@@RavensFanJ I made an error, which Anthony thought I was misinforming. My bad ,I typed the wrong info I put it right. I did thank Anthony for my mistake, at which he had every right to make the point.
Sheriff Herman has a junk yard in Cleveland Wisc 7 miles south of manitowoc, yes I believe that is a different one and that’s why they don’t want zellner to get her hands on it
Thats correct and not one person family or friend ever mentioned the color might look blue in certain lighting , this would be extremely important in helping locate her vehicle but never mentioned .
@@anthonyhills2024 thats funny how our brain confuses our memory's 😁🤭 now i am not sure anymore. There is in foul play or somewhere on yt the recorded call from Karen. I ve heard it but couldnt remember when and where 🤔 you could be right with 'kinda green'. Would be also interesting to see the original missing flyers and how the car colour looks at the sheets!? I also think i saw it ones somewhere but it was a while ago.....
I don't care what color the car is/had/has in photos, I just want it "for scientific testing"!!!! ALL of it, in and out! TEST that RAV, is MANDATORY! And by someone competent, this time ...if it's not too much to ask!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;)
I think there were 2 RAV4's. There was more to the theory or suspicion than just the color. I only vaguely remember but there were issues with the VIN (appeared to have been tampered with); damage to the front driver side corner; something in the driver side front wheel well. Maybe more but I can't remember. I remember thinking that there may have been too much forensic evidence in Teresa's car that would contradict the story law enforcement wanted to tell so they had to use another car which they obtained from the competing salvage yard owned by someone involved in law enforcement. They didn't have time to find a RAV4 of the exact same color and they didn't have to because people believe law enforcement would not lie. Hopefully some one else can fill in the details that I cannot remember.
@@anthonyhills2024 I think the original comment that includes "so as to not set Steven Avery up" is sarcasm. I could not get it either and just dismissed it.
I never really bought into the 2 Rav theory. I’ve explored the reasons why some do believe in it and it’s just not compelling enough to seriously consider it imo. I have color changing paint on my car too. It looks blue in my garage especially under the fluorescent light and dark purple when it’s parked outside under the natural light. You also have to consider the flash and exposure when the photos were taken because that can also alter the perception of color. LE did so many sketchy things in this case that can be perceived as intentional, nefarious, incompetent, or just shitty investigating/police work so I understand why theories like this exist. They did it to themselves so I have no sympathy for any of them. I think it’s good Kathleen is addressing some of these issues.
Mike Halbach picked out his sister's Toyota RAV4 off the internet and he picked a 6P3 Deep Jewel Green to give to Sheriff Jerry Pagel to give to WBAY news which aired it on the 3rd and the 4th of November 2005. The Halbach's watched it and the Avery's watched it and they all agree that Teresa owned a 6P3 because nobody said it wasn't. Pam and Nicole find a Toyota K95 two-color combination, 760 Mystic Teal Mica and Medium Grey caddling - Not Teresa's RAV4-6P3. The VIN, detached, bent not in factory condition comes back as a 760 Mystic Teal Mica all one color. You have a VIN for a 760, on the dash of a K95 neither 6P3. Two RAV's and one VIN.
If there was only one RAV, the State would have given it to KZ and said go for it. Do your testing, then go away. But here Kz has reproduced State supplied photos. Why was Kim P'litzker's vacation photo with the RAV in Black and White? If Teresa took good care of her car, why does it look like a wreck at ASY?
