Theorem is a small step up, with a sharper downlane motion. with a similar pin height, i think there is enough room for both. you can always separate them more with surfaces.

not doing a combined chart, but the charts are relative to one another to give you a good idea of how they compare

Only one year of releases on this chart.

​@@BowlingBuckoshStill, that's my benchmark and still something that plenty of people are likely still purchasing

Definitely an option! Since NU is so early and smooth, it's likely that you'd take a step in with reactive when you change. If the shot has a lot in the middle you might even consider balling up when you step in.

not sure the exact question, you threw a lot of info out there at once. the original Web black/purple/blue is a sanded hybrid from 2018. it will be much much rounder with slightly less overall hook than the shiny widow 2.0 hybrid with HK-22. Mesmerize is HK-22 with the Cohesion additive from the Hammer Effect. It's a sanded solid that will be much earlier and stronger overall than the Atlas Pearl. The Atlas pearl will not have Cohesion, and is much longer and sharper.

This is it

Yea, since (and including) the last Bowl Expo 2023. I would place the Envy Tour directly between the Hazmat Solid and the Low Flare on the chart, but there are differences in shape since the EvT has asymmetry.

if there were more space between balls i would place it in the narrow gap between the Effect and the Hazmat (o.g. hybrid). The Effect is stronger in the late-midlane than Widow 2.0 Hyb, but Widow 2.0 Hyb has more backend that Hazmat hybrid.

@@BowlingBuckoshawesome thank you! Was thinking about picking up the sting but wanted to make sure it fit in well with what I had

no. since you are not drilling through the nugget, the drilled numbers scale like normal. the nugget only lowers the RGs of the undrilled ball relative to the same core that does not have a nugget prior to drilling.

@@BowlingBuckosh got ya I just thought maybe it would lower the RG a little cause I’m removing weight from the outside but it definitely makes sense it would change them like normal.

without knowing your tilt, rotation or PAP, it's a bit difficult to advise. sounds like it's either a layout mismatch or a ball strength mismatch. if you are using a particularly strong core or cover, you need something longer, and if you are using a ball on the weaker side, the reverse is probably true. if multiple balls are leaving corners, then i would say your layouts are an issue.

knowing nothing about your game or your house shot, it's very difficult to advise. for higher pattern volumes, higher speeds or lower rev rates, i like the Hitter. For more friction, lower speed bowlers, or higher rev rates i would say something like the Breakaway.

5" pin-PAP should be sufficient; without your PAP i don't know how far from the grip center (CoG) the pin is with a 30 VAL angle. the pin-CoG distance is the critical distance to control flare potential for no-thumb bowlers. 30 VAL is usually a medium-high pin-CoG number, but it varies PAP to PAP. we recommend the range of 1.5" (absolute weakest) to 5.5" (absolute strongest) pin-CoG distances.

My Pap is 6” straight over when I’m up the back, and 5.5” over by 1/2” up when I get around it. I tend to prefer around 4-5” COG distances. 5x4x5 is my favorite 2LS layout for reactive solids.

then 30 is a good VAL approximator for 4.5" 👍. on syms i would go with a long drill angle like 85 to get the CG in line with the CoG for our designs.

if you are leaving it at box finish, try Hammer Clear Magic foam and a microfiber towel. as soon as you're done bowling, pump it onto the ball surface, lighty wipe to spread it evenly, let it sit for an extra 30 seconds to work, then scrub the dirt and cleaner off. If you sanded the surface, then my favorite product is PowerHouse Clean N Dull, same instructions.

NU cover has some pearl in it but it is NOT a standard reactive base. it's built on a completely different chemistry platform.

your best bet is to be engaged with your local pro shop and local staffers. there are very few staff positions available at a regional/national level.

Radical doesn’t do a lot of staff positions from what I understand. They talk about it on the weekly podcast occasionally.

Max Bias is a really strong candidate for this. Any of the stronger sanded asyms such as Hitter or og Outer Limits would also be ok depending on the strength you are looking for.

you can drill Rattler NU stronger and more use surface for a step up if you choose!

@@BowlingBuckosh very tempting 😂

cool, keep us posted about how it goes!

@@BowlingBuckosh @BowlingBuckosh I ended up going with a more control layout. 5" pin to pap, 2" pin to COG (per the Troublemaker layout tool), which was 100x5x64. Tried it out today, and did well with it. Had to play straighter that expected, mostly due to the house shot being wrecked by open play. Once I got outside enough to find a little friction, the ball picked up earlier than my Xray and Pathogen Plague Solid urethane. The Xray was useless on the carry down. The Rattler NU was a few feet earlier, and what I would call aggressively smooth than the PPSU.... meaning it doesn't make as fast of a move, but covers more boards than you would expect from how smooth it comes off the spot. Can't wait to try it on the actual fresh league shot. I expect it'll let me play about 5 boards deeper than my PPSU... so I can switch to the NU when that ball gets into flat 7 territory. If I were to give layout advice, I'd say use the Troublemaker layout tool, and treat the NU like a reactive ball. It took well to a weaker layout, when a normal urethane would've puked with the layout I used. No need to slap the standard strong urethane layout on the NU to get it to react correctly. Use the layout to fine tune the reaction like you would on a reactive ball.

@@deadpolymers3416 for most players i would recommend a neutral-to-strong pin-CoG for NU covers, but i'm glad this motion is working for you. i know your rev rate and lack of oil volume are a unique situation.

