Voluntelling is when someone volunteers a person without their knowledge or consent and is expecting them to do it without complaint. It's a common problem in a lot of families
1st story: they are the perfect candidates for couple counseling, specifically sex counseling. If this doesn’t work: divorce. Also sex is not transactional. You don’t give sex in exchange for massage or other services. What rSlash suggests is basically pity sex and that’s not a solution.
I agree entirely. They need to get to the root of her sex drive situation, but in no way should the poster be expecting it as some favor or compensation for the nice thing he was doing. If counseling doesn't work or she refuses to seek help or understanding (maybe she's ace for example, or has a hang up from a past situation or trauma) then divorce and find someone with more of a drive. She shouldn't have to give him 'service' essentially to pay back his kindness, and it's gross that he equates going to a prostitute to a massage. I don't agree with rslash on this one, I think it's an "everyone sucks here".
I'm glad someone else noticed that. That kind of stuff really bothers me because it boils relationships down to transactions. He's only giving the massage in hopes of getting something in return, which isn't a nice thing to do. If I were his wife, I'd be frustrated that I can't just enjoy a nice thing I receive because the giver is expecting something in return. Super shitty behavior.
I'm surprised at the number of people looking at story 1 and *instantly* reducing it to "OP is thinking in purely transactional terms" like there wasn't an entire preamble about how they initially wanted to have multiple kids and were having a decent sex life until the doctors told them "it's actually a miracle you managed to have that first kid and that there weren't complications, you both have reproductive problems." Like, does that just not register? Do y'all just ignore the part where this was a 12-year relationship, and the husband tried talking and suggesting counseling? Or is this just "well, it's a story on Reddit so we have no idea what parts are true and I'm gonna make assumptions based on my own thoughts"?
So glad someone said something about this! Another thing, sex isn't required for a strong and healthy relationship. It helps create a stronger bond and plenty other things, but there is so much more to a building a bond than sex. Theres love languages, helping out around the house, being supportive and open to your partner/spouse, being understanding. From what we know from this post, the only thing OP has confirmed are the massages, but it's not coming from a place of love and care and a genuine want to help, it's seen as transactional and OP only does it because he expects something from his wife simply because he gave her a massage. Everyone sucks here, but the wife gets 1.5/5 at most, meanwhile OP gets 3.5/5 or 4/5 buttholes.
Yes but you're also not OBLIGATED to give sex...he wants sex, she isn't initiating...so he isn't initiating the massages she wants. I think it's just a consequences of your actions scenario.
3rd story had an update: OP is going through with the divorce. The comments were attacking OP for divorcing because "it was just one thing." She went to talk to the kids and ex. She does want to have a relationship with them but she needs time alone first. Op wanted to buy them tickets for Disney but the comments talked her out of it.
@@SpongeboykingI think it’s because the commenters may have felt sympathetic about the kids and how their bio mom flip flops between being absent, active, then back to absent. To me, I feel the same, but they are still assholes (along with their bio parents) and OP has every right to walk off.
I saw the update, she's divorcing because he admitted he has feelings for his ex wife and that's why he was not stepping in with the kids because he didn't want his ex to leave again
"just one thing" - yeah, and that one thing is a toxic household. I could see the kids acting up if they were like 8 but at those ages, especially after a few years of calling HER "mom" and then the husband not being a husband. If that were a movie, she'd have snapped and took them all out
3rd story has an update: Basically he told her that he still kinda loves his ex-wife and Didnt want to do anything to defend OP, so he didn't stand up for her. She moved along with the divorce, the kids told her "we were wrong, we miss you, dont leave dad" but they were obv not. She told them she loves them but you can't go treating people like garbage and action has consequences. She got a house now
Those " kids" are so fake .. if I was op I would've straight up laughed in their faces as their turning on the fake waterworks to try and emotionally lure op back into their stranglehold....
@@lorilancaster5917 who wouldn’t? The kids threatened her and called her a bitch, and the husband basically told her he didn’t give a shit about her. I would leave him too. Edit: she left them that one time, not abandon. There’s a difference 🤦🏿♂️
Story 3: OPs ex-husband isn't just a bad husband, he's an even worse father. What good father lets a toxic, manipulative woman back into his impressionable children's lives? He KNOWS how they feel about their mother, he KNOWS what kind of woman she is, and he STILL let her back into their lives. They are 16, still under his control and in his custody. It is his RESPONSIBILITY to protect them from this evil woman, regardless of if they think they want to see her or not.
Unfortunately given their ages he probably couldn’t keep her out of their lives without legal action . Straight up forbidding them from seeing her would’ve resulted in them actively trying to disobey him and making him their enemy too. I also wouldn’t be surprised if she still had her hooks in him .
To all of (you)s: This is NOT about legalese, but about a father TALKING with their kids about what's good and what's bad. He didn't even intervene when they started "fighting back" HIS wife. What is the problem with (you) people?
Based on an update, the dad still loved his ex, he was enjoying having her back in his and the kids’ lives, and would have basically done anything to not lose that. It doesn’t justify him, but it goes a long way to explain how he acted - it’s easy to get seduced by the presence of someone you never got over
@@thedatabase677 Lots of times the true colors don't come out until much later and it's never at once it's always little by little until they're not hiding anymore it's really them.
Second story OP said in comments that he’s breaking up with her: Comment from Orsombre: This is such a lack of respect for your ex-wife but also for your feelings that I hope that you have already broken with your gf. Being drunk is not an excuse to discuss other people's private parts in public. What else is she ok to discuss aloud when you are not around? She won't change because she is jealous and insecure of your ex. OP: While writing this post I literally thought what am I doing? yeah I realized I am done. I am tired. I’m packing her shit in a box and leaving it in the hallway Comment from ohhisnark: she'll probably claim you're breaking up with her because you want to get back with your ex. that's the insecurity talking. wish her well and wish her a goodbye OP: Yeah, well if that’s what she thinks is gonna happen then I have done the right thing for breaking up with her. My ex-wife and I are not romantically in love anymore. I love her as a friend and the mother of my children. besides she is in a happy Relationship
I had a feeling it was an amicable divorce, and the gf most likely was saying "Why don't you like me trashing your ex? Are you still in love with her?"
Yeah, it screams an issue of insecurity from the GF, and unfortunately she's showing that instead of internalizing or working out her insecurities, she instead deals with them by projecting them as problems with anyone and everyone she deems as 'against' her. It's a massive red flag that any relationship she has is one argument away from her being a relentless b to her partner.
