The Disappointing & Forgotten Sonic Series 

Man thank God I can't play as Knuckles this game Would have been terrible if i could

@@boombob3Di hate playing as my least favorite character metal sonic what’s that? what do you mean he’s only playable in spin-offs and side modes? i’m not supposed to think about that or else i’ll cry myself to sleep

@@boombob3D People used to hate Sonic's friends back then. The 2010s were dark times.

​@@Sonic_The_Weredogyeah it sucked lmao.

SEGA needs to escape the monotony. While Frontier is breaking away from it, that is technically a postgame DLC. And Dream Team is an Apple Arcade exclusive game.

Sonic Mania absolutely should've been the Sonic 4 we got. It just feels like it belongs as part of the original five titles, it fits right in with Sonic 1, 2, 3, Knuckles and CD.

Fr sonic advance was the sonic 4 back then

@@koolaid33 "it fits right in with Sonic 1, 2, 3, Knuckles and CD." Maybe because 2/3rds of Mania is just a retread of those games lmao.

​@@koolaid33Nah, Mania can't be Sonic 4 because it's mostly just a copy of the first 3 and it had no intention to evolve the series with each iteration the way it was on the Genesis.

Gee, it’s almost like it was only called Sonic 4 for marketing reasons or something.

But it is on phones!

@@MustacheDLuffy he said " *only* on phones"

Eh, it didn't hurt too much to have it on consoles. If only it wasn't literally branded as a sequel and marketed as such, it could have made for a great $10 title or something. I mean, Xbox Live Arcade was a thing, so having a sort of 2.5D pseudo-rehash of Sonic as a small anniversary release would have made *some* sense, even if it sucked a little gameplay-wise. Same for the PS3 with the PSN store. Could have made for a small time waster. The Wii version was the only one that ended up actually making sense since that console was more on the casual side, just like releasing it on Mobile. But a "fully-fledged" sequel to one of the most critically acclaimed games in the franchise? I'm sorry, but that's like playing Russian Roulette with a fully loaded Revolver. Episode 2 made more sense all-in-all but the fate of this game is pretty sad.

Was originally supposed to be called "Sonic: The Portable."

@@mark030a Good point!

Yo I know

Yeah

Me too.

I eat the cotton candy from my

Yeah man 2014 was such a great time for me I still think the game is ass but I have good memories with it

Actually I don't think the deal had anything to do with that. Episode 2 just did not sell as well as Episode 1 did, which is what put the Sonic 4 Sub-Series in the Scraps.

Episode 2 was in development before 1 was even out. By the time 2 was basically done Sega ultimately decided cancel it, and have Dimps work on different projects. They apparently briefly considered doing an Ep3 with Christian Whitehead after his mobile ports of CD, but they fell through.

I feel like Sonic 4 wasn’t successful for a reason. I would love a remake of 3D blast, or at least revisiting those zones, because some of them were really cool and there was an element of puzzle solving

YESSS THIS!!! And episode 3 was gonna be worked on by Christian Whitehead and would have shown even MORE improvements and probably would have been amazing!!!

​@@SurfRayfun fact:some people have made stuff like sonic 4 episode 3 a channel that has alot of stuff called glitch678

Episode 2 is mid

@@ShadyFanEdits No

@@lukchem Well,the co-op sucks,the soundfont makes my ears suffer,the physics are terrible,Modern Sonic,the homing attack,the controls,THE GODDAMN LEVEL DIFFICULTY(*cough* Sky Fortress *cough*). But at least it's better than Episode 1.

why they didn't just use the sonic advance physics is beyond me

Yeah, In this case, they just opted to reused the physics engine instead of trying to build something similar to the classic titles, like what they had did with Sonic Advance 1.

Hey!Sega'nın telefonlara Sonic Rush'ı portladıklarıni ve bundan vaz gectiklerini duymuştum.Ayrıca Dimps hem Sonic Rush hem de Sonic 4'ü geliştirdi.

Superstars was the only one of these that was made after 4 by Sonic Team

@@Rusty_Spy Superstars and Sonic 4 weren't even made by just Sonic Team.

What would be the point of that, everything that was new about sonic 4 was bad. You either carry over those aspects and the game sucks, or you don't carry them over and there's no point in calling it sonic 4.

@@ohno5559 That's not true Sonic 4 Ep II was a significant step up from I while keeping what kept it sonic 4 resulting in a flawed but solid game with Ep III they could easily do the same.

@@johnman8398 The tails/sonic combo moves were a legitimate development, it would be fair to carry those forward (but make them execute a lot faster). Outside of that though, most of the improvements in episode II were in fixing mistakes episode I introduced, like the visuals. Nothing that really establishes a solid "sonic 4 identity" that can be carried forward. Considering the main distinguishing feature of Sonic 4 was the godawful physics, they'd be better off taking what elements worked in episode II and using them elsewhere rather than trying to continue under the Sonic 4 identity.

