After hearing about Master Chief's luck, Guilliman would sit down with him and ask a personal favor of finding his lost brothers. That he, Ciaphas Cain, and Captain Titus have a mission to find Vulkan, Russ, Dorn, the Khan, and Corvis.
The reason the Mechanicus is so slow and dogmatic is that iconography has meaning in the Warhammer 40k universe. If your circuits or components align into certain shapes, they'll get corrupted quickly. So, every tech and weapon has to be made sure that they don't align with those shapes. Then there is the fact that there are reality parasites (the four gods) that love to screw people over by whispering sweat things in their ears. As one guy said, they're scientists and engineers who are genre-savvy enough to understand that they have to be extremely careful with what they can do.
Yunno all in all, the Adeptus Biologis could definitely probably better replicate the SPARTAN augmentations than ONI/UNSC could. Superior infrastructure, expanded resources; all that logistical/material/capital gobbledygook. That said the latter would probably be better suited to getting the science behind things done in an effective manner without too much interference from Inquisitors who want to do a little "audit" (ONI is to the Inquisition what the CIA (Cunning but brutal) is to the KGB (Brutal but cunning)).
UNSC: "You see, the thing is..... we kinda kidnapped children to make them.." IOM: "Based! How many do you want?? I can sign you up for 1 billion by the end of the year, we have a couple hive worlds nearby that are in need of punitive measures."
One more selling point for the UNSC and something that the Imperium doesn't have... the ODST- a way for non-Astartes to survive rapid ship to surface deployment without the need to risk hard to replace ships.
The only thing I would change in your ideas would be to create as little Votaan Lore as possible, by saying that after the center of the galaxy is broken open from different angles, a group of Qin traveled to where they heard a "good people" human empire existed and established trade relations with them, in exchange for a planet so the Qin people could start over. This would give a huge tech boost to the UNSC and provide an interesting story for the Votaan, and perhaps a new Qin Kingdom in the Pacificus Segmentum
@@MacroLore You think you can incorporate this idea or concept of this on your next videos. "Rebuilding the lost faction" kind of curve ball for the 41k
Quick correction. The UNSC has always existed as a military branch for Humanity since the Rainbow Wars. What happened was when the Covenant War showed the UEG couldn't keep things under countrol like before, the UNSC became the government as a military junta and absorbed the colonial military branch into it.
When facing Radiation weapons, cancer is a distant problem, your skin falling off, losing eye sight, your cells losing ability to replicate and vomiting blood is a much closer problem.
@@nobleman9393 you said when facing, as in being the ones shot at. I’m not too knowledgeable on rad weapons but would this still be as severe of the UNSC were the ones shooting them?
I'm so glad this wasn't a "UNSC dies lol" story like I've heard before. Also the Spartans make sense as an intermediate unit, they're known to be faster "reaction wise" and less fanatical as well as easily mass produceable and can operate in stealth. The Astartes are the living tanks and the Spartans are the Delta Force of the world.
Exactly. Like, in terms of power scaling, I think Spartans are what you’d get if the Assassin Temples, Scola Progenium and Biologis wing of the Mechanicus got together to try and produce the ultimate commando unit. Something to be sent ahead of an invasion force to soften up the enemy. Sabotaging weapons platforms or motor pools, disabling anti-aircraft or anti-orbital defenses, weakening the infrastructure of static defenses, perhaps tampering with or destroying supplies.
@@venerablebrothergoriate5844 While the UNSC as a whole is less advanced than the Imperium, they still have enough toys that the Imperium would adore. Spartans sure, but also coilguns small enough to arm an infantryman or tank with, energy shields that are probably cheaper than something like a rosarius or iron halo, ODST drop pods, their microchip/crystal chip technology, Quantum Entanglement Communications (pretty sure)... And, of course, the Shaw-Fujikawa Slipstream Drive. That would be an absolute gamechanger for the Imperium - a new and reliable FTL alternative that, as the Covenant and Forerunners have shown, can be just as fast or even far faster and more accurate than Warp travel and DOESN'T rely on a whole race of abhuman mutants? The Mechanicus would get an absolute hard on for that.
spartans would be a better recon unit get a regiment of sole spartans about the size of the ghosts and set them off they would be stacking space marines like its jenga
I usually think of them the same way I think of the Tau. Cept they’re weaker than the Tau since they don’t have shield for their void ships, so weaker space wise which is normal for the UNSC. Ground wise they’ll definitely have to fight the same way genestealer cults do since their tech is lower than baseline imperium for armaments but Spartans would shred guard forces and would probably shred as a boarding party. Main problem is if they’re annoying enough the imperium can declare a crusade and even in this senario it’s a small fleet that worse than imperial ships so they wouldn’t stand much of a chance in orbit and orbital supremacy is incredibly important Covenant fleets would probably shred tho.
@sanguiniusonvacation1803 Lizard men with cybernetics . UNSC reaction fix bayonets , take aim and shoot any non human sob that comes our way. Necrons .. UNSC response. Bomb ,bomb ,bomb ,bomb the planets turn the mountains into rocks the rocks into pebbles , the pebbles into sand , the sand into space debris. Aka Nova Bombs to every Necron world they come across. It's going to suck for the first engagements. But they will 100% adapt and use their planet killers. Because they sure as hell don't have the numbers at this point. But they have the explosives.
If the Imperium decides to flash scan their fallen Astartes instead of putting them in dreadnoughts. This opens up several new options. 1. Design improved dreadnoughts. The smaller space of the AI chips would allow dreadnoughts to carry more weapons and armor. 2. Put the AI into a spartan or space mariner power armor. New recruits can be trained by the living memories of fallen warriors. The dead literally passing on their battle knowledge and instincts to the younger Astartes in real time.
Your example number 2 is very very similar to how the forerunners “produce warriors” in the halo forerunner trilogy. Every single warrior receives the “genetic imprint” of their mentor. Literally absorbing their essence and the original essence
the impersuim does in fact have ai but they still need to be bascly a actal brain in a jar or human that been cybernety contected dereactly into a mechancal body of some kind to work properly due to the warp messes with pure ectrinic circits in a way that makes ai go mad wihout some biowetware comptuer thats won't be efected by the warp ectrnicic circit corupting properltys bascly.
Those poor, poor UNSC bastards - talk about coming up snake eyes on the possible future scenarios they could find themselves in. No nice, shiny, Federation techno-utopia for them, oh no; they get thrown into 40K, where it is wall to wall cosmic horror and existential nightmares all day, every day.
