the boost bottle has nothing to do with excess fuel, it allows for more pressure buildup from the transfer and boost ports in the sleeve from the crankcase, what you see is oil in the line, basically the bottle makes the crankcase bigger, it stalls when you pinch the line because of the pressure drop in the case and cutting off the required pressure the carb is tuned for with the bottle installed. 2 cycle engines are extremely simple in design.
there you have it from - the man the myth the legend lol. im sure your right, i havent done much research on it. i just know the effects of it are more power down low with less fuel usage overall. carb can be set leaner and run at the proper afr
+ThunderHead289 They do indeed make the engine run more efficiently and smoother, no doubt, since the boost comes from the pressure in the crankcase, adding the bottle allows for more pressure to be built up, so it will run and idle better, faster and smoother, it's actually better for the engine and plug life. I will be adding one to my kit as well. You can also change the port timing to get a smoother powerband, although its very risky unless ypu know exactly what to do and how far to go.
+stilltlrforlife either way...sure beats peddling!! I never use the car to eun to the store to get small stuff anymore, saves gas like crazy!! Good luck with the bike!!
The way a boost bottle works (also known as a resonance chamber), is by altering/interupting the intake pressure waves. Essentially, it has the same effect as a longer intake runner. The only reason you get better mileage is because it reduces the amount of fuel that gets shot backwards, out of your carburetor, through your air filter. So, you're burning more gas, rather than spraying it into the atmosphere. I have a ball valve on mine, so I can keep it closed for better driveability, or open it at high rpm, for better mileage. You don't need it a low rpm, since the pressure waves are not strong enough to exit the air filter.
Everybody, it seems, on the forum I am part of says these are a joke. My buddy at the bike shop swears by his. And what I saw in your video is exactly how terribly my motor idles and dies. I am totally stuffing my Xmas stocking with a new intake and boost bottle! Thank you for a great video!!!
No matter what I do, I can't get a constant idle, or If I somehow manage to make it, I can see the fuel going back to the carb when I remove the air filter. The lower the RPM the more goes back. It's just a waste. I don't know how these things work, maybe it has something to do with the vacuum, but I think everyone should try it, it's not hard to make it at home or you can buy it for cheap. It should save you fuel.
Tune the carburetor, it should work without a boost botle, either that or pull the trottle cable from the carb and put the pin a bit richer, Maybe your leaned too far out.
I wonder how low can you set the idle with the boost bottle. Because without it, when you set the idle low, the mixture gets richer and richer till the engine dies. But with the boost bottle the mixtures would remain the same.
one more question you say you got a thousand miles on it now did you have to change any Pistons are rings because of the lean mix I understand about the Boost bottle how it functions but if you run that wide open then you're running lean seriously lean what have you been mixing with your fuel and if you can answer the other question earlier
With two separate carbs and two separate bottles, you'd definitely have to be able to get them absolutely perfectly sync'd, but it would work just the same, making more power with a dual setup however has a lot more variables involved.
Amber Heart you need to check that every time you ride one and I run a puch 50cc rear rear axle brakes and sprocket and it still needs to be checked and it's basically a motorcycle rear end
you have a pretty good piston rattle their sounds like from an air leak you need to check your rings right away and see if your piston just bored it sounds like it's getting ready to croak rattling that way
I did grease mine lightly once, about 18 months ago but it gets messy so I wiped it off. It hasn't worn at all. It just has a cleaner line in the centre. I don't have the chain too tight. I made the mistake of having it nice and tight and the chain snapped. Play is important.
I have boost bottle been on since the day I built it. When I took it off there was nothing in it nor looked or smelled like anything ever was in it.I took it off to try and tune my new CNS HP carb I think I may try again since this new carb is using much more gas than my NT Speed.Where did you get that air filter I need one like that.
Hi, Good Job body!! Question?? I bought a huffy bike w/80cc motor well he put it in the ED for sale...... So my question is I drove like 4 to 5 blocks only......and let me say something when I get off from the car down, I small gasoline, anyway....... the gasoline is licking from all around the carburetor, so I don't know what could be the problem, can you help please, thank you!
