to feel more in line with how they see themselves no matter the reason why isn't hurting anyone. The only time I'd take issue with any kind of life quality maximizing procedure is when there is a clear deferential to longevity as a consequence (like say getting 40 cosmetic surgeries in the span of 4 years might be a serious risk level to health and the person should wait in between. Also of course a mental evaluation that 40 is what they genuinely want and it's not trying to use something as a coping for something else, which should never be assumed, but considered because mental health is important). I dunno, I think people don't really think, they just react. I'm perfectly happy to call anyone any name they give me (and pronounce it as best I can) use any pronouns (though my own conditioning to assume male/female based on body expression is definitely ingrained and very hard to not do on reflex and I hate that I could accidentally hurt someone with it because it's just automatic. I'd rather call someone by whatever name they ask me to, but I will do my best with pronouns. It just sucks when I make the mistake because I'm calling it based on the body I see which I know is very invalidating for both trans persons who don't have those markers yet or people who are non-binary.), not judge what they identify as or their gender or if none of the above really fit and no label really suits how they feel. If someone legitimately identified as per the meme of attack helicopter, ya know what, I am happy for them. I am happy to call them heli or something if they want me to. And I know it's used to mock the idea, but that's why I'm using it to explain. Because it doesn't hurt anyone to do so and I care more about peoples well being mentally and physically than I do about my own subjective standards for what I consider normal or whatever. My feelings on it do not matter. The person who is unhappy does. So long as their happiness doesn't cause suffering, we can all deal with being disgruntled by having reality be something we didn't know was going on, like how gender and sexuality are not solid in the way we thought. Even in history this is shown to be true, yet we just regurgitate what we're told to believe and therefore our standards follow. Very long comment I know. I just wanted to express how I feel about it. Because ultimately I just want people to be happy in their own skin/body/mind and whatever it takes to do that is what should be done for everyone.
It makes me mad when transphobic people say “they’re sad because they transitioned”. Maybe we’re sad because millions of people think our existence should be illegal?
Exactly. Like, maybe they're upset because everyone hates them? But if bigots used their brain (bold of me to assume they have one in the first place) then they wouldn't be bigots.
That whole attitude makes me feel like when im talking to someone whos a little less than supportive i have to pretend im doing okay even when im not. i shouldnt have to be happy all the time to validate my existence. I struggle. Lifes hard. I cry. A lot. But i cry because things actually matter to me now. I finally have things to love and things to lose. I have hopes and fears. And relationships with people i care deeply for and that i worry about every day because i love them. I didnt transition to be happy. I didnt transition to make my life easier. I transitioned to give me a life that feels worth living.
@@ErisApplebottom This is one of the most beautiful things I have ever read. Thank you for articulating this. I honestly kind of get it but from the other side where I cannot socially transition (or consider medically transitiioning) because of an unsupportive environment and country, and I spend most of the time so dissociated from myself and everything else I either feel utter despair or nothing at all. I wish more people understood that trans people are allowed to have all the full complex emotions and experiences cis people do, with highs and lows, and that accessing whatever gender affirming care they need often enables them to do this. It doesn't turn them into Pollyana's who are happy all the time. NO ONE is happy all the time.
@@Lisa_Flowers im sorry you find yourself in that situation. Thats really hard to go through. And that numbness of dissociating and cutting yourself off from those feelings, sometimes we need that. To put on a straight face (pardon the pun) and survive. To get through where we are. But its no way to live. I know i tried to live like that too long and turned to drugs to help me feel ok and hide from my feelings and thoughts. And you learn that you cant cut off the pain and sadness and despair without cutting off the joy and love and passion. Theyre two sides of the same coin and we cant open our hearts to one without letting the other in. ❤️ I hope you can find a way out and find some support. There are countless people out here that would love you and support you and want you to be the best you you can be. I dont know your situation or what country your in. But no matter where you are i know there are people just like you there. If there is a way for you to reach out to them i want to encourage you to. You shouldnt have to go through this alone. ❤️ I wish i could do more but sending big hugs and much love
I love the women's hell comic because it 1 admits trans women are women, even in the eyes of the abrahamic God, evidently 2 that means terfs go to hell
Honestly yeah, but also, that's just accurate ain't it? Why would their be a heaven for people who literally decided 'keeping oppression on their own side matters more than everyone escaping it'? Its thoughtless, tactless, and reflective of moral lack in the very least and of vulgar ignorance in every other respect.
Technically though, terfs are trying to control others, which could come under the definition "thou shalt have no other gods before me" transphobic and homophobic people are trying to act like they know better then God, by acting as such. Also "These are grumblers, malcontents, following their own sinful desires; they are loud-mouthed boasters, showing favoritism to gain advantage." -Jude 1:16 Very much rings a bell with transphobes and homophobes, they protect and defend people like Russel Brand and Trump, yet when an lgbt person does it, they don't react the same (Ezra Miller for example).
