Shunning in the Church | My story: where I’ve been and where I am now | part 2 |live Q&A  

Thanks for sharing your story, Alana. You are an inspiration and encouragement to my family. We had some horrible experience with folks in the Reformed Baptist Church we attended. Like many who have left Calvinism, we discovered how our hearts become soft, tender and loving once we return to the true God of the Bible. God bless you, Hector & your children. He is our Healer and our Strength. 🙏🙌

I am so blessed that the majority of my friends from the church we left have continued as friends. There have been a few who cut me dead (this includes our old pastor) when we are in the same vicinity. My niece became a Jehovahs witness several years ago. When her daughter got married, we went to the wedding. I saw my nephew standing outside by the door watching the service. We signaled to him to sit by us, but he sadly shook his head. I thought we would have time to talk to him at the reception, but he wasn’t there. In confusion I asked my sister what was going on and she told me he was being shunned. When my son got killed they all came to the memorial service and my nephew told me with tears in his eyes that it was the first time in 4 years he had been in the same room with his mother. I can’t even imagine. The blessing is it has opened him up to spend time with the Christian side of our family and he is listening.

"By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another" John 13:35

Thank you for sharing your story. It truly has helped me in my healing process of shunning with no closure at this time with a beloved sister who is reformed. But, the beauty from ashes is how incredible faithful our Lord has been to me. He has helped me mature in Him. I so resonate with the crazy making and even now occasionally get triggered by thoughts Satan puts there to derail me. But His Spirit has helped me find the way of escape and there truly is the peace and joy on the other side. My dear sister in Christ, keeping shining for Christ through your content. I too look forward to the day when Christ comes back and sin, shame, all suffering will cease in the universe…all that will perish. Hugs and much love and gratefulness for you.

Church hurt is one of the most difficult, painful experiences. It is heartbreaking when there is so much division between brothers and sisters in Christ. We are supposed to be united in Christ. Sadly, so many are blinded to the fact that causing division in the church is a tactic of the enemy. Instead of going out and being the hands and feet of Christ, we waste so much time in conflict with our fellow brothers and sisters. What a difference it would make if we instead kept our eyes truly on Christ and strived to be the followers He called us to be. Thank you for your video. Though the Lord has carried our family through our particular church hurt situation and helped us heal, your video was encouraging. I know it will be helpful to those going through the difficult experience of church hurt.

Oh my. Heart breaks for what y’all have, and are going through. My bride of 48 years and myself are currently in a Calvinist congregation and are praying about what to do. I’m currently able to throw out the Calvinist / Reformed teaching as scraps, and keep basic conservative cross centric truths. However, I’m sure this will become more difficult as we travel along the TULIP path. I pray for you and your family to stay strong and for God to offer comfort during this season. FYI….You are an encouragement to me and I’m sure many others.

I forget if I've mentioned this before, but you were a HUGE breathe of fresh air when I was attending my former Calvinistic assembly a few years ago. Though I didn't believe the Calvinistic doctrines, I certainly felt the corporate gaslighting that made me question my sanity. I knew a great many things were off about what they were teaching, but I just couldn't put my finger on the specifics at the time. And being that I was the ONLY person at my church who believed differently and spoke up against it made me often question whether I truly believed the Bible in a correct way. "How can my ENTIRE church believe FOUNDATIONAL things that are so different than me? Could it be that I'M the crazy one here? How is it that NO ONE ELSE sees this?" At one point, I was brought to the end of my rope, and I was faced with a choice: [I can just accept my church's teachings and from that point onward just accept internally that I have literally NO basis for truth (because I knew deep down their teachings were contradictive) and effectively shipwreck my faith], or [I can act in faith and courage to stand on the Rock of Scripture and reject their teachings as I hold fast to the Word of Truth]. I said to myself and to God, "If I'm the ONLY person on planet earth who believes the true gospel, then so be it; I have nothing if I don't have the truth, and I have no where left to go if I do not have the Lord's words of eternal life." Shortly thereafter, I came across your, Mr Flowers', and Mr Thompson's channels and saw that there were others who believe the true gospel. I wasn't alone!! *HUGELY sighs in relief* Your videos and testimonies were a huge help, so thank you! And I too am still healing after several years of gaslighting, so you're not alone in regard to the lingering effects. Blessings for you and your family!