Story 4: Yeah, there was no way that OP wouldn't be grumpy with that situation. OP is voluntold to load a U-Haul, there is no U-Haul, heck not even closed to prepared, and the wife and child gets to see a playoff hockey while OP is left in a sucky situation. I'd be pissed too
His wife dropped this on OP, takes pictures and send it to him and say how much fun they are having, and the fact the wife is CONFUSED why OP was in a bad mood pisses me off even further. Like, is she a dumba**?! Same here rSlash, I am pissed FOR OP.
I have been "volunteered" several times in my life where I didn't know until the day before or on the day that I'm supposed to help. I've put my foot down and said that I need to be asked before giving my consent. If they don't, I don't help. Doesn't matter if I am perfectly capable and free to help out, on principle I am not lifting one finger. Any time that I am asked to help, I drop everything to help out. Even at my own expense. If I was this husband, I would be calling up a marriage counselor and a divorce lawyer.
@@MrAgnosticman I agree because the wife can’t be that dense to know that what she has done throughout the story was wrong. I don’t see counseling working because it seems like she’s incapable of seeing nor atone for her actions. I also bet this has been a pattern which OP has brought up his issues with at least once before.
Story 3: NTA. They have no right to be shocked after the sh*t they put OP through. They were being extremely disrespectful. They can't just expect OP to come back when their mom disappears on them again, especially when they DISRESPECTED OP. Divorce your husband and don't look back, if my husband didn't side with me on this, I'd be reevaluating my marriage.
There is an update where the husband basically said he was still in love with his ex, and he wasn't defending OP because he didn't want his ex to run away again.
And along with this, the ex tried to attack OP and the stepdaughter threaten to assault her if she ever defended herself. No apology, sincere or otherwise, can make up for what was said and done. I know in updates OP said she may try for a relationship with them in the future but I hope she reconsiders. They don’t deserve to have her as a surrogate. Let them be wife 3.0s problem.
Entitled people always get shocked when they don't get what they feel they're entitled to. In DH's and kids' minds they could treat OP like garbage but still always get all the benefits from someone who's a good, caring person.
Stepmom story UPDATE: Kid’s bio mom left AGAIN, and so the kids wanted OP back. When OP asked husband why he didn’t have her back, he said he was still in love with kid’s mom. OP left, got her own place. She was saving money to give to the kids for Disney, but Reddit talked her out of it.
Also the kids were 16. Not 12, they have to learn that you can't just push people aside and threaten them. Hope they know they choose a deadbeat mom over their actual mom.
"Voluntold" was a term we often heard at the Naval Academy, the same as "mandatory fun". It's basically ordering one to volunteer, i.e. they are told to volunteer without the option to refuse.
This is funny, I didn't scroll down far enough to see if any military explained the concept has been around for quite some time. Wasn't those kind of orders always the best.
@@mendysmovies2330 Exactly this. If anyone ever popped into our shop and said "I need volunteers" you made yourself SCARCE. Go to the bathroom, go sweep the hangar, /something/. If you asked what for, you were automatically voluntold. Mandatory fun days sucked too. Instead of just giving people the day off, we had to go to command cookouts and stuff.
Ngl I'm surprised Dabney sided with OP in story 1. Don't get me wrong, I agree because who needs to be massaged THAT MUCH? I do wonder if there's something OP is leaving out but it sounds like he hit most points people would make. I don't agree that getting a massage is cheating but I do get the idea of "I am constantly doing for you and when I stop, you decide to go to someone else?"
@@ramenbomberdeluxe4958 the husband is correct tho. She is literally just taking and never giving anything in return. She doesn't love him or even care about him. Her taking the massages elsewhere when it was something between them both is akin to emotional cheating.
I’m assuming Dabney is using his life experience as a married man to make a proper judgement here. This is more than just about the massages. OP gives and gives and gives while his wife just takes and takes and takes. So much so that she doesn’t even realise how much she’s hurting her husband. Edit: there's of course the boundary issue. She didn’t even bother to properly discuss whether or not she agreed to that boundary. She just bulldozers all over it which is so disrespectful. She is oblivious about her actions or worse she knows what she’s doing and she doesn’t care.
@@miniman649This. OP did not articulate his point well, but this is essentially it. To most people, it's just a massage. To OP and presumably to the wife, at least early on in the marriage, this was an intimate thing between the two of them. This would not be a problem if the emotional burden of the relationship was shared equally, but OP has to shoulder all of it. And, honestly, he gets kuddos for sticking with it even when it was emotionally taxing. The problem is that that effort is not being reciprocated, or even acknowledged. OP shoulders the emotional burden for literal years, faithfully giving massages, and when he expresses dissatisfaction and hurt, the response from the wife is dismissal and entitlement.
For story 3, notice how the bio mom left again when it was implied she was asked to give money to the kids... The woman is running from financial responsibilities and favors.
Last story: I hate when people would violin- tell me to do something for people. To me it’s like openly stealing credit for somebody else’s good deed. My family did it to me all the time, my parents or grandparent, but not me the person actually doing the work. But if you complain or refuse you’re the asshole that’s too lazy to help. That’s what your wife did, forced you into helping your family then actually try to shame you for being frustrated from working all day while she got to have fun with your son. And her excuses that’s not her fault because she was offered. It’s not like she could say no and explain that she already agreed to help her family.
If I were the wife in the situation, I would've told the friend who invited me that I can't abandon my husband like that, and will help him if I can. Not ABANDONING him to go to a game and then get surprised by a pissed off husband.
@@dracko158or since the gf was supposed to have been packed and the UHaul rented, I would’ve offered spouse the ticket and I help with the move seeing as how it’s my family. And when I found out that they weren’t packed nor was the UHaul rented, I would tell them they’re on their own and go back home.
@@dracko158 Or at least see if they would take just the son and both of them go help. But yea I would've straight up refused that if I was him and yes exactly she ABANDONED her husband. Absolute shitbird of a wife.