Me: “how can you call this *pulls up picture of Jamie* a woman, but call this *pulls up a picture of a woman* a man?” Transphobe: “because it’s so obvious, we can always tell” Me, knowing damn well that they don’t cause they just called JK Rowling trans: -_-
11:06 How dare they use the Doctor for a transphobic meme! Star Trek has been a very progressive franchise, and the Doc would definitely be a Queer ally. If they're gonna try and be transphobic, at least do some research on the character and franchise they're using.
"would be" its not that progressive if they haven't gone out of there way to put queer people in the show and actively showed the doctor being an ally.
I've grown up watching Star Trek, and in every decade the current running Star Trek series was among the most progressive programming available, and I started by watching reruns of the original series!
My step father's 90+ year old parents have never deadnamed me ever since i came out, and while my biological grandma who after 17 years of knowing me as a girl had to adapt to me transitioning occasionally uses the wrong pronouns, she always catches it and repeats what she said with my proper pronouns, and that's what all of my family does. I didn't have to ask any of them to do that, none of my older folk ever pulled their age as an excuse to misgender me. Being old doesn't mean you don't have to learn anything new. Older people who are held up as wise ever since the dawn of humanity are those who were always open to learn and share, being older in itself doesn't magically grant you the "good old timey truth" this grandma meme seems to imply if your mind was always closed and up your ass. I can sleep easy knowing my great grandpa who fought nazis and beat up cops would be proud of me finding myself and refusing to let others tell me otherwise, even if he never got to learn there are more than two genders. I'm not so sure many of those conservative folk who's entire teaching ethics works on being raised in tight standards, shame, bigotry and violence will be beloved old folk, they'll be at best feared and at worst abandonned.
Clownfish reach puberty and fully frow and develop. Transgender kids have stunted growth and blocked puberty and plastic surgeries. yes, let's talk about CLOWNFISH DO NOT GET PLASTIC SURGERIES, TAKE PUBERTY BLOCKERS or CROSS SEX HORMONES TO BECOME transgender. HUNANS have to use MAN-MADE TECHNIQUES to do things to their bodies that are UNNATURAL. Nature cs Nurture NATURAL vs MAN-MADE Natal vs Body Modifications and Plastic Surgeries Get back to reality. Transgender is a man made fad, trend, and abomination of what is natural and beautiful about the natal human body. ALL THE TRANS, HERMORPHODITE ANIMALS ALL NATURALLY, FULLY DEVELOP AND REACH NATAL PUBERTY TO BECOME SEXUALLY REPRODUCING ADULTS, EXCEPT HUMAN TRANS KIDS.
11:06 what makes that joke even more stupid, is there was the story of a trans man who wanted to compete in a mens wrestling tournament, but was forced to compete in the womens. he then won effortlessly twice in a row, and people try to use him as an example of why trans WOMEN shouldnt be allowed in womens sports...even though hes a trans MAN
I read a comment about someone who was transmasc who competed in men’s sports, and when he ended up winning people claimed he only won because he was trans Like, honestly, people…
I've seen a caricature where a bodybuilder woman was competing with average looking woman in running. And I honestly don't understand what exactly transfobic artist wanted to say. If she is a transwoman, then why she is taking steroids? Anti-doping committee just can't approve androgens for transwoman, she should taking another hormones which reduce muscle mass. And bodybuilders are bad in running anyway, they have another goals. If the artist wanted to say that's a residual muscle mass, that's wrong again. Regardless of gender everyone needs steroids for that. What I'm trying to say is transfobes have no idea about the subject they're talking about.
After I came out I've supported and defended all trans people. The transphobia is on the rise and I like that our boy Jamie speaks about the bigotry openly. Many trans folks have no public voice so it's important that we stick together. All LGBTQ+, not only us trans folks. They can't destroy us if we are not afraid.
@@Faeishly9 If you see someone defending the rights of an entire class of people and your first instinct is to interpret that as a defence of a despicable crime, you might just be a bigot.
@@Faeishly9 Do you support jews even after the german gov't in the 1930s uncovered jews that committed crimes? The answer should still be yes, you don't get to defend classes of people conditioned entirely upon every single one of them being saints, if you do that you don't actually protect anyone who you apply that condition to. If someone was to claim that that trans person shot the kids and teachers because they're trans I would shout them down as a bigot as is right. People condemning the actions of that shooter aren't bigoted though, but those who attribute a flaw in moral character to their membership in an immutable class of people is not to be tolerated.
Star Trek has been openly pro-trans since AT LEAST TNG. Transphobes trying to use their characters for their memes is so idiotic, it's almost hilarious.
@@pathevermore3683There was the episode about the nonbinary race tho. In a way it represented trans people but I've always had mixed feelings about it
@@pathevermore3683 In addition to the whole episode about that person who knew she was a woman in spite of her people not wanting her to live as a woman, Data supported his child choosing which gender to live as.
