The Mystery of the Nephite Kings [Radio Free Mormon 347] 

Bill Reel here. I watched this last night RFM and as usual you are amazing. The mormon community is lucky to have you.

I feel so sorry for those who were subjected to the indoctrination of the LDS propaganda. I understand how difficult it must be to turn one’s thinking from belief to disbelief. I admire people who can face truth and have the courage to admit their own truth. It takes real character. I do believe God gave us all a conscience that helps us in this journey. Truth comes from God. Thank you for sharing your life experiences . It helps all of us to reexamine our life values and what we were taught and what we learn and establish as our own truth. Good job.

This scholarship is why I am a monthly donor to RFM, along with your ability to present it in a way that gets us students sitting in the back of Sunday School playing our phones to look up and pay attention. Once again, my eyes have been opened a little more.

Nice work RFM! Thank you for the insight yet again

Well done! This was well researched.

Thanks RFM!

I’ve been missing all this RFM! You’re fantastic ❤

Thanks again RFM For giving of your time and talents :-) I look forward to your broadcast and all the rest of the gang

Thank you RFM for spelling that out. I had listened to Dan Vogel explaining the small plates and large plates and the order of Book of Mormon writing because of the lost 116 pages, but I am no where near as intelligent as you or Dan Vogel. So to have you "translate" Dan Vogel for me very much helped!! 😅

Great explanation of a potentially difficult to understand topic. You laid out the information clearly and concisely. Gracias 🙂

Like and share! ❤❤🎉🎉

Always FASCINATING!!!!! Always!! I’m a doctrinal person, have been for years, your conclusions and data is so interesting!!! Thank you 🙏🏼

Great show

This is brilliant!

Great work

Thanks!

Great collar, radiofree!

always finding interesting aspects that have been sitting there in the text all along

A few items, if any are interested. 1) It is asserted by RFM that Amaleki doesn't explicitly mention that he doesn't have a brother, when in fact he actually says that he does have a brother, but he in fact is not around or even perhaps is dead (Omni 1:30). So Benjamin is his best option. 2) Jacob 1:11 does indicates that the Nephi x king title was what the kings “were called by the people” however it indicated “let them be of whatever name they would” which does indicate that they did retain a separate name from the kingly title of Nephi x that the people used. This interpretation does seem consistent with the pre-Mosiah1 king apparently named Mormon that is mentioned without any Nephi x kingly title (Alma 18:4). This verse indicates that the place called Mormon was named after a king. There are also a couple possible alternative interpretations of this verse, namely that the king gave the place the name, but not after himself, and that the king may have been a Lamanite king, as at the time the place was utilized by Alma1 it was in Lamanite territory. These two don't seem to be as likely. 3) Jacob only knew the tradition of the Nephi x titles that existed during his time frame, it may have changed later for a variety of political reasons or lack of direct posterity. 4) It is extremely likely that Mosiah1 may have had the additional kingly title Nephi x prior to being made king over the land of Zarahemla, and just retained the name Mosiah1 as he was no longer the king in the land of Nephi, or just a king over the Nephites after arriving at Zarahemla, as he was king over a whole different area and people. Mosiah1 never indicated that it was only Nephites that came with him, just those that had the same belief system and followed him, so he wasn't really a lineage/political polity king at this point as he was being driven out by force from the land of Nephi. Also it is also extremely likely that Mosiah was not his original birthname and was given after the fact as are most personal names in the Book of Mormon as they are given names based on their adult characteristics or accomplishments. This type of name change makes total sense for someone such as Mosiah1 whose name is reflected of him operating as the new Moses in leading his followers through the wilderness to the new promised land of Zarahemla. In Biblical Hebrew the name Mosiah would be the word mošiaʿ which means roughly a “hero sent from God” and reflects a person who has an office in ancient Israel, who delivers the chosen people of Israel from unjust oppression. So it would be appropriate to give Mosiah1 his name based on this etymology, but only after he led his followers in Exodus fashion to Zarahemla. Don Bradley has argued the alternative possibility as to the Nephi x title and Mosiah1, namely that Mosiah1 had the lineage only through a maternal line as there were no direct descendants of Nephi (or siblings) present. With regards to the 1 Nephi 1:8 and Alma 36:22 issue, 1 Nephi 1:8 is part of what Nephi refers to as the “the record of my father" which is specifically indicated to be part of the Large Plates ("first plates")(1 Nephi 19:1). So Alma2 in 36:22 is getting this information from the Large Plates as RFM indicates as one of the possibilities.

Another excellent dissection of a book of fiction, and the evidence of it.

Thanks, RFM. I look forward to these episodes! If only God had sent an angel with a flaming sword the 116 pages could have been preserved 😉

Sounds about right

22:20 Amaleki does mention a brother that ran off with Zeniff's expedition, which may have been stitched in to answer the question of why Amaleki doesn't just pull an Ammaron and hand the small plates to a male sibling. Also interesting that Zeniff is not named in Amaleki's account. Perhaps another detail Joseph was not confident in at that point in the dictation.

I live in a community that loves to get together and has great difficulty saying goodbye when it's time to leave. Even phone calls are ended with multiple byes. I can't count the number of times I've heard someone say at a party they had to leave, couldn't stay another moment, and then spend a half hour saying goodbye to everyone they know individually, with a few additional moments of chatting thrown in. I don't see the 'seam' between Jesus saying 'let's be going' and then continue talking as eleven other guys get themselves ready to leave, nor his continuing to teach as they get ready. As to the other 'seam', have you read The New International Commentary on the New Testament's book on John, written by Leon Morris? He tackles it. Thank you for challenging me to dig a little deeper. I hope you do, too!

I was never a Mormon but I am surprised by how obviously phony the book is.

👍🏻

Joseph Smith busted again. Case closed because Smith threw the book at himself🥴

This is just more proof that that JSj was highly intelligent. Not a dumb or uneducated guy.

Nice work. I do remember feeling like this part was contrived, even when I believed. The small vs. large plates was just all too convenient, especially for a God that didn't have his kids go to all that work just to provide for Harris losing the 116 pages. It baffles me that people see that as faith-promoting. The one thing this does point out is how clever J Smith was. He jad to think about it for a couple of months to come up with a workaround but he found one that fooled a lot of people. It would also indicate that he had this story down pretty well in his head. None of this detracts from his creativity and resourcefulness. It DOES reveal the nature of who he did. Intentional fraud. There's no apologetic or excuse here. He meant to make this book appear to be real sonhe could go on bilking people of their money and their daughters.