I’ve seen all the pictures and there are definitely two ravs. It’s not just the color that’s different if u examine both Ravs There are so many differences plus the car they found was not in good condition like hers was. I think they got it from another junkyard and planted it there to be honest, and just so happened that someone in the police force had a family member that owned a salvage yard what a coincidence
Here are some facts which prove the police knew that after TH's work meeting with SA at ASY (31 Oct), the Rav4 was not on ASY and therefore must have been moved onto ASY at a later time. LE were notified of TH's disappearance at 4pm 03 Nov. At this time they were informed of TH's 31 Oct work appointment locations and given evidence/information indicating possible abduction/murder. The same day (03 Nov) LE went to ASY and spoke to SA at 7pm. SA informed LE, TH had driven her Rav4 off ASY at approx 3pm, immediately after her 31 Oct ASY appointment. The following day (04 Nov) at around 10am LE spoke with SA at ASY and carried out a consent search of SA's trailer home and garage. Also, on 04 Nov, LE sheriff appeared on local TV news. He stated the case was: _"suspicious in origin"_ the news stated: _"TH's last stop was at SA's home"_ the sheriff further stated: _"This is the last place she is seen alive and seen by somebody and of course we are going to be concerned and interested in that area"_ The news then said, the sheriff was conducting an aerial search for TH's Rav4 as this was _"a major key in the investigation"_ The following day (05 Nov) 2 female volunteer searchers were given owner consent to search ASY and located TH's Rav4 on ASY at 10:30am. So, how do the above undisputable facts prove LE must have known the Rav4 was initially not on ASY and was moved onto ASY later? The answer, is because: LE did not properly attempt to rescue TH or gather evidence which might convict someone of a probable crime. The state case against SA is LE did not know the location of TH or the Rav4 and therefore LE did not know TH was not held captive or dead on ASY or the Rav4 was not on ASY. During a missing person investigation, LE follow official procedure and must make an immediate decision as to the likely seriousness of the disappearance. If the case is deemed serious (critical) then procedure requires LE to immediately conduct a thorough search of the last known whereabouts, to look for the person; for any other evidence and to preserve the area as a possible crime scene. There is no question this case was classified as 'critical' from the moment LE were notified because, there were obvious reasons to suspect TH was the victim of crime. So, why did LE not search ASY to see whether TH or the Rav4 were there? Did LE just assume TH was not held captive or that finding the Rav4 there would not be important evidence? Something is very wrong with the inadequacy of LE searches for TH and the 'key evidence' Rav4: 1) A detective quickly looking in SA's trailer/garage/yard for TH or the Rav4. 2)The sheriff flying over ASY and stating in his report he was 'too high to make out vehicle types'. 3) No police search of ASY for TH or the Rav4. It's not just the things we do that determine our intent and constitute our acts - it's also the things we do not do. If we turn on a light - we want to lighten the room, but, if we do not turn on a light in a dark room - we want the room to remain dark. LE were obligated by official procedure and civic duty to immediately search the ASY for TH and the Rav4. They had over 40 hours in which to do this; it is clear they chose not to. Why? _"Milwaukee Police Department Missing Persons Investigation Procedure:"_ _"C. CRITICAL MISSING A person who has been reported missing and meets any of the following criteria:"_ _"2. There is reasonable suspicion to believe the disappearance of the missing person is not voluntary and/or the missing person is the victim of foul play."_ _"2. Reporting Factors: a. Location last seen, last seen with, date and time last seen."_ _"A. INITIAL INVESTIGATION:"_ _"2. Conduct a search of the last location the missing person was seen and conduct an interview of those that last saw the missing person."_ _"3. Fully identify and separately interview anyone at the scene of the disappearance of the missing person and treat the location as a possible crime scene."_ _"4. Identify any areas at the incident scene that have been disrupted or may have the potential for the presence of evidence and safeguard those areas."_ _"5. Broadcast a description of the missing person and vehicle."_ So, the following is what LE actually wants everyone to believe: _'We got information a young woman had driven her car onto a junkyard and had not been seen since. From the details we believed this was suspicious and we were very concerned for her safety. We conducted a consent search of a trailer home on the junkyard and a flyover of the entire junkyard. In more than 40 hours we did not think it was necessary to conduct an LE search of the junkyard for the missing woman or her car.'_ Can anyone actually believe this? Is it really possible for (genuine) LE to have acted this way in the same (LE stated) circumstances? Is it more believable the LE flyover of ASY and LE SA trailer search were to give an appearance of correct civic duty and procedure and the real reason LE did not conduct a search of ASY is LE knew it would confirm what they already knew was true - the Rav4 was not on ASY and that time (darkness) was needed to move the Rav4 onto ASY. Then having 2 volunteer women find the Rav4 would give appearance LE were not trying to frame SA. Did you know that, following the discovery of the Rav4 on ASY, LE conducted an immediate search of the ASY, stating in reports: _'we quickly searched outbuildings as there was chance TH was alive'_
Well said. They neglected to do their job. It really is that simple. Just like their simple minds (unless as you say, they were trying to cover up/had intelligence). That yard with all them buildings and hundreds of abandoned cars was an obvious playground to a potential criminal trying to hide a body. The police failed in all counts.