My family do this all the time. Even today and I was diagnosed with cancer 2 years ago. Go help bring up Christmas tree, I know you are scared of heights but climb a ladder to second story to put up a reef for your grandpa
I see this is a problem for a lot of people. Have you ever considered telling your mom or dad that you told Grandparent that mom or dad will mow the lawn for them or something like that? After that immediately leave and go hang out with friends and don't respond, or better tell them before going in for school or a test so they know you can't/won't be able to have your phone out so they can't push it back on you. The only way I see anyone understanding that it sucks to be voluntold to do something is to put that person through the same situation so that way they experience it for themselves.
Story 3: it doesn’t take a genius to know they were just repeating everything there deadbeat mom was telling them, but it doesn’t matter. And their feelings don’t matter, those feelings stop mattering when your stepson called you out of your name and your stepdaughter threaten to assault you if you defended your self against her mom. Then because you didn’t reward their behavior with vacation got mad at you and claimed you were jealous. They made their choice. They don’t treat you like dirt and then beg for you to come back when the woman that abandoned them abandoned them again. But the worst person in all of this is your husband who should have checked his kids attitude, but said let them disrespect you in front of him , then try to make it seem like it was your fault. You didn’t do anything they did this to themselves, you are not spare tire.
Sounds like the ex just wanted someone to take care of the kids while person he actually want comes and goes as she pleases and the disappearing reappearing “mom” also likely getting some extra mayo on the side
1st story: just because he gave her massages all the time doesn’t mean she owes him sex. It’s not a quid pro quo. That said she DID owe him an explanation and effort. OP didn’t even know what the problem was and tried what he could. It doesn’t sound like she tried at all.
Definitely at least the effort. An almost daily massage should be appreciated and there should be something she does intentionally for him in return. At this point it sounds like the wife was doing a lot of taking and no giving.
She sounds toxic even if OP and his ex aren’t amicable she doesn’t have the right to trash talk someone unprovoked. However I wonder if OP trashes his ex around her which gave her the idea that it was okay? If so OP is more of an AH because that’s a no no when in a new relationship
@@MalekitGJ if so then he should’ve nipped the comments in the bud asap. One rule into having an amicable relationship is to provide respect. He wasn’t doing this whenever his gf insulted the ex in the first place. I also posted this comment before reading the update.
@@lorilancaster5917 dude, in this very video OP said: "I always told her to tone it down whenever she made a remark about my ex" It was the GF who never stop.
Story 4:Imagine being so lazy,you dump all YOUR responsibilities to help YOUR family (who didn't even do their part correctly) on your husband,not compensating him at all,and going on a trip with your guys' kid as his first major sporting event and boasting about that trip to everyone,And not expecting anything to happen Peeeeeeeak jerkiness on wife's end,NTA at all
Third story has an update: Hello, I have been getting a lot of messages asking for an update. I am now in a place to be able to give an update. You can look at my previous post for what this is about. I went back to the house 2 days ago and my husband and I had a long talk about what happened and how I didn’t feel protected by him and how he knew how disrespectful they were being but didn’t stop anything. He said that he still loved his ex and that’s why pretty much. He didn’t want to do anything for her to leave them again (them as in him and the twins) but that didn’t change how he felt about me… I did not feel comfortable with that. I told him that I’ve been there, not her and how could he still love her and it was very emotional and there was crying and yelling. I made the decision to move along with the divorce. I spoke to the twins and they cried and said it’s their fault and to forgive them and their dad and not to leave. I told them that as much as I love them, staying with their dad and in this home was not an option but I would still love to have a relationship with them if they want but I am still very much hurt by what happened and would still appreciate a little more time for myself. I let them know that their actions have consequences and they can’t treat people the way they did. I did move out and I was staying in a unit in one of my rental properties. Exciting news, I bought my first house. It was a fairly quick process. I’m excited for what’s next, I bought my first house ever and next month I am taking a break from work for a few weeks or the whole month … maybe 2 or 3 and doing some exploring of the world and healing and finding myself. I lost myself in the twins and my husband and didn’t really focus on what I wanted and what made me happy. So I bought tickets again for Disney World, I have also made plans to go to Thailand next month and from there… I have no clue. I’m doing some spontaneous trips… I have always wanted to see the 7 wonders of the world. Any way, I am really happy to be getting a break. I told the kids I would love to have them over for dinner when I get settled in to my new place. I do feel bad about canceling their trip to Disney so I am thinking about funding a trip for them to go this summer for their 17th birthday… Just not with me, I’m excited to be traveling alone and I need the mental break. That is all really… Edit: I read the comments about not funding a birthday trip for them because it is not my responsibility that is a Mom or step parent responsibility and you know all of you are right so I will not be funding that trip. It’s still hard for me not to be or Jump into that role and I have to get out of it but ultimately they did not respect me as their mom so I will not be doing that and focusing on myself and my trips. It was Just a thought and nothing was set in stone and I’m glad I didn’t. Thank you for everyone who is here still giving me advice and kind words. Once they earn my trust back, I will have no problem funding it Info: There seems to be some confusion… I talked to them 3 days ago… I didn’t not buy a house 3 days ago. I have property with units (duplexes) that I rent out to people and I was staying on one side. I bought a house for me to live in. (I have everything I need sorted out to where I can buy this house now and the divorce is not an issue) You can close on a house in less than 30-45 days if you pay in cash. People are so focused on my financial situation. I’m not rich in any sense, but I do good for myself and I deserve it because I worked hard for it after I came from nothing. I’m not abandoning them “again” the twins have said that they will try to earn my trust back and if giving me space is what can start that healing process they’ll will do it. I’m inviting them over for dinner next month and we’ll see how this goes.
This also just seems like a serious difference in maturity between the two participants in the relationship. Like, "why do you care, she's your ex"-because divorcing someone doesn't have to mean you then hate them, nor does not hating them mean you still want to bang them???
Its also just unattractive to be that jealous and insecure. My current girlfriend is a bit of an insecure person, and badmouthed my ex to me all the time. Now, i didnt split up all the amicably with my ex. But that relationship is still a part of who i am now as a person, as are all the experiences in my life. Luckily my current gf recognized this as a her problem and understood why i didnt want her doing that, so she stopped and is working on herself
Massage therapist here: There is nothing sexually intimate about legitimate massage. The real problem is that your marriage was already dead long before the massage. Be honest about why you are really divorcing because this really isn't about the massage.