@@BowlingBuckosh 2 weeks of league (throwing it 5 of 6 games), as well as maybe 5 or 6 full games of practice and I'm loving the ball reaction so far. The 5x2 layout I used was a bit too smooth out of the box, but as it lane shines it's getting better and better. Like NU Blue, the Rattle NU with lane shine is a bit more clean and a little stronger off the back end. If I drilled it again, I might go with a shorter pin to pap, to get more flare out of it, but I really like the shorter Pin to COG. This is a must have ball for those high rev bowlers who want a smoother alternative to reactive balls.

the original Crypto (solid) or the Boom? Break Away will be a nice step down from the original Crypto with more length but a familiar motion shape. Boom is longer and stronger downlane than Break Away.

Sweet I can't wait to get it ordered

a nice little bump up in strength from the entry level Rhino line.

Fireball similar, but stronger than a Tundra Fire, and Arctic Vibe is a bit earlier and rounder than both. If Tundra Fire is too much, I would look to a Nu Blue Hammer. You can smooth the box surface to help give it a bit more length.

@@BowlingBuckosh excellent idea! Thank you!!

12.5mph at the pins is still medium-slow off your hand, so you are definitely rev dominant. pin-down is a good option for you for a smooth motion front-to-back. we RARELY recommend pin-down syms, but your style would be an exception. with your high rev rate you should get a controlled benchmark motion, (or one step more controlled than benchmark), on fairly fresh medium conditions.

@@BowlingBuckosh you described my Squatch Solid precisely. It's pin down. I'm going from 16 lbs to 14 lbs (age). I drilled my first 14 lb ball this past weekend. Widow 3.0, 70x 5x 30. I had to lane shine it out to keep it on the right side. I beleive these modern covers are too strong for me. My selections will have to be lower differential, or pin down to add extra feet in length.

a full 9 pts more diff in those Raw cores - a great value!

no issues on my end. try going to the original trouble maker landing page and scrolling to the bottom. if you are still having issues let me know. dv8bowling.com/products/balls/retired/trouble-maker

@@BowlingBuckosh got it! Thanks!

any time you drill into a ball you change the performance, that is why layouts matter so much. The mass removal of the inner core plays a big role in the final ball numbers. With this inner nugget, it is very deep and relatively very small, so hitting it is unlikely, but you could raise the RG just a bit more than usual if you do.

The Emerge is a much much stronger core and coverstock. I think the control that a Raw offers might do her a bit of good. She will then have 2 options, Emerge for oil and Raw for control.

@@BowlingBuckosh thank you for your reply.

from Ebonite? not likely. the original Infinity from Brunswick is probably the next closest recent release.

no physical chart. Hammer does have strength ratings with the ball/core images on their website. if you have questions about specific balls in relation to each other, i can help answer those.

hey there! i see the Cypher being a bit later revving, less in the midlane, more in the backend, and less total hook, but not by a lot. piranha is faster revvving and higher flaring which gives it a bit more midlane and smoothness.

I believe we are seeing some level of improved continuation out of balls with non-centric mass locations, yes, but i want to point out a few interesting things too: the Radical bands are rarely centered. In Breakaway for example, most of the band is above the midplane by design. Also, a band core like Breakaway will have a little bit more total diff and a good bit more intermediate diff after drilling than a core with very little middle mass, all else being equal. The difference in diff and int diff is enough to make them read earlier and firmer, which could be what you are seeing on the lanes.

@@BowlingBuckosh Thank You for the insight; earlier & firmer could be what I am indeed seeing. I had available an Innovator, which has the middle band, & Thug with a less enhanced middle band. Took my Innovator Pearl 50 x 3 1/2 x 35 and Thug Corrupt Hybrid 50 x 3 1/2 x 60 (same 500/3000 surface) out to experiment; had friend help spot & film. PAP was confirmed, both balls reached the "pin to spin" line 2 - 5 feet after the end of the 42' pattern. Also found the axis at just before the pins; using tape spots and both eyesight & camera to confirm all 3 axis positions. More importantly, traced the flare rings, both in the oil & after the pattern. Bowtie on the Thug was spread out, while on the Innovator was tight. Total flare Innovator 4 5/8" & Thug 4 7/8". Innovator 3 1/8" oil flare & 1 1/2" dry flare. Thug 2 1/4" oil flare & 2 5/8" dry flare. Innovator is much earlier than the Thug (for me) on the lanes. Just rewatched the Innovator Throbot video & the pin up vs pin down layouts had a very similar chart for each individual type. Seems I have 2 very different ball reactions here. Once again, thank you. btw, just watched your Cypher info!!! you rock.

interesting analysis. the total flare potential of these 2 look to be similar after drilling on paper because the midband of innovator allows the thumb hole to make up the difference in intermediate diff after drilling. the thug is both a higher RG core and a substantially weaker cover technology, which is likely contributing to the innovator revving earlier and digging in the front part of the lane sooner by comparison. i think your eyes and the oil v. dry flare measurements back this up! thanks!

there are different opinions on which is better. the current one certainly is more modern and bold. We don't use the old one because the pin (or DOT) was used as the ball in that logo, and with modern layouts, the logo is almost always drilled into in that location.

@@BowlingBuckosh maybe so but I still think the old classic logo would look better on the bowling balls especially if you're into the marketing Part also I got a suggestion I think it would be a great idea if Columbia 300 would bring out a resin reactive maybe with the hk22 are the yellow Dot for the black UDOT

maybe at some point. the two cores are great compliments with not much overlap.

Thank you for the reply, I’ve been waiting for an explosion pearl and a new Track Heat, I’m most likely going to try the Kaboom and hopefully it’s as good as the messenger pearl

The could make a Kaboom 💥 spare ball; it's a plastic explosive