As a fearful avoidant I am tired of hearing the excuses for the challenging relationships we have; everyone has a messed up childhood, and that is not an excuse to break hearts & ruin lives! I decided to work on myself so I can heal and be the best partner that I can be one day so I am not ghosted by a fellow avoidant ever again because they were too lazy or selfish to work on themselves and heal too! Life is all about choices, and there is always a choice to do better & be better regardless of the past!
Thats the spirit. As an ex of fa, your words gives me a bit of joy and happiness because you are looking to be happy like u and ur future partner derserve. I wish you the best!
Same, FA myself and after many half assed attempts in the past, I finally started my healing journey 5 months ago after losing my ex for a 2nd time. Made the decision for me because I was tired of feeling miserable and unlovable and even though its the most challenging task I've ever taken on, its so worth it because I'm starting to feel happy again
Dumped my avoidant ex after she came back from China. 30 days with no postcard, email, phone call or text. When she called and texted me, I returned the favor only for eternity. Now she can enjoy all the freedom she wants and I keep my sanity.
when i didnt want a commitment she loved me and chased once she got me got bored and didnt want it , so what do i do now? go back to being secure and indifferent its starting to attract her back
@@tankthearc9875 That's how it goes. I pushed my avoidant away at the beginning and thats when she was the most obsessed with me. When It got to the point where i told her i loved her, I think the relationship very slowly started dying. The final straw was when she said she wanted to move in with me and I agreed. I think she triggered herself by saying this. Or maybe she wanted me to say no. But we broke up soon after
I have 3 kids. I did skin contact with them, insisted on empathy. They grew up, and they pointed to me that my partner is a covert narc. I agreed, and they supported me during the breakup. They are all in meaningful relationships. These 300 kisses I was giving them daily saved my sanity.
yes, Avoidant partners do change, but not with you, when they leave they change for a while and if you come back they are the same the other time they change is when they are in a relationship with someone even more avoidant than them, and they become anxious and that's how they change, but not for you, for them.
Ex wife was quiet BPD and Fearful Avoidant. Spent 17 years with her. I was very secure. I think that's the only reason we were able to last so long. But over the years she slowly chipped away my boundaries and I did lose myself the last 5 years or so. But I pressed on each day. Finally it got to the point I pretty much lost myself and stood my ground on a last few boundaries, and she monkey branched to a bum. By that time I had started to lean AP or even FA a bit. My secure attachment may have improved her quite a bit, she was quite the mess when we first met, but ultimately she's still a mess. I don't think she will ever find what she thinks is out there. And at her age, I doubt she will find anyone willing to put in the effort. But hey, you never know I guess. In the meantime, I spent a year getting back to secure and am doing better than I have in a long time. Don't throw yourselves away for these people. You can have the biggest heart, I know I did, but you'll never fill their cup and you'll drain yours trying to. Find someone who will appreciate you and what you offer every day!
"You can have the biggest heart, I know I did, but you'll never fill their cup and you'll drain yours trying to." this breaks my heart.....I wish it weren't true, because that means we (I) have to give up on that partner.
I love my avoidant ex, but I don't want to be my partners mother or therapist. Im not responsible for their healing. They must make the choice to help themselves.
And they rarely want or seek for help. They think they don't need help and that they can heal themselves alone, by themselves. That's ridiculous.... I'm sorry for them.
I've been an avoidant for 44 years but only learnt about this in the past few weeks. Fascinating stuff. Also explains so much about my past relationships. It's actually heartbreaking when you break up with someone only to realise that you love them deeply but they have moved on. It's like waking up from a dream and into a nightmare.
@@Trapicidal they do things like hurting others without having any intention because they don't know about their problem, so the best thing is be informed about their problems and work it out slowly slowly till their subconscious is reprogrammed and change their behavior. You can only go through their problem and solve it if you love them, have patience, endurance and care about them, also they're willing to put effort to change, otherwise you should just leave, simply because there's no reciprocating emotional exchange for a while and that will make the life very hard.
All I can tell you guys is that I dated an avoidant for a while and even 1 year and 7 months I occasionally think about her. It still hurts but it gets better
Me, too. We gave it a 2nd shot but still didn't work out. Almost a year since our second breakup and I still think of him everyday. 💔 My family and friends are tired of hearing about it, but it's still there. Better, but there.
Im the same. I wonder what shes up to and if she would ever reach out. I honestly dont know how the interaction would go if she did, obviously would need to talk about things and dont think shes capable of that.
@@dannywholuv move on trust me. You won't be able to heal her. Even if she reaches out it will only for her own ego and self esteem, to make sure you're still there. I know I'm generalizing but at my own experience and some people's I know it never works out. Avoidants are selfish monsters and never care about us in the first place
I was dumped after 10 years. She told friends I grounded her. Didn’t matter once she was triggered. I have been in no contact for 4 months. Trying to play it safe by staying away. She wanted to remain friends, I refused. I won’t enable her. This is hard but I know it’s the best thing for me.
My ex reached out to me a day or two ago, after about 10 months. She's a day late and a dollar short, but no matter your viewpoint, keep in mind: you'll need a plan for when they reach out to you again.
10 years for me. I was always managing the relationship by being calm every time they threatened to leave, then a few events triggered him, and he left and treated me like I had never existed. Wanted to be friends, but I said no. It hurts like hell, but I'm sticking to it.