We've had this discussion on other threads. You can write it as many times as you'd like, you will apparently never understand "probable cause" and the requirements for a search warrant. After talking with Avery on the 3rd (and he even let them quickly go through the trailer as you mentioned), there was no reason to suspect him of anything yet. He seemed cooperative, and for all they knew, she wasn't even dead - she was just missing at this time, and there was no evidence to suggest death yet.
@RavensFanJ If they were permitted to search the trailer, they would likely have been permitted to search the premises (without a warrant). Whether TH was thought dead or alive ... they should have looked around... The Avery's never blocked anyone from looking so why weren't they searching immediately? She'd been gone a while..
@suzyhill802 They didn't ask to search the ASY, because Teresa's last known location was simply Avery's trailer and the immediate area in front of it and Barb's. The ASY was a 40+ acre property, and without probable cause they wouldn't be getting a warrant from a judge in order to search it. Not only that, but with nothing to go on, they wouldn't necessarily search the whole thing even if they *had* asked Avery if they could. They had to call in multiple other departments just to search it in the week they had the warrant *after* the RAV was discovered just to get it done.
@@RavensFanJ A young woman driving onto a junkyard for a 20 min work appointment and not being seen or heard from for days after is _'probable cause'_ to apply for a search warrant and a search warrant would have to be issued on that evidence. LE did not ask to search the ASY or apply for a search warrant.
TH’s RAV4 was mystic teal mica - a colour between blue and green with the mica added it would reflect different colours. I don’t believe in 2RAV4s but I do want her to get access to the RAV4 in custody to check for Bobby’s DNA - she already has his results because police had it examined.
Her rav 4 was supposed to be green. I have a video on youtube on what her rav 4 was supposed to look like. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-93GZUkJfeDA.htmlsi=caJwbHJiVFwhHvp5 Wouldnt the person who switched the rav 4 use the exact same color you ask? This is Manitowoc County we are talking about. It wouldnt surprise me if there were two rav 4s.
I stay neutral on this subject. I don't know. I have seen people go much more into detail on the research that far exceeded the color argument. As far as the argument they would have gotten one exactly alike, we have to remember that without MAM , none of this comes up. Who was going to question the RAV. ? The real question here is why they would need to do that ? What would cause them to need two RAV 4s ? If we can find that answer we should be in a better spot to decide. Hint if they get the car back from the crime lab, they may find the answer
I dismiss the two rav 4 theory. I've had a jacket that was black but depending on the lighting looked green and even brown. The rav may look blue, but it does have green in it. There's a number of factors at play which you've mentioned. Lighting, the camera, dust on the rav 4 could affect the colour.
@MalibuGrailorProduct The best way to be absolutely sure is to rule out all or as many plausible theories as possible. Eg: Was it damaged and the handle was replaced before TH died? Was the rav 4 purchased used by TH? Was it a mistake by the manufacturer?
Yeah, I had a car once that was labeled "royal blue," however it depending on the lighting it would change colors. That's why I don't put much thought into the whole idea of the RAV seized not being Teresa's.
Mine is “Fuji sunset red”. In some light it looks really red and others it looks a yucky orange 🤷♀️ As for the Rav 4, I’ve no idea , but in this case anything is possible!