It may not be sexually intimate to the masseuse, but to me it sounds like she may have a sort of massage fetish, that she gets sexual gratification from just a normal massage and doesn't actually need the sex part. If that's the case, then yes, it would have a lot to do with the massage. Obviously there is A LOT more than just that going on, but to OP it's a big straw on the camels back.
even if a massage isnt sexually intimate, its up to the people in the relationship how its percieved. for example my boyfriend would never get a massage from anyone but me because he sees it as cheating (even when I tell him its fine because I dont see it as intimate). While on the other hand he is fine with me getting a massage by a massage therapist as long as its a woman.
@@kenenigans It's just a slap in the face to me when people see it that way or see it as a luxury since we are every bit as legit as physical therapists and chiropractors. Massage therapists are taught the most manual therapy out of all of the professions. When I go to continuing education classes and watch people outside of the massage profession attempt manual therapy, I purposely don't look so that I don't witness anything that would mean being a court witness to an injury. Yes, it is that bad. Physical therapists and chiropractors may have more education than massage therapists but our education is still different and there are things we know that they don't and vice versa.
Voluntold is big in the military. That's basically where the officer lines everyone up, asks for volunteers then congratulates a few people for 'volunteering' and then get your assignment.
That last story made me mad as well 1. Volunteering someone’s labor without talking to them first is all sorts of disrespectful 2. I would’ve left too if nothing was packed up and you had to spend all day doing something you didn’t want to do in the first place 3. The fact that the wife doesn’t get why taking their kid to a PLAYOFF hockey game without them means the wife either is oblivious or just doesn’t care about OP’s feelings I’d have a long discussion with the wife if I was OP in this situation
Rslash: I've never heard this term "voluntold" before, but I like it. Dude, I've heard of and have been using that term for years. I'm glad you've finally found it. 😂
Fourth story: the moment I got there and there was no U-Haul and nothing packed, I'd simply get back in the car and drive away. If his BIL and his girlfriend are that lazy to not do the bare minimum, they can do their moving themselves;
We've found that almost every time someone asks for help moving, they aren't even close to done packing. It's wild how common it is to be so inconsiderate.
I've only ever asked for help once, and I had been completely packed for a month, and was living out of a suitcase. My moving company canceled on me, last minute and I had to ask a buddy. I still did most of the loading and unloading, as well as pay for gas and buy him dinner. I got to return the favor a few months later, when his TV broke, and I had the money to buy him a new one.
@@abbadabbado I wasn't lucky enough to have a family growing up, so I compensate by treating my friends like family. I am lucky, however, that I have a great group of friends who also treat me like family. The moving company thing was a minor annoyance, but I did get to spend the day with my buddy, which is always a plus.
I guess I must be a unicorn because, even though it’s been a long time since I’ve moved, anytime I’ve ever asked friends to help, I’ve had Everything packed up and ready, or at least enough of it packed that things could be loaded up while I was packing the rest of it.
Last Story: as a veteran of borrowed (generously offered) labor, I will tell you nothing pisses you off more is when you get to the location and no one has anything packed. Basically wasting your whole day, watching them slowly, put together all of their belongings. _”Hell has no wrath more bitter than a man forced to bear with a backache, tired, and hungry - all for the sake of stupidity of a presumed loved one.”_ 😂
Um for the first story… I might get hate for this, but I feel that op has left out some information. I wanna hear from the wife, and get her side of it. Sounds like there’s something else going on. Second story, don’t dish it if you can’t take it. Third story: op double down walk away, block em all. Fourth story: op divorce double down, get custody of your child.
I agree with the first story he's definitely left things out. A healthy relationship doesn't go sexless for no reason. I am going through some things and I really struggle to get intimate. I had a bad birthing experience, breastfeeding then this year I had to watch my mum die, my partners grandfather has Terminal cancer and now my brother has cancer. I have two autistic children on top of that and my father is breaking down, I am struggling financially and mentally but painting my face as a happy one because I am the family rock, the one who keeps the show going on. So when all my energy is put on everyone else of course I don't want sex. I lost nearly 6 stone in weight in a year due to stress. The husband is a problem, zero understanding of his wife and her wellbeing and probably doesn't even understand that her hormones could be a fault and she may need medical attention. She's better off without him and he just sounds like a sex obsessed jerk who doesn't value her role in the family.
First story made me so mad, acting like he’s owed s*x. He sounds toxic as hell, and I’m sure she’s not perfect but that whole relationship just sounds awful. I didn’t like rslash’s rating on that one, I had to stop and say “are you kidding me??” 🙄
If lack of sex is that big of a problem for him then he either needs to grow a pair and divorce her or stop whining and just jerk it. But to instead try to manipulate her into having sex with him is when it becomes a huge problem.
@@FantasticaB I actually yelled "WTF RSLASH?!" after hearing his take. This guy made it clear that he treats her like an npc that he can put brownie points in to get his "reward". I know this language all too well as I have dated and interacted with far too many people who think they are entitled to someone's body just because of their relationship. She probably feels exhausted and turned off by how much this person has obviously been pressuring her for the use of her body. Guys like this absolutely ruin their own love lives by turning love making into a required chore by constantly trying to coerce their partner instead of letting it happen when both are feeling the moment. I've been in a committed relationship for over 7 years now, and not once has this partner made me feel pressured to perform, and that autonomy in the bedroom has kept our fire for one another burning quite well, unlike the ones I mentioned before. Here's a few of the biggest red flags so everyone can see where I'm coming from: 🚩"She knows that I have a high libido, and she just doesn't care" 🤔 You know she's not in the mood, and it doesn't seem that you care about how she feels. 🚩"I noticed that doing the big massages was the best way to get intercourse, as she was more likely to allow me to do foreplay things that work on her if i had already done this prep work" 😓 The use of the word 'allow' in this context squicks me out. It feels like that wording shows that he regularly uses her enjoyment of massage to coerce and push for his own gratification. 🚩"The success rate was never that great anyway, only like 20% of the time" It all just makes me nauseated to read because I might not know this person irl, but I've known dozens like him. 😔
Last story: Op has every right to be upset. I hate when family members volunteer me to help someone else without asking me first. They they wonder why I don't want to help or why I'm in a bad mood if I do help. Just ask me first and I'll be more willing to help
I already knew op is not the AH because I hate being voulenteered to do anything. One thing my siblings used to do and still try sometimes. Mom says. "Someone needs to do dishes." Eyes go to me until my name is said. Now they say, "Someone get the baby." Who is not mine, and unless it's dangerous like he found a penny or something then I let them stare at me while I'm on my phone. I love the kid but even getting told to do things like that pisses me off unreasonably. Like they can just ask, "can you get the baby?" Yes I can. Not, "Oh, someone go get him." Then all look at me and get huffy at ME only when NO one offers to do the task.