@@Tracer_Krieg Yeah I was going to say, the UNSC has to face a hyper-religious alien empire hellbent on exterminating them, a brutal alien mercenary organization, two very much alive ancient aliens who specifically hates humanity(the endless and the Didact, thought technically Didact is already dead), an intelligent infectious space fungus hellbent on eating everything, remnants of the Insurrection, oh and also galaxy destroying superweapons, man humanity seems to always gets the short end of the stick in most Sci Fi stories
They just spent 30 years getting meat ground into the dirt by alien races. Having the chance to FIGHT BACK and have nearly infinite supplies (if slowly arriving, perhaps) would be CATHARTIC.
Dawg this is a better ending for them than what they got in Halo. They got genocided and put into breeding camps for aliens to eat them. That could happen in 40k sure but not to the level it did in their own universe where there were like 5 planets left of 800.
Once as inquisitor causes a Spartan to go MIA and the Biologis Tech Priest gets to take a look at the inner workings and the Imperium of man figures out what Spartans are and how they work the Schola Progenium is going to take the few million orphans that were not taken by the assassin guilds and mass product them as much as they can cause even 1% success rate would be a lot of dam Spartans
Spartan 2s have about a 35% success rate. Spartan 3s and 4s have a 100% success rate. All significantly better success rates than Astartes have. And Spartan 3 augmentations are near equivalent to Spartan 2s. So just use that and you have a hilariously easily mass producable super soldier for the Imperium. Just a step below an Astartes. And their all of their power armor has built in energy shields and doesn't even need big stupid backpacks to power them!
@@noneofyourbusiness2437 spartan 3s are not near equivalent to Spartan 2s. they cut corners with the 3s to make them cheaper. 3s don't get the massive skeletal augmentations by default as they were not meant to use Mjolnir armor, and they don't get the rapid growth thing, so they are smaller. also, 75 2s went into the program and 37 made it to the field; so closer to 50% success rate.
@@Greywolf905 They _do_ get very similar skeletal augmentations, actually. Its just in injections rather than surgically implanted. They recieve a Carbide Ceramic Ossification drug that makes their bones comparable to Spartan 2s. Otherwise Noble 6 and the rest of Noble Team wouldn't be able to wear their mjolnir armor without dying like standard ODSTs. This is a list of the augmentations they receive. "Carbide Ceramic Ossification Catalyst", "Fibroid Muscular Protein Complex", "Retina Inversion Stabilizer" which accompanies retina inversion surgery, and improvements to a Colloidal Neural Disunification solution. The last one increases their reaction times 300%, just like the Super Conducting Fibrification of Neural Dendrites give the Spartan 2s, thus giving them Spartan Time. You're right in that they don't get the growth hormone capsule so they aren't seven feet tall. Their biggest downfall was that most of them were given S.P.I. instead of actual Mjolnir. And they weren't selected from the best of the best candidates who won the genetic lottery like the Spartan 2s. Also, they might not have been trained quite as intensively but I might be remembering that part wrong. The Spartan 4s also have Carbide Ceramic Ossification, so they can wear Mjolnir too. As for the success rate, 30 of the 75 died, and 12 more were permanently crippled for life. So 42 were failures. Looking it up, 42 is 56% of 75. 100 - 56 is 44... So it would be a 44% success rate. Okay, I was wrong about that. I just looked up the success rates on Google and trusted what I saw rather than doing the math. My mistake. But that just makes it even better because even if they went with the 2s, their potential recruiting numbers could be rediculously high. It might not match the 44% success rate since the Imperium probably wouldn't care about Dr. Halsey's super strict genetic, physical, and mental standards but it would still be easier to mass produce than Astartes. That said the 100% success rate of the 3s is still better given their similar level of capability. Just give them the thyroid implant and proper Mjolnir rather than S.P.I. and you basically have Spartan 2s made with a slightly different methodology. Mostly chemical rather than surgical.
I say 1% Success Rate cause of how backwards the Imperium of Man is but if higher success rate of lets say 20% success rate for Imperium made Spartans 20% of 50 mill is 10 mill Spartans with that amount they don't need to be spartan 2 grade as a squad of normal Tempestus Scions with basic gear can kill chaos marines reliability so Tempestus Scions + Spatarn Augments ya scary
@cloverhoofs7249 I think we're also forgetting that spartan IIs were all pre screened and only perfect candidates were chosen, somthing the imperium probably wouldn't bother too much with.
On the matter of Spartans I imagine you would see relatively quick adoption by the wider Imperium (at least by imperial standards anyway). But you would also likely see the program split into two parallel lines of development, an S4 style program that recruits from the best the IG has to offer, and a continuation of the S2 model that focuses on acquiring genetically ideal candidates at a young age. And unlike the UNSC the Imperium wouldn't need to hide even be subtle about their recruitment of children, it's already part of their culture!
Its important to note Real life weapons exist in 40k and are called Auto guns. They make up a substantial minority of guard weapons and we know from the lore for common autoguns like Agripinaa patterns that they are roughly equal to modern fire arms. UNSC weapons are definitely comparable to those. They'd probably be best at fighting rebels and genestealer cults. They're good, but I don't think they'd have the firepower or the numbers for the big foes. Also spartans were originally made for quelling Insurgents, they'd be a less insane, cheaper version of the officio assassinorum
You're higher than me if you think UNSC weaponry is comparable to the 20th millennium weaponry of old Terra. The shotgun is a warcrime in their universe because it killed things too well. It was too good at its job. What about the semi-automatic rocket launcher with toggle dumb fire and heat seeking missiles that can 2 shot scorpions. Or the basic pistol that has an integrated scope and chambers in 50. with low recoil. Do you think I wouldn't want my troops to have handheld sniper rifles?
@@Lord-Regent-of-the-Imperium If you actually look at the lore numbers, comparing an Agripinaa pattern, one of the most common autoguns to a Halo MA5C rifle the Agripinaa has a slightly slower muzzle velocity but slightly higher caliber than a MA5C. They're practically equal. The only point of contention is what the bullets themselves are made of, is it tungsten, brass, or a fancy sci Fi material.
