ELECTRIC CARS ARE NOT ZERO EMISSION [EV News - Week 6, 2024] 

Zero tailpipe would be more apt 👍

How many children breath toxic fumes on the street from tail pipe? EVERYONE !!

Funnily enough, I just found some information about estimated total production & lifetime CO2 emissions for ICE cars, which breaks down in to the following: 10% CO2 in production 5% CO2 in end-of-life decommissioning 85% CO2 from the tailpipe. So, even though EVs are estimated to involve emitting about 40% more CO2 than an equivalent ICE car in their production, that'd still mean a near 80% overall CO2 reduction based on there being no tailpipe emissions from an EV.

@jonathantaylor1998 Interestingly enough a new survey in Norway (or Sweden) had similar percentages. I didn't want to quote from it as I wanted to raise the point about "it's not just making the car but running it" That gives it impact upon the planet. I love the thought of cleaner air in our cities, but until they can sort out lorries and busses. Then cars don't really solve it.

Thanks - have cut it out using the RU-vid editor so it'll be sorted for anyone watching after it processes!

Has potential for a great Monty Python sketch....?

You said that six hours ago, did it really need saying again? There are several more modern studies that prove the break even point is far earlier, fyi.

@ModernHeroes So, you are questioning Volvo who, I suspect, have a greater handle on this than yourself.

Probably yeah, good job I wasn’t the one that did the later studies I guess.

Volvo themselves have publicly retracted those statements and admitted that their first studies used incorrect assumptions and input data. I guess once false information is out there some people won't ever give it up if it suits their narrative, even when the source of the statement admits they were wrong, they completely ignored the carbon cost of exploration, extraction, bulk shipping, refining, transport and fuel delivery in their initial calculation as well as any energy recoverbility of recycling the battery at end of life In the US the break-even point is around 30k miles, 22k miles in the UK if charging from the grid and 8kmiles if charging from 100% solar / renewables (ALL production and trnasmission losses included) - these numbers also exclude the energy recovery of recycling the battery at end of life.

Volvo themselves have publicly retracted those statements and admitted that their first studies used incorrect assumptions and input data. I guess once false information is out there some people won't ever give it up if it suits their narrative, even when the source of the statement admits they were wrong, they completely ignored the carbon cost of exploration, extraction, bulk shipping, refining, transport and fuel delivery in their initial calculation as well as any energy recoverbility of recycling the battery at end of life In the US the break-even point is around 30k miles, 22k miles in the UK if charging from the grid and 8kmiles if charging from 100% solar / renewables (ALL production and trnasmission losses included) - these numbers also exclude the energy recovery of recycling the battery at end of life.

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The embodied emissions in the manufacture of EVs are "substantial", although not that much more substantial than ICE, plus they are reducing as the technologies are refined and the payback is less than assumed. . Unfortunately it's taken 1 person with the initiative, tenacity and knowledge to take on the whole establishment (while receiving a huge but unsurprisingly amount of "imaginative" negative press). Probably worth reading "The master Plan" (2006) again (I'm assuming you previously have?) which confirms that the EV is, while also certainly part of the solution, a means to fund the end goal of energy transition. . From memory, Air and sea transport account for ±3-4% of total emissions, and road transport about 12%. It's a start, rather than the whole solution, but we must start somewhere. . Next? Heating and homes? . We're already heading (at least in the UK) towards a substantially "non fossil" grid. Let's hope we get a Government not fixated on throwing away the spare energy via Hydrogen while showing proper commitment to energy efficiency. . It may be too little, too late, but we must keep pushing.

You do know that there are companies today recycling EV batteries and that the percentages are reversed from your "guess"? Then there's the opportunity to recycle not only vehicle packs but the billions of cells from other devices which DO go to landfill. I wonder how many device batteries you have simply thrown away? . smh

@@rogerstarkey5390 yes the 5% I mentioned and yes batteries in all walks of life are thrown away or as we know go to landfill including the recycled batteries I give to the dustmen who who should recycle but throw them back into the wast truck !

​@@johngoff8923 I'd LOVE to know precisely where you found the "5% EV batteries recycled" nonsense. A link would be great, I suspect it was "someone you know"....? (Go on, tell me it was on Reddit, or similar!) . Are you under the misconception you could just "throw away" an EV pack? . Have you no idea of it's size, or the expertise required to remove it, or move it, or the fact that it has "value" sufficient that any *Expert EV Technician, or Vehicle Dismantled, or indeed Vehicle Manufacturer* removing a pack would immediately send it for full recycling? . How about that fully 95% of materials can be recycled providing raw material *more* pure and *better* performing than new stock? . Or, that the recycled material will be less than 20% the cost of new stock? (THAT'S "valuable"!!) . If you enjoy facts, search Redwood Materials as a starting point to check this. Otherwise stick with your confirmation bias.