Good for you, don’t give into her! Trust me they don’t change and it can go on for decades like me 20 yrs and it’s so bad now attorneys are involved. Find a decent person and watch for those red flags because they tell a lot!
I faced my demons and they beat the shit out of me. I gave myself severe, life-threatening PTSD in an attempt to fix my own reactive abuse. I had to figure out what was causing my unwanted reactions and why. I’m avoidant because of a lifetime of “known but un-thought” trauma. Give us some grace. Not everyone has the strength or even the ability to face their heavy past. It’s sad really. For every person they hurt, they hurt themselves more. Which only makes it more difficult to untangle the pain of the past as time goes on. Early intervention is key. Don’t put up with abuse. Communicate, set boundaries and enforce them, part ways if/when necessary.
💔 Their AMBIVALENCE to connection is so brutal, almost violant in its force and nature, like this huge heavy pendulum that swings, like a wrecking ball that wrecks everything in sight, ie everyone around them, the more close you are to them, the more the injury you will suffer is brutal. Their CHAOTIC emotional world regarding romantic relationship and true intimacy is truly unbearable to be around, they are all over the place all the time, ficlkle minded by the hour. the hurt they cause is immense. I truly feel sorry for them, for him - my avoidant, I cannot understand how he could give up on me, I was so attuned to his pace and need for autonomy as I need those for me too sometimes yet I am secure and patient, How could he let me go completely without missing me and reconnecting after I left him completely alone? He killed our connection. I hurt so bad every single day. The pain is immense. No therapy can help me with that. Help 😢
Hi, I went through similar caos with my ex partner. You should understand that some people are attention seeker and manipulate people for their benefit. It’s over, it hurts but will help you focus on yourself and take your time to heal. After this relationship it’s like you took a vaccine and now you are immune to this disease. Next time you’ll keep more attention and will recognize if the person you are seeing has these toxic traits. Hope you get well, keep working on yourself and you’ll be ok. Love you ❤
Mine discarded me 7 months ago, she said she couldn’t give me what I needed. Like you, I was attuned to her needs for distance and space because I also like my own time by myself. I was really good to her, we never fell out or had any conflict ever. She cheated on me with an Ex , lied about it , then began deactivating. She dumped me and jumped ship with this Ex she met a year before. He was likely ‘ put on the shelf ‘ the whole time I was with her. She then committed to him and is still with him, moved him in to her place etc. it’s like Wow ! It’s an extremely painful experience. It didn’t make any sense because this guy is an alcoholic and was still drinking. I am sober by a few years ( we met in AA) she has 3 young boys too ! I was thinking ‘ really ‘ ?!! You’re subjecting your boys to that ! ? Unbelievable. I felt sorry for the boys and I’m sure they must have wondered where I’d gone to suddenly. It pushed me into a massive depression, I was broken for a few months. I had to obsessively learn attachment theory and read A LOT OF MATERIAL. It didn’t wipe it away but it really helped to get educated to a high level on this stuff. I suggest blocking and removing them from social media. If you’re not ready to do that yet , it’s ok , but when you are , it’s a great indicator of your decisions to respect yourself. Over time I could see it for what it was. Each case is unique but the patterns are common. Luckily I had Salsa as a hobby, I had not long begun lessons before she discarded me so I went full on into it like 4 nights a week. I’m now quite advanced for someone who’s only been doing it under 1 year. Distract ! Learn ! Sleep ! Look after yourself. I did loose loads of weight because I go a bit anorexic when I’m in a lot of pain. I couldn’t date or go into any kind of sexual relationships either! A lot of my guy mates are kinda baffled I havnt ! Maybe it’s a good thing in the long run! I just felt worthless and parts of me can still feel that today. It’s like I’m infected with their toxicity somehow and others can see it bleeding off me! I guess some of it is my own childhood abandonment traumas! After 2 years sober it was brutal to experience that because I was shut off from my emotions for years and years. Maybe it’s a great lesson and a pathway to deeper healing 🤷🏼♂️ ! All I know is , I havnt used any body or done anything to change the way I feel ( apart from salsa) she taught me lots about myself. The dynamic is, the avoidant basically holds a mirror back at you to reveal the parts of yourself that are missing, it’s like a spotlight on the relationship to myself. I held onto a person who couldn’t love me, value me, appreciate me. That is quite possibly the subconscious unhealed parts of me that I drank on. It echos back to the inconsistent love and attention I received as a child from my mother who is somewhat emotionally immature, because she was raised by emotionally cold and harsh parents in the 1950’s.
Oh honey I’m so sorry. My heart breaks for you as you described my exact scenario with my avoidant man. I wouldn’t wish this pain on anyone. It’s been 3.5 months and it still hurts terribly. I met a kind and handsome man recently and I just can’t give him anything because I feel so empty and all I want is my terrible, toxic love who cares not at all for me. Scotty my Scotty, why do you push love away?
Amazing & insightful self analysis! You’re an inspiration and the perfect example of someone who has done the inner work! The world would be a much better place if everyone took time and energy to do what you’ve done! Inspirational & thanks!
You are describing anxious & fearful avoidants here. Dismissive avoidants were created through smothering and enmeshment, they were the golden child, they crumbled under high expectations.