It is so hard. It leaves you wondering if all their loving actions were a lie. The best part is GOD will fill your life with real friends once the fake ones leave.❤

I really hate how you were treated. ❤ Calvinist are staunch and believe others are wrong. In the church eyes....you may have been accused of heresy. You aren't! They think you leaving was an attack on them. It wasn't. I am so sorry that your friends all those years shunned you. You weren't causing problems or being divisive or a gossip. ❤ Sending love. Thank you for sharing.

I have experienced shunning as well, and it is extremely painful. A woman pastor once told me my husband could still continue attending her church, but I wasn’t welcome, because I told her she was wrong about my being currently involved in witchcraft. I had respected her and had loved going to church, so when she came up with this false accusation, I hurt for a long time, until I decided it had appeared to me that she was a leader from God but wasn’t actually qualified to preach let alone falsely accuse me. I’m totally fine now, because I know I’m right with God. God is the only person’s opinion I care about in that situation. It’s so painful when people slander you to disqualify what you have to say.

People dont like having their BS called out.. systems, if they have legs, should be able to deal with scrutiny. Bless you for standing on what you believe and making the sacrifiices

Great live Alana. I have PA Dutch in my family and shunning is done outside of the church and even within families. It’s heartbreaking and undoubtedly not from God! However what is not for you God will not have you sit in forever. Our Lord Jesus Christ will carry you through this storm keep clinging to Him 💕 and God bless you for speaking up about this hurtful act done to others

So sorry you are going through this!! You have been such a role model for me for the past 6/7 years!! God bless you guys 🩵

I wish that you were my neighbor/lived close by. It would be so nice to have someone to talk to one on one who absolutely understands what I have been feeling. I am a church refugee at this point in time.

I agree with you that a person with a soft open heart and open ear, willing to work through issues should not be shunned.

Thank you for continuing to be such a blessing to the world through your channel! Many people may not like the truths you share, but that doesn't stop those truths from needing to be shared. God bless!

Thank you for your boldness in sharing truth.

Thank you for shedding light on this important issue. My husband and I recently left a hyper-fundamentalist church and have been experiencing shunning, even still now. I went to the church as a lost teen, got saved and then baptized there. I grew spiritually there. Met my husband and got married there. Became a woman there, made what I thought would be lifelong friendships there. It is a shame what they and that system has done. They would say they are not shunning us, but I have been on the side of shunning others when they left. I know how this goes. I feel awful that I ever did that, so now to be receiving the same treatment is horrible. May those who shun finally open their eyes and see that it is ungodly to do so.

My whole life I’ve been seeking truth and along the way I’ve left what’s false thanks to God! Jesus led me to himself. I found out that truth is a Person who so graciously revealed Himself to me by His Spirit and in the Scriptures. I believed! There’s a cost to sincerely seeking the truth. I’ve been shunned, ignored, treated like I was crazy. There will be a time when you’re at complete peace with that and it doesn’t hurt anymore. I can attest to that! I pray this encourages you and those who have offended you ask your forgiveness. If they don’t, God’s peace reigns with you and His healing is complete❤

Alana, I believe we (non calvinist) cannot come to a mutual framework where we can call calvinists our brothers. They truly believe in a different Jesus.

Did someone really say "you brought this on yourselves" that's insane crazy. Glad you still have Jesus! 😊

“Narcissists try to destroy your life with lies, because the truth will destroy their life.” - unknown. Alana, all the lies ever said about you through this were said by people who view God as a narcissist and so they not only behave as narcissists, they are narcissists. You thought they had fruit but it was merely a good counterfeit, like wax fruit. They knew how to behave and dress the part. They say they are seeking God’s kingdom, when really they are preserving their own kingdom, their own livelihood and their own social circle. It may be hard to accept, but a narcissist never truly loved you. They loved themselves, and once you didn’t make them shine, they didn’t want you heard from or seen from anymore. If they aren’t the highlight of the party, they stop smiling. They don’t know how to love, because they never knew Love himself as he is. Love isn’t proud or self seeking. Love is not narcissistic seeking his own glory. He left the glory of heaven and came to this dark, dusty earth to know us and so that we might know him and so know what it is to be treasured no matter what. He came so that we might know him, so our faith would be restored in him. He gave faith to everyone by the life he lived, the death he died and the life he still lives answering prayers and preparing heaven for us( One would think the cross would be enough, but he is that good!). He never gave us a reason to ever doubt him. It may be hard to believe you were never truly loved because you may have felt treasured, but once you didn’t make their crown shine, you were no longer a treasure to them. Your true faith is so beautiful to Christ though. When Christ told a man in the Bible,” I saw you under the fig tree,” and the man believed he was the Messiah just because of these few words, Christ was taken back. He responded,” I have not seen so great faith in all of Israel.” Christ was taken by this man’s faith. It was beautiful for him to finally see this level of faith! While people look to see the beauty of paradise and the perfect vacation, Christ is taken by the beauty of true faith. He looks at you like you are so beautiful because of your true faith. You aren’t just loyal to him , even though….as a Calvinist is loyal they think Christ is worse than a criminal, but say he is good,” even though…”. That isn’t faith. Faith says, I “I know so and so didn’t… because I know them and can make a good judgement of them.” Not having faith is making a bad judgment of someone. Can you imagine the type of paradise it was for Christ to finally find someone who had faith in him at just a few words? You have actually made a good judgement of God and he values that. You are a breath of fresh air to him and to all your true brothers and sisters in the true faith. I’m glad to have you hanging out online so we can hear from you.