Yeah the others expecting you to do THIER job is so pissy. I would look at them and ask why are they looking at me to do it. It's your kid, get off your ass and take care of the kid yourself!
Re: being voluntold I've been married for 28 years to my wife. Early on, my wife volunteered me to do something; I have forgotten what it was, but I do remember that it was something that I would have gladly done. Instead, I pulled a no-show. When my wife asked me WHY I didn't show up, I told that it's about respect. I told her that I wouldn't volunteer her, and that she needs to extend that same courtesy to me. Problem solved.
Story 2:In my opinion,Talking about exes in general (let alone trashing them) is just unnecessary,OP has nothing to do with his ex anymore,so why should anyone even mention her? NTA
I'm really interested too. Also him cutting his responses out because they're not popular feels so fake to me, stand behind yozr words or, if you think you were actually wrong, write that in the comments and correct your statement. Don't fix up videos based on popular opinion, that's pretty spineless and feels less genuine, which is why we watch these videos in the first place, for sincere commentary.
I forgot I had headphones on and when I clicked on the video and was blasted with a "WELCOME!" Jumped out of my seat, clutching my chest. Think I saw my life flash before my eyes lol
I havent finished the first story yet but jesus these people need to not fucking be together what a toxic cesspool massage is not cheating, in any way shape or form not even being willing to talk to your partner when he's trying so hard to reach out is wild
The expectation was never constant massages from OP in story 1. He chose to do that, when he stopped, the wife looked to get that elsewhere, she never expected or begged him to massage her.
Even at the base level for the last story - volunteering someone else is just wrong. Adding everything else on top of that and yeah, OP has EVERY RIGHT to refuse being volunteered for anything
1st story: Maybe I have a different perspective on this, but your spouse doesn't OWE you sex. If your sexual needs/libidos are incompatible, or if you feel like you're giving more than you're receiving and you've already tried therapy, then divorce might be an option, but saying a woman is an AH specifically for not having sex with her husband is a little sus.
Agreed we only get the man's side. She could have early menopause for all me know. Or she's struggling with her mental health. Even if you go to counselling and if you have a crap therapist you'll never get better. I didn't like r/slash response sounded very misogynistic
I have lost a bit of my respect for you Rslash for your comments on that first story. Sure, the wife was selfish, but sex should never be this transactional and she does not owe it to him
But she does owe him intimacy. Their married. I agree sec isn’t like this. But come on. She can’t get mad about him not wanting to give for her when she doesn’t give back. IMO. And her getting the massage somewhere else is wrong imo. Ops intimacy argument is right
Relationships have 3 key factors. Mental, physical, and spiritual. Most may not line up spiritually which is fine but that places weight on the other two. And for most men that's physical..if she is unwilling to help or contribute physically then she is probably not contributing emotionally either from the way it sounds. DIVORCE!
If a partner pulled what OP's wife pulled and SIL wasnt even done packing? 🤣 either im leaving (with the trailer) as soon as im told they arent ready or I'm literally hurling everything into boxes, no labels, everything mixed together and be as thoughtful and caring as they have been to me...🤡
bingo, one shoe of every pair in a completely different box, cookware in with bath towels and some of the shoes, a box just filled up with loose cutlery and boardgames, just complete chaos
Not volunteered, OP was voluntold. His wife is super selfish. You know what OP, if you have siblings who are possibly getting married and they need someone to be a helpful coordinator, just throw your wife on the spot. She’ll be pissed, but she’ll understand being voluntold to do things is something super ANNOYING!
I feel like I have to disagree with slash on the first story, to me it sounds more like a sexual compatibility issue. They had sex frequently when they were trying for kids, after that it dropped off which sounds to me like the wife was participating mainly for the outcome of getting pregnant not necessarily the enjoyment of intimacy. Honestly they needed to sit down with a counselor.
Yeah, OP went about it in a roundabout way that I feel is a 0.5/5, but I feel like they're young and is his right to get a divorce, just as is her right to not want to have sex, which seems to be the core issue
@MClara-ep4sf yea, I agree they should have just sat down and talked it out. Tbh I don't even know how to feel about it, I feel that they're both wrong but both right. She doesn't owe him sex, but his needs also matter. However, a massage isnt cheating, but rather disrespectful to be told not to and do it anyways. Imo they should have split up sooner
I agree and would personally lean more towards ESH no NSH. They did try counseling but clearly it didn't go anywhere, probably because one or both weren't actually being honest. A lot of people go into couples counseling thinking it will "fix " their partner and they don't have to admit to their own faults. It's clear they've been sexually incompatible from day one and neither had any clue how to actually have a proper adult conversation on this. Sex is extremely important to him, he's not wrong in having a high sex drive and wanting a partner that wants him just as strongly. He's not wrong for that, just as she's not wrong for not being super into sex and mostly just wanting to get children out of it. Where they're wrong is that they both have this attitude of "no I'M FINE, it's THEM in the wrong!" keeping them from actually talking about this.
ya know, there have been several stories that have really shown that Rslash is a man, and they almost always are ones like the first story. Where a husband/boyfriend/male coworker makes a post, about a wife/girlfriend/female coworker, clearly leaving information out, and Rslash takes it all as is and sides with the OP, until someone else points out how much is missing. It is obvious that the husband is only giving the massages as a way to get "Intimate Touch" from his wife, and not because its something he enjoys or wants to do to be close to her. Having differing Drives can cause strain in a relationship, but as others have said, it wont go "cold" for no reason. Saying the wife is Selfish, or "2.5/5" for not "just having sex with him" is Incredibly misogynistic and such a bad call on your part. They are BOTH adults who should have had an ADULT conversation about the situation instead of him treating his wife like vending machine for sex. I hope you actually read and take the comments calling you out for that call to heart, and Do Better in the future.
Getting a divorce over lack of intamacy is valid. Giving a massage ultimatum instead of having a conversation about intamacy, especially with a child, isn't.
