The Number One Reason Catholics Leave the Church // Catholic in America 

As a lifelong practicing Catholic, one of the big reasons I see many folks leaving is that the pastors and priests at their local parish are increasingly unconnected with their parishioners. Many priests give sermons and homilies about topics that virtually no one can relate to, very vague and ambiguous. This adds to the disconnect and slowly drives folks away.

The weird thing is someone can be a murderer, confessor sin, go to jail, and still receive the Eucharist, but God forbid you get divorced and remarried

The annulment process for me was very nerve-racking, but did provide me closure and renewal. I married an older woman when I was younger, and she took advantage of me, and was very abusive and I stomach dead for almost 10 years before I realized it was destroying me in every way, and I had to get a divorce, I was fortunate that all the criteria were present for me to get an annulment which did provide healing and also a sense of closure to that for not only me but my current wife. I’m definitely going to take the advice given here and offer my experience as a guide to others that might be facing the same process at my parish. Thank you, gentlemen God bless.

I have a question for the fathers. Why can a priest or nun leave his/her position and marry but I can’t leave my spouse and remarry? They made a vow same as my vow.

Thank you for this it offers me some hope and solace.

Coffee and donuts is every Sunday after mass for our Parish 😌 it helps us connect

I'm happy to hear the discussion on divorce. I divorced him, he remarried in a civil ceremony. I never remarried, he has recently died. Where does this leave me in the eyes of the Catholic Church?

Weak shepards. Weak bishops not standing up for the Church and not holding priests accountable for their bad actions, trying to hide these things (scandals). Protestenization (sp?) of mass. On an individual level many dont understand the Catechism. All of these are my opinion

The first reason back in 1966 is Vatican 2 and the cost of catholic education.

I just grew up and saw the hypocrisy and BS for what it is.

The Catholic Church has to focus more on the word of God than traditions. People are in the Church but spiritually thirsty and want to know Christ personally

the church not being transparent. Trying to control every issue with an iron fist. sweeping abuses under the rug and pretending it will go away. Any and all abuse should be reported to police, then the church but the directions are always do nothing until the church reviews and decides if valid or not. You guys say "reported"....you want to define that for us, who should it be reported to?

words like "concubinage" have such derogatory meanings. Even the use of that in this video validated my reason for leaving.

LISTEN TO ME!!!! It’s the constant singing through the entire mass. WE DON’T WANT TO SING!! We want to be with Jesus!! My church wants us to sing through the whole communion!!! That should be a time of being with Jesus…. and contemplating what has just happened! Other nonsense…. the handshake of peace. The total lack of reverence!! It’s horrible!! We don’t want a production or a show! We want Jesus! I rarely feel fed after attending Mass. I feel frustrated and angry. 😡😡

Sounds like you need to train your Ministers more if they are driving people away.

As a Catholic of nearly seventy years, I have got to the point where I can no longer support an institution that has so calously treated the abused, the outsider, the child, the alienated ... stuff that supposed to be at the core of its mission. I believe I have to stand in solidarity with the thousands of victims of a church that has done everything to avoid the kind of self examination and deep reform it expects of individual sinners. But beyond the devastation of the abuse crisis, it seems to me that the heart of the problem is clericalism. There is no sign that this is changing, so I'm out. It's not a decision I've come to easily and I accept I will be a 'spiritual orphan' for the rest of my life but, for me, participation is compliance.

"Devition to what is right is simple, devotion to what is wrong is complex and admits to infinite variations...For those who follow nature, everything is easy and straightforward, whereas for those who fight against her life is just like rowing against the stream." -Seneca

Father Michael and Father Tom, did your parents live as brother and sister during their annulment process?