Star Trek has always been ahead of the times, even the original series; not always where it should be sure, but you have to judge it for when it came out. Sometimes it was driven by the cast, as the studio execs were a little... hesitant. Old story, but Shatner intentionally messed up all the takes of the scene where he and Uhura kiss where you can't properly see the kiss, so the execs would have no choice but to use the one that showed it.
@SarahSloan-lt8vw”I could care less” you stalk around this comment section all the time repeating the exact same bullshit to everyone everywhere, it’s pretty damn obvious you care. If you really didn’t care you’d fuck off.
If you called a trans woman a 'he' back then you'd just get laugh at for not knowing what a woman or man was (and there was trans people back then - they were the gender they lived & were unquestioned as such).
@@aoikuma2337achielles and his partner, sappho and her partner are the first two i can think of (the latter is literally the origin of the word “lesbian”)
7:29 the thing is, elliot looks dead inside and unhappy in that pre-transition photo. i'd recognize that "i'm trying so hard to just be cis" look anywhere.
True. But to these jackasses it is more important that someone looks conventionally attractive to them and smiles. They don't really care if the people they talk about are genuinely happy either way. They're looking to score points.
Yeah, I noticed that too. It’s like that one song Stranger In A Photograph by Tom Henrik: “she wears a dress, the perfect girl, they say she’s beautiful. But when I look at her I see it’s sad but true that she’s not real; she was just an illusion”
I saw it more as like, if you take a picture of someone on the best day of their miserable life of over 30 years, and compare it to a picture of their worst day in 5 years of living happily, you’ll make it seem like they prefer being miserable
A school "friend" of mine once ranted about intersex people being "disgusting and deformed", then got mad at me for telling them to shut up. Some other people from our class even came to comfort her. That's my supposed friend group, dear fellow lifeforms... Grrr
That's ableist AND queerphobic. Nobody should be described as "deformed". It's dehumanizing and othering for people with disabilities, myself included.
As a union 69 representative of the L with my co-rep. (My wife) we officially would like to put out a statement for the L community. We (as the L in LGBTQ+) do not condone trans exclusion, or attacks on any other parts of the queer community based on their sexuality or gender identity. Please don't market yourself as a representative of the L (we assume the G&B community leaders feel the same way) without the express written consent from your union leaders. Thanks 😂 P.S. we assume your union dues are in the mail. We can't find many of you trans exclusionist on the members list and as such we cannot confirm you as a active member of the L (or G & B) community until you have paid your back owed dues and submitted a updated application with you local LGBTQ recruitment office. Have the life you deserve.
The two trans women going to women's hell: pleasantly say hello to the other women in hell, are likely the first pleasant and kind people the other women in women's hell for a while The Transphobe who drew that: Hurrhurrhurr I drew them facial hair and that makes them bad isn'T MEETING PLEASANT, FRIENDLY TRANS PEOPLE IN HELL TERRIBLE?!?!
Shes spending her time arguing with other idiots, rather than responding to the intelligent participants in the debate?? That says a lot. Can she even begin to engage with the serious points made by Dr. Ann Loutfi? Instead of scouring the internet for trash right now, doing the youth yet another disservice. Memes do not represent the reality, its comedy, or its trash, with a million interpretations: maybe the point being made was that the youth used to have it hard and now have it so easy they lose their grip on reality. Or think they can gaslight other grownups into denying facts. Lots of females become unsafe if men can legally enter their private spaces (changing rooms, shelters, prisons, sports) because some males will lie, exploit the gaslighting happening, and rape them. Its not about memes and its narcy to belittle and make comedy of the repression of women's right to female only spaces. Jamie. Does. Not. Care. About. Others. The videos are completely self serving. When I raise an issue on her video she says she will block me, yet actively seeks out dumb arguments to seem superior. Its the behaviour of a narc. Someone with issues. Its a problem to young people watching. And no one with any level of self awareness cares about being called a transphobe -- its a smear put upon anyone that seeks to set boundaries between males and females in the interest of safety. Its a manifestation of bullying, censorship and pressure to submit to narcissistic grandiosity. Its the grown up version of calling me a chicken on the playground because i wont play your ugly game. Females having access to spaces absent of males is really not even to do with trans; your right to throw your fist stops at the point of someone's nose. Get over it.
lol they're also forgetting that elliott is an actor. neither of those pictures are necessarily reflective of his actual emotional state, *he's trained to show emotions on his face that aren't necessarily what he's feeling in the moment*
I am cis lesbian and I have a trans brother and several trans friends, I can say our friends group is very accepting and diverse. So I think you are right, I haven't seen many transphobes at pride but I have seen a lot of homophobic and transphobic bigotry outside of pride
Actually the Greek gladiators were not slaves at least in the beginning. That was a Roman thing. The Romans then enslaved the Greeks and forced them to produce gladiators and physicians for those gladiators. In Greece the Gladiators were treated like athletes and were referred to as the Champions of the Gods. When they passed they would make shrines in their honour. It was a profession, a career that many men strived for in Greece. They were cared for extremely well in every way. However...when the Romans took over the sport, that's when things got really bad for them. They went from heroes and legends to slaves and fodder. Then it just became only a slave/blood sport. It did not start that way though. Sorry...I love history stuff. I'll shut up now.