52:50 “especially” - an interesting word! “Malista” - Paul used it another time: “When you come, bring the cloak that I left with Carpus at Troas, and my scrolls, *especially* the parchments” (2 Tim.4:13) It doesn’t mean “exclusively”… I embrace the ancient Christian perspective of Universal Reconciliation (of “the all things”, Col. 1:20) - but I also believe in very real “election” - not unto exclusive salvation- but as the “first fruits” of a larger, full harvest (Romans 11:16)… I understand 1 Tim. 4:10 in that light 🤗 Blessings!

We are all striving to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. We are to be encouraging each others convictions because we may be at all different areas on the race track. Even though I attend a Messianic Congregation, I've come to terms that I do not want to call myself any religion. They all have their own doctrine (pride). Messianic just happened to be the closest to what Yahuah has convicted me of thus far and we are to continue in fellowship. Our congregation is full of different perspectives but we are mostly on all one accord that we believe in Yeshua and we love him so much that we strive to obey His commandments, all that apply to us. Ive been shunned by my christian family. They are still in my life and act like nothing happened. Im trying to let go because i was so hurt and nobody in my family takes responsibility so its challenging to be around them. We will all be accountable individually. Yah bless you sister

The thing is if you say something that disagrees with a pastor, and you are persuasive, then he may feel his own authority is being threatened. If his authority is threatened then not only is his pride pricked, but maybe he is afraid of losing his job or many tithing people leaving his church and causes he righteously believes in. So, maybe he isn’t trying to be outright evil, but if someone comes to him with slander, and he has reasons to want to believe it, then that is the motive behind why the slander lives. Their livelihood and social standing is being threatened and their mission they believe in- their life goals are being threatened. He and his legacy is his own greatest goal. I’ve noticed some men will argue no matter what they actually think, or not considering the view of a woman, because of a woman is right and they are wrong, then even their own confidence and social standing has been shattered. It’s starts when boys are small teasing each other, thinking women are “naive” and less intelligent, when really you may have a larger IQ than them, able to retain larger amounts of scripture in context. I don’t think Eve was less intelligent than Adam. They were both naive in the sense they didn’t know what death actually looked like. I think the only things Eve was naive about was believing the snake had authority he didn’t have and that it was possible for her to not be fully loved and so never forgotten by God. By authority, I mean someone who truly knows something. In this case, she believed the snake was an authority that knew what would make her happy; she thought he was a friend, but he was slimy , subtle sales man. Up to this point, after all, authority had never meant something negative: there were no policemen, firemen or doctors before sin. Adam was older and so was the authority she looked to for how to have the most fun and what foods tasted best mixed together. He was an authority in a positive way, simply because he was born first. I don’t think Adam could be deceived over this idea that God did not love them, because he knew that he loved Eve the way God loved him; so he knew it was impossible for them not to be loved. Having children taught this amazing love to Eve. Seeing God give her an animal, his best, to cover her nakedness shedding a light in the darkest corner of her mind, where she did not know God yet, and this light God shed, gave her faith in his love. He gave us his best and his all on the cross. Adam and Eve looked forward in faith to Gods promise of the cross in the same way we look back in faith. Through this horrible ordeal, rest in God’s truth and love.

Shunning happens when leaders fear the people could be exposed to truth when talking to this person .