I was born and raised Catholic, I attended church every week, went to catholic school, taken my sacraments, was an altar boy and CCD teacher.. a true definition of a devout Catholic. I started petition for a declaration of nullity of my marriage at the Catholic Tribunal years ago. After denial, I dove deep into the bible in hopes to find the true answer through the teaching of God’s word. I was invited to a Christian church and started attending service along with Catholic mass every week in hopes to find that truth. It made for a long Sunday, but it helped in my healing process. My annulment petition has been appealed all the way up to Rome, but I’m now feeling that my faith in the Catholic church and their teachings are starting to diminish as I learn more about their man-made rules. Their denial and forced separation from God has actually made me closer to him and HIS teachings. Here is a letter I sent to everyone in the Catholic Church involved in my annulment process.. To Whom This May Concern, Saturday, June 21, 1997, It was a sun - filled warm first day of Summer, a day in which two people consented to go together to church in order to get married in front of family and friends. There were tons of flowers, music playing, limos and well dressed guests, it was quite a fancy affair. On the surface it all looked, sounded and smelled like a wedding, the bride dressed in white and the groom in black, both consenting to marry each other at the altar. The couple had consented to a wedding, but proper marital consent was never present. In proper marital consent there are four factors in which two people must commit to: The spouses are free to marry. They freely exchange their consent. In consenting to marry, they have the intention to marry for life, to be faithful to one another and be open to children. Their consent is given in the presence of two witnesses It was a wonderful party, but it wasn’t a marriage because the content on the consent was invalid. At baptism, I was freed from sin and reborn as a son of God, I became a member of Christ and incorporated into the Church and made sharers in her mission. At First Communion, I celebrated the real presence of Christ in the bread, wine, and gathered community. Through Confirmation, the Holy Spirit gave me the increased ability to practice my Catholic faith in every aspect of my life and to witness Christ in every good or bad situation. During the Sacrament of Marriage, I was promised to be taken as a husband, to live together in holy matrimony, to be loved, honored, comforted, and kept in sickness and in health, forsaking all others, for as long as we both shall live. On the contrary, my spouse abandoned her home, husband and children while committing a grave act of adultery and mortal sin. Forsaking her marital obligations by acts of infidelity. 1 Corinthians 13:4-6 The verse says that love does not dishonor others and delight in evil. When you are cheating in a relationship, regardless if you are married or not, you are delighting yourself in evil. In conclusion, I have been affected adversely by divorce. My petition for annulment represents my calling out to the Lord to have the spirit of healing and bring me out of darkness. I honestly and whole heartily believed that civil law had the power to dissolve marriage and that remarriage was acceptable after civil divorce. - Canon 1099 Matthew 19:9 - I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery 1 Corinthians 7:15 - But if the unbeliever leaves, let it be so. The brother or the sister is not bound in such circumstances; God has called us to live in peace. Since my divorce and remarriage, I have felt abandoned and betrayed by the Catholic Church, excommunicated, convicted of a mortal sin and promised of an eternity outside of the presence of God in hell. I’m honestly being convicted of a sin in which I didn’t commit. I’ve also been excluded from the Lord’s supper, the celebration of the Eucharist, forbidden to receive the bread and wine, the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit, all while reciting - Lord, I am not worthy to receive you, but only say the word and I shall be healed. I will continue to pray each and every day in faith that justice will prevail in my petition for a declaration of nullity. Romans 8:1 - There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. God Bless.

Bad liturgy, bad theology, and pastoral indifference cause our youth to drift away from a faith they were never permitted to know.

The opposite is true for me. I embraced Catholicism as an adult and love being part of the Church! As a convert, I appreciate the Church more than many nominal Catholics. Also, after listening to all these reasons why ppl leave (re-marriage, LGBTQ rights, women's issues, etc), there are thousands of liberal Protestant churches, mainline primarily, that have gone the liberal and "inclusive" way and their pews are EMPTY today, which means that granting what is perceived as freedoms, does not automatically correlate with increasing church attendance and the return of the faithful. It is quite the opposite, based on all statistical reports.

I feel like Mary Magdalene in a room full of Pharisees throwing stones at me when I go to a function. I can’t bring myself to go to what I think are important things. Or volunteer. I wouldn’t have anyone to talk to. I live in a small town. So I feel sad when I go to mass.

For me it was the misbehaviour, mistreatment, and abuse in religious orders and institutes and how little actually there is discussion on this topic. For example, if you have left a religious institute because of the horrible experiences, no catholic will believe you, they just think you are trying to defame the church and the institute. This Cosa Nostra is truly untouchable.

The most serious issue I have with the Catholic Church is that it is unable to heal people (both spiritually and mentally). For example, I was told that confession is not psychotherapy, which is definitely true, but then, what is it? Why should God care if my sins are forgiven by such a rotten institution? How helpful can 10 Hail Mary's be to avoid the same sins in the future? At the moment, I just feel like letting the church bask in its sense of perfection until there are literally two or three believers in a parish, and heating in churches is financially unsustainable.

