I understand your point, but the main benefit of VRR is to smooth out bad frame pacing in some games. So if bad frame pacing is causing this flickering, then it negates this benefit
That's a good point, but what I'm showing is not bad frame time, it's atrocious performance caused by a technical issue, no game should be running like this
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 Yeah problem w all lots of "standards" nowadays and technology all over place, is developers don't have time to perfect or get good with their programming like back in good ol tube TV 240 p days. Maybe the whole we can patch it after the fact age, so push out a broken, inefficient game to get money ASAP for publisher plays a role too. Xbox Series X Flight Sim flickering and stuttering (especially menu or cutscene as you said) at VRR or 120 Hz, PS5 Final Fantasy XVI atrocious flickering with VRR. It defeats the 1000s I spent on TCL R646 and Marantz SR6015 and all other devices people have issues with...so many issues nowadays, even though we should be getting better. I almost miss my high end plasma TV dvd and early blu ray days. Love your videos though, nice to see someone looking into things in an intelligent way.
I’m experiencing this on horizon forbidden west intermittently with vrr enabled. Seems to trigger after a cutscene or vendor screen. Since it’s on console, not sure what I can do to prevent it. Is it the game, the console, or the tv? Turning off vrr stops it,but not as smooth gameplay. Tv is Sony x90k. Changing local dimming and other settings had no effect, but turning vrr off did…I’d like to use it though. So nice until it flickers a little.
I noticed there's a very slight difference in black levels between 60 100 and 120hz, the vrr flicker is probably a result of the TV's hz fluctuating between the different black levels of the different hzes, that's why it goes away when it's not fluctuating. As for why afterburner causes performance to decrease is a mystery though
I have this with a LG C1 using g-sync on PC with Diablo 4 right now. It definitely happens almost exclusively on loading screens, in menus, and with the map open in game like you described. I've tried adjusting black levels through the TV's settings, lowering in-game graphics, etc. but can't get it stable.
I see it now on ps5 with horizon FW running with vrr. Is this an issue more involved with game developers utilizing vrr correctly, or the hardware of tv or console/pc?
I’m experiencing brightness flickering in games like Spider Man Miles Morales, Uncharted 4 and Resident Evil 4, where performance is no issue at all. It may be true that worse performing games are more likely to flicker, but I doubt it is the main cause. Miles Morales, for instance, runs flawlessly on performance rt mode on a PS5, but whenever I toggle 120hz mode, I start seeing brightness flickering especially when web-swinging through streets. It is not something that I can reproduce or point out exactly, but I’m sure it is there. It causes eyestrain, which is not the case when I play on 60hz mode. My TV is Sony X90J btw.
I have those games on the PC and there's no VRR flickering. If performance fluctuates you get flickering, if it's flawless you won't. RT performance is very bad even on my PC with a 3080 12GB, I never use it.
I'd play on the PS5 at a locked 60fps when possible with OLED Motion Pro high to get 158fps like motion clarity. That's much better than any 120fps mode
One other thing I noticed about VRR is that when I played Resident Evil 1, the FPS was even lesser than it was if I did 60 hz Dolby Vision. I guess while it enhances some games, hurts others?
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 I guess. All I know is that when I used Game mode on my tv, the frame quality was even worse than without it. I guess certain games can’t handle Game mode’s processing power.
i randomly started having this issue about 6 months ago and still have a problem i play on series x. ive noticed what feels like delay lag my aim is so bad now on apex and call of duty when i flick on someone its not accurate at all and my aim goes everywhere feels like my controller is slow and super sensitive at the same time like there is no aim assist. never had the issue until this past half year. i bought new controllers new console new monitor everything and same problem. idk what to do cant play any fps games and enjoy it just stutter lag constantly
I have a ps5 and the flickering in this game only happens when I'm in the pause menu or the main game menu. It's not constant like something psychedelic but it happens every 10 seconds for example with a little flash and not in the whole screen. During gameplay I have no problem. For this to stop happening, I have to turn off vrr in the game menu. The last of us part 1 suffered from something even worse as the flickering was permanent if you played with vrr active in the game menu.
So I just bought a OLED c3 48 inch and I noticed that flickering not as bad but just during loading screens and at points of having my dashboard on also. is it normal for these tv to do that?