Oh man this hurt my heart to see you working through this. I love you like a sister. ❤️

I believe in church discipline....done very loving. I was once in a reformed church, and they did church discipline towards the rebellious... but the ones that repented were never treated well again. Their sin branded them. I felt like they didn't restore well once the member was eventually repentant. It was hard to watch. That was the only reformed church i went to. Now, i am at a church that believes in discipline if needed, but if someone is repentant, they are welcomed back and loved.

Just on point, we do have grieved hearts, we feel sorry etc, however our hearts are no longer broken. Jesus doesn't live in a broken heart. Our hearts are new and compatible 💝💯🙏🏼

What you are describing as "crazy making" I have experience and also describes the definition of narcissism and narcissistic behavior. Different situation but same outcome.i can relate to...its NOT of God. Keep your eyes of Jesus and focus on what is good, and true. God bless you. We are the body of Christ. Not some buildings.

Excellent starting point 😊

I was calvinist for 1 day and was leaning towards in the beginning of my conversion , I made a prayer if I made the right choice let me convince my partner, she defended God's character rightfully so, I had no arguments besides the bad proof text and philosophy, she had scriptures of not being unconditional even pulled out Genesis (Abahram asking if God would destroy Sodom and Gomorrah if there were 50 righteous down to 10). I couldn't defend my viewpoint and I slowly removed myself from any Calvinist communities, found other like minded individuals. I cannot be calvinist as scripture points to us having choice and even God refraining from giving those in Nineveh punishment based on choices people made (repenting changing their mind), it was never total depravity. Saw Mike Winger and Leighton Flowers and saw vicarious atonement for the world just those saved are the ones who accept Jesus and have faith only in what he did

Im a Pastor. In my previous church, I was run out because people accused me of preaching Calvinism. While I am not a Calvinist and I showed time and again I am not by examples of book recommendations,podcasts etc.. (non that were Calvinist). Basically a rouge member (who was the wife of the head Decon) drove me out. Thay was 6 months ago. Howeber now, God has opened a door to a new church that like me is more Provisionalist in Soteriology. It stink,.it hurts. But as you said, God is faithful.

Be of good cheer! For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: {Ephesians 5:8}

If you’ve ever heard Ken Ham speak about believing Genesis 1, creation vs evolution, he says that your starting point is everything. Could not be truer than in the reformed/Calvinism camp. Their starting point is the system, not the Bible. They then reword/redefine and/or lift out of context scriptures to back-fill and “prove” their system. They simply do not believe the Bible, as written, to be true. They do not believe John 3:16-17, Rom 5:2, 1 John 2:2, 2 Cor 5:14-15 are true as God wrote them. The list goes on and on. This is where the fragrance of Roman Catholicism enters in…they need a “priest” to explain verses because they don’t *mean* what they say. In these systems, God was either a horrible communicator or intentionally cryptic because He really wanted to dupe mankind and only revealed the truth to some men, like Augustine…or Joseph Smith, etc. It’s so much easier to just believe it for what it says to whom it says.

Smh… the church is broken in so many ways! Definitely not the church of brotherly love!!! The hypocrisy is unreal…. So sorry that happened to you. When I was struggling with Calvinism, people like you, Latin Flowers and some others really helped me out! But this seems to be a theme in the church these days. I’m happy to hear that your not angry or bitter when the church falls short of living a Godly life and loving one another. Another huge problem with the church is also shunning those who are victims of sexual assault/abuse It’s unbelievable that they are shunned by church leadership and not only are they shunned but shamed! I know that’s a whole other topic but it’s been on the forefront of my mind since our church really messed up with that in the past. And although it was over 20 years ago, the church is still broken on the subject and not very many are willing to help her get the justice she deserves. It’s infuriating and very sad! What is wrong with our church leaders? What’s wrong with the church body?? Many have grown cold and acting like the pharacies (sp?) I’m so proud that you still remain a voice of truth and are taking the high road on this one. Always opened to reconciliation and putting God first in your life. That’s what matters and God, the true judge, sees that! Keep fighting the good fight and thank you for always being a encouragement to me and to many others! ❤

Thank you for answering about how you told your boys what you used to believe and what you believe now. I LOVE that you had them read the Bible for themselves!!! We should have done that when we left. What actually happened was I was listening to a lot of Leighton Flowers videos with the volume up as I worked and my kids overheard. 🤣 We never taught them about Calvinism but they could have overheard my husband since he talked about it all the time. I wonder if they just decided not to listen because it sounded too weird and complicated. I was raised Calvinist. We were taught total depravity young, but I don't remember hearing about God being the only one choosing who to save until I was maybe 14. I just decided not to try to figure it out until I was older. But the truth of the gospel is simple and makes total sense. God bless!