Every “lapsed Catholic” I know … “One day I started reading the Bible …”.

sinners are everywhere you need to know the Catholic faith well or you will be lost and leave, Jesus does not let me leave he touches me evetime the Eucharist is celebrated I feel him, one of the times I was kneeling down with my eyes closed and I saw a vision there were three small flames of fire, as I am hearing the priest lifts the host and praying says " Thru him and in him oh God oh mighty father in the unity of the holy spirit all glory and honor is yours now and forever and ever Ame Amen . Then the flames became one flame , I opened my eyes stood up and went to get the most holy Eucharist . This is where my Jesus is Amen

AMEN!

Priests get transferred every six years. Hard to want to invest in really knowing your priest because he will be gone.

You are on the right track. Faith and culture. Right on! I am a lapsed Catholic but not really, not in my heart. I will continue watching.

I left because I was sick of being treated so badly. The church has learned nothing about the child abuse scandle because a bunch abuse is still really common.

Our secretary thought she was the second most important person in our parish; I’m uncertain if that was God or our pastor. Not incidentally, our pastor was the kindest, caring, most thoughtful priest I have ever met. When people came to him with concerns, he didn’t tell them to go home and pray about it, he gave sound practical advice. After he retired I lost interest in attending church.

How does someone formally walk away from catholicism? Is there a procedure to follow, a form to fill out, like you would for an annulment ? Catholicism was forced on me from day one. It was not my choice ever. Want nothing to do with it. Just want it to be official.

Pope Francis is s good reason to leave

i will tell you some of the reasons i have thought about leaving..... hateful parish secretaries, priests who talk down to you in confession, being left out of things as a single person..... its all about married couples and families.... i feel the church just wants me for my money.... they dont care about me as a person.

These guys have no idea and perhaps they should interview real former Catholics.

The people I know who have left the Catholic Church has to do 2 things, the teachings on human sexuality mainly same sex acts and those who have been divorced and remarried without an annulment.

The only thing that I like about my parents' church, now is the food pantry.

Catholics like myself leave the Catholic Church after decades because they finally read their Bible and become born again and leave dead religion for a Bible believing church that preaches the good news of Jesus Christ! We are sinners he died for us so that we may have eternal life to all who accept this free gift! The good news is you can not earn or work for your salvation…salvation is a free gift from the Lord my good deeds are like filthy rags! Once you realize what a sinner you are you can finally realize your need for a savior!!!! I pray everyone picks up the Bible and seeks God while he can be found!!!!!! There is a time coming very soon that your time will run out don’t be found without Jesus!!!!!!!

I am 66, cradle Catholic, still practicing. I remain so because I simply "don't throw out the baby with the bathwater". There is a deep mysticism within our faith that I discovered, through grace, that focuses on the very core of the faith; this singular relationship with Jesus and the constant presence of Divine Love. There is NEVER a mention as to how to develop this depth, the readings of the mystics, etc.,in sermons that seldom go beyond the literal and banal. IMO the people are starved. Give them some real food. They desire spiritual food that they can use for their own deep, personal, spiritual development. In that way the boring priest or unfriendly neighbor won't chase them away. If they run that easily it's because they were never spiritually embedded. As a former Spiritual Director what I heard from young women is that they could never remain or become Catholic because in their view, it's an empire institution that allows oppresion of women. Why, they say, would I practice within a religion that does not allow me to advance. If this were the "real world" and I was employed by them, it would be illegal. They're not wrong. They find the exclusion of women in the priesthood archaic, medieval, and offensive. In my conversations, there is no "spin" or explanation that will get them to see it differently as it's just too counter cultural. The church's teachings on many topics are a hard sell in 2014. As I see it, the institution will evolve into something new or die. Right now it's dying. Those of us in the pews hold no power. You, as priests, deacons, bishops, cardinals, & the Popes, do.