As a enby _and_ bi/pan/whatever-you-wanna-call-it, I swear on my honor: the whole “lgb without the t” thing is gonna be like that one tweet about NFT’s as soon as bi people realize we were never gonna be accepted by those weirdos and we were just being used to oppress trans people: “In hindsight, it was easy to say in the end that (lgb no t) was a scam, but in fairness it was also easy to say at the start, and in the middle of it to.”
Omg non binary has an abbreviation?! How have I never known this lol. In all my life I’ve never heard of that. As a proud ally I shall cherish this new information
Oh gosh, the Women's Hell comic is from Sinfest. A venerable and formerly well-loved webcomic that took a *hard* turn into a confused jumble of transphobic fascist nonsense. Honestly one of the biggest sources of bile fascination on the web.
As a side note on the topic of trans teens in Ancient Rome, more people need to hear about Egalibus, the Trans Teenage Emperor of Rome. Egalibus was amab and took the throne at only 12 years old. In spite of the protests of her advisors and others, Egalibus preferred to dress in women's clothing and be addressed using feminine terms. Like Hatshepsut before her, after Egalibus's death, most records of her life and reign were destroyed, but just enough survived for us to learn at least a little bit about her. And before anyone says it, I know it's difficult verging on impossible to apply modern terms about gender and sexuality to historical people, but based on the few records we have of Egalibus, it certainly seems like transgender would at least be the closest modern equivalent.
@@robokill387 well, considering the modern basis of the plastic surgeries being in skin grafting, and how early forms of it are mentioned in India(mostly to deal with the punitive nose amputation) It would be riskier just on account of a lack of antibiotics, but we're also talking a about a time with an expectedly high mortality rate for that factor. Just saying, not totally impossible. Just highly unlikely to actually achieve.
Um? That's not a question that we were discussing. The point I was making is that she was seeking one, not that it would have been possible at the time.
Hey, I know this story gets passed around a lot. But it's worth remembering that the one source we have on Elagabalus that mentions this is incredibly hostile to him (I'm using him because, as far as we can tell, that's the way he presented himself in most contexts.) You have to remember that Elagabalus massively pissed off the senatorial class. He was from the middle east and hugely upset the traditional roman religious landscape by trying to import the cult of Elagabalus, the god after which he was named and of which he was the hereditary priest, into Rome. (I'm talking "this is the new supreme god and all the other gods are lesser or married to this god and we should move all the holy objects of the other gods to his temple".) The sources also do describe him as having sex with men where he was the bottom partner, which would also have been seen as very unmanly, although of course this might also be a malicious rumour. Portraying Elagabalus as "so depraved that he wanted to become a woman and started dressing as one!" fit in with a lot of stereotypes his opponents could use: the effeminate oriental, from a culture with temple prostitutes and priests who castrated themselves for their strange gods, who was so far removed from manly decency he'd even let other men have sex with him and sought to be their wife. The portrayal just fits in a little too well with the sort of slander that would be thrown his way by the traditional factions. I also think it's really important to note that elagabalus was a teenager. A teenager who was thrust into the highest political office in the world at the time (if child stars get fucked up, imagine what that'll do!) While some teens can figure out they're transgender (I did), for many this is a very confusing time if they have any sort of queer feelings. I don't think we can know how Elagabalus would have identified nowadays, since if the rumours are based on anything he could have been a trans woman, or genderflluid, or nonbinary, or gay and a crossdresser, or just a gay man (with the accusations being meant to show how unmanly he was.) And it just sits ill to project a fixed identity on him you know? I think it's safest to use male pronouns and his male name for him, since on inscriptions and coins and such he clearly kept up male presentation, and allow that there is a distinct possibility he was some form of queer, though it's impossible to know what he would have been. Applying the label transgender in any definite way just sits uneasy with me, you know?
@@alicev5496imo applying the majority of the labels we use today on people in ancient times just doesn’t fit that well - not because there weren’t trans people or something, there most definitely were - but because the understanding of gender/sexuality and what not back then was probably different enough from today that our modern terms just can’t encapsulate it accurately, but also it is important to have historic figures that show queerness isn’t a new thing, so i think the best thing in this type of situation is to estimate them as adjacent to one of our terms - such as “most likely not cis,” without specificity, because we just don’t have enough information to be specific - so in this case, it would just make sense (to me at least) to refer to them using they/them
@21:44 Even if B stood for just being attracted to exactly two genders or even exactly women and men, then "The B in LGBT prooves that non-binary people don't exist" argument would be equivalent to "The L in LGBT prooves that men don't exist".