"When the Avoidant loses a person...." NO! CORRECTION When they treat someone like sh**, pull back, ignore, cause undue stress/anxiety to others not to mention putting them quickly in therapy, , CHEAT, LIE, MANIPULATE, and then deny they have a problem...that's how the real intro should start here. Sorry, just my true thoughts and experiences, let's discuss Borderline Personality Disorder or something else. The "Attached" book was written a long time ago...Sorry Chris, just my true thoughts and experiences about Avoidants...
Yes, mine too. It's like volunteering to sacrifice yourself to some lunatic. You'll lose yourself trying to help a black hole. You'll forever be changed by the absolute insanity you experience. Don't get it twisted either, it's abuse plain and simple.
My FA ex monkey branched to another. He had planned to keep me as a friend. It didn’t work out like that. I declined and walked away without a tear or drama. I am his only ex who did not remain a friend. Radio silence forever for me. I think he thought I would always be in his life. Nope. I moved on and healed. I do watch videos occasionally. Never again!!!
@@cjeverydaydays2492 "they do. Being avoidant is a human condition." --- monkey branching & being an avoidant are two very different things. with your comment, you have made it clear that you do not know the difference.
@Slaughterproof I'll finish the story: About a year later one of them DID reach out. She told me they met up and it was a complete disaster. She never really elaborated. Very weird girl. She suddenly ghosted me too after knowing her 3 years. I was friendzoned from the start but I was not in love with her but we hung out from time to time. Great conversations. Whole story is weird.
I only just realized after this video how much I appreciate the effort and thoroughness you put into your videos. It doesn’t just focus on the topic at hand but you meticulously back it up with careful research so that in the end I am more enlightened, and knowledgeable, with a more holistic point of view. That what makes your content stand out from the masses for me.
truly amazing vids, audio and visually meticulously crafted! big fan.! underrated af . I'll bet he will accumulate many views as attachment stlyles become more and more widely discussed and understood.
Even better is to not engage with them the moment you suspect they may be avoidant. Be careful about who you entertain and assess whether they may be avoidant early on before you enter any type of intimate relationship with them.
I thought your solar system with the sun, and orbiting planet was spot on. I tried to be the supportive person helping, keeping a distance giving them space.... Unfortunately in the end after 7 years I no longer had the patience as he would not give me a real relationship and continue to tell me we're "just friends". However, we did all types of couple activities and many sleepovers. In addition, I've met his family also. He would not budge an inch. I will be the only ex that refused to maintain his hokey friendship talk... To keep me in his orbit and use me for emotional support on his terms.
Conflict presents an acute risk to the safety of relationships with avoidants. Avoidants need to stay in control and, however unconsciously, giving ground for them would upset the balance of power, which can be too torturous a position. They find it very hard to think like a team as they innately view this as dangerously giving up part of themselves. While they may believe they want relationships in theory, in practice they experience regular aversion to their partner - no stronger than when inevitably faced with issues or forced to confront emotions, which means they are much more at risk of walking away. Partners often sense this, which creates a problematic power imbalance in conflict, when both are not showing up with equal desire to move towards resolutions and to make the relationship work as a team.
@@lisaosborne8635There ARE so MANY avoidents OR Narcissists out there, you CAN'T help but be involved with SOME in your life EVERY DAY, no matter where you go or what you do! That commercial on T.V. for Al a non states:"one out of TWO families has someone that suffers from Alcoholism! One out of THREE women lives in ABUSE or is raped at least once in a lifetime! These are the statistics but I believe EVERY family has some one that has a alcohol problem and EVERY woman lives in ABUSE or is raped at least once in a lifetime! Now that we are in the age of information and of course, social media things have grown, changed, and morphed into this reality of delusion that is not able to sustain life, "living on life's terms!" We can now share our experiences, compare, learn and make educated choices and decisions based on other's factual information! It's a Blessing and a curse at the SAME time! You CHOOSE what it is for YOU! So YOU now can determine what direction you want to continue in your life! Which CAN be a tremendous burden sometimes! Like going to battle or war so to speak... If you are a Christian and are educated on the Bible it says,"these things are supposed to happen!" "people will be lovers of themselves, not following God's commandments," "Sin WILL be rampant and cool the Love of MANY!" I think this IS happening right NOW! So it IS getting harder to find "true, authentic, honest people out there, or ANYWHERE! So be AWARE! Be SAFE! Be Prayed up "using wisdom and discernment!" Be BLESSED! 💯🙏❤️🔥💥💫🌴🌈🌅🕊️💕
@@Julie-nj6ljTo get to know others to determine if they are avoidant, you don't need to be in a romantic relationship nor physically intimate settings with them. There are questions you can ask and scenarios and situations you can use to determine if they are avoidant before moving forward with them.
I think the problem is people who look for happiness and validation outside of themselves, from another, will never admit and understand they have internal issues and they tend to repeat the same cycle of misery over and over without finding that “happiness” they’re looking for. They never heal, grow, evolve, or try to look at the situation from another perspective because they’re emotionally and mentally immature.