I experience green and white flickering often on my Xbox Series X with vrr on. I think it's the console. Perhaps some bad soldering on the first models, but no company would admit to that. Luckily a cold reset tends to fix it.
Same, I might try 60hz output on ps5. Noticed some flickering in games that run 60fps and cutscenes are less fps. Hmm if things weren’t so dang rushed all the time, we might get a product that works out of the box!
Not sure how that game works and how many things you can change with that game on the PC. But on World of Warcraft the frame drops to 15 frames per second on loading screens. Howver, because the game is on the PC, there's a command that players can use to increase the FPS on loading screens. I changed mine to 60 FPS, and even the loading bar is now smooth, lol. So, some games you might be able to change the loading screen FPS cap, because most games reduce FPS on loading screens and are capped in someway. If there's a config folder for the game, you might be able to change loading screen frame rate like in World of Warcraft.
Freesync premium pro does not have flicker. I never had tearing or flicker issue on my M32U. Now I have LG C3 AND GSYNC flickers and freesync not. Same experience. What gsync does better ?
I have this VRR flicker on my new C2 OLED, but I don't get it at all on my old 2020 CX OLED in the same games and same settings and same frametimes. So yeah, it definitely is a technical issue with the newer LG OLED models and needs to be fixed on the C1, C2 and possibly C3. One shouldn't make excuses for LG messing up. These TVs cost a lot of money.
I've been using vrr ever since I first bought my 3080 earlier this year. It runs very well but I do get a flicker sometimes too. I haven't tried to fix it yet. Now that I think about it, I'm wondering if it has something to do with the local dimming.
This happens in spider man remastered on ps5 when I turned on VRR and 120hz fps mode. So how to fix this on the ps5? My tv is a TCL Q7. I see fps is going between 120 and 75 etc. But when I playing the game it doesn’t happen. Maybe I don’t notice it. It happens Only while in menus. Is it a problem with the tv?
Sadly it seems panel lottery is also a factor. I thought they would flicker all the same, but my 77C2 shows substantial more VRR-flickering than my 48C1, Sony 55A80J and 65C9. I'm about to contact LG, because it's so annoying. That was never an issue on my other TVs. I'm playing on PC where this is more of a problem, because console games tend to have a more stable performance in terms of steady frametimes than on PC.
Any news on this? My first time playing a vrr title, HFW on ps5 on Sony X90K. It seems to lightly flicker after some gameplay or cutscene. Stops if I turn tv vrr off and back on, but comes back after a few minutes.
i have the 45" LG OLED monitor and i have this flickering on 3080ti with eery single driver higher than 528.24, so tell me how this is a MSI AB issue, if i can replicate this just by upgrading the GPU driver? :O
Do you see a perfectly flat Frame time graph of do you see spikes? VRR flickering only happens with unstable performance. That's what I'm showing in this video. If the GPU drivers are causing unstable performance, VRR flickering is the least of the problems. You couldn't even turn it off and lock the FPS for a good experience
i don't understand, it's not MSI AB the issue but the Hz fluctuation, if you disable VRR and you still get fps, no more flickering. But not sure if you lock to for example 40 fps, you still get flickering due to LFC kick-in.
Man, i have this flickering while watching some scenes of youtube videos. I miss old 60hz non-gaming monitor which didn't have this strange tech, even games with bad frametime didn't flicker on it
If you switch to performance mode vrr you get a more stable framerate and the flickering is gone. So I guess the flickering is caused by the fps fluctuations going below the vrr Sony range.
VRR flicker is different than OLED strobe light , this gray area flickering is OLED strobing and has nothing to do with VRR. It's the Oled tech . Thes happens mostly on Gray patterns. Oleds don't like frame variation and Near gray colour's because pixel state going from perfect black to near gray it's like on off million times that is one.problem also PWM on OLED works different... Long story there is a fix but u lose the perfect blacks...