The "THIS is the future LEFTISTS WANT for our HOMES" meme was DEFINITELY made by a left winger, it gives off so much ironic energy and it's actually really funny
4:02 The creator of this meme is also historically illiterate. Gladiators were SLAVES. They did not want to fight other people/animals to death for some rich peoples entertainment, they were forced to do this for a chance to be freed from slavery. They certainly did not like this either, as there were rebellions such as the War of Spartacus
Not all gladiators were slaves. Some gladiators were free men (and occasionally women) who did choose a career as a gladiator. They were paid moeny for it, and the more successful ones were treated like celebrities, similar to modern wrestling champions. They were legally allowed to quit whenever they wanted. It was a job like any other. Slaves, convicted criminals and POWs were also forced to fight as gladiators, but gladiators weren't all slaves by definition.
@@Andromedaaa_spelling*. grammar is how words are put together to make a sentence, spelling is how letters are put together to make a word i’m really sorry, i had to💀
@@scdl-m2z This would not be about spelling. True the two words are spelt differently, but they are both still correct. It is grammatically incorrect to use the plural version of the word in that sentence. Not a spelling error, a grammatical one.
Did they not read the part where gladiator training was also often very gay? Or that in a lot of those cultures it was strange to NOT be bi/pansexual??
Well, not really, the "gayness" of ancient Rome and Greece is exaggerated. LGBT people existed, yes, but it wasn't everyone, or even the majority. They were more accepting and enlightened than say, 19th century England, but not compared to today.
@@robokill387 wait till you learn about apollo and homosexuality was heavily supported and sometimes even advised for moral purposes (for military groups)
Hmm, 60 BC, huh? Note that for the purposes of this, I am using "third gender" to refer to either intersex, transgender, or both. The Ancient Hebrew word "טומטום" or "hidden" is used in Jewish Rabbinic literature to refer to third gender type people. The Ancient Romans referred to third gender as "gallus" with "galli" being the plural. The Ancient Greeks argued a lot about how many genders there are. The number varied between 3 to 7 depending on if you count “fluid” and “uncertain” and as distinct categories, which the Ancient Greeks did. Only 2 genders was never an option for the Ancient Greeks. Aristotle was firmly in the "there are only 3 genders" camp: masculine, feminine, and “in between” (μεταξύ). Then of course there's their deity Hermaphrodite which was seen as both and neither and inbetween all at the same time. People absolutely had the language back then. It was squashed by the spread of Christofascism which is absolutely not a new phenomenon.
@@artikulv731 FYI: the term "Two-Spirit" is a modern word that was coined in 1990 in my hometown of Winnipeg by a meeting of First Nations LGBTQA+ people to represent us. It was created at the Third Intertribal First Nations, Native American Gay & Lesbian Conference (yeah, clunky-af name. LOL) to replace the problematic word "berdache", which was a French word that essentially meant catamite (a "bum-boy") because not all people who are outside the binary are gay men. Our Tribes have recognized genders beyond the binary for hundreds, if not thousands or years. My own Tribe, the Eastern Cree (we call ourselves Inowak. Cree was an outsider's name for us) recognized four genders at base: masculine male, feminine male, masculine female & feminine female. So don't go assuming the term "Two-Spirit" is ancient, because it is not.
I love Jamie’s rant about 60 BC teens in arranged marriages. Also most Greco/Roman peoples, men weren’t allowed to marry until after their military service or 30 years old, so no longer teens.
Plus many gladiators were prisoners of war and violent criminals, forced to fight for their captors' entertainment. That meme creator would apparently rather their teen boys not just go to war, but be *captured by the other side and forced to fight each other, murderers, and underfed wild animals, to death.*
The one with Elliot Page looking "worse for wear" after transitioning really gets to me... So many people just don't get that you can look happy on the outside and be a massive wreck (or even suicidal) inside. They want you to pretend you're happy, and then they happily assume you ARE. And god forbid you ever tell them you were pretending, cause obviously they know better. 🤦
Elliot is an actor, I've been told that is a scene so he has to act miserable. Its like taking a shot of any of the actors at Tony's funeral scene in avengers and saying they are depressed.
@@cryochick9044 That was from an interview where he was talking about, ironically, the pain of being a closeted trans man. The second the conversation shifts from that he lights up, and there's no shortage of recent photos of him absolutely beaming with joy.
@@cryochick9044 uh.. maybe do some research on these things before you accept whatever the hell some random says like you're taking a piece of drug infused blade candy 🤦
I had overheard a homophobe say that gay people didn’t exist before the 2000s and my mom said “My aunt is 65 and she’s a lesbian.” First time hearing my mom say something that isn’t offensive or hateful.