I feel like calling it 4 implies quality in line with the og trilogy, which we didnt get in a classic title until mania (though im still mad that sega didnt let that game have fully original stages)

@@sixty5notch796 It's because Mania was a very short game. The addition of old stages was to make it big and fitting as an anniversary title. Remember, one of the game's selling point before launch was "it's longer than Generations".

My thoughts exactly. If this was called literally ANYTHING other than Sonic 4, nobody would give a damn about it. Just another subpar 2D Sonic platformer Sega sent out on phones just to cash in on the mobile gaming craze.

I find it hilarious the fact that if look closely at some of Sonic 4 backgrounds you can see the game's original title, Sonic the Portable. Yes, it was meant to be a smartphone game

@@pablocasas5906 Sonic the Portable

This comment is cursed. Ouya AND Sonic 4? A match made in hell.

@@user-vi4xy1jw7e fr. it just reminded me of this crazy STEM teacher I had who said RU-vid was going to be paywalled and the Ouya was going to singlehandedly antiquate the entire console market and become the only platform. I can only imagine what he had to say about the Google Stadia back when you'd get an ad for it every 5 seconds

The games are alright. The problem is that they called it Sonic the Hedgehog 4, making it being compared and expected to live up to the genesis games. It also was very short and copied a lot from the Genesis games. If it was released as Sonic the Portable as it was meant to be originally, it would get a lot less hate. Yet Sega was Sega and got greedy. It failed to live up to the name it was given and was punished for it.

Episode II was OK but still imo the biggest issue with Sonic 4 was that you would spam the homing attack to kill badnicks and reach higher parts of the level, instead of using actual skilled platforming like in the Genesis/Mega Drive games, a point not really mentioned in this video. It's fun for what it is though. I tend to agree with Cybershell: Sonic Mania was the true Sonic 4

Way too mid

Sonic 4 ep1 wasn't bad. Sonic 4 ep 2 was better.

I like sonic 4

that shit is mid too

​@@SonplaysMinEcraftI haven't played it but I heard that the boss battles is what drag the game down.

@@SonplaysMinEcraftDid you even play it?

@@EternityVoid_On my first playthrough, I didn't struggle at all with a majority of the bosses. People just suck at video games.

​@SonplaysMinEcraft "mid too" I wouldn't really say sonic 4 is mid, I feel like it's straight up just bad while superstars is just mid.

I hear Episode 3 was gonna be done by the people who made the Castle of Illusion remake. And that was a hit.

Sunset park is from Sonic Triple Trouble

Downfall started with Adventure 2

it's so fucking annoying especially because 06 is actually really good, it's just got REALLY bad physics. i dont think it's what killed the series at all, what killed the series was SEGA rushing sonic team and making them crunch and then also the marketing they did for a while in the 2010s with the edgy humor and all of that dumb shit 🙄 they were actively killing their own brand. it was nothing to do with the games Lol

Some music is good Yeah.

I'm tired of pretending it's not. go to any Superstars OST and the comments will all be 6 months old and have only bad things to say unless it's one of the small handful you can immediately tell were from Tee Lopes. Jun wasn't even the only composer besides Tee Lopes but if people can't immediately tell, they get real biased real quick because that's the popular thing to do.

Bro just cause you grew up on them and like them doesnt mean that theyre definetifely the best, try things from all eras of sonic not just boost, i just recently beat s3&k for the first time and its so damn good

@@sixty5notch796 i played allmost every era of sonic, unleashed is objectively the best sonic game and i will stand by that

word i'm in the same camp. shit was my childhood and everyone can pry that from my cold dead hands werehog stages included

​@@sixty5notch796dawg just bc theyve played unleashed and think it's the best doesn't mean they haven't played every game? i also have and it's still my #1.

@@callie-flower3177 for real cuh

Who cares about the story

That's Sonic 3's first zone, Angel Island Zone.

​@@koolaid33 they mean everything _around_ sonic 3. the room. that being said, i have no clue.

something that runs doom

@@smolbrendan5978 yess that's what I meant

It's EmuVR. Has support for systems up to PS2 and even has lightgun support (best in VR, of course).

I like the game too, it should not have the name title 4.

🤨

Thank God it stopped.

Outside of Sonic 4 (which is a stretch) when was bullying their own franchise a selling point?

@@johnman8398 it was heavy during Meta era, they had arron (from game grumps) as their main sponsor which was weird cause he would constantly shit on the games and devs, in a lot of videos they would make fun of their start in 3D like 06 or even claiming adventure was bad. It was all in their social media and it was annoying

@@AlexSzubkaIt wasn't all that heavy in the modern era unless you were terminally online. Having Arin as a sponsor doesn't mean they're bullying their franchise as a selling point, he's also a fan of sonic. It wasn't all over their social media either.

@@johnman8398 you can watch their previous anniversary videos or just look back at their old social media if you care that much. this isn't just a personal feeling alot of people have noticed this.

Shut yo ass😭

It's a 2D game though

@@midi_feline so it is.