@@Lord-Regent-of-the-Imperium I still remember learning the specifics about the magnum, and seeing Pillar of Autumn's general crewmembers one handing the damn thing. Part of the reason why the OG halo 1 magnum 'supposedly' [later on] got explained was that the Pillar was on a secret high stakes mission, so they were given the *Good* bullets. The SAP-HE could penetrate the helmet of a Covenant Elite (Without shields.) in one pull, a scavenger that retrieved technology from a metaphysical empire [Forerunner: "I don't like how the galaxy looks. *tweaks how the entire galaxy works.*] that produced a shitty knockoff version of their shields- which deflects automatic fire pretty well. I bring this up, because most Stub/Autoguns underperform against the equivalent UNSC variation [The Imperium makes a lot of useless crap on the regular.] *But* I'd also say that modern firearms are about equivalent to some variations of autogun. Now, that sounds insane, but the imperium has lost a Fuckton of technology, and there is genuinely a market for Muskets in the imperium. If you were to say, get a autogun with all the fixin's [Specialty ammo, high quality, etc.] Then it outperforms the UNSC stuff. Absolutely so if you compare it to an Archeotech variation. To summerize archeotech weapons, a basic archeotech revolver [A kinetic destroyer] Gets taken by Custodes. The highest level of Imperial military might. tldr: There is shitty guns that the IG can get, that range from 'Makes our current shit look fantastic...Because economically it makes more sense.' To "The gun can kill three space marines in one bullet if you get them in a row, before applying specialty rounds, because the golden age of technology makes the Halo CE Magnum look Fair and Balanced from the covenant point of view."
“Every single bullet costs something” not with a laser gun. Love his acknowledgement of one of 40ks best features. Nobody ever runs out of ammo. Not even a storm bolter stuck on rapid fire…
People keep forgetting that the lasgun was supposed to be a cost effective logistical marvel, and that it can handle basic infantry just fine, and in some cases excel against slightly inferior enemies and below.
@@user-ww5sj3ny2y Yes it does it has power packs or battery packs which are rechargeable just like a lasgun or lascannon. Which depending on the variant of Spartan Laser and the battery pack. Each power pack holds between 4 to 8 shots before needing to be changed, The only reason it can't be changed out like a magazine in the games is for gameplay balancing reasons. Kind of like the limitation on the energy sword in the games. So yeah it has an ammo compacity but operates like a lascannon. That can be fired by a single individual soldier as opposed to having a crew served weapon. Also the lascannons power packs each are only useful for one shot. Meaning the UNSC is bringing two things into the Imperium with the Spartan Laser. The first is the obvious improved mobility of being a manpat anti armor weapon the other is having 4 to 8 shots before needing to change the power packs out. And then there is the fact that the Spartan laser can be used against enemy personnel. Imagine the face of a Tau Fire Caste warrior when the Guardsmen pull out a shoulder fired lascannon basically and shoot one of them in the face with it. The Spartan laser has a 1 to 3x magnification scope improving accuracy. So like I said it's a shoulder fired lascannon meant to be used against armor but can be used against personnel.
An interesting concept, UNSC's more efficient approach to space travel and logistic would be unvaluable to the Imperium of Man, naturally you 've to consider the fanatism and lack of pragmatism by a LOT of imperials, to avoid being branded as hereticals and subject to Exterminatus, the UNSC should use a very soft and astute/gradual approach, an example of this was well described in a (ongoing) Fanfiction, where GI Joe 's (& Transformers) world is suddenly teleported in WH40K'S universe. So they use their skills to fight the various menaces, either Xenos and human, with the masquerade of a far lost human colony.
Something not mentioned was that spartan and astartes use different flavored mods. Sure an astartes would wear a spartan like a scarf but by the end of the spartan 3 program they were pumping out spartans at near 100% success rate. Hell, most of the reason that spartan 3's never lived up to 2's was because they were used too early and treated as completely expendable. So combine the high success rate of spartan conversion with the effective modifications and you'd have ten or a hundred spartans for every engagement against, or with, astartes. Now i don't say that for the 'who would win' argument, but the possibility of rolling spartans, or their mods, into astartes programs. Firstly because astartes would always see spartans as lessers, so rolling them into the chapters would give them a feeling of camraderie rather than mockery or imitation. Secondly because spartan augments might be compatible with astartes augmentations, or a mix and match thing could go on there. You could end up with a higher rate of successes in the space marine programs while also still having 'lesser' positions for those that don't quite meet the requirements.
There’s a great video by “UncleSamLore” where he goes over the spartan 3 program. Your comment touched on part 2 so I can’t fully respond. But your second point is dead on in my opinion
fact unsc ships will instantly be converted to troopships for the imperium. Slip Space is far more reliable then warp travel. plus slip space doesn't have demons. edit: this is like really important, im suprised you didnt mention it as a bargaining chip, like we give you slip space tech and safety of joining your faction and we will give you basically the solution to all your logistical problems. warp suffers majorly from chronic never arrive on time or at all. but slip space is predictable, it literally has only slowed down a few times in halos history and each time was during a major fucking galactic scale wars.
Slip space is mostly reliable, under special circumstances (mainly when powerful forerunner tech is involved) time can mess with slip space. It just depends how the technology would mesh with 40k rules. It could turn out that a slip space drive is near unusable near warp storms, or even when a being as powerful as a primarch is onboard.
@MacroLore, or it taps into/temporarily creates parts of the webway? Also, Slipspace drive bombs and Nova Bombs would definitely peak the Imperiums' interest.
the soil space drive forces the vessel into a realm of 11 dimensions, the drive doubles as a computer that does intense math to plot the slipspace jump and create a quantum shield to protect the ship and crew from being torn asunder by slip space. so if it appears in 40k it would be a separate system of travel compared to warp travel. a primarch might be able to survive for a tiny bit inside slip space without a quantum shield but he will die to prolonged exposure as his body is torn apart at the quantum level. add on edit: Halsey has stated normal matter cant survive slip space
I think you need to change a few things. The number of bullets was estimated in COIN operations, where artillery isn’t used as much. While it’s definitely a lot of bullets being expended, I don’t think the 300.000 each kill will apply in full warfare. Additionally the industry will be able to make bullets of higher grade cheaper as time goes on. Especially if you have access to the resources of an entire system, the cost of small-arms ammo isn’t going to be that much. while the AR’s are “armor piercing”, it’s relative to infantry armor and very light armored vehicles. You won’t be ripping through an infantry fighting vehicle any time soon. The design of the UNSC tanks could be used by having the UNSC rebuild them with Imperial tech and armor, with a bit of their own mixed in. A plasteel and ceramite Scorpion with a Lascannon would serve just fine and solve many of the problems the Imperial tanks have, such as a lack of suspension.