Alana....first of all let me affirm you in your quest of using your critical thinking skills and be a real disciple of Jesus ie not following religious traditions or doctrines of men. Its a brave step that not many are willing to do. I know I'm talking to the choir but by your testimony of this shunning it is quite evident. Especially when you are an upstanding member of the body of Christ in your local church (formerly) I come from a Calvinist family and was shunned for many years. It was so painful but upon my pulling away, they came around a bit. Its better but there's still a low level of shunning which for the most part I'm able to brush off. I also don't attend the institutional church any longer because of stuff like this. I became a Charismatic years ago and even in that community there's abuse. I finally found many others that left institutional religion to follow Jesus. I gather in bible studies or small groups of interaction. Also I enjoy going into the You Tube community and as you can see participating in that. Continue to share so that you may be healed. James recommends that and I do to as its very cathartic. You might be interested in looking at some You Tube channels that talk about narcissism- flying monkies- stonewalling- grey rock are good one Dr Ramini (not a believer but has some good insight into this psychological phenomenon. Have a blessed day!

I believe that reason that the church is sick is because of one missing essential doctrine. It’s not a mystery, though. It’s simply the doctrine of Love. I have heard it preached for years and years, but it is never taught. Not correctly. That would mean that the church is suffering with carnality. Love is supposed to be a sincere internal condition expressed by joy, peace, patience, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, self control.

They don’t want you to rock the boat. And they can’t handle passionate people. They aren’t genuine friends, they never were. They just go through the motions like so many others, especially very traditional religions. It scares them that you’re asking questions. I ask deep questions like you do in Sunday school and I’ve found that almost no one else thinks that way and they give neat simple answers and don’t really think.

This was amazing. We attended a couple of churches that have membership. We did not become members during the time we were there. The last one didn’t not consider one part of their body unless they became a member. You were not allowed to partake communion and other things unless you were a member. Too much to mention here. Could you do a video about church membership and covenants? 🤍🤍🤍 sister, homeschooling mom on a healing journey 🙏🏼

I was in a cult from 19-39 yrs old. Left it three years ago. Thank the Lord! I know the way they excuse much of their distance/shunning/unloving attitudes and actions is the "label"they put on someone as "reprobate." This they feel gives them justification for their wrong attitudes and actions. I feel confident that's what they believe about me because I have no desire to go back. They equate that as "I have no desire for God." Not true at all. My eyes have been open to them (through pain and God's discernment). I can't unsee the seen and don't even want to. I didn't want an "appearance of godliness", I wanted God.

They’re separating from you because of a non essential issue elevated to essential. That is idolatry. It is worship of the system over the savior. You get the same with dispensationalism. I’ve experienced this from churches many years ago because I no longer accepted the pre trib rapture.

I am thankful for your honesty and courage. I do have a question.....what are you doing to rebuild trust in other Christians again? We were part of a covert calvinist church for a year and a half and experienced shunning when we left. It messed up our heads following the whole COVID experience.We then became part of a church that follows the "Moses model" led by a narcissistic pastor who destroyed our ministry, our friendships, our trust. We left that church after a year and I am finding it hard to trust a church again. God has been very close to us, I trust Him, but as a mature Christian woman I do not know how to enter a church building again. How did you do it or are you doing it? Although you seem to have friends left, I do not and I know at some point I need to try again but I cannot rekindle the desire. I also believe that taking time to properly heal is important as various people who left Calvinism when we did....also fell into cultish churches a second time. This leads to another question.....are those injured by Calvinism more likely to fall into cults a second time? Is it us? Is it me? Or, are there more cults following COVID and the isolation? Would love to hear you discuss these questions. Sorry this got long...

Ugh sorry for the many spelling errors… guess that’s what you get when you write fast and check nothing lol

Hey Alana We are going through this right now. I appreciate your raw videos. Thank you for helping me NOT feel crazy!! Romans 16:17 - " I appeal to you, Brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them." This is difficult for me.... Am I causing divisions and creating obstacles In my current church? Should I keep quiet so I do not become one that Paul is describing? How do I decipher this text? .... Or, would this be the calvinist doctrine going against what God/ Jesus taught?