+Lee Dunlap - No it will not give "more" hp. But will surely increase it's efficiency in low/mid rpm. When PROPERLY tuned the pro's are better fuel consumption, torque, less carbon/emissions and general better overall feel of the motor, since most 2 strokes are quite sketchy in low/mid range. Con's - Well not much, just some more hardware on the way when maintenance time arrives. As a general rule keep the hose short. Longer hose=low rpm, shorter hose=higher rpm, the carburetor idle jet and needle might have to be played until a good compromise is reached. Depending on your particular setup maybe just adjusting the mix can produce satisfactory results. On my setups usually have to go to a smaller (leaner) idle jet even with a better flow air filter. Factory advised setting of 1.5/2 turns, with boost bottle already in 5 turns out. So screw almost falling off... Hope it gives some insight. Just don't say like some morons "I tried ONE entire hour and it didn't work... LOL Be well ;-)
Woah, rarely see 2-stroke on a road bike. I bet you go pretty dang fast on that! Also that was a great demonstration, we might have to use the same method as a demo :)
Just get intake thats capable for a boost bottle got mines off Amazon for like 14 bucks..then buy some tubing and find a regular bottle about the size of the boost bottle...i have a hot sauce bottle as a boost bottle
whats the best 50 cc motor? here in ny we can only use 50cc. want a reliable motor. i actually need a 80cc due to my size. see some on ebay, but not sure on the quality of them, and i dont want to break the bank.
The 80cc are really 66cc units. And if anyone asks you the size, just lie. Go with the two stroke. Less movin parts, less stuff to fail overall. I rode my first engine for 1800 miles and I was extremely hard on it.
Those bottles reduce the over rich condition caused by the pressure wave reflecting, traveling backwards in the intake tube passing across the carb twice at low and mid speed conditions. some of the mixture wave enters the bottle reflects and renters the crankcase without picking up more fuel. This improves fuel delivery accuracy at low speed. I read that on some Yamaha document a while ago.
ThunderHead289 Can you tell me how to break in a new motorized bicycle kit? Im planning to buy one from amazon and boost bottle. Can i run a boost bottle during engine break in or wait?
you can with no problem. my break in procedure is to not let the engine run longer than 30 minutes and mix the oil richer, like a 25:1 ratio for the first 2 tanks, then it should be good. - i really wouldnt go over 25 if i were you. more engine wear and just damn painful to hit the pavement. not worth it over a bike
ThunderHead289 k, i already ordered it. is it possible to use something else rather than 2 stroke oil like a 30 weight non detergent oil AFTER BREAK IN USING 2 STROKE OIL cause i have no idea how much 2 stroke oil costs in my area. and back in the old days of non roller bearings, 30 weight non detergent motor oil was the best thing on the market
im going to be straight honest with you based on my experience. i have no idea. im a muscle car guy and this is really as far as i have gone into the two stroke world.
ThunderHead289 thats why its called testing. Once my kit comes in and motor broken in, ill try it once i run out of 2 stroke oil used to break in. Is there a way to measure out 2 stroke oil accurately without using a 1 gallon gas can? And how much oil per gallon would be used in a 25:1 oil gas ratio as you said?
Did you lower your idle only, or did you adjust your jets in the carb too? And I guess you would have to adjust the jets for that air filter anyways, but I'm referring only to changes made specifically for the boost bottle. If you did adjust your jets, did you make them richer or leaner? Thanks!
ThunderHead289 Ok, that sounds good! Nobody can argue that you're not getting some kind of performance increase as you are clearly able to run with less gas than if you didn't have the bottle. My 2nd motor kit will be coming soon and I'm going to try this, I hope I get similar results to you
so I just read boost bottles website and they said that it works because there's an echo effect in between the fire stroke and the exhaust stroke and that the Boost bottle eliminates the echo where has to burn gas twice or something and they said that you have to richen the carburetor to get it to work when you're using one
michael lancer It simply sucks excess fuel because some fuel escapes as the intake port closes. The needle richens it up 2 or 3 times makin the motor run rich
I think thats very true i did a research on boost bottle and thats exactly what it supposed to do i do hope mined turns out like that im in the process of putting one on on a schwinn occ stingray good job good luck with it
I have the same problem with mine, it must be all the way up or it won't run, where did you get your boost bottle and how did u get it to go on the intake?
+Crying Angel well there is something about how deep you have installed the valve on the intake which i read was supposed to be flush are as flush against the inner side of the intake so that it does not impede flow...not sure if that helped
+adriano lehman I worked out what it was, I changed the little star phillips head screw on the clamp that holds the carby on the intake pipe and it appears it must of been sucking air though it and when you turn the throttle cable down it was getting to much air and not enough fuel, I never liked the idea of that shitty screw and so I changed it with a nut and bolt and it fixed my problem, but thanks anyway for the help ;3
Marion Cobretti my clutch lever has a locking lever that i can pull in so the clutch is held in the disengaged position. all clutches should either have this extra lever or button. including yours
They have a very poor name. They don't have anything in them, it's just somewhere for the reversion to go instead of out the carb where fuel is wasted. It's a poor mans Reed valve.
in needs to be fairly volumetrically correct, something like a 5 hour enery or the energy shot deal you can get from dollar tree thats slightly bigger than the 5 hour energy.