Best comment. I agree! Their internal issues / core wounds have nothing to do with us. Yet it seems their lack of confidence and shame make them feel so bad about themselves and in order to try and make themselves feel better they use outside validation; maladaptive coping mechanisms; and push people away by being mean to make themselves feel better. They are constantly mistrusting and reading into others behaviors and tendencies that they themselves are doing regularly. Incredibly hypocritical. Emotionally immature and an inability to even look at themselves in the slightest. Just my experience with an diagnosed extreme DA who leans FA as well. You’d think after so many years of this cycle they would finally have to look at themselves. Mine hasn’t really so we didn’t grow together. That’s okay. I got radical acceptance eventually that he’s not going to do the work. That’s when I focused on me not us. I didn’t understand why our therapist said you are paying the price for his childhood trauma and his past traumatic romantic relationships. Plus she couldn’t believe how patient; and understand ing and compassionate I was for so long. Now I understand. Not even attracted to him anymore as he reminds me of my stepdad. I understand why I was attracted to him and I’ll never get to re write the past. Don’t need to because I love myself and finally know my worth. I too no longer need the external validation. ❤
I have to admit that watching all your videos, going deep and carefully in your analysis, that help me a lot mentally and emotionally to understand what i’m going through in the past 5 weeks. Where i found myself attached to an avoidant person, where things started perfectly well in the first 3 weeks, then turn to miserable hell in the last 2 weeks. My head was about to explode just in order to get the answer for one basic simple question “Where/how/how did things went wrong?”, and now i can tell i know the answer. I understand my fuck up, i understand i rushed things and pushed it harder, she felt her boundary got pushed and now here we are. Thank you do much Chris. Keep going ❤
I'm a fearful avoidant but I would never treat someone like shit. I just hide when I get triggered. It's really hard to understand for people around me😢 I can only hope they're still here when I come back when I feel safe again. I know it's selfish to hope for that... so if they don't stick around I understand.
Do you tell your partner when you disappear? If not, then you are treating someone like that. Thats a large part of the issue, the lack of communication. I won't assume how you do or don't communicate, but a lot of avoidants just go silent from their partner without a word, just to pop up days, weeks, even months later, acting like nothing happened.
@@AttachmentTheory-oo2ds I communicate about it yes. The other way around was too hard for him tho... he just ghosted on me :( But that's a different story.
Have you tried going to therapy so you can find better coping strategies? I’m happy to hear that you don’t discard people but you deserve to experience healthy, loving relationships.
very clear explanation, not to mention the excellent video. Thank you for what you are doing. Feeling almost hit over the head realising how many dysfunctional humans there are not knowing how they affect themselves and their romantic situationships. Wish you to keep on opening eyes to as many as possible and make this world better
I will forever love him, I feel sad seeing this and truly understand what the cause was for abandoning me. However, I cannot be with someone who is not capable of receiving love. Now I must heal and move on.
Im going thru same shit , keep work on yourself, educate about them , try to fully understand and look at it rationally not emotionally, that will help with self healing. Not being around them is helping you , not ruining u.
I like that you used the word dark side. Right after my ex avoidant broke up with me, I dreamt that I was in my bedroom having a really nice convo with him. Which was the perfect depiction of our r/shp. Just nice and pure and deep and all the good things you want in a partner. Then suddenly monsters broke in through the wall. I ran away, I thought he would follow me but he was stubborn and didn't want to look like I was leading him or that he was scared or whatever. I had to close the door behind me or the monsters would take over the whole house. I know that was so selfish and I hate that I did that inthe dream. He was mauled but I came back with my mum to check on him. He said he was fine through the door(we were scared of opening it incase the monsters would come out) but I could smell blood. I feel like this explained what happened. The darkness took over him and I could only care about myself so I wasn't able to help him. I was anxiously attached and all I cared about was how he wasn't meeting my needs... I didn't really understand him then
You're not selfish, you're good hearted .. Your energy knew he'd sacrifice you if you stayed - hence the blood - he'd already sacrificed himself and needed your blood to survive but you have like 'guides' watching over you that gave you powerful messages of intuition through a dream to help you on your journey - you were destined for new pathways 💛 Stay in the light
I second what jone7079 said. You are not responsible for killing someone else's monsters. You can support them in their quest sharpen their sword, give them a shield, but you are not their monster slayer and you are DEFINITELY not their shield against the monsters (if that makes sense).
I think part of it like you said with their childhood and conditioning is partly because this is normal to them. They were probably surrounded by this emotionally unavailability and saw it as normal if not even something to look up to. The other part of it is also what I see with a lot of golden childs... they are so used to their superiority and will stop at nothing until they find it and their world will crash if it doesn’t work out. I think someone who is actually kind and loving compared to how they were raised is so foreign to them that it’s actually suspicious.. it’s so out of their comfort zone that they start to see them as the biggest enemy. It’s so different that it’s unsettling and they seek any way to make their partner into this character and sabotage everything. They leave so many in their wake and i’ve seen them brag about it but upset privately. They ask why? But they do absolutely nothing to change it.. i’ve seen them rehearse and pantomime progress over and over. They feel like being accepted by those who hurt them is more important than being there for the one that loves them because that one is like the invader, the one that makes them challenge all their notions of love and emotions. I think the real issue is they idolize the ones who taught them to be emotional unavailable and they endlessly seek it from them, that rejection is part of their desire and driving force. When love comes easy, it’s questionable and even comes across as weak which is probably how they feel underneath it all. To them their saving grace is having acceptance from the ones who taught them this conditioning, they perpetually seek it out. it sad but as much they want love, they been programmed to see it as weak and their pain stems from not having enough approval and acceptance from the ones who kept them at a distance in the first place.