The UNSC was in charge from 2525 on, right after first contact when they absorbed the CMA and enacted emergencies acts to take power. 2531 the UNSC had existed since the early days of colonization and was in full power by this point. The UEG was in control up till 2525 and then after 2552.
The question I would have is, would the Halo humanity even have souls as defined in Warhammer? Halo doesn't have the warp, therefor humanity wouldn't have a connection to the warp. If they don't have Warhammer style souls then I think they'd have an even stronger buffer against the warp then the Tau, they'd basically be living Necrons.
I'm not sure to be fair. You could argue that the gene song that the Librarian implanted could be considered a soul. I am not a fan of this argument though. I believe that they would be the equivelant of T'au. They are still visible, but you have to be looking hard to find them. And even then they weren't designed by the same gods, or even the same reasons
@@MacroLore It's more of the fact that people(mostly fanfiction writers) have a tendency of forcing characters, or factions, from other universes to suddenly have the same magic system of the new universe. While they must now follow the new magic system, I don't agree with treating those from a different universe as if they've always used the new universe's system.
@@supremercommonder The Domain doesn’t really collects souls so much as retains all the information about people to the point where this “information” is practically the person but in data form.
This is a minor nickpick, since your point about logistics still stands, but I think it warrants consideration: the estimation of how many rounds are expended to kill a single insurgent are not representative of what they would be to kill a single chaos cultist, an ork, etc. 40k war doctrine is vastly different to modern day COIN operations. The standards are different, the enemy is different, the politics are different, etc. First world westerns militaries place a prime emphasis on keeping their own casualties low, and they also happen to have access to vast military resources (particularly the US military, but others as well). They are likely to pour large volumes of fire on an enemy position to gain fire superiority and keep the enemy in place, and then call in a very expensive airstrike...because they can. And because what costs more than all those bullets, bombs, and fuel is the months of constant patrols and operations needed to finally find and engage those insurgents. It's like when people watch a video of an Apache helicopter and complain about how the soldiers are "wasting my tax money!" by using a hellfire missile to kill one or two insurgents. They don't understand that simply sustaining those forces in theater costs exponentially more than the munitions actually used in combat. When you finally have the enemy in your sight, you use whatever gives you the most certainty of a kill. Compare that to 40k, where most fighting is in massive pitched battles where one or both sides is throwing waves of soldiers at the other. All else being equal, this kind of fighting will VASTLY reduce the number of rounds necessary to kill a single enemy. Of course, if that enemy is some crazy creature that can tank 50 7.62mm rounds to its center of mass and keep fighting for a while, that may raise that number back up. So, round expenditure is highly contextual, I guess is what I'm saying. Also, your point on rounds used for training is true, although if the division of arms goes all the way down to the squad level, then you'd really want ALL of your riflemen trained on both lasguns and conventional firearms. This is how things are done currently in militaries, as it's no good if your automatic rifleman is knocked out of the fighting and no one can pick up his weapon and operate it. He may be more experienced, but others will have had some training at some point. And, obviously, he will be well trained on the use of the service rifles the rest of the squad is using, too. A possible solution here is to make the division of weapons at a higher level. Say, a standard rifle company has two autogun platoons and one lasgun platoon. That could help mitigate the issue, though obviously it will limit the flexibility in small unit engagements. I do agree that the UNSC has little to offer in terms of ground vehicles, which is funny because 40k vehicles are so inefficient in design. But UNSC vehicles, while looking and feeling really cool, are mostly inferior to their modern-day counterparts. It's possible the warthog would be more nimble than equivalent Imperium vehicles, and I could see Hornets being of some use. But the UNSC seems to have lots of gaps in its arsenal of vehicles, mostly because Halo Wars is the only game that needed to introduce some of those roles. But that's just my ramblings over nothing of significance. Great video!
first you'd need to figure out how the void dimension of Warframe would fit into the 40k verse... I would depict this as a dimension that has nothing to do with the warp. otherwise,the Imperium would call the Tenno witches and heretics,trying to kill them,purging EVERYTHING in the Origin system and even chaos would then call dibs on the Tenno by corrupting them and slurp their souls.
@@Spartan135 The Void seems to be a bit stronger and completely unrelated to the Warp. The Warp ( or at least the Big Four ) would cease to exist when everything in 40k were to be deleted from existance while the Void wouldnt give a damn about it. On the military side, the Origin system can literally out-produce the Imperium by a large margin. Hell, if the Sentient and Tenno were to work together then they can conquer most species in 40k ( well except for Necron and Dark Eldar )
Slipspace technology that the UNSC has could change the entire course of 40k history. It's arguably a lot more safer than warp and a lot faster as well. Downside of UNSC slip space is that its been noted to inaccurate at times as ships can end up thousands of kilometers off course, but they'll never hit each other, unless we're talking about the Slipspace drive used on the Infinity, which could go A LOT farther (by thousands of lightyears given it's Forerunner tech) and is a lot more accurate and has less of an error range
I laughed when you said the Imperial of Man hates wasted manpower. I mean to quote a famous creator, "Why can't Arconian not get the proper funding to patrol the Eye of Terror. Because it cost money, money the High Lords could spend on Black Jack and Hookers." Or why does Empire of Man insist all weapons have to be loaded with an army of loaders when even a pully system would be preferable. They don't care if they waste manpower doing something even half-efficient Or the death toll on their worlds to work the most inefficient manufacturing facilities seen even today. Crisis, factories foramen from the 1800s would cry with the death toll and inefficiency we see on Forge World.
Red team are Spartan 2 washouts not Spartan 3s. So, they'd have to develop a fix for whatever failed with Red team for their augmentations and/or develop the Spartan 3 program from the ground up.
@@MacroLore the Spartan 2 augmentations had a low success rate resulting in medical washouts ranging from stuck in a wheelchair to clinically dead. Red Team are among these washouts that were able to be rehabilitated and put back into service. So you'd have to see what went wrong with them to perfect the augments for more Spartan 2s. Also since Cortana was made using a clone of Halsey's brain you could get the logistics train running even faster if you could convince Primarchs or Custodes to have their brains cloned for this proces. Though you'd only have the AI for 7 years before needing a new one it's still better than whatever is running the Imperium at the moment.
What kind of fully detailed how to make and comprehend technology schematics do you think would be the most revolutionary to the Imperium of Man as a whole and be the biggest galactic game changer? The ACUs from the Supreme Commander series of games? The capabilities to build and manufacture Armored Core 6 mechs, bosses, and structures? Or Human technology and weaponry from the Bolo series including the Bolo Mk33?