Bro can you please help is something wrong with my c3? When I play The Last Of Us Part 1 on PS5 I can see the screen flashing every 10 seconds only in dark areas. But when I turn VRR off and on it goes away but it comes back after few minutes in game. I would really appreciate if you can tell me if it’s normal or not
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 I did, I spent the day going back and forth to bestbuy. 3 damn LGs, the 3rd one they tested in store with a rtx 4090 because the manager blamed my gpu. They had the same issue too. Manager ended up giving me a $100 giftcard for my time and troubles. I went with a nasty ips instead. M28u. The LG looks light years better but the flicker was horrendous. ru-vid.comQeQ4jVyNBHg & ru-vid.comEf0GN4h-6ms that was the 1st one. Didnt bother recording, just returned them, 2 and 3 were far worse. Bad luck for me. The picture was amazing, but I am not doing the flicker on flicker off thing
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 1 is a bad sample. 2 is a pattern. 3 is a issue. The M28u doesnt look nearly as good in colors but no flickering. My LG was the LG c2 42 evo OLED. Not sure if that matters, the size, maybe they didnt fix for those yet?
So you said that this getting on and off of the image(flickering) in vrr ps5 mode is normal and we can get 120 Hz output with it without any problem and this is a normal thing?
It's a consequence of unstable performance of the specific game, nothing to do with the consoles or PC. The difference is that on the PC, we might be able to adjust the graphics and lock the FPS at the driver level to improve stability and prevent VRR flickering. On my PC, it's never visible during gameplay because I make sure that the games frametime is as good as possible. Otherwise, I don't play the specific game
It's Normal on OLED . OLED have stutter have Flicker have Glossy panels and reflections have ABL and low brightness,have Burn In , Have shadow Crash and many more ... The biggest problem is when a pixel goes from on state to off ... All Oled have Near gray flicker.
(DCS) & (StarField) is doing this to me on my LG monitor. Sometimes it does it and sometimes it don’t. But I have a 4080 paired with a 12th Gen i5 12400. I’m waiting on my i7 13700K to come in. I hate when it flickers like that lol but thank you so much and I appreciate you.
It’s because the TVs vrr is on and your Playstions vrr is on at the same time I had the same issue with my series x. I turned off the series x vrr off and kept my TVs vrr on and it stopped flickering
That's right, brother, 1 wanted to know that I have this image flickering problem in Miles Morales, Spiderman, Remastered, and Uncharted 4 games that support VR, but when I turn off VRR, the flickering disappears. I just wanted to know that there is no problem with my console ps 5 and is this a normal thing because the fps is variable?
Try the 60fps no RT mode. Those games, especially Spiderman, are supposed to run like a dream on the PS5, and you shouldn't see VRR flickering during gameplay
Hi happy to find a channel that raises the problem, I have an LG G2 and when I activate the high frequency mode in God of War Ragnarok I have the image that flickers, I am in 120hz VRR and when I deactivate the high frequency mode of god of war when I switch to 60hz vrr the image returns to normal I don't understand? I add that on my series x and I can play in VRR 120hz without any problem with image flickering, could this be a problem with the PS5? Thank you for your answers !
Not true.. without vrr the output on your screen only shows 60 or 120 hz but it’s not the real FPS , so Better to always leave vrr on because that’s the real output
Hello. Please tell me, I have a Sony xr65x93j TV, with settings for xbox series x: 4k, 120hz, VRR - on; The screen flickers during the game, what is the problem with the TV? in the console? or in VRR? And please tell me what to leave at 120hz without VRR or 60hz with VRR enabled? Thanks a lot in advance
Please help me understand why at 120hz VRR is on there is flickering, but at 60hz there is almost no flickering (game 120fps) Does this flickering depend on the FPS in the game? For example, in fortnite 120 fps and flickering is present. Help me understand please, I can’t sleep))))
Did I understand correctly if the fps in the game is in the range from 40 - 120hz then the screen will not flicker? For example, Lies of p seems to have a stable 60 fps, but it flickers a lot at the xbox series x 120hz settings. How does it work? Help me understand
Okay then why is this an issue that is only present on oled screens. There is no g-sync flicker ever anywhere on normal ips monitors regardless of the games performance. I used a 200$ budget ips panel 24" 1440p 165Hz and also another 27" 1440p 165Hz ips panel in the past with G-Sync enabled and i never had any flicker in any game ever regardless of performance. But with my new oled monitor there is a lot of flicker especially in game menus. And that is an issue on all oled monitors. Can you explain that ? That is definitely an issue of the undeerlying oled panel technology and has nothing to do with the games performance. Also that is exactly what vrr is made for. provide a smooth gaming experience when the fps is fluctuating a lot.