I too came out of Calvinism and was shunned

How do you know if you have forgiven the person that has lied about you and slandered you? That has happened to me. Maybe even a video about forgiveness. Thank you sis It's hard but atleast we have our truth, Jesus

Love your strength and your channel. Speaking of man made doctrines. Sunday is also a man made doctrine mandated by Catholic church.

This is how human groups weed out people that they no longer consider one of their own. At the core of it, people in such churches are scared, as they already sense or know the drill - that if THEY spoke up or questioned key contentions they are curious about or that make them uncomfortable, they know they would be shunned as well. Plus, it's just easier for people to go along with whatever is the status quo. Unfortunately! And it's difficult for those who leave to remain close to people that you mostly only interacted with through church - as even if a few don't shun you, every time you're around them there will be this "elephant in the room." And I can't imagine a close friendship with those remaining in such a church being possible without at least one frank explanation as to why you left. Which is also like inferring that they are part of a unBiblical assembly with troubling doctrinal issues.

Damage control is the perfect definition. I shunned people that left the church and when my eyes opened…. I left …. was shunned myself and I have grown from this. Jesus is abundant in love not judgment.

Thank you for sharing, sister. I have recently come to reject Calvinism also after 21 years. But now I gotta ask if you don't mind, what position do you take if not Arminianism? Provisionism?

Concerning the hypothetical prayer to God about what they should do and He answers they should cut you out of their lives, well they have a great excuse for that. They’ll say “MARK AND AVOID” and won’t feel an ounce of guilt. It’s like when they don’t feel guilty for stealthing (or even openly with elders but not members) a non-Calvinist church. They believe they’re doing the Lord’s work. I hope you can eventually get to a place where their behavior doesn’t hurt you or your family anymore.

❤

Remember Ps 34:18:"The Lord is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart...... It is really sad that when we get saved via our Lord Jesus, we find ourselves called something. (Calvin's or Arminiast) It does not matter what christains call you. God calls you his child (1John 3:1). Remember when christains condemn you and separate from you Jesus does not (Rom 8:35). When Dave Hunt wrote books exposing wrongs in the charismatic movement many calvinists cheered. When he wrote "What love is this "exposing Calvinism, hewas severely persecuted by many of those who cheered before.

I am sorry for your painful experience. You should consider looking at the history of Calvinism and how they treated opponents. Starting with Augustine who was a bully, then Calvin who was harsh and killed Servetus the heretic and was against the Catholics and Anabaptists, then the Calvinists abused the Remonstrants expelling them, the Puritans killing witches in Salem etc. Sad to say you are one in a long history. I encourage you to consider looking to a theology of the Kingdom of God as a replacement for Calvinism. Not the social gospel modern version/s but the biblical one based in the teachings of Jesus.

Ok so I watched it again and now it makes sense. I didn’t think this was important and thought this whole topic was dumb about Calvinism, but now I do understand where you are coming from and why Calvinism is dangerous. I have never been a calvinist but this theology is dangerous. Dang Alana you seem to have been hurt again by a cult like mindset in a church. Hopefully your new church is not cult like and you don’t have to be a member. It’s sad people get so wrapped up in calvisim and Arminian extreme instead of focusing on scripture and following obeying and growing in intimacy with Jesus. I might be more Arminian for sure but this is very sad. I pray you find godly friends who understand to focus on Christ and not crazy doctrine.