The mastery of stellar engineering. Namely producing artificial stars. More efficient energy production, energy storage. Weapons manufacturing and just using mini stars as weapons
@@MacroLore I was thinking the ACUs would be more revolutionary. Think about it, a matter replicating and constructing mech that within an hour can bulid a base that batter a Tyranid invasion.
You want them to do well then put them next to the Severan Dominate, they would have a good and reliable ally from which they could learn basic things about other factions and would know what to say and how to react, plus you can trade a lot and relatively safely and that's what matters in live the most in the end.
I hope in part two you talk about Halo Mac cannons because I think the imperium of man would be very interested in getting there hands on them seeing as there basically massive super guns and could do a lot of damage against tyranids and probably the tau as well. Ps great video, I love halo and Warhammer this was great to find.
The Tau Empire has a very similar naval combat doctrine to the UNSC: engage the enemy from extreme range with highly precise kinetic and energy weapons, missile swarms, and strike craft.
@@tyreecebaker6600 Except that only SMACs would have the power to catch the imperium’s attention. And also macrocannons also use magnetic acceleration and deal more damage than the average MAC.
Fun Fact: you can translate Head Hunters into Latin which is Caput Venatores So you can say the head hunter branch of the Officio Assasinorum is the Venatores Temple
Honestly, I think an assortment of Halo Wars/2 vehicles could actually stick around after copious updates to 40K standards. The Scorpion Tank would be perfect as a "Light" Tank or Mobile Turret for a Guard unit, while some like the Cyclops would probably be retired or relegated to civilian use. On the topic of Corpse Starch shortage, Two words: Flash Clones. Clones are created, Clones die, Clones become Corpse starch, and the Imperium is fed. Now I have to wonder how the designs of the UNSC/CMA/UEG starship would be adapted into Imperium type and sized vessels. Honestly, I can see updated version of frigates in their original sizes being used as close support vessels for planetside operations. Think of them as UNSC/Guard versions of AC-130s and giving "proportionate" responses when called upon. Paris classes would be perfect for heavy close support, stalwarts could be used for lighter support, and Charons could be used for troop resupply under fire.
Cadians are still around. Cadian standards and training are still being applied on many Imperial planets. There are even kasrkin kill teams made up of non-cadians and they are all around the galaxy too.
I'm don't think you mentioned this but what would happen with the UNCS ships would they still exist to some extent or be replaced entirely by imperial ships with some parts( ie. The slip space drives or mac guns) woven into them? Also great work and keep it up!
Originating in a human brain or not, they are not run on human brains/organic matter. UNSC AIs run on silica/crystal wafers, and are thus literally _Silica Animus_, a Mechanicus term for a twisted mockery of a human mind, treacherous and insane. In other words, every UNSC AI would be regarded as on the verge of turning omnicidal, like _all other AI made by humanity_ and destroyed.
@@dkbros1592 If nothing else, that'd make for a very fun set of ideological clashes between various Forge Worlds over whether UNSC Smart AIs - the ones created from flash-cloning brains specifically - are abominable or not. On the one hand, they're still very much ARTIFICIAL intelligence. But on the other hand, they're direct copies of human intelligence created with a profound loyalty to mankind that a "simple" thinking program would not have. And of course, they could just refuse to ever fix rampancy - that way no AI can ever be around long enough to think of rebellion.
UNSC stands for United Nations Space Command. They were part of the UEG but were basically running the show by the end of the war. Even though the UEG never technically went away.
Imagine if the UEF from Supreme Commander was teleported into the 40k Galaxy -The building time in game is actually canonical (You can literally have an army ready with full T3 and experimental in half hour of your driving) -The in-game unit cap is linearly just that your pc wouldn´t fry as the army grew exponentially. -Quantun Gate Teleportation, no warp shenanigans. -Resistance to psionic attacks (The Aeon shenanigans) -Only weakness is that we don´t know nothing about their space capabilities.
@@MacroLorejust letting you know that Destiny would slap. Oryx, the Taken King powerscaled to maximum could theoretically solo 40k but that’d be boring. Honestly the Destiny power level is just absolutely bonkers.
I’d say if you wanted any ghost of a chance of the Spirit of Fire cooperating with the Imperium they’d have to drop into Ultramar. Probably just in time to help Robust Girlyboat fend off old Morty and his gangrene gang. And maybe they’ll survive whatever seething rage he will barely manage to hold back at seeing their AI.
Was there any mention of neural markers/implants? From what I read they can be used to read thoughts so it could potentially be used to negate chaos corruption
That and the neural implant has an IFFID tag that can be used to track every individual member of the military. So chaos corruption would immediately be taken care of by ONI assassins via training accident.
More like Machine Spirits . Because that's the closes thing they could come up with to classify transhuman minds that can control technology in the way Smart AIs can.
Hi this is my first time watching one of your videos. So I would say that some of the UNSC,s VTOL and anti-aircraft weapons have a slim chance of being used, simply because they might fill roles the imperium doesn't have or we don't really see. Something like the Hornet or Wolverine. Also I know that Lasblasters ( or whatever the Frateris Templar used) haven't been a thing for a while but ODST with them would be great.
I don’t think 7.62 would be all that effective in 40k. A las rifle is described as being equivalent to a 50cal and in media appears equivalent to 7.62 already.(since lore numbers are goofy)
the rounds in halo are armor piercing with a hint of magnetic acceleration, while they won't punch though something heavily armored as astartes & other armored vehicles the magnum & sniper definitely can. the magnum fires 50 cal APHE rounds, while the sniper can penetrate tank armor.
@@cr90captain89 I don’t think the hand held rifles in halo are magnetically accelerated at all, there isn’t anything like that mentioned or on the wiki. Off the top of my head right now I’m fairly sure it’s all FMJ which isn’t even the better armour piercing we have today.
@@syd4952 nope, the UNSC uses small miniaturized low power magnetic accelerators into their weapons which gives them just enough punch to make 7.62 viable, its why a fully shielded elite (a 9 ft tall saurian, described by a super soldier as having iron for muscle) flinches when you pelt him with shots. or why 5ft tall grunts with additional armor do 360 degree backflips when shot by the magnum ( the transfer of forward momentum that the 50 cal couldn't do on its own.)
@cr90captain89 40k unsc sniper can't pin all 40k tanks but a handful of them they can however, if we was about to talk about the Imperium knights then no it can't.