I say it's not an issue because we can't play with the kind of unstable performance that will trigger this anyway. If it never happens on LCDs, that's interesting.
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 I dont understand what you mean. VRR flicker is not even an issue anywhere except on oled screens. And even LG themselves confirmed that this is an issue of the underlying oled panel technology. The performance doesnt matter since fps fluctuations will happen regardless of the performance optimizations of a game being good or bad. And this is what vrr is made for - provide a smooth experience when fps fluctuates a lot and is not stable.
To reduce Frametime Spikes, you should Limit the FPS to the Point your GPU can handle the FPS on a stable value. I had flickering on my AW3423dwf with Afterburner on or off, maybe you should update afterburner. The flicker can be eliminated with a nvidia gpu + gsync ultimate monitor OR use CRU Tool to reduce VRR Range to 100-165 instead of 38-165. It WILL reduce or eliminate flicker.
So there is absolutely no way to stop the flickering on 4K 120 hz? It’s set in stone until Microsoft and Sony can find a workaround for their consoles?
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 and that’s how they get you. That flickering is not good for my OCD so I guess I’ll do 4K 60 hz in Dolby Vision, even if there is a little blurring in dark scenes. I wish I had known about this before I got a Sony tv designed for 120 hz gaming.
I would never get a monitor with this issue. I game since so many years and a ton of games have frame issues. Sure, if the game is coded well, this wouldn't be an issue, but we see in 2023 that a lot of games are NOT coded well. If you can't keep that 120 fps you'll suffer or have to set the FPS cap lower (I think It's below 100 fps where it doesn't flicker iirc)
The problem happens only with stuttering and other huge fps fluctuations. I never suffer that problem. If the game is stuttering, it is garbage anyway, I wouldn't play it
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 Yeah. I have no issues with vrr using my PS5 on the G3. I was probably doing something stupid. I hooked up my 2021 Razer Blade laptop with 3080 16 gb to my 55 inch G3 and enabled Gsync. I had the laptop lid closed so it ouputs exclusively to the tv in Gsync. I then tried to play Modern Warfare 2 online with an Xbox controller. I set the settings so low and it still strobed and flickered.
Haven’t encountered this flickering issue with VRR set on the A80J yet. Also I find that when hitting below 60fps, 48-59 is the sweet spot for low frame VRR for responsiveness and visual consistency.
Nice video. But I do not really know if I understand tbh imho... For example, did you see the problems with the Flickering on the Alienware QD OLED? It has to do with some unsupported vrr on windows I heard, you deactivated the GSync to not have Flickering anymore dude??
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 I have commented to your comment that you should go deep with the Alienware QD OLED after u puchase it, did you delete my comment? Why?
I'm replaying RE2 right now on my LG C1 with RTX 3080 and it starts flickering even when my fps drop from 120 to 110 and stays hovering at around 115 for example, with VRR on, settings are all on max with HDR and ray tracing. It's only in a few areas though. It doesn't even need to dip very low, even if its just a few frames below 120 it will flicker, i notice it very well in very dark hallways in the game. I can only completely eliminate it by setting fps to 60 for example, my 3080 never drops below that, but obviously i'm not going to do that with a 120hz tv and an expensive GPU. It's weird because for example in RE village, my frames go all over the place between 80 and 120 and i get no flicker whatsoever while playing that game, it ONLY flickers 1 time just when the game loads up, and that's it.
it because the game have stuttering issue, like streaming or loading issue, in split second the fps go down out of range of VRR. This not happen if the game very well optimized even your fps is low because of demanding scene.
Hey my man, great video and great points. But let's say you don't have MSI running on the background and still get that minor flicker during loading screens. My current LG C3 connected to a 4080 via HDMI with high quality 2.1 cables always flickers during loading screens, specifically noticeable when it's a grey or dark loading screen. I've even tried other cables and even connected the TV to my gaming laptop... same results. Once the game starts there is no issues. All Gsync stuff is enabled, TV settings are setup properly, in game options setup properly. The forums all say it's VRR gamma flicker and welcome to OLED technology. So what's the deal? If this many people have the issue how is it that LG and Nvidia are not aware of this or rolling out some sort of fix? The new LG C4/G4 will be coming out soon and they are rated to 144hz. I can only imagine the boost in refresh rate causing even more issues. What other suggestions would you have for settings. And no disabling Gsync VRR is not an option, lol. Keep up the nice work on the channel.
