Yeah, it could have been a neat little character quirk of his that could have given him some personality, but who needs that? We got Dino writing "FUCK YOU" on a nightclub list!
@@eachasteriod1334 They could've kept formula of 3 vergil fights too, goddamit. One to see if Dante has what it takes to enter organization, maybe interest Dante by having him meet equal. Then another where they're arguing about Kat or Vergil testing Dante again, or something but this time going balls out. And then Final battle, where it's vergil waking up to tyranny. And hell we had Vergil in Limbo last chapter. And we could've had him be pulled alongside Dante into limbo early on, just to see him be able to do anything. Why estabilihs Vergil is weak if he's final boss. That literally sandbags the boss fight
So the Raptor News Network workes as security, Mundus has god-like powers and an endless horde of demons and demon-collaborator, and now we find out that his mistress owns a club for high society demon-collanorators, yet Munuds still doesn't find Dante or learn that Vergil is a nephilim till later in the game. YOU'RE PATHETIC MUNDUS! You might as well give me your job.
Y'know Lilith's taunts would be so much more effective and a lot more fun if she actually played some kind of club remix of Kat being interrogated. It'd be horrific, but it would actually fit the level theme.
So Mundus doesn't know Sparda had two kids even though he broke into their house and ripped Eva's heart out but somehow Sparda escapes with Dante and Vergil, putting them into the care of demons? How do Lilith and The Hunter know Dante's name and face but Mundus doesn't even know he exists? Shakespearean writing folks.
The reason he went to the mansion was because of the twins, where the hell did you get the idea that he didn't know? How the hell do you think he knows Dante (who has for years shown to be abnormal for a simple human and having been able to kill demos with his bare hands) is Spardas' son? As for Mundus not knowing who Vergil is, that one is simple to explain: Vergil was smart about hidding his identity (gou know, being the leader of a "terrorist"/rebel group and all) while Dante has been hunted by demons since he was a kid and has been killing them all this time.
Unversed Hero bit even after bob barbas puts Vergil’s face on the tv, and mundus could clearly see he is an identical face to Dante, mundus is too dumb to realize he’s the twin. There’s no point for Vergil to put up the hiding in the shadows to avoid mundus if his identity has been exposed
Because the main villain can't be smart in ANY WAY AT ALL...That's not EDGY enough...He might aswell be some guy who skimmed a wiki page and went "Ima go kill the son of Sparda, that sounds easy!" and the Wiki says *last edited by Verg1List3hc00lest*
You know what is the most funny thing about this? About Vergil wanting to abandon Kat? That there is a two part Comic that is a prologue on the game that focuses on Vergil and how he saved Kat, what her Role is in all this and Vergil actually falling in love with her. However, because of him wanting to protect her he entered his Devil Trigger several times, which made him lose control of himself, and they both decided that Vergil actually deletes the memorys they have of their romantic feelings in order to not make Vergil fall into his Devil Trigger again. Even more funny is how he Vergil reacts to a Kat that is in danger in the DLC, buuuuut that is for another day ;)
That's... actually really interesting and there is nothing in the game suggesting that. I... am going to make a theory. That was made after the script was completed to add depth to Vergil and Kat. I think this for a few reasons, mostly because it's written so it can be easily ignored. Man, that bums me out. If we had that instead of Vergil's Downfall... Maybe even hint at a redemption arc... I dunno.