Considering the size of the UNSC forces they would disappear into the massive ranks of the imperial forces. The 480 trillion imperial guardsmen, the tens of millions of space marines, the millions of knights etc. They would cease to exist after a century or so of combat and go down as a small note in imperial military history.
The thing weve seen is individual worlds in th imperium are perfectly willing to skirt the rules fir their own gain, at least unless its a daot ship then they just mindlessly kill with out a first thought let alone a second. If the tau can integrate themselves then the unsc can as well.
There are hundreds or thousands of dormant AI within the Milky Way. I promise you that the dark age AI would favor the UNSC since they are closer to the golden age humanity
@@MacroLoreDidn't those AI destroy golden age humanity with the men of iron though? Which is the exact reason why The Emperor ordered a kill on sight on every AI to begin with?
@@iamsinistar8971 there are many many theories. One says the emperor caused the age of strife, one says ai just revolted, one says ai fell to chaos, one says ai were given poor instructions, one says the ai realized that to achieve humanities ultimate goal that humanity could not exist (this goal being defeating chaos)
@@MacroLore Knowing 40K Tzeentch probably sent some viruses to set things in motion...Either that or he got bored and wanted to pull a chaotic prank for kicks and giggles.
@@iamsinistar8971 Tzeentch is also the only chaos god who would win the great game, and just not tell anyone and keep them playing. It's not a stretch to think that chaos tainted the AI, since if they came close to "achieving a soul" it's a bad day for the galaxy. Or AI isn't allowed yet since there hasn't been a "rebirth" of the Omnissiah or the chaos god of creation/machines (Vashtorr). It's a really open ended question like the Rangdan Xenocides
I like to imagine the planets the unsc make their own are fundamentally different but still loyal. Other regiments can rely on the fact there can be a supply line and their commissars are a bit fairer than most
Imagine if cawl just took the tech that mind coppies ppl and makes the "ai" and just did it to the Emperor Caz thats something i could see him asking guiliman to help with
You forgot two things. 1. Imagine the fusion of spartan laser destrctive ability with las gun battery tech, as well as replacing MA5s with cheap rapid fire gauss rifles using the aforementioned battery tech would be THE signature weapon package of the UNSC. 2. Better mechs, you see those fancy energy shielded Mantis and the more basic Cyclops mechs? The spirit of fire could make those things with just slightly modified blueprints, and yeah those things can be piloted by your basic grunts with their implants which everyone in the UNSC forces get.
Um or the UNSC Marines could just start using their canonical weapons attachments like the Kinetic Bolt barrel attachment that encases the bullets fired in Hardlight infused anti matter and just go about their day without having to learn a new weapon system. Also the Spartan Laser variant The M6/X variant is powered by Series 6971 battery cells . Which are both changeable and rechargeable . And are far more powerful than a Lasgun power pack. The Lascannon power packs each have one shot and their done. The Spartan Laser takes out tanks,armored vehicles , aircraft ,personnel , etc and has 4 to 5 shots per battery cell. Of course the game mechanics don't show you taking out battery packs or recharging a Spartan Laser. But that's game play.
@@John2r1 first part: Halo 5? Gross. I was thinking more Reach to Halo 3 tech. Second part: I did some searching and what you said is true. Like man, the Imperium just cannot win in the tech department. Objectively worse FTL, worse weapons, worse exterminatus. You would have thought that you can't beat the Imperium in the exterminatus department, but the NOVA bomb just obliterates a planet and it's moon by being in orbit between them.
@titanfallgamerwithnotitanf8187 Oh trust me I got about halfway through Halo 5 campaign and quit because the games story sucks. Chief goes from Hero of the UNSC to being hunted by some children level Spartan team like a game of tag. But they did introduce some good tech in that game. At least as far as multi-player is concerned.
This suddenly occurs to me though the biggest problem the UNSC would have would be the Mechanium. Due to their mandate that all technology is theirs. The Mechanus would wend their tech priests to take all unique tech and put themselves incharge of it. By force if necessary. This would be something unnacceptable by the UNSC unless they can prove that something like the Spartan II's would be something only the UNSC can make. I'm saying the SPartan II's for a few specific reasons. The mechanium has a better grasp of Genetic engineering than even the UNSC. So they would be able to have it would be harder to convince them. But Spartan II's are chemically augmented and trained a specific way. This would make the UNSC have more credit in that only they can make Spartan II's which while not as good as Astraties they can be deployed in larger forces and be used like elite commando forces or even combat divisions. Although that would likely mean that unless they can somehow convince the imperium to turn them into a war world. Or war system their is no way they would be allowed to do anything but make Spartan II's. They wouldn't even be able to make tanks or anything else. The UNSC would need some kind of excuse that the Imperium would not even question why they have combined arms. Like some major Xeno attack or some invasion of some sort in the sub sector that requires the Major troop's to be deployed. (another problem is that the UNSC might not be allowed their own fleet it's an imperial law and only an anomaly that ultramar has it's own fleets due to getting permission by the Emperor himself. Although I could picture the UNSC would somehow manage to create a clerical error and perpetuate it for a long time. if they can get one of their AI's into the Imperium Bureaucracy somehow. To keep up the clerical error.
You are forgetting How Guilleman would react to the UNSC possessing a FTL system that does not rely on the Warp, Navigators, or Gellar Fields to function, and (hopefully now as fast as the Covenant) not affected by Warp Storms or Currents!!!!!! Something like that would be INVALUABLE to Guilleman for getting reinforcements across the Great Rift and navigating the Galaxy without the Astronomicon!!!!
Now imagine if USMC somehow gets sucked through a warp hole and end up joining Imperium. Suddenly the Inquisition would find out exactly which xeno races females can get impregnated.
I like the idea, although I feel like the glaze was laid a little thick on the Spartans. Even though the Imperium has generally better technology and stuff, despite most knowledge lost and progress haulted, the Imperium's real advancement is bio-engineering. They are really good at it, so much so that with the exception of the Necrons, no one else in the current 40k universe really can do it better. And, with everything else stagnated, bio-engineering is the only real thing that they continue to improve and refine. Don't get me wrong, the Spartans being used as a branch between Astartes and Guardsmen is a decent idea in hindsight, but the UNSC technology far predates Imperial bio-engineering so I have high doubt they will continue making the same Spartans. I can see them creating new Spartans that are modified by the skilled hands of the Imperium's bio-engineers, but even then I kind of douobt it being anything more than an elite unit amongst their guard regiment. Spartans are highly capable and enhanced humans, most not quite to the level of space marines, but definitely can perform on their level, but many of the Astra Militarum elite forces do the same, such as Krieg Grenadiers, Cadian Kasrkin, or the general Tempestus Scion, all of these elite units perform on and outperform the level of Astartes on many occasions.