+Cinema Tick heres how it works: The bottle's function is to absorb & release pressure pulses from within the intake, assisting the breathing of a 2 stroke engine. During the intake stroke, air is sucked through the intake manifold and into the port at a considerable velocity. Because of this velocity with the air's mass, it has inertia. When the intake port closes, the flowing air suddenly has nowhere to go, creating a high-pressure area. Naturally, the air wants to release its pressure in the easiest way possible, so it tries to shoot back out the way it came, creating a pressure wave in the opposite direction of the intake direction. Then no sooner does the wave begin to travel, the intake port suddenly opens again leaving the motor to try and pull the pressure wave back in again. This dramatically effects the lower RPM power band, wastes energy, and kills low-end performance.Now with a BOOST BOTTLE fitted, Air goes down the manifold until the intake port closes. The flowing tries to escape back up the manifold but is met with a small port that has a residual vacuum. This vacuum being caused by the previous suction of the intake stroke, sucks most of the pulse inside the Power Bottle, storing much of the pulse's energy. The intake valve then suddenly opens, creating a low-pressure area outside of the Bottle. The gasses then shoot out of the Bottle, directly into the intake system as a pressure pulse, instead of having to be pulled in by the piston. More air is then also pulled in from the manifold to completely fill the cylinder? Thus giving you an additional boost of power. These have been Dyno tested and proven to work, they show more hp increase on the low end, some hp increase at mid rpm, and a little hp increase on top end. Power bottles work best in conditions where a rider is constantly going from full throttle, to closed throttle, then back to full. like on a motocross track, or very small tight road course.
that's because your carburetor is adjusted to run right with the air that is in the bottle. then you deprive that adjusted carburetor of that extra area of air sure it's going to act different and shut it off that bottle doesn't do jack. if you want something do a reed valve
It looks to me that you do have a vacuum leak; did you make sure that you don't by soaking the bottle, tube and fitting with gas to hear the idle change?
I actually did float the bottle in hot water and cold water with a rubber cap and no water got inside so I do not believe there is a vac leak. I have also used rubber braided hose(fuel grade) on this same system and it responded exactly the same. its amazing what a change it makes, no vac leaks here. it sure proved me wrong I figured these were trash. I only bought it to actually make a vid proving it doesn't work. how wrong I was. . . I still think the reed valves are better but still.
I think boost bottles act like capacitors in a circuit. I can't keep thinking that racers don't use bottles though. I might attempt a boost bottle myself now; you made me skeptical and curious.
they don't because they run reeds which are far superior. it is very dependent on carb adjustment. you cant just slap them on and they work for sure. if my AFRs are ever a little out of adjustment, the bottles effects are felt less and less. theres a pretty small window. id imagine a better style carb would make the benefits negligible.
Thomas Theo im sure some is, but the boost bottle exists to help to minimize this effect. without the boost bottle, much more is lost through the air filter from the 2 stroke reversion. this is why most two strokes have reed valves.
the reversion will take the path of least resistance. i dont think it should work either, but it does. you can feel the difference. the vid shows that it is indeed doing something.
Hey! How do you control the speed of the idle? Can you send me a picture of the screw, with the carburetor in it? Also, could you edit it with paint, and do a red circle around it. Thanks in advance!
NO they are not the same. The PK80 and the GT5 Grubee have the same displacement range but they have different stroke, different connecting rod, piston, stud spacing, etc
Where did you get that boost bottle? I cant find those whereever I look I either find those shitty china ones or those over prices shitty blackberry ones.
You should be able to adjust your carb and still run off the main intake from the back of the carb.. Mine runs totally fine without it.. Was looking for a solution to squeeze a few more mph out of it or get better acceleration at least
+CLELDKFKEJ I know it can run just fine without it, but in the video, I show that It can run with much less fuel when set up for the boost bottle. For it to run without, I have to open the throttle up more and richen the mixture.
Fuel Saver actual working watch this video, extension of the the boost bottle theory. boost bottle is a passive fluid capacitor now what you are to see is an active fluid capacitor.