@@PolarPhantom The thing is that Vergils downfall kinda follows up to this Comic. You see that in certain reactions of Vergil. For example, when his "Hollow" removed his heart, it had three holes. Directly after that, scenes, he suddenly had Flashbacks regarding to Kat with Scenes from the main game, mostly how she calls out for him, how he was glad that she was alive, and finally how he treated her like shit in before the final Battle, and we then see a sad Kat at the end of this flashback. After that flashback, he wakes up and sees Kat being hunted down by a demon. Dispite what happened before, he did not hesitate to try help her, to such an extend even that he goes through the entire Level just to save her. The moment before he told her that he will help her, he seemed to think about something. Maybe at that moment he was rememembering what happened to the two before the game. This would also explain why he remembered how he saved her from demons and gave her a home, and why it drove him mad when she said that Dante is a real man, and that Vergil is weak, not even half the man that Dante is. After he kills her, part of his heart was regenerated. His hate for Dante makes also more sense on a emotional Level. Vergil tried to save Dante from a place where it is said that there is no turning back from. He tried to help him get his shit together. and for what? To be betrayed by the brother he loved. Granted, Dante was in the right to defy him since Vergil wanted to rule over the humans, making him no different than Mundus (except for the whole Part where Mundus was making Humans obedient to sap their live energy to cultivate the demon realm). Anyway, for Vergil, it was betrayal from his own flesh and blood. After killing the fake Dante, his heart restored another piece. Finally he got to his mother for favouring Dante over him, giving her the ultimate Punishment of telling her that he killed Dante and throwing his pendant to her, leaving her in that pitiful prison where she is now not only suffering physically, but also mentally knowing that Vergil killed his brother and abandoned everything that was good, including her. Vergil Heart was finally restored, but there was one more thing he needs to take down... in order to make it finally his own! His own Devil, the power of the Devil Trigger he tried to repress so hard to not hurt the ones near him. He now takes on his own Demon, but not in order to get rid of him, but to finally be able to control him, to use this power the way he wants... Thinking about it like that, everything makes more sense if you read the Comic before playing Vergils downfall.
I know they talk about the metal band a lot, but Noisia are genuinely well regarded dubstep producers, and not just in the screechy "skrillex" sounds, but with more of the underground pure heavy bass kinda production. Still not really my thing, but seriously they're actually pretty good as far as dubstep goes. Ninja Theory really didn't skimp on soundtrack at all, despite it not being to everyone's taste
They don't just do dubstep. In fact they're more well known for doing Drum 'n Bass (specifically the subgenre Neurofunk) which is also heavy on bass but also with fast paced drum break samples. The Hunter's (first boss) theme is closer to their older stuff basically. The "metal band" is Combichrist who are well known for doing Aggrotech, a kind of electro-industrial music. You hear it in this episode with their song "What The Fuck Is Wrong With You?" which is from one of their albums. The funny thing is that the original music they composed just for the game is all metal/industrial rock and very unlike their old material, a trend which continued to their next album released after this game which was mostly rock.
Why would a super tough demon be guarding a club for humans and demon collaborators? It's not like they need Berial to guard a club from regular humans.
@@omegaxtrigun No, but when the club is owned by the mother of Mundus' child and successor, I feel like it would make more sense to have at least one guard at the door capable of taking a punch from Dante
Around 2:00 Pat's talking about Virgil's weird blue gloves in this scene. I wonder if that's a holdover from when this Virgil was supposed to be a germaphobe? Also, the getting into the nightclub scene and what Pat says about it is EXACTLY what this entire game does wrong when it comes to "cool".
Kat explained it actually at the beginning, it's bc she is a medium, so what ever you do in limbo will affect her if directed at her. Other people can't be interacted with from limbo bc it's limbo.
Yah, I don't know why people make up nonsense to drag this game through the mud, come on there is plenty wrong with it already. Give it some credit for the things that actually worked out.
Chris East Or maybe it should do more to engage the audience about details concerning its world instead of info dumping with a damsel in distress to be. Even after rewatching the play through up to this point I forgot that was the reason she could be harmed. It isn’t anyone dragging the game through the mud, it’s the game failing at making a memorable setting or lore besides making Sparda a shell of his former self.
Not many people know this, but there is a hidden mechanic of input buffering. Doing so raises your style meter really high, even on Hardcore mode. I.E, you go into stinger --> trillion stab, then hold R2/RT and Dante will end up doing the damage of a demon weapon w/o having to switch. You can't stun a weapon aligned demon, but you will still deal the damage. Add the buffer from demon evade and it's the equivalent of 4x's the damage. Try it, Pat.
I just realized that the two them can do both. Dante holds Lilith hostage abd draws Mundus out of his lair while Vergil saves Kat and closes the Hell Gate.
So...Lilith and Muundus Jr. are able to withstand demon and angel weapons along with rebellion but yet, a regular real world human made sniper rifle is enough to kill them entirely. ...What?
Nah don't worry about it. That sniper rifle was the very same on that Sparda used when he woke up to justice and waged a one-man war on Hell itself and- oh wait that never happened because all that this Sparda has done is fuck an angel and be into BDSM or something
Ok, Pat here's the explanation as to why Dante can't kill the SWAT guys. DmC seems to have based it's Limbo on the Astral Plane of Shadowrun. When you're in Limbo/the Astral, you can see people, but they are gray shadows. Some people can see into the astral/Limbo, but when doing so their shadows become brighter, and they are vulnerable to attacks from the astral/limbo side.