Dear sweet sister in Jesus, you are on the right path! Calvinism is false, we choose by our freewill that God gave us, God does not condemn anyone to hell without a chance. I was never a Calvinist but felt I was inbetween the two viewpoints and I researched it some years ago, there are some good resources. 1. Dave Hunt's book of the Berean Call "What Love Is This?" 2. A youtube channel called Faith On Fire, I think also Good Fight Ministries has some, and I saw a great video explaining that predestination is not unto salvation but what we are predestined for after salvation and it made perfect sense but argh I can't recall the name. Some searching on youtube may yield good results though for anyone searching this out. The more research I did, I actually became an Arminianist and never looked back but whatever. But keep exposing this, please! They are wrong and you are right! There is so much cultish mind control now it is like the dark ages! We don't need them! They need us! We are the church. All we need is Jesus. They have no authority over us. We don't need anyone's permission for these things when we have His command. They are in sin and need to repent, not us for leaving the error behind and exposing it. These people were never your true friends anyway. It is not a loss even though it hurts and I understand. Better painful truth than deceitful delights. I see all the immature haters in the chat comments too and I'm shocked. Those trying to silence you are the ones who need to be silenced. All these Calvinist preachers are heretics in so many ways. Take John MacArthur.... did you know aside from Calvinist heresy, he denies that the blood of Jesus saves? He also says if you take the mark of the beast you can still be saved (in direct contradiction to Scripture: Rev. 14; 9-11)? He is also a cessationist which is false, he is a false teacher as are the others (regardless of any good things they may say). But Alana, you keep going! God gave you a good mind, not so that it could be controlled by wolves. Don't let them control what you think, or do, or say, you do not need their permission to do what Jesus called you to do. You seem to be a sincerely loving Christian who is obeying the Lord, you are also smart, strong, and yes... in great shape and lovely as well. Use what He gave you and march forward in this battle! You might even start a ministry for people who have been abused by church hurt. I do pity those people who did the abusing on judgment day. All we can do is pray for our enemies and exemplify Christ and His ways and love, honor and obey Him. We can't control their mistakes. Each will get what they deserve at the judgment seat of Christ, if they are even indeed His. Love to you and power to do His will my dear!

Alana, why do you think being an Arminian is the first step to being a Calvinist? I attend a Church of God, which I thought was Arminian, and last week the pastor quoted John Calvin , which concerns me. I’m praying he isn’t considering Calvinism. A pastor of another traditionally Arminian church I used to attend taught straight up Calvinism( He had never actually went to seminar, so either just didn’t know what he was talking about or was straight up rogue studying what other scholars said on the side.) Unfortunately, some people can quote theology books better than the Bible. The Bible college I attended recommended not reading doctrinal books but to just read the Bible while we were there. Anyway, why do you say Arminianism is the first step to being a Calvinist?

Alana, maybe these people weren’t really your friends to begin with.

I love your channel. I understand with individuals, but I can’t understand why you’re not willing to take a stand against those who teach these doctrines calling them wolves. The doctrine of limited atonement is viciously brutal. If Christ died for the whole world, then the doctrine of limited atonement denies the very work of Christ. How can that not be a dealbreaker whatever the cost? If Christ died for the whole world, then Calvinism is blasphemous. This is not like disagreement about other doctrines like infant baptism versus immersion and things like that. There are doctrines we can disagree on. I don’t think this is one of them.

The way I interpret election is that God created or elected 2 groups. Either you're saved and go to heaven or you're not, but WE CHOOSE to accept Jesus as our Lord and follow him or not. A question that I've struggled to answer that a family member asked and was not satisfied with my response is if God knows ALL things then he ultimately knows who will choose him and who won't so why would he create me in the first place if he knows that I'm going to reject him and be sent to hell. So to them that appears as if yes they were created to be sent to hell because God already knew they weren't going to choose him and to them that's not loving. If anyone has a good response to that I would love to hear it as I desperately want this person to understand. God Bless!

People don't want to hear a different belief system than what they believe Even if theirs could be wrong. They either believe it because they've studied it and come to the conclusion that it is right or they believe what someone told them to believe and they are too lazy or what's worse, don't care to seek after truth. We told our church why we were leaving our once traditional but now becoming reformed church due to pastoral change-we told them we were leaving because it was showing signs of becoming Calvinistic. Nobody wanted to know what we saw and why we believed this. If they did "see" it , they didn't want to leave, thinking they could fight it(but then didn't anything or even bring it up.). Nobody is shunning us, they just don't bring it up. If anyone does ask, we tell them what we see and what Calvinism is. Pastor still is not telling the church clearly that he is a reformed Calvinist although we can hear it in his sermons if we listen. You have to know the lingo. What's funny is, he told the Deacons he doesn't like the word "Calvinist" he prefers "reformed Baptist". We're thinking the Deacons thought oh, see, he's not a Calvinist! 🤔. People like to remain ignorant if it's going to disrupt their life even if they're in the wrong. We found a good traditional Southern Baptist Church to attend and have been welcomed in with open arms. Still keep certain friendships with people at the old church. Have never had a conversation with the Calvinist pastors. Have seen the bully Pulpit used so didn't see the need to talk to them

I didn’t catch it if you said it or not, but what’s the name of this church that you’re making these accusations toward? You shouldn’t be mean to one another but if you think this church is in serious error, then you shouldn’t want anything to do with them either This is what the Bible says

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