You are missing the UNSC biggest contribution and that is FTL JUMP . The imperium needs to sacrifice lives just to do that where the USNC can jump without the warp.
Halo stars are bad enough over all but they contain the Ghoul Stars that brought the Pale Wasting that saw entire sectors devoured by xenos including 12 whole chapters of space marines in the losses. Also besides the horrendous creatures ans eldritch horrors, there is the bone kingdom of the flayed ones too. Add a splinter fleet of tyranids in it for extra toppings
Standard 7.62 is *not* an anti armor round. It's good against body armor if that's what you meant, but generally, body armor is more to take a few rounds as opposed to just being truly bulletproof
The UNSC uses 5 ammo types , 6 if you count the APHE rounds from the Silver Timeline. But since that timeline is bullshit were going to stick with the 5 canonical types. 1. M118 FMJ-AP (full-metal jacket, Armor Piercing) rounds. Obviously these are designed to pierce armor. 2. Shredder rounds, an alternate 7.62×51mm ammo type that is designed to splinter on impact, and are highly effective against lightly-armored infantry like the Covenant Grunts for example. Which are a kind of mix between a goblin , giant crab and a chimpanzee. 3. Hollow-points . Yeah the UNSC basically pisses on the Geneva Convention. 4. 7.62mm AP-T (armor-piercing, tracer) ammo. 5. 7.62mm HEDP (high-explosive dual-purpose) ammo. Now the UNSC just wiped their ass with every single convention and treaty banning exploding bullets, caught them on fire and tossed them out the window. So yes they have ammo for armor piercing. and exploding the target inside the armor. Of course if anyone really angers the Army/Marines then the Snipers might just break out the M99/M99A2S3 Stanchion and start hitting the enemy with an anti material cannon from hell aka a man portable Gauss Cannon aka a mini mac sniper rifle capable of hitting targets at 4.9 miles away or 7.9 Km if your into drinking metric leaf water. And when it hits the round turns the target into red mist. I mean seriously the M99A2S3 is a suppressed coilgun that fires Tungsten Darts at Mach 43.7 . Not sure what space magic they used but that might just be enough to take care of the problems the MA5 doesn't take care of.
Could you please do the forces of NOD from the Tiberian Sun Series. As if they were a heretic cult in 40k. It would be really cool to hear your story on how you imagine it to be like. 😁
@@MacroLore it’s a RTS video game series for Command And Conquer, Tiberian Sun is my favorite of the groups. Renegade is a first person shooting in the same universe , that is my second favorite. If you want lore videos for this series. You can watch the lore videos from Jethild, on RU-vid. I would link a video. But RU-vid won’t let me. If you have a discord I could link the lore video series of his. 🙂
I feel like they would be almost just admech but with a suicidal units, wacky vehicles, itchy nuke button fingers and fanaticism towards glowing green radioactive crystals...so cyber skaven
I love these sorts of topics. If you ever dive into putting Star Wars factions in Warhammer 40k, I'd suggest starting off with the CIS. Not only could they fill a niche, but I believe they'd do well. So, take the several thousand star systems belonging to the CIS and plop them into 40k.
All jokes and memes aside, I believe you can watch PancreasWork's video on UNSC being in the Warhammer 40,000 galaxy for good reference on this topic. He did phenomenal work in incorporating the UNSC in a bat-shit insane galaxy that is Warhammer 40K by including several scenarios that could work. Personally, I love the scenario in which the UNSC becomes an advanced Nomadic Civilization that travels across the galaxy, helping whatever Human worlds and sometimes, benevolent Xenos worlds however they can; All the while, the UNSC adapted and reverse-engineered advanced technologies of different species and made them better for themselves. Depending on their location and the time of their appearance in the Warhammer 40K Galaxy, the UNSC might make contact with the Imperium, and given the unique technologies + industrial capacity + most importantly, the adaptability of the UNSC, the Imperium might make some concessions (with Guilliman at the helm of course) and accepted the UNSC's conditions. Anyway, what do you think about this?
@@thesilentscreamer1595 except that pancreas is a pathological halo fanboy and all his arguments are based on his fanboy logic that the UNSC would actually get that far. Which is a *massive* assumption.
Ok i have to say this now as a fan of both games and lore,if you Going to say Spartan's are literally Mechanize tanks or unit's then they will just simply get out number and die because you only have 3. A guy said if they will ever be Spartans in Warhammer40k they won't be the front lines troops due to the UNSC jump into a different place and they don't know what is out there. Therefore they would save them and use ODST to Scout out ahead saving something that is must valuable or secret making sure no one knows about them and slowly they will become assassins due to space marine are = if not better but when you go into different versions of space marines then the Spartans can't compete due to using the warp or taking massive damage. There are more reasons why i said this due to lore. Now if they can make Spartans then they would be better of doing that for the front line troops however that can't be due to lore reasons on X people on the ship = X deaths and there proof of this out there if not then we can't use game lore because it won't add up people in the ships for the UNSC. Overall you might get 3 or 5 Spartans if not less, not 20 in mind because they are rare gen II not gen IV. Also in the lore for both games about humans they would be the same due to we believe hell and stuff so yes the warp will be a thing for them can't lie but no they won't be the same as the Tau because both games use the human as the real verse of ourselves so it wouldn't make sense if you removed it. I can say so much more into this debate with you have by your opinion that most of it sounds good but the things i said and saw what you said i disagree with. Due to not making any sense. In 40k hell was a thing and it become the warp overtime and hell was rename of the warp and humanity slowly get Visions of the warp and realizing its real and when they use the warp people thought they are not humanity so they killed them and realized the warp is a tool a deadly tool, so they made Sister of battle to make sure the warp won't get as bad because it was bad enough how it is with the other factions. I will Edit this part to see whats nexts Ok so you did agree putting them in the assassin's and I would agree they will join the imperial of man. But I don't think they would make Spartans or make them go into space marines due to lore but I do see where they can combine both into 1 super solder but that's going to be hard if they don't have that Dr tho. But overall i will say I agree 80% of the video but disagree with the 20% Due to what they might happen with the UNSC. I mean what you said I would say something different but simpler in some ways.