Her family didn't think this was important enough to mention it looks blue in some lighting and green in others so this Mica teal was all Ken Kratz idea to solve the color people were saying 2 Ravs and the state went overboard making excuses but if they knew this was true they would not bother explaining .
Newscott it dont realy matter about the cars colour reason is the car undoubtedly found on Avery salvage on 5/11/2005/ us definitly blue no question .In reality in the real world where common sense prevails if Teresa Halbachs car is Teal in sunlight it changes colour then common sense tells me that the car found on asy on 5/11/2005/ is not Teresa Halbachs car as that car is most definitly blue therefore wheres her car has it been lost deliberatly as the state are very good at losing exculpatory evidence I.e. the blunt bloody object . If it turns out it's not Teresa's car then sorry to the guilters naysayers they have to let Steven Avery out & exonerate him compensate him ,same deal for Brendan Dassey after all both guys are innocent of this crime come on state of Wisconsin you've had your fun here let both men go .You want Kathleen Zellner gone let both guys go.
@MariaMar-ev9xd Hey I didn't say rightfully or wrongfully. I said Avery is in jail for the murder of Teresa Halbach. I was just showing him what a true fact is :]
LE often use green magnetic flourenscent fingerprint dust , think about it , it never looked green until after the dust was added at the crime lab & ASY it was blue after dust it looked greenish
One of my questions has always been, and maybe it has been answered, is that the key that was planted in Steven’s bedroom, did anybody check that against the RAV4 and see if it actually opened up the door this old Toyota key that was thrown there just to frame him
@@RavensFanJ The key was planted!!!!!! And the evidence are there, if you open your eyes! ;) Plus, the key was SO planted, that it almost "fu*k up (his) case"!!!!!!! What more do you need?! Photos with the key in a pocket?!?!?! ;)))))))))))))))))))))))))
@@RavensFanJ ...a copy-paste-wiki-pages-person-type would see as evidence only a photo with the key in the pocket! A "selfie" even, right? ...fair enough :))))))))))))))) What was I thinking?!?!?! ;)))))))))))))))))))
Kathleen has never set eyes on Teresa's RAV, in person. She only references the RAV found on ASY and said photos of that RAV. New Scott should consider how common a color and trim combination was Teresa's RAV, and the State had only one day to find one before planting.
@anthonyhills2024 I never said I did. I pointed out the fact that you don't believe Zellner because she's never seen it, but instead you'll believe there's *two* RAV's without having seen *either* 😂
@@anthonyhills2024You mean except for the part where the State did in court? And Avery's defense never brought up anything about that not being her RAV? Lol
You must recognize that you are dealing with the legal representees of Wisconsin, Therefore, they make-up their own laws according to their will and in this case, they're saving themselves from paying out 30 million dollars. So, very unfortunate that Teresa had to fall victim to these corrupt law representees. For me the mental-health community tried to force me to end my life. And when I tried to report it to the local district attorney, they completely wiped out my computer and phone via an IT attack. and in that process had taken over 25,00 from me in a theft. Prior to this they allowed a homicide attempt against myself via rat poison, when my ex-wife got pregnant by my ex-best friend. And while I was dying my other ex-wife kidnapped my 2 oldest children. So, either the legal representees are the absolutely dumbest of all time, or they are the most corrupt of all time. It's very sad that the legal system had done that to Tereasa.
In an interview years back Kathleen said on the first day of taking the case she phoned up the storage unit to confirm that the rav was there and it was. so it's still going to be there. I'm glad she has finally said something about it and hopefully put an end to the two rav theory. I'm not dissing anyone that had thought there were two cos for a few years I used to think there were two but after reading henburys research he did on it.. I knew he was right there is only one rav.
@@newscott reminder , KZ had trust in Tom Fallon being on side for allowing the testing of the bones All the time Tom Fallon knew the bones he was agreeing to allow testing on had been returned to the Halbach’s. My point being KZ being told The Rav is available for testing is not assured IMHO if the history of the bones are any indication. Nothing will surprise me Ps forget the colour There are other factors suggesting 2 RAV4