U should be honest with divorced n married couples. The bible says no divorce n remarriage. So such couples should live as brother n sister as one cath priest preached. It's not easy. The holy spirit will give strength, real strength, to fulfil this task. He will surely do it if we seek him

Father, sorry, but I draw the line at "Roll Tide!" (Multiply-dipped Gator here and sometime parishioner during my student days at St. Augustine's Catholic Church in Gainesville, right across University Avenue from UF, in that diocese way east of y'all.) But seriously, God bless all y'all, and pray for me, David peccator.😅

I am 41 years old and say the catholic church is the most free believing than other christians churches. I see catholics leaving our faith without knowing it. I invite people with doubts in catholic faith to investigate more and not saying "all the priests, decons, nuns and the pope are wrong". Our church has been make corrections gradually 🙏🏻

They leave the church because of the sheer hypocrisy of the Catholic Church. I love the church and am a cradle Catholic but I find the “rules” of the Catholic church a lesson in hypocrisy. You have a married priest (which is fantastic) but my gosh, what a bend of the rules for the Pope to suit the church’s needs. This episode honestly made me cry. The Church is ridiculous in so many cases. Now I’m listening to a married priest state being lonely is a state of grace. Be serious. I am sure Father Doug means the best but he cannot be serious that a woman who was abandoned by a MAN that now loneliness is a friend. I have to stop watching now.

*FULL DISCLOSURE:* I’m a Protestant. As for _”not being fed”,_ I’m not sure what the Catholic view is on teaching _(catechesis?),_ but if a Protestant told me that, I would ask how long they had known the Lord. We are to mature spiritually just as we mature physically. At some point, we should have learned how to *FEED OURSELVES!* And then, in turn, learn to *feed others.* But, if I were Catholic, I would still attend Mass, since that would be my only access to at least some of the sacraments.

15:55 God bless you father. It makes my heart glad that you said that it's good if former Catholics find home and refuge in another Christian denomination, because they are still serving the Lord. I feel the same way about Christians find refuge and a better walk in the Catholic church. We may not agree w/ all each others doctrines, but I'm an echumenical Christian and I want people to stay serving Jesus either way. If they are closer to Jesus on another branch of Christianity, then praise God. The closer the better. We don't want Christians to be lost or become reprobate.

I watched n fast forwarded the video n couldn't find any solution to divorce n remarriage. But throughout the video all of u hv ignored 1 very important matter tht such people should turn to. But as always the rcc is all based on man made teachings n nothing more

Wow. I feel you are mind readers. Right on! Re mwntoring - it works. Look at the sponsorships in most AA groups. They work. I have 2 AA kids (in their 50's). I know it works.

Priest should be bold n make additional extra effort to teach the word of God to there parish church.

The Vatican is adorned with gold and diamonds and jewelry when you walk through it the Halls everything solid gold but your picture about suffering and overcoming

The restrictions on Latin Mass, very traditional traditions and going woke are my pet peeves with the church. As for being political, church must have the guts to call out sin and the remedy for it, woke society or not.

The Priests don’t uphold Catholic dogma they pander to certain groups and do not give sinners correct guidance - in a word, today’s Priests are weak.

Too many divorces an annulments. The US is crazy in this matter

I definitely do not want to do that (attend a mass in English)!

I was a strong Catholic from childhood to my early 30's but was shown the Bible (by an ex Catholic) I researched the church teachings against the Bible and found too many errors, paganisms and heresies which I sadly followed. Coming out from that institution to understand what by Grace through Faith for salvation is not a "works" based salvation which is the Catholic teaching "the Gospel plus works" than a time spent in Purgatory for the purification of sins. In the light of the New Testament there is a real revelation and freedom to worship God through Jesus Christ without condemnation, to know once saved always saved, choosing to live by the flesh or the spirit but always knowing that the Spirit in me cannot sin!...above all the Bible tells me without any reservation or confusion or doubt that the moment I take my last breath I will be in the present of my Lord regardless what the Catholic church teaches " In 2 Corinthians 5:8, the apostle Paul writes, “We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord” (KJV). The expression absent from the body refers to physical death. When this life ends, believers will be immediately ushered into the glorious presence of the Lord. Then we will see Him face to face (1 Corinthians 13:12). And, at that moment, we will be “present with the Lord.” READ YOUR BIBLE!