I mostly agree. Its a parental or caregiver wound that needs to be healed which is why approval is needed by someone who is like the dismissive parent vs someone who is understanding and attentive. When you grow up with dismissive and un-attentive, it feels odd to have someone who is healthy. The kicker is, the dismissive un-attentive parent may have thought themselves unworthy of a child's unconditional love for their parent and pulled away. Little did they realise what they were modeling for their child. They made it about them instead of what the child needed.
@@RH-ul2bcfor me, the war wages inside when I “have to” show up for my son emotionally because I don’t know how. I have no idea how to naturally give or receive love in most situations. There’s a hole in my chest where comfort and unimpaired empathy should be, like I can feel it and it feels like grief. First, with my impaired empathy, I see how I could hurt him if I don’t show up properly. He could end up in a lifetime of pain like me. Second, my lack of comfort, it brings back all the times I just needed a hug and acceptance from my mother and she dismissed and covertly shamed me. It’s a double edged sword. Every loving interaction with my son feels forced and painful and it overshadows the comfort and empathy I so desperately want to give him. Then throw on shame for not being able to stop being avoidant. Yes, my healing journey is well underway. It traumatized the shit out of me but I’m finally able to connect with my son again. And I’m doing an amazing job parenting very intentionally instead of reactively from a place of my own abuse. I plan to guide him down a path of emotional intelligence and secure attachments. Put a stop to generational trauma !
This video is a master piece. You are saying many things you tought to us in the past, but in a very clear way. It is also offering realistic hope and respect to both parties. Awesome call out to institucionalized children challenges. Just want to add from first hand,...children's neuroplasticity is so huge that they can learn love quickly, and the cases you shared are on the extreme side. I do not want to discourage adoption projects as those are very fulfilling,...in my case being a mother of adults I can proudly call it the best project of my life. Thank you Chris for becoming better each day, taking us with you. Greetings from Costa Rica 🎉🇨🇷
I wonder how much early childhood neglect and temperment factors into how the avoidant personality gets formed. Some people have a value system and morals which allows for them to live the life of a eunuch to help them accomplish more, not less, in their life sometimes after the person has realized they can accomplish far more while being a single person who is not actively looking for romance. That is far different than the kind of person who is avoidant while often having wishful thinking fantasies about the ideal romantic partner for them who is somewhere out there or who is becoming one.
yeah my avoidant ex was poly (they had a partner when we met), and somehow thought they could have TWO meaningful deep committed long term relationships?? Lol. I was discarded two weeks after they moved in with their other partner (which they didnt want to do but were fawning over this person who was arguably more toxic and way less compatible than we were ). It was a whole MESS.
Thanks for this video. This made me cry a bit and echoed a lot of what my therapist and I have been talking about in my weird, on again/off again relationship with this girl I love. She ticks all the avoidant boxes. As much as I want to save her and make everything easy for her...and just be with her, I have to keep prioritizing myself, even when her distance hurts.
This is a beautiful video Chris. I've watched thousands of videos, read hundreds of articles, dozens of research studies, and several books. I think this may be the most educational, gentle, and well intentioned video I've seen to date. I hope every person who unfortunately developed an avoidant attachment, and everyone who loves an avoidant whether they've been lost or are trying to find a way through the dark, sees this video. This will help a lot of people if they are able to let it, thank you. I don't subscribe to anything normally, but I hope you continue to create videos with this level of care, so you've got me. Thank you again
I love your content ❤ so thought provoking and profound, unique way of examining this topic... Can you please consider making a video on the urge from "our" end to fix the avoidant? This urge to be their lighthouse and live happily ever after after we mend them is immense, I feel the passion to fix him and explain and love him in my body... can you please shed some light?
People made up so many different labels, titles and names for behaviors, making it all so diverse and complicated while its actually quite simple: Someone wants to be in a relationship with you, or someone simply doesn't want that. If someone is acting strange or avoid any type of emotional connection with you; they DONT want it with you. Just go and find other people who does want an emotional connection with you. Or you stay and analyze all the behaviours of someone who doesn't want to be close to you. 😅 If someone wants to be in an emotional/romantic relationship with you, you will definitely notice that in their behaviour as well. ❤
i agree for the most part that we are all using psych terms carelessly taught to the masses and usually very subjective from the teacher as well. It’s a speculative science designed around pharmaceutical profit. However.. analyzing behavior of yourself or someone else is always important when there’s a clear pattern of the behavior. If it is destructive and ongoing, yes we can explore what that means but i really don’t think it’s ok how often we are quick to label and diagnose one another even if we have a background in the field. I don’t think it’s healthy but I think it’s alright for people to try to understand the behavior but be careful about easily labeling someone or casually diagnosing them. It’s honestly just creating more stigma.
I had someone in my life who is an avoidant. Yes, he wanted to be close but he could not manage. And after I while I was simply done doing all the heavy lifting in that situation for him (walking up to him after an argument, rebuilding connection ...). There are easier relationships out there, so why bother?