I agree, differences in libido are valid concerns. But I don't think the way he went about it is valid. Sexual favors compared to muscle tension relief is... not the same
@@aurorasurrealis1032Me too, I thought I was the only outlier thinking “just because you give your wife a massage doesn’t mean she HAS to have sex with u”
@@perkuu6937 makes me think of the saying "Women are not machines that you put kindness coins into until sex falls out" OP should've had a conversation about their sex life, suggesting counselling or smth, but instead he gave her massages in the expectation that he'd get sex out of it. Manipulative af imo.
The fact that he wanted to list 'infidelity' as a cause for divorce shows his mindset. Plus if they wanted another child, I wonder how much pressure was on her for that? For too many people sex is just about reproduction and to withdraw physical affection as a punishment is pretty nasty. Sure she could have been more understanding, but I wonder if he only sees full intercourse as sex - some men (and women) do.
Did the ex purposely stay long enough to destroy the relationship because it sounds like she left when OP was ready to divorce which is super messed up just to come back to your kids just to make sure they don't have a good mom to replace the ex
Voluntold started out as a military term, when they'd ask for volunteers if no one did they would tell someone they had to do it, so voluntold was born.
Fors story 3 there was an update: Hello, I have been getting a lot of messages asking for an update. I am now in a place to be able to give an update. You can look at my previous post for what this is about. I went back to the house 2 days ago and my husband and I had a long talk about what happened and how I didn’t feel protected by him and how he knew how disrespectful they were being but didn’t stop anything. He said that he still loved his ex and that’s why pretty much. He didn’t want to do anything for her to leave them again (them as in him and the twins) but that didn’t change how he felt about me… I did not feel comfortable with that. I told him that I’ve been there, not her and how could he still love her and it was very emotional and there was crying and yelling. I made the decision to move along with the divorce. I spoke to the twins and they cried and said it’s their fault and to forgive them and their dad and not to leave. I told them that as much as I love them, staying with their dad and in this home was not an option but I would still love to have a relationship with them if they want but I am still very much hurt by what happened and would still appreciate a little more time for myself. I let them know that their actions have consequences and they can’t treat people the way they did. I did move out and I was staying in a unit in one of my rental properties. Exciting news, I bought my first house. It was a fairly quick process. I’m excited for what’s next, I bought my first house ever and next month I am taking a break from work for a few weeks or the whole month … maybe 2 or 3 and doing some exploring of the world and healing and finding myself. I lost myself in the twins and my husband and didn’t really focus on what I wanted and what made me happy. So I bought tickets again for Disney World, I have also made plans to go to Thailand next month and from there… I have no clue. I’m doing some spontaneous trips… I have always wanted to see the 7 wonders of the world. Any way, I am really happy to be getting a break. I told the kids I would love to have them over for dinner when I get settled in to my new place. I do feel bad about canceling their trip to Disney so I am thinking about funding a trip for them to go this summer for their 17th birthday… Just not with me, I’m excited to be traveling alone and I need the mental break. That is all really… Edit: I read the comments about not funding a birthday trip for them because it is not my responsibility that is a Mom or step parent responsibility and you know all of you are right so I will not be funding that trip. It’s still hard for me not to be or Jump into that role and I have to get out of it but ultimately they did not respect me as their mom so I will not be doing that and focusing on myself and my trips. It was Just a thought and nothing was set in stone and I’m glad I didn’t. Thank you for everyone who is here still giving me advice and kind words. Once they earn my trust back, I will have no problem funding it Info: There seems to be some confusion… I talked to them 3 days ago… I didn’t not buy a house 3 days ago. I have property with units (duplexes) that I rent out to people and I was staying on one side. I bought a house for me to live in. (I have everything I need sorted out to where I can buy this house now and the divorce is not an issue) You can close on a house in less than 30-45 days if you pay in cash. People are so focused on my financial situation. I’m not rich in any sense, but I do good for myself and I deserve it because I worked hard for it after I came from nothing. I’m not abandoning them “again” the twins have said that they will try to earn my trust back and if giving me space is what can start that healing process they’ll will do it. I’m inviting them over for dinner next month and we’ll see how this goes.
Thanks for the update. 🥹 I'm happy you stood up for yourself and the respect you deserve! After putting 6 years if your time and getting disrespect.. I think you've made the right choice. Though I'm sure it wasn't easy. 🥹 I also recently left a relationship I had got 6 years. Stay strong!
The first story. ESH. So obviously the situation of a dying relationship is complicated. But at the same time. Nobody is owed anything in terms of intercourse. A massage isn't what op stated it is. I get them often due to issues wit neck tension. He is as bad as her.
I think that second story is a man defending the mother of his children. Not in a romantic way but in a matter of respect. It’s gross for one woman to talk about the privates of another woman so grossly. That’s a huge red flag. I wouldn’t even be friends with someone like that.
I don't think it's respectful, he was just getting embarrassed by her comments in the public setting. He should have cut that sh!t off immediately when it first started happening even when they weren't in public. If he didn't want her talking crap about his ex that he's supposedly in an amicable/friendly split with, he shouldn't have let it get to that point and told his new gf that wasn't cool and get over her insecure self.
exactly. breakups/divorces don't automatically mean you have to hate each other. If your partner and their ex are on good terms, what's the point of being so hateful towards them? Obsessive behavior.
Last story: As I was reading, I was starting to wonder if the wife genuinely loved him or just saw him as a walking semen-factory/laborer. … but then he asks: “do you seriously not understand why I’m mad?” And she says: “yes, I need you to explain it to me” now I’m wondering if I was right.
Story 1 sex is never owed in a relationship but this isnt what he got upset about they were wanting completely diffrent things out of the relationship its totally valid to say "hey my needs arent being met and id like to discuss options" even if that need is sex she clearly didnt care about his needs to the point he broke hes definitely better off finding a partner with similar values
Not sure if you remember the story you read some time ago where a 20-something’s mother was constantly volunteering her daughter to help her people and stole her car because she didn’t do as she was told then cut up her license with cops right there. She was being voluntold to help these people.
7:23 think of it this way, by disrespecting your ex she's disrespecting you by saying you choose shit-people, then the "did I hit a nerve" part sealed it
Dabney has never heard of the term voluntold?! HAH! You sir are lucky! Every person that owns a truck has fallen victim to that term at least once in his/her life.
Oh my yikes for that poor Step Mom OP. People like that are a large part of why I don't think I'd ever be comfortable with a blended family. I know it worked well with my mom & grandpa, but the amount of stories I hear about Step and Adoptive parents getting absolutely sh@t on by the kids when three "real" family shows up is just not something I think I have the emotional bandwidth or personal patience to tolerate.