@@JoseRS1186 Ah, I forgot to put in my general thesis. If It's in D&D, it was copied from somewhere else, but I don't know the early stuff well enough.
Kind of like Berserk, Guts is in the interstice between the physical and astral plane, so he has to deal with a lot of shit from the astral plane that ordinary humans do not.
Man, theres so many moments in the game where you go "hey, that's cool!", but then the game goes ahead and puts its foot back into its mouth all over again. Is it possible to have a game that just has all the cool parts of DmC, but cuts out the trash? And by that I mean a game besides DMCV which uses a similar art style/gimmick to this game? Because honestly there's so much of this game that honestly deserved to be in a better game
1:02 Pat: so why didn't dante shoot the swat guys... Me: because it wouldn't have worked because they are normal. Only reason kat would die is because she is a median, someone trapped between both worlds so anything from either can hurt her. A normal person. Wouldn't be affected by limbo as they are on different plans.
That's what I assumed, but the game didn't really do a good job of explaining that. Just a quick line of Dante asking Kat "Hey, if I can hurt you while I'm in Limbo, what about these guys trying to kill you?" and Kat just goes "I wish, but only reason you can hurt someone like me is 'cuz I'm a median, these guys are just normal humans, so your weapons will have no effect on them." It would have made it more clear to the player why they can't fight the SWAT guys during that mission, but Kat is still affected by things in both Limbo and the real world.
What if some schmuck unluckily named Dante showed up to this club Lilith owns and someone said his name out loud? Would he have to fight demons as a normal dude? I can only imagine the number of false Dante alarms here.
Yeah, but didn't Dante and Vergil stand on the roof 'irl' and watch her get taken into the prison automobile rather than jumping down and murdering cops SSSavagely? -Then Vergil looked at Dante and said 'Don't worry Dante. Let's start making another one!'-
"we respect women!" Woman in the game. "i am nothing without this baby and my entire value and agency in this world is entirely tied to my ability to reproduce." .........
Her situation does suck. Mundus would probably kill her as soon as she delivered the baby. That said, it doesn't go far with that idea and isn't presented that way, so yeah, still pretty fucked up. Don't know why we expect much from a company whose head is an open and proud misogynist.
What if this game was Dante seeing first hand that he should be more sympathetic towards these demons as the game continues, but Vergil and Kat never consider it? The hunter, Slurm Queen and Barbas would've been the indulgent, simple beginning and the rest of the bosses different.
How come Mundus doesn't know Sparda had two kids. When the demons stormed their house did nobody notice the dual pairs of color coordinated beds, clothes, toys etc.?
I'm hesitant to say how I'd improve the plot of this game, mainly because it's so rife with problems. However, If I had to suggest anything, I'd suggest the following four improvements. *1) Replace Donte with Dante.* This, quite simply, would probably be the simplest change to improve the plot by 1000%. Instead of having this obnoxious 2edgy5you atmosphere, it could have a light-hearted tone, with Dante riffing on how absurd the entire plot is. *2) Don't Retread Old Ground.* If they really wanted to distance themselves from previous installments, they shouldn't be retreading the whole Sparda/Mundus/Vergil angle. Just set the story at some random point after the events of DMC3, and make only the bare minimum of references to previous installments in the franchise. *3) Keep the Premise; Ditch the Plot.* The idea that demons are covertly behind many of society's problems isn't terrible. However, the way it's implemented could be drastically improved. Like, maybe a sect of demons have infested a city; are fuelling the inhabitants' vices as part of some mumbo-jumbo magic ritual thingy to gather power and conquer the human world or whatever. Each boss could represent a sin but channelled through a contemporary representation of said sin (consumerism for greed, fast food for gluttony, mindless television for sloth, etc.). Think DMC4 meets They Live with a dash of American Gods thrown in. *4) Focus on the Otherworldly.* Related to the above, make sure the focus is almost entirely on the world of demons and demon slayers. If there must be a connection to the mundane world, make it Kat. Instead of serving as a source of exposition before she inevitably gets damselled, she could fill a "sceptical cop" kinda role. You know, the clueless mortal who mistakes the protagonist for a villain, but slowly comes to trust and respect them as they learn more about the supernatural world. This would have the additional benefit of allowing her to serve as the straight man to Dante's... Danteness.