!!!!! I posted this video I don't know how long ago and have been so surprised that this has not been seen. thank you for being the first. it was only like that for a day after I removed my gas tank. how embarrassing is that.
The boost bottle won't make any difference on whether it idles or not. If it won't idle without the boost bottle, it means you have other issues like air leaks through the head, intake, carburetor out of adjustment, etc.
William Todd false. Literally the only leak would be either the connection to the bottle or the bottle itself. But you clearly don’t understand how the “boost” bottle works. The name is rather misleading
And you obviously have a leak otherwise it wouldn't die when its idling. That or your carburetor needs cleaned and adjusted. Mine would idle and die too, I found the head bolts were a bit loose tightened them down and it idles just fine. You seriously have engine issues and that bottle is giving you a fake fix. Pull that bottle off, pull that intake off, put the original intake back on, and get your air leaks fixed and/or your carburetor cleaned and properly adjusted. I'm a small engine mechanic, I've fixed several engines with the same idle stall problem, it has nothing to do with adding a bottle and hose. Your carburetor isn't properly adjusted, its dirty, or you have air leaks somewhere. A can of carb cleaner will quickly help you find those leaks.
actually your phone picks up pretty good.. it's okay man everybody wears out of set of rings and things every once in awhile that's when two strokes run their best is when they're about to blow
If you used a tap to cut the threads in the fitting would be easier to install. And it would be a cleaner fit. The way you tightened the head bolts will work in a pinch but I would recommend tightening them with a torque wrench. Sorry to say if you think tightening the head blots the way you did, makes them all equal you’re misinformed or delusional. Just looking at how you did it I can tell you didn’t torque the bolts enough. The recommended torque is between 10 and 12 ft. lbs. 12 lbs converted to inch lbs is 144 inch lbs. I torque mine to 140 inch lbs and I check them often.
Also, I've always thought a better design personally would be to use a diaphragm of some sort with maybe a electro magnetic plunger....that would give a bigger "POOF!"
Bike can't idle without boost bottle help? That's proof of an underlining issue. Pinching a gas line to kill it? I'd use an inline spring loaded petcock. Kill switch and key can shut it off. I have a key installed so it takes care of the shorting similar to how a computer is turned on and off.
+Bobby Cratchet ?! woah son i hope you didnt already dislike this video or something. i dont think you have a complete understanding of the situation im demonstrating here so allow me to explain. first of all, my kill switch works just fine. im pinching the vapor line from the bottle to the intake to show that without the boost bottle the engine will die. this shows the bottle is doing something. the reason the engine dies is that the bike is running much more efficiently with the bottle, so without it there is not adequate fuel to run the bike and it leans out and dies. it also dies, because with the boost bottle attached, the idle feed settings on the can be turned way down since not as much fuel is needed to run the bike due to the efficiency increase. so naturally, when you cut the supply from the bottle, there will not be enough fuel with the boost bottle based settings to run the bike. Does this make sense? if you have any further questions or issues, id be happy to explain.
Ok, that helps clarify things. I understood the pinching situation but still I'd have a secondary petcock in play. What I don't understand is a NOS system is usually in place to give an extra boost of power via nitrogen and oxygen, which I've seen in cartridges and larger bottles but in this application it's being done without the extra fuel usually introduced in a more traditional setup that would be in a car, truck, motorcycle etc.. I've done just a small amount of research and haven't been impressed. I saw your video and was presented with a bike @ a standstill that proved the NOS system restricts fuel, apparently. I made my bike more efficient with a better carb and changing the C ring in the carb to the lightest setting(first notch). Different strokes for different folks. If it works for you... I have seen where it says it lean's out your mixture but that seems counterproductive where a NOS system is concerned. Sure, you proved it leans out your fuel mixture or makes it more efficient for you but the point of the system is a boost of power which I didn't see, which isn't usually done @ idle either. You proved it fits your needs but not that it can give someone a boost in speed which is usually the desired result when a NOS system is being researched or purchased.
the boost bottle isnt nos, nos is completely different. this bottle is simply an open chamber that enlarges the plenum. you can make one out of a hot sauce bottle honestly. it doesnt lean out the mixture, it uses the current mixture more efficiently. i two stroke does not have valves, it has ports within the bore. these crap two strokes without reed valves will actually have reversion where some of the mixture is pushed back to the carb. by expanding the plenum, the unused air fuel mixture is stored in the bottle for the next stroke. this is why the idle throttle open percentage can be reduced (this doesnt mean its leaned out) its still the same air fuel ratio. is this making sense? nos is a whole nother thing that should never be used on a bike since you cannot inject fuel with it. nos is an oxygenator that will create one hell of a lean surge if fuel isnt added to get the right afr.