Love your "Frankenstein" phantom ex theory. Makes total sense. I could never feel good enough around my FA ex, as he would subtly dredge up my self doubts. I could sense unrealistic expectations of me, that I needed to measure up to something perfect. He admitted having MANY ex girlfriends, some of which he continued to obsess over. It became clear he was still not over one or more of them, and this was part of his vague excuse to flee for the last time. ... I also like your analogy about how abandoning my own universe is self-destructive. I became guilty of that, just trying to help him find comfort in the love he seemed to be reaching out for. But the more I tried to offer my love and insight into healing, the more he retracted and isolated. I still don't think he was/is receptive to active healing, as I believe he is finally settling into the dark "yang" you describe. And I definitely have returned to my own universe, much happier and confident again.
Not to sound overly insensitive, but the pain of avoidants can’t be that great; otherwise they’d do the work of therapy to feel better and do better. That’s what I always get stuck on: When my depression got so bad I would do anything, any kind of therapeutic intervention because I was in hell; avoidants don’t see their behavior as problematic or even that self-destructive. Maybe a little wistful yearning here and there, but they’re masters at self-soothing. Ultimately I don’t really buy this woeful tale. Avoidance isn’t in the DSM, but the trauma they unleash on secure and anxious attachers is 100% in the DSM. It’s real, long-lasting, devastating harm. We’re Charlie Brown; they’re Lucy.
You are spot on! The damage is severe. Nobody really understands this! They stuff their feelings and move on to the next victim! We are left drowning in our feelings like we were brainwashed😢
Secure attachment here. Thirteen years with a DA, the last two years of the relationship fighting with the DA and my covert narcissist mother = crazy levels of stress and major depression. He left because "I'm not in love with you", but he added when he was running downstairs, "we can be friends!".
@@kimwells2369 and they ultimately don’t care. There’s never genuine remorse. And virtually never any change on their part. The only cold comfort you can take is that they will always have failed relationships.
Because they have moved out of their hearts, or they shut their hearts up or off. When you're mental, you're far more cold. They operate from mind & brain and the heart is shut away. Because they had to do that. Whether they can ever rescue that is up to the individual. How much potential regret do you want looking back?! Trauma causes you to skip back to the past, like a broken record. Most avoidants I think ARE aware enough. It's whether they can face going back into that room where their heart is shut away. So sad.
Psychologist here, and you're not actually correct. There is nothing in the DSM that singles out "trauma caused to a person with anxious or secure attachment by a person with dismissive avoidant attachment". Trauma is trauma. What's in the DSM are PTSD, DID and OSDD. And none of these are caused by a breakup in a normal context of a relationship that wasn't violent or physically, sexually or emotionally abusive.
After 13+ year's married, she had me thinking I was always the problem because she is an alcoholic and knows that's my childhood and trauma. I was put down, belittled, etc. I was 15 years clean off Mem I relapsed for 4 2; months. I am a codependent person. I literally was going crazy, and nuts, ready to end it because she was the Devil. When she called me a narcissist, I thought... am I!? So over the last week and a half I started digging and researching. I have learned so much thankfully and why didn't I see this TOXICITY years ago I would have bailed. That's when I learned I am Anxious Attachment and shes an Dismissive Avoidant. Would she be Narcissistic and relationly be a DA? I am confused. I also would love to go NO CONTACT but we have two girls. A 12 & 3 year old. My 12 year old lives with me and 3 yr. old with her. I know shes smeared me all over our small community and even has my own Uncle and his wife. She gets to drinking and running at the mouth admits it once to me and deny. And I had just gotten a pretty guys him but
They have to want to fix it, the one thing I love about attachment is there is awareness of EARNED SECURE attachment... BUT each of us are responsible for earning that secure attachment with ourself
My avoidant ex can only remember the fights, he’s still, after four years apart (after 16 years together), angry at me for leaving. He’d made it clear he had no interest in having a real relationship just having me on call when he had a social event and he didn’t seem to understand why I wanted more. He wanted no emotional attachment at all. My biggest regret now is hanging onto hope so long.
My DA ex boyfriend and i were on and off for 10 years. I did everything i could was loving and supportive. He ghosted me a year ago and im still healing. I got sucked up into the un healthlyness. He thought he was just made this way and wont changed
This makes sense.. and without getting into too much detail... I did this... we will see. I am not waiting around for nothing to happen and I am not jumping into something else just to ease the pain or avoid what isn't.
I read the comment section and it makes me feel better to know I’m not alone. I keep my feelings and emotions bottled up as I feel it’s kinda weak to admit weaknesses, but I’m slowly opening up, at least enough to foster the help I need. I had a fearful avoidant monkey branching bipolar covert narc., we were friends for well over half a decade and he was my bestfriend during Covid as he didn’t mind texting a lot. He had a massive manic episode started using drugs again and then everything he was masking came out. I didn’t see it until it was too late. But after 2 1/2 years now, I feel better and honestly don’t care that he’s not around anymore. Theres still a wound and it can still hurt when something triggers it but I recognize it for what it is now, it’s just a memory, it can’t hurt me now. And now I have the superpower of recognizing people like him ahead of time. I can easily screen for it, it’s kinda cool.
I was his FIRST partner, and still not good enough. He told me his secret fantasy was him walking into a bar and not recognizing me! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 To be fair, he wasn't only avoidant but an emotionally abusive covert narc.
u understand that every woman says this about her ex to avoid accountability for anything she did wrong. narcissists make up about 1% to 2% of the population, but its funny how every single woman's ex is a narcissist & she did absolutely nothing wrong lol smh
@@asdfxcvbn746Also, the described fantasy of walking into a bar and not recignizing the other person is narcissistic. And so is avoiding accountability, which you mentioned yourself. It is important that we take accountability and hold others accountable at the same time.