No, Dante is too goofy and Donte is not as bad as you guys cry all the time. He's growing as a character and just get rid of the edge pops here and there and you got a good character. If you don't like his name is Dante, then just make him a different character. I hate how everybody think that most of the problems of this game (which are a lot but don't make this a bad game, it's still pretty good) are related to Dante.
I agree with alot of your list, except I actually enjoy the idea of retreading old ground in reboots to see the differences. Don't make the EXACT same plot by no means, but the "ooh that's just similar enough or a cool reference" feeling is awesome. The downward triangle tattoo Pat made fun of, while arguably stupid is a cool thing because it's the same but different. If this game's story had continued (maybe not even as a game but an indie comic for those interested in seeing the world grow) it would have been cool to see revisions of other characters like Trish, Nero, etc. Different quirks with underlined traits that are integral to their characters.
@@EduardoFlores-bt4fo yeah I guess I just hate that his somewhat witty lines are few and far between. If you take out the "fuck you" attitude or at least reduce it, I'd like him more than a quarter of the time. Maybe start out that way but grow into something else. That woulda been cool
@@EduardoFlores-bt4fo I'll agree Dante is way too over the top for this version of his universe. People seem to not get that with a narrative like this game failed at making would be just as bad with O.G.D. for the simple fact of "if this guy doesn't give a fuck, why should I." But also, while I feel DmC Dante is hated a wee bit too much, I feel you are building up character that he does not have. If they had kept the demon orphanage stuff more engrained in his motivation or something that might have helped.
@@seanmartin355 They both have different kinds of charm they both hit that B-movie shlock fun. The gameplay in this is also done by a new team go back and compare it to DMC1 or 2 and see how you feel. for their first attempt at this type of game they did incredibly well
@@insaincaldo I mean it's implied that killing the demon who drags Dante in is how he gets out, so like I guess that's how he used to do it before he found a walking can of squirrel semen
I don't want to give this game any unfair knocks, but I think the reason Kat would die from Dante's shot in Limbo was because she's a medium, with one foot in and out of Limbo. The SWAT guys were just normal corrupt cops.
Fun fact: during the development of this game, NinjaTheory actually brought someone in to help them with writing the plot (can't remember if it was someone involved with the old series or just a writing teacher). During the process the guy asked them to participate in a writing exercise where they'd follow the adventures of a chimp and they would explain what feelings each scene is supposed to convey. Eventually they got to a part where the chimp comes across somebody in grave danger, and the NT guys made the chimp flip the guy off and walk away as he's being horrifically killed, and NT guys said that this was supposed to make the chimp look "badass." So if you're wondering what type of person could ever think this shit is witty, there ya go.
Anyone noticed yet, by the way, that the car they are driving is not only "V" for Vergil, but it could be read as V for five, as in DmC is technically the fifth entry and fifth DMC?
Vergil's been in hiding the whole time and actually stayed hidden unlike Dante who just murdered demons all the time. And even now it's why Dante does everything and Vergil doesn't actually fight since it'd be like "oh there's another Nephilim"
Let's not forget that Mundus literally walked into Sparda's house, where BOTH sons were at, and he still didn't know about Vergin. And like the other guy said, they had a freaking picture of Vergin they used on the news and Mundus still didn't figure it out. This game's Mundus is a freaking dumbass
So I had an idea on how to fix this game's story and make it interesting. When Sparda (a demon knight who turned against his own kind and married an angel, living with her on earth and fighting for humanity) and his wife Eva (Angel who similarly abandoned heaven to live on Earth) are found by the demon assassins, Eva grabs the boys and runs while Sparda stays to fight the demons, Dante gets separated and somehow escapes but is lost. Eva and Vergil are cornered by an assassin demon and Eva is slain but as she dies, Vergil absorbs her power, which causes his previously black hair to become white with power, but makes him easier to track because his power is detectable while Dante is below the radar but still strong. This explains why Vergil is in hiding. Sparda is captured and chained, and is kept in Mundus' personal chambers a trophy of his triumph and superiority. He's also possibly being used as a battery of power? (Depends on whether you want to paint Mundus as a leech of power, the cause for his world dominating power?). Then the game proceeds as normal. Dante is who he is and at the end when he kills Mundus, he frees his father who is emaciated but proud of his son, he dies in his son's arms, Dante absorbs his pwoer and his hair becomes white, and he absorbs his father as a Devil Arm, the sword Sparda. Instead we got this.