The Catholic Church is a Middle Ages (circa 1500) religion that still lives in a "sin universe" where leaving the world and retreating to a church is the way to live! Please note that Jesus did not retreat from the world, but went into the world to reach out to "saints and sinners." When it comes to sinners, the Catholic Church does not reach out to them as Jesus did. The Catholic Church only reaches out to Catholics and the "saved". The Salvation Army is the only religion that exists to reach out to "the poor and the hungry," hence they are doing the work of Jesus.

I was baptized Catholic as an infant but raised agnostic. I went to a lot of East Coast holiday masses with extended family. My experiences at these churches were not mean but highly reserved. I grew up under the impression that Catholicism is the Christian denomination for introverts in that most members wanted to be left alone in their prayers. Also, it’s hard to ignore that the Catholic Church was a world power like the modern day United Nations in the Middle Ages and it still is to some extent today. There’s definitely an element of protecting “the state” at all costs in the Church like any modern government. I think there’s a lot of reprogramming work in the Church that needs to be done to remake the Church as a spiritual beacon of truth and not a political one. I’m attracted to the guidance of spiritual discipline in the Church. Nevertheless, I’m turned off by the attempts at social discipline from the Church that’s a vestigial goal from a powerful political past.

1 Timothy:2:5.. For there is ONE God,and there is One mediater between God and man,the man Jesus Christ...John 14:6; Jesus said to him,I am the way,and the truth,and the life.No one comes to the Father except through me.

If the holy eucharist is individual what does a marriage have to do with it. This promotes no marriage and fornication.

I wouldn't call it the elephant in the room but with the shortage of priests I see more and and more priest from other countries preaching in America. Unfortunately, I feel that the language barrier is a serious problem. So much in that it's hard to stay focused. Everyone loves a good homily. I think we connect better. I think the shortage of priests is compounded because of the churches refusal to allow men to marry ( at least in America) and refusal to allow woman to become priest. I think its a larger issue than the church realizes.

I am not a Catholic. I went to a Catholic wedding recently. It was conducted in Latin. While the proceedings were visually pleasing, I had no idea what was going on. I thought it was all silly beyond description. Nothing I saw or heard would have any chance of causing me to explore becoming Catholic. If anything, it drove me in the opposite direction. I noted that, even while folks were speaking English about Catholic concepts, I didn't stand a chance of understanding anything.

Because it’s religious and not about seeking a personal relationship with Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. .. Jesus hates religion ! The religious people of His day were the only ones He ever spoke harshly to

It's the attitude of the priest and staff. Mocking people in the name of righteousness, telling people to go elsewhere, paranoia, NO spiritual direction for people who really need it...can't be bothered and not even pointing us in any direction. Who in their right mind would want to deepen their faith when they can't even find a spiritual leader to guide them. I am so angry and can't get over it.

♥️ from India

I am struggling with staying with the church because of my divorce and remarriage. My current husband (of 12 years) refuses to get an annulment from his 1st marriage. I may have gone on with mine if he was willing to pursue his. I talked to a priest, and he was very black and white and very rude. Basically stating church law. I knew the church law. I have not walked away completely, but it has slowly been happening since that conversation 10 years ago. I know if I go through the process, I will still not be free from sin of adultry as my husband (non-catholic) won't. My past marriage was horrible with mental and physical abuse and infidelity. I do not want to visit that trauma anymore. My children are adults now and would get backlash from their father and possible family if I pursue this annulment. They don't understand as they are not Catholic. I know the kind of questions that are on the annulment forms. My mom was a DRE, and she helped with annulment processes at that time. These are very personal questions my ex would not be willing to answer. And if he does, he is a narcissist and tells a different story than reality. So yes I am hurt by the rejection and I am seriously looking at Episcopalian or Lutheran church but I am Catholic and feel that guilt and that grief of losing my faith to where I would rather not even attend church at all. Also, the new priests that are coming out to the seminarian ( it seems like our church recieve the fresh out in the last 10 years) seem very black and white in their thinking. Very unreachable humans and give the impression of not compassionate at all. Definitely not someone I want to open up to. This is another reason I am thinking of leaving. They seem to not be the same compassionate priests I grew up with in the 80's and 90's. Are they trying to make them too unreachable for a reason. I am not the only one noticing this.

let's see. If I'm divorced and remarried, but have no annulment, I can't receive Communion. But if I'm a pro-abortion politician, I can?

Political Parties are irrelevant. What @pd417 is trying to say is the sermons are repetitious and don't address how they affect us as people today.