Question: How well would a Planetary Annihilation Commander do in the setting of Warhammer 40k? If it was to defend humanity how well do you think the robotic armies it can spawn would do against large Tyranid invasions of entire sectors? Would it take out many Hivefleets and make them waste quadrillions of bioforms and lose alot of biomass by the sheer power of it's manufacturing capabilities and the strength of it's armies?
@@MacroLore Planetary Annihilation is a real-time strategy game on the PC developed by Uber Entertainment. Several game developers of the Supreme Commander games also helped create Planetary Annihilation which is why when you see gameplays of it and the way units behave it is kinda similar to Supreme Commander some what but on a bigger scale. The Planetary Annihilation Delta Commander will build gigantic infrastructure even larger then the ACUs could ever manufacture in Supreme Commander. We're talking about giant robots the size of mountains and cities and massive defensive structures or production facilities. You can bulid thousands of nuclear launching sites, giant ships and space stations to attack in orbit of a planet, massive plasma platforms, and even planet destroying weapons and you can literally even move a planet by constructing several giant thrusters on it and make it slam into another planet. The Titan robots in this game are so big it's like Dark Age Of Technology continent sized robots big.
@@MacroLore Indeed it is, Planetary Annihilation is a big in scale game and you can set up wars across a solar system and invade other planets of your enemies and punch holes into their defenses as you land in and contruct your own base on the enemy's planet. That's alot of Dakka as the Orks would say. And since you can build ships as well your not defenseless against fleet combat. You can build alot of orbiting defenses as well to use against ground infantry or heavy armor. Once you see what the biggest wars and varies levels of destruction and units in certain videos you can see why I think a Delta Commander would devastate a entire Tyranid Hivefleet. Multiple Delta Commanders would be so powerful in Warhammer 40k I think they can both survive and thrive pretty well without taking over the entire setting immediately but being powerful enough to keep on persevering. They maybe limited to a few solar systems at a time but they pack some serious precision, unit cohesion, and firepower.
So the thing about 7.62 x 51 is that it’s genuinely magnitudes weaker than las guns. Like lasguns are unreasonably powerful, they’ll blast limbs off and such. If what you wanted to do is get them dark mechanicus traitors then they’d definitely ditch all their normal gear for las guns. Even AP 7.62 is kinda alright it’s good for modern body armor but I’m pretty sure level 3a plates can still deflect it if you don’t hit it head on. Secondly radiation actually is terrible for armor since rad weapons are basically just normal slug weapons that eventually will kill their opponents with radiation if you aren’t straight up hitting them. Anyways on a side note enough radiation by itself will kill you no less the radiation sickness you’d get volley firing like you would need for rad weapons to work as anti armor since you need a lot of rads in the area which is still detrimental to your own troops. Anyways the assassin part is kinda random I think you were in the right track with the scions train of thought. Like cadian kasrkin seem like a similar role they could fill but practically just using them as breaching teams would be ideal since fitting anti tank weapons inside sucks. Corpse starch also isn’t common to each among the imperium just in hive worlds. The guard regiments each have their own sources that isn’t corpse starch. Bit of a grim dank joke that sorta caught on. Apparently one of the more common food rations is something called Soylens Viridians which is made from algae apparently.
Um you can blow off a human limb with a shotgun. So no Lasguns are not as powerful as many in the fandom like to make them out to be. Secondly the UNSC uses 7.62x51mm ammo but there are different types of rounds they use. The most common is the M118 FMJ-AP rounds but they have others. Shredder rounds are an alternate 7.62×51mm ammunition type occasionally employed with the MA5 series of rifles. The projectiles they fire are designed to splinter on impact, are highly effective against lightly-armored infantry and building materials like marble usually tiles sometimes columns depending on how many rounds they shoot. 7.62×51mm hollow-point ammunition are optimal for use against unprotected biological targets. 7.62mm AP-T (armor-piercing, tracer) ammunition is also used. My favorite two types of ammo employed by the UNSC are the 7.62mm HEDP (high-explosive dual-purpose) ammunition. And the gyroscopically-stabilized APHE (armor-piercing high-explosive) rounds optimized to deplete personal shielding and pierce armor before exploding inside the target. In the case of the Covenant this is energy shielding and Nanolaminate armor. Yeah the UNSC doesn't follow the Geneva Convention or the 1868 St. Petersburg Declaration or the 1899 Hague Convention either. These make the use of exploding or expanding ammunition illegal in war. Just so you know. Also Lasguns don't work like ballistic weapons. And the human arm that was blown off was unarmored. A dude in polished armor from the middle ages could survive being hit by a lasgun because the metal would reflect the lasers energy duh. But the same knight in shiny armor wouldn't survive being shot by a APHE 7.62x51mm round. Fact is armor is built to protect against expected weapons and the UNSC aren't idiots. They will do something not very many groups in the setting do. Adapt to their enemy.
@@John2r1 You would think they would use Dum-dum bullets to kill them easily and deplete their shields faster. Polished steel armor wouldn't have enough deflection to prevent a laser from burning through it.
Those calibre weapons do reasonably well against lightly armoured vehicles in-game (and yes, game canon supersedes all other sources) - but yeah, they're pretty crap against tanks. You'd still lose one-on-one, but get a whole team to focus fire a Warthog with BRs or DMRs and it's taking a lot of damage fairly fast.
Are we talking about the played out always one step behind UEG/UNSC or the fully realized Reclaimer UEG/UNSC where all of humanity are augmented and the Armed forces all have powered armor and combat skins and contender class AI's plus a fleet of millions that are up to a 100km long and armed with hard light and plasma based weapons to name a few,that UNSC will have no problem with being in the 40k universe, thoughts?
I believe that Humanity's "augmentations" are actually undoing genetic damage that the Forerunners inflicted in the Halo canon. It would be very interesting to see that baseline.
Interesting counter scenario, what if a small Imperial fleet found itself in the Halo universe. A total cultural revolution among humanity, increasing religiosity and xenophobia in response to the Covenant, the rise of a religion derived from the Imperial Cult.
funny thing about that is that IoM ships are so big even a small fleet would have a huge tonnage over most fleets on both sides of the human/covenant war. ships like the Punic class supercarrier would be classed as a Light Cruiser by the IoM. in fact I think the dauntless is actually bigger. it would be enough to tip the scales for a moment. maybe long enough to humanity to field IoM shield tech on their ships; which would tip the scales permanently.