Pour ne pas avoir de scintillement le 1% low fps doit être le plus proche du max fps autrement le yoyo sera trop grand et l’ecran scintille sur le oled et c’est que votre jeux est mal régler.
Because IPS pixels are always ON... On OLED panels don't, also there is NO flicker free OLED monitor ... U can see Ratings measurements. There some technics that make Oled panels feel.like.they can be flicker free but its impossible. U can't have everything. IPS.have gray blacks and are flicker free with amazing coatings and OLED are fast very fast with perfect blacks great colour's great angles but Glossy stupid Reflective panels , Blacks that are purple when u open light , shadow crash, ABL when u go over 300 nits , High heat panels , and many many more problems... But they look great at full darkness. U can't have it all. Perfect solutio would be Micro leds millions of them with very very powerful hardware to manage blooming. But this is 5 to 8 years ahead. Just wait after 2-3 years all Oled will be sold for 200 euros. Even if they don't suffer Burn in , All Oled lose Brightness.
@@Tripokaridos22 Not exactly. IPS is an LCD panel which uses liquid crystals to pass the light through. They are not always on, but they can't block 100% of backlight when they are off... VA panels are also LCD and they work the exact same way as IPS. Only difference being better light blockage when the pixels are off, yet they have worse VRR flicker than OLEDs. Thats strange, too.
@@inceptionsd IPS do use liquid crystals but also use backlight or edge light and to my knowledge backlight is always on , the intensity does change but never goes fully off unless there are zones of backlight. U can test it your self use minimum brightness and black background... The backlight is always on at IPS VA panels. That's known and that's why the use Backlight Zones ... And that's why Monitors with Many zones over 56 or some of them have 1000 zones... Didn't sell a lot because of blooming and flickering problems... On PC monitors with backlight zones the brightness was going from off to On in a way that was terrible seeing bloom and flickering strobe effect. And that's normal. There will be Always strobe effect when a pixel or backlight is going from fully turn off to fully turn on. That's why Panels IPS or VA with no backlight zones have better VRR and no strobe or flickering...
@@Tripokaridos22 "Because IPS pixels are always ON". These are your words, are they not? It is not my intention to argue at all, but you have to realize and accept the fact that you made a mistake... Pixels are one thing. Backlight is a totally different thing. An LCD panel consists of a backlight, light diffusor and a TFT LCD matrix sandwitched between the two polarizer films, where one of them is rotated and passes the light at 90 degrees. When voltage is applied through an lcd layer, liquid crystals rotate exactly by 90 degrees, which negates the rotated polarizer film and passes the light through it. When the subpixel is off, liquid crystals rotate back to 0 degrees. All that you said in the previous comment is true, apart the fact that lcd pixels dont turn off completely. They do, in fact. Its just that some light bleeds through them.
Haha, it was not flickering (visible) with high stable frame rate like that 119fps after you close msi, but with vrr working scenario it was flickering. And maybe that is becouse the display has a low dip in brightness wich is the same times as Refresh rate of Display (acording to rtings flickerfree or not test) in such variable refresh rate it would be lower and higher so, variable and maybe thats way maybe visible.
It’s happening in game for me. Ps5 Last of us part 1 remake it’s pretty bad. Then with another game man of Medan on ps5 it doesn’t flicker but with Xbox series x it flickers.
@@plasmatvforgaming9648 10-4 I might try that. You think it’s game related and not the consoles? The developers of these games rushes most of these games out.
OLED no blacks with open lights, Bad Reflections, No VRR , Stutter, Shadow Crash,ABL, Small Full screen Brightness, and not even consider the Burn in... 😂 OLED needs many yearsto fix these
I would particularly like you to have a PS5, it's a great console and you can only buy the exclusives on day one like God of War Ragnarok for example, games that have on other platforms you buy for PC normally as you always do... It would be an investment for the channel and for yourself too, because the exclusives are EXCELLENT for the most part as you can see playing Uncharted 4, and also because you would leave the PC niche since most people have consoles. 🙃
That’s normal too? Because i having this. By the way you know other game apart uncharted (one that be in gamepass where i can check the flickering that you show?) This video shows other porblem that i saw ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ztMidr2iGWY.html