I stand with Martin Luther "The Bible and the Bible only." Babylon has fallen Revelation 14.

Man... this was just a big nothing burger

RCIA class taught heresy. Prayed to holy feminine holy spirit. Would not say that Homosexuality is a sin. Alter girls, laity eucharistic servers and blessings. I left looking for a more Traditional Catholic church.

One thing I think Protestants have that I envy are the bible studies.

Priests can not get married

I'll add another another reason I didn't hear mentioned... with widespread availability of the internet people can readily learn the Truths surrounding the formation of the early imperial Roman church/state, as well as liberal borrowings and influence its from pagan ancestors. An increasing amount of scholarship on this topic is being presented in the US and abroad, without fear of repercussion form the once-menacing Holy Roman church.

I am no longer a Roman Catholic and have no animosity towards Roman Catholics. Why I can not go back, is for many reasons. One thing I recognized, Eusebius rewrote history to define an orthodox view of the relationship between church and state. He rewrote history to accomplish this. He did this to help stop the murder of Christian’s, and he succeeded. Peter never even stepped foot in Rome. He did not have time to be an overseer/bishop and this was not his role. He was an apostle and elder. He did not speak the languages of Rome and was not a Roman citizen. His purpose had 99.9% to do with the house of Israel. He preached the gospel one time to a Gentile household, then he withdrew from the Gentiles. Paul, the only apostle to the Gentiles, was a Roman citizen and spoke their languages.

Ok! Too many reasons, but, JIMHO, none of them really addresses the real ones happening now... Let us to pick Generation Z for an instant. IN all Human history, Zoomers are: 1) The ones with the highest average life expectancy ever. 2) The ones with the highest average academic level ever. 3) The ones with the highest average general immediate information access ever. With a so high life expectancy, academic level and immediate information level, those youth have gained the highest OPTION level ever in human history!... When they feel ill they'll search a doctor, when they'll feel there is no justice in their case, they'll search for a lawyer, when they feel in need they'll search for a social worker professional... They won't search for a Priest, Pastor or any other religious leader of sorts... Forgive me... But the Church, JIMHO, has miserably failed on addressing this when that has started to be that way, back in mid XX century!... Surely Vat. II has tried to address a little bit of the thing... But ultimately the Church remained more or less like it has always been!... Being a Philosopher myself from State University training may have provided me with such that sensibility... But, sadly, it is rare for me to find someone whom shares all of my concerns... Because one cannot have a good answer, while not posing the question the right way!... People simply ceased to believe because they ceased to see a reason for believing and publicly to practice their belief. Sadly as "simple" as that. For me, now it is sort of too late. The society as a whole is going in a diverse direction most religious people dislike... Whatever we can now to do is to minimize the damage by retaining, at least some of the younger remnant... And TBHH: It would have been better if the leaders ceased to be so obsessed over human sexuality!... It would make wonders if simply the Church would go out of human sexuality for a while. No compromise with the world, but no condemnation as well. Simply out of that stuff. Currently I live in a rural area near Holly Mother of Fátima Shrine in Portugal that back in the day was a very solid conservative Catholic area... Not anymore. Here pretty much only the 75+ yo are going weekly to Mass. At my late 40's, I'm regularly one of the 5 youngest individuals on Church, other than on the few days when the kids Catechism comes. I've no hope on a better future. When kids make Confirmation day, it is like Church freedom day for them. That is what that "party" means for them. We will need some decades till we can again to restart on Europe as a Missionary area... But humility will need to prevail... And watch the Bible as a wonderful Catechism about the human salvation... Not a literal inerrant life guide like in the not so distant past. Forgive me if you find this far off topic, but I'm sort of tired of those discussions. Yeah: The scandals and corruptions matters... But there is tons of life out of that stuff to be addressed. And sadly nobody ready to address it... Oh, well... At least our beloved Pope Francis seems to be ready, but quite a Preacher in the desert, TBHH... Have a wonderful day!...

As some one exploring joining the catholic faith, as of today my biggest hang up is the Social Teaching and specifically the official approach of the church to achieving those goals as I understand. I can't submit myself to policy suggestions that to my reasoning mind clearly don't work in the way they are intended to. I agree with the stated goals I just don't agree with the way the church would like to achieve those goals.