Story 1 sounds like reason for divorce is alienation of affection. And if the shoe was on the other foot, nobody would shame her for wanting a divorce.
Did Dabney actually suggest that the wife in story one OWES op sex because he gave her a massage? That sex should be used as a weapon in a relationship? Surely not!
Story 1 was definitely NOT about the massage. OP listed some things that led to the argument then divorce but I'm sure it's way worse. There's no way she loved him
Or she could be going through early menopause and unaware of it because of other issues ( it's mentioned she has fertility issues) and menopause goes nuclear on your sex drive. Basically non existent but of course men don't actually care what women have to go through. Unfortunately women are governed by AWOL hormones.
While I do agree the wife is selfish in story 1, trying to get her on infidelity because she got a massage is ridiculous! That is just absolutely dumb and he needs to be real like the lawyer said. Just say it’s because they were sexually uncompatible
Legally speaking, you are absolutely right and he doesn't need to bring the word "infidelity" into court. Luckily, the no-fault divorce is a thing that exists now. Morally speaking, if massages are a source of intimacy between them and she gets one elsewhere, that definitely counts as cheating. He's also in the wrong, though, because withholding intimacy as a manipulation tactic is never okay, even as retaliation for the same.
@@detictivecastielmalfoy4220 perspective She said, if you won't give me what I want I'll get it elsewhere said fine, same thing She said no Then he said no for you too... Then she not obly did it, she hid it If there was no kid this marriage should have ended years before. But the comparison is fair if you accept something doesnt jave to be identical to be in a class of object....from his perspective, she was cheating on the relationship..."cheating" has more than one meaning, in thos case it was to control his needs to never be met, not care about that, and meet all of hers
@@detictivecastielmalfoy4220 Both gives you physical joy and reduces stress in the end tho, and both involves a lot of touching. She couldn't even go without her dose of joy for a few days and immediately sought an outsider to get her needs met even tho her husband made it clear he views it as an intimate act. Yet she also made it clear she expects husband to go without an arguably higher form of joy and stress relief for months on end, and not seek an outsider to get his needs met, and he needs to accept that her viewpoint of what's 'intimate' in this relationship is the correct one, and his viewpoint is 'ridiculous'. So, she dismissed his viewpoint of 'intimate' immediately and decided on herself that breaking that is 'not cheating', but if he breaks her viewpoint of 'intimate', then it's cheating...
Takes two to make a dead bedroom. If the other party isnt feeling as if theyre valued or loved and instead are being used for their partners sexual pleasure only then it generally leads to the situation OP described.
Regarding the first story - While i understand that it's severely frustrating for OP, sex is NOT transactional. OP and R/slash are just assuming the wife is withholding sex because she wants to. It's obvious they don't really have feelings for each other anymore, so maybe the wife is just not attracted to him in that way and feels uncomfortable having intercourse with OP. I think it's a bit harsh to give her a 2.5/5 ESPECIALLY if OP is out here considering a professional massage as cheating. Yes, it can be a boundary crosser that makes you uncomfortable, but it is not cheating. I saw an update saying OP and wife are getting divorced which sounds like the best thing for them. There's absolutely no reason to make a woman feel bad or call them selfish for not feeling comfortable when it comes to sex. That's a huge huge huge red flag.
The term "voluntold" has been used in the military for years. My dad, who retired almost 20 years ago, after serving for 30 years (Ret Chief MSgt, USAF), used it my entire life. It is right up there with "mandatory fun" when unit members are ordered to attend unit events, like BBQs.
My family used to volunteer me for doing things all the time. We used to have family get togethers for Christmas etc and the family member who hosted would always say something like; "and after lunch David is going to play the piano for us," without asking me first. One day, I'd had enough and refused, much to everyone's shock. They never asked me again, thank goodness. It wasn't only the piano. I used to be volunteered to cut someone's grass, or to move some wood and plenty of other manual labour things. I moved away as soon as I could.
1st OP is dumb simply for even making this about a massage when it clearly is judt lack of love and care in the relationship. You dont even need a reason to get a divorce or end any relationship for that matter. If you arent happy, walk away. If you have some kind of desire to improve things, maybe seek therapy.
That last story is unfortunately common if you are the unlucky soul in your family who owns a truck or even worse a truck and a trailer. My entire life (turning 30 this year) my dad has been stuck being pressured into helping family members on both sides (but especially his side) do things because they needed his truck, trailer, or both. It got to the point he started telling people no. Not only does he have health problems that means he shouldn't be doing most of those things, family members would borrow the trailer then break it. The breaks have been ruined once or twice and the break lights have been broken more times than I can count by family who couldn't be responsible while borrowing the trailer. To top it all off most of the time someone did something to it they didn't pay to get it fixed despite saying they would. Moral of the story don't let people pressure you into helping just because you have a truck, trailer, or both. It's not your responsibility to provide those things to people family or not. If you want to help great, if not set boundaries and stick to them. And if you get voluntold like Op did then set the boundary right then and there. The backlash won't be fun but you won't find yourself in that situation again.
First story, nobody deserves a score. If the wife has a low libido she can't be forced to have a more frequent love life. Suggesting she should be more grateful by doing bedroom stuff against her will is a weird take. If the husband can't deal with that then they should just divorce, and that is exactly what happened. This is a story where two people have different expectations from a relationship, and they get divorced for irreconcilable differences. This is obviously a" 2 yes, one no" situation. The massage isn't even that relevant. For one partner, the massage is a prelude for more. For the other partner, it's platonic. Again, irreconcilable differences. Their marriage and divorce might just be the textbook definition of irreconcilable differences.
It's not really a weird take tho catering to your significant other is very applicable and a essential part of the relationship not saying he deserves her body whenever she wants but if u love someone u make concessions n even then she's not entertaining ANY of the efforts of the guy like for example therapy
I don’t see the situation as much as the husband is owed sex but more of why should I put more work into making you happy than you’re putting into making me happy in the relationship. To me it reads like this situation could happen with anything like the husband wants to have a meal with his wife everyday and the wife refuses but still expects him to make meals she likes everyday despite nog doing anything for him and the situation would be the same. I could be wrong but that’s how I read the situation. As for the actual message while the Op definitely do the best job of portraying it to the Op the wife getting messages is something he considers intimate and special between them, whether or not it is something that should be is something entirely but that’s what he thinks and she just blatantly ignored it. I wouldn’t say Op is definitely in the right but it does seem like he’s putting more effort into making his wife happy in the relationship than she is from what he said. Divorce is definitely the best choice since it seems like these two people are very different and there doesn’t seem to be much communication in the relationship.