I think I get it now, the biggest issue is this what they thought was cool. As in the game is dated on an idea of what they think people at the time like. They tried to grab a trend instead of making something that stands on it's on style.
Not checking the date would make it worse, but even still walking into a room and finding the leader on anonymous is a weeb is unintentionally hilarious.
@@Exel3nce I mean in terms of design and tone. Its like when underworld came out and you had all this grimy 'dark" action movies that were just dark visuals and overly goth outfits.
You know, I think this level helps me pin down what I dislike about this game. It never knows what the fuck it wants to be thematically. Starts out with "Hey, strip cluuuuub!", then moves onto a neon dance club themeing, then its got a game show for some reason, then it wants to be a fighting game with "ROUND ONE, FIGHT!". It comes off as the TBF favorite of "I clapped when I saw it!"
Ah, the Night Club level. Definite proof that Ninja Theory was composed of a tremendous art design team being slowly strangled to death by a writing team high on the smell of their own farts.
The juvenile in me can't let go that Pat keeps saying "I can't knock him/them up" in this playthrough and others when he's referring to knocking enemies into the air. How nice of Pat though to want to give Vergil more targets to practice with.
I assume he didn't shoot every SWAT guy because they weren't seers like Kat, and therefore have no connection to Limbo through which he could harm them.
Im gonna prolly get shit for this but the question Pat brought up about how "if Dante couldve shot Kat in the beginning why couldnt he shoot the S.W.A.T. guys?". In the second mission after Dante and Kat meet again she explains to him that she is a phsycic medium, meaning she can pass in between Limbo and the real world, and thus can see through others in Limbo while being in the real world like Dante and Vergil. Only her though. While in Limbo, Dante cant ineract with humans and vice versa. So yea the answer is right there if you pay attention, but then again it is DMC Devil May Cry so yall probably arent
While visually interesting, Lillith's stage makes it really unclear why some of these stronger demons cant just obliterate him in Limbo if they control that much of the world.
To be fair, Kat probably would get shot by Dante because she's a psychic and projecting herself halfway to Limbo or something. I'm not saying it's a good reason but it's there.
Now that I think about it, why would Lilith have divinity statues in her limbo world devil club? Did they just grow in one day like mushrooms and she hasn't gotten around to removing them? Or did she install them for extra revenue? Like, are her patron upgrading their sick savage moves as well, and she's getting in on that orb economy?
Re 0:50, Kat is a medium and has a different relationship with Limbo than everyone else, hence her ability to communicate with those in both realities simultaniously.
Hell yeah! Finally, the coolest part of this game. Lilith's club is the coolest level and the coolest song in this game. Noisia really out did themselves. It's the only song I still listen to to this day. If anyone else likes electronic music like I do I highly recommend listening to the entire composition. "Lilith's Club" by Noisia. Edit: I noticed that pat made a comment saying the song changed around 20:46. Nope it's the same song. ;3 The entire theme in between the arena battles is the same composition. It's awesome.
Seeing Noisia's contribution to this game in this part shocks me with how great some of the club tracks are in a game such as this. If only they did this for DMC5...
Leap: "That's just enemy step for losers. Let's grab enemy step, why not?" *Didn't use it at all* Nearly the end of the video: "I'm gonna take off enemy step because I'm never gonna use it ever." That was quick
*Dante, about to write his name on the list* "Ha ha, yeah! This is super Dante-y! I love this!" *it's "fuck you"* ...again, this game kicks me in the junk right when it should deliver
0:50 The likely reason as to why Cat would die if Dante shot her (and not the SWAT team members) is because she's a medium who has a spiritual connection to Limbo. Her actual body isn't in Limbo, but her spirit is, and it appears to be vulnerable to the nastiness that resides there (including Donte). 6:38 "He could have Limbo-slipped into the club, too." So speaking of Cat, she's the one who helps Dante get in and out of Limbo, so no, he couldn't Limbo-slip into the club.