21:51 Fun fact, in botany plants that have male and female reproductive organs on the same flower are referred to as 'perfect bisexual', which in my opinion as a bisexual person is a pretty good way to refer to bisexual people in general. Although I might be a bit bi-ased 👉👉💙💜❤
Hey Jamie, just wanted to say that when I got a resources document from my trans health clinic you were the first source and link when the "influencers"(I think) part came up. I was so happy cause I have been watching your videos for a few months and it's just cool to see you in actual docs
I'm going to say the same thing as I say to others when people use "snowflake" and "sensitive" as an insult.. Its always hypocritical cos the moment they hear anything disagreeing with their world view, they react super strongly and get very upset and angry. It *always* seems to be self-projection.
Shes spending her time arguing with other idiots, rather than responding to the intelligent participants in the debate?? That says a lot. Can she even begin to engage with the serious points made by Dr. Ann Loutfi? Instead of scouring the internet for trash right now, doing the youth yet another disservice. Memes do not represent the reality, its comedy, or its trash, with a million interpretations: maybe the point being made was that the youth used to have it hard and now have it so easy they lose their grip on reality. Or think they can gaslight other grownups into denying facts. Lots of females become unsafe if men can legally enter their private spaces (changing rooms, shelters, prisons, sports) because some males will lie, exploit the gaslighting happening, and rape them. Its not about memes and its narcy to belittle and make comedy of the repression of women's right to female only spaces. Jamie. Does. Not. Care. About. Others. The videos are completely self serving. When I raise an issue on her video she says she will block me, yet actively seeks out dumb arguments to seem superior. Its the behaviour of a narc. Someone with issues. Its a problem to young people watching. And no one with any level of self awareness cares about being called a transphobe -- its a smear put upon anyone that seeks to set boundaries between males and females in the interest of safety. Its a manifestation of bullying, censorship and pressure to submit to narcissistic grandiosity. Its the grown up version of calling me a chicken on the playground because i wont play your ugly game. Females having access to spaces absent of males is really not even to do with trans; your right to throw your fist stops at the point of someone's nose. Get over it.
Transphobic people: Trans people are such SNOWFLAKES. I can't even use the wrong pronouns or tell them that they're horrible people that should kill themselves without them getting a little annoyed! 😂 Also Transphobic people: STOP SAYING THINGS I DON'T LIKE!! 😢😢😢 THIS SCIENTIFIC STUDY THAT LITERALLY PROVES TRANS PEOPLE EXIST IS FAKE!!! 😡😡😡🤬🤬🤬😠😠👿😭😢😨😰😭😭😭😭
These were all just frustratingly stupid, but I was especially frustrated by the "actual doctor" meme. Cis gender people do things, remove and add, to affirm their gender, too. Laser hair removal? Breast augmentations? Liposuction, circumcisions, all of those tweeks, nips and tucks? These are methods modern medicine have made possible for people to feel more like theirselves. People were trans long before they could get affirming surgeries, but thankfully we nowadays have the knowledge and methods to help people who benefit from medical transitioning.
@@Gdr5928 it literally isn’t. Cosmetic means “just for looks”; no one getting a sex change is doing it “just for looks”. Would you call a skin graft cosmetic?
@@Gdr5928 it literally isn’t though. It’s medically necessary for those that get it. Saying they have a “functioning body” while ignoring the harm said body is causing them proves that you don’t view mental health as being important; you’re only concerned with the physical ability to reproduce (which is gross btw). If you had something like a disfiguration, would you not want to get it corrected if you could? No, it’s not just for looks
Just have to say this... transitioning is literally saving my life. Dont know where i heard this one but i love it : transitioning wont solve my problems but it will make my problems worth solving
@@tyrnanreply958 check out informed consent clinics. Seriously, all it took for me was a one hour conversation online with the prescribing doctor and I had my prescription for estrogen and finasteride. No previous counciling or anything. Just a lifetime of knowing deep inside that this is what I want and need. Good luck to you! 😁✌🏻
love the "TQIA+" being depicted with a gender non-conforming person. i guess being asexual is a gender thing now! wish someone would've told me earlier so i could update my understanding of myself as double genderqueer LMAO
The Elliot Page meme made me so mad because I just finished his memoir (fantastic read get Pageboy in local bookstores) and he went through SO MUCH AWFUL STUFF before he transitioned so it's really super hateful and bigoted to assume that he was "so much happier as a woman"
@@starscreamthecruel8026 Honestly the more I read about DnD it makes me think that the Christian Heaven is just a lair of Mindflayers. We are all slave to the Elder brain, but we don't know we are slaves. We enjoy being slaves to the brain, and serving it forever....
Heaven is when we all move onto the next life and all the bigots go to hell so we don't have to deal with them any more. We can all just live as our true selves in peace without anyone being like "but I don't like it"
Something funny regarding the trans people in sports arguement. I do powerlifting at my highschool and i work out with two trans men. They are the same strength as me, a cis dude. And the second strongest person on the team is a woman. Gender doesn’t matter in sports just your dedication.
There have been some studies in the athletic performance of trans vs cis athletes, and results were mostly similar! Trans women regained about a 10% average advantage in running speed, and trans men outperformed cis men in the sit-ups category!