Cobalt is perhaps one of the most problematic materials used in electric vehicles, both environmentally and socially. Cobalt mines produce toxic residues that can leach into the environment, poisoning groundwater and harming nearby communities. Additionally, smelting cobalt ore produces fumes with a high concentration of sulphur oxide and other air pollutants. Oh yeh... that's the SAME cobalt that the oil companies have been using in the refining of crude oil since the early 1970s, isn't it...? Oh, and the same cobalt that's used in the aviation industry for building their engines...? And, while we're at it, the same cobalt that used in the manufacture of resonance magnets for hospital MRI machines... Yeh, that's the one... Only, whilst it took the oil companies over 60 years' worth of known cancer and deaths before removing lead from petrol, the EV battery industry has largely moved on from using cobalt in battery production in about 10 years. Do you still think that oil companies are the 'good guys' in all this...???? 🤔

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Yet Norway’s equivelant regulator banned the “self charging hybrid” ads as misleading - who’s spinning what exactly?

@@ModernHeroes If Norway did as you say then they are on a slippery slope going wishy-washy and reading in things not in the wording. I suspect there is more to this though. There are differences around the world. For example, here in Sweden you can't say something is free in an ad if you have to pay money to get the free thing but in the USA it's just fine to do so. You can however say for no extra cost instead here and I suspect it's something like that in Norway's case that something more was implied. By spinning I mean that you are all over the place trying to find examples to make EV's look good then ignoring what was stated in the beginning. EV's are under heavy pressure right now because of the lies and forced legislation used to sell an unready product to the world and people are pissed! I have however seen a big propaganda push against EV's, especially on RU-vid that go the total opposite route and use all manner of lies and exaggerations to put even more pressure on EV's.

@sirburn1918 . Maybe check the derivation of the phrase "charge". "To load". As in load gasoline, etc into a fuel tank? .

@@rogerstarkey5390 All words come from something but it is a stretch to say that to charge is the same a as filling the gas tank. It might be closer in meaning in Norwegian though.

I charge mine 100% from home solar - I guess that's as close as it gets.

Nobody cares

The obvious question then is, why on Earth are you wasting your time watching, then commenting on an EV-specific You Tube channel...? 🤨 That said, while you're here... A few more pertinent questions for you - if you were the Prime Minister, how would you begin to counter the ever-increasing incidence of childhood respiratory illnesses in the UK, caused, primarily, by the horrendous air pollution in our towns and cities caused, in the main, by tailpipe emissions from cars and trucks? Do you have kids yourself, Douglas? Or maybe nephews / nieces? If they asked you to take them out to play, would you decide to take them to a local park, away from traffic, or would you decide to take them to play, even safely, at the side of a busy road intersection? Think about that, yeh... 👍

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"In the UK ..." We unfortunately suffer from the con of "Marginal cost pricing" Which for those not familiar "is where units of electricity are sold at the price of the most expensive unit needed to meet demand at a particular moment in time". ( Excerpt from the House of Commons Library website) . Or, if the country has been running on cheap renewables for a day, but they turn on a gas peaker plant for 30 minutes at the evening peak load, ALL energy for the day is charged at the price of the (expensive!) Gas rate. . Since over the last 12 months the UK generated MORE renewable energy (mainly wind) than from Natural Gas, you might think (as do I) that our pricing should be based on the *Renewable* tariff? . At VERY least, the individual energy types should be split and charged at their "going rate" with wind and/ or solar well below 50% the price of gas. Anyone fancy a ±40% reduction in their energy bill? ..... The "opinion" (doesn't deserve "argument") that EVs are essentially "powered by gas" takes no account of storage, of that EVd spread their load across a day, week, month, or that they actually (unfortunately) *reduce* the Gas cost since many do charge overnight when the gas plants must be kept "ticking over" to avoid costly shut down/ startup. . Of course, as Wind continues to ramp and more storage comes on line, those plants will become increasingly redundant, as did the coal plants. . Let's hope that sooner rather than later! . (Coal took 9 years, I'm hoping gas fails in 5)😊

​@@ModernHeroes Re 🤭 . Seems we have a particularly "special one" here?

Using the total mix of energy generation sources in the UK the average EV will offset it's carbon debt after 22k miles, 8k miles if charging 100% from solar / renewables. The most polluting electricity production method is through burning coal - it produces 980g of CO2 per kwh (including the exploration, mining, transport of the coal to the coal fired plant), the average transmission losses in the UK are around 7%. The average charge losses from L2 & L3 charging are 8% in aggregate, So 1145g CO2 per kwh after accounting for losses. So using my Model 3 as an example that gets 5.7miles per kwh i.imgur.com/ihRQNA3.jpg I generrate all up 216g per mile if I charge 100% from power produced by coal. Burning petrol produces 10,400g of CO2 at the tailpipe and another 3,640g on average in the UK from the exploration, mining, bulk shipping, refining, transport and pump delivery - all up 14,040g per UK gallon. So even if I charge my Tesla 100% from coal fired power I still only generate as much CO2 as someone getting 65mpg in a petrol car, the UK does not generate 100% power from coal, the avarege car does not get 65mpg.