@@ftdfijturidtunyjhuifI don't really agree with that, kind of feels like you're saying that if you love someone then you need to put your bodily autonomy and boundaries on the back burner because if you love them, you would have sex with them even when you clearly don't want to. OP has a high sex drive and his wife clearly does not, the solution here is to split and find people you are more compatible with, not go around acting like you're entitled to your wife's body and then throwing tantrums and equating a strip mall massage to cheating
THANK YOU!! You explained it perfectly. I disagree with rslash take because it's so weird to be mad that one partner is getting pleasure from one thing while the other isn't in this situation. Like she shouldn't be forced to give him any sexual pleasures just because he agreed to giving her massages and POSSIBLY getting sexual favors as a "reward" for his work.
@@GrittyTones ofc with this general level of disagreement the solution is to split but the whole autonomy argument is irrelevant any and all compromises involve sacrificing some level of autonomy since the entire point of a compromise is giving up something u want to a degree to please the other person
Last story: I'm not even into sports or have kids but I would be PISSED in this guys shoes too. Though I'm surprised rslash never heard "voluntold" before.
When I was younger my dad would have me do things and I was like “I don’t remember volunteering for this.” and he would say “I volunteered you.” Most of these things were in front of company basically making it so I couldn’t say no.
As a registered massage therapist I was worried about the first story when I read the title. But now I agree with RSlash, they aren’t getting a divorce because of a massage. The massage is just the straw that broke the camel’s back.
1st story: I 100% get that the lack of intimacy contributed greatly to the downfall of that relationship. However, am I the only one who thinks that OP is wrong, not over the issue about the massage, but because it sounded like he expected sex every time he massaged her? Personally, I'd rate this one an EHS because, obviously, his wife was being selfish by expecting him to massage her every day, but it sounds like he expected sex in exchange for the massages. Sure, massages can lead to intimacy, but they don't *have* to lead to intimacy. A massage can be a simple massage, period. All of that having been said it sounds like they're ultimately incompatible, as he sees massages as physical intimacy and she doesn't, but at the same time, she seems to think she's entitled to a massage from her SO. Remember kids: the only things you're entitled to in a relationship are fidelity, honesty, kindness, love, safety and communication. I'm probably missing some other aspects, but my point is that you're not entitled to money, sex, massages, gifts (except for maybe anniversaries or birthdays), or any other physical things.
yes omg and i see no one else saying this. hes not even massaging her bc he wants to make her happy hes just doing it bc he expects something in return & clearly he views it as transactional.. so so weird
I don’t see the situation as much as the husband is owed sex but more of why should I put more work into making you happy than you’re putting into making me happy in the relationship. To me it reads like this situation could happen with anything like the husband wants to have a meal with his wife everyday and the wife refuses but still expects him to make meals she likes everyday despite nog doing anything for him and the situation would be the same. I could be wrong but that’s how I read the situation. As for the actual message while the Op definitely do the best job of portraying it to the Op the wife getting messages is something he considers intimate and special between them, whether or not it is something that should be is something entirely but that’s what he thinks and she just blatantly ignored it. I wouldn’t say Op is definitely in the right but it does seem like he’s putting more effort into making his wife happy in the relationship than she is from what he said. Divorce is definitely the best choice since it seems like these two people are very different and there doesn’t seem to be much communication in the relationship.
>it sounded like he expected sex every time he massaged her? Go see the story again. He did massagues every day but was contend in having sex just a few times a year. It is when it droped sharply that there were problens, the wife was just not puting any effort on the relatioship
The wife never demanded these massages tho? And why shouldn't she expect it from him? He'd massage her with varying levels of thoroughness every day of the year. He literally made his massages as predictable as the sun rising in the morning. If I were in her shoes and they stopped all of a sudden I would ask what's up too. The fact that op treated his massages as transactional and not something to just make his wife happy is bad enough, but he's making the transaction without her even knowing it's happening in the first place. She thought the massages were just massages. He thought they were sex tokens. He didn't communicate about this aspect at all. And his outlook on massages being inherently intimate is superweird too, does he just think a masseuse is another form of prostitution?
@@steampunkfox4932 That's also a possibility that it's a matter of him putting more effort into the relationship than she is, but that wasn't how it came across to me. Then, again, I've seen a lot of men act like they're entitled to sex, in general, but I've also seen just as many men who didn't have that view.
The first story is just ridiculous. They have a perfect situation: they already have a kid with low chance of another. They don't have to limit themselves with birth control nor do any risky stuff like vasectomy. Bed fun every day with no consequences, and she still does not appreciate how perfect their situation is.
It's not really the massage. It is really the fact that he set a boundary, clearly, with the repercussion/consequence. It wasn't even an unreasonable boundary. And right after, she decided to clearly cross those boundaries. So, the wife actually made a concious choice to choose divorce with her actions. Husband definitely NTA
that was a kinda weird take on the first one. it isn't healthy for sex to be transactional, and it's weird to expect someone to perform sexual acts when they don't actually want to out of pity or to appease their spouse. that's not to say OP's frustration isn't valid, just that the solution is not for his wife to have sex when she doesn't want to. she still sucks here for other reasons, but that one isn't one of them. (OP also sucks here for the record)
That 100% depends on perspective. from his she was paying for a need her husband provided, and refusing to let him meet his need or provide for it herself....it is selfish and the marriage was doomed.....note, im not saying sex is required, but it is a need most men have and not just knowing that going in, but knowing that after kids you are going almsot cold turkey...without telling him, or offering him any other option or even trying to disciss it is just plain wrong.....
I don't think he ACTUALLY thinks they're 1:1. In this specific context, the comparison made sense and it was just a desperate plea to get his wife to open up and save the marriage
Family matters story : stick to your guns, OP. This is a learning moment for these kids on the consequences of their actions *and* for awareness of others’ ability to manipulate them *and* their own weak points connected to being abandoned and how that can cause their brains to prioritise an abuser as it triggers the instinct to stop themselves from being abandoned again.