@@Gdr5928 They don't lol. Why do you think they keep segregating the genders in sports? They know the truth and they're terrified of seeing it proven in real time: men are not stronger than women. Seriously. Sports were not segregated until recently. Every time a woman won, they segregated that specific sport until barely any were left. When competing on a professional level, this is the only thing that matters: all athletes are stronger than all non-athletes.
4:44 "Inside you there are two greeks, one incredibly buff from sparta, able to kill a bear unarmed. One from Athens, capable of writing poems and stories that will be read 2000 years into the future. Both of them are gay"
Shes spending her time arguing with other idiots, rather than responding to the intelligent participants in the debate?? That says a lot. Can she even begin to engage with the serious points made by Dr. Ann Loutfi? Instead of scouring the internet for trash right now, doing the youth yet another disservice. Memes do not represent the reality, its comedy, or its trash, with a million interpretations: maybe the point being made was that the youth used to have it hard and now have it so easy they lose their grip on reality. Or think they can gaslight other grownups into denying facts. Lots of females become unsafe if men can legally enter their private spaces (changing rooms, shelters, prisons, sports) because some males will lie, exploit the gaslighting happening, and rape them. Its not about memes and its narcy to belittle and make comedy of the repression of women's right to female only spaces. Jamie. Does. Not. Care. About. Others. The videos are completely self serving. When I raise an issue on her video she says she will block me, yet actively seeks out dumb arguments to seem superior. Its the behaviour of a narc. Someone with issues. Its a problem to young people watching. And no one with any level of self awareness cares about being called a transphobe -- its a smear put upon anyone that seeks to set boundaries between males and females in the interest of safety. Its a manifestation of bullying, censorship and pressure to submit to narcissistic grandiosity. Its the grown up version of calling me a chicken on the playground because i wont play your ugly game
9:27 As a genderfluid person, not to brag but I got to have more than one gender throughout my life! Sometimes even two at once! Seriously though, the amount of genders someone has had in their life doesn't make them better or worse than someone who has had a different number of genders. Having had only one gender or more than one gender isn't as important as being happy with the gender(s) you identify as.
What does that even mean? Liking and doing different things, day by day, typical for one sex or another doesn't make you gender fluid. You're simply being human.
I read an article on pink news today about the British angling (as in fishing with one of those poles) pulled out of the world cup because a trans woman competed. I still can't believe what I read
I mean, trans women have been banned from women's *chess* for some reason. Can we stop pretending it's a genuine concern with trans women's supposed superior physical strength now?
Love Jamie's take on these ❤🏳️🌈 So mad on Elliot's behalf! Also I'm fairly sure the miserable 'after' pic is actually an acted scene, so he wasn't even miserable irl at the time
The one commenting on Elliot...you have to look really hard to find an image of Elliot now without a massive smile on his face. Such an obviously manipulated take!
So, Gladiators, for the most part where there as slaves, and didn't go home. They lived in the colosseum and most would die there unless presented with a wooden sword to mean that they're free to go.
About trans men in mens sports, there are as far as I know fewer trans men in professional/competitive sport than there are trans women, this is because in a lot of countries testosterone is seen as a performance enhancing drug, automatically disqualifying any trans man on HRT.. :P Don't quote me on this tho, I am not very sport-wise! XD
@@expiredahhmilk Absolutely! :O I personally think that those rules should be updated to include trans men, but I'm not entirely sure how they'd do that while still keeping those who actually use testosterone as a performance enhancing drug out of the sport.. 😅
A person I was talking with made a transphobic comment in reference to an article titled “He’s Him” in reference to a cis male athlete. After the conversation, I thought that I should’ve said, “Oh, it’s cool to see a trans man play [sport]” and watch their head explode.
@@MojitoMousemaybe allowing a specific range of testosterone levels in competitions, one more normative to AMAB people’s natural levels? that might have its own problems, though
I say, just let trans people play. It's impossible to have a completely even playing field because everyone is different. If you're a trans man on T and you're on a normal dose that is prescribed by a doctor, you should get to play.
I will never understand the argument that the label bisexual means there are only 2 genders. That's like saying that the word bilingual existing means there's only 2 languages.
Bi (two) + sexual (of the sexes) "First used of sexuality in Richard von Krafft-Ebing's 1886 Psychopathia Sexualis (in German) and Charles Gilbert Chaddock's 1892 English translation thereof, due to the theory that people were naturally attracted to the opposite sex and so the brain or mind of a person attracted to "both" sexes (or to the same sex) must be partly of another sex and thus 'hermaphroditic'."
@@chiseledcheese clearly you missed my point. Bilingual means fluent in 2 languages, but that doesn't invalidate the existence of other languages. (It's not a perfect comparison since bisexuality is typically defined either as attraction to two or more genders, or attraction to both people of the same gender as you and people of different genders. But even if you do take bisexual to mean attracted to 2 genders, that doesn't mean that only two genders exist.)