@@nickus51 "Also, the described fantasy of walking into a bar and not recignizing the other person is narcissistic." --- what? y'all just say anything just to use the overused narcissist label lol smh... so let me get this straight, a man having a sexual fantasy about walking into a bar makes him a narcissist? you are reaching so hard rn lol smh
@@asdfxcvbn746 Did you spend 6 horrible years with him? Did you have to get a restraining order against him? Were you there when his own parents told him he was poisonous and no good? Or when his sister said she wants nothing to do with him? Were you there when he was fired causing disruption amongst his colleagues and insubordination? Oh. I thought you were...
@@asdfxcvbn746 You might want to re-read what I said and do some research on narcissism. I said narcissistic behaviour, not narcissist as a person. Stonewalling, silent treatment, ignoring someone and similar behaviours are narcissistic and abusive. Someone telling you they fantasize of going to a bar and not recognizing you, that is fantasizing about stonewalling you. Hence, it is narcissistic. Given that it triggered you so much, better question is why. I suggest some self-exploration.
Your videos REALLY helped me in the past 4 months Chris, i'm still trying to heal but i'm not sure if she was an avoidant or a narcissist or both. She love bombed me at the beginning, i thought it was the perfect relationship and all was great at first. She also told me that she wants a future with me and kids and cannot ever give up on me. I was by her side in the most important events of her life like after finishing high school and getting the med school exam
It's hard to tell the two apart on most days. I find that narcissists pretend to care when they don't. While avoidants actually care but pretend that they don't. They shove it dooooown. For narcissists it was never there in the first place to be shoved down
Those poor institutionalized kids - even the fostered ones .. I remember watching a show and seeing how neglected these kids were and it has always stayed in my mind and broken my heart 💔 I fully ebullient and gained a lot from this material, i liked the ☯️ examples and the "stages" was waited for me to see from those angles and gave me deeper meanings that resonated.. Tysm for your content, subscribed and can't wait to see more ❤
I didn't fall in love with her get married or to marry my wife to be a babysitter and only to shut down ghosted and be with someone that's broken..... fix yourself for Christ's sake or die alone I could care less about her childhood we all grew up with a messed up childhood some what. She just turned 50 she's been through like 30/40 different relationships. You mean to tell me you've been on this rock for 50 years and still can't find love..... goodbye
Avoidants need to heal their caregiver/parental wound of being dismissed and emotionally abandoned or they will look for love in all the wrong places. This takes a deep dive and awareness few people have and can take some time to get past. They can be attracted to unavailable people and usually are. Its no picnic for an avoidant either. Look at your relationships with your parents. As a child and now as an adult. I dont say that to dole out blame (it helps to be forgiving and often times its repeated forgiveness as you go thru the emotional layers to heal). Being a parent isnt easy. Once some dots get connected with emotions aside, you can begin to heal no matter what your attachment type. Every day is a new opportunity to do things better. Treat yourself and others with respect and understanding. None of us are perfect. 🙏
19:47 I agree with this part, but don't be in a relationship with someone at a dying star phase. Maintain a bigger distance and have them seek you out while you focus on your own thing. Allow them to change on their own without it disrupting your own life.
I had to leave her and our situationship after 12 years. She’s DA and I’m FA leaning anxious. It’s been 11 months. I thought I was fine for awhile because I threw myself into work and numbed out. Now I’m feeling my feelings and it’s extremely painful. She broke me. The push/pull intermittent reinforcement, breadcrumbs. I knew she was wounded and I made the mistake of thinking I could love her out of her wounds. I can’t love her out of her attachment style. I can’t fix her, rescue her, or make her happy. I feel terrible because I think she’s much worse than my own wounds are. I lost myself in the situation and abandoned myself. Now I am starting therapy soon to repair my own attachment wounds so hopefully I will never repeat this same pattern again. I’m drawn to these types like moths to a flame and after all these years , it just feels abusive. The twisted thing is, I still love her.
@@dont6441True. But it gives them the Upper hand to swim instead of sink. The passion that’s needed to change the institutionalized manner some babies are born into.
Basically love them from a distance. Maintain your own life and show them what stability looks like. Keep yourself stable and safe, don't take their behavior personally and stay far enough away to not plug them into the center of your solar system thus losing yourself kinda thing.
I can't believe how accurate this is man. Im trying to be better and im trying to fight against my true nature, but im 28, and ive tried and tried. I used to hear the phrase "people never change" and get upset, because that's BS, and i have changed a lot for the better, but the older I get the more i feel like i should just accept who i am, and leave people alone. Maybe its true, and people never change.
well u should accept who u are. that is the first step. It is not ur fault that u are avoidant, u r not defective u just developed a protective mechanism to deal with people when u were a kid. Now that u are an adult u just have to show ur inner child that, "hey, u remember we use to be scared of this thing well now it is not scary because we are grown ups too. its fine let us move slowly." u are not wrong or bad but atleast u r aware thats so great.