Nobody can decide what a liminal space actually is, damn

Emuvr link in description

Blinded by nostalgia

Are we really in another Sonic Dark Age? Frontiers was mostly well reviewed and sold very well, we got two successful live-action movies, there was the Netflix show and Knuckles' TV series broke ratings records for Paramount+

Sonic 4 and Forces aren't shit they're mid at worst and shouldn't ever be compared to the likes of 06 which is genuinely bad.

rewriting this bc i was a little too aggressive in my last comment even though im not really mad? lol but 06 was good, genuinely. i appreciate what they were trying to do with it's story, and i like the different direction they took with it tbh. it's just burdened by bad/glitchy physics bc of how it got rushed and i Wish it wasn't bc it deserves better. elise and sonic don't count as a complaint tho LOL if it's a genuine one... pls. grow up.

@@user-vi4xy1jw7edawg i’m 17 06 was my first sonic game 😭😭

it will be a very dumb more from Sega to make a remaster of a hated game in the fanbase and it will also make some confusion for the casuals playing sonic.

I don't think there's a point in that. A remaster isn't gonna fix all it's downsides, no matter how badly we wish it would. On top of that, it's virtually impossible to see Sega do this. Sega is a company, regardless of how caring they are for the community, money comes first and Sonic 4 is not profitable, especially nearly 15 years later with all the negative press on it being out.

Probably yes? With upgrade visual and physics.

You only heard the boss music, didn't you?

I don't think the mobile port ever had the "cel shading" thing-

@@midi_feline oh interesting, I wasn't aware of that but thinking about the phones of the time it makes sense

Emuvr link in description

you have a thing you stick to and you know what. i admire that

@@callie-flower3177 Well thanks.

Fr

everyone who says this is missing the point the composers of the classic sonic games pushed the Genesis sound chip to its limits, squeezing every drop of worth they could get out of it. they were trying to make the OSTs for the games sound GOOD. They wanted to make music, which they did. Games like 4 and Superstars completely miss the point of why people liked the classic's OSTs and why it sounded synthy and twangy to begin with. Technological limits. You see how Sonic CD doesn't have the same sound OST as the other 3 games, the composers got an upgrade in sound quality and took advantage of that. They *evolved* what they had previously had. It's the 9th generation of gaming, if you're going to make a follow-up to the Genesis games, you DON'T wanna go back 30 years and purposely make your OST sound like gargled garbage (cough cough Superstars) Tee Lopes had the right idea when composing for Mania. Taking the design, or feel (for lack of a better term. I'm not a music guru) of the classic sonic games' OSTs and improving upon them. Notice how none of the songs in that game have that awful percussion? TL;DR This is an unfair comparison. You can't compare the classic Sonic games OSTs to 4 because the only reason they sound like that to begin with is because of hardware limitations. They weren't trying to make it sound like that, they were trying to make it sound like high-quality compositions, to the best of their ability. It's the whole reason why Sonic CD and Mania sound the way it does. The technology allowed for higher quality, so they USED it. To put it simply, purposely going backward in composition for the sake of "nostalgia" is completely missing the point of what made the OSTs of those games special in the first place.

@@ironicallyuncreative Cry me a river, I'm not readin' all that

@@midi_feline there's a TL;DR at the bottom for people like you. I'm sorry you can't read more than 5 words at a time. Must be hard.

@@ironicallyuncreative > "the composers of the classic sonic games pushed the Genesis sound chip to its limits" No they didn't. Compared to other Genesis games, Sonic songs were *very* basic in arrangement. The majority of them don't even use every channel at once. So this is simply false. A solid half of 3&Knuckles' OST completely neglects the PSG channels. > "You see how Sonic CD doesn't have the same sound OST as the other 3 games, the composers got an upgrade in sound quality and took advantage of that." Limitation=/=bad. Why do I keep seeing this argument everywhere? Limitation is one of the greatest sources of creativity. 2d gaming itself is a limitation, as there's no Z-axis. This whole idea of "FM synthesis bad, CD audio good" doesn't make any sense. Especially in this case, since Sonic 4 ACTUALLY DOES use modern synths. Is Cardi B's music better than Beethoven's because her music uses more modern instruments? I love CD's music, but more stuff doesn't automatically make something better. Hataya himself stated that CD's soundtrack is techno/house. This is still electronic "synthy" music, which is automatically bad according to you. > "if you're going to make a follow-up to the Genesis games, you DON'T wanna go back 30 years and purposely make your OST sound like gargled garbage" You yourself just said it's a follow-up to the Genesis games. Why can't the music reflect that? Also if you're implying the Genesis sounds like "gargled garbage" idk what to tell you. > "Notice how none of the songs in that game have that awful percussion?" Oh no, compressed samples! In a game where being retro is the entire point! 😱 So how do you feel about Tee Lopes also using Sonic 1/2 samples in his Sonic Origins work? TL;DR: If "old sound bad" then nobody is allowed to play piano anymore as that instrument is hundreds of years old.

no sonic 1, 2, 3 is classic SA1 is modern

F%ck no