@@sia9907 *pat pat* Hey you don't have to brag that you failed biology. Sex is a bimodal distribution, actually. Intersex by definition doesn't fit into those two categories. As for gender, it can be wherever on the spectrum. Also "male" and "female" are sexes, not genders
@@sia9907 no they're not. They're are legally neither sex. I less their parents force them to get reassignment surgery when they come out of the womb, which is disgusting and irate.
Not sure why this one got me. I’ve watched many, but hearing Jamie say “been my gender my whole life” multiple time really hit me. I have been my gender my whole life but (big trigger warning for child A**se and neglect) my biological parents did all they could to change me. They were so awful that my case ranks as one of the worst in my state. My father alone committed crimes agains myself and my siblings that landed him in jail. I’ve lived through a lot and made it through with Grace and joy. It took over 30 years of healing to get to where I am, but I am happy to say I found myself again and those people failed at pulling me down! My father is six feet under now and I know nothing about my mother. I have great adopted parents now who care for me and love me as I am. They are my true parents and though it took me a decade to find them, and I had to walk through hell to get there I am so happy now. Joy is a state of being, not a constant emotional state. You can feel sad and still have the joy inside of finding who you are.
I'm so glad you met your real, adoptive parents. I'm glad you made it and I'm glad you're happy now! It may not seem like much but when you share your survival, it helps the younger of us have more reason to believe that our own survival is possible, so I really appreciate you sharing.
Hang on, so by the meme's logic: women hate other women, but they like Dylan because she's like "one of the girls." So wouldn't that mean they'd also have to hate her? You know I'm beginning to think these talking points aren't well thought out.
One of the biggest anti-arguments i’ve heard is you can’t change who you are just accept it. Yes that’s what I’m doing. I’m accepting what I am by telling you. By vocalizing it outwardly, I’m not hiding it. Yes the word What is very important in that sentence.
@@SammyLammy1D I mean I'm pretty sure to fight you couldn't be a free roman citizen, and you could make a lot of money and get a lot of social attention. But I'm not an expert on the whole period of ancient Rome- so we could both be Right for different points in history
People who call our younger generation "soft and snowflake" are the same people who got triggered by the Barbie Movie 😅 I just can't with those old conservatives
@SarahSloan-lt8vwCome on, can you really not see that you’re blatantly disrespecting others just because of something they decided to chose for themselves? I thought the older generations were the ones that spoke out about respect, well then why don’t we respect each other and treat each other like people instead of purposely saying things that do nothing except destroy your own credibility?
People only call Jammie a woman because he’s gone on record and came out as transmasc Seriously. If they didn’t know he was trans I doubt they’d even notice anything. I myself had no idea until I saw him confirm it in a video
No I call her a woman because that is her sex. Even if sex and gender are different sex is still a thing and we have used male and female as descriptors of sex since the dawn of civilization so for me to call Jammi female isn’t wrong even if Jammi is also male
My experiences with grandmas in Germany has been basically universally positive. It blows my mind to see people here mostly take the position of "I don't understand it, but I'm glad you're being yourself". So many people share this opinion, young and old here. It's not true everywhere in Germany, and there are bigots everywhere, but when large international health organizations and the national community of health professionals are for trans-affirming care, then the people seem to accept it too. Something about more trust in the systems.
As a professor of Roman history, I can tell you there were definitely trans people in ancient Rome: one example (of many) are the Galli, a priestesshood of trans women dedicated to the goddess Cybele who used she/her pronouns. (Many of us teach about them now. 👍) And thank you for all the awesome content, Jammie!
“Don’t know your gender?” I do know my gender. Got confused for a bit, pretended to be a guy for a decade or two, but I know I’m a girl. “Check inside your pants” One second…looks like a penis. She gets in the way sometimes but I don’t mind her. “Don’t like your gender? Get over it you can’t change it” Oh good, I was afraid I’d be able to change my gender to that of s guy. Glad you’re affirming my existence as a woman who happens to have a penis
I'm a trans guy but I appreciate the vibe of using she/her pronouns for your stuff. I see some people use the term "hen" because it's the female equivalent of "*ock". 🐤🐤 I wonder then if the trans guy equivalent of a "p**sy" is a tomcat?
@@Queer_Nerd_For_Human_Justice I mean, a dick is just a clitoris that was exposed to a lot of testosterone. I'm AMAB, so I have an outie, and as a nonbinary person, I discovered that calling it both of the 4 letter C words interchangeably helped me with that dysphoria. I just call trans guys' junk dicks or other phallic terms. 😅
"Yes, there is evidence of people who might be identified as transgender in ancient times, well before 60 BC. For example, in ancient Sumer, Akkadia, Greece, and Rome, there were priests known as gala and galli who were assigned male at birth but crossed gender boundaries in their worship of various goddesses" hell yea