Not true. As an Anxious preoccupied, I've reprogramed my beliefs, it's doable. Read and watch videos, the more you educate yourself you'll start learning about yourself and how nothing is wrong with you. Not only that, learn all attachment styles. This will help you not personalized other people's actions, helping you better understand them
@@SuicidalChocolateSK Every body is capable of changing for the better as long as they are willing to put in the resources and continue to find different ways to fix themselves. People never change because that's too hard to do
What happens when the avoidant tries to control you why you orbit in your own life? They control by rejecting small things. They’re compelled to do it.
@@chrisseitercoaching Fantastic, Chris - well done! I was genuinely thinking that the person who did the graphics did so well😅. The video is the exact message I needed - great quality too!
I wanted to be there for him but I am heavily leaning into the anxious attachment even though I exhibit a lot of secure traits. And I had to leave him because I knew I could not hold him through his process, even though I think he really started to trust me that maybe I could. I started therapy when I fell in love with him (before we ever dated) because I felt I had to heal myself first before being able to have a healthy relationship. I did not think we would start dating shortly after. I am sorry for leaving him alone again everyday and for not being strong enough or meeting him later in life. But I also realized that I myself still have a long way to go and my wounds may also be too deep to ever being a really safe partner for him. I have a lot of regrets, I think of him everyday, I miss him immensely and then I have anxious spirals sometimes myself or also idealize him but I am staying away even though it is the hardest thing I have ever done and I hope he is happy and finds ways to heal himself and has a lot of people who will help him, even if I cannot be one of them.
Not sure? It's in every video: therapy, lots of it, so you can heal. You will need to shop around to find someone who specializes in attachment and someone you can feel comfortable with. And do the work.
Just because a relationship broke it, that doesn’t mean a relationship with you will fix it. Women are constantly raising men, prioritizing other people…It’s ok to not be that person and opt out for your own happiness, health and well-being. You’re worth being in a healthy relationship with other secure people.
That's a great explanation for the "phantom ex" phenomenon. I was avoidant before, and the more I grow the less I tend to let that franken-ex show up as a made-up memory. I made that mistake of getting absorbed completely in my last relationship. Now we just broke up, It's difficult even remembering who I was before these 3 years. I was an avoidant before, I worked on myself hard enough to become anxious which I think was a progress still. Now I'm willing to become secure. I'm 29 so hopefully I can in a few years become good enough for myself, and build a healthy relationship.
what a joke - don't be someone's therapist so they can 'heal' - you weren't put on this earth to sacrifice your life to do this kind of work - unless of course you choose being a therapist as your professional and get paid for it - then yes, by all means you can specialize in a practice on avoidants if that's what you choose to do
@@damienandraynemusic so wait.... partner's were put on this earth to sacrifice their needs and ignore them and instead stick around and tell their avoidant what to do? lol
@@damienandraynemusicwhat’s a joke is an avoidant not working on themselves and expecting others to tiptoe around them and cater to their needs while the avoidant gives nothing in return and refuses to self reflect, take accountability and face their fears.
Yes and No. It is fine to support other people and to occasionally put their needs first (relationships are a constant negotiation between own and other's needs). Relationships are never 50/50 in that regard, as we - sadly - do not live in a perfect world. But it can't be one-sided most of the time.
yeah, you're right. Mothers are suppose to lovingly give emotional needs to their child, in the first few years it is imperative for healthy development. How many mothers today do you think are truly meeting those needs?
I like the solar system analogy. I’m still not sure what benefits avoidants bring to a relationship unless they have self awareness. I still love my x-husband but he was so hateful when their was a challenge that i needed his help with that i found it impossible to love him and love myself. I had to choose and eventually chose myself but not before significant damage to my self esteem.
Both partners in a relationship need to work at keeping their side of the street clean. If the partner of a dismissive avoidant/fearful avoidant (this video highlighted more of the dismissive avoidant traits) is able to stay connected to themselves and their values, while upholding their boundaries, anything is possible. If an insecurely attached person isnt willing to do the work to meet your needs and become more secure, it simply wont work and no one is under any obligation to sit by and wait. If you are doing your part to show up as a secure partner and after some time, the other person hasnt grown, or wont take a look at their behavior....please leave. It wont get any better. These insecure patterns take work to break through.
3:31 An avoidant might use a deceased parent with whom s/he had an idealized relationship to replace the phantom ex and bring that person into discussion every time there is potential for closeness (like in 'I wish I were with my mom now')
My person left me with no word at all, just to immediately hop into a relationship with their coworker. They had no remorse for my feeling at all especially after being together for 5 years.
Ok this is an amazing video. I don’t think the title is the best, it isn’t really the main theme. Still one of the best videos I’ve seen out there on the topic.
I thought i had read enough information on personality disorders..i am so angry at myself finding myself with this person.. i have to start from zero again
See i gotta disagree. Avoidant is your afraid of commitment. But if you sleep witb someone and act like your commiting. But know inside you wont? Your just heartless!! Im avoidant but i wont kiss sleep with or give that intimacy to a woman. Cause i dont wanna play any games. I will have chats. And date them exclusively out of respect. Thats as far as i take it. I make sure they know to tread light. Cause avoidants are aware they arent gonna commit. It doesnt just happen like some realization. Id say its premeditated even. They know they cant keep those people around without giving them love.. so they do selfishly. That's just being terrible. Not avlidant.
