"i shudder at the thought of hbox drill resting me at 50, but he won't do that for the next 5 years" lmfao juan saving melee every day by being years behind on technology, truly a hero
Drill into rest is a common Puff kill confirm in Ult, so Hbox would definitely jump at the chance to use it in Melee if he knew it was good against certain characters. We need to enjoy this while it lasts.
The crazy thing is that he drill rests in ult all the time, and had a briefly viral clip in 2021 where he got a drill rest in Melee But yeah he doesn't seem willing to fully lab out when it can work out in melee, he only practices by playing actual matches
Honestly this is a surprisingly optimistic matchup chart. Granted I'm nowhere close to being a pro, but I honestly would've thought that Yoshi and Pika would've been 50/50, so it's interesting to hear why a pro Marth player thinks that they aren't.
I think this is the greatest sign that melee is still alive, because amsa and I think axe as well think their characters beat marth. Seeing diverse opinions in pros just means the game is that far from being solved
Personally, from what I've seen, not only is Yoshi punish game is good on Marth but Marth biggest problem against Yoshi is that he has a pretty slow attack speed when compared to Fox and Sheik, and that makes it far easier for Amsa to super armor and counter almost anything Marth does. I think the match up is 50-50, but I could see either character slightly better than the other.
I think if puff players utilize more options instead of being in the air somuch to get caught by side B uptilts they might turn the MU even or even slightly puff favored, but thats just from seeing what non-puff mains can do with the character. Puff is generally underutilized in certain MUs.
I am definitely exaggerating when I say that but when you have a clear MU advantage, melee can snowball pretty hard and that's why it's in my instinct to say that.
I'm pretty sure the matchup ratio usually means the odds that one character will win a game, not a set. So, if you're winning 60% of your games, you should be winning more sets than 60%. I don't want to do the math right now for what the probabilities would be for a Bo5 where each game has a 60% chance of winning...
@@matthewthompson8625 can use an online binomial calculator! If there's a 60% chance to win a game, you have a 65% chance to win a Bo3 and a 68% chance to win a Bo5 That said, I tend to agree with mahik! A 60:40 matchup traditionally means that with best play from both sides, the favored character should win 60% of their matches. This makes sense in context since stage counter-picking factors into matchup spreads! I think a lot of matchup charts are weird - I don't see a mario player who is as good at mario as zain is at marth beating zain in 40% of the time in bracket.
thats the thing. Their punish kinda caps vs marth because his weird weight. You never hear this argument against sheik cuz she's perfect combo weight for spacies. Usually if you hear "reversal" in a convo between melee players, its probably referring to Marth. It cannot be overstated, spacies can DIE for trying to go in a balls deep combo vs Marth. Then on top of that, stages matter quite abit. Not pleasant when the spacie MIGHT have a good stage in Yoshi's or DL but it depends on their playstyle, whereas Marth has a free win on FD, a semi FD in Stadium, and a potential FD mini on FoD and the fact most spacies don't really like FoD cuz u know, fuck that stage..
Falcon touch you and you’re dead. Plain and simple. Marths lack of hard hitting moves makes it harder to finish off stocks. While Falcon has a bad recovery, his aerial drift is tricky for Marth to hit because even with big hitboxes, you need to be more precise than many characters since your moves don’t last as long as theirs (and does not hit as hard). Falcon can edgeguard Marth easily when he has to with ledge regrabs, knees and back air even though most of the time, he doesn’t have to edgeguard since Marth dies at 70% from a stomp knee, random knee, grab knee etc. Marth’s bread and butter does not work as well as other matchups (dtilt and fair are not very effective) Falcon keeps jumping over dtilt and punish. Or his CC grab game against Marths fair is too strong because of his quick dash and his weight. Marths need to do more nair. Also, Falcon is better at getting grabs (speed, buttgrab) AND punish harder than Marth does in this MU Obviously, in melee, the better player will often win but among the top tiers, Falcon and Sheik are the biggest threat to Marths
@@TheBeggies95 those are very fair points, but most of my falcon friends say its slightly marth favored simply cuz "yeah i can kill him, but can I get to THE POINT in which I an kill him?" Its like the many lower tiers that can 0 to death spacies, but spacies still win cuz they win hard on neutral. Same concept, just less extreme in Falcon v Marth.
You list all these downsides vs sheik then say its only 45-55. Shits way too rough for that. And I feel ganon has a better marth MU than that hes one of ganons better top tiers. Surprised yoshi and pika arent even if not winning vs marth with how impossible it feels to kill
@@chefoil3045 You have every right to hate Marth lmao I you ever need to stay positive during a game against Marth, just remember Luigi has a decent punish game on him
@@youri7229 Out of curiosity, which matchup do you hate the most as Ganon? Also good shit for playing Ganon, he was always one of my favorite character to watch