Ok. Understood. Maybe let your viewers know that, if it isn't widely known, that boost isn't synonymous with NOS. Then we dive into the pool of muffler expansion pipes to help complete the trinity. Reducing idle speed without changing the mixture either way thereby using less gas. Thank you for the education.
What I don't get is your idol speed is quite high , I understand the bb has a valid effect on the motor , you can clearly see this but , my motored bicycle runs at idol quite low without stall out and doesn't consume much fuel at all and a higher idol consumes more fuel regardless ,it needs fuel for the pop , wouldn't it just be easier to slow the idol speed to just above stall , IMHO it would consume the same amount of fuel
its adjusted all the way down, so I am using no more fuel than you are, I am just attaining greater efficiency out of the fuel that I am using. you can see in the video I have the carb adjusted way down. in that position,the slide is barely open and doesn't allow much air through at all. in the idol situation the reversion of fuel back into the intake will go back into the boost bottle at a higher efficiency and likewise on the next stroke pull it out again. the boost bottle is most efficient at idle if anything.
im not sure why everyone thinks it is idling so high, it must be from the sound quality because my bike actually idles very low compared to other mb I have seen.
its attached to the intake manifold and reuses some of the wasted intake charge that is blown back into the carb. honestly a reed valve set up is much better but they are around 100 dollars. most two strokes have reed valves
Yamaha called this "Torque Induction" when they marketed it on the RS100 and RS125 back in the 1970's plus on the 1980's RXS100. They never used it on any other products. Their global patent ran out recently hence the poliferation of "Boost Bottles".
Andy Reid You are incorrect sir. My 1973 Yamaha 350 has side covers proclaiming 'torque induction' but does not have anything like this. While most two stroke bike makers e.g Suzuki, Kawasaki, Bridgestone, Hodaka etc, used rotary valves, Yamaha pretty much pioneered Reed valve induction. That's what Yamaha was calling 'Torque induction'.
Ronald Colman Isand corrected sir!! However Yamaha did'nt invent the reed valve as a Eropean manufacturer experimented with them in 1958 but never used them on production or competition bikes.
+Andy Reid Just my 2 cents. Yamaha marketed their "boost bottle" as YEIS (Yamaha Energy Induction System). Most Yamaha two stroke still under production still use it, due to it's efficiency.
+crpth1 I stand corrected!! Yamaha didn't actually invent the Reed valve as it originated with CZ back in 1958. The Czechs couldn't make it work properly with the materials then available and it was dropped. Yamaha, like all the Japanese bike manufacturers, were prepared to pour investment into making flawed good concepts workable. There is zero advantage on fitting a boost bottle onto any 2 stroke motor with multiple cylinders fed from a single carb as this type of motor already uses blowback boosting to increase low down torque. Boost bottles work on the same laws of physics as tank gun barrel smoke extractors for those who are skeptical that they do anything.
yes we understand it's like a motorcycle carburetor because I've been a motorcycle mechanic in this is PUD. work glad you guys are getting into engines anyway but the two-stroke technology is the same as it's always been get a reed valve if you really want to do some good porting and polishing helps
ThunderHead289 I guess so, it seems to equalize the pulses. I may try it on my 1979 Garelli moped to see what it might do. I have an aluminum bud bottle. Any thoughts?
+Anthony Butera need to error on the smaller size vs large. If your moped has reed valves, it will really make no difference at all. It's only for open plenum stuff
ThunderHead289 My Yamaha IT 175 had reeds and the boost bottle. My moped doesn't have reeds, so it will be neat to see what different size bottles might do. It is pristine but hard for me to leave it be. Thanks for the input. My IT bottle was larger than 175 cc.
Just for fun, I made my own bottle. 24 ounce monster can. Runs smoother it seems but can flexes and noisy when doing so. Gonna change cans for a stronger bottle.
@@daltenmorris5072 I had a coors bottle. Thought was boost bottle is good but might be my imagination. In removed it. Best upgrade is a smaller rear sprocket. Faster speed with less redlining. From 42t to 36t. Any smaller ,I'd be breaking the law.😅
No it doesn’t it robs power and makes the bike more lean the motor won’t last as long just cause he is clamping the hose doesn’t mean a boost bottle work all it does is